Trash Taste Podcast - The Dark World of Chris Chan | Trash Taste #68

Episode Date: October 1, 2021

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Just a quick heads up. Some of the topics that we will be discussing this episode are quite graphic and quite grotesque at times. This is mainly about Chris Chan and the history of Chris Chan. It's all about it. And it is a very disturbing story. I would not recommend Chromecasting this to the entire family. Yeah, don't watch this with your family. Watch this with headphones if you have to.

Avoid it if you're not, you know, if you're a little bit squirmish. There are some sensitive topics included. Yep. And also we apologize if we say the wrong pro. for Chris, we're not doing it intentionally. We mean no ill, well, and yeah, thank you so much. Enjoy. Welcome to this episode of Trash Taste. I'm Connor, I'm here with the boys as usual, Jerry and Garn.

And today we have an interesting guest, a rather unusual one, I might add, as well, Gino Samuels. Hi, Gino, how you doing? I'm okay. I'm okay. Just okay. I'm very okay. So, there's probably gonna be a lot of people who don't know who you are or what your work is.

Some people might be familiar with what you do. You do a YouTube series on the very nice, very notorious and infamous Chris Chan. Yes, I do. It's a very extensive series. Yeah. That's a way. That's a way.

It's an understatement from what I can tell. So, yeah, obviously there's, if you don't know what Chris Chan is or the law behind Chris Chan, it's a very strange tale of the internet. And one that I don't feel qualified to talk about. I don't think any of us are qualified to talk about. How would you explain what you do

to somebody who doesn't understand anything about Chris Chan or the internet essentially. Okay, well, I talk in depth about Christian. And if you don't know, Chris Chan is a certain person who's received a lot of attention over the years from various online forums

and online groups for his and then later her unusual actions. That is an understatement. That's a very brief introduction, a very simplified introduction there. Right. Yeah, also has been bullied a lot. Yeah.

So yeah, I guess you could say he's kind of like the forerunner of several online groups. Right. Several online, I guess, I don't know what you. It's so difficult to like describe like what he's all about, right? You kind of have to go chronologically year by year to like really get the full story. Yeah. So this is, okay, because I had not heard of Chris Chan until like I think a few months ago. where Connor introduced me to one of your videos.

And I was, because he couldn't believe that I hadn't heard of Chris Chan as someone who had been on the internet. He was just like, what? How have you never heard of Chris Chan? Got it's been doing YouTube since, which year now? 2000. 20, 2007.

So basically the start of YouTube. Yeah, I found it, you know, how dare you be on this website and not know anything about Chris Chan? See, because like, I knew of things associated with Chris. you know, which we'll obviously get into later in the video. But like, when I heard the name Chris Chan, like obviously, you know, knowing, because I'm Japanese, right?

So when I'm the only thing, something Chan, I think like, oh, it's just like a character or like something like that. And then when I realized that Chris Chan was an actual person, I was like, oh, okay, now this completely changes things. So the reason why this episode came about and why Gino is here today is that I've been watching Gino's series. Now Gino does, well, a kind of a mounted, task of documenting everything.

And I think what episode did we on 59 right now? Is that correct? So you have made 59, roughly around 30 to 50 minute videos. How many hours of content have you made? Do you even know? Of course, many people have calculated already. It's over 40 hours. 40 hours.

So this is a 40-hour documentary. You know, Michael Jordan is eating his heart hour right now. Last dance, eat your heart out, you know. 40 hours of content. And it is just this. very fascinating look into a side of the internet, essentially. It's like a really interesting just like case study, isn't it? Yeah.

It's like a person on the internet. And I think it's just so, there's nothing like it on the internet. And to have just such material, like the sheer scale of it is really daunting. Trying to convince someone to start watching, because the way I try people into Christian this whole thing is not because I don't particularly care about what happens, but it is almost like a TV show at this point, which we can also get about later

whether that's ethical or not and you know, whatnot. But, you know, I get my friends into the documentary, I'm like, please watch this, it's insane. Like when you, like, introduced us to Gino's documentary at your place that one time, and I saw that there was like 45 episodes at the time, I think. I was like, oh, is this what it feels like to like try and get someone into one piece?

No, that's like, I was about to say the exact same thing. This is like, I saw the episode, it was really interesting and I looked at the rest of the episodes and just the sheer length. I'm just like, oh, oh, no. Yeah, it's like, I know, I know, like, because like, just from watching episode one, I was like, oh, this is so interesting,

I want to watch more, but just like, the sheer amount just made me kind of fall back a little. Yeah, I think I started watching your series around episode nine or 10, and that's when I started watching, basically whenever you uploaded them. And yeah, it's been one of those things where the longer it gets, the harder it is

to convince people to start. Yeah, yeah, because it gets so taunted. I think what happened the evening I showed these guys the series is that we'd had been drinking a bit. And we were like, what should we watch? And I was like, I know the exact thing to watch at like midnight. Let me put it on.

Yeah, we finished watching all the Super Monkey Ball speed runs and we were like, what else can top that? And Connor was like, watch this. Yeah, so we started watching it. I don't even know how to begin talking about this topic because it is so difficult to explain if the viewers don't know anything and I imagine the viewers don't know much.

Right. How would you describe Chris to someone who knows no idea who Chris is. Okay. Chris Shen is an autistic individual who through the process of bad parenting and their own afflictions caused themselves to both become a subject of bullying online and also in turn, they did not learn to avoid the trolls on the internet by addressing them all the time. only brought them into a bigger mess.

It is just a case study of what not to do on the internet. Right. It seems like for me, from an outsider, because I think out of the three of us, I know the least about this topic, and it just seems from what I can garner, it's kind of like the perfect storm

of someone who is very susceptible, susceptible to what people say about them on the internet and being trolled and just kind of the worst trolls possible, egging them on. And you just see the result from that. Yeah. And that's, I mean, it says a lot when you can make 40 hours of content and you're not even up to date,

you are you with the full story? Is that even close? Yeah, I think there was obviously, people might know a lot about the recent news that happened. Yes. As Chris Chan or Christine, I don't even say this. I'm like afraid to like say it out loud. Had, you know, a lot of people like their mother. Unfortunately, Chris.

I'm trying my best to say this without getting demonetized. A lot of people like them, but I think Chris really likes her. Took it to another level. We joke, but the reason why it was so, it was covered in like a lot of mainstream outlets

because it was so despicable. It's like, you know, Chris Christine had a sexual intercourse with their mother who, I believe, has dementia, is that correct? Possibly. Possibly. Okay, I don't know. But when you see clips. But it's very old, right?

Very clips, it's very concerning. At least 80. I think around 80 now. Yeah. And, you know, it's obviously, incest is legal and the fact that,

it is just insane. Yeah. It is, and quite frankly, it feels like the worst timeline to be on. It felt like, you know,

we can get into it later about what happened after, but how do you, you know, when you start to introduce the topic of Christine, how do you talk about it to people who have like no idea

who want to know about it? In a sense that, okay, you've given the basics of who Chris was back then and, you know, how it all started. But how do you describe the documentary that you make? It's a deep dive into a certain individual that I guess for the most part, Chris was mostly known for the videos on YouTube for a very long time. But then I started exploring their Qikiki, which is their own dedicated wiki based on like everything they do. and I found so much amazing information and interactions and content, which gets ignored a lot on YouTube. So I decided to compile as much as I could,

as much interesting stuff as I could, into video form to make it more digestible on YouTube. So you just read all this stuff, and you're like, this is so interesting. I want to repackage it in a way that is more accessible. Right, yeah. Wow. So how did you get involved in this initially?

Initially, I wanted a video series like mine to exist, but no one had it around. and so I decided to make it myself. Yeah, fair enough. Fair enough. And you're going to go. No, because like, I guess what, uh, what, uh, motivated you to get into this kind of,

because it seems like there's an entire culture around Chris Chan right now. I totally don't. Christorians. What's a Christorian? Christorian is a person who knows pretty much everything about Chris. Who is a part of Christry. Oh my God.

There's a person to respond to Christi. I just couldn't imagine someone unironically being like, I am a Christorian, yes. Professional Christorian, yeah. Do you, I mean, are you technically one? Do you refer to yourself as one? Do you identify as a Cristorian? People refer to me as the go-to Christian at the moment, yeah.

You sound utter contempt when you say that. You're the face of all Christorians right now. It's a burden I must bear. You know those memes where it's like the people holding up like the world, the army, and it's the, they're living like peacefully at the top, It's like Gino Samuel holding up the fabric. I feel like it has some aspects. You do seem almost, you know, you hate many aspects of it.

Is that fair to say? I wish there was something more to my identity rather than being a Christian. Right, right, of course. But yeah, of course, I can't blame them because it is like the things that I'm most known for at the moment at least. It's also, it is just so, I think when a lot of people see that you've made 40 hours or nearly 60 episodes on something, they do think, what drives a man to do such a thing to make 60 episodes? And I think if I remember correctly when you've been doing this, your channel got deleted at some point, right?

Yeah. So your channel is called Gino Samuel 2.1, plug, link in the description. I think because it got deleted during the first one, is that correct? Yes, Gino Samuel 2 was terminated for bullying and harassment. Right. And that was for the Christian episodes. That was the Christian episodes. I was up to Part 12 at that point, yeah.

I think I remember this happening. And I thought you were going to quit, right, at that point, at some point, no? Yeah, I did quit. I actually made Part 13 and then released it on a different video hosting platform. But then after that, I decided, you know what, I'm just not going to do this anymore. Yeah. Yeah, because what I want to know is, did you know what you're getting yourself into when you started this project? Well, at around Part 5, I got already 10,000 subs on YouTube.

So for that, I made a Q&A video and answered some questions. and people asked how long do you think it's going to be. I said, I'm probably going to get up to date around part 15. So I really had no idea. Well, yeah, because it's just insane that, you know, because like, because again, I've seen a couple of your episodes, right? And it's just insane because it's like one episode isn't just talking about like one core thing. It's like, it's just a compilation of all the things that just happen in chronological order.

So like, on average, like, how long does it take to make one? Chris Chan episode. From the start of writing to the publication, maybe three to four weeks. Jesus. Oh my God. I mean, yeah, I can't think of the amount of research that has to go into it, right?

Because, like, man. Yeah, what is your research process for this? I wouldn't even know how or where to start. Yeah, do you talk to a lot of people in the community? Do you ask them, hey, what happened if you're not sure? Or, like, what is the whole process? Very rarely, I do talk with someone. But mostly go through the Quiki and then the Qibi Farms.

It's Qibee Farms. Kiwi Farms is a certain website which is focusing on discussions around people online who do laughable things and are affectionately or unaffectionately referred to as lull cows. Yeah, because there's a whole website called lullcow as well, right? Which is separate.

As a different thing. Yeah, so a different website, but that is like the type of person. Generally, someone who just makes a lot of drama, does a lot of very questionable things. Yeah, my understanding of, like Kiwi Farms and Lowell Cow was always just like a place where people go to like talk drama about certain people and like. Yeah, where I feel like 4chan is just unfiltered garbage that is sometimes funny but also extremely questionable.

I feel like Lol Cow QFam very centered on the creators online and very much about people who are doing stuff online. Whereas 4chan is just anything. Yeah, anything goes. I wasn't correct me if I'm wrong, wasn't Kiwi Farms started like for Chris, like to document Chris? Yes. Yeah. Yeah, it was originally called Quick KeyFirm. forums.

Did you not know that? I did not yet. Oh, okay. Well, that's, well, there you go. We're going to learn a lot today, ladies and gentlemen. So, yeah, it was originally called Quiki Forums. And the reason it developed into KV Farms was because it was during a certain dry spell of content from Christian when they were not being active online for like a year or so.

People started making subforms about other people who are similar to Chris. And then after a while, they decided to abandon the Quiki forums and then get a new I mean and call themselves Kiwi Farms, which is apparently a result. It's actually based on a mispronunciation that some other lull cows said about the Quickey forms. They pronounced that as Qui Farms. So that's how it started. And so Quick is, is that just Christian Western Chandler? Christian Western Chandler, which is the name.

CWC. Right. And that is essentially the universe or like what, is that what Christine Bill? Is that correct me on the, the Lord? so much information, it's very hard to keep track. Yes, Chris started building their own world, I guess, during their teenagers. In late 90s, they developed this concept of Quakeville,

which is the city of Quakee, Chris Chan. I'm, I'm already lost. There's just like this whole. It's a fantastical world. So you know, like, do you know what sonature is? No. Do you want to explain what sonature is? Well, I mean, it's very.

I mean, yeah. Okay, so I think Quakeville is. was actually before Sonichu, so it was just like, slotted into there. But yeah, Sonichu came about as a high school project. Chris was doing a design class where he had to design his own CD, and he wanted to put on Sonic and Pikachu. I can't remember what was it, Sonic or Pikachu,

and the teacher said he couldn't put in any copyrighted characters. So he decided to go around that issue, combined Sonic and Pikachu into Sonichu. And that came like a very iconic meme on. So I found out about the whole Chris thing because I knew what Sonature was. Because like, you know, being on all sorts of internet forums back in the day, like you would just see Sonatoo

like out of context or you know, used in some ways. Yeah, I remember I saw it a lot. Yeah. So no one of this, I just thought it was a rip off. Yeah, right? So I thought it was just like, you know, one of those like funny memes that someone created, right? And then I realized, oh, Sonature is linked with this person called Chris Chan and then that's how I found out about the whole world of Chris.

And then I just went deeper and deeper deep into the rabbit hole essentially. So, you know, when you watch your documentary, it starts out, you know, I mean, quite positive, I'd say. Well, not positive, but, you know, I'd say hopeful, you know, you get a, you get introduced to Chris at the time. And it kind of becomes this like, you know, you get to see Chris on TV when very young, right, when they won a competition. And you're like, oh, okay, it's going pretty well. And then you start to get into some very personal details about Chris, which I always found very, very concerning how they were, like, how did you get this information?

Because there's, when you get introduced to Chris, you learn about Chris, you learn that Chris is autistic, that Chris is very obsessed with games and stuff. And then somehow we, we get a very detailed explanation of Chris's school life,

how they had at the time, multiple gal pals, as Chris always refers to them as, who then we found out later, they were, the, Chris's parents were asked the, gal pals to be friends with Chris so that Chris had friends.

There was just like so much personal intimate detail that I don't even think I have about my own life. Yeah, right. There was like a medical record or something or a psychiatric record? It's a psychiatric evaluation, right? How was that? You showed this in your episode of Chris and I just sat there in awe being like, I don't even know where mine is.

If I have one, I don't, you know, where would I get this? This is an information that should be like public. Was this all self-published by Chris? Some of it was the documents, the school papers, the medical records, were actually, I guess, illegally taken from their property. Oh, wow. At a point, yeah. It was at a point much later in their life around 2014, actually. There was a troll who got into their dumpster and took out all the papers.

Jesus Christ. Fuck, you know. So people have been going to Chris's house and just dumpster diving constantly, just trying to. That happened at least once. I don't think many people did that, yeah. It's kind of crazy, is it? Maybe just one time, yeah. But people do go there and take updated pictures of the house, for example,

and their lawn, yeah. Yeah, so as someone who doesn't know much about Chris Chan as a whole topic, so like what are some of the most notable things they've done or that we can mention, I could say that have, like, garnered them such a notoriety online. I mean, at this point, is there anything that they haven't mentioned? Like, because for me, I'm just like, Okay, so you talk about Chris,

Christian being like one of the most documented people, probably in history at this point, and just seeing the first part of your documentary, I'm just like, yeah, I can see that. Like, I don't think someone has had such intimate detail be leaked or put out into a public space before, but like what are some of, how did they gain notoriety in the first place?

That's what I'm so curious about. All started in 2007 when photos of Chris were posted on 4chan, I think, and then maybe something awful.com. Yeah, I remember that forum website. Yeah, so people connected the dots and showed off the pictures as this is the person who created the Sonnet Choo comics and look at him. It was kind of like a freak gawking. Right, which is something awful. They used to just post anything that was awful, quote unquote, what they thought, and they would just mock it.

Yeah, yeah. And that was the thing. Yeah, so that's how that started. And Chris noticed this and started making videos addressing rumors and correcting the record. Yeah. I believe one of the most worrying things and is where you could definitely tell this is gonna take a turn for the worst

in the documentary that you made is that at some point, Chris has this brilliant idea of just releasing everything. Yeah, right. Just handwriting an absurd amount of personal information, probably penis length included at some point in there, you know. So, yeah, the way that she fights back

is to basically docks herself. Yeah, which is a really strange strategy. Yes. Yeah, this was in response to the Encyclopedia Dramatica page which was made about Christian at that time. Yeah. And apparently, according to Chris, they were fed up because they got a lot of details wrong.

So I wanted to correct that and add context to the information. Which just sounds like a disaster. Basically adding a footnote. Yeah. It's all the information. It's like, you see like a fire and you're just like, let's just pour oil on this. No, that's not how you burn a fire.

Here, let me help you. Jesus. Yeah, and part, he called this task information overloads. Which I... I love that. I love that Chris kept calling it that. It's like, I don't think that's how it works on the internet. Maybe in person, if you shoot that,

I would be like, wait, what? Which I imagine he was kind of like thinking that the Anteclepia Dramatic page would be like a malfunctioning robot. If you feed it too much information, his ads going to explode. Yeah, right. You thought that, maybe.

It's just like feeding a logic bomb to like an AI or something, right? Yeah. It's like a plot to like a movie or something. And Encyclopedia Dramatica, again, there's another drama website, right? Where it's just encyclopedia of people who have done, well, drama things,

and it's literally just documented. There's a lot of people on there. There's numerous websites that are horrible like that. Oh yeah, you know, it's unfortunate that some people go on there and then correct the record about them. I still don't think that's an act that's been done. I don't think most.

Yeah, it's definitely unprecedented. Most people on there tend to not go on there and say, hey, guys. No, no, no, I didn't actually do that. I did this instead. And I think, so that's when, that's like the, correct me if I'm wrong, that is one of the biggest catalysts, right? So what kick started the fascination that people have with Chris. Yeah, and basically fed the trolls because they received so much information,

so much personal information about Chris. And this included one particular drawing of Chris and, their friend, at the time their female friend, being satisfied in a certain way. Yikes. Yeah, that got a lot of attention to, obviously. Right.

Yeah. I think later on, Chris also mentioned, or Christine at that time, mentioned that, yeah, they thought that it was okay to draw sexual pictures of someone because they weren't actually taking, like doing the sexual thing to them or something. Yeah, also Chris,

Chris in a video, or no, Chris in a personal email said that they made that drawing in order to release their certain urges instead of acting it out in person. Wait, personal email to who? Personal email to the female friend. Oh, yeah, justification. I do remember this.

This was in a previous episode, right? Yeah. So they were like, oh, I'm not going to do anything to you. That's why I'm drawing stuff so that I don't do anything to you, which must be an extremely concerning email to receive. Is this person just like the human yikes machine? Well, that's the problem is that every time when you watch this documentary

or when you're reading about Chris, which is just worrying in itself, every time you want to give Chris a chance and root for Chris, something happens where you're like, fuck. Yeah, every time she's that close to get in the W, she does something that gives a deal. I feel like in the start of the, in the history,

you very much are rooting for like Chris has just stopped. Just stop. Just get off the internet, raising money for charity or something. You know, and I think there was one turning point for me where I was like, oh, for fuck sake, when I was watching this.

And I think it was, I don't think they do this anymore. But Chris at the time would just say racist things and it was quite homophobic very often. And it was just to the point where I was like, you know, and I wonder how much of that was due to the environment that they were raised in. I feel like it raised very difficult questions where it was like, is this your fault

or is this your environment's fault that you're raised and you haven't been educated better on this. Is this how you actually are where you're like orchestrated by people? Well it's hard to say, you know, because I feel that they're a very impressionable person and I felt like you can definitely tell whatever that was told to them as a child

was stuck with them quite a lot. So it's a very conflicting thing, especially because Chris does have autism, quite severe autism. You do, you almost want, to justify certain things, but then every single time you wanna justify, well, I'm sure it's, you know,

something else happens. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, you're like, for fuck sake, I am trying my best to want you to do good. I'm trying to be on your side. I'm trying my best here. Yeah, I'm just like, you know, like that domino meme? Yeah, it is literally that.

It is literally the massive domino. Like Chris Chan draw Sonic shoe and then it ends with sleeping with his mother. Yeah. Like I'm just like, what happened? In between, how did we get to this point? Because, you know, I don't even know where to begin about, you know, because I do want the viewers to kind of understand

the certain milestones, if you will, kind of run through it just so that. Notable points. Just so that people can kind of, who don't know anything about it, can understand, you know, roughly the timeline. So in 2007, this all started, correct? And I don't know when the trolling saga started, but it felt like it lasted a millennia.

So I thought, what's the trolling saga? I feel like there was like 30 episodes where it was just trolling. I mean, yeah. There was 30 episodes, but it was like in the span of two years. Yeah, the problem is, is that there is, I feel like the recent history of Christine has been very not well, not well, not. I think you meant to say chryry. The chrystery has not been, there's not as much, essentially.

I feel like there was a lot more recordings of trolling and stuff and just the amount of it. There's a lot still, but it's mostly confined to long Twitter rants. and like threads on Twitter and not the many videos, which I guess is not as entertaining to most people. So what kind of trolling are we talking about here? Oh, there's some egregious stuff. Do you want to... Oh, sure.

Things really started to kick off in around 2008, I guess, when trolls decided to pretend to be females online, interested in Chris. The catfish. Right. Right, right, right. Of course. And that happened many times, actually.

Chris kept falling for it every time, which was unfortunate. Every single time. Every single time. So you think like even, you know, it's like how many times? They won't expect a 10th catfish. Yeah. Right? It's like how many catfishes before you're like,

I've seen this one before? This looks awfully familiar. You know, one thing as well that is really concerning about, you know, Chris set this whole documentary, especially at the earlier years, is just how much Chris wants to have sex? Yeah, I like, because I think that's like the only way that you could fall for catfish that many times, right? It's very uncomfortable.

He just wants a girl. Yeah, how did he refer to girls at that point? Because I remember, Boyfriend Free Girl. Boyfriend Free Girl. Boyfriend Free Girl. We need like an entire encyclopedia. This is like, this podcast will not do it justice.

Hopefully what we can do is give you a basic introduction and a quick rundown of the important events and that if you really enjoy or you are extremely intrigued by what you hear you can go and watch Gino's videos about it. But we'll talk about it. And yeah, boyfriend free girl is one of my favorite phrases By the way, that's officially called a quickism. Oh, okay.

A quickism. So these are all words that are used. Used by Chris, yeah, invented by Chris, kind of, yeah. Quick, it's like, it sounds like a story, like a made up story. You know, the thing that's very concerning about Christian out the whole thing,

especially earlier on, is the way that he talks about sex is very much almost like a, watching a caveman speak about sex. Right. Yeah. Yeah. I want sex. It's just like there's no emotion.

No intimacy or anything. There's no mention of wanting to be close with someone. It's just I just want to have sex. It's not so much like I want to make love. It's more like I just want to procreate kind of like vibe, right? Yeah, it's really strange. And I think that's that also starts, like you said, it starts the trawling saga, which has some really disgusting points.

Right. Which, I mean, so they start trolling with the catfishing and then it goes. We're not at the disgusting point yet. Oh, no. It depends what flavor of, because you know, I feel like there's a little bit for everyone in terms of disgusting. What is this in IGN review?

Just a little something for everyone, huh? Whichever thing discussed you the most, at some point, Chris has been involved with it. Like, whichever thing, which ever thing discussed you, whether it be, I think one thing that, I think was the first thing that happened that really caught me off guard,

and I knew that this documentary was not going in good places. I can't remember if this was the first or what, there is many of the trolls, correct me if I'm wrong here, they often, when they were pretending to be boyfriend and a girlfriend,

they would convince Chris that they were like almost dating. Right, right, right. And then they would ask Chris for videos of him doing certain things at the time. Videos and pictures, yes. Close up pictures of certain body parts, yes. Yeah.

And I just remember I was taking a bath one time watching this documentary. I was just like cleaning, you know, just chilling, you know, because you have a nice bath in Japan. And I just remember it was like, and then Chris bought the cake and then filmed himself sitting on it. And I was like, what? What so? And then you proceed to scrub hard. I was like, I'm not clean enough. I'm not clean enough. So what, so what was, why did this all happen? I think it's just a way to see, you know, would Chris actually do this? Just to just to challenge Chris in a way as well. And I guess this also comes as a, as a consequence. to the state of the internet at that time where it could be anonymous a lot more easily.

Yeah, it was very open. Yeah. Kind of just sounds like they were limit testing. Well, it was like that year was like the Wild West as well. Where everyone, it kind of came normal enough. Yeah, mid 2000s internet was terrifying. Yeah, that was. Oh my God.

Yeah, I remember mid 2000's internet man. Yeah. It was literally like the lawless place. Yeah. Like, I think at the time I was on, I was mostly on new grounds at the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That place was truly like, you know,

if it was the wild west, there would be duels happening left and right. People getting shot down. Yeah. And so this was for two years, mainly, the main... Mostly two years. And was this because Chris was just extremely active in responding? Or was because there was just a lot more of it,

like a lot more trolls than there is now? What was the reason why there was just so much in those two years, do you think? Well, it helps that Chris provided many entertaining videos. So I kind of created content for them to laugh at. There was this certain group. a very close-knit group called the private villa of corrupted citizens. Like, I don't even know if you're making it out.

It's almost tragic with like the lack of being trolled right now. It's sad that a lot of the trolls sometimes just seem as pathetic as Chris sometimes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I'm watching this, you're like, I don't know who's more pathetic. The guy trying to get Chris rubbing a cake in his ass video or Chris, you can't, I can't decide most time.

It's how you feel when I'm like talking about fate. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What is what did you just say? This is as difficult as fate to get into, I think. The Chris Law is more complex than me. No, no, yeah, yeah, I think Chris Law is in its own world. Yeah, definitely. Evening weeps, baby man here.

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The PVCC was also the name of their community college, or the Piedmont, Virginia Community College, renamed as the private villa of corrupted citizens. Because to Chris, that college symbolized a very dark time in their history because the dean of the school prevented Chris from posting an attraction sign on the wall asking or looking for a girlfriend. Chris would often post signs across the school and then also around their area. advertising that they wanted a boyfriend free girl.

Right? Yes. Wow. It's very strange because I think the lack of awareness is just always the Achilles heel. Came to Chris. Yeah. And I believe, for example, there was a period where Chris got kicked out of the mall. At least once, yeah.

For putting up signs. Well, it wasn't signs. It was loitering. Loitering? Lawtering with like a... For a boyfriend free girl? Right. Yeah.

Chris would approach people right at them all. Yes, they would as well. And also maybe throw a rock with a red string attached and try to like lure her girl in. You're making this up. It's called the Red String of Fate. Oh, right, that's popular in Japanese culture? Yeah, yeah.

And like anime and stuff. Literally like your name. Yeah, your name has it on the pinky, right? The Red String's of Fate, right? instead of a pinky, it's just a rock. They just throw it people. So Chris was literally fishing for girls. That was at least one attempt at that.

Yeah. Okay. And then, yeah, Chris was actually very infamously dog piled on by security guards and thrown in jail, I guess, for a little bit, but then released and then permanently, or like temporarily banned from the mall. Right. The local mall. So, yeah, that was an issue for Chris, because that prevented Chris from,

from going to the go-to hotspot for boyfriend-free girls for a time. I can't ever take it seriously when you say that. Because what I find fascinating, right, is that from an outsider looking in, you do kind of, you want to feel sympathetic towards this person because they are getting the worst of online trolls, right? But at some point, you just hear a story about something that they do and you're just like, what is wrong with you? It very much pushes the limit of, you know,

how much accountability can you put on someone. Yes. Especially when Chris does have, like, quite severe autism. Yeah, exactly. It's very difficult to feel like, man, if this was a normal person, this would be totally your fault, but also how much can you, you know, like I said earlier, like there's so much factors of like,

you can clearly tell the upbringing. Yeah. Was questionable, maybe. I don't know how good the parenting was. I mean, I'm not a parent. I can't judge. Right. But you have to have learned some of these things from somewhere, right?

I mean, what for you was like, the sympathy line that like Chris like went over the line and you're just like, nope, there's no way I can read for you anymore. If there were you ever at the sympathy line? I mean, I'm not, personally I'm not very sympathetic. Yeah, but especially not after the recent events. Yeah, yeah, yeah, of course. Recently now it's like there's no sympathy there.

There's like, all sympathy's gone. The sympathy line is just like in the, in like the dust of this point. But yeah, like I said, I remember I was watching it and there was parts where like I genuinely felt like sympathetic towards Chris. I wanted to see Chris do better. And then there was just a rant about why Chris hated gay people at some point.

And I was like, for fuck sake. But was that orchestrated by the trolls? No, no, no. That was, I believe a lot of the issues of upbringing with Chris is the parents who were very old when Chris was conceived. The father was 54, the mother was 40. So they were already old-timey kind of people who didn't really understand what autism was when Chris was diagnosed.

with it and they were kind of afraid of of letting Chris go to a to a special school for autism or you know to treat it in any way and just they kind of pretended that it didn't exist and kind of try to right yeah you know I would be absolutely crushed if I found out my parents asked someone to be friends

with me that would yeah I wonder if that did a fact Chris at all if you I don't admit did Chris even view it that way eventually they found out yeah but at the at the time it was they were very happy was It was the happiest time of their life,

as they stayed many, many times during their high school. Yeah, it's almost, it's... What's the backstory behind this? So Chris had a lot of gal pals, is that correct? Yes. In school. Who are girls, but not girlfriends. Just friends who are girls.

Photonic. But he did want to have some of them. Were their boyfriend free girls? As you would call it. And you would see a lot of the pictures of like Chris's earlier, birthday parties would be with these gal pals. Right. And later found out that Chris's dad had asked,

I believe, parents or them to be friends with Chris. Actually, it was kind of an amazing situation where this was a later trolling attempt, I think, at around 2015 or so, Chris themselves tried to organize a high school reunion, so then they would finally meet up with their gal pals one more time. But during this time, trolls decided to pretend to be gal pals and stated in their emails that their parents only asked them to be friends with them in exchange for like money or good grades or whatever.

And then Chris asked their mother, is this true? And then she answered, yes. Yeah, just coincidentally got it right. Wow. Jeez. But, like, I'm thinking, like, because even up until the whole trolling saga point,

that I think a lot of these trolls knew already so much information about Chris Spice or everything. So it's like, did they get it right coincidentally? Or maybe there was, like, some hunch being like, well, you know. It's also a really sad watch. I was like, oh, go, gum.

I interrupted you. You had a question. Oh, no, no, no. I was just saying, like, I wonder if it was actually a coincidence or not. Or maybe they had a hunch of some kind to be like, maybe the parents did actually do this. And let's just, like, run with the story.

I guess it was a hint. Yeah, that means, um, how, how likely is it for these galapels to be so close with Chris? Honestly. Honestly. Right. Right.

Yeah. Reality is sometimes harsh, unfortunately. I think one of the things that, did you just quote Thanos? Reality is often harsh. Reality is often harsh. It would be whatever I want it to be.

I wasn't even aware because I've never even seen this fucking movie. You've seen the memes. You've seen the memes. I've seen the memes. I don't remember them. You know subconsciously. That meme was living rent free in my head somewhere.

The one thing that I felt very sad about watching this documentary is Chris's clear nostalgia and almost want to be back in high school. And the fact that Chris never grows out of it. Yeah. That's what really just felt very sad watching. Because, you know, this has been going on.

We have videos of since Christmas, God knows how young, and it going up and just never changes. And always wants to be back in high school where things were simple and had gal pals. Was their high school life good? Probably compared to now. So they claim. Right, right. They claim was great because they had gal pals. And, yeah, that's it really.

Also, I believe, I believe, you know, they used to frequent the local game store and all a lot as a child, is that correct? Or is a teenager? I'm not too sure about, personally. Well, I mean, I feel like when you, people have a lot more patience when you're a child, right? And I felt that Chris had a lot of luxuries,

probably, the fact that people would probably, you know, they wouldn't question a lot of things and they would also be a lot of very patient with some things, I'd imagine, that people aren't really when you're an adult. People get kind of scared. Like there was a whole arc, if you will, with Chris in the game store.

Yes. where Chris ended up... Arc. Yeah, an arc. There's arcs in the story. There's multiple arcs. So Chris, how did this start with Chris in the game store? Because you're trying to explain this rough arc.

Okay. Chris went to a local game store where they played games and bought games. Pokemon trading cards. Yeah, right. Yeah, and I could play games on the TV as well on the Wii at that time, I believe. And that's where they met their female friend,

which they later drew, know, in a certain way. Through a rock. Yeah. Reeled her in. So yeah, in this game place, Chris really liked this, this female friend and got way too touchy several times, way too many times, even though she addressed this in emails privately.

But Chris continued to do so. And eventually that relationship fell out after the image was leaked by Chris themselves. It's like who is every Who leaked all this information? It's always Chris. It's always Chris, yeah. So yeah, and after that point Chris still continued to go to the game store

for a little bit longer before they started causing way too much trouble with the manager getting very annoyed by their constant hogging of the TV of the games, possibly even shouting racial slurs at the African American children. Yikes.

Every single time you want to root for Chris, just so you hear something, you're like, for fuck, say. Yeah. Fuck. You know, I get it if like, you know, Chris tried to like approach the goal, you know, to be like, I just wanna be in a nice relationship

with you, you know, like, not in like a weird way kind of thing. And then they're just like, no, I'm gonna do the worst thing possible to try and move this forward or move the relationship forward. Had to be racist towards kids. Really? Yeah.

Really? Yeah. It's like being a nuisance is one thing. Hogging the TV is one thing. It's almost. There's only one thing worse than a racist. A child. Yeah, that's true.

It's like a comic book villain at times. You know, it's almost, it's like a, it's like a Darmann video, right? It's so textbook racist or in some ways where it's like, you can't make this up. No one would do, no one would act like this. And so anyway, carry on, carry on the game store. So yeah, they were banned.

And after about nine months, I believe, Chris made a video on YouTube addressing the manager of the game store. Thinking that, you know, if you put his name in the, in the title of the video, he would just magically see it and see this video addressed to him. Well, like the manager's real name in the title. Obviously, yeah. You know, because people just going on to YouTube and just typing out their full name, he's made a video about me.

Maybe if it wasn't like his name in the title at all, It was like the stock DV, like, SMQ005 or whatever. Chris started the video with this video is addressed to the manager of the game store, blah, blah, blah. And please let me back. I'll learn my lesson. I don't like that. I remember this. Yeah, I do remember this.

And the manager was like, no. Yeah. Like about half a year, maybe after that, Chris was convinced by a trollsome gal pal or a girlfriend online to go back to the game store and try to get themselves unbanned. Right. They actually recorded the conversation privately on their person. Of course. Because Chris's girlfriend, e-girlfriend at the time, as far as they knew, thought it would be a very good idea.

And they would be able to threaten the manager with like, oh, you said this and I don't know. Right. Use this blackmail. Right. Right. And then the manager said, no. And just kicked him out again. And I think threatened to call the police.

And then on the way out, Chris called the manager a Jew. and um you know what i mean you see what i mean you see what i mean and that that happened right yeah that happened and then other things happened yes about another year after that chris um chris went back to the store with with their mother actually and um this was after after their elderly father had died already right so they went back to the store because they saw a new banner up on the store saying under

under new management or under a new owner and they realized that the manager of the store now became the owner of the store and became angry again, they were kicked out and on the way out, the manager of the store was run over by Chris's car twice.

See, the thing was... Not accidentally, right? Well, the thing was, we're not really sure what was the order of the situation, but both Chris's mother and Chris themselves were driving the car and each took a turn to

run over. This is pretty horrible. This sounds like a fucking looney-tune skits. It's fucked up. It's so, you can't make this up. It actually sounds like a loony tune skit. Right, right, right.

So I'm not sure who did it first. Like, did Chris accidentally do it and then... Swap. Oh, your turn. Finish it. Finish.

Finish the job. Please, mother. Or maybe they thought that, like, the second time the other person driving was like, cover for them, you know?

Right, right. You take the ball. It was me. So then it was run over one twice. But anyway, yeah, they were both charged with a manslaughter. No,

it wasn't manslaughter. It was like grievous barley harm or, I don't know. Was the, was a sauna owner okay? Um, the owner was okay, actually,

and he actually wanted the, the charges to be dropped or at least lessened. Damn. Oh. Yeah. What a nice manager. After all the show they went through.

So we got racism, homophobia, hit and run. Like, is this person just speed, running hay crimes now. There's more, there'll be more. She's trying to like 100% hey crimes.

Like getting the Xbox achievement, man. It's like a bingo list of crimes. It is shocking how many you can accidentally commit when you're not really aware. Is Chris Chan the original gamer? Yeah. The completionist. They're completionist.

Oh God. I mean, I mean some people might say that Chris might be the first let's player in a way. Yeah, because Chris, Chris did videos of Little Big Planet? Chris made a video on Little Big Planet back in 2002 or three. Wow. And they were narrating their actions over it, which makes like...

That's a let's play. Like one of the first let's plays ever, yeah. Holy shit. And that review was actually published in the Nintendo Game magazine. Or it was it? Nintendo Power was. Yeah, it was published. Wow. Actually, Chris had two things published in Nintendo Power over the course of their life.

It was like an Animal Crossing video, if I remember correctly. Was Animal Crossing? Yeah, yeah. It was. Wow. And they were talking about what they were doing. And one of the first things that Chris did during their narration in that video

was saying that they were a high functioning autistic virgin. Oh yeah, yeah, I know. This is something that Chris often mentioned very often. It was I'm a high functioning autistic virgin, which you know, when you watch it, it's like, what? Yeah. You're just not used to hearing that. That's like four words I didn't think I would hear

next to each other. Or someone's self-proclaimed. Yeah, right. Which is just, it's bizarre. And the whole, like I said, there's arcs, right? And the game store is over like 10 years. No, no, there's quite a long time, if I remember correctly. About five years, yeah.

It's quite a long time. The game store arc. And also watching these, this documentary, it's kind of, because it's all in chronological order. It's concerning how often stuff gets revisited and Chris tries again. So what other arcs are there? Well, like I said, the trolling one feels like it lasts forever.

Yeah. The initial, I mean, Chris is always being trolled with that. Did ever stop though? It didn't really, but there was like, I feel like in- The fourth Ninja War. arc then. Just kept going.

Yeah, yeah. It's like the manga arc that you wish ended like 10 years ago. They just kept on going. And like, you know, there's some really abhorrent trolling that was done. And again, like some of it is so bad that I do still feel sorry for Chris.

Like, you know, wouldn't he shove stuff up his, you know, his member at the time? Up his member. Did he do that or is it his butt? It was the butthole. Which isn't very good. Obviously, yeah. But yeah, this was a very unfortunate, very dark episode in Chris's life where Chris believed that their e-girlfriend at the time was being kidnapped by their evil brother or whatever.

And also their PlayStation Network account was also being hacked and held hostage. So Chris had to choose which one. Would you prefer to save your girlfriend or your PSM account? At which. Which they chose? Chris chose the girlfriend, but by choosing so, Chris believed that they would get both because they made the right choice. Like a Bible, like you made the right choice. Exactly, yeah.

It was the five-pounder. Yeah, it's the money of the Bible. It's the money on the Bible. You get both if you pick the Bible. But yeah, during the course of this debacle, Chris was tasked with either, I think, burning their sonature medallin, which they, which they, which they fashioned out of a, like, Play-Doh or a clay. Very iconic piece of, uh, either, either burn it or put it up their butthole. So Chris chose to, you know, cut it up into smaller priests first because it was too big.

Oh, oh, of course, totally understandable. Don't burn it at that point. You know, it's already destroyed, but don't burn it. They put it up your butt. You can put it back together afterwards, right? What was the logic behind cutting it up instead of burning it? Is it ever explained? Uh, no.

It's just like, what, if you're destroying it, Why not choose the option of destroying it? Well, because you can still put it back together, right? Maybe, is that the thinking? Maybe Chris thought that they didn't have access to matches. Oh, I'm not sure. We don't know. Or just kind of ironic, given what happens later.

But yeah, yeah. And what happens later? No, no, no, we'll say, but we'll say. You don't know? I don't know. I'm not sure. It's like one of the most biggest plot points in the whole story.

We haven't even got to the plot twist? I'm so, I'm so, It's like one of the most well-known parts of the story. I might know it. Maybe we'll talk about it. It's in part 39, by the way. Part 39. I remember because this is the part

that I was waiting for to happen because I heard so much about it. I don't want it to know. I know, it's insane, it's insane. So yeah, Chris put the thing up their butt and filmed it. And obviously in your version, you censor it for the... I believe it was like a Skype call it or something.

So the person acting as the girlfriend and also the evil twin brother. They were the same 13 year old boy, by the way. 13 year old boy. 13 year old boy doing this. So yeah, after the shoving, they revealed themselves to be a 13 year old boy and that the girl never existed, which distraught Chris. There were other... Well, yeah, naturally.

There were other members of that trolling group in the call, but just listening and, you know, being muted. But after that, they came out and said, Jesus, stop. Like, they knew that. Yeah, I remember this. Yeah. They knew that this boy went way too far, obviously.

Yeah. Yeah, it's so disgusting that you know that only like a sick kid would ask someone to do this. When I was 13, I think I was just playing Jenga or something. I don't know what the fuck I was doing. I certainly wasn't thinking about that. I wonder, like, how do these kids do this? Yeah, right?

That's like, throughout this thing, it's almost as much as Chris was doing some really abhorrent stuff. I almost find that everyone involved was also very guilty of doing some really heinous things. And it felt like anyone who went near this like cesspit of drama was just dragged into doing really horrible stuff. Honestly, it just sounds the entire thing just sounds like a shit show. Like it's like the worst part of the internet in every aspect. It shows every single terrible thing a troll can do. It shows the terrible nature of what feeding trolls does. You know, I don't think there's,

and that's why it's almost hard to look away because it's so fascinating. It's such a magnificent train crash, right? That you just like, yeah. It's like if the train crashes and does 10 back flips and then lands and then catches fire. Yeah.

It's just almost like everything that, it's just so insane. And I think that's why, again, you should go and watch Gino's video on it, or videos. Wait, well, hold on, like, you guys, you guys like blue-balls me with this like point. All right, okay.

So there's the whole trolling I don't know. Is this the best talk? So, yeah, go on, go on. So, yeah, so the, so the, so the, so the trolling with the, with the fake girlfriends thing went on for quite a while. Pretty much until Chris's father died. Right. When he was, when, when, when, when, about two or three years, yeah.

So after that, they decided, you know, let's leave Chris alone. You know, they've suffered enough, I guess. I guess that was their, there are things. Yeah, two years later, I think we've done enough damage. I think this is enough. Like, like, it should have been stopped at the medallion being shoved up. Yeah, so there was a solid year where Chris didn't do much except occasional Facebook posts. Yeah.

And then, fast forward to 2014, where in the middle of the night, Chris was, I believe, trying to make a cup of coffee. And the extension cable, which connected to their coffee maker, it was like draped over the bathroom door. And, like, the constant opening and closing, like, damaged the wire. Yeah. It caught fire. The house caught fire. Yeah, it was a... You also have to understand

that at this time, Chris's house is a hoarder's house. Yeah, right. So, you know, when you hoard stuff, your house just goes up in flames. Yeah, of course. That was the problem is the reason why this was so jank

and the reason why the coffee machine was so fucked to begin with is because there was no floor space. Right, right. And I believe there was two or three cats inside this hoarder's house. Oh, no. The cats, I don't know if the cats,

I assume the cats, unfortunately, didn't make it. One cat dies, yeah. Oh. Yeah, the, it's, Now I'm sad. That's what's so sad about this is that, you know, in some aspects you kind of don't feel sorry

that Chris ruined their own life, you know, because you almost, you know, this is done by yourself. Yeah. But I think the most unfortunate part about this is not only is our Chris's parents and dragged into all of this mess, but also pets as well. Yeah, just like other, you know,

like innocent bystanders just got involved. You know, this manager got ran over. You know, there's many points in this story that are so sad just for, again, it's like a vacuum. If you're involved with Chris in any way, generally not good stuff was happening. Yeah, and the hoarder's house, there's pictures of it. I'm sure we can show it on screen, right?

It's totally fun. Yeah, probably fine. It's fine. This is what it looks like. It's pretty bad. It's very, very bad. So was Chris the hoarder or was it the parents? Chris was mostly not the hoarder.

Actually, Chris's room was the most tidy. His mother, right? It was Chris's mother, yeah. She was the hoarder. And actually, actually, resulted in a pretty, I guess, infamous video of Chris, who, after posting a house tour video on YouTube, which is insane to think that you would post a tour of that. Yeah.

Right. For a girl, obviously. Right, right, right. Girl, as far as Chris knew. Chris's father found out and demanded that Chris take down the video off of the internet, which was kind of an impossible task for what you do. Yeah. And then during the recording session where Chris was shouting at the camera and all the trolls to take it down now, now, now, now, now, Chris's father walks in and they have this little discussion about Chris saying, about Chris's father saying, you know, if the health department sees this video, we're going to be evicted, you know.

You just, you just, you just suck a knife in our backs and killed us with your video, is what he said. Right. So it was very. Jesus. Yeah. Crazy video. When you're watching this video, you have to watch the video

to get a real horrible sense of scale of this. It is essentially like a jungle gym. You can't like, even the camera doesn't, you can't see anything. It's junk everywhere. And it's just too zoomed in. So every time you're like looking around, you can't get a sense of scale of anything

because it's just so much stuff. And obviously, you know, hoarder's houses are basically just fire hazards. I mean, that's the reason why you get evicted because you can't do that. That's exactly what. what happens, right? Cockroaches, pretty whole also.

I believe the cats were also sick at the time, is that right? Or they weren't? I wouldn't be surprised. You can't be healthy. There were later, there were other new later cats who became sick in the house, yeah. Right, I remember watching a video when they moved to the new place, which was given, was it provided by the government? There was a new temporary rental place, yeah, that was provided by the house insurance agency.

And, yeah, I remember there was a point in this video where you could hear the cat, and it sounded like it was dying. This sounded very bad. Dogs too, honestly. Oh, the dogs as well, right? No, leave the animals out of it. It's a horrible story. You know, and I think it puts into,

you often ask the question of like, how ethical is it to watch all this stuff and document it and talk about it? Is that something you often struggle with when you're making these videos? I do, yeah. Yeah. Well, I think one thing about your video

that I could get is that it seemed like you weren't, it was just pure documentation. Right. You weren't putting your opinion into it was just pure, this is what happened and this is just a pure documentation of things you can already find on the internet. Yeah, it's kind of just like, you know,

just laying out the information and kind of leaving it up to the viewer to make their own opinions about the whole case, whatever might be. For better off it was. Because I think that's what really attracted me to your videos is that, yeah, again, there was just no input from you, but also made you a kind of a mysterious figure.

It's like, you always stop the video saying, like, who is Chris? What drives it? I'm like, who's Gino? Why is he making this video? Which is why I wanted to bring you on Because I really wanted to learn more about you as well And what drives you to make these videos Because I feel like, you know

It takes a mental toll, I imagine, Having to document this stuff And there are some lines that you have to say out loud Because you narrate Chris's words And there's some very funny Out of context clips of you being like Just shouting really funny stuff I'm putting stuff up your ass

I just sorry I hate to do you like that it's the burden he has to bear yeah it is the burden at which point were you just like committed to like I mean I mean yeah yeah that way you were just committed to I assume completing this thing I mean you've gotten this far right

I mean I was committed since the beginning I imagine just I was I was not expecting this to last this long unfortunately but I do understand that some parts may be a bit boring for some and just a constant maybe Facebook like readings of a Facebook posts or tweets for example

which I do cut down as well but I find it interesting and relevant to the story which is a kind of conflict from me every anime has its filler art I find that's what makes your video so compelling is that it almost feels like no stern it's left unturned like every single thing is included is that fair to say that you include pretty much everything

Not really. Most things, most things, things are really not interesting or not relevant to the development of the story. Then, yeah, I do skip over them. So how much stuff is, you know, when you have the episode, how much stuff in between like tweets or Facebook post is cut? Like if you had to give like a ratio of like how much information makes it in to not in the video. Possibly about 1% doesn't make it out.

Oh, so nearly everything else goes in. It's like literally everything goes in. All right. Wow. I mean, it depends on how much detail, on how much time I spend on it. Like, for example, if it's a vaguely interesting tweet, for example, I just mentioned that Chris talked about this. Or like, if it's more compelling, if it's more interesting,

I just read word for word, most of it, for example. So I spend more time. Yeah, because I was about to say, like, if you had said, like, oh, about 20%, that would be like, geez, how much content is there on this person? A worrying amount. Yeah, right? Like, I already watch your videos and I go,

Mike, this is more information than, you know, several generation families that, you know, have on the internet, let alone just this one single person. Oh, God, I remember, what year did Chris transition? 2014, I believe. Right. Right. And it is a very disturbing phase. Yeah, that's what I want to, like, what led to the transition, I guess.

There's a lot of stuff that Chris does and later Christine. They're very, like, worrying, I'd say. Right. Well, that happened a lot. What's the line of worrying? I've already had a lot of worrying things this episode. So how did it start? We know that, how did all of it begin with Chris? The transitioning. Yeah. Chris, very early on, exhibited some interest in being a female.

Like, for example, writing on public posts in a troll-created forum, which was made to appear like a fan side for Christian. but they're all just trolls. Yeah, of course. Yeah, of course. Chris said that sometimes they thought that maybe life would have been better if they were born as a female. But since I was born with, since like God delivered this package, I must like fill it, I don't know, something like that. Chris, Chris sound a lot more more poetic than I do. Yeah, of course, of course.

But then Chris started leaking some, some, Chris was sending nude photos to other other girlfriends, which I featured. Chris trying on their mother's underwear, bra as well. So that's that was wearing as well. Yeah. Yeah. And then after that,

another e-girlfriend convinced Chris that maybe they would feel better jogging because they were very self-conscious about their man boobs bouncing around. So she suggested maybe Chris should wear a sports bra. And then Chris discovered that they really liked

the feeling of a sports bra. And pretty much never took it off after that point, honestly, until they transitioned and started wearing, you know, women's underwear full time. Right, right. It's like, some people suggest that maybe Chris was influenced by trolls saying some quotes exactly that Chris was convinced to become a female

to explore their feminine side. This is questionable. No one's really sure how this happened. But, yeah, Chris started first identifying as like a lesbian soul in male body, something like that. Okay. I'm not very well educated on this stuff.

It's very, I try to, but it is, it's quite a lot of information. Yeah. Yeah. And after about another half year or so, they fully embraced the identity of the new name,

Christine, and changed their gender officially, even on their driver's license, so it's quite legit at this point. Yeah. And they do use gender transitioning medication as well. Okay. Right, right.

Yeah. I say concerning, because during the first phase, it was very much a DIY transition. That wasn't the first phase, actually. Was it not? It was quite a bit after that. Oh, was it?

I felt like that, because that was what stuck out to me. What goes before DIY? Well, so... Well, Chris decided to expedite matters by listening first, by listening to binaral beats on YouTube. What is binaural beats? I still don't know what that is. Bynaral beats is a type of like a humming noise that's supposed to influence the way your mind works and kind of change you in a certain way.

Like, for example, it uses like a certain frequency, I believe that it almost acts as like a type of hypnosis of sorts. Is it a lot of, is it bullshit? Is it actually science behind it? Is this a well-known thing? This is the first I'm hearing of this. No, this is very much like a music, like,

is it really a real thing? I mean, there is some science behind it, but like the whole thing of like hypnosis and stuff like that is very, I mean, I mean, Barninal beats making you like feel uncomfortable or comfortable.

Yeah, I can see that, happening, but changing you from male organs to female sexual organs. Chris was trying, Chris was trying to grow boobs. Boops, and then Chris was actually going to the actual channel of these bernaral beats and asking the uploader, will this bernel beats video cause my testicles to develop into ovaries, or will they make another video about that or something like that? It's very sad, because in some aspects, this is where other aspects of the internet fail

Chris, right? Like this is a predatory thing to, I don't know if they encouraged or they said that, yeah, you'll grow boobs from listening to this beat. That's bullshit. But it's also, when you're desperate enough, as I imagine Chris was at the time, I mean, we're willing to believe it.

I mean, I'm sure Chris has fallen from more obvious stuff with like, because this was after the traveling phase. Right, right, right. And didn't Chris end up in hospital for trying to, so this is a very disturbing thing. Um, they believed, uh, that the, uh, opposite sex organs were inside. All they had to do was cut it open. And they did indeed do that, right?

And they ended up in hospital? Um, what they, what they cut was the, uh, was the space in, in between the, uh, the douche, right? I believe that's, yeah, I believe that's a way to call it, yes. I think it's called the gooch. I think it's called the gooch. The gooch. The gooch.

The gooch. The gooch, gooch, sorry. Skin between the balls and the blood, right? Yeah, they cut. Right, that one. Pretty deep cut, right? They cut. Peronium?

The perinium. I don't fucking know. I'm not educated on this. I don't touch that place often. It is the perineum, also called the taint. The taint. So that's the, that's the space between the hole and. I'm so sorry, viewers.

I'm so sorry. We're using scientific terms here. Chris believed that in this space was where their labia would be if they were born as a woman. So they. So they. They cut it open and posted photos. Oh, oh, oh. They posted photos.

Oh, yes. What? Wait, of after the act? Like, after they cut? It must look like a crime scene. Jesus. Looks fine to me, I don't know. You poor man.

I've seen worse. I can't tell if, you know, if you've been broken by all of this. You're just, you've been so numb to it for so long. Like a war veteran now. Yeah. This is a maze me.

Do you know what sound a man makes when they die? I do. And I like it. They went to hospital for it, right? They were very reluctant to go to the hospital because they thought they were. It could have been.

It could have died. From what I understand it was very worrying. It could have like. Yeah, no shit. They could have like like abscess or something and died from it eventually. But yeah, eventually trolls convinced Chris to go to the hospital

and get it checked. Oh, the trolls convinced Chris to go to the hospital. Which is weird because then Later on, I'd say from this point onwards is where it used to be like kind of like a almost torture hostage situation. Yeah. I want to torture you, but I want to keep you alive.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Because a lot of the trolls, and I believe the especially what happened later on as the founding member of the Kiwi farms. Right. Often would financially look after Chris and would help manage Chris's finances. Right.

Wasn't it later there was like a group of people, right? People would often, they did a go fund me, correct, after the, something after the watchman or something? Was that what they called? The Watchman is a different thing. This is insane. So these people who had originally were trolling Chris ended up then...

Supporting him. Supporting Chris and almost being protective of who can have contact with. Chris, right? Yes, yes, they were. It's weird, right? Because it feels like a hostage thing. Yeah. It's like, I'm going to feed you food and take care of you,

but you're still my hostage. Right. The weirdest cult I've ever heard. It's very strange. Yeah, the thing is, is after Chris's father died, the main trolls behind all that kind of stopped their trolling and then moved on to Kiwi Farms just like

as an observation kind of thing and looking after Chris. But like the other trolling that happened after that point was made by other people which were not affiliated really with the original core. Which then there's like tons of different factions of people who are obsessed with Chris. So who are the watchmen? The watchman was

a group created a comic drawn by Frank Miller. Pretty poor at a movie out of apparently. Comic was definitely better. Watchmen's not that long. Anyway, Watchmen were a group which were created

for the sole purpose of protecting Chris. Right, right. Which did not work at all. They're broken up at this point when it was revealed that some members of the Watchmen were actively involved

with trolling Chris. Backstabbing the Watchmen. This is why it's such a fucking Like every single person involved is, you know, has questionable motives. Yeah, because I only found out about the watchman from the recent events, right?

And there's like three or four other groups or something that were all involved, in all this stuff, and they all have their own names and stuff like that. When did documenting Chris really reach its peak of popularity? Peak of popularity. Well, now it's very popular. Yeah, yeah.

But, you know, before this, you know, I definitely felt like there was an increase people who are benefiting and profiting off of Chris in many ways by making content around Chris in a almost harmful way. This is definitely a more recent phenomenon in this half a few years, I think. Which is, I feel like where it started, you know, it was kind of improving. Yeah. And Chris was not really involving much and people were not really trolling Chris as much.

And then when the popularity of documenting Chris, I swear it feels like it then became, started going backwards and this trolling starting to get worse again and kind of coincides with the idea guys so I got to know the idea guys

yeah the idea guys what's that it's another group another trolling group which how many trolling groups are there that is absurd amount I just love the names

there's a new one every month yeah okay okay so the idea guys so the idea guys were very detrimental to Chris's psyche because they convinced Chris that all these different alternate realities alternate dimensions

of like anime land and all these all these cartoons actually existed and you could travel to them interdimensional yeah they were the ones yeah okay okay yeah so and to this day chris still believes that they can access this different dimension yes and chris actually believed that at some points they were possessed by like sonichu and other other characters and that they were sonature right right something like they were like it was it was sonchu speaking through their body for like a solid don't worry about it don't worry about it She was just like, all right, I'm going to yee out. This is a bit too much for me, man.

Anyway, yeah, Sonature was apparently talking through Chris's body for about half a year, honestly. It's just like, you can't explain. Like, it's so hard to keep up with this because even, you know, when we watch the whole series in depth, it is so confusing and there's so much stuff. And we've barely even touched on the fact that one of the main aspects of what Chris was doing was making a comic about sonature and all the stuff was. That's what really started the whole attention on Chris because there are a comic was so crazy and at Lange and people realized that Chris was actually using the comic as a way to live out their own fantasies. You know, like a self-insert. Like a self-insert. Yeah. Like a self-insert.

Yeah. The main character was Chris. Basically. So they believed they were Sonature. Right. Yeah. For a little bit. And then there was, there were other characters as well, right? From what I remember, there was like Rose Choo and stuff like that. Ross Choo is Sonichu's love interest and wife. Yeah. Yeah. And there's also, I believe Chris also at many points would include real people that would die or... Yeah. Prince of something, right? There would be the main villains, but no one actually died, actually, in Chris's comments.

Because Chris believed that Quakeville was real, and they didn't want to cause that much harm to their characters because they would feel hurt. Right, right. You know, I really believed this. I say right, right, and fun. Yeah, yeah, I totally understand what's being said here. Yes. Totally following what's going on right now.

Also, you know, one other thing that I also found. very worrying was Chris's spending and lack of financial. Okay. Where did Chris get an income from? Now I'm curious. Chris has a social security or disability payment, which Chris calls the tugboat. It's about $800 a month. And this is what Chris uses to pay off credit card debts and buy logos.

which brings him in, which brings Chris into more debts. Right. Chris gets money and immediately spends it on like toys, Legos. Yeah, right. Which is very disturbing because I think Chris's mother at the time wasn't working either, very old, needed. And they were mainly relying on the income. Like the mother must have already been like retired at that point.

Oh, they were. Yeah. No one's been working in that family since since the 90s, I believe. Right, right. Right. There's a very, very chilling video later on where, Chris is getting their mother to promote Chris's selling of merchandise. Yes.

And saying that they need money for food and stuff. Right. There's several videos like that. It's very concerning stuff. Like merch is in like what? Handmade merch by Chris. Oh, it's like the Sonnychew medallions and stuff like that, right? Yeah, there were medallions.

They were signed photos, I believe, as well and stuff like that, yeah. And I assume it's the trolls that are buying that kind of stuff like just to like fuel the fire, I guess. At this point, are they really trolls? Are they just like almost like fans? Superfan. People wanna get in on it. It kind of sounds like a symbiotic relationship, right? Where Chris feeds the trolls and the trolls feed Chris. Yeah, it just doesn't end.

Yeah. And by acquiring objects from Chris, they become part of Christry in this. Yeah, that's, no, no, that's serious. These people are very invested in it. I love that, so. I love, I enjoy, I really enjoy keeping up with it. But also, I do feel like, I'm consuming something bad. Like I am taking part and helping and fueling

a very dark side of the internet. Yeah. But it's also just so insanely fascinating just because again, we've never had anything like this in the history of the internet, I feel. Like it's so, it's so outlandish, right? Like, is it a good thing? I'd argue you in the history of the world. Honestly, like it's just so, everything about it's just so outlandish,

it just doesn't sound real. I think because everything that should have protected, Chris failed. Right. It should have been a safety. It feels like this is almost like a case study, you know, yeah, of how not to parent, how not to, how not to act on the internet.

Literally a case study of how not to do everything. Yeah, yeah, it feels like. Anything about this, just don't do it. Do you feel, you know, when you're, because obviously you're making the documentary, how do you handle dealing with like the, I guess the moral implications of it sometimes and struggling with that if you do it all?

I usually don't. Yeah, you're just like whatever, just power throw. Yeah, because I convince myself that I'm just documenting. It's all right. I agree. You know, I don't see what you're doing is anything inappropriate or wrong by any means.

Right. Yeah, because it's not like you're like one of the trolls that's putting information out, right? Like it's already existed out there. But I think by watching it in its entirety or watching it in parts, you really do just end up feeling sad about the whole situation. Yeah. Whereas I feel like if you hear a little bit and you get very, very tailored information in a way that leaves out important details,

you might be more likely to participate or fuel trolls to join in. Whereas if you watch, I feel like if you watch the documentary, there's no way you can be sitting there thinking, yeah, I want to join in and troll. You're just like, fuck, man, Jesus. Yeah, definitely. Good evening. It's me, the monk.

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One of the main reasons I reached out to you and asked you to come on the podcast is, well, first of all, I found out that you lived in Japan, which is great, very convenient for us because we only let in-person guests come on. In two, obviously, there was some massive recent news at the time of recording. This will be published a lot later.

And I kind of want to get into the most recent history. And obviously, if people who are, sorry, Chris, sorry, come on, sorry, sorry. Every time we say Chris or Gino's like, Fuck. Funny you dies and so. Must be like whiplash. You know, like we said, there was some very big news

and I guess let's talk about the very recent history, sorry. Yeah, you got it. You got it. About it, because I think the viewers who don't know anything will be intrigued or viewers who do know, we'll want a little recap maybe.

So what would you say is like the very recent, where it began, I guess, or where the arc or whatever, if you will. So this all started at the end of July, of this year when a certain phone call was leaked like a discord voice chat was like between chris and a certain female party a real female a real female by the way actual female who was actually obsessed with chris right that's that's that's a different female okay okay right there was somebody genuinely like wanted to be with chris yes he was in this group is that yes yes yes there was

but this is a different this is a very disgusting female trollsome female and they were chatting away and Chris revealed very casually how their recent development in their relationship with their mother was going and how it started and how the mother... When did this development start? I guess June or July of this year, as far as we know. Right. Yeah, Chris was exploring the mother's body. This is actually sickening to get.

It's so disgusting. It's so disgusting. It's quite crazy. But I remember when it started, everyone was. was like, please say, psych. Like, please say this is a joke. I remember that even the Kiwi Farms members were like, no, no, no, I'm sure there's a mistake.

Yeah. What was originally leaked was a four and a half minute edit of the call, which was very heavily edited, which originally removed all mentions of the female party in the call. So you didn't hear it all. So it sounded very fake and edited. So it thought maybe like things... They're stitched together to make it sound like that.

But no, later at another point, like a nine-minute call was leaked with the full content. And no, Chris was actually doing this, apparently. I was, I was hoping that Chris was, like, astral projecting and, like, maybe in their mind having intercourse with their mother in Quigville. Just wanted to justify it in any way that made it not real. I know, yeah, I know I saw that argument quite a bit when the news first broke out, because, you know, the whole thing of Chris, you know, with the whole Quigville thing,

being, you know, almost in this delusional world, right? So I think the biggest argument was that they just imagined that. they, you know, did stuff with their mother. But in reality, we have no proof kind of thing, other than this call, obviously. Yeah. Yeah, Chris was talking about how at first she said no. Oh, no.

And how she was very confused. But then apparently, Chris satisfied her in a way that their father never could. It's, it's, you can't make this up. It's so fucked. I actually feel physically sick. Yeah, I do. I feel it's disgusting.

This is like every bone in my, Like every bone in my body, like, I think this is the worst and most like, I definitely feel we need to put a disclaimer at the beginning of this episode. Yeah, we're gonna have to. Because, yeah, yeah, and what's more messed up is that this all came out of Chris's mouth as well.

Like, this wasn't paraphrasing or anything, this was like, like, their voice. It was how proud, I think Chris sounded was very disturbing and how almost, like, happy they were, was very disturbing. Yeah. And it was just, you know, for every time you feel that Chris understands social norms

or understands the situation, there's just another one that slaps you in the face where you're like, Chris has no understanding of what the fuck is right or wrong, I feel. Like, I feel like I've heard serial killer stories that are less disturbing than some of the stuff I've heard right right now. Like this is, this is just going like so many stages beyond what is even like comprehensible of what a human mind can do, you know?

It's, uh, it's, if someone wrote this in a story, they would be like unrealistic. Yeah, I know. This is bullshit. This is so stupid. No one would ever do this. And it's just like, it's just so sad. And then also, Chris later did, is Chris currently in prison or in jail?

Currently in jail, yes. Rightly so. Yeah. For incest charges, I believe. For incest charges, yes. Because over 200 people called the local police department after that call was leaked. And Chris and their mother were actually first separated, you know, Chris went, Chris had to find some other form of accommodation for a while

while their mother was being checked in the health center. And yeah, Chris was at a hotel, and there were lots of people outside the hotel recording and taking pictures and like waiting for a celebrity to come out of the door. It was disgusting. The trolls immediately found where it was staying, right? It's just disgusting these trolls doing this. Like, what's wrong with you?

Like, this is not something to, like, try and get a scoop out. This is just tragic. And then the police came around And Chris was arrested publicly in front of everyone And then Chris said that the merge was happening Like the merge of dimensions of cartoon and reality were happening And I was like Chris doesn't realize What they're getting into

Yeah I mean I actually Because you know when I saw the news break out And I think there was a guy who was live streaming the entire thing Yes yeah Yes it's another lol cow if you know So one of the low cows was live streaming the arrest of Chris These guys seem so pathetic Oh yeah, no, absolutely pathetic human being.

But because, like, the guy was shouting at Chris, like, like a fucking paparazzi. Yeah, yeah. How do you feel? Like, what's going on in your mind right now? And of course, you know, Chris is like smiling, very jovial throughout this whole arrest. But what's so disturbing is that throughout that entire time where Chris is talking about, you know, the dimensions merging and that they have, you know, like sonnet chew and rose chew in their presence or whatever they were saying. The entire time, again, they were smiling. Like, they have no idea how much.

shit they're actually in right there. Yeah, did Chris understand what being arrested? I don't, I don't even think Chris understood what was happening. Also, I believe they were like plugging their channel as well. Well, I think, yeah, they were plugging their channel or something like that, yeah. They were plugging the channel a lot of places. It's like, what are you guys doing?

There was so much wrong with that lifestyle. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Kind of just wanna bleach my ears. Yeah, right? Yeah, right. Yeah. It was really hard to sit through the footage, but my God, it was insane.

Yeah, it was insane. Yeah, as fucked as it is, it is. It's also super fucked the sheer amount of people that are trying to just milk this for content. A lot of people were making really terrible clickbait videos that were like 10 minutes that didn't include anything. And we'll just put Chris's name in the title because it was a hot topic. Of course. And I believe you actually went on, you announced a hiatus after this happened. Yeah, I was actually originally playing a hiatus anyway after Part 60 came out.

But in light of these events, I thought 59's close enough. So I released 59, I guess, as scheduled, maybe a day after. the arrests or so and then I did a hiatus stream saying I'm going to on break until next year year round yeah it's because of the yeah because I want things to cool down I don't want to take advantage of the situation so you know I'll back away for a bit yeah I mean props to you it'd be very easy to be like you know what this is probably the highest search terms the best SEO for chris chan right now you know it's everywhere every video about chris chan's getting a million views I could just pump it out right now and get two mill but I yeah props

you, man. I do. Yeah, that's a big boy move right there. Yeah. Oh, yeah, you want a lot of respect points for me for doing that. There must have been a tough call. I'm sure a lot of people like, no, release the next part. Tell us about all the details. Actually, most people were very understanding.

Really? Yeah, actually, it was very surprised. I mean, I guess from the seriousness of the situation, right? Yeah, when it happened, you know, did you get like a barrage of messages and emails? I did, yes. They're slowed down for now, yeah, but I probably did get two or three hundred, Twitter DMs saying, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry.

I'm sorry for your loss. It's like a personal loss, like a family member or something. Jeez. Is this the end then? Do you think this is the end of the story? It's a very quiet part of the story, at least. Right. But yeah, since Chris is in prison now, or in jail, actually,

awaiting trial in September, I believe. Yeah. There's nothing coming out of Chris. Nothing at all. So it's very quiet. It's just speculation and discussion. I do hope the, because in courthouses in America, you can just turn up, can't you?

You can turn up, but I believe there's laws against recording. Yeah, you can't record, yeah. You can write an account of what happened later. I somehow have the feeling that we'll get some audio recording. I somehow have a feeling that the trolls are going to find a way. They're going to find a way. It's going to be so sad, you know?

This is already discussed enough last thing you want. It's like 20 trolls in the courthouse just like giggling away, watching this all go down. I don't know. Don't be that guy. This is why this whole thing I say is a cesspit because anyone involved with this in most capacity is a piece of shit.

Like both parties are justice. You're good, you're good, I'm sorry. You know, there are a lot of people who are out there trying to take advantage in any single way they can to get a quick back. Yeah, exactly, exactly. Yeah, it's just, oh man, it's just nuts. The more I think about it, I'm just like,

this would be the greatest told fictional story of all time and then you remember horror. Nothing is fictional about this. I think the most horrible thing about how this is that, this is real. Yeah, exactly. This is actually, like this is, this actually happened.

Yeah. It's happened in real life and it's just so well documented. And it's just like all these events, when you hear them separately, they sound like, you know, like that would already be the worst moment of somebody's life. Right, like, like one of those things. And to think that that all came from one person.

Yeah, that's why I think, you know, people say most documented person in history, I don't think that's correct. I think it's the most embarrassing documentation of someone in history. No one has taken as many else as Chris. No one has self-given that many else. The sheer amount of disturbing stuff

that has been self-documented, you know, serial killers haven't reached this level of fucked up stuff. Yeah, exactly. We've had serial killers with more, like, class than some of the stuff that Chris has been doing, which is boring to say. Yeah.

You know, and I, again, like the whole situation is very sad. Yeah. And I've never wanted somebody to lose access to the internet more than Chris at many points. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, you just, sometimes you see people online and you just think you should not have

any kind of internet presence at all. And I think this is just the worst example of just like what everything that can go wrong and everything that has gone wrong. Yeah, when I found out that Chris had a Twitter, I was like, oh no. This, you know, I feel like Chris is, well, before this, before this drama happened recently,

Chris had been pretty tame online. Yeah. Chris had I think it actually commented in one of our videos. What? I believe so. Really? When we spoke about Chris on Trash Taste? He's serious?

I believe Chris had actually commented on it and a very normal comment. Right. And Chris had been pretty chill, I'd say. It was pretty calm about most things. As far as we know, yes. Until the shit storm happened. It was the calm before the storm.

Right. What was the arc before that then? Arc before that. I feel like it was mainly like a lot of people were hoping that and Chris was, it seemed, was getting better. and that was generally calmed down a lot and wasn't doing as many questionable things. Is that correct in saying?

Yeah, definitely. Right before this happened, there was a certain book published on Amazon comparing Andy Warhol to Christian. What? Because apparently there was a legit argument for that. Right. There was some interesting comparisons there. I actually had, I was in contact with the author before it was published and he gave me like a, an advanced copy,

seemed pretty good, I guess. And you read through it? I guess it was good. I didn't read too much of it, though. Didn't have much time. But Chris apparently did have enough time. They bought it themselves, and they were reading through it,

and yeah, they were enjoying it, actually. That's what's weird, is that Chris participates and consumes all the stuff about themselves. I mean, in a sense, there's like kind of a kind of coolness to being compared to someone like Andy Warhol, as much as like some weird shit,

Andy Warhol has done in his life. He's also like an artist. Yeah. So like I think to Chris would be like, oh, cool. Someone says I'm like Andy Warhol. That's kind of, that's kind of epic. What's most sad about this whole story is that at any point during Chris's earlier life could have been salvaged if their parents just took away the fucking internet.

Right. Take away the PS5, something. Just do something. Like a complete lack of parenting in many ways. Yes. Yeah. Why, how on earth was Chris posting all the stuff online? and the parents had absolutely zero knowledge.

How did that happen? And if they did have knowledge, why the fuck didn't they stop any of this? Well, maybe because they're old age, right? Could be. Maybe they're like a generation gap. They didn't understand the impact of... I don't think they understood the internet.

I just feel like everyone in their life has just failed Chris. Yeah. And it just feels like now Chris is now just a part of that cycle as well. Yeah. And... Well, it's what happens when your parents fail you and you take... You know, you often pick up... You know, I'm sure we've all done it

or you've picked up aspects of your parents that you're like, oh God, I wish I didn't pay you. pick that up. Like little things, you know, but normally with most people, it's little quirks, you know, it's like- Or like, you know, things you say. Yeah, yeah, it's small behavior,

not, you know, not life-destroying habits most of the time. Exactly. Yeah. Scary. It is a chilling tale about parenting, I feel, most of the time. Where do you think it all went wrong

or where do you think Chris was failed the most? Was it, and how much blame do you put on Chris? That's tricky. a lot of the blame goes to the parents. At the very beginning, they encouraged Chris to see the world as against Chris. You know, because Chris had autism and they were treated differently because Chris had autism. And any action that Chris did could be excused because Chris had autism. Right.

So, so Chris was raised with this understanding that the world was bullying Chris all the time. Which is not something you should teach to your kids. So Chris was given the mindset of I'm always the victim, but also I can be excused for my actions. Yeah. Chris, because their parenting was so bad, Chris was mostly raised by television, by cartoons, by anime games, by pornography as well. Chris learned most of the outside world from those sources. And Chris would often say things that would be like cliche lines. in a in a TV show like it takes a real man

to admit his mistakes he would say that and thinking that that would solve the problem sounds cool in a TV show yeah yeah not so much in reality and and they were infamously and they would infamously in their videos we do the the claw of fail as they say like

like this a threatening gesture right like a cartoon villain yeah oh like damn you and always took off their glasses for dramatic effect right right it just feels like a lot of that is also motivated by trying to have sex as well that too which is also caused by the media that that chris consumed like has this amazing goal that that one must achieve uh chris once stated in a video that's that some of the like some of the live goals were um or driving to ohio which chris completed playing the lottery which chris completed

and the virgin breaker was still not completed yet so chris was aiming to uh So, take that off. This felt like the monkey's palm of wishing. Chris got the wish complete, but at what cost? So I was gonna ask, before her mother, did she ever lose her virginity? Yes. Okay, really.

Prostitute. Oh, that's right, that's right. I remember this. The prostitute arc, of course. Of course. I remember that. The very, the very, of course. The oldest profession in the world.

Honestly, I feel so bad for the prostitute. It's, it is, it is. There's a, again, you present a scenario and you pick the worst, worst choice. It's like going through heavy rain pressing nothing. You know what I mean? It's literally the worst outcome and the worst input in an RPG or something.

You can't, it's favorable. Just how many bad decisions were made back to back to back to back to back. And still, Chris always found a way to get a fucking internet access. Yeah, and it just sucks right because, you know, they were, given the choice and they always picked the wrong choice

and it's like because no one was there to lead them in the right direction, right? Because the trolls are the only ones who had contact with. And of course the trolls are gonna lead them down the wrong direction. It feels like in a way that Chris was raised by trolls. You know, you hear about people being raised by wolves

and whatever. Honestly. Because some of this stuff sounds feral. Yeah, it does almost sound on like that level of just a case study where you have a child that's just raised by wolves, except just replaced the wolves. Living in the mountains.

Replace the wolves with the, like, the most, like the lowest internet trolls you can think of. And this is, this is what you get. Yeah. Very unfortunate as well, I think the time around Chris was raised was definitely like the whole like American pie era of films where sex was like the goal. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

If you were a young boy, 16, it was like everything was about, even when I was growing, I'm sure you guys felt the same, Everything in media was like, get late, get late now. Oh my God, you're going to lose your virginity tonight at the prom? Yeah, that's how it was, you know. And as the movies would say, it's always at the third date. Yeah. So Chris always specified that no sex before the third date.

Yeah. But I imagine if it came up in the conversation, I'm sure Chris would have been delighted. Yeah. Yeah. To add on the being raised by trolls thing, Chris was actually given lots of reasonable advice, I guess, by the trolls during that. era of 2009, 2010, like clean up your room and stop and get a job and get at least a part-time job

in Walmart, for example. And trolls were trying to make Chris realize that Sonnetchu could never make them money because it was an amalgamation of Pokemon and Sonic. You can file that IP. So, yeah, they wanted Chris to give up on that fantasy

and, you know, be more productive in society, which Chris did not do. But at this point, Chris had never been made to have to do anything that they didn't like. Chris had always just doing whatever they wanted to do. Chris wanted to play games all day? Chris would play games all day.

So I think it's hard when you've gotten to the age of 20, 25. And then you're suddenly told, hey, don't play video games anymore. Don't do these things online. You know, like reality slaps you on the face. Yeah, start working a nine to five. That's never going to happen. Yeah. You know, and if the person has never forced to do that by parents or an external force,

of course it's not going to happen. I only worked in McDonald's because my parents told me it was a good idea and I wanted money. That's all. I wouldn't have done it. But what's so weird is that those same trolls who were telling Chris to, you know, get a job and clean his room were the same trolls who were like, hey, you should shove your medallion up your butt.

I mean, like, what do you think the trolls wanted out of all this? Because... It's entertainment. Probably. Entertainment, yeah, and more Sonature comics. At that time, they were really looking forward to the Sunshine. It was like a hot commodity at the time. Really?

Was it that? What did people want more of it? Sonichu was more known than Chris for a very long time. Yeah. As like an internet meme. Yeah. And then now I feel like it's very much flipped. Yeah.

Why was this, why did the Sonichu cop the comic like gain popularity? Well, well, because Sonichu as a comic was created first by Chris when they were, I think, from 21, from 21 years old.

And it looks like it's drawn by someone considerably younger, like a five-year-old, for example. So Chris didn't have the most amazing art skills. Chris did not. Right. Or storytelling skills. Better than me. Any kind of skills, honestly.

But so that's why this ridiculousness of the comics was the appeal for a long time. And also Chris started to focus more on the Chris in Quickville rather than Sonichu a lot of the times. And beating up trolls. Trolls and the security guards. Yeah, in the comic. Yeah. Whenever anything bad happened in Chris's life, often it would, be appearing in the comic is like a kind of, you know,

when you get insulted and then you go back home and you remember how you should have responded. It's almost like that way. Instead of being like, I should have said that in the moment, Chris, like, I'm going to draw the scenario in which I come out on top as the Sigma mayor. It's the thoughts you have in the shower. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Shampoo bottles clapping you. Yeah, exactly, exactly. And during this time, the trolls were accusing Chris of being gay, which Chris did not agree with. Well, because Chris is very homophobic. at that time. Very homophobic and very, very straight, according to Chris. So to prove this, Chris drew an entire episode of the comic

where Chris's character, Sonny two and Rose True, have very explicit sex in this so-called human comic. How do you prove you're not gay? That's how you do it, clearly. My God. That was a thing. But then actual, because, you know, I understand, like, Sonatitude and Rose Chu, not real IPs, right?

But then later down the road, weren't, like, actual ice. like MUTU is a character, right? What? Yeah. Eventually, I guess I didn't go up to the comics that far. Or I think Mitu is only married to Chris. Yeah, MUT is married, yeah, that's right, that's right. That's right.

That's right. That's right. No. No? In this dimension. Oh, in this dimension. Sorry, God. Sorry, I'm confused with.

I also, you know, I feel like these details aren't important, right? This is not an important detail. Well, then what is an important detail? I don't know, I think it's an important detail. Why is it an important detail? Because we have a person who is like, in this dimension, I am with MUTU. Let's go to a smash tournament.

Why? There's a difference between Mining Muto and being with MUTU. Very different. Why MUTU? Why, I don't know. You see MUTU's hips? Damn!

Damn. Damn. I've never looked at Mutu and I'm just like, damn. He's childbearing hips. Of course. Is that a boyfriend free girl? Like is that what Mutu is? Yeah, boyfriend free girl.

Yeah, definitely boyfriend free girl. Is that in the Poker Description of Mutu? Does that you have no gender. No gender in both. No gender. Mutu's created a lot. How very progressive of Chris. Of course, yeah.

Chris used to be anti-asexual, so. Anti-Asexual, yeah. Chris had a problem with people. people who didn't want to have sex. Right. The gay people and the asexual people too. Right. Because I believe that Chris was once rejected by a girl and because she said that she

was asexuals. Oh. I think that's why. I was going to say, I was like, that seems like a very weird hill to dial. At least twice. But anyway, the Mood two things is because of the idea guys. Right. The previously mentioned trolls, which convinced Chris that they were in the relationship

with both. Both, throath, three. There's three husbands and wives. Mew two, Magichan Sonichu, and Chrysler Rosechu. Very progressive, I think. Well, what was the second one? Magic Chan Sonichu? Magic Chan.

Which is a different character from the Sonnetchu comics, Magic Chan. And they put that idea in Chris's head? Well, yes. The marriage idea, yes. Why? Why do they do this? Yeah, why? What do they have to gain from convincing Chris that they were married to you to? For the lulls?

For the lulls, of course. For the lulls. This sounds like the worst, like, offspring of inception that I've ever seen. Yeah, true. This is literally the worst inception movie. It was also a very, a very troublesome account during the Idea Guys saga, where the idea guys convinced Chris that they were holding chrysal roast you. They were their love interest at the time hostage, and they were torturing her.

so in order to stop them from torturing her chris was forced to do many other things such as um film videos like urinating on the floor and then having like on a carpet or like a laminate wood floor i think it was the carpet oh the fuck again the worst choice fuck man like oh okay carry on i think it was the carpet because i didn't get to that part in the uh dock so i'll get to it later but anyway yeah so then then chris was was told to have pretend sex with a pillow while All-Starby Smash Mouth played in the background. That was a thing.

What the fuck? I'm sorry, that's just funny. No, it's terrible. It's almost funny to think about, but then at the same time, I think about, it was the song choice. It was disgusted, and for some reason, I heard All-Star Smash Mouth,

and I'm like, all right. I just don't know what other kind of reaction to have. Yeah, I don't know whether it's a laugh would be disgusted. And Chris did it. Obviously, another trolling group at a later point leaked these videos on Chris is on Twitter. Right. Yeah.

But anyway, also the idea guys managed to extort over $6,000 out of Chris. Okay, that's not cool. That's not cool. Yeah. And this is where the owner of the QB farms and another elite group of former trolls got together. What makes them elite? Yeah, I was going to elite troll. Well, loyal god of trolls.

Put in the special forces. What is an elite troll? We're an hour and a half in and we never even mentioned the man in the pickle suits. I can't believe this. Wait, what? How could we forget the man in the pickle suits? Oh, of course. This was an earlier trolling attempt back in 2009, 2008-2009, where Chris went on a real-life date, if you will, with a female troll posing as a girlfriend who was then...

Yeah, who was then snatched away by a man in the pickle suit. Because Chris hated pickles, because it reminded them of penises. Of course, they're super straight. Right. Right, right, right. Not that he doesn't like eating pickles. Oh, they hate pickles, too. All pickles, eaten or just seeing.

Anyway, the guy behind the pickle suit's costume is actually the administrator of the Quickey. and he's one of the moderators on the Chris Chan Forum on Kiwi Farms so he's like a big shot still Wait wait so a dude In an actual pickle suit arrived Yes During the day

Yes And took the girl Yes You know what? If that happened to me on the day I'd probably be fucking traumatized pickles as well This is so early on that I think I've forgotten about this This is part 11 by the way Clearly a Rick and Morty fan

Yeah Yeah I got Rick before it was like Okay so What is this He turned up. Funny as should I've ever seen. So this, what does this have to do with the elite trolls?

So the man in the pickle suit and the owner of the QEEFarms and another troll got together and seized Chris's Discord account which was used to communicate with the idea guys. And from there they found all this information. And they found then the addresses and names of the idea guys and tried to report them to the FBI actually. Oh, wow. Because this was extortion of money across state lines. So it was a federal offense. Oh, Jesus.

Yeah, so they even called the idea guys' mothers to no avail. I mean, because I assume they were old children, right? Teens at least, or maybe early 20s. Or get the shit out of them, though. Probably. I think they stopped after that. Oh, yeah. But, yeah, there was no case against them.

Chris is still out $6,000. Jeez. Well, they were out until. until a GoFundMe was established by the owner of the KVee Farms to get Chris a plane ticket and to go to a My Little Pony convention in California. They raised over $5,000 and maybe less than the week after that was the phone call concerning Chris's mother. Right, they're about to just go to the My Little Pony.

Because they were obsessed with My Little Pony and the Sonic series. And I remember there was a whole series of Chris complaining about Sonic and the new series of Sonic. I missed that too. Right. That was back in 2014. God damn. There was also like the,

my favorite, like, troll who was like, probably the most talented troll. Like the Liquid Chris one, is that what it's called? That's very good. We should just go in chronological order.

Skip everything. I'm just, I'm so, because it's not really that important to the story, but also, this, the liquid Chris is probably my favorite part

because it's probably the most tasteful for all of this. I love as well how every time a point is brought up, you say the, the date, like, like a real historical way.

I was of course, 1945, Germany. December 2014 is when it all happened. I know how people feel when One Piece fans talk about their arcs now. It's like, oh yeah, the big mum- arcs. The biggest lobby-up, I'd say the only like tasteful troll,

in my opinion was the liquid, Chris. Where someone did a spot-on impression of Chris's speech, the speech pattern. Very good. And filmed videos as Chris. And, wanted Chris by like saying they were the real Chris and it was very it was very well done right and the the way that they would speak is like it's very good right

yeah yeah and they would they challenged Chris to like a sing-off or something yes how this started was Liquid Chris as as he became referred to actually started posting videos on YouTube as Chris just for the entertainment of his friends yeah and after a while trolls noticed this and wrote emails to Chris about it saying oh this guy's trying to steal your identity, you should probably address this, and this is how they became involved with each other. And to prove who was the real Chris, they would do several things, like for example, the real, I mean, the actual real quiz, Chris, or solid Chris, as they were referred to out this time.

Solid Chris! Like solid snakes. No, this is literally the plot to Metal Gear Solid! Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm not even joking. Exactly, yeah. So anyway, solid Chris posted their like real address, their phone number. They're proving it was them. Yeah.

So. Why? Because they were the real. They were the real one. Only they would know. It's like that meme of like someone who, when it's like hacker who knows my address, me who knows it longer. It's literally that meme.

Yeah. So yeah. And then after that, Chris, Solid Chris decided that the best way to go about proving this was to do a sing star challenge where they would pick three songs for the other to sing or it was like... Right.

Something like that. But anyway, the best singer would be voted the champion. It's like a fucking American Idol. It's bizarre how Chris chose this. And they... Amazing because Liquid Chris was actually

a pretty good singer. And very good at playing guitar. Playing guitar. So like I actually like just killed the song. songs and Chris was terrible. That's what was so amazing about it, is that it was so funny. My God.

And then, yeah, and after the contest was over, according to a technicality, Liquid Chris won. And then they decided to call it quits and leave. And according to the Liquid Chris storyline on YouTube, he won't have to get married with his girlfriend and then go to Richmond and join Nintendo and make a sonitude game, for example. Right.

Yeah, and then Chris was very angry with that. Because they weren't the ones making the sonitude game. Right, yeah. The fake Chris. It was very well done trolling, actually. It was like where you're like, okay, trolling is too bad sometimes. Very tasteful, very funny.

That just seems like the tasteful prank. Yeah, basically. Because there's no repercussions in that, right? It's just good fun. Everyone's getting hurt. That is just good content. Yeah, that's good content. I mean, Solid Chris was very angry.

It produced really entertaining videos Like life-ruining things You know It's not extortion of money Or anything like that Right exactly You have compared to the other stuff

It's like oh wow Something somewhat tasteful Yeah Right And then obviously there was the whole saga With Chris and Sonic And Chris and Sonic yes So

Like the real Sonic? Sonic the hedgehog Right Yes Okay Not the fast food chain That's the different Sonic Anyway

This Sonic This was in relation To the new Sonic game at the time Sonic Boom Sonic Boom that's it yeah the new TV show

and game which was which of course featured very wild redesigns of the characters including a Sonic the Hedgehog

with Blue Arms which was incredibly offensive to Christine right right incredibly offensive oh my God they were very angry Chris would rant

on Facebook and they would demand that GameStop would stop selling Sonic Boom they would even buy Sonic Boom merchandise

and break it apart and like paint and repaint their their arms tan and um Jesus and they encouraged a boycott of Sonic Boom even though they they were purchasing Sonic Boom toys themselves so yeah and then of course they went to a Game Stop and they tried to change the Sonic Boom game covers with with one saying please don't buy this game Sonic's arms are not blue and Chris was banned for that and then Chris went back again around Christmas 2014 and then

they were kicked out again but during this point someone noticed that Chris was there they started filming a short video on their phone and on their way out Chris pepper sprayed a GameStop employee it just doesn't sound real one thing I want to know

is has Chris ever had like a single real friend in their life. Have they ever, have they had like an actual human connection? I guess they're a Galapel from the game store, which Chris ruined that with that image. Right. Yeah, probably that.

So that was probably the one time where they had somewhat of a chance. Yeah, because she actually had, the friend actually had a brother who I think was also on the autism spectrum, so she was more understanding of Chris's needs. Right, right. Right. But obviously not that understanding. Yeah, pretty much everyone in Chris's life

failed, Chris, in every single way, which makes this a very tragic story. I mean, it's just, it's sick, it's fucked up, and it's also sad, right? Because it just seems like Chris has just never had, like, a proper human connection in their life. And that's, you know, that's pretty fucked, because everyone needs, like, a real human connection.

And if the only connection you're getting and the only communication you're having is with internet trolls, and not just like, like, like internet trolls, but like, I think I would lose my mind if I had that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. I would actually go insane, which I think Chris is right now.

Which might explain why Chris is so involved in this whole dimensional merge thing and why, and why Chris project, astral projects into these different cartoon dimensions, like hyper dimension, Neptune, it was also very, very big for Chris. You never want to assume someone's mental well-being, but you have to have great concern when you see the stuff that Chris has of late. He was very involved with. And even though it seemed harmless, you do have to wonder why, what had to go wrong for someone to believe this stuff.

Obviously in the case with Chris, everything. Yeah, it's, yeah, I remember there's also many points with the Sonic thing where Chris was demanding, like, getting responses or something from Sonic or something? Was there a point where they, Chris was very angry because Chris thought that they included Chris in the show? Yeah, there was a Chris actually did not think so, but everyone else thought so, because there was this character on the Sonic Boom TV show, which was a crazed Sonic fan, which looked a lot like classic Chris Chan. And trolls thought, or like observers of Chris thought it was Chris,

but Chris denied it. Right. Yeah, it's very similar. Wow. And I remember they would, Chris would spam voice actors a lot of like My Little Pony stuff and just demand them to I don't even almost see what

just weird demands yeah just on Twitter all the time yeah this was this was because Chris met them at a at the My Little Pony Convention Monica Real right

Monica Real that was a long time ago that was 2004 actually before the internet thing really kicked off but yeah Chris was in contact on Twitter with these

voice actresses because they showed compassion for Chris during their meetups at the MLP convention right Which I guess tipped Chris off the wrong way. Chris could not let go. Yeah.

Jeez. Like I know I shouldn't be dumbfounded because this is a podcast and, you know, we need to keep talking but like I genuinely don't even know what to say anymore. This has just been me like the past half hour. Yeah, right? Like I'm trying to add on to the conversation, anything.

I just don't even know what I want to say. Like where'd you go from here? I don't know. Surely there must be many points where you're like, fuck, I can't do this. I can't keep documenting this shit. Like, like, has there ever been points where you've just legitimately gone like,

nah? Yeah, when I stopped making part 13 originally, when I went a break for like about nine months or so. Right. Then I came back with 2.1. Well, I mean, like anything that Chris themselves actually did

that made you go, I don't want to document this. I mean, the closest thing was the recent event. Right, right. Which encouraged me to go on a break. Right. Yeah,

because you were saying that, Yeah, because you were saying that the court case was September, right? September 16th was, I believe. So probably by the time this episode comes out, we might have new information about it, right, at this point. I mean, at this point, I just want the story to end. Like, this story needs to end. I just hope the judges never lets Chris have any internet connection.

That's what I would. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I also worry that the trolls are probably fine a way to do something in person. I mean, it seems like this has led very clearly into real life. I mean, it obviously has with trolls showing up at Chris's house. Yeah. And it's just, I don't know, it's like, the line has been blurred so much that there is just no line anymore. Yeah, it's just the wild west, isn't it?

It's like now it just kind of seems like this is the shit you would expect to hear on the deep web or something. But no, it's right here in front of us for a lot of people. Scary. Some of the most disturbing things I've ever heard in my life, probably. Especially coming out of the internet. And, yeah, like, I just, this. This story needs to end. I thought I've heard a lot of fucked up stories

from the internet and then I'm hearing all this today and I'm just like, Jesus. Yeah, it's not good. It's really not good. You know, one thing that I have to wonder is quite difficult as I've experienced something similar myself is when you're a creator who makes something and often a certain type of video,

is it difficult being stuck in the category of the guy who talks about Chris Chen? Is that something you struggle with? Yes. Yeah. I think the word you're looking for is pigeonholed. Yeah, because you know, I had a similar thing when I started my YouTube career,

where I was only doing a certain type of video on a certain type of anime. And it was like all I was known for. Yeah. And it was what everyone referred to me as that guy who does X video. At least your username isn't that, like me. True, yeah, Joe's called The Anime Man.

So I'm kind of fucked. He doesn't watch anime anymore. No, no, no. It's the biggest lie. Yeah, the biggest lie on you. It's the man now. You know, is there any, you know, is there like a plan? Do you have something you want to try and branch out to?

Oh, yeah. Actually, my channel is called Gino Samuel 2. Point 1, because it's actually originally my second channel. So my first channel is devoted to music, original and covers. So that's what I've been doing a lot longer than the Christian stuff. As far as Japanese things go, I guess I'm most well known for doing a cover of plastic love, which kind of... Oh, you did?

I did. I did. It got over a million views, so it's... Oh, shit. Wow. Nice. That's my other thing that I'm known for, I guess. Nice.

It's enough of plastic club and Christian. Yes. Two very different things. Yeah. Also, there's the Gino Samuel 3, which is where I post documentaries that are not about Chris Chan. Right, you did one about Yokai, right?

I do a series about Yoki, yeah. Oh, cool. Shortish videos about Yolkai. I hope to branch out onto other topics. Yeah, nice. Do you like Japanese folklore and culture and stuff like that? Well, I assume you ask, because you're in Japan, right? Mostly focus on Yoki.

Other docs will be about different topics, wide range. People are probably wondering, why are you in Japan? What brings you to Japan? Well, I've been interested in Japanese culture for a very long time. And I started teaching the language myself. Actually, when I was still in the school, I was learning the writing systems and reading and writing. myself and then and then I got into a course in university which allowed me to do a year

abroad study in Tokyo or in Japan I didn't know if I was going to Tokyo at that time but yeah so that allowed me to to experience Japan and then decided to come again and work as an English teacher nice so yeah that's where I am now mm-hmm spent a year in Hokkaido which was I don't know I don't know I mean I love Hokkaido yeah I've only been on like it vacations that. Exactly, exactly. If you have to live there for a year in a very small town of 5,000 people, it's quite a different experience.

Which is the majority of towns in Hokkaido. Like most of Hokkaida is pretty desolate. Yeah. You couldn't talk to anyone, I assume? Very little. Yeah, my Japanese skills are not that good, and everyone's English skills are also not that good. So I was kind of stuck in the rut.

I was employed by the city hall or the town hall. So then I would provide English lessons to all. the schools in the town, which is like three of them. So yeah, preschool, primary school, secondary school, or the junior high school. So yeah, everyone knew me. Everyone looked at me everywhere I went. You're the guardian. I'm the guy in, yeah.

At that point, you are just the token foreigner. Yeah, yeah, the 5,000. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Did you enjoy teaching English? I did, yeah. I eventually got used to it, and I enjoyed the fun of it.

I got used to it. Sounds like an acquired taste. It was tough at the beginning, of course. And of course, Hokkaido has some very gruesome winters. Actually, almost died at one point, which was... What? In the winter? Yeah.

I was at school, and we were caught by a blizzard, a very terrible blizzard, and we had to send all the kids home and all the staff home. I had to walk home. Of course, I didn't have a car. along the course of the walk I got really cold obviously and there was snow getting in my boots and my feet were freezing which was not good. It could barely walk because of the wind and the snow. When I got to my house I could not open the front door because it was frozen shut.

Oh my God. Because the door frame was metal. Oh, yes. Oh, my God. So I decided to go back out and go to a convenience store to buy like an electric lighter in a van attempt to try and heat up the door and melt the ice. Along the way, I got really sleepy. And I thought,

maybe I should take a rest. I really wanted to do that. But then... This sounds like hypothermia. I mean, that is hypothermia. It is hyperthermia, right? It is hyperthermia, man. I thought I was going to lose my feet.

But yeah, I managed to struggle my way back home and pull this hard as I could. Because, of course, in Japan, you have to pull the front door open, not push it in. Yeah, which very difficult in that sense. But, yeah, I actually managed to open it after a while and heat up. crazy stuff. Fuck, did you have any lasting side effects from that? Were your feet okay?

I'm okay, yeah. Just like, yeah, your feet is black. I can't walk anymore. I imagine I was very close, but yeah, because I could not feel anything. There was no sensation of like touch at all. You just wanted to teach English. You should have to live in your bed.

I just wanted to teach English, right? Man, what's the teaching? It always loses feet. So how long have been in Japan for? Um, aren't enough. about four years, spent a year as a study abroad student in Tokyo, and then when you're in Hokkaido,

years in Tokyo as an English teacher for an after-school thing. How much you have to, like, speak Japanese in your class, or do you use it for your work at all? Zero, zero Japanese for us, yeah. What? Really? It's an all-English environment, yeah. Oh, so all the kids are speaking English?

Oh, yeah. Oh, wow. Is it like a cram school kind of thing? Not a cram school, kind of like an after-school, almost like a daycare, if you will. So you never get a chance to improve. you're Japanese. Right, yeah.

So people are always online when you talk about living in Japan like, oh my God, do you're not fluent in like one year? What the fuck? Yeah, it's like you don't understand. When you're here to do certain things, you don't get the opportunities that a normal person would get living here.

I mean, even with our job as well, right? Like we're always talking with like English speaking staff and people overseas and stuff like that. So it's very rarely that, you know, you have to actually talk to Japanese people. Unfortunately, like it sucks because you can't just, unfortunately just absorb it via osmosis. You actually have to get this, go out

and put effort into learning. Yeah, you can't have to learn it. Yeah, it's a thing which you do, which most of us hated in school. Yeah, as an adult, you have to choose to put time in it. Because like one thing, one thing that you don't really think about is how much time you have to put into actually learning an activity and like you have to put time and effort into it.

Whereas as an adult, I don't think it's any harder to learn a language, it's just harder to find time to commit to it. Yeah. In the perfect world, I would just, I would want to take like a year of my life just to like fully commit to learning Japanese. But I can't.

I have a job and have commitments. Yeah. And I think as an adult, that's just much more harder to do. Yeah. So you've always been really creating on YouTube for quite a while really. Yeah.

I'm a compulsive creator. Right. So is there like a next step of what you want to achieve after you're done with this documentary? Interesting to that you just say that because I did actually come in contact with two

two producers involved with creating content for for example streaming services or even Hollywood actually concerning Christian obviously but but yeah so so they see my work and and of course they see

they see dollar signs after after this recent debacle but yeah so we're interested in maybe creating something I'm not sure yet if it's possible but yeah either American Network or Netflix, Amazon, maybe streaming, I don't know. About Christian?

Oh, like a feature. Well, honestly, it could be, you know, true crime is all the rage right now. This is now a true crime story, unfortunately. This is like, this is a Netflix level story. I say like it's like an Avengers level threat. No, this is, making a murder looks like a joke to this. This is like making a Christian.

Yeah. Honestly, this is... Like, Black Mirror thought it was dark until this story out. We could have a five-season Netflix show about this and it wouldn't do it justice. It's, oh my God. Yeah.

That would be very cool. Yeah, that would be sick. I'm just curious. How much longer do you think it would take to catch up? To catch up? To catch up? To the story.

Because you're at, what, 2017? 2017, yes. November 2017. Part 60, we'll go into 2018, finally. So maybe another 10 episodes Part 70, yeah, maybe. This is like the anime adaptation

that catching up to the manga, right? When it catches up to the manga, what happens? Do we delay the episodes? Stop! Yeah, what happens? Yeah. It has to be, I don't even know how I would feel

being in your shoes. I don't know, you know, I'm sure one hand I really want this to conclude. On the other hand, I'm like, oh, God, what am I going to do after this? Exactly. Yeah, I guess, you know, other than the movies or any other future plans that you have, or creating staff or music. Do you want to be done with this?

Yeah. That's a good question. Kind of. But, but if the opportunity arises, like, for example, if I, if I can get something done with Netflix, like I can get my name up there, this could be like a stepping stone. A stepping stone. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean, I feel like now you must be the go-to guy for information about this. As they say, I am the Christian guy.

The go-through Christian. You've been the only person who has been able to present it in a way that it doesn't make you feel like you're in some weird internet forum, kind of like finding out about a guy who you shouldn't be looking at. You know, whereas I feel that the videos very much present it, like we said, in an objective way that makes you not feel too bad for consuming it. Whereas I feel like if you're reading it a lot, you're like, it feels weird. Yeah, like, I shouldn't be here kind of thing. I don't know, this feels wrong. Like, I'm fueling this, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah. Well, I mean, I wish you the best of luck. I really wanna see what else you can do. I'd be interested in what other documentaries you could pull off. Yeah, God knows that you've proven your, your dedication to your subject. I think no one can question that.

When you go deep on a subject, you go deep on a subject. You know, if someone's making a documentary about anything, I'm like, get Gino, man. That man has gone in heart. Yeah. You know, massive props to you, man. I have absolutely massive respect for the sheer amount of work you put into this.

And I, you know, I don't think I've put one tenth the amount of effort to something in my life. So I mean, congrats, I guess. Thanks. I'm gonna go and watch the rest, I promise. You should, you should. I'm not like episode 10 right now. I've only got what, like 50 episodes to catch up on?

It's all right, I can do it. If I catch up on one piece, I can catch up on this. Yeah, I was about to say. I caught up on one piece, like I'm gonna catch up to the rest of you now. You should watch it. It is very compelling. It's very well.

done, Gino's done an amazing job, and of course links in the description to all of Gino's channels. Check out his music as well. And his third channel where he does documentaries and stories about Yokai, right? Damn, you wanna plug yourself anymore, anything else you do?

Yeah, I'm good. Well, there you go then. Yeah, man, oh, Gino, man, thank you so much for coming on. This has really been a pleasure. And what was I gonna say? This is probably the most different episode of trash taste we've ever done.

It's been an enlightening episodes. Yeah, eye-opening to say the least. This is probably the least tangents we've ever talked in an episode. Yeah, right? It's almost a themed episode in a sense. But yeah, I've just... It's definitely been an educational episode.

I don't know if I've wanted to be educated on a lot of this stuff, but now I am, apparently. But it has also been fascinating. Yeah, it's super fascinating. Yeah, I don't know what else to say. It's probably been like the episode where I've found it the hardest to talk. Yeah, right?

Sometimes I'm just like, how do I even react to this stuff? Yeah. It's, other than making a just dumbfounded face. It's just gonna be like me making YouTube reaction faces throughout like two hours of this. We should get all the thumbnails from this. It's just like the thumbnail face just like,

yeah, just use, just use me and Gant for thumbnail faces because we made so many this episode just from listening to these stories. It's absolutely insane. Is there anything you'd like to say to the viewers before we end this? Any final thoughts? Final thoughts?

Christian's story is very, very complicated. And it can serve as a lesson for many things in life, serve as a lesson what not to do on the internet, how to behave in-person relations as well. It can, well, basically, see it and think for yourself because that's what I really encourage with my series is that you make your own decisions. I'm not going to tell you what you think.

Yeah. Thank you for bringing such a good moral. to this absolute shit sense of a story. But yeah, Bel Air, let's thank the patrons as well. Before we forget. Oh my God. Sorry patrons are trying you in this one. You have to have your name on this.

But hey, if you like to support the show, then make sure to go over to our Patreon. Patreon.com slash trash days. Also follow us on Twitter, send us your memes on the subreddit, and if you hate our face, listen to us on Spotify. And thank you, Gino for coming along.

Yeah. All right. Bye. Check out Juno's channel. Bye.