Triforce! - Triforce Bonus! #3: Best Villain

Episode Date: January 11, 2023

Triforce Bonus! Episode #3! We're making every fictional villain fight against each other to find the most evil, scummy, vicious bastard of them all! Support your favourite podcast on Patreon: https://bit.ly/2SMnzk6 Music courtesy of Epidemic Sound. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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hello everyone and welcome back to the triforce podcast uh here is third of our little bonus episodes for you as we will no doubt be recovering from the new year's celebrations and not able to record the podcast this week or there's some reason why there is no podcast but who knows uh please enjoy this fun interesting podcast that we prepared in advance in case we weren't able to record over the new year which has happened please enjoy hello everyone welcome to a triforce bonus episode a triforce big big boner hello bonus okay how's your eye sips woke up this morning and his eye was bleeding i have a bleeding eye what and then i had to explain to him who the Chiffre was. And he said, the number?

And I was like, I don't know what that is. Apparently that is the French for it, or the cipher. Le Chiffre. Yeah. Yeah, no, I didn't wake up with it. Yesterday, at some point during the day, I don't know when, I suffered from a, like a burst blood vessel in the white of my eye. I've never had that before, but apparently it happens.

And apparently there's nothing anybody could really do about it. Just clears up after a while. Good Lord. Is it like routinely a drop of blood will roll down your face? No, no. It's not like bleeding out of my eye. It's like inside the white of my eye so you've got like a red eye yeah like a very red eye like it looks like it's bleeding good lord

yeah which is worrying like my wife was like holy crap like maybe you're having a stroke or something i was like no no i don't think like i feel fine like there's no loss of vision or like you know it doesn't feel um this isn't the doctor's surgery we're just interested yeah no well like if you are worried about it you should go some i'm not i think it's fairly normal yeah i'm not worried did you like strain did you like lift a cupboard no one of those dad things did you like cupboard did you have like a specifically like did you have like a big poo like a really strenuous no no no like no bigger than usual i mean mine are mine are usually something to write home about sort of thing but like no like nothing

nothing out of the ordinary i've never had anything like this before in my life but you like hanging upside down on some chains or anything like no like i wasn't i wasn't funnily enough no i wasn't doing my own search at home no i was just that could do it just doing normal stuff you know just gaming eating um you know just this is the usual this was inspiring because i didn't have a topic for today's uh thing where we decide what the best thing we do is right but uh i thought well because sip said i feel like a super villain. What about top 10 personal medical emergencies? We can all read. I know Flax has had a couple of scares in the past.

This isn't top 10. This is the best. We have to decide together amongst ourselves what the best superhero or super villain is. It's got to be villains. We got to do villains. Villains. I don't know if I'm super familiar with all the villains. Like, I'll try. Like, I don't know if I'm super familiar with all the villains like I'll try like I don't mind joining in

But like I'm I'll just say like I'm not a list You will be familiar with these guys. Yeah have to be super they could be villains from anything So obviously we got we got to put Darth Vader on this. Oh, yeah Okay, hang on this is good these are like the what about the guy from um fucking mad max um immortan joe immortan joe yeah he is scary and and honorable mentions to the bad guy in blue velvet as well who's like like a mini hopper in blue velvet yeah with the fucking uh mommy he's got the fucking breathing mask and shit yeah okay uh what about from um from another david lynch from we could have uh from twin peaks we could have what about the okay another david lynch how about just every bad guy in the in the david lynch because they're

all really creepy what about the guy with no eyebrows from lost highway like that guy is super fucking creepy what was the what was the name of the the baddie in blue in in twin peaks was it wasn't joe it was like i think you can't remember his name he doesn't need to be on the list of best um again it was it was like bill it was um fuck it's been so long i love the show so much as well i know that's why i brought it up it's not bill it's a topic it's been so long i love the show so much as well i know that's why i brought it up it's not bill it's a topic it's uh we are staying on topic he's a villain it's ball but he's not he's not good enough you can't he is he's not gonna be he's not gonna win we shouldn't be really even talking to someone about unless they unless they're in consideration for best villain of all

time i mean you started by saying darth. How about on the topic of Bill, what about Buffalo Bill from Silence of the Lambs? Okay. Would you fuck me? That guy is memorable for sure. Was she a great big fat person? I think I've got a business card around here somewhere. Would you fuck me?

But surely Hannibal Lecter is the bigger, more memorable villain. here somewhere would you fuck me but surely hannibal lecter is the bigger yeah i mean hannibal lecter it like is bad too but like he he gives you insights into the mind of buffalo bill who is the actual bad guy in silence lamps right only to serve his own purposes dude only that's true his own sinister purposes yeah i think he's got to be up there yeah what other bad guys we got are you do you want me to write these down or i'm writing them down okay i thought the point was that you are gonna write them down i am writing them down okay no sure you're no i was talking to lewis though i thought lewis i'll write these down i'll write these down if lewis is like the maestro of the show right so the way we do this is we get a top eight and then we have a little knockout

tournament right right right so do you want any of these people you've listed on that top eight list well yeah all of them i wouldn't have mentioned them if i didn't want them on there i think we have to mention a bunch then pair that down to a list and then okay so let's start off with darth vader versus emperor palpatine. Which of those is the bigger villain? I think it's got to be Palp because Darth Vader comes, spoiler alert, comes good in the end, ends up as a good force ghost. And Palpatine was really the one who set it all in motion, corrupted him, all the rest of it. I think Palpatine has to be seen as the ultimate bad guy of that series rather than Vader. He's a bit more sinister as well.

Vader is like, what you see is what you get. But with Palpatine, it's kind of like, he's like a cat, you know, like ready to pounce. Like he's all like, oh, young Skywalker. And then all of a sudden his eyes go red and he goes like, you know, which I think makes it a better bad guy. Yeah. And also he was a more prominent character in the prequel trilogy, which were all awful. So I think that makes him even more of a villain. I don't think that counts for anything. I think it does because I hated those movies so much and they've become such a meme that in fact,

he's a villain in my life as well as in the movies. I'm chucking Sauron on this list as well, by the way. Sauron? Sauron was a punk ass bitch, though. Like, if we've got categories, let me just go. Is there any other sci fi bad guys that you feel like need to be like up against Emperor Palpatine? Like, like, is like fucking Kylo Ren, like any any other like alien? I think if we're talking Star Wars, the only other bad guy is probably like Grand Admiral Thrawn, right? But he's kind of cool as well so i would put him in there jabba the hut's

not in it long enough well no no no what about the the terminator like the t1000 oh the t1000 was pretty cool yeah and terrifying as well the running it's tricky though because um remember that he also came back as a good terminator and if you see terminator dark saga or whatever it's called dark timeline i can't remember the name of dark something the t-1000 that's sent back uh basically when his programming is complete becomes a good guy like you can i don't know if you can Make all of these characters not a good villain because they had a bad second movie or else had some origin story where they turned good The thing with bad guys is that they usually start off pretty badass and you're scared of them But then once you get used to them they turn into almost like, right? Like bumbling idiots who can't do anything. You know what I mean?

If we're talking about Skeletor, then fair enough. Yeah, but if we're talking about villains over the course of multiple movies, I'm saying that the clown effect persists and grows over the course of the movies. You know what I mean? Yeah, I think so. Thanos, I would say Thanos is a good bad guy. He doesn't become more clowny, I think. I'm not like that's the guy with the with the glove, right?

That he's the he's the one with the gauntlet of power that snaps his fingers. Big purple guy. Yeah, the big purple guy. Yeah. So, OK, though, sci fi. All right, fine. What about what about Alien, though? I'm just the alien, the alien from aliens. And like, you know what I mean? Well, here's the question I've got to ask about the Alien. It's just an animal.

It would be like being angry at a dog, like Cujo from the film Cujo. I was angry at Cujo. It wasn't Cujo's fault. Cujo didn't sit down and think. He's just a fucking crazy dog. I know, but he could still be an arsehole if. He's just a fucking crazy dog. I know. I think he might be rabid. He could still be an arsehole if you're a crazy dog, right?

No, that's the opposite of true, isn't it? Because if you're not yourself, is that evil? If you're not in your right mind, you mean? Yeah. I mean, that's literally been a defense that people have used for killing someone. I was not in my right mind. Yeah, but they're still arseholes anyway, right don't know i don't know if that's i don't know if that's true we can't say that the alien is bad if somebody killed your mother and then turned around and

said i wasn't in my right mind you'd still think they were an arsehole but we're not trying to personal that's exactly it it's in the eye of the beholder, right? Like, it is going to be like a personal thing. Well, if that's true. I took Cujo's affronts personally, is what I'm saying. I don't think that's fair on Cujo. Not because Cujo is a sentient animal. He's a dog. He's long gone as well, so who cares?

I care because we're going to put this fucking list together. Yeah, I'm sure he died. Cujo's not going on the list. No, Cujo's not going on the list. No, Cujo's not going on the list. It's not the spider from arachnophobia. I would put the spider from arachnophobia on the list. But it's a spider. It's doing what spiders do.

Cujo's just a stupid dog as well. I mean, it's all the same, right? Yeah, you're right. I will die on this hill. We can't put these animals on there. We can't put animals on there. It's ridiculous. You can't.

Yeah, okay, good. You know, when you get bitten by a cute little cat or whatever, it doesn't know what it's doing. When I ate salmon last night, am I evil? Because I essentially paid someone to murder and prepare that fish for me. That's pretty evil. No, I wouldn't say so. I mean, it's acceptably

you knowingly decided to do that. That salmon's kids might have a something to say about that, except I don't know if they're called

kids, the spawn spawn. What I'm saying is if we're going to go down that route and then it doesn't make sense. Animals aren't

capable of evil. Let's leave sci-fi that if you want, if you actually, we just, we're not even on. So we, we,

we left sci-fi a long time ago. We're we let's just we're not even on so we we we left sci-fi a long time ago we're talking about uh vicious dogs and spiders and animals evil animals wild animals interesting subject though okay you're right there is movies and books that feature you know animals gone wild if you like um and um i i you know we've touched on a couple but there's definitely more out there right yeah i agree are we gonna what about mr mustaf like what about the entire movie cats well mr mustaf and everybody put that entire film as a bad guy uh okay to be honest extra yeah so i've already put the categories right because i think we should decide which of the

which of the witches because that helps us pare stuff down right we've got sci-fi we got beasts all right we've got fantasy voldemort well voldemort goes into fantasy along with sauron yeah we're just putting a big list together aren't we so yes but we need to trim it down to eight and i feel like we're gonna have hundreds if we don't we just hit eight so yes but but oh shall we stop no but i think i think jerry i think we should pair it within categories is what i'm saying like these wait so we're gonna do a multi-part series of biggest bad guys no we're gonna pick one from each of eight categories and then they have to square off against each other to become the ultimate bad guy that's how we're gonna narrow it down yeah i'm not sure there are eight categories or are we gonna let's find out i don't know where we're going yet this is completely

okay sci-fi horror there's got to be kids in there as well right like uh the bad guys from like uh the earnest movies or like the kids movie the bad guy from clifford the big red dog we obviously have serial killers on this list. Wait, so are we going to go reality here or is this purely fiction? Yeah, reality is a good category as well. You've already picked a lot of horrible people. Nasty Nick from Big Brother or something like that? Right, but that's not real.

What I'm saying is we're not going to take real life characters, are we? Would you say he's more of an arsehole than kujo yes i see what you should say is hitler should be on the list right that's what i'm saying is if we're gonna if we're gonna go into reality it becomes no fictional character is as bad as someone who actually did this stuff in real life so we've got to stick to fiction otherwise it gets okay it's gonna get okay yeah well no no we should well if we do if we're not doing reality yeah because who's going to beat Hitler? Well, maybe Jeffrey Dahmer, but even then, Hitler's probably worse.

How are you fucking putting Jeffrey Dahmer on there? Man, have you read about what that guy did? It's fucking insane. You're so crazy sometimes. It's true. What about Hans Gruber? Then we've got to go into the whole... What about Joseph He's Fritzl?

Action. So that means action movies. Oh, right. Sorry, back to fiction. We're not going to do reality. We banned reality. Yeah, reality is just going to be too much, right? So then superhero is a category, I think.

Superhero? Yeah, probably. Superhero. What about a bad guy in like a comedy movie? Because quite often comedy movies are driven by a bad guy. Yeah, like Shooter McGavin in and happy gilmore sure for example guys this list is about the best super villain or villain like villain like there is right we think the best villain is not necessarily it's not antagonist it's just it's actually and then i'm gonna put historical slash drama so we've got

sci-fi horror fantasy kids movies action movies superhero movies comed to put historical slash drama. So we've got sci-fi, horror, fantasy, kids movies, action movies, superhero movies, comedies, and historical slash drama. Because that allows us to put things like Hans Lander in from Inglourious Basterds, for example. Let's start at the top. Let's finish off sci-fi. Emperor Palpatine. Are there any more contenders? Immortan Joe

probably would have to go in there. I think that would come under possibly action. Yeah, Immortan Joe. I would put the T-1000 in there as

well. Or even the Terminator, like himself. Because in the first movie, he was the villain, right? Oh, the T-1000 was

the liquid metal one. Yes. So yeah, sorry, the T-1000. I was thinking of the T, what was it 500 you have to imagine these one these guys fighting each other as well for the ultimate supremacy so like imagine the t1000 fighting the emperor that would be a fucking nuts that would be a tough one

that's like some fucking mortal kombat ship right there i think the lightsaber would do pretty well against him though well he could just reform though, can't he? Yeah, but I think like his weakness was like lava, right? And the lightsabers do get pretty hot when they burn stuff, don't they? That's true. You know, I think you could zap him as well. I don't know how good the lightning would be about good against liquid metal though. Would Palpatine be able to use the dark side to corrupt T t1000 and make him like a dark Jedi like Oh easily Yeah, we feel a team even though it was a long time ago in a galaxy far far away

They were droids there were and there were droids that served the Empire So would he be able to convince of would join me the dark side and the 80 1000 be like yes master Like would that be a thing? thing well he's already working for skynet right or whatever i don't think for ai i think the thing is though is that i like it you know like palpatine had um more of like uh you know he wanted to he wanted to rule the the galaxy right like with a right fist whereas the t1000 really only wanted to find john connor like he was he was just programmed to do one thing right to go back only wanted to find john connor like he was he was just programmed to do one thing right to go back in time and kill john connor and that was it he didn't really care

about anything else so like you're right like in terms of ambitions and stuff i would say yeah the t-1000 is formidable like on the battlefield but like you know it like in the overarching like meta sense it's kind of simple simple, you know, like he's not. It's a fair point. I see. Okay, let's leave sci-fi alone. What's next, P-Flex? So horror.

So I've got Freddy Krueger. The clown from It. Freddy Krueger. The clown from It. Pennywise. Michael Myers. Pennywise, that's right. We got Michael Myers from the Halloween movies

I genuinely I think Pennywise is the Having seen the recent It movies I mean we got a couch just hidden Both we are 40 and we have A long history with this stuff And there was movies that terrified us as kids For sure and they stand up but

Those recent It movies have been Brilliant and It scared me when i was a kid too so i saw a bit of one of the more recent it movies and he was in like a like a like a house of mirrors the the clown and he like he put his like tongue up against the glass and was sliding down and it looked he had like tons of teeth and stuff it was it was horrifying actually it's horrifying yeah um pennywise the clown yeah it's really bad pretty scary pretty really horrible villain yeah so that's horror are we gonna put things like the predator from predator in horror or would that be sci-fi that's more sci-fi i think i think that's i think with the i think the difference between a sci-fi villain and a horror villain is kind of like what we were saying about animals before.

The Predator, the T-1000, they're animalistic, really, aren't they? They have a very simple, narrow purpose, right? Whereas a horror villain is a lot more psychological. Well, it's an easy way to tell, right? Because the title of the movie is the name of the horror villain, a lot more psychological and well it's an easy way to tell right because the title of the movie is the name of the horror villain right right that's how you know what about uh jason vorhees jason vorhees yeah from the friday the 13th friday the 13th yeah yeah oh well i'll be freddie and jason the hockey man again they're all very spooky, classic slashery horror tropes. But in a way they're a bit campy now.

Like, you know, they've, they've become a bit of a joke. They've gone through the clown process that I was describing. Right. The clown process. They've become a little bit parodies of themselves. That's it. They're just becoming caricatures of themselves through the ages. Yeah, to the point where these horror movies of the 80s and 90s,

I'm sure they're supposed to be scary, but they kind of aren't. People laugh at them now, and it's sad, but they haven't had a reboot. I feel like it did happen to it a little bit what about the drum teacher from Whiplash very scary right yeah yeah

yeah let's get him on the list you should put him on the list somewhere that guy was fucking insane and like the you know like when he thought that like he knew like all along what was going on and he used that as like the fuel for the one last hurrah at the end. Right. And you just think this is such a problematic relationship.

It was astounding, really. Like, it's just, it was crazy. I would put him on a list of villains for sure. The drum teacher from Whiplash. Everybody knows who we mean. Yes. Yeah. I mean, people are going to be unhappy that we are giving horror the short shrift here, in a sense.

Well, I think there's a lot of horror that I haven't seen, serious horror that people are really into. And then the horror I have seen is, like you said, just become a joke. Like Freddy Krueger jason like all the the sort of like tropey old classic slasher villains but then nobody cares of anymore they're like jigsaw from saw yeah see i've never seen any of the saw movies or anything okay he was he was pretty evil but what was weird is they kept making movies even after they killed off his character which really confused me right um You've got Pennywise the Clown is quite recent because they remade it, you know, about, what, six years ago?

Maybe it was more recent than that. They're still making fucking Friday the 13th movies and Halloween movies, I'm sure. I think Freddy Krueger certainly had a huge influence in the 80s in terms of horror bad guys, because even though he was extremely campy, it was fucking terrifying as a as a kid yeah chucky and what about he was never scary i don't think anybody was ever pinhead remember pinhead pinhead from the hellraiser movie hellraiser genuinely terrifying kind of scary and i would say that is really scary candy man you say that was only three times in the mirror at the time

they've remade that as well they've remade that I know what about that guy with the pins in his face that's Pinhead that's Pinhead

from Hellraiser the Cenobites the Hellraiser Cenobites who are creatures that have descended into hell and are now sort of obsessed

with pain when I see when I see the cover of the movie Hellraiser man it takes me back to the 80s it does going to the video store to rent movies with my kids right and so seeing that as an 18 that was you know there was like this this whole section that was almost just terrifying to yeah it was like an awful section right like there was the adult, but then there usually was a horror section in the video store as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Kids didn't really go into it. Just the VHS covers were scary. Yeah. Well, they called them video nasties, didn't they? And there was like a big push to ban them. And a whole bunch of them in the 80s were literally banned. Like, can you imagine a film being banned nowadays? Like, it's not possible, possible really because of the internet as well

Yeah, but but there were movies that they cut you well Orange and Child's Play were both banned in the UK Like no, no, this is too much for people and well actually, the video nasties was was I think it was more more kind of like the was was i think it was more more kind of like the the the really nasty stuff like the like the like a lot of porn as well and snuff stuff and like kind of a lot of it i think a lot of mainstream stuff got caught up in it yeah yeah because it was pushing the envelope pushing the line yeah but yeah like i think you know i mean we live in a world now of, you know, a completely different world where anything kind of goes if you want to find it.

And you still kind of have the self-police. But I think there was a time, certainly, the moral panic idea that we needed to protect certainly children from just having access to this stuff or it being shown on TV. Yeah, child's play. access to this stuff or or being shown on tv um yeah child's play there's definitely um links with child's play to some of like the nastier uh incidents of like the late 80s early 90s in the uk especially right like uh wasn't wasn't child's play something to do with uh with uh with jamie bulger and all that as well like there there was... Oh, God. I don't know. There was definitely links to it. There was a real panic.

Yeah. But there were movies like... That was Chucky, though, right? That was Chucky. Charles Payne was Chucky, yeah. But, I mean, it wasn't... They weren't scary movies because the fucking puppet is so stupid.

They were just like gory movies. There was a big thing for gore. Yeah. Like Cannibal Holocaust, which was a big thing for gore yeah like cannibal holocaust which was a movie that was released had scenes cut for animal cruelty and rape that's why that was edited so when you look back at why these films were cut in some regards these were not just films that people were making no just for a laugh they were they were deliberately trying to be outrageous outrageous as well right there's's always going to be that.

There's always going to be like things that are at the edge of, of what's allowed and they do well, you know, the things on the fringes do well. Look at things like the human centipede and how, you know, that just awful concept. Yeah. What a concept. Big, um, big thing because of how, you you know over the top it isn't and kids are the kids teenagers certainly are one to challenge themselves with the the grossest and the goriest and the the worst things you know to try and but a lot of these were made in italy believe it or not there was a there was a horror film called gestapo's last orgy which is a

nazi exploit exploitation film. This was a big thing. Somebody was exploiting the Nazis? I know. It's like Blaxploitation, but with Nazis. It's kind of out there. Driller Killer was a big one. But that was Abel Ferrara,

who went on to be considered quite a good director, but it's absolutely bonkers. I've seen it. It is trash. I haven't seen it. I've heard good director, but it's absolutely bonkers. I've seen it. It is. I haven't seen it. I've heard of it, but I haven't seen it. I haven't seen Texas Chainsaw Massacre either.

It's just depressing. They've remade it like a million times as well, right? Yeah. Right. Okay. It's time to move on. P-Flex, what's the next category? We've definitely agreed Pennywise.

Fantasy. Wait, wait, wait. Are we going with Pennywise? What about Pinhead? Pinhead was so much scarier. Chuck Pinhead in there as well for the scary factor. But I think Pennywise, again, like with Pinhead, I was too young to watch Hellraiser and too scared because of the cover of the box.

But it is a bit more accessible. No, actually, do you know what? I was terrified by the Pinhead guy. And I've never seen it. So maybe just because i don't know about it it's even scarier yeah let me tell you once you've watched it and there are a lot of hellraiser movies it gets scarier because they they you go into hell it's just it's horrifying and if you watch the first hellraiser movie it's not like a schlock it's not schlocky

and sort of like played for laughs or or it meant to be like oh my god they're schlock it's not schlocky and sort of like played for laughs or or meant to be like oh my god they're behind you it's genuinely horrifying like his this guy is has been reduced to like a little blob and she needs to feed him human blood to come back to human form and so she lures men into their house and then kills him with a hammer he sucks the blood out of him until he comes back and then the centibites come out to reclaim him it's horrifying it's genuinely terrifying and it scared the shit out of me so i really think pinhead and it's all about hell which scares me as an atheist the idea that it's real is even scarier so if anyone's a clown i know it's pretend pinhead part of me is thinking what if i'm wrong

do you worry you worry about hell of course do you know you know what? Because if I'm wrong, I'm going there. Yeah, I'll be honest with you. I, at times, sometimes worry as well about hell, you know? And I always- Send me to fucking hell. It doesn't exist. Fuck, it does not exist. You're mad.

Yeah, but- You're fucking mad. What if it does, though? What I'm saying is there's a non-zero chance that it's real, right? There is, in an infinite universe, there is a very tiny chance it's real, and you could end up there. That's pretty scary. That's what I'm saying.

I don't even think, like, our consciousness is particularly consistent. Like, every morning you wake up right after being asleep unconscious gone right yeah you could just be you could just be reset at that point and you probably are yeah like your consciousness only sticks around for 24 hours do you mean you only really live on this earth today man dying in your sleep's got to be the way to go but at the same time it's kind of depressing to think about it eh like because you've got a whole day planned and you're just never going to wake up again i mean that is sad isn't it if you wake up in hell that's bad obviously but i think that you're going to come up with something worse than an attempt i just i just don't think that i don't think you i don't think it can exist unless we are all in a big community computer simulation

and there is elon musk the arbiter of the computer system has decided that you have a tweet something mean about him That's it. Yeah, but I think that's the only possible scenario And maybe if you get your head frozen, you might wake up you might be in a living hell. That would be bad true But yeah, I wouldn't risk it Anyway fantasy fantasy. Well, this is the good stuff. We're kind of limited on this because obviously we're sticking to movies Yeah, I know I feel like with fantasy is just like Lord of the Rings like what other like fantasy That's that movie fantasy. I mean, there's so many because like there's there's so much more fantasy in Books and games and stuff where there's like you'd have more to pick from but for movies I would struggle

Voldemort yeah, we put voldemort in there i was gonna put that under kids i know it's a harry potter but like i've never seen them so i don't know like what okay your kids would love them they are they are fun my son tried to read the the first book and he did not like it it was just like but i think he i think some of his friends at school are into it now so he's like talking about getting into yeah he wants to keep up sort of thing but like i don't know maybe it's just like not for him or i i don't know but like well there's uh there's a few others there's queen bavmorda from willow if anyone remembers her she betrays her own daughter and

attempts to kill a baby i went to see pretty bad willow in the movie theaters for my eighth birthday we had uh like me and a couple of my friends my parents took us all to to see willow in the movie theaters when it when it came out it was like because it came out in what like 87 something like that yeah yeah or 88 maybe let me look it up let me look it up because there's a new movie coming out it was 1988 yeah uh but there's a there's a new willow coming out um on fucking uh disney plus wow some new willow thing new series or a movie or something so they've obviously there's a fan base for it i i am a fan i will be honest with you i loved it as a kid because there was no lord of the rings movie and this was as close as you got to something like it.

Yeah. Although it was the Ralph Bakshi one, but come on. Come on. There's other things. There's other villains from Lord of the Rings. I mean, Saruman as well as Sauron, right? Saruman. Saruman is a great villain.

What about, what's his face? Boromir. He's kind of a villain as well, right? Nah. It's the ring. It's the ring, doesn't it. He's kind of a villain as well, right? Nah, it's the ring. It's the ring, doesn't it? He had an agenda, though. He just wants to do what's right for his people.

Okay. Of course, not just Voldemort, though. A lot of people would argue that that woman is a worse bad guy. Not J.K. Rowling. What's her name? The pink, the lovely, the lady. Oh, Imelda Staunton's character. Yes.

Oh, what's her name? I can't remember her name, so probably not. Who was she? Umbridge. Dolores Umbridge. Right. Oh, a great villain, you know, with that lovely middle-class lady, pink hair, pink sort of dresses. Yes.

She looks like a career politician. Yes. Just a really, really good villain. Yeah. But is she worse than Voldemort? I mean, that's like saying Goebbels was worse than Hitler, you know. I think a lot of people would say so. No.

Just because of how insidious she was a kind of i guess she was a servant of yeah i mean that's why i think sarah man would have to be out of you've got to go to the top in these things you know essentially i see in any structure whether it be this is why i'm propel patina's at the top of the list as well pal the buck so you're you're you're your ultimate villain like bar none is palpatine like you just think no no no no but that's inside i'm just saying in terms of how if we're going through a movie like say the harry potter movies if we're finding all these other guys that were along for the ride and also being bad guys essentially we the ultimate bad guy

would have to be their leader because if you're a bad ass and you're still following orders that guy must be even worse you know how about that guy from ghostbusters uh gozer vigo vigo gozer vigo the the destroyer the carpathian that was ghostbusters too i think and the thing is like gozer i think i think if you're talking about really big bad guys it's got to be gozer right the gozerian because uh he was like the god he was he was like uh like the the the god yeah of all of that so but what about the guy uh walter peck i think his name was. The one who came in and... This man has no dick.

Yeah, exactly. He shut down the facility and let it go south. Yeah, he worked for the Environmental Protection Agency, right? Yeah. He was an asshole in Die Hard as well. He was the shitty reporter. That's right, yeah. He plays those shitty roles so well.

I think it's's William Anderton. I'm going to look him up. Wait, was he in Die Hard? No, the guy in Die Hard was different. Yes, yes. No, it was William Atherton. It was the same guy. He was Walter...

I think it was Walter Peck in Ghostbusters. Do you know who I'm thinking about from Die Hard? I'm thinking about the guy uh who's like uh the police chief no the big the big like wall street guy who thought he was gonna like talk to you know he was like doing cocaine and stuff in the office bubby yeah i'm your i'm your white knight yeah that's who i was thinking of yeah yeah god i haven't seen that movie in a long time. So good though. Alice. Oh my God. Alice.

You are right about, um, these Alan Rickman's done some good. I mean, obviously Lance Gruber from Die Hard. Yeah. He was so good. Wasn't, wasn't Alan Rickman in Harry Potter as well? He was, but he was not a villain. He was not. Spoiler alert.

He was not a villain. He thought he was, but instead it was the most brilliant even as not a fan of the harry potter trilogy his his plot his the threads of his sort of character are the pinnacle of the entire thing so good so yeah the snape story is one of the better ones isn't it good um yeah so all right well let's stick to fantasy who do we think then like this there's a lot to pick honestly like are we putting gozer on the list i put gozer on the list sure let's put fucking gozer on the list i mean between sauron and voldemort i would guess because queen babmorder was only in one movie and it was willow uh saruman was a servant of

sauron really yeah saruman was the was the punk ass bitch i was referring to yeah didn't he get thrown off the tower like the second movie yeah what a fucking i would always say that he was kind of corrupt because he had one of the palantirs that sort of crystal ball and i think he was corrupted by sauron who i mean essentially it all comes from sauron you know he says i know know, we have to join with him. You know, he's like, we're not going to beat him. We've got to join with him. Like, he's made a conscious decision,

but essentially Sauron is the ultimate evil in that universe. And Gozer is only in one movie. But all they have to do is cross the streams. All they have to do is cross the streams. Gozer was in the new movie as well, if you'd seen it, which you probably have not bothered to see, but it's looking like potentially a trilogy so uh it will expand the ghost well that definitely puts gozer down my

list in that case well so yeah come on though i mean but like i mean if we're just considering gozer from the original ghostbusters movie i think gozer was a was a bad badass in that like i thought it was pretty all right no bad things did gozer do um gozer um resurrected uh themselves through the key master and the gatekeeper which turned uh lewis and dana yeah zool and all that stuff into uh that was a great bit that was a great bit with the eggs and the fridge with the eggs the whole thing that was awesome that was a great bit with the eggs in the fridge. With the eggs. The whole thing. That was awesome. That was a great bit. And also wreaked havoc on New York City, if you remember.

I do remember. Through Ray imagining the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man. That's right. That was Goza's fault. Let's compare and contrast Goza's output with Sauron's output, which is that he wanted to enslave the entirety of Middle-earth, and had almost already done so previously. I mean, it's a place that doesn't exist, so. Yeah, but Goza doesn't exist.

Yeah, but New York City does. Yeah, but we get it's fantasy New York City. It might as well be called Gotham City. No, no, no. It was actual New York City, didn't you see? Yeah, I'm walking here with sliders fucking eating hot dogs. Anyway, i think that we i think sauron is definitely the the more i'm happy let's just put gozer on because i'm i think that this is a group

organization three-way between gozer voldemort i don't really know much about voldemort so i my my pick would be with Gozer or Sauron let's be honest in all of these movies they are a background character right like the 90s Sauron you never really it's a presence

he doesn't have a mortal form but honestly like the ring is more of a villain than Sauron do you know what I mean? But the ring is Sauron. I mean, Gozer does have a mortal form in a very athletic looking Asian woman, which has got to have bonus points there, no? You've got to hate the villain.

You can't fancy the villain. Yeah, she's pretty fucking hot though. She's got like that short hair and stuff, like the spiky David Bowie hair. My vote's for sauron okay i'll go with sauron i'll go with sauron as well all right even though i think gozer is a contender for sure i'll take sauron i think it's a big stretch i can't believe you came down this close we should do superhero villains um wait we've got fish movies we haven't even listed any bad guys let's not worry about the kids movies let's just do the topics we know superhero villains we got thanos i know it's me we got thanos what about magneto we got magneto

is kind of a badass yeah he is but he's also a good guy the joker we got all of the superheroes kind of like uh jump between being good and bad yeah than doesn't but Magneto definitely I mean he's basically sticking up for mutant rights in a world where they're about to be annihilated and him and Professor X basically take two ends of the spectrum Professor X is we should work with them Magneto is we should fucking kill them all because they keep trying to kill us you can understand his point you know they're literally on the verge of annihilation and he saves a bunch of them I don't think Magneto is a villain in the same way that Lex Luthor is, who just seems to be an absolute piece of shit.

Hey, what about if we're still on fantasy, which I... Are we? No, no, we've gone on superhero. Oh, okay. We didn't... Okay, that's fine. If we missed someone, you can bring them up, and we'll quickly discuss. Go on.

Who have you got? Well, I was going the uh the guy from game of thrones you know the uh what tywin lannister tywin lannister um well i mean joffrey you mean joffrey joffrey cersei the uh what about the night king the uh the night king one um the um the withered one um the one that can ride the ice dragon and shit like that. Like, I don't know. Like, they were kind of cool, no? Yeah, they were.

I know nobody liked the last season of the show. That's the problem. It sullied the entire memory that I think even bringing it up has brought pain to people. Yeah. It was good for a time. Joffrey was great, actually. He was a real time. He was really good.

I'm going to stick joffrey on there under the earlier seasons were like really good and the books were great that should be under fantasy well fuck is it sauron or joffrey i certainly hated joffrey a lot more than i hated so joffrey was such a piece i'm gonna put joffrey on there he was a fucking cunt he really was yeah you know he was just oh by the way can we actually also have on here uh grandpa joe from the charlie and the chocolate yes what a cunt everyone hates that movie grandpa joe why did everybody hate grandpa joe let me tell you about grandpa joe all right he's big wait the guy the guy who's burping in the air with yeah yeah Yeah. Let me tell you a little bit about Grandpa Joe

because this occurred to me a few years ago when I was re-watching the movie. I thought Grandpa Joe's a fucking piece of shit. Charlie and his mother are broke as shit, right? She's the only one bringing in any money. She's got a son to look after. The dad's gone. We don't know what happened,

if he died or if he left or whatever. They live in a fucking shack and she's got three or four old people to look after in this bed i think it's four and they've all taken to their beds they haven't stood up in years they've just taken to their beds she's there grinding away she looks like even you know she you can tell that she's just being beaten down by this charlie is almost giving up he's but he's got this dream of getting the golden ticket he gets a golden ticket he goes home within two minutes grandpa joe's up dancing around the bed we've got a golden ticket it's ours charlie ours no no it's it's he sings i've got a golden ticket

doesn't he he says it's ours charlie i think oh well either way either way he's a piece of shit suddenly he's staying in bed waiting on hand and foot yeah right and then suddenly as soon as charlie gets a golden ticket he's up and adam he's fucking doing it unbelievable leaving everything behind yeah i i feel like you guys aren't putting yourselves in grandpa joe's shoes here okay i would be the exact same yeah my life sucked you're lazy bastard. If my life sucked that bad, I would just lay in bed as well and wait for Charlie to bring home a golden ticket. So, look, he's slovenly and ill-mannered.

Can we put six on the list of villains? Come on, don't put me on the list. He teaches his bad habits to Charlie, both by example and direct instruction. He's bedridden for 20 years while his daughter is working to support a family of six. Yeah. He demonstrates little respect for women.

He's a lecherous pervert he spends his days in bed with two women and another man right yeah which is itself an abomination he's my hero he's actually also an industrial spy because he has an impressive array of knowledge about walker's operations particularly for a man who's been bedridden for 20 years. He steals throughout the factory, okay, and has plans to sell Slugworth a gobstopper. Yeah. Joe's bad.

What a piece of shit. All right, he's definitely on the list under kids' movies. He demonstrates little empathy. I can't believe we put this guy on the list. I can't believe you guys have thought to this extent about this throwaway-ass character. He has no empathy for them when they all start drowning and getting turned into blueberries and all that shit uh yeah but do you have empathy for them when they start drowning and turning into blueberries those kids are assholes he's vindictive towards the other people and and selfish he puts

himself ahead of other people often, right? And makes jokes about the other kids when they were being sucked down the river. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, he's a piece of shit. Those kids were fucking pieces of shit

themselves, though. They're kids. They're products of their environment. I'm not going to judge a child because they're obnoxious. I mean, what was her name?

Oh, the fucking, the little girl, Beauregard or something she was a piece of shit but her dad spoiled her what about the cowboy video game playing guy as well TV Mike

who was the chocolate fat German chocolate eater guy Augustus Gloop fuck me man what a movie they were just spoiled kids like i think they were they were all villains in that but even wonka was a bit of a fucking villain i mean i didn't even like charlie particularly no charlie was okay but it was just like i don't know man like i think that's just a thing though right all of his stuff all the kids are evil in his book.

All of his Roald Dahl stuff is great. The kids love reading that. Almost every character is like a piece of shit in that Roald Dahl book. It's so different though. It's so refreshingly different to the standard. Well, for kids movie, I'm putting Grandpa Joe down. A hundred percent. All right, put Grandpa Joe down.

I didn't realize the extent of his crimes, honestly. Oh, he's terrible. Action movie. I've got Hans Gruber. What else have we got? T-1000. That was under sci-fi and Palt won.

Okay, what about Immortan Joe? We can put him in. For action. He's a fucking piece of shit, for sure. We need some... What about Le Chiffre?

Fuck, I... He's in one movie. All right, fine. What about Goldfinger or Blofeld, I... Who's this fucking Le Chiffre? All right, fine. What about Goldfinger or Blofeld or any of these James Bond villains? No, the Bond villains are dumb as hell. We're not putting them on the list. They're also campy and silly. They're gimmicky one-hit wonders.

They're so bad. They do all this work to get the base set up and everything and then they they just bumble through their plan you like they're always foiled by james bond they're garbage i agree about uh hans lander from inglorious bastards he he's in he's in historical drama slash his uh historical drama is that the guy that played by Christopher? What's his name? Yeah. Yeah.

Chris. Christoph Waltz. Yeah. He's under his soul. Yeah. I go for that guy. Yeah. So what about like Agent Smith?

Like, well, I guess that's more sci fi. Isn't it? He's just a computer program. It's hard. You know, I mean, all right. He's intelligent. He's just doing what he thinks is right. He's just a computer program. It's hard, you know. I mean, all right, he's intelligent. He's just doing what he thinks is right.

He's got a point. Human beings are a virus, you know. What about the alien from Alien for action? The Predator for action? I think Predator is pretty good for action. Predator is a decent baddie. He comes to a planet just to hunt human beings. Yeah, he does that weird, like... However, I will say this.

Again, kind of a product of his environment. He's come from an alien world where this is just what they do. If that's how you've been raised... Not only that, I was really disappointed when all Arnie had to do was cover himself in mud to, like, get around his defense systems. Well, he used infrared, didn't he? He just had to do was cover himself in mud to get around his defense systems. Well, he used infrared, didn't he? He just had to mask his body temperature.

But I mean, come on. Have a little bit of situational awareness. You're in a fucking bog, basically. What else is he going to do, right? You have to be able to think about this stuff ahead of time. What about Nurse Ratchet? Nurse Ratchet's a good shout.

Nurse Ratchet. Yeah, from One a good shout. Nurse Ratchet. Yeah, from One Flew Over the Cookies, man. Oh, yeah. She's a really horrible, horrible. Yeah, yeah. What about the lady from Misery? Would that come under horror? Oh, yeah. Oh, God, what was her name? It's not really horror, though, is it? It's not like Scorcher. Yeah, she had a name as well. Yeah, I can't remember her name from Misery. Shit, no, I'm going to remember this.

Annie? Annie Wilkes. It was Kathy Bates. Yeah, yeah, yeah. In a career-making role. Yeah. And it was James Kahn was in it as well, right? It was James Kahn, yeah.

That was one of the first stephen king books that i man sci-fi we didn't even say khan himself from the wrath of khan yeah it's true he was a good baddie he was hard done by i mean he was just the superior internet yeah i found out later that that was a fake chest I was devastated for years I thought that that was oh it looks so fake yeah it did

action movies though what about well I don't know if it's Biff from old Back to the Future oh yeah Back to the Future

Biff Tannen I've got him under comedy I've got him under comedy he's gotta win the comedy how many fucking categories have you got shoot eight you said one of the characters said sci-fi horror fantasy kids movie action superhero comedy historical drama job done

okay fine let's get on with it all right for historical drama um Bill the Butcher from Gangs of New York. Daniel Day Lewis played him, right? Yeah. He's a racist, xenophobic piece of shit, and a murderer. Nice. Just like Grandpa Joe. How about- Allegedly. Where does Jaws fit in The Shark? Well, I mean-

To the animal. Nature. To the animal. It's like he'd be in the Cujo category. So he's on the animals list with Cujo and the alien and the spider from Arachnophobia. Yeah, he's just wreaking havoc out there. They even say that they swim in the ocean, they eat, and they make little sharks. That's it, Martin.

That's all they do. So it's just an animal doing what an animal does. Okay, Norma Bates from Psycho. That would be horror. Yeah, it would. And surely, surely Pinhead is worse. I mean, I was much more scared of him. All right, how about Anton Shiger from No Cut Tree? What about Anton Dubek from Strictly Come Dancing for comedy villains?

You're kidding me, though. I fucking hate him. I'm not even kidding. I'm putting him on that list. Why not put him on the list? What about... I don't know. I've got... Oh, I can't think of any more. That's enough. That's enough.

We've got such a huge list now. Holy shit. We actually have it. I can't fucking believe Grandpa Joe is on this list, by the way. He has to be on the list. So we've got sci-fi.

We've got Palpatine. I think we're all comfortable with Palpatine. Horror, we've got sci-fi we got palpatine i think we're all comfortable with palpatine sure horror we've got pinhead but we could go for someone else if you go pinhead's fine yeah fantasy we've gone for joffrey because we definitely are having yeah we decided that he was worse he was a hateful little piece of shit and such a great performance i fucking hate oh yeah grandpa joe as the bad guy in the kids okay i i want to contest kids though because in a category where cruella deville exists come on she's worse than grandpa joe for sure but she's such a parody like of ever of all this i mean we're adults now richard from the animated

robin hood i mean i hate like fucking joe i think it has know what I mean like I think it has to be what we think of the worst people in these movies you know I think Grandpa Joe is awful I think the fact is that those guys wear

their villainous on their sleeve Grandpa Joe seems to be your friend he's a closet villain yeah he's actually a villain it takes an adult mind to look at

a kid's movie and think man Grandpa Joe fucking sucks right and it's only when you get older you realize it i think it's very obvious cruella de vil's evil man but grandpa joe's evil is more insidious captain hook like okay move on the guy from monsters inc you know we've got a side between three spider crab man so let's decide hands gruber hands gruber immortan joe or the Predator. Okay, I'm saying Immortan Joe, because the setting and everything in the movie

was just way better than the other two as well. Oh, better than Die Hard? Can we not have Hannibal Lecter on this list as well? Well... Hannibal Lecter... He would be horror. He would have to be under horror. He's not horror.

It's not horror. It is. He's like a psychological horror thriller. And also, can we have Anton Chigurh on this list as well? Because he's fucking awful psychological horror thriller and also can we have anton chigurh on this list as well because he's fucking yeah yeah who's anton chigurh again he's the villain from no country for all oh yeah holy shit that guy was fucking wild i know he was so scary yeah what time do you close? Now, about now, now is not a time. What time do you close? Oh, he was so, what a great movie.

Don't just put it back in your pocket. Man, I love the pacing of that movie. It was so fucking good. Yeah. That film is amazing. It really is. But it's like, it's like the book is amazing. And they, they, the job that they did was so good that it's the stuff that they cut with made sense and everything, but the way they told the story, I know some people kind of pissed off with the ending in a way, but it wasn't really about the characters that we thought it was about.

Like the, the, the, the, the push bush of the the story was about uh the the sheriff not anybody else he was the main character really um i mean the film's even called no country for old men you know and he's sort of winding down and thinking what the fuck has happened yeah it's not so crazy yeah uh what a what a movie and it's so nuts sorry so we've gone for a more tan joe especially he kept a bunch of women in prison so that he could have babies with yeah, and it was like drinking their fucking milk Did love Mad Max as well There's meant to be more but like where where where it's gonna be my favorite movie it's coming So for superhero we've got Thanos Magneto and Lex Luthor

I kind of want to take Magneto out for the reasons I stated. I just think Magneto is... I'm more familiar with him. Can we also put the Joker in there? Yeah, the Joker can go in there, I guess. It's just such a meme, but sure, I'll put the Joker. Thanos was just the ultimate bad guy. He tried to kill half of all living things. Wait, is Catwoman a good guy or a bad

guy? Who? Michelle Pfeiffer Catwoman? Catwoman's always been kind of nebulous yeah she's bad and good um but mostly good she's kind of you know one of those she's she's a kind of um harrison ford-esque kind of you know indiana jones kind of good and bad mostly good kind of well in everything harrison ford plays like like, you know, he's kind of a... Like wrongfully accused. Kind of a roguish guy, right?

Are you sure about this? Name a Harrison Ford role where he was kind of a bad guy. Where is it? I mean, he was like... In Indiana Jones, he literally is a tomb robber. No, he gives them to museums. Oh, that belongs in a museum. That belongs in a museum.

Yeah. So righteous of him. I don't know, like, he just busts in on these fucking places. Like, he doesn't have any, like, special gloves or brushes. He just runs in with a whip and starts breaking stuff. He's not about preserving that history. I think the gloves and the brushes are a lie. Like, this stuff has been around for thousands of years

and been manhandled and, like, weathered and stuff. You don't need a brush and gloves. Just because you fight Nazis doesn't mean you're the ultimate good guy. Anyway. That's true. Stalin fought Nazis. Let's decide who we're going to have for action then. Because you guys want it in Wattage.

We've gone in Wattage, yeah. So we've got Thanos, Magneto, tension lex luther or the joker all right i think thanos is the worst of them i don't know i think i think thanos is just an arbitrary how can we make this bad guy bad or he wants to kill half of all living things like yeah i don't know it feels so generic lex luther just wants to fucking make money and cause chaos like what's what's his deal the joker is just insane what about dr octopus no i think it's more i think i think it's more worse to have someone who's insane though because that because they they you don't it's the unpredictable horror nature of they don't have any concept of good anymore at least stanis had some twisted reason why he did have a logic i mean he was the protagonist of his twisted reason why he was doing it. He did have a logic. I mean, he was the protagonist of his story.

He thought he was doing the right thing. Although I will say... But isn't that worse? I did enjoy the Marvel movies with Thanos in. I thought they were pretty good. Yeah, they were so good. He was just such a good baddie. I love that he always, like, whatever they said,

he always fucking shot them down. Had some cold logic for why they were wrong. I've seen Thanos in one of those movies. I think it was infinity war that we saw maybe in seattle possibly and he seemed pretty cool and honestly i would take him over the joker any day because man the joker is just so tired and like fucking boring yeah really you got it you got it fine comedy comedy it's a toss-up between biff Tannen and Anton Dubek. Okay, and what about Shooter McGavin from Happy Gilmore as well? I have no idea who that is.

Do you eat pieces of shit for breakfast? Remember that guy? I eat pieces of shit like you for breakfast. Do you eat shit for breakfast? No, I don't remember. Okay. I've not seen it. All right, okay.

No, I don't remember. I've not seen it. All right, okay. I mean, Biff Tannen is the all-star classic comedy villain, right? I mean, we got Dr. Evil. Don't forget about him as a comedy villain. Yeah, I guess Dr. Evil could... Don't you feel it's also kind of played out? There's something about Biff Tannen.

One million dollars. There's the white Goodman from from dodgeball you see oh yeah scared but biff tannin was bad in multiple movies he was when he stole the book and very memorable as well right yeah he turned in die in in die hard too in back to the future too we have a sort of apocalyptic vision of what biff tannin's ideal world would be like and he knocks around uh marty's mom and his horrible tour and stuff like that and he tried to force himself upon her in the first film that's true real bad yeah scum yeah all right let's get biff on that biff tannin worse than anton dubek and this is a close call because i fucking what about harry and marv from home alone oh yeah harry and marv from home alone is a good shout and what about kevin's brother as well when he eats a last piece of pizza what's his name again what's kevin what's kevin mcallister's

brother's name like chuck or something like that uh chuck or like buzz or something like that. Chuck or Buzz or something? It's Buzz, I think. What about that guy from Office Space? Buzz McAllister. Bill Lumberg. I'm going to need you to come in Saturday. I'm going to have to go ahead and

ask you to come in on Saturday. Oh, and also going to have to ask you to come in on uh saturday oh and uh also gonna have to ask you to come in on sunday bill lomberg yeah he was a good he was a good comedy villain as well he was relatable i did like i did like bill lomberg yeah because we've all had a boss man we've all had a lomberg we have we haven't all had a tannin no no true which so are we gonna say tannin because he was more of a bastard lomberg was just a fucking idiot yeah lomberg because he was more relatable lomberg was a bit of a fucking doofus wasn't he yeah okay we'll go with we'll go with what we've

got lomberg what's no biff what's the next one we're gonna go with biff the next one is tricky we got john doe from seven that was kevin space's character in seven right the drum teacher from whiplash hans hans lander nurse ratchet annie wilkes from misery bill the butcher from uh gangs in new york and anton sugar and and uh what's his face from blue velvet what's the guy's name from blue velvet again i can't remember but he was mommy yeah he was fucking insane right and the guy with no eyebrows from lost highway has to be in there too he was really well right but we have to pick one but what about leonardo de capri's character in in django unchained oh man yeah he was tell them candy he was cool yeah that was a great movie wasn't it holy crap

I really like no country for old men Anton Sugar for this and the drum teacher from Whiplash those would be my top two I'm going to take Bill the Butcher, Annie Wilkes and Nurse Ratched and Hans Lander out

I'm going to take Calvin Candy out I'm going to take John Doe from Seven out leaving us with two and nurse ratchet and hans lander out okay oh i'm gonna take calvin candy out right i'm gonna take john doe from seven out right leaving us with two the drum what about kaiser sauce what about kaiser sauce kaiser sauce well problem is we never really know who kaiser says they is yeah and also it's just uh i guess i think anyone played by kevin spacey super cancer now as well because we could have put frank in there as well uh frank from uh house of cards uh the the the guy what's his name again ah fuck who cares um the the frank cards no yeah the the guy the main character i know i know he was canceled i can't remember remember but he was he was really good in that but

I mean Anton Chigurh is a genuine murderous psychopath terrifying yeah and really scary because

he again like that relentless he's like the T-1000 in his own way yeah but he also breaks you mentally

before he kills you yeah if the rule is what brought you here of what use of the rule like he asks you it's like ah yeah he fucks with your mind big time before he does i want to say anton and there's no reasoning with

him there's nothing and he's so good at yeah yeah okay yeah let's go like as as as terrifying as the drum teacher from whiplash was i think anton sugar is more dangerous you know yeah because he's he's gonna kill you yeah he will actually yeah all right so all right lads this is the list okay we got palpatine pinhead joffrey grandpa joe immortan joe thanos fifth tannin and anton chigurh so let's start with the battle i'm gonna divvy this up okay i was gonna say grandpa joe versus immortan joe okay who's worse uh i think immortan joe is is probably worse just because of the keeping the pregnant women around man and i just have not been on board for the whole grandpa joe thing i get it i get it but i just think there's timeder apples out there, you know? Yeah. All right, I agree.

So we got Palpatine versus Pinhead. Right. Wow. This is an interesting one. Like, I would say Palpatine because of, you know, his ability to channel the force and he controls an empire and stuff. But there's no fucking around with a minion of hell you know like it's got to be the ultimate really like you're right it's where i'm struggling is mortal he will die at some point and he will go to hell which if we're in this universe where

pinhead is real hell is real palpatine will end up there well and pinhead will be the one sticking pins in his head but he could just be a force an evil force ghost forever you know he could ghost around he's got a lot of powers old palpy you know he does he's a badass at some point they have to go away otherwise it's essentially a terrible punishment being a force ghost because you will be around until the heat death of the universe and when it all just splits apart and you're just floating around thinking what was this all for it must things you could get done though or in all that time you could like get through you know you could complete all the all the achievements you can't there's nothing to achieve you're done it's all gone oh right at the end of the heat death of the universe yeah what you said there's

going to be nothing except a force ghost of palpatine there'll be other force ghosts around all the other bad guys they'll be able to hang out but they will have been pulled apart by the immutable laws of the expansion of the universe is that is that the true hell well exactly but but at least he's just alone are you saying that in order to continue you're gonna have to go into some sub-universe like hell which is continuing on after the heat death of the universe i'm saying this where is hell located has to be infinite out a different dimension it's a different dimension right okay clearly sure so if we're saying palpatine in either universe right the either either the one where he lives forever as a force ghost and there is no hell, that's bad, right? But if the one

if Pinhead is around, not only does he live forever, he's also in hell. So it's like floating around in the universe with nothing happening, floating around in hell with all the worst things imaginable happening. I think people get the better of Pinhead a lot, though. Right? Like, they find ways...

Only when he comes into out of hell right and they need to have that special cube and shit yeah he has to come out and drink blood and stuff right no he's not the blood drinker it's a different yeah but pinhead just likes to be enjoy suffering and torturing he's one of the cenobites they come around and do hell stuff i mean they both were people though pinhead was once a a british captain elliot spencer like they did come from humanity yeah both of them yeah wait pinhead was a sailor yeah yeah oh wow the hms uh pinner for very good uh what do you think sips i i'm going palp obviously period is going pinhead what's your i'm gonna do you know what it's? I'm going Palp. Obviously, Perion is going Pinhead. What's your...

I'm going to... Do you know what? It's got to be Palp for me every time on this one. Okay, Palp it is. As terrifying as Pinhead is, I just think Palpatine's got the edge. Okay. So now we've got a tough one. Joffrey versus Thanos.

Right. Oh, man. Best villain. If it was a contest, then who was the the the bigger cunt well i would say joffrey wins that one hands down i hated him i hated him so much that was so cool we really did we fucking hated joffrey man i couldn't stand him the poor actor had to fucking retire from acting i think he had enough of this he had so much height he's like he's become the new joey from friends right like you'll only know him as joffrey i think people were just calling him a cunt in the street

and i didn't even like think thanos was that bad like i spent a lot of the movies thinking oh he's i feel bad for these guys. He's misunderstood. He's always seemed so glum as well. There's that whole bit where he like retires and he's like living on a farm. And then someone comes and like fights him again. Fine, I didn't want to split the world in half anyway, guys. He has to kill,

he has to kill his adopted daughter. He's such a fucking, he just spends like the whole movie, like kicking an empty can down the street. He's like, oh, I guess I'm'm gonna do bad things all right so joffrey it is yeah i think it's got to be joffrey here and this is a tough one

it shouldn't be biff tannin versus anton chigurh these were my two i wanted these two in the final i know but i can't believe it well look oh i can't believe it i really hated biff he really he really gets your he grinds your gears hard eh like you just hate him in those movies and it's so good he's such a meathead get his like yeah so i imagine that's what trump was like when he was younger you know oh my god such a fucking meathead just a bullying egotistical piece of shit piece of garbage what are you looking at butthead but just uh anton chigurh is a legitimately terrifying sociopathic serial and multiple murderer yeah yes yes who i want to see more of like an instrument of destruction is like a fucking air powered cow

killing rifle. It's fucking wild. It is horrific. So are we going to get an answer? Yeah, I'm leaning in Anton here. I love Biff, but man, it's got to be Anton for me. So now. All right. We've got four.

This is at least redeemable, I suppose. Yeah, I guess. And eventually, of course, in the original movie, he becomes kind of placated and sort of, I put two coats of wax on him for you, Marty. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He becomes like their butler or whatever. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like their toad. So now we've got Immortan Joe versus Palpatine. Oh, yeah. Like two wrinkly sort of people who are alive longer than they should. Two dudes who are like on or very close to needing some form of life support, right? Because they're so old. I mean, Morten Joe has to wear that fucking thing. Oh, I know.

All the time. And the Force is the only thing that seems to keep Palpatine alive. Yeah. And his lust for politics as well. His passion for the Senate. Morten and Joe sort of take advantage of this sort of terrible apocalypse to have this awful, Keep the water from all those people. Awful evil empire raiding. And obviously, obviously whereas palp is more he's corrupting an entire galaxy he is i think with palpatine he's always had the force and so all he's really

had to do to to get to the place that he's at is use the force and do lots of like uh lots of like behind the scenes backstabbing gentle manipulations and stuff to get to where he is. Whereas I think a more 10 Joe's rise to power was probably a lot more difficult, you know, like, I think you got to hand it to him about that. Let me make one point about that in more 10 Joe's rise to power depended entirely upon something happening that was out of his control. The end of the world, the apocalypse, whether it was nuclear war or a climate crisis or whatever yeah mortan joe rose

to power because he was one of the assholes that happened to be around right time right place sure palpatine crafted this for himself i know but the environment that mortan joe exists in is a much harsher one than um the galaxy that Palpatine knows, right? That also means there's less resistance. Yeah, I suppose. For Palpatine, he's had to battle his way through rebel fleets, the fucking Senate, all this shit. And fucking Jedi's coming out of the woodwork trying to do him in. He's had quite a tough, tough decade.

Yeah. I mean, is... Shout out to Palpatine. Well done. Big ups to Palpatine on this episode, actually. quite a tough, tough decade. Yeah, I mean, is Immortadjo... Big ups to Palpatine on this episode, actually. Is Immortadjo just a milk-loving skull fetishist

kind of, like, do you know what I mean? Is he just a pervy... He does. He's a milk drinker, for sure. A pervy edgelord, do you know what I mean? I don't know. Also, he's only in one film, and he's not really in it much sure that's true i mean palpatine is a consistent he's got a sweet fucking ride though like he does can i just you know that imortan joe's third son his name is scabrous scrotus I mean, Palpatine has

the Excelsior class Star Destroyer, which is fucking awesome as well. We're talking about sweet rides. He has got sweet rides. I want to go,

I'm leaning Palp on this one. Yeah, I'm afraid so, me too. It's got to be Palpatine on this one. As much as Immortal Joe is nauseating

and awful and great. We're saying Palp is worse because i'm sure all the bad shit that immortal joe does is happening on countless worlds under palp's rule and he's fucking all over it and he's got the you know he killed a bunch of those kids i mean he he created the star destroyer let's not forget and the fucking death star blew up a planet sorry that's what I meant the death yeah yeah sorry then we've got Joffrey versus Anton Chigurh I was gonna say Anton Dubek there I was gonna say gosh this is a tough one well actually this one isn't a tough one I think in terms of who I hated more for me it's

Joffrey yeah but in terms of who testable in an actual fight, I mean, Joffrey is a punk ass bitch, right? Yeah, but that's what makes me hate him. Yeah, there's no respect there. I despise him. He's a weak piece of shit who takes advantage of his position to be awful to people. Loves it. He's a sadistic, horrible. And he's so fucking he just looks a cunt as well.

If you look at him. Yeah, yeah. He's fucking detestable. That's true. My vote is Joffrey, but it's up to you, boys. I think the- I cannot live with myself knowing that Joffrey has won something, though. And for that reason, I'm going to go with Anton Chigurh on this.

Are we saying that Joffrey can't win this greatest villain of all time because that would just be too that would just be to be too smug about it he would yeah you reckon he would relish that i think he might be right like he would still be all bloated purple faced in hell laughing at us for voting him right okay yeah fuck joffrey i'm out of spite i'm i'm voting against Joffrey. I'm going to... We hate him so much that we don't want him to win the competition. Yeah. But then again, it was the ultimate betrayal for us. Game of Thrones turned out to be so awfully punishing, you know,

and was ruined in our minds. It was such a villainous piece of work in general. It was, yeah. So many of the characters in that show were utterly hateful like yeah they really were they were awful to each other awful i mean he killed like three guys i mean he killed let me think he killed the guy on he killed the the desk clerk deputy at the start yeah the guy on the highway killed the guy with the truck full of chickens. Yes, he killed the chicken truck guy, yeah. He killed three Mexicans in the motel.

He killed the two Mexican drug baron guys. He killed the guy who was also in office space, in his office. He killed the desk clerk at the hotel. But he didn't kill the gas station guy who correctly guessed the coin flip right yeah but that makes him scarier yeah because like you just don't know like uh imagine being the survivor like this guy would just went on like a like a multi-day murder rampage but the thing is you find out about it after the fact that the only way you got out of it was because you guessed the coin flip joffrey probably would have killed people on a coin flip in the same way, right?

Yeah, but in a different way. I think for Anton, his whole point is this is all just fate. Like, I'm just flipping a coin. And that's why he says, call it. What do I say? I didn't put nothing up. What do I stand to win? Everything.

Stand to win everything. Come on. Come on. Let's just get this over with. It's definitely Anton Chigurh, right? Your impression is so fucking good, people. It's too good. I love it.

All right, sure. He gets through. Al versus Anton. I'm going to have to fucking watch No Country for Old Ben tonight just after listening to you do that impression again oh my god so good so what's what's that mean the final is palpatine versus anton sugar not too bad sugar best movie villain of all time best best i mean i think he's so this he's so fascinating and so dark and so such a brilliant performance yeah i i love it palpatine is almost

comical at times yeah we have to add the prequel yeah to me has like some skeletor qualities honestly like he does have your bumbling boobs like it's you know i'm gonna go with anton i'm gonna go with anton i'm going to go with Anton I'm going to go with Anton I'm going to go with Anton here as well honestly we have to after

after after your absolutely spot on like line for line remembering that movie and bringing it back so vividly to me

Anton it is Anton Chigurh Anton Chigurh wins and the top recommendation if you've not seen the movie um you're missing out because it's a good it's such a good film yeah he's such a good character um yeah just endlessly fascinating we'd love to see an anton chigurh spin-off series it would be shit but i'd love to see it yeah we'd love to see him um kill more people with that stun stun rod or whatever he uses. The cattle gun. Holy shit, that was a bonus Triforce episode.

Man, what an episode. I enjoyed that a lot, actually. The to-ing and fro-ing was fantastic. It was tough. It was tough decisions. Really good one. We all fought our corn as well. Everybody had a case and put it.

Yeah. And I think we should be happy where we ended up. All right, everyone. See you next time. Bye.