TRASHFUTURE - Mindfulness Meltdown ft. Maggy van Eijk

Episode Date: January 30, 2018

Riley (@Raaleh), Milo (@Milo_Edwards), and Hussein (@HKesvani) sit down with journalist and mental health writer Maggy van Eijk (@MaggyVanEijk) to talk about the mendacious claptrap that is self help and self care and the other ways in which we try to inject psychology into our veins to escape from the hell pit of capitalism. It's a fun romp that includes a visit to Jay Shetty's fantasy land, a couple products from Arianna Huffington's scammy well being company, and two readings - one from liberal douchebag Richard Branson on how to be happy, and then on Alpha Dog Big Dick David Brooks on Jordan Peterson, whose dick curls like a pig's tail. Check out Maggy's book, Remember This When You're Sad! https://www.amazon.co.uk/Remember-This-When-Youre-Sad/dp/1911600737

I feel I'm still like exhausted from the last episode of blockchain maybe you should have woken up earlier yeah maybe make sure it's never got to bad owl mindset I know but Jay Shetty is actually an owl I love that what he can rotate his head at 180 degrees I actually I actually feel like Jay Shetty was like oh you know if you want success you've got to get up really early in the morning I mean because I'm in California I have gone up really early in the morning to do this podcast about come and how Jay Shetty is a dipshit you're winning in a way yeah isn't isn't that the real success real gorilla

mindset the real horseshoe theory okay it's it's monk mindset Jay Shetty former monk current motivational philosopher I've been I've been dropping some of his his weekly wisdom and and the gorilla the gorilla monk set where Jay Shetty makes women go up so early in the morning that they deliriously agree to go on a date with him I'm pretty sure I wake up earlier than all of you hey everyone this is Jay Shetty and welcome back to my YouTube channel so I wanted to talk to you about why I decided to wake up so early what motivated me and there's so many scientists thinkers CEOs who all believe in waking up

early this is how our life works every day 86,400 seconds are deposited into our life account that's accounting for 24 hours in a day it tells us that every day we have a fresh new opportunity to invest our time wisely now the reason why we decide to wake up early is because then you have more time if you're sleeping for most of that maybe you get 50,000 maybe you get 40,000 the point is that the more you're awake if you've slept effectively you have more time to develop yourself I mean I wake up very early in the morning and hang out outside weather spoons with my fedora and my trousers completely down to my

ankles are you trying to get it and the new job editing spiked yes because as Jay says in the video but you may or may not put into this recording I promise to cut it in much like and yeah that means there's a 50% chance I'll cut it much like he says in this video just ask a editor of an online magazine about you know the value of time and how waking up early means that you can push out more content before everyone else because when I wake up and I check my phone the first thing I want to see is a particular wealth strategy so I can do while having my trousers down to my ankles of course like all good monks

yeah adopting the spike philosophy of trousers down shirt rolled up rubbing vapor up into your nipples trousers down shirt up peeing full can't lose no Brendan O'Neill is a fan of Liverpool FC because we know he'll never pee alone okay we're getting slightly off topic the video we just watched before launching into this this cold open in media res Tarantino style give us an Oscar best podcast award in the Oscars you know the red carpet who are you wearing at Ed's tracksuit when you wash it haven't yet we watched a video Jay Shetty's weekly wisdom video where he says that actually what you should do is

wake up like at three or four because when he was a monk and he I don't really know what that means I guess it means that meant that he pulled his entire like long habit robe up above his nipples to go pee that he said his argument is what if you basically had a refilling bank account and oh my god their dollars in the back you know actually the seconds in the day you could use them much more efficiently so wake up at four in the morning sleep is for the kind of pussies who as Jay Shetty reminds us get silver in the Olympics I like that's that that's his example of failure like people who are like the second best in the world at

a sport like oh fuck I'm such a failure if only I'd gotten up at midnight show your nation uncle he's an agent you come home with an a you're like you know slap you across the face with a slipper because you didn't get like an a-plus you know he's a type of guy who's literally dead who was literally just like my dad when I was growing up we'd wake him up at 5 30 in the morning and when I'd ask him why it wasn't for the truth which was I'd really like you to kind of like you know work in my store in the mornings hold my shirt up well I pee yeah it's because it'll make you a stronger person it'll make you more

versatile it'll make you it'll make you appreciate the value of work and time and now look at me I'm a 26 year old guy who hosts a podcast yeah the pinnacle so it you know if anyone embodies monk mindset it's yeah there is nothing that more embodies the monk mindset than the strength required not to pee for the whole of January yeah and that's it thank you for reminding me yeah my balls are filled up so much of pee how about yours my size of weather balloons that's why isn't that's why his neck hurts he's like carrying so much weight in his balls with a pee in store the thing that makes this Jay Shetty video or as I call

him Jay Shetty whoa bear in mind that he does follow us online Jay Jay Shetty come on trash future but pull your shirt up above your nipples don't pee on us also that that weird bit when he's like oh ask someone who lost someone they loved how the value of a minute it can mention like your friend just lost their dad and you're like excuse me what does a minute mean to you how much is a minute worth in Bitcoin I mean I can I can really imagine him like going to a funeral where like some guys like you know some guys like dad's just died and he'd just be like I'm so sorry for your loss but you know now that you have all

this time and reflection on your side you can really maximize what life you've got left you can you can you can buy that car you've always wanted you can start that business you've always dreamed of go for gold yeah because you never know you never know if you're next Jay Shetty mafia hit man I mean all players like theme music on his phone because I can just totally imagine he has well what's really pernicious about him is that he talks about like the virtues of getting up at like you know like like 11 o'clock at night or whatever in order to like have CEO mindset this is why all these people are

successful because they make the best use of their time but ask someone who's like having to take four different forms of public transit to do like five different part-time jobs gets to sleep like 20 minutes a day like oh did they also have CEO mindset Jay Shetty retire bitch Jay Shetty has the same kind of shitty opinions as good advice as as as the Stormfront anime appreciation for how about we we introduced the podcast and get into the rest of the content guys I mean we don't we could leave it a mystery well welcome to Pod Save America welcome welcome to trash future the podcast but how the future if we don't

implement fully automated luxury gay space communism is and will be trash I am Riley your your host you can find me on Twitter at Raleigh my terrible terrible handle it's RAA leh hi my name is Hussain Kizvani I am the cousin of Jay Shetty and you can follow me at H Kizvani I sometimes do good takes but not that often in fact considerably less since I joined the show according to someone who I know he literally said like you've become worse since you joined trash future so shout out to you which it which is better and in the ball who's coming at us from the ball from the from the dang ball it's it's your boy

Milo Edwards coming at you from Los Angeles where it's like 8 o'clock in the morning following the Jay Shetty lifestyle you can find me on Twitter at Milo underscore Edwards but you probably shouldn't did you go for it did you go for a 10 K run I actually only run in units of 56 miles because that is what CEOs do and I only drink kale smoothies raw water and raw milk I've already I've already been violently six several times this morning and that's how you know you're doing well worth it if your body is stopping you for being successful you know it's time to shed your body it's time to put your consciousness on the

blockchain and let yourself sore fucking up isn't that's gonna be a thing isn't it that's gonna be a fucking thing is just literally people shooting themselves in the head so they could be more successful I'm leaving the model coil I'm shuffling off this mortal coil and onto the highway to success pivot to death before we pivot to death who is our fine esteemed guest on what I assume will be this Thursday bonus episode oh I like being a bonus hi I'm Maggie you can follow me on Twitter.com I'm Maggie Van Ike I wrote a book about being a bit crazy and unlike Hussein I have peed today and it was great I miss those days

you know it was great you just wake up in the morning just let me like that's my that's my peeing slogan may your shirt fly as high as the eagles but you wake up in the morning just ready to shoot this like looking into the distance it's free in the morning CEO mindset just thinking about how many shares I'm gonna buy today look at the toilet and say not today I like the idea but we should start making motivational posters where it's like no matter how low your pants are your shirt will soar with the eagle oh my god I've got I've got a couple of products from from the wellness factory nice because we're

we're talking about mindset sanity mindset liberal insanity mindset and then a conservative black hole of mindset today we're not gonna talk about Mike Sernovich this is a Mike Sernovich freecast nice because it needs to be a safe space for all of us especially me who's afraid of gorillas and also who's afraid of ejaculate the first product we have today is the energy pod what happens there any any pod and any any guesses on what the energy pod is is it like a coffin shaped dome where you go in you have act you have described what occurs sweet it could just be like loads of fucking shit can oh yeah and it

probably is considering Maggie just Maggie just as correctly described it as a coffin shaped dome that you go in okay it's called an energy pod yeah how do you get the energy okay so you know I get my head around a coffin shaped dome because the dome and a coffin aren't the same shape so in so in the in the original Star Wars trilogy and the Empire Strikes Back there's a scene with Darth Vader I don't care I don't care I watch Star Wars and don't fuck so in the Empire Strikes Back there's a scene with Darth Vader's in his pod which has become like a meme which I really like so I think it's a pod save America

totally like pod save the Republic like as Emperor Palpatine sees his power like John fucking John Favreau and Tommy Vita would be like now we're here talking to Bale Organa about how he intends to protest through hashtags yeah so yeah hey Emperor Palpatine more like drum for my right and then Star Wars never happened because the Death Star just blew up because of their excoriating criticism. Nancy Sinatra quoting them going I've always been with the hashtag rebellion right so if you're in the pod yeah and on the screens of the pod are just kind of J Chessie videos playing over and over and you come out and you

feel invigorated and you've realized yourself sleep is really bad and I'm going to be absent from it okay so it's a thing that's either the shape of a coffin or a dome or possibly both at the same time we're not sure and you go in there and the air is just pure meth and you just you breathe in the meth and then you feel you feel so energized that nothing really matters anymore and you just sort of asphyxied you wank yourself into an early grave which is really all that the tech industry is. I'm gonna drop a little more info from this because we're doing two products today two rapid-fire products. The world's

first blank designed for blank in the workplace. The energy pod features a zero gravity position, privacy visor, specially composed blank music, and a gentle blank sequence of programmed lights and vibrations. Is it a sort of masturbatory age genuinely? Does this sound like that? Like it's a sex robot where you have to like plug yourself in like in the matrix. What about the music like is it like toto like what are they playing in there? On the limb biscuit topic. I only just realized yesterday what a limp biscuit is. How is I so late to the party? Because the party was over by the time the girls

got there. Is it is that after a game of soggy biscuit in your boarding school dorm room? It's a varsity sport once a year. The best jizzers from both Oxford and Cambridge. They meet on a small boat in the middle of the Thames to try and come on a cracker first and it's judged by some Matthew Pinson. Is that how Riley got his got his all? Anyway, after that digression, I'm going to now read to you the uncensored description of the energy pod. The world's first chair designed for napping in the workplace. The energy pod features a zero gravity position, privacy visor, specially composed

sleep music, and a gentle wake sequence of programmed lights and vibrations. With just a 20 minute nap, your employees will emerge refreshed and focused. My sleep music is just this podcast. Don't repeat. No, it's limp biscuits rolling. That's like my 3am running mix when I do my CEO stuff. Light lights and vibrations literally sounds like something that would wake you up rather than help you sleep. Like how little understanding these people have of like what are the primary conditions required for sleep?

They never sleep. Either that or your employees are so fucking sick of like looking at Excel spreadsheets, but they'll fall asleep at literally anything. Like you could play like the stupid techno that Riley listens to. It's not stupid. It's very good. The very good techno that Riley listens to and you'll fall asleep or like, but it kind of, you know, this scares me a little bit because it kind of fulfills what I was thinking about yesterday, which was at some point in 2018, like either influences or tech Silicon Valley bros are going to turn like Guantanamo Bay

torture techniques into like lifestyle choices. Yes. So like, I, I, I literally like yoga. I literally can't wait for like the Zoella, like waterboarding skincare routine. Yeah. It's called the orange jumpsuit mindset. I know it costs like 2000 pounds. And you want to drop some guesses as to how much you have to pay to get an energy pod. 69,000 pounds. Nice. Three gallons of piss. That could be anything, depending on who's

depending on what month, if it's CEO, piss, a weather, a weather balloon sized ball full of piss. I think it's, I think it's like 3000 USD, 14,325 dollars. Wow. Fuck me sideways. They are sold by Arianna Huffington's company Thrive Global. Goddamn. I love to fry. And which also used to employ Jay Shetty. No, that's the thing. This wellness thing.

Like we could file a fucking Rico case on it. Like, like this is like a Tony Soprano level grift because Arianna Huffington is on the board of directors of Uber famously woke company that does that like isn't horrible and has encouraged Uber to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars buying sleep pods and meditation wristbands for their drivers. I'm now just really enjoying imagining them being like the soprano is like, hey, you want this wellness pod? You sleep in it.

It's like, I know, where did you get this? Hey, it fell off a truck. Tony Soprano sleeps in the pod. Also, I feel like you could I like I could do the energy pod thing for free. Like I just get people to sit on me and I like vibrate gently and like sing nice songs into the air and it's like, boom, 14k. You sit on Limp Bizkit. You sit on front doors and then he whispers.

Boom, energy. Yeah. So that's that's what this is, essentially, is it's a way for Arianna Huffington to allow Uber to think that it's a friendly employer by offering people sleep pods instead of just paying them. This is this is also like it's not even I don't think it's necessarily about pay, but the whole like sleep pod concept has been something that's kind of been embedded in like corporate myths for a long time.

So, you know, when you look at like graduate brochures, which is also another one of my hobbies, like looking at young people with what? So if you look at like which one of these will eat my Limp Bizkit? Hussein's hobby is looking at 18 year olds. I like looking at 18 year olds and thinking about all their stats from rowing as well. Measuring their skulls and checking their racial compositions while they're on the cheap. No, if you look at like graduate brochures, like, and even when you go for like corporate open days and stuff, if you're like applying for jobs,

one of the things I'll kind of say is that we have lots of these like lifestyle things that are embedded into kind of the corporate workplace. And one of those really notorious things are like sleeping pods, right? And I, you know, there's countless numbers of like, you know, 18 year olds who are really fascinated by the idea that they get to sleep in this like luxury little pod inside their office. And I've heard like some of them kind of, you know, say whenever you go to kind of graduate events or whatever that, you know, oh, it's really cool.

But like, I don't even have to leave my office and like, I don't have to go home and like I can shower here and I can exercise here and they feed me and stuff like that. It's kind of fed, it's kind of like woven into this mythology that like not only are workplaces supposed like workplaces supposed to offer you this kind of stuff, but it's inherently a good thing that like the separation between home and workspace is like paper thin, right? The only place that you come to the only place, the only reason you have a home to begin with in London is so that you can masturbate

and like swipe on Tinder while you don't pee. Well, that's actually leads into the other product that I had. And then after this product, we're going to get into some, we're going to get into an article about this leading it to the mental health stuff from Descent magazine. Very good publication. We didn't, we didn't invite you here for a reason. It wasn't justice. It wasn't it wasn't just to like, you know, dunk on Jay Shetty and Ariana

Huffington, although that's a big part of it. This is the other product. That's the Lord's work. This is the other product sold by Ariana Huffington. The phone bed, the phone bed, the phone bed. Oh, a phone bed. It's the phone bed. Okay. Can we guess what the phone bed is?

What is it? Like pretty self, is it pretty like self? Well, obviously it's a phone and a bed. Yeah, I'm like trying to be funny about it. I'm just, I don't think it's a phone embedded in the bed. But is it like a phone bed in the same way, but like a Nokia 3210 is a phone? That'd be a good bed, though. You guys are thinking about this the wrong way round flip phone that flips out

into a bed, still thinking about it the wrong way round. Yeah. Um, to be sweet, is it a bed that pulls out into a phone? No, you guys are guests around and they've forgotten that one of those moody t-shirts is really small, right? But actually it's a bed. No, you guys are thinking about this the wrong way. Sponsy.

That'd be cool. Okay. This is what it is. I'm going to put link this picture. A bed for your phone. Oh, my God. What? My phone doesn't need a fucking bed. I love the idea that iPhone sixes will be like, like

will have more places to sleep than like homeless people. The incredibly normal economy. The phone bed charging station makes putting our smartphones to bed a regular part of our nightly ritual. First, we tuck our phones in and then ourselves by giving our phones their own bed outside our bedroom. We could say good night to our day and then get the sleep we need to wake up fully recharged at four in the morning so we can run 56

kilometers, not P and then either be like a precarious gig economy worker or Steve Jobs. Same thing. Wake up early. Jay Shetty is not going to like this and to show our children how to have a healthy relationship with technology. There's room in the bed for the whole family's devices. No, it's constructed of solid wood with velvet line compartments

and satin linens. The fuck is wrong with these people like literally how much of a smooth brained idiot you have to be to come up with this device. It's just a fucking box that you can put a phone in like phones come in boxes that technology already exists and is free with a phone. You put you put the blanket on it. You give it a little cup of oval teen. You read it a story stroke.

It's basically like a replacement child. It's a replacement. It's a replacement child because no one can fucking afford children anymore because they're too busy sleeping in their sleeping pods and not actually sleeping while they're supposed to be sleeping. Well, because now smuggling them across the border is so expensive. We're going to make us like breastfeed our phones. I mean, it's a Black Mirror episode waiting to happen.

Yeah, that's like what if there was a bed for your phone and what if what if the phone was actually your girlfriend and your girlfriend was cheating on you. But don't forget tribute porn. People do jacket onto their phones really a limp phone. That's a Black Mirror where a guy jacks it onto his phone and only then finds out that his phone was his mum all along. Come on, Milo, Milo, his step-mom step-mom. OK, yeah, that is no, that's just a legit porn genre.

I love it how like in incest porn, even though none of them are related anyway, they still bother to make it like set like step-mom rather than just mum. Like, so because it's like to help people get past the idea of imagining that it's actually the person's mum, even though they know that no one in this video is related at all. Porn industry has needed good storytellers for a long time. And I'm glad that like new there are new companies who are investing more into stories like good storytelling when it comes to jacking off.

Before we before we go on to talk more about mental health. I've I wanted to say one thing. This is something I wanted to get off my chest for a while, which is that the semen of your time, which is well, I'm kind of like, is he going to acknowledge the semen on his chest? I'm kind of going. I'm kind of going going somewhere from here, which is that you are that I. OK, one of my most recent like

pornographic movies, the movies, as I call it, that I sort of watched. Is it possible was well? It was it was a movie where Elsa Jean has to bang her stepmother, Phoenix Marie, but also her stepfather. She has two stepparents. What did no one think of this in the in the script segment? Did no one ever look at this? I'm like, hang on a second.

She's just adopted. Hang on a second. Why does she have two stepparents? Maybe she banged her real parents to death. They are gone. Anyway, back to our serious political podcast to get a little serious for like two seconds before we get back into the cum stuff. Nice.

Descent magazine published this really excellent article by Laura Marsh called The Coping Economy. And I think all of this stuff we're talking about the sleeping pods, the meditation, wristbands, the mindfulness, that that shit in the core, in the corporate workplace. New Saint Touch on this is basically around sort of trying to, I think, internalize, internalize alienation and to make the solution to alienation, something employees have to take on themselves and they shouldn't

have to band together to do. So the article says many Americans are now learning to meditate at the office from Aetna, a health insurer, to General Mills to Google. Corporate America has bought into mindfulness in a big way, rolling out employee training programs across its campuses and promoting mindful leaders to top positions. These efforts gained momentum after the crash of 2008, which coincided with the most precipitous decline in fortunes Americans have seen

since the Great Depression, a period of layoffs, outsourcing and the casualization of labor. That essentially what happened is despite all of the bailouts, despite the massive sort of injections of cheap fake credit into the zombie economies of the US and the UK, we are still seeing massive bonus payouts at the top, sort of gloating over sort of rising share prices. But this sort of relentless hammering of the actual lived experience of workers, whether in white collar positions, blue collar positions,

either as casualized, precariated, as a word I don't think exists, but to be made precarious and sort of forced single people forced into doing the jobs of four people and, you know, in order to do it, they've essentially given us ways to trick ourselves into not being suicidal. Oh, okay. As someone who is a white coat collared worker in which I mean, it's various money pattern, white coke, white collar. I just wanted to make that joke.

I don't actually have a point other than like, yeah, it's, it's true. I think it sort of, it does like feed into the whole like Jay Sheddy video and just the phenomenon that's come out of it, which is the idea that like we look for meaning in different types of like lifestyles or objects to kind of often to detract ourselves from this reality. And I think, you know, we've, we've, we've talked on the show about how, you know, parts of that sort of like responses to kind of manage our mental health, right? The idea that if you kind of fixate too much on kind of the

reality about you're in a broken system and like the basic monikers of like growing up in adulthood or like completely inaccessible, like you've got to find ways to manage yourself because you've got to find ways to survive, right? So you end up finding survival in these like stupid lifestyles where it's like, oh, if I wake up really early and I go for a 10 K run every morning, then I'm in control of my body. And if I only eat like certain types of food and like I drink raw water from an enema, then I'm in control of control of my own body, right?

You know, we joke about that, but it is, it is like a very like true reality. And like, yeah, that's quite, Maggie, as an actual mental health person, I kind of want to know what the actual smart person on the show. What, what, what is your, what is your essentially your opinion on this kind of thing? Yeah, it's bullshit. It's like, it used to just be the diet industry was telling us, oh, we were fat and like, you must take this pill and you'll be super thin. And that pill ended up being speed. The only good thing medical science has ever done.

And so now that's transformed into this wellness thing in general, but all these wellness products and tips are all coming from super privileged people, mostly white people. And it's bullshit. And it completely turns the shame in on yourself. And you feel like because you can, you know, eat this like crazy thing that they're prescribing or wake up and go on a crazy run, you're failing and you're not, you're, you're just being tricked. And I feel that's, that's not even just at work.

Like I feel like the modern world is so intensely miserable that basically all, all amusements have now become like sort of infantilized wank, like people I know who are like relatively intelligent people who I was at uni with. And we're like, go out a weekend. Oh yeah, we're going to like an adult ball pit where you can drink beer in Dallston or like, oh yeah, we're going to like a sort of funky bingo night. Well, I'm like, what the fuck is this shit? Like no one, no one does real things anymore.

People just go, maybe I'm, maybe I'm like an old man now. I do have, I do have an old man today. Well, no one plays a traditional game of limp biscuit. Yeah. Well, it happens is, you know, you play, you play five days of cricket and then the losing team have to play limp biscuit amongst themselves. I have one more extract from dissent that I want to read that I think is quite sort of, sort of hammers this point home, which is it to the article continues in the workplace.

Meditation in combination, calmness initiatives can perpetuate intolerable conditions by creating a culture of acceptance, encouraged to see their general well-being as separate from their economic well-being, mindful employees concentrate their efforts on cultivating the first, not the second. This can keep them from noticing how intimately the two are in fact linked, how abundantly job anxiety spills into the rest of life. If happiness lies within, then the lack of happiness is a purely personal matter and work can't possibly be the problem.

It's a lot of words. Personally, I'm just grateful that Riley has bought me an energy pod to make sure that I'm always in great form for the podcast. Like corporate mindfulness, wellness and the sort of, if you like the sort of the liberal, the liberal discourse of mental health is essentially a sleight of hand that you must never sort of ask where your problems might be coming from. You shouldn't think of yours.

You shouldn't think of yourself as ill. You shouldn't go to a doctor. You shouldn't question the system. You shouldn't question your relationship to work. You shouldn't. You shouldn't take control over your own life. What you should do is learn how to bend like a willow and just accept all of these things as facts of nature.

But in a lot of ways, like if you think about it, like I, we often kind of characterize that as like particularly deliberately sinister on the show. And I was thinking about this the other day while I was not peeing. All great ideas happen when you don't pee. All great ideas happen on a toilet that you sit on and then look down on and then do not feel and the water is pure and clean as the driven snow. Well, well, I guess while your trousers around your ankles and your shirt is rolled up above your nipples.

But in a lot of ways, like a lot of this is just a reaction to things that most people feel that they can't control, right? So because when you mention like when you question the system that you're in, when you question like the economic conditions that you're in, especially if you're like not working when you're working like service based roles or like gig economy based roles, like your priority is survival, right? And to me, it feels like all the wellness stuff and all the people I know who've kind of adopted some of the wellness things are doing it because, you know,

yeah, they know that the system is shit. They know that like the basic things that their parents got in terms of like properties and marriages and kids and stuff they can't attain. But when you feel powerless and when you feel powerless and like a system that you know is shit, but you can't necessarily take down. Again, you've got to find ways to essentially like survive in that. And some of that is really infantilizing, like, you know, ball pits and I'm just trying to think of like a glitter rumpus parties.

Yeah, why are you writing raves? I mean, I mean, secret cinema. Yeah. Yeah, like the things that, you know, we should be experienced, like experience economy stuff, like, you know, escape rooms, escape rooms are really interesting examples. Angus Harrison, come on trash feature. Yeah, please come on trash feature Angus.

Please respond to my DM. Yeah, but escape rooms are a really interesting example of that, right? Because for a short period of time, you are in an actual dystopia, right? Things are coming at you. They're coming to get you, but you know that like at the end of it, you can like stay still in an escape room and they will kick you out, right? You're going to get out of it in one way or another. But the whole point is that when you're in there, like you have the control

to get out of it, there's a system, there's a way to get out in this particular dystopia that we talk about, i.e. the economy. Discourse. Sips Merlot. Yeah, like, you know, the same sort of instincts are there. You still want to get out of it. You still want to survive. No one, I don't think there's like the majority of people beyond like Mick,

you know, our guest and only fan, Mick Wright and a few like hard line socialists like actually believe they can take the system down. Most people just want to survive in that. And I think wellness really profits off that vulnerability. I've spoken for too long. I'm sorry. I'm not the guest on the show. Ones aren't up to the task.

Yeah, all of this stuff is also like just putting a plaster on like a gaping wound. Like when you have proper mental health issues, you can do yoga as much as you fucking want, but you're still going to feel suicidal. And it's kind of this stuff is kind of like breezing through that shit. Like no one wants to acknowledge like serious mental health conditions. And it's all like, have some green tea and you're depression will subside. And it's like, that's really not going to happen. It's not going to happen.

I fucking wish. Oh, no, the problem is you were drinking black tea. It was the wrong tea. All I'm saying is that like the Tetley guy on the on the box, my green tea, one thick bee. Yo, all right, we're out of Merlot. So we're going to make the switch to some fucking muscaday and we're going to be back in a sec. Oh. I'll take your note.

Anyway, the visa process is going great. I'm going to be a British citizen very soon. I'm proud of you. And then I can continue all my terrorist ways. Of course. No, I have to do the test. Well, when Brexit happens. Yeah, I'll share.

Yeah. So give me your tips. Um, so I'm being very, I'm being very legit here because I was sitting, I was sitting on the bus next to this guy who was taking, who was revising for his citizenship test. Yeah. And like I thought so he was reading, he was reading this page about poetry, right? And I was like, oh, he must be like in English.

He must be like studying an English degree or something because they're like reading about like Mary Shelley and like Jane Austen and like all these kind of really technical things and all these like very technical things about like old British homes. So I asked him, like, are you, are you studying that English at university? And like, no, he's like this guy who's come from, um, he's come from like Mexico and he wants to work in the UK. And I'm just like, you're going to be learning way more about like,

or I, you know, I did an arts degree. I didn't know, I don't know any of this fucking shit. Right. You know, no one knows any of this shit. Um, yeah. Remember, there's a question on the UK citizenship test that's like about the Huguenose and it's like, who the fuck in the UK knows what a Huguenose is? Like no one.

The Huguenose are probably like a subset fan of like the Millwall football team. There are some, there are some people who came over from France because they really like the films of Hugh Grant. Oh shit. We really need to jump into the second half of the content. Let's go. College and Air horn. You've got to edit that in.

You know, you have the power is produced, the edit sounds in, and yet you don't do it. We have more. We talk more about the stuff Riley should edit into the show. When the recording comes out, do a content horn. Can't do it. It does. It out back to it. But like there's been a couple of shows where like Riley's just like,

we're going to put edit point here. Like, and I was listening to it on my 10 K run in the mornings before I do all my CEO mindset stuff, where I have to stop and I have to think to myself, fuck's sake, I can't wait for like automation to come so that we can just automate Riley Quinn out of trash. Forty four percent of jobs in the UK are at risk of automation. Some of them are as the organizing force behind irony podcast. And now I'm going to edit in the bit of Riley, you be I'm going to edit in the bit

from the Simpsons where the machine comes in and takes over the radio station. Twenty five percent chance that happens. Twenty five percent chance. Guys, guys, try doing that. The machines guys, guys, guys. Want to know what happiness? Yeah, happiness and mental health. You one of the secrets to happiness and mental health.

Yeah, I got two very wise men that we're going to read of or about in the second half is one of them, Dilbert Balthazar. No, Dilbert's not wise. He's powerful. Get it right. Scott Adams is a sex hypnotist. I actually quite like Dilbert when I was a kid. I had a book called The Dilbert Principle, which is like him explaining the philosophy.

It was I thought it was quite good. I mean, to me, I was like 10. Do you guys want to know how Richard Branson is happy? Always. Richard Branson, the man, the Virgin King, Richard Branson, the Volcel King, who has used all of the cum that has built up in his body to not only privatize like the like like great swaths of our public transit infrastructure, but also to literally jizz it all into one bit in the ocean in the Caribbean and build his own.

But also to share, but also to literally sue the NHS for denying him a contract for social care, the fucking blonde hair dipshit vampire, who is the worst person in the entire country who doesn't even pay taxes in the country. You guys want to know how to hear how he's happy? I'm often asked, what is the key to success? Summing the NHS, my answer is simple. Happiness, happiness should be everyone's goal. But I understand that it can seem out of reach with many, for instance,

affected by mental health problems that alter their outlook on life. Fuck off. Oh, my God. Like, Richard, what really alters my outlook on life is not being a billionaire. I would stop so far. I was a billionaire. I would like if I as as someone who also has a history of self harming, I was like, if I was a billionaire, like every time I wanted to self harm,

I'd be like, wait a minute, I'm just going to buy a gold plated blowjob. And I'll feel great or self harm with like an antique guitar. I mean, we joke. But like the only thing that would change if Riley was a billionaire would be that the quality of wine on trash future would go up slightly. Richard, Richard, Richard Branson self arms of the Hatori Hanzo razor. OK, no, no. Our favorite blonde bearded.

I wish he was a tornado victim, but he wasn't, right. Dear stranger, you don't know me because I'm a billionaire and inaccessible, but I own you. But I wait. Did he write this on Craigslist? Dear stranger, M for M, no strings attached, four twenty friendly. Yeah, dear stranger, you don't know me, but I hear you are going through a tough time and I would like to help you by suing the NHS. I want to be open and honest with you and let you know that happiness

isn't something just afforded a special few. It can be yours if you take the time to let it grow. It's like a Tamagotchi. Yeah, or when you're in the mental health ward and you're like, wait, I have a bit of time now, some happiness. I have a lot of time because I go up at three forty five in the morning and to watch to watch Jay Shetty videos. Also, all that time we're saying says by not being.

Yeah, like that's a lot of time. Yeah, you know how long it takes to put your pants around your ankles and pull your shirt up above your nipples. I know Branson continues, I'm fortunate to live an extraordinary life and that most people would assume my business success and the wealth that comes with it have bought me happiness. Yes, dickhead, but they haven't. In fact, it's the reverse.

I'm successful, wealthy and connected because I am happy. Richard Branson CEO mindset, never sleep, privatize everything, and then you can finally be happy. I mean, I mean, that's how he's so connected, right, because he's just trying to own everyone. Literally, yeah, not like, yeah, not, not like us, where we like lay down, we lay smackdowns like owning. Yeah, but type of.

Guys, do you ever think in the quiet moments between not being or in the quiet moments between, you know, one Jay Shetty video ending in another one beginning, like, what if like Jay Shetty and Richard Branson are actually right? What if it's what if it's we who had deluded, you know, maybe all we need to do is just, you know, be positive and get up at 4am and then everything would be fine. And if everyone really did do this, we'd all be like kale drinking CEO, you know, immortal, like no jizz, you know, superheroes.

I'm going to cut in the bit where they announced the Immortan Joe from Mad Max Fury Road. Witness me, cries, cries Richard Branson as he sues the NHS again. Richard Branson is like a version of the Immortan Joe, but who's a total pussy. Richard Branson continues, if you allow yourself to be in the moment suing the NHS and appreciate the moment suing the NHS, happiness will follow from suing the NHS. I speak from experience of suing the NHS. We've built a business empire by suing the fucking NHS.

I mean, did he really write that right? Join conversations, but that would be very on the nose for his style. We built a business empire, joined conversations about the future of our planet, attended many memorable parties, president's club, and met many unforgettable people. And while these things have brought me great joy, what having a fucking business empire, it's the moments that I stopped just to be rather than do. I love to just be that have given me true happiness. Why? Because allowing yourself just to be puts things in perspective.

Try it, be still, be present on the third bus to your fourth job. I love to just be while standing in some obscure bus stop in Hackney, where, you know, famed no-go zone Hackney. You know, waiting for another shitty bus that's 15 minutes late. I just look at the stars and I think to myself, I look, I look past the new builds, the new, but the empty new build flats, staring at the stars and the moon and I think to myself, God, be really strange if the moon actually existed. Anyway, that's that. Guys, we've been over this. The moon has to exist, although

there would be nowhere for the lizards to have their base. Anyway, that's how I'm now a billionaire CEO. Um, thanks for that. I love to just be when I'm chowing down on my fifth limb biscuit and I'm like, I love my life. If you want to get swalled, there's a lot of protein in a limb biscuit. Branson continues. Oh God, does he continue? I'm afraid he does. Once he knows, once Branson discontinues, I'm going to have a fucking party. Don't waste your human talents by stressing about nominal things or that

which you cannot change. If you take the time simply to be and appreciate the fruits of life, your stresses will begin to dissolve and you will be happier. Anyone want to point out why that's mendacious claptrap? He's also never someone who's been like sectioned or like had any serious shit happen to him because it's so easy for him. It's so easy. It's because for him, just be the sort of an even state of just existence is basically happiness because he's one of the richest people in the world who never has to fucking worry about anything.

No, he'll just get a motto on a jet ski and then he's like, oh, sweet. That sounds pretty sweet. It does, doesn't it? That's just it. It's like, no, happiness is within you. It's like, fuck you, bitch. Happiness is a jet ski. Literally fuck off. I want a jet ski. I want, yeah, I want a fucking jet ski. Fuck you, Richard Branson. As Richard Branson sits there on a jet ski, getting his dick sucked by a model, he's like, why are all these people who, you know, aren't getting their dick sucked by a model on a jet ski so unhappy? It must be that they're not living in

the moment. I'd better help them live in the moment by suing the fucking NHS. Exactly. Because then you really have to live in the moment because you could die at any time. Richard Branson is to the UK, like Jigsaw is to his victims. He's like, I'm going to make you appreciate your life. And Jigsaw was just like an early Jay Shetty alias. Let the games begin. I mean, that's what like, that's what Richard Branson kind of, that's his whole brand, right? Like he's a, he's a ghoulish billionaire, but he's one who's kind of a little bit more

like media savvy than the other ghoulish billionaires in the UK. So like, he can do like stupid sort of real virtue signaling things like, oh, we're going to like ban the Daily Mail from, we're going to not sell the Daily Mail on our trains. Which kind of got all the right wing charts being like, oh, social justice warrior, Richard Branson, fame social justice warrior, Richard Branson. It's just very ghoulish how like he's been able to sort of get away with this because he's just been very good at the personal branding end. But then to be honest that he's in the same realm as like, you know, Bjarre and Huffington's, obviously the Jay Shetty's, I guess there's a few other like CEOs who are sort of like that.

I'm not allowed to mention one on the show because of an NDA that I signed. Anyway, I have an interesting unrelated thing to say about Jonah Peretti, but do you guys hear that Jonah Peretti, when he goes to pee, he puts his pants all the way down to his ankles and pulls his shirt above his eyes. No, I think he like just takes it to the knees. Jonah Peretti is not breathing after all the way to the ankles. Also imagine being manic with Richard Branson's money. It's like when I have mania, it's like, oh, I ordered like 10 books on Amazon because I'm foreign and I can't go into overdraft. Like if I was Richard Branson, I'd be like, oh, I just bought Africa, whoopsies.

If I was Richard Branson and I went manic, I'd be like, oh, no, I just bought an entire company of mercenaries and tried to take over Equatorial Guinea with Tim Spicer. Whoops, it's what happens. The Equatorial Guinea coup is still my favorite thing that has ever happened. History should have ended at that point. Like the point where like Margaret Thatcher had to intervene to get fucking Mark Thatcher released from an essential African jail. Why didn't he just make shirts? I know. Well, the thing about the thing about Virgin is a lot of people think that, you know, that that's a weird name for a company because it's named after how Richard Branson doesn't

fuck for strength. But actually the name Virgin refers to the islands where he keeps all of his tax-free income. So it's a normal and fine name. I mean, if I had Richard Branson's money, I would buy the Virgin Islands and turn them in, turn it into the Volcel Kingdom. All the energy pods you could buy. Yeah, we pay our fucking taxes and everyone has energy pods. And then you can take over Equatorial Guinea. Yeah, because we're building them for strength. Then we're actually building a mercenary army and then we're going to take over Equatorial Guinea. Yeah, you can be incel there too, but it's like very sectarian. It's a bit like Sunni and Shia, you know. And do you know how we achieved that? We achieved it by waking up at

free in the morning when most of the money comes free. Do you guys want to switch from a kind of liberal self-help tax avoiding dipshit to the confluence of the two most odious people on the right? Yes, please. Because, and I'm going to prepare the, prepare the conceptual air horns, David Brooks, the, the famous taker tour of someone with just a high school degree to a terrifying Italian sandwich place. So Prasada, spooky, the spookiest me. David Brooks has written a hand wringing soul searching column on Jordan Peterson, the dark Kermit. We can just, we could, we could just like release that as the podcast title. And then in our mentions, we'll just have all these like guys wearing fedoras and like Beards that don't connect to their faces,

being like, actually, he's really, really intelligent and maybe you could learn something from him. Yeah, when you were going out on dates, I was studying the Jordan Peterson. While I'm on dates, I read Jordan Peterson. My date just sits there. Yeah. She listens to the wisdom. No. So I don't, most of our listeners, I think we'll know who Jordan Peterson is. If you don't, the brief introduction is that essentially he is the respectable, Muppet voiced philosopher of the alt light. He's not a white nationalist, but he does kind of believe that more or less women should be in the kitchen and that James DeMore was fired for truth.

Yeah. I mean, I know that there'll be some people who will listen to that and they will never to say, oh, you were wrong. Actually, like he represents just like men who just don't like feminism. Um, no, he's, he, he represents actually, I, I represent actually the people who believe it equality between the genders. I'm afraid to say the word sex in case my mother spanks me with a ruler, which I actually enjoy my stepmother and stepfather spit boast me. Jordan Peterson. Oh God, how long is it? How long is it going to take before like Jordan's Peterson spoof porn shows up? How long is it going to take for Jordan Peterson like, like real talk like, like I wonder, like, because like David Brooks was famous for like diddling a research assistant

than marrying her and making her change her first and last name. What does he not understand how marriage works? No, um, no, he, he, he Jordan, like David Brooks has like famously kind of a perv. Jordan Peterson either he's like completely smooth down there like a Kendall, which, or, um, or like a Kermit. But so Jordan, basically Jordan Peterson's book 12 rules for life is about how to be a like masculine warrior who, um, can debate the S J dubs on logic and rationality. Yeah, he has, he has rational mindset and he knows that your ad hominem attacks tell him more about you than anyone about him. Um, and what I think is really incredible is that like David Brooks, like genocidal architect of the Iraq war and booster of same

game, uh, essentially puts a piece in the New York, New York times where he wrestles with the difficult truth that Jordan Peterson is talking about in his book about how you don't have how you can't jack off. Fair enough. I agree. So he says trees, my truth. If your truth, if your truth is hard for more than four hours, contact a physician. I feel like I feel like my legs going to write a book in a similar vein and he's going to call it hard truths and he'll do it and he'll do it for a joke. He'll think it's really funny, but then somehow he'll end up getting like a weird cult status. I mean, he too will be on channel for having to talk to Kathy Newman about why he doesn't work. This isn't the guy who like made up that he had a working class friend

who did. Is this the guy? Oh my God. This is the though. It's like, no, it's like Richard Branson is jigs is the jigsaw of UK public services. David Brooks is the jigsaw of local Italian restaurant. David Brooks and Brendan O'Neill pretend to be each other's working class people that they definitely met. My friend Tyler Cowan argues that Jordan Peterson is the most influential influential public intellectual in the Western world right now and he has a point for much of Western history. Peterson argues Christianity has restrained the human tendency toward barbarism and this is where he gets his like rules for being like alive, but fucking hasn't also like, no, just, just, just, you know, the crusades and like burning witches at the stake and also

like the scramble for Africa. Don't forget that the Mao Mao that was restrained. If I just bought Africa with Bitcoin, it would have been fine. Africa called a colonial coin. That would be great. So for most of Western history, he argues Christianity restrained the human tendency toward barbarism unless you're not white, but God died in the 19th century and Christian dogma and discipline died with him. Good. That gave us the age of ideology, the age of fascism and communism and with it Auschwitz, Dachau and the gulag. So once again, David Brooks bringing out the horseshoe theory here again to protect and now the university safe space yet to protect a professor who like in one of Jordan Peterson became famous for intentionally misgendering

trans students. What a brave stance Jordan Peterson is taking misgendering trans students because like that's the thing is like we forget but like trans like trans people control the media most big corporations like you know when we picture like a normal person like an average person we picture a trans person you know like it's they have all the power and Jordan Peterson is bravely standing up against them trying to bring back Christianity this much maligned religion that kept us from doing anything bad in the 19th century. But to be fair Tim, he is non-gender binary because his gender is lizard. So his gender is Muppet. Get it right. He's one of the moon people that we hear so much about. One of the moon is Muppets. Is Kermit a lizard or a Muppet?

That's the kind of philosophical question. It takes a mind like Jordan Peterson's to answer. Does Kermit's gender change depending on what gender the person with the hand up Kermit is? Jordan Peterson, come on trash future. Tell us if Kermit's gender changes. Is Kermit trained? How much he call you dad that he changes? Alice have his end and follow me. I'm a good account. We've mentioned her three times on this show like in two episodes we're kind of very much boarding on harassment right now. As David Brooks tries to kind of he could say reconcile the sort of Kermit radicalism of Jordan Peterson

he continues. Since most conflict is over values we've decided to not have any values. We'll celebrate relativism and tolerance. Yeah, that's how it works. We deny the true nature of humanity and naively pretend everyone is nice. The upside is we haven't blown ourselves up. The downside is we live in a world of normlessness, meaningless and chaos. Not norms. It's just annoyed that he can't listen to limp biscuit anymore. It's too normy. Back in my day in the mid 2000s everyone got to listen to limp biscuit and wear free quarter lengths and play limp biscuit in peace. So I'm actually now the trans people have shown up. I didn't actually see this before when I first read this article but I have now.

Can you let me get through the whole quote and then like like do like a back of the throws scream like Donald Sutherland and Invasion of the Body Snatchers. Chaos Peterson writes and this is a Peterson quote now is the impenetrable darkness of a cave and the accident by the side of the road. It's the mother grizzly all compassion to her cubs who marks you as a potential predator and tears you to pieces. Chaos, the eternal feminine, is also the crushing force of sexual selection. Women are choosy maters. Most men do not meet human female standards. Oh my god. What? I love to meet human female standards. Oh he's really he's really projecting a lot there isn't he? I am definitely not a choosy mater.

I haven't made anything. Hi Maggie I don't believe we've met but I live in a bowl. Yeah that's Jordan Peterson's main point. Life is suffering and women won't fuck you so become alright because fuck all else matters. And somehow his message resonates and that's completely fine. Nobody cared who I was before I put on the fedora. I mean the generational war is really between Dua Lipa's new rules and Jordan Peterson's 12 rules. And then with like the liberals clinging on to Bill Maher's new rules. So but I think like if we want to say like what this says to like it's fun to dunk on Jordan Peterson because he's like a total pussy who like sounds like Kermit and built a long house in his attic and also looks like a derrily dunker.

What I think this what this what this tells me or what this tells me about is that when people are economically dislocated then and when people what people are easily seduced by hatred people are easily gotten angry at other people when and when when the markers of a good life are essentially acquisitive and when the incentives are for people with more power to hoard the markers of a good life from everybody else then all of the people who have no investment in society would have no desire to see it continue are just going to lash out. They're going to think of like they're going to imagine a kind of binaries between man and woman that are order and chaos. They're going to want to impose their will because that's ultimately what fascism is. Fascism isn't it is when the logic

of capitalism decays the hierarchies that the capitalist society holds precious fascism comes back to save those hierarchies without ultimately eroding the hierarchies of capitalism when capitalism emissarates white men fascism surges to the fourth so that women go back into the kitchen and black people are in their place. Which is why the real agenda of the fedora wearers is to oppress the irony podcasters because they're annoyed that we hoard the markers of a good life i.e. we fuck. No not all of us do please don't generalize. I'm sorry no but the point is to say you could fuck like you meet the standards of women you just don't fuck. And I want to kind of get through a little bit actually in this this might be a bit long but the the end of the article because I think

this shows why david brooks especially who is this moderate republican that seems to be the main constituency of the democratic party in the united states why they will never be able to get him. david brooks concludes his article about jordan peterson that peterson personifies the strong courageous values he champions his most recent viral vid with over four million views is an interview he did with kathy newman of britain's channel for news newman sensed that there was something disruptive to the progressive orthodoxy sorry i didn't know that like being okay with like like i didn't know that misgendering was actually radical i sense a disturbance in the liberal orthodoxy that's right disruptive to the progressive orthodoxy in peterson's worldview

but she couldn't quite put her finger on it so as connor freeters dork noted in the atlantic i switched an f to a k um she did what a lot of people do in argument these days instead of actually listening to peterson she just distorted simplified and restated his views in order to make them appear offensive and cartoonish sorry you say that the eternal so she just repeated them back to him and said you are a racist you're a sexist you're a trans person i'm sorry i'm sorry that seems insulting to my intelligence it's an ad hominem attack and i will not listen to you sorry guys i'm getting hot take off your jacket man's not hot no two days no we we left that in 2017 we now only do like we only we now only do obscure chinese memes um the latest which has been um

there's this new chinese meme that's out uh which is oh can you remember what it is this kind of okay kassie chow from buzzfeed mentioned it so like she's great she is great she is she is she is she is good and like too pure to be on the show in my opinion i'm way too hot about jordan peterson i need i need some other reactions that aren't from me so i don't just keep yelling into the microphone i mean i i didn't read the article but i did see some of the kickback and there was a lot of it and it was kind of so i kind of said this before that too because every time you tweet about this post in any way that isn't kind of supportive of jordan peterson um you'll get like a horde of like guys infadoras and beards that don't connect

in your mentions being like oh maybe you're just like not intellectual enough to get it right um which really sucks when like because i saw there was like this one woman who was like doing her phd in like behavioral psychology and he's got a bunch of like these like overwatch dorks like saying that she does he's like not smart enough to understand or like deliberately misrepresenting and that's the thing like it seems like a lot of his fans kind of will stand for him so much that they won't really like they won't necessarily interrogate everything that he said because the book itself is a really simplistic i you know i read the book and most most of this is like really dumb stuff like one of the things that he says is get your house and order before you go

and talk about the world basically meaning get married have kids get a mortgage um send your kids to school wake for them to grow up wait for them to buy their house and everything and then maybe you can then talk about you know the system or like you know wider politics and stuff so that's never gonna happen for us yeah so he and that's the thing like it was really absurd because he's talking to this it's a trap he's talking he's talking to like this generation of young men who like not only are not going to get it but they're completely aware of that very exact they're in the same like situation as the rest of us the difference is like the choices that you make in terms of interpreting that so you've got some people who kind of say actually yeah maybe the

system's really shit and we should really be interrogating this kind of new encouragement of bullshit jobs and like paying three courses of our salary and rent um you know just to survive and then you've got this group of guys who are like okay well we still face the same problems but it's because no girl that goes on a date with me wants to get married and have my kids straight away um you know and those tend to be the types of guys who gravitate towards Jordan Peterson and then you've got like the David Brooks section of people guys who like to pretend they're intellectual because they got liberal arts degrees and work bullshit jobs these are guys who like work at like well they work at like management consultancies and stuff right they're the ones who kind of

read this book and they get they embrace so much of this self-help bullshit already but it sort of just makes sense to them there's nothing in Jordan Peterson's book that I haven't seen in like like a Jay Shetty video or any of these types of kind of like here's how you be a real man and prep your food videos right he's like he comes from our tradition and there's nothing in that book that like is really revolutionary it's just the fact that like he can say that he's a professor and he's got like a few references on like google he's up there with professor green and the nutty professor it lends it lends an intellectual it lends an intellectual like backing to like shitty ideas in a political climate where like the last intellectual

to like represent that space was like I don't know like fucking Dave Rubin or something right anything is the bar is so low that anyone can go above it I guess I guess what I was interested in was like so Jordan Peterson's book is effectively like a self-help book right it it feeds into this weird self-help culture like I've seen like this boost of like new self-help books but I'll like largely targeted towards men and this is in a climate when like we're talking you know men are supposed to be like more open about their mental health there's more resources for them to do that and it seems like this is like a very sinister kind of a very cynical like outpost of that and I sort of wondered what as someone like who just wrote like a really really good and very honest

book about mental health like how you kind of think about like the culture that sort of come out of this particular moment yeah it's hard because I think uh like today someone on Twitter called me a Miss Andrews dog but but a dog is man's best friend I should have replied not the dogs our final ally in the struggle against the SJ dogs but no it's like totally true like male suicide is super high like we need to have those conversations but I don't think self-help is the way forward I think people need to share their experiences but no one should be prescribing like their lifestyle to anyone else like I would be really worried if people read my book and they were like we're gonna live exactly like this woman does because they would be fucked it's just about sharing your

experiences with being like I tried this and I really fucked up and this didn't work and then someone being like okay I'm not gonna do that I'm gonna do this instead and that's so much more important than being like oh you should wake up at like 3 a.m. and do this because those types of those types of like lifestyle hacks or whatever you want to call them they're really just like ways of shielding vulnerability right like this is what I find weird about this sort of culture that we're in which in theory says that men should talk more about their mental health like in Jordan Peterson's book he does talk about like mental illness and depression and stuff he talks a little bit about kind of you know how he was taking antidepressants for like for a while

so he exposes that sort of vulnerability but his like solutions to that are still very much kind of enclose everything you can and once you kind of get these kind of symbols of being like a proper man you know pulling your pulling your socks up getting your like your shit together those are the things that you need to kind of overcome right like these very inherent issues which for a long time men have just not been encouraged to speak about and if you don't it's because you're not it's because you are too accepting of other people because you're too accepting of yourself and you're not kind of rigidly morphing yourself into what is essentially a version of an ideal man from the 1950s yeah yeah it's like Don Draper yeah like for everyone

famously a happy character so happy um yeah and it's also kind of um being a prejudice against and it's like yeah you can have depression anxiety but like what if you have schizophrenia what if you have borderline personality disorder if you have bipolar like you can't just pull your socks up and your hearing voices are telling you to like go kill yourself like whenever i'm feeling down i just put a feather in my fedora and go next to them i wish i could do that but those are things like you know all men can wear fedoras none of you are no more of your mishandry maggot you know women came into fedoras and they brought all of their female concerns to fedoras and fedoras were my safe space as a man right now i can't wait to do that in three i can't wait to do that in

four days um but like you know friend of the show paul joseph watson he was for a long time he was going on that like thing where like mental mental mental illness doesn't exist or like you know this idea that like anti-depressants are like subscribe like prescribe too much which in theory maybe like you know he might have a point but he like the he kind of substantial of all this bullshit which wasn't just like critiques from like big pharma or kind of this culture where we don't understand mental illness enough to kind of you know talk about like different sorts of solutions or like varied solutions for him it's just like you know millennials like don't appreciate anything and you know they don't understand the value of having a wife and kids and therefore

they're wondering why they got like all these really bullshit things which then leads us to our next segue um about another mental health book which was published at a very similar time to maggies now this is going to be a very short segue because we've been recording for a shit long time yeah also like which is i think ultimately i i think and and you guys can sort of dissent from this if you want but i think yohan harry's position on anti-depressants is anti-science and dangerous if you're feeling depressed if you're feeling possibly suicidal go to a doctor do not read yohan harry's opinions but i and i don't think anyone in this podcast is enough of a medical professional no to rebut him necessarily all i can say is please don't listen

to him and you can only come at it from like a personal experience and that is like i'm allegedly on the highest dose of antidepressants if i go any higher i will just like explode according to my tp famous anti-depressants c4 but if you're max out on antidepressants the only solution is to get up at five a.m exactly but without them i know for a fact that i would not be here anymore so for me it's like well they do help because i'm a testament to it helping so that's why i think like we've talked about this sort of before and during the break and stuff we're not really going to give yohan harry the air time no just i mean we can't say what to do but all we can say is if you're going to listen to your doctor or yohan harry yeah listen to your doctor yeah exactly

even if your doctor is dr seuss all right fuck it that's not it from before we before we transition out maggie what what is your book where can we buy it oh so my book is called remember this when you're sad and you can buy it from amazon.com the website normal website and also fan of the show bookshops so yeah thank and i can say as someone who i riley pulling back the curtain struggles with quite non-trivial mental health issues and self-harm and stuff it's a very very good book and i like it it's also illustrated really well by flow perry i drew the boobs on myself which are my boobs so thank you all right good night everybody good night

so you