TRIGGERnometry - Britain's Free Speech Crisis, Rayner and Refugee Murder

Episode Date: September 9, 2025

Konstantin and Francis discuss Graham Linehan's arrest, Angela Rayner's resignation, the Ukrainian refugee who was murdered in America and more. Triggernometry is proudly independent. Thanks to the sponsors below for making that possible: - Protect your wealth with The Pure Gold Company. Get your free investor guide at https://pure-gold.co/trigger - Evening Being by Verso. Get 15% with code TRIGGER at http://evening.ver.so/trigger Join our exclusive TRIGGERnometry community on Substack! https://triggernometry.substack.com/ OR Support TRIGGERnometry Here: Bitcoin: bc1qm6vvhduc6s3rvy8u76sllmrfpynfv94qw8p8d5 Shop Merch here - https://www.triggerpod.co.uk/shop/ Advertise on TRIGGERnometry: [e-mail] Find TRIGGERnometry on Social Media: https://twitter.com/triggerpod https://www.facebook.com/triggerpod/ https://www.instagram.com/triggerpod/ About TRIGGERnometry: Stand-up comedians Konstantin Kisin (@konstantinkisin) and Francis Foster (@francisjfoster) make sense of politics, economics, free speech, AI, drug policy and WW3 with the help of presidential advisors, renowned economists, award-winning journalists, controversial writers, leading scientists and notorious comedians. 00:00 Introduction 01:55 Graham Linehan's Arrest 14:38 Angela Rayner's Resignation And Government Reshuffle 25:12 David Lammy's Comments About Donald Trump 34:25 The Attack On Private Schools 41:36 Violent Crime And The Murder Of Ukrainian Refugee In America Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

He's arrested by five police officers. Armed police officers at Heathrow Airport. The only people I saw during this entire time defending his arrest were comedians. We're a laughing, stalk internationally. Completely. We're a joke. Can they please stop fucking crying? Oh my God.

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Schedule pickup. And we'll come to you with a check in hand. Your car, your timeline, your terms. Visit Carvana.com to sell your car today. Carvana. Pick up fees may apply. Francis, a lot happened last week. We had the Graham Linenhan being arrested for tweets

by five armed police officers. We'll talk about that. We obviously had Angela Raina resigning and the cabinet reshuffle. Shabana Mahmoud is now Home Secretary. We'll talk about that. Of course, that whole thing in British politics was massive. And we've also got this latest story,

which I just think is a horrific and also the media coverage of it has been, I mean, it's one of the most disgusting things that I have seen in our entire time doing the show, which is this Ukrainian refugee who went to America, Iran Zarwuzka, who was stabbed by just a crazy guy on the train in Shala, I think. No media coverage as far as we can tell at the time of recording. So we'll talk about all of that. Let's start with Graham Linehan. Graham Linehan, former guest of the show, one of the most talented, I would say one of the greatest

comedy writers in English language history. I would say in British history, but he's Irish and, you know, things can get touchy. Things can get a little touchy. Comes back from the US where he's now working with our good friend, Andrew Doyle and others, and Rob Schneider. And he's arrested by five police officers. Armed police officers. At Heathrow Airport. Well, I think this is, look, how else are you going to deal with a comedy writer who writes tweets,

apart from arrest him with submachine guns? Yeah. He was arrested, interrogated by the police and released on bail. for three tweets in which he basically was a little bit mean about transgender ideology and he made a joke

which was about if you see a trans woman in the toilets do this, do this or if that doesn't work punch her in the balls. Yeah. I mean it's a joke.

The reality is that we've now I don't think because we, do you remember in 2018 and 2019 we were talking about free speech where we're going free speech is under threat people are going, no, it's not, you're just far right or whatever else.

And now we've got to this point where somebody like Graham Linoffin, who is a celebrity, who is celebrated quite rightly for his comedy, which is brilliant, now gets arrested for tweets and even people on the left. It's really interesting. There've been a lot of left-wing commentators like, all right, like, the game's up. There's nothing. What can you say? There comes a point where you look at the country and gone,

We've crossed a Rubicon. And I think for a lot of people, this is a Rubicon crossing moment. For a lot of people. But what was interesting to me is I posted it on my Facebook where I still have some friends from the comedy industry. And the only people who were defending him being arrested. This is the great irony. This is the thing you and I have been saying for years. In Britain, it's not true in America, but in Britain, the people who are most pro-censorship are comedians.

Yeah. It was extraordinary. The only people I saw during this entire time defending his arrest. What comedians? And Zach Polanski. And Zach Polanski, the leader of the Green Party, who, I mean, I'd love to have him on the show because we'd have an interesting conversation.

But there's also another thing with it, which is, and a lot of people do this. So Nick Cohen, who writes for The Spectate, I think he writes for The Times, other papers. I quote tweeted him, a tweet, the tweet is now deleted, where he said, this is playing into the hands of the far right. And this is what they always do.

It's like, the problem isn't the problem. The problem is it just, the arguments of people that I don't agree with. What if the problem is the problem? What if actually those of us have been warning that many of the laws that have been passed in recent years and many of the laws that are now being over-interpreted by the police because of the infiltration of the College of Policing

by mermaids and all these other stone wall, all these other crazy organizations, what if that's the problem? What if the problem is that people are being arrested for tweet? Comedians are being arrested for jokes. What if that's the problem? This is the thing that I find so frustrating with the left. It's this, this is far right.

Now, the far right exists, but they're nowhere near as big or as strong as they pretend. You know, in their minds, it's like they're going to whack up one day, and the hordes of Nazis going to rise out of the ground, and they're going to storm into London, and they're going to take over all of London. That's enough about Tommy's rally. You know what? the kingdom. We're going to go and document it and see what happens. But I think your point is,

these people massively exaggerate the nature of that threat. They massively exaggerate. And the thing that I find interesting is, do you genuinely believe this? And I think they actually do. I think that they live in this magical world where all of a sudden, they're going to, they're going to wake up one day and Hitler has come back and he's like, hey, yeah, yeah, and then all of a sudden we're back in Nazi Germany. Well, I don't think we should dismiss the fact that, you know, we just released an interview Tom Holland in which we talked about the fact that one of the things that will happen is a result of a combination of things. One of them is progressive overreach. And the other one is the fact that very few people now have the lived

experience. I use that term in inverted commas or some kind of connection to what happened during World War II. The taboos around fascism are breaking. And there's definitely fringes on the right, particularly in the United States, that are openly floating with fascism, right? And fascist revisionist history. But what people like Nick Cohen and others are doing is they're labeling lots and lots of normal people who are not remotely interested in anything like fascism as far right. And this is something the British media, you know, the left side of the British media is deeply irresponsible with. And not just the media.

I mean, David Lammy, for example, of course, you remember he called a group of European Eurosceptics, conservative Eurosceptics in Britain, worse than the Nazis at one point. We'll come back to David Lammy in a little bit. So this has been happening for a long time. And the thing is, among other things, it just doesn't work anymore. Like, calling people for it just doesn't work. No, it doesn't. And it's really dangerous.

Because if you want to radicalize someone, then misrepresent them, smear them, and call them one of the worst things that a human being could be. If you want to actually radicalize them, make them double down, and make them take more and more hardline positions, then do that. Isolate them, smear them. You can't keep doing that. You can't, the people in these positions of power, which they still, the media still has power, the legacy media. You can't keep doing that because what you're going to do is things are already really toxic in this country. We've done lots of conversations between me and you or with other guests where we're,

talk about how this country is a boiling point. I think what everybody needs to do is actually take a little bit of a heat off the gas. And by turning around and saying we're going to embolden the far right, this is far right, that's far right. You're just pissing people off. We've got every right to be angry, you're making them even angry. And to emphasize how badly this doesn't work, I mean, people keep saying reform is far right. Well, reform is now the biggest party in the country in terms of its popularity with the public. I think it's won 100. It's been top of 100 polls in a row.

I went out in a middle class town in Kent. Not a lot of those in Kent, but over the weekend, there was a reform stand right in the town center. Reform is the party with the Big Mo in Brooklyn right now. There's no question about it. They just had their party conference. And it just simply does not work.

And when you start, calling people like Graham Linehan far right or putting him in that box or saying the people who are concerned about his free speech rights are far right. You've lost the plot. You've completely lost the plot. And with Graham, he's now going to sue the police for wrongful arrest. I have no doubt he's going to win that case. I mean, if there's any soundings left in this country. The police are now calling for the government to change the law, which is what people like me and you and many of our guests, Toby Young, of course, of the Free Speech Union has spearheaded this fight. We've all been saying this for years, which is if you pass these laws, the police will then enforce these laws, and then you will be locking people up for making jokes.

I remember being in rooms with, including, by the way, if people want to blame the Labor Party for this, okay, they're responsible to some extent. I remember being in rooms with conservative ministers two or three years ago where I was saying to them, if you pass this law, this is what's going to happen. And here we are. because a large part of the problem is, is that we have got politicians who don't understand social media. They don't understand the internet. They have a, I won't even say,

a rudimentary understanding. I think it's a complete lack of knowledge about it. And so it's this idea with like, oh, if I just, if we can just stamp this out and, you know, these awful opinions, then everything will be fine, but you can't do that. I don't think it's just politicians, though.

I think the public are very badly misinformed about this issue. And one of the reasons, I don't know if you notice this, but even reform people now, when they talk about this issue, they all go, yeah, but we must protect children. And the reason is that in a lot of people mind, in a lot of people's minds, the online safety bill is about protecting children from violent content, pornography, etc.,

which, I mean, elements of it are, but most of it isn't about that. And, you know, you're using a sledgehammer to crack a nut, and you're smashing the entire kitchen up in the process. That's what's happened. But a lot of people in the public just think it's about safety, you know, and they haven't really looked into it properly, which is what often happens with many of these bills.

The politicians get them through under fake slogan earring, and then we end up where we've ended up. Yeah, and it comes a point, and this is not only devastating for the UK domestically. We're a laughing stock internationally. Completely. We're a joke. The amount of messages,

I get from like American comedians or big people in America, effectively taking the piss. I wake up every morning going, what's happening with your shit show of a country? And then there's a... It's embarrassing. It is embarrassing. You think about the things that this country has given the world.

The thinkers, the writers, the poets, that... You know, the people... Shakespeare was controversial. In his days, Shakespeare was deeply controversial. What would he do now? What? Lock him up? I mean, we probably would. And what pissed me off the most is actually West Streeting, who I actually, who's a Labor Minister, but I actually think he's broadly very sensible guy. Yeah.

I respect him. You know, might not agree with all his politics, but I respect him. He came out over the weekend and he was like, well, don't blame the police. You know, it's about legislators getting the legislation wrong. I'm like, we're not blaming the police. We're blaming you, dickhead. We've been saying this for years. Yeah.

You pass bad law and then you will criminalize speech. And then, by the way, we've still got these non-crime hate incidents. which is basically where you've done nothing wrong, according to the law, but we're going to blame you, call your hate criminal anyway. Yeah. And if you do an enhanced security check, which you will need to do if you want to be a teacher, a doctor, in a position,

or one of those types of professions, and that comes up, you probably aren't going to get the job. Right. So there's people who are going to be very talented, capable people who are denied jobs because of something that they wrote, which isn't even criminal, you go, what?

We're in a crap. version of China. Because at least in China, things work. Mate, I went to see my acupunctrists who's just spent a month in China. She's Chinese. China is way ahead of us on tech and all that kind of stuff. It's incredible. So it's better too. So we're falling behind in many of these different things while also adopting some of the shi's authoritarianism at the same time. It doesn't make any sense. It doesn't make any sense. And you just, it has to come to a point. And I think the good thing, if we're looking at the positives. I think people are finally realizing where we are. Because before you could deny it,

before you could go, oh, you know, that's a fringe issue or this person, let's be fair, they're dodgy and they said a dodgy thing. A beloved comedy writer who makes a joke about trans people in bathrooms and you've got five armed guards, that is the moment where everybody, I think, went, hang on a second. In the interest of accuracy, we should say that I think, think the reason they were armed is that police officers at airports are all armed. Yeah. That's probably why they were armed. However, you can see it from Graham's perspective.

You've got five guys with firearms arresting you. I think he had a bit of a panic attack or something. He had to go to hospital because his heart rate was through the roof, et cetera. And Graham is a, what would be the right, I'm trying to find the right language. He's a bit of a big softie, I would say. Yeah, he is. He has a kind of nervous disposition. So I imagine it would have been very difficult for him.

and unpleasant, but he was not being arrested by armed officers because, you know, it was designed to intimidate him or whatever. I just think police officers at airports are armed. Yeah, is my understanding. Absolutely, but they were about trans, mate, so it's just crazy. The good news is, though, and thanks to Angela Raina, who will talk about, there's been a reshuffle, and now I'm sure everything will be fine. Yeah, exactly, exactly.

So I'm sure, I mean, it's a really, interesting situation with the Labor government, because normally a government runs out of steam towards the end of the first term, or in its second or most, or third term. I mean, it's barely been a year, and they're on their ass. And everybody's just like looking at it going, I mean, this is going to die pretty quickly. And it's not if, it's when and how quickly it's going to die. And so the Angela Raina thing is just another body blow for a Labor government that's run out of ideas. It doesn't know what it's doing. And it's not fit for purpose.

Well, I don't know if you remember, but after the last election in which Labor won the landslide that they currently enjoy, I did a article and video on our channel called Labor's landslide shows the country's moving to the right. Sounds kind of crazy one. They've just won this landslide. But the point I made in that video in that article, first and foremost, was the point I made in that video, in that article, first and foremost, was the problems labor are inheriting are structural in nature. And all of their bullshit claims about how the country is being ruined by the evil Tories because they hate the poor and all of this other stuff is going to turn out to be vacuous dribble very quickly.

And then they're going to realize they're saddled with all the same problems, which is what's happening, number one. But the other thing is, this is the thing is you want to run your mouth, you want to talk a lot of shit about the other side. I respect that. Like, I talk a lot of shit about people and things and whatever. But you best be able to back it up. And if you talk about the evil Tories like Nadine Zahari, who I've never been a big fan of, by the way, you know, having dodgy tax affairs and all this stuff, you best make sure that you're whiter than white when it comes to your affairs.

Now, with Angela Raina, I have to say, it's still an ongoing discussion. From some of the things I've seen, I actually think she's kind of. victim to something that 99% of people would fall victim to. So what happened with her is basically the British tax code is so complicated. You have to get loads of tax advice if you're doing anything remotely challenging with it. And she got legal advice about the trust that she had for disabled child while selling a problem. It's super complicated. And they said in the legal advice, you're probably all right, but you best get specialist tax advice. And what she did is what 99% of people would do in that situation, which is not get the specialist tax advice and just

chance. Yeah. Right. If you are then going to end up being deputy prime minister, that will probably come back to butt you and ask. But that is not the same as someone actively setting out to profit from tax shenanigans, right? There's also some questions about the revision of the value of the property. It's an ongoing discussion. But, and so I actually would be quite prepared to defend her and the basis that, you know, a lot of the people won't agree with this. People will hate this or you see this all in the comments. Oh, she should be held to.

These are, this is going to be coming from a lot of the people who've paid a bill to cash in hand. You've done all of the stuff that we all know people do. And by the way, I'll be honest with you. I don't do it simply because I know that people are going to be rummaging around in our stuff. But most people who are not public figures in some way, let's be honest.

Yeah. Most people in Britain, the very same ones are completely. about Angela Raina, will, like I say, pay, build a cash in hand, or do a little bit of this. Everybody does it to some extent, particularly when it comes to super complex things. You probably can't be asked. Okay, they've said it's all right. It's probably all right. You know what I mean?

Yeah. However, she is the very person that talked all the shit about the conservative ministers who ended up having to resign over the same type of thing. And if you create this ridiculous standard where any time anyone can, someone had a cake during lockdown and all of this other crap. And this is the biggest outrage in history. Well, now you reap the world. Let me introduce you to the people I work with to protect my family against financial instability, inflation and turmoil. For me, one of the best ways to safeguard your wealth is by investing in gold. And that's why I trust the pure gold company. Here's a smart

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participating stores only while supplies last the app for full terms. Well, I mean, that's it. So she was Labor's attack dog, basically. And then she was actually really good at it. You can see clips online about going after Boris Johnson and Boris Johnson reeling and not being able to handle her, which I found actually quite satisfying. But the problem is, like you said,

is that you adopt, and every party political party needs one of those. Let's also be very clear. Left, right, center, you need that kind of bulldog-esque, who's going to go after somebody and be relentless about it. And it ain't going to be Kirstama. But if you adopt that role, you best be sure that everything in your history is squeaky clean.

Because you are going to make a lot of enemies, and they're going to use whatever they can in order to bring you down, just like you have done to them. Well, this might sound idealistic, but I would much rather we lived in the world where we kind of understood that this is an impossible standard for people to meet.

And if we're going to destroy government after government after government over these things, I don't actually think that's conducive to a healthy political climate. I just don't. I don't think we want people in politics who've never, ever, ever, ever,

even remotely done anything that can be in the, super bright light of media scrutiny be misconstrued or presented as this person being the most evil tax evading person, whatever. But if politicians keep setting this standard for their opponents, then they will keep reaping those same consequences. By the way, one other thing on this, can they please stop crying? Oh my God. Can they can I, you know that thing about two tier, T-I-E-R? Now it's becoming the two-tier T-E-A-R government. Why do you all keep crying? I mean, This is it. Stop fucking crying.

Do you think Vladimir Putin is looking at Rachel Reeves, sniveling into a snobrag and going, you know, you know, Dimitri, we must call off him. We must call off war. They're too strong. Can they please stop crying? Why are you crying? I don't want to see you crying. You're supposed to be the leaders of our country who, like you say, are supposed to project strength across the world. Why are you crying on TV? Because you fucked up your taxes or whatever it is, and now you have to stop crying. Can they please all stop crying?

You know, could you imagine, like Churchill? Churchill did cry a fair bit. He did, but he did it in private. Yeah, exactly, like a real man. Exactly. I don't want to hear about your mental health. But you know what? You say that in a satirical way.

I mean it. I don't want to hear about the Prime Minister's mental health. No. The person at the top of our country who's in charge should be the most mentally resilient person that we've ever seen in human history. He doesn't break, who doesn't fail, who's always there on the ball, and he can have his breakdown when he leaves power. People think I'm joking.

I'm not joking. I do not care about your mental health if you're the prime minister. No. Or the chancellor. Do your fucking job. This is it. Because the whole point of being a prime minister is you are meant to be. prime ministerial. You are meant to be the person, the guy, and it is a man, right, who comes out

and everyone's like, that's our guy, that's our leader. He's in charge. He knows what he's doing. In fairness, it wasn't him crying. It's all the women he's appointed. And look, I just stop crying. Yeah. I'm not interested. I'm genuinely incredibly not interested. And then everyone talks about the crying and like, oh, I feel sorry for her. I don't. You want to. You want to. the job. You wanted one of the most difficult jobs a person can do. That's on you. Yeah. I wouldn't be able to do it. Yeah. But at least I know that. Yeah. I think so I don't go and and then start going, yeah. What's Cheonging Ping thinking? You must be pissing himself if he had a sense of humor, which he probably doesn't. Yeah. But we're a joke. We arrest people

for tweets. Oh, politicians are crying all the time. I'm trying down the toilet. Yeah. Well, the result of her resignation, of course, is there's been a big reshuffle. David Lamy, now Deputy Prime Minister. The news just gets even better, mate. By the way, I don't know if you noticed this. I was reading all the news coverage, and universally throughout all the media,

this phrase was used about David Lamy, which is he was widely known to have worked very hard to establish relationships with other countries in advance of becoming foreign secretary. Yeah. Right? That's not my recollection of what happened. My recollection of what happened, I looked it up.

I'll actually have to read this. We looked it up before we started because this is worth reading out. When he was a backbench MP in 2018, not that long ago, David Lammy described Trump as a tyrant, a woman hating neo-Nazi sympathizing sociopath. And then in 2019, ahead of his state visit to the UK, Lammy also posted that he was deluded, dishonest, xenophobic, narcissistic, and no friend of Britain.

But in his first interview since Trump's victory, David Lammy told the BBC, the president-elect was someone that we can build a relationship with in our national interest. Do you know? These people are shameless. I know, mate. Just absolutely shameless.

Do you know how tarnished David Lammy is? I'll tell you how tarnished he is. He's become the first black deputy prime minister, always about to be. No one's mentioned his race. No one's mentioned his race. You'd expect the left to have their dicks out and gone, this is amazing.

The only thing it could be better if he was trans, but no one's even mentioned it. Because it's like, off, it's him. By the way, by all accounts, David Lamy, very smart. Went to Harvard. And up until a certain point, was saying some really sensible things

about fatherlessness in the inner-city communities and all this stuff. And then you just want to f***ing mental. It's right, because I'd say about 10 to 15 years ago, he was Blue Labor, David Lammie. He was on the right of the Labour Party, particularly when it comes to culture. And then when the woke movement hit,

I mean, he didn't even drink the collade. He just froze some of it. He used it as a suppository so it could be done from both ends. And he went absolutely torn up. Anyway, he's Deputy Prime Minister now. And the Home Secretary is Shabana Mahmood, who was until very, very recently

seen at globalized the interfada rallies. What's not to love? And by the way, you know, we joke about all of this. But I tell you something now. I know a lot of people, as you do, in the American halls of power, they don't look at these issues the way that we do. They think we're going to share our security intelligence information with these people, people who are that globalized the interfaider rallies?

Yeah. You think, like, this is seriously discrediting. And by the way, Shabana Mahmoud is seen within the Labour Party is going to be, she's going to be tough on immigration lane. Yeah. Well, she's very much apparently to the right of the Labour Party. It says a lot about the Labour Party. I don't know, mate.

I was reading, she's a pro-castrating nonsis. Is she? Yeah, she came out. I'm starting to like her. Yeah, she came out and said, yeah, I think we need to castrate them. Maybe we need more Muslims in halls of power, mate, because at least they've got traditional values on those things. Yeah, and also when it came to the assisted dime bill,

she voted against it from a religious point of view. So it's kind of, and I think people don't talk about this enough. as the Muslim population grows, the Muslim population traditionally will be largely predominantly Labour voters. And I think here, Stama is looking at your party or whatever it's called,

Jeremy Corbyn. He's looking at the independents who are gaining traction on basically Gaza and Palestine. And he's thinking to himself, I've got to hold this broad coalition together. I've got to hold, you know, the white working class,

the Metropolitan Liberals, the Muslims. So he's going to have to put people in to appease all these different people, which is why I think losing Angela Rainer is such a body blow to him. Because for a party that purports to be about the working classes, you're looking at a lot of those front benches. You're like, you? You working? Well, Angela Rainer had the backstory.

And now that she's gone, that's a real blow to them in terms of the optics. And what you're going to get, you know, I mean, you've got, you literally have someone whose job it is to be in charge of policing, immigration, et cetera, who is attending globalized the, I mean, do people understand what that means? Globalize the interfa. The interfaith is a violent terrorist movement. That's what the interfaitor is. So global, like, people are, I don't really understand how that's going to work. But that. And this is something, again, not to spend this entire episode talking about how brilliant we are,

but when I remember when I first spoke out about woke culture and this far left ideology infecting British culture and politics and everything, people were like, well, why, like, oh, you turned down that contract once people said you can't make jokes at a comedy event at a university. These are just young people, you know. It's just students. Students are always a bit crazy on this stuff. No, they're going to grow up and then they're going to become lawyers. And eventually they'll become politicians and influential people. And this is what you have now, this ridiculously simplistic. Like there's a sign of her standing with a free Palestine thing.

And irrespective of what you think about what's happening in Gaza, standing with a placard with the words free Palestine is not going to resolve the Middle East. No. Peace crisis has been. gone on for 70 years. It's simplistic student politics sloganeering. And that person is now in charge of the Home Office. So what you've ended up with is essentially people in power who think that just saying some simplistic words is the way to achieve things. I don't think it is. No. No. And it's,

and there's going to be a lot of people who look at this and think, like an American going, can we share state secrets? Can we work together? particularly when you have people in America who are very pro-Israel. Right. And you go, well, this is a fundamental incompatibility. I think what's really worrying on a broad level is we have got a political party that is simply not fit for purpose. And my concern is going to be they're going to limp on things are going to get worse and worse and worse until we get to another election. You, I was reading how there's a group of Labour MPs.

who were talking openly about needing to tax the rich even more, increased taxes in order to improve public spending. I'm going, you're just, what are you doing? These are people who have no understanding of business, how to run a business, how to generate wealth. Well, if you don't know how to run a business, you don't know how to generate wealth, then why are you in charge of the fucking economy?

Well, if you look at most of the people in the Labor Cabinet, most of them don't have business experience. They all have public service experience or university experience or politics experience. So that's why one of the reasons that they treat wealth as something that government creates because they don't understand where it comes from. So to them it's just about you put taxes up,

you get more money off these evil blood-tucking, leaching, rich people. And the problem is, you know, when they made the changes on the non-doms, the non-doms just left. you haven't got more money. You've just alienated lots of rich people. Okay, fine. I mean, if you want to do that for ideological reasons, I get it.

It's the same thing they did with VAT on private school fees. It's just about punishing people for having aspiration. It's not actually raising a lot of money. No. Dozens of schools have closed as a result. There will be hundreds, maybe thousands, maybe tens of thousands of children that don't get the education they otherwise would have got. better education, for which their parents were paying, therefore taking the burden off the state system,

right? But it's just ideology. It's about punishing people for success and for aspiration. Being sleep deprived messes with everything. Reaction time, memory, decision making, even your emotions. It's like walking around legally drunk and the long-term effects just as bad as smoking. Most people reach for melatonin, but here's a problem. Melatonin is a hormone. And most supplements give you doses 10 to 50 times higher than your body naturally produces. That's why you wake up groggy. Your sleep gets worse over time and your body stops making melatonin on its own. That's why I use evening being biverso.

It's melatonin free using clinically studied ingredients to help you fall asleep faster, stay asleep longer and get more deep end REM sleep without messing with your hormones. I've been taking it myself and honestly I'm falling asleep faster and my mind actually switches off at night, which used to be a battle. Shut it, of course it did. Head to V-E-R dot-S-O and use code Trigger to get 15% off your first order or click the link in the description. That's V-E-R dot-S-O. Code Trigger. USAA knows dynamic duos can save the day like superheroes. and sidekicks or auto and home insurance. With USAA, you can bundle your auto and home and save up to 10%.

Tap the banner to learn more and get a quote at usaa.com slash bundle. Restrictions apply. I had a real issue with the school fees is because there was a conversation to be had because every private school is a registered charity. And maybe we needed to have a conversation like you're a registered charity. What's your turnover? Can you get any kids in on a scholarship? Maybe just one or two. If you're a tiny school. I mean, most private schools do have a scholarship. There's one or two that don't. I remember I had a friend of mine who worked in a very prestigious private school where the sons of the Beckham's went and they had no scholarships whatsoever. That is unacceptable. But we can have a conversation about it and go, okay, maybe this, maybe that. And then we can work together to ensure opportunity. To opportunity for talented kids who couldn't otherwise afford that type of education. But to just use that blanket. That to me was an act of class warfare.

That's what it was. But this is what they do. This is what they do because you can't actually fix the real problems of the economy if you wedded to the ideology that they're wedded to. And people will see when I episode with Catherine Porter comes out just how much this country is crippled by its net zero policies that are actually not achieving the results that they should be. You can't grow an economy when you've got some of the highest electricity

and energy prices in the world. Because the economy is energy transformed into products and services. That's what you do, right? So, but if you're wedded to net zero, then you will always have these economic issues that we have now. Anyway, I just, I, I, my sense is I'm actually, people will think that we're being very negative and we are. I'm incredibly optimistic.

I think this is all great. I do. You're an accelerationist. I've become an accelerations. I actually think at this point, Chris Williamson talks about this. We talked about it. I just recorded an episode with him.

And he's the one that introduced me to this concept. But basically, if you're stuck in a relationship, there's like a six out of ten, or a job that's like a six out of ten, which basically means you're not happy, but it's not so bad that you were just driven to leave. That's actually in many ways the worst place to be. So that's where I feel Britain has been for some time now. We're kind of at a

point where we all know things are getting worse and worse and worse and are bad, but they're not so bad that people have the incentive to just go, you know what, we need like real change, not just to change from a useless Conservative Party to useless Labour Party, but actually to give somebody a bit more radical an opportunity. That's not to say that more radical is necessarily guaranteed to change everything for the better. Radicalism. and Biden definition is extreme and therefore can have extreme good and bad to it, which I imagine will happen.

I mean, whether it's the reform or the Green Party, right? If you're on the opposite side of that, you're going to see there'll be issues with competence, there'll be issues with delivery. But my point is, I think at this point, the only way that the status quo will be destroyed is if things get so bad, people actually can't put up with that anymore.

Yeah. And I think that's the only way out. And so the worst things get, the happy I am. I will say this. Illegal immigration is obviously a massive problem. Immigration has been a problem in this country for far too long, far too long. And successive governments have essentially gas-lit a nation. That is unforgivable.

It's why I despise the Tories. And I don't want them in because I don't think they can be trusted. But to those people online who think that we're going to get rid of the illegal immigrants and other immigrants, and suddenly we're going to be living in this magical world where we're all back to the glory days, whatever they were. It's not going to happen. You need to grow the economy. Until we grow the economy, none of this matters.

And it's not just grind the economy. We have got a huge sway to the population who are not working. They are on disability, incapacity benefits. They're not working. Yeah, all of that's going to have to change. And that's the structural problems that I'm talking about. You have to scrap net zero. You have to, look, people aren't going to like it.

People are not going to like it. When you take benefits away that you've trapped people into by saying to them, if you feel a bit down today, you're probably depressed. Here you go. Here's a check. Fraser Nelson, when he was on the show, he talked about all of this. People are being trapped in the cycle of dependency. It's not their fault.

It's part of it is their responsibility. But look, I talk to Chris about this. And I said to him, look, you and I, and you and I too, this is true of me and you too. We are people who've always had a lot of drive and a lot of ambition and a lot of aspiration. Maybe above average? Yeah. I don't know, but let's say that we do, just for argument's sake. If you, when you were in your mid-20s, you were not having a great time in life.

No. Neither was I, right? We're both a bit depressed. We were struggling with this, struggling with that, addiction, whatever. Right. if someone said to you, I'm going to give you $25,000 a year, no questions asked to sit on your ass at home and do whatever you want. Would you have turned it down?

No. Most people would not have turned that down. And they wouldn't be happy in the end. They would not be fulfilled. Their life would lack meaning and purpose. But they would be comfortable enough that they would not do anything to get out of that situation. They would have been comfortably miserable. Comfortably miserable is exactly where they'd be.

So once you've trapped a lot of people in the situation, you then take those benefits away from them. They're not going to be happy about it. It's taking methadone away from an addict. But what choice do we have? There is no choice about this. We have to end the fact that so, so many people are not working, right? You have to grow the economy.

You have to scrap net zero. These are the things. Now, look, dealing with illegal immigration is incredibly important. Fairness, it does cost a lot of money, all of these other things. It's a security risk. We have to deal with it. But people need to understand, even if you get a party like reform that comes in, stops illegal immigration, maybe even deports lots and lots of people who need deporting,

that's great. That is not going to make Britain great again. No. It is one of the many problems that are plaguing our society, that is plaguing us as a country. And I think that people are hyper-fixating on the immigration issue because it's easier than actually looking at all the other problems. It reminds me of like a fat person. You know when a person is massively fat,

they're like, well, I'm going to lose my, going to lose weight, and everything's going to be sorted out. I'm like, it's not going to sort the job that you're miserable at. It's not going to sort your relationship that is failing. It's going to be, look, your health's going to get better, you're going to feel better, you're going to look better, you're going to have more energy. But that ain't going to sort out all the other problems.

But just like with a fat person, the illegal immigration issue has to be dealt with. Absolutely. And it's really important. But there are more things. beyond that, which is one of the big reasons the country is where it is. And one of them, you know, the other thing we wanted to talk about, and this is an American story, but the reason it resonates around the world is I think we've all seen this happen in our countries

is crime, violent crime, and particularly violent crime that is happening and being committed by people who keep getting arrested and released, arrested and released, arrested and released, who don't spend enough time in jail, who are not disincentivized from their behavior, and the general sense of a rising lack of, you know, safety in society. And this is, of course, a horrific murder of this Ukrainian woman who fled the conflict in Ukraine,

ends up in America. And she gets on a train in Charlotte, and the guy just looks at her, there's no interaction sitting behind her, gets a knife out, and stabs her to do. death. And that's bad enough. But then you go, it was going massive on social media over the weekend. It's not been covered by the BBC. It's not been covered by the overwhelming majority of mainstream media outlets.

As of the time of recording, which is Monday morning, in Britain, has been covered by the telegraph and now as of literally an hour ago, the Times. that's it. And look, you know me and people watching our show know how much we resent the re-racialization of society and the obsession about race and everything is about race

and it does my head in. We should not be thinking like that. However, after we've had this decade of everything being about race, you have to ask why this story is not being covered and it just so happens that the perpetrator is black and the victim is white.

And you go, imagine if the skin colors were the other way around. And he was a white person that stabbed a beautiful, completely innocent girl to death on a train who was black. Would we be talking about it more, do you think? I mean, it's undeniable at this point, isn't it? It is undeniable. And the reason these crimes or these incidents go viral isn't just because of the crime. even though it's an awful crime, and it's a 23-year-old girl cut down in her youth.

And the fact that she fled Ukraine adds an even more horrifying element to this. It's because it taps into something which you have just alluded to. And it taps into this feeling with people in the West, and it's not just people in this country in America, I think it's people across the West, who see their cities and communities descending into lawlessness, who see things like, I go to, I go to my local tube station

and I feel like I'm in downtown L.A. I feel like I'm in downtown L.A. There's just homeless people. They're aggressive. There's people just pushing past the barriers. People, you know, the guards aren't doing anything. And you're going, what's happening? It just feels like we're descending into something

that is not very pleasant. And for me, as someone, everyone can drink, who saw what happened, Venezuela, I'm going, I'm seeing the same kind of descent. I'm walking in London and going, and certain parts of London that used to be beautiful, going, this is starting to feel like downtown Caracas in the early noughties. And you just go, this feels like a civilization. If a civilization is a knitted jumper, it just feels like we're pulling the threads and watching it

slowly unravel. And I think people, are terrified and to be honest with you, I think they've got every right to be. Well, my point about the media coverage is it's very significant. I mean, look, George Floyd, what happened to him was terrible, but I mean, it tore the Western society apart in like dozens of countries. Daniel Penny, right? This is a guy, he's sitting on a, on a, on a, in a train carriage in New York. There's a guy who's threatening all the passengers. He grabs him in a chokehold and as a result of that, the guy dies. Or maybe even not as a result.

Maybe it's the way the medical treatment he was given after, we don't quite know, right? The media ran story after story, basically calling him a murderer, right? He was eventually acquitted in a trial, which it should never have gone to trial. The guy was, he should have been given a medal instead of a trial. The guy was a hero defending fellow passengers. But he happened to be white, and the person he grabbed in a chokehold happened to be black, right? So, wall-to-wall coverage, right?

And by the way, these are the same media. media organizations that lost their shit about Me Too. Now, there were some legitimate things about Me Too, right? Harvey Weinstein is a scumbag and all of the other people who engage in horrific behavior like that. But Anziza Ansari is a little bit pushy on a day, and they basically ruin his life. And here is a woman being stabbed to death in a random violent attack. Is that not a Me Too issue? Yeah.

Is that not a Me Too issue? We don't care about the safety of women unless it's comedians offering them to give them a blowjob or if the skin colors are the wrong way around? What the fuck is this? Yeah. It's so, so, so depressing because everybody knows there's fundamental inconsistency. There's hypocrisies right at the heart of all of this case. And the fact that we, it makes me, it makes me so worried because I think that we're now living, particularly in the West, because of social media and a lot of other reasons. We're living in these two camps. And you go, can we carry on like this? Can we carry on if we just feel like we're being perpetually gaslit because in a way we are? But we are being

gaslit. This is a case where because of the races of the people involved, it's not being covered the way that it would be covered if the races were the other way around. We know this. Now, that is not acceptable. That is not acceptable. And I remember when I did this Norway debate with Janice Varifakis and Cynthia, I can't remember her surname. And I said that we have created a framework of racism that works the other way around now, where institutions are openly racist against white people, all the people laughed in the audience. But that's what's happening. Yeah. That is what's happening. And it's completely unacceptable. It's unacceptable for institutions to be racist against black people. And it's unacceptable for institutions,

including the media to be racist against white people. And that is what's happening here. Yeah. There's no other explanation. No one, I can't think of a different explanation of why this story is not being covered. And you go, okay, if that is the case. And then you look at it societally and you're going,

well, if we carry on down this path, then what we're going to end up with is somewhere really dark. Yeah. Which is inevitably some kind of race war. Of course. But if you antagonize people in this way, instead of saying what we want is fair treatment for everybody, which is what we want, we don't want white power or black power movements. We want people coexisting peacefully.

I saw a clip on my Instagram of a guy. I think he's running for something in Texas, black guy. He talked about the fact that he was, I think, in the U.S. Army during the invasion of Iraq or Afghanistan. And he talked about the fact that he deployed with 100 people and like 13 of them are dead now. of every color. And he was like, this is my angle on it. This is why I don't think about things from a race perspective. That's in a society which has different ethnic groups, that's the only way it can work. Yeah. If everybody is treated as an equal citizen and when a terrible thing happens to them, it gets the same consternation, it gets the same media coverage. That is how it should be for everybody. Black, white, brown, Muslim, Jewish, atheists, all of it, Christian, all of it. And the fact that that is not what's happening is going to cause a hell of a lot of problems unless it's addressed quickly. Yeah. And also we... And I'm not on this one, I'm not an acceleration. It's because this one doesn't end well.

No. And also, we need to go, we were at a dinner and there was someone speaking and he was saying, you know, there's a lot of nice people in HR who were woke and are discriminating against white men. And I didn't say anything. But what I wanted to, because the conversation other people talked. But what I wanted to say is white power. Exactly. Give me it. When my country back, no. What I want to say is these people are not

nice. That's not a nice thing. What they're doing is evil. Yeah. If you discriminate against someone purely on the color of their skin or their gender or their sexuality, whatever the race, whatever the gender, whatever, then that is evil. That is evil. It's as simple as that. And you cannot be logical and rational

and intellectually honest and go, this type of racism is bad, but this type of racism, well, that's all right. No. What you and I have been saying is for a long time, and for a long time, until I think now, when people are aware of it, this was considered some sort of far-right talking about.

It's not a far-right talking about. People should be treated equally. Yeah. And white people should be given all the benefits of the rule of law, protection under the law that everybody else should. We shouldn't have these exceptions for certain groups.

And certainly when it comes to media coverage, the media need to stop covering up crimes and also to stop emphasizing crimes because of the races of the people involved. It's disgusting. And also law enforcement, and it's not just the police, because the police will go,

what are we meant to do? We arrest the guy. We put him in front of the courts. He goes, that's not on us, right? But the police need to do more. The justice system needs to do more. The prison system needs to do more. It just can't be.

And I go back to this. There's a reason that Robert Jenrick video about the tubes went viral. And people go, no, there's a reason because it taps into something, just as this case did, we cannot live in the cities and societies where we descend into lawlessness, because this is going to happen more and more, and people are going to get quite rightly more and more upset. That is going to cause more friction until something really nasty happens on a societal level. we need to take control of it. It's not good enough where we are.

It really isn't. I agree. Well, that's us for this week. A nice uplifting message for trigonometry viewers and listeners. People keep asking us to do these conversations, so we'll keep doing them as long as there are things to talk about. And there will be. And it's always going to be uplifting, mate.

Absolutely. We'll see you next week. This episode is brought to you by Netflix's remarkably bright creatures. What if a Pacific octopus held the key to a mystery that could heal your heart? Well, that's Tova's reality. An elderly widow working at an aquarium. Tova forms an unlikely friendship with the cramudgeonly, Marcellus, whose remarkable intelligence leads her to a life-changing discovery.

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