TRIGGERnometry - Dave Rubin: Don't Ban This Interview

Episode Date: June 10, 2020

Dave Rubin is the host of the Rubin Report. Support TRIGGERnometry: Paypal: https://bit.ly/2Tnz8yq https://www.subscribestar.com/triggernometry https://www.patreon.com/triggerpod Find TRIGGERnometry on Social Media:  https://twitter.com/triggerpod https://www.facebook.com/triggerpod https://www.instagram.com/triggerpod About TRIGGERnometry:  Stand-up comedians Konstantin Kisin (@konstantinkisin) and Francis Foster (@failinghuman) make sense of politics, economics, free speech, AI, drug policy and WW3 with the help of presidential advisors, renowned economists, award-winning journalists, controversial writers, leading scientists and notorious comedians. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

IP Vanish protects every device you own, your phone, your laptop, your smart TV. If it connects to the internet, it should be protected. IP vanish encrypts your connection and masks your IP address, helping keep your browsing private at home and on public Wi-Fi. And with no device limits, one account covers everything. Stream with added privacy. Browse securely. Connect with confidence.

Right now, save 83% off the two-year plan. Get started today at IPVanish.com slash audio and take control of your privacy with IPVANFANF. Hello and welcome to Trigonometry. I'm Francis Foster. I'm Constantine Kishin. And this is the show for you if you want honest conversations with fascinating people. Our brilliant guest this week is the host of the Ruben Report.

Dave Ruben, welcome to Trigonometry. It's good to be with you guys. You know, the alliteration in both of your names means that you will succeed as podcasters, radio, people, YouTubers, whatever it is that we're all doing. Those are perfect names. I think we'll do very well, and I'm very fortunate that my middle name doesn't begin with a K because given the reputation you get, but talking about any of the issues we're going to talk about, you don't want to have three Ks in your name.

It probably goes without saying that we're all white supremacists anyway, so let's just let it be. Well, let's get straight into the white supremacy then. Dave, I said you're the host of the Ruben Report, which of course is how people will know you, but you've got your new book out, which is right next to you behind your left shoulder. Don't Burn This Book. We both read it. fascinating stuff. Just tell everybody a little bit of why did you write the book, Dave?

Yeah, well, as I mentioned in chapter one, when I signed the deal for the book, which is a couple years ago already, I was originally going to write why I left the left, and that's a title of a Prager U video that I did a couple years ago that has something like 20 million views. And, you know, I've become sort of the poster child for the people that are leaving the left, the people that are realizing that leftism as it stands, progressivism, democratic socialism, socialism, collectivism, whatever you want to call this new postmodern set of ideas that seems to have infected our Democratic Party and really worldwide lefty politics all over place, that it has nothing to do with liberalism. And I've gone out of my way for the last couple of years

to try to separate those two ideas. And I'm happy to discuss that further with you guys. But basically, that was the book I was going to write. And after a couple weeks of writing it, I was kind of like, you know, I've said all this before. And I don't like, I don't like the idea of writing a book that's about things that I'm against. I want to write a book about things that I'm for. So I went back to the guys at Penguin Random House and I said, hey, I know we signed this deal here, but I'd really rather do this, talk about free thinking, talk about classically liberal principles, talk about why people are so afraid of saying what they think, you know, in a time like right now in 2020 where, you know, for America, for all her flaws, it's a pretty great,

spectacular free nation it still is as our most western nations by the way and they immediately said yeah we want you to do what you want to do and that's sort of what changed the book and what's interesting for me right now is you know we're taping this sort of beginning of june of 2020 i finished writing this book in july of 2019 so 11 months ago and then the publishing process just takes a long time so you know you have to edit for a while but basically i stopped touching the book in terms of editing and everything else in November of last year. It didn't get released until April of this year, and yet everything that I write about in that book is exactly what we're all grappling with right now, watching the left go off the deep end, watching the last few liberals unable to sort of stop it from happening because they're

either being silenced or logic and reason just doesn't play to this new lefty crew, some interesting alliances happening on the right with sort of disaffected lefties and libertarians and conservatives. and maybe more than anything else, that good people are just afraid to say what they think. I mean, that really is the driving point of the book. And as we watch, you know, J.K. Rowling get attacked on Twitter in the last couple days for basically saying that we should admit that there are biological sex differences, which we all know.

Or Drew Brees, who had to apologize for saying all lives matter, which, of course, all lives matter and police lives matter. And that's not to say black lives don't matter. I mean, things that we all know are true. and yet the mob comes and attacks these people, and that keeps good people silent, and I just don't want good people to be silent, even if you disagree with me, which is what I say at the end of the book, you don't have to agree with the 10 or 12 policy positions that I lay out in the book. But I hope you'll realize that I've thought them through thoroughly to get there. And then if you do the same, if you use logic and reason and facts and come to different conclusions, so for example, abortion is a big one that I hold a different position than most of my conservative friends, But if you come to that position honestly and forthrightly, great. Let's live in a country with people that have different opinions. Do you know, Dave, when I see your journey and when I was reading the book and I'm seeing my own, we shared a lot of the same thing. So I formed a school teacher

then became a comedian, lefty liberal, all the way through. And slowly I've watched my own side degenerate into lunacy. When was the moment for you where you thought, you know what, I can't do this anymore. So I lay out three cases in the book, or three moments in the book where I really saw like the craziness of the left. I'll do one of them for you now because I think that'll probably get us into a lot of the things that are happening these days. So I was on air at the Young Turks, and as you guys know, the Young Turks is a progressive, I would say far left socialist YouTube channel. I would say they've gone further in that direction since I left a couple years ago, But I was on their channel, and remember, I was a Bernie supporter, the whole thing.

You can find videos. I'm supporting Bernie Sanders, who I now know has basically, you know, the worst set of ideas possible. But we were on air and we were critiquing Fox News, which is what almost everyone on the left does all day long. Instead of coming up with their own good ideas, they watch Fox News all day and then they just sort of wait to find something that they said so that they can spend hours talking about it. And as I said earlier, I didn't want to write a book about things that I'm against. I want to write things that I'm for. Sadly, the left seems to always position itself, especially in a day of Trump. They're always positioning themselves on whatever it is, the reverse of Trump, that's what we're

for. But that's not a position. That just means you're going to take almost any position. And by the way, I think that's Trump's greatest gift, is he can get all his opponents to take any position that he wants. If Trump said, open borders tomorrow, they'd all be for a wall. So, in effect, we were watching a clip on Fox News, and there was a guy by the name of David Webb, who was, I believe, on Hannity.

And David happens to be a black conservative. Now, I say happens to be because you're not going to believe this, but I believe black people can hold all sorts of political opinions, including black conservatives. Conservatives, there are black libertarians, there are black anarchists. This is all very problematic, Dave. I'm out, mate. I'm out. I can't take it. I know, I know. It's a litany of racism and masagi.

Anyway, we're watching this clip of him, and he's talking about basic conservative principles, and they're calling him an Uncle Tom and a grifter and a sellout and all of these things. And what they didn't know, my co-host, was that David Webb and I, our friends, I had had a show on Sirius XM radio years before, and I was a lefty, and he was on the right, but we met in the hall one day, we became friends. And I used to go on his show probably once a week or so, and we would debate, and I'd take the lefty position. take the righty position and then we go downstairs, we'd have a steak and have some whiskey,

and we were good, and we did this for years. Now, I'm watching the supposed tolerant liberals look at a black man who happens to think differently than they think black people are allowed to think, and suddenly they think that gives them license to call him all of the worst things in the world. And at that moment, because I knew David, I know David, and he is a good, decent man who has spent, you know, the time coming to his conclusions, honestly, I looked at them and I thought, wow, you guys are the racist. The anti-racists are the racists. And I think we're seeing that explode into everywhere right now. The people who purport to be the anti-racists are the ones constantly injecting racism into society. The average person in America, certainly,

But again, in the West, generally, is not racist, meaning that they would want different laws for different people based on race. They're not racist. Now, that doesn't mean you might have some old prejudices, and we should do our best to unpack those and expose them, of course. But the idea that the system itself is racist. But really what this moment was about was a clear-cut example of them attacking a man I know and using his race against him, because he didn't think the way they wanted him to think. And I thought, this is what I'm seeing proliferate. And now we see it virtually everywhere.

Yeah, it's fascinating to me because I'm actually a very good friend with Zubi, who you've had on the show. And he gets the same, he gets all the same stuff. But it's interesting. One of the things you always say, Dave, is Twitter is not real life. And coming very swiftly onto what seems to be happening in your country and in ours right now, I'm starting to disagree with you on that one. I think Twitter has become real life.

Yeah, you know, it's funny when I came up with that phrase, that little one-liner right there, it was a couple years ago. And when I first tweeted it out, you know, I think I added a couple caveats that were seeing it leak into real life and all that. And by the way, I did videos about five years ago about how YouTube culture was suddenly becoming real life, too. So I actually agree with your premise. I removed it as my Twitter bio because in many ways, well, A, I was promoting the book. So it's a book promotion thing on there now. But also, I think you're kind of right that social media, the things that happen on YouTube and Twitter and everything else are now dictating how our politicians behave and react.

Now, a lot of that, obviously, you can link directly to Trump, right? Because he's the president of Twitter, in effect. But I think you see this across the board, regardless of political allegiance. People seem to want to get the most retweets, the most likes. It's a constant game to one-up somebody, destroy somebody. own somebody, prove somebody wrong, all of those things. And now we're seeing our politicians and in many ways, us, the people, we're behaving like that. So Twitter in and of itself is not real life in that if Twitter shut down tomorrow, real life would continue. But yes, the ideas that

proliferate on Twitter have now affected the organic lives that we live in a really bizarre way. And this is one of the things we wanted to talk to you about because big tech censorship is something that I've written a lot about. We have some extensive experiences as a show dealing with that because you may be aware of this. Last year, we interviewed a gender-critical feminist who said that trans women aren't women, and YouTube deleted that video as hate speech,

which incites violence against vulnerable groups. They then reinstated it because we kicked up a big fuss. Only last week we had a very widely respected journalist in this country, Peter Hitchens, Christopher Hitchin's brother on the show. He talked about the rationale for the lockdown not being as solid as people are making it out to be. YouTube shadow banded and we caught them red-handed. How did you catch him?

How'd you catch them? The way we caught them is basically you could not find the video in search on Google or in YouTube. And we literally got our producer to make a video showing him searching for it. You couldn't. And then we again kicked up a big fuss three days later. no acknowledgement from YouTube, no admission of guilt, anything like that, video now is available for people to watch. Let's talk about big tech censorship, because if Twitter is now real life and they are in charge of controlling our flow of information, this is the issue of the future,

isn't it? In many ways, it is the biggest issue, period. And I say that knowing full well that we're in the midst of worldwide riots, and at this point, what I would say is a supposed pandemic, to tell what's real related to the pandemic at this point. Although it'll be really interesting to see if, because of all the riots now and the protests, if we suddenly have a spike, on one hand, we know the media is going to somehow blame the Republican states for opening up early, and they won't blame all the people who were protesting this whole time. You know, quickly, though, on your specific case, well, first off, it doesn't surprise me, right? We know YouTube does these things all the time. But one of the tricks that they do is that,

they suppress things and then only days later do they release them. But then at that point, A, your subscribers don't see it. It already is going to be suppressed in the algorithm and not show up in search and everything else. So they're in effect crushing your video. Do you have any paper trail of it or absolute proof? You don't because they're not stupid and that's what they're doing. So first, let's not forget also that Twitter has shadow banning in their terms of service. It is in their terms of service that they are allowed to throbial.

accounts, meaning certain accounts can be seen more, certain accounts can be seen less. So in real life, if this was a basketball game or a cricket game or whatever else, if one team was playing by one set of rules and the other team was playing by another set of rules, and every time the score came in, one team won, and you knew that the rules were fixed, yet you kept playing, there would be something wrong with you. And in many ways, that's what we're all doing. So we know, so for example, May on my YouTube channel, it was the best month we've ever had in terms of views, watch, time, monetization, the whole thing. Now, I partly think that's because of good content and people are home and they're watching more and we're doing a lot of relevant stuff. And I had some big guests.

But I have no evidence that that's actually the case. Sometimes they're just kind of nicer to you. I think possibly what happened was, you know, Joe Rogan left is leaving YouTube at the end of the year and moving to Spotify. So I think they were like, holy cow, we can't screw over. for everybody right now. And, you know, I've been one of their most outspoken critics. So they're kind of like, all right, maybe we should, you know, release Rubin a little bit and so that he sees a little more money coming in. He sees his numbers. I don't know if that's true. But because we're only dealing with partial information all the time, it's like we're all conspiracy theorists at some

level. So I think what you're really asking here is, well, what do we do about it? Right. Like, what do we do about this? It is an incredible thing that we're able to do this on YouTube right now. It's incredible that we can release these podcasts, we can find ways to get our audiences. My preference is not to regulate big tech. I don't like the idea that you would take big tech and then take big government and somehow align them together. I don't think government does virtually anything well. So the idea that government bureaucrats would be going to the offices of Google and YouTube to try to figure out what they're doing with the algorithm, like, I just don't think that's possible. I think the ship has sailed. I don't think government's

functional enough. I think these companies, are too big. Now, what Trump did a week or two ago was he did an executive action, which, by the way, I don't love executive actions, right? Because that's not really how we're supposed to be governed. We're supposed to be governed, meaning that the legislative branch, Congress is supposed to pass laws. The president's just supposed to sign them. But all presidents do these executive actions. And what he basically said is, if you guys are going to act as a publisher decide who can be seen and who can't be seen, well, then we're going to remove legal protections. I'm basically okay with because that's not regulating in a traditional sense.

That's saying we're removing legal protection. So if you're going to be messing around, you're going to be more liable to lawsuits. So I'm basically okay with that. But for guys like us that are free speech people that want to exchange ideas, maybe talk to scary people sometimes or perceived scary people, there's a danger in that too because, you know, if Twitter and YouTube suddenly go, oh, you know, our legal protections aren't here, well, then suddenly they may want to be censoring more things. because they're not going to want certain conversations on board.

So I think we all have to be very careful what we ask for. And I'll just say one other thing, which is I'm a man of my word, and I don't just talk about these things. I actually put them into action. I started Locals.com. We're building digital homes for creators where you own the video, you own the audio, you own the user data. You set your rules in your community.

And the company's blowing up and we're getting tons of people on there and you guys should be on there. And anyone that wants to own their future, By being on YouTube, by being on Twitter, by being on Facebook, you're renting an apartment from a crazy landlord who's willing to rip up the lease at any moment. You need to own your stuff. And that's what we're doing with Locals.com. Look, I spend a lot of time telling you what's wrong with the world. So let me tell you about something that's actually right. Sleep, specifically getting more of it, better quality, the kind where you wake up and feel like a human being, rather than someone

who's been thrown down a staircase. Most mattresses are just layers of synthetic. foam and crossed fingers. You're spending a third of your life on the thing, and most people have no idea what's actually in it. Avocado green mattress is different. Their mattresses are certified organic, built from natural materials, designed to actually support your body properly rather than just hold you in one position until morning. The craftsmanship is real. These are mass-produced objects. Someone has put thought into them. I'll be honest. I'm not the person who thinks carefully about where he sleeps. My dating history will tell you that. I'm the person who's been on the same mattress for eight years and called it fine.

But the older I get, the more I notice that fine isn't actually fine. Your body tells you, if you're going to invest in anything for your home, your bed is the one that pays you back every single night. Avicado products are made, not manufactured, and thoughtfully crafted with real materials to deliver lasting comfort and support. Go to avocado green mattress.com slash trigger to check out their mattress and furniture sales. That's avocado greenmatress.com slash trigger. Avocado green mattress.com slash trigger.

So you wouldn't agree, Dave, as in, to take sort of the left-wing view, which is to come in and break these monopolies up. Why not? Because the idea that the government, well, first of up, I don't think the government has any right to do that. No one's forcing us to be on Google on YouTube on Twitter. Now, you can argue that maybe they've become the new public utilities like the phone company or the electric.

Now, I think there is some argument for that, but I think it's a rather unimaginative argument. You know, there's so many interesting things happening in the world with decentralization and blockchain and so many cool ways to get your stuff out there that, yes, if Twitter banned me tomorrow, let's say tomorrow, they pulled an Alex Jones on me and they banned me from Twitter, YouTube, Facebook, the whole thing,

would that be awful and a seeming, let's say a seeming infringement on my rights, it seems like it would be, but they still are basically private companies. The idea that the government can come in and say, oh, we're going to break you up so that maybe more competition can arise so that maybe more voices are in it. It's just like, I don't think the government's good at anything. I don't know anything that the government's good at. So why would they be good at this? And also, let's not forget, you know, all the conservatives that for a year have been screaming Trump has to regulate. He has to regulate Big Tech.

It's like, you know, Trump could lose the election in November. And let's say now you get, I'm not even sure it's going to be Biden, but let's just say it's Biden with Elizabeth Warren as VP, something like that. Well, congratulations. You just married the progressives who would love to silence all of us with the regulators, with big tech, with government. That is a nightmare scenario. Just try to imagine if the government had more power over big tech and now we have President

Joe Biden or Elizabeth Warren or something like that or Kamala Harris or God knows which one of these clowns they're going to select. But imagine that. And then all the conservatives were attacking the president all day long on Twitter the way that Blue Check lefties do on Trump all day long. You think they're going to stand for that? They will boot these people in a second. So those of us that don't like centralized power, even when it feels like we need it most, we have to be wary. I mean, if you don't have principles, when they're tough to have, you don't have principles. But all the that being said, I like that this argument is being hit in many different ways. So, you know, Tucker Carlson is more okay with regulation. I've discussed that with him on a show. I'm more of a free market

guy. The Prager you people who are, who are, I'm totally aligned with on most things, they're suing, they're in an ongoing lawsuit with YouTube over censorship. So I think you have to hit these companies in many different ways. And I'm not saying that I'm purely 100% right, but I'm putting my money where my mouth is with my company and we'll see. What I think we need, Dave, is transparency. That's the one issue we don't have at all at the moment. So if we knew what they were doing, if we knew how the algorithm is available. Why not?

You're never going to get it because either you have to have the government force them to be transparent, which once the government's involved, it's like nothing good will come of this. It will actually harm their ability to innovate and do what they want to do, whether the things that the things that they want to do are good or bad is almost irrelevant at that point. But yes, would we all like them to say this is what our algorithm is? And if you talk about these things, you'll be, you know, exploding in views and if you talk about these things, you're going to be depressed. They're never going to do it. I mean, the ship has sailed. The idea that they're

going to do that, you know why they also can't do it? Because they would completely expose themselves as publishers, not as platforms, which goes directly to what Trump's executive action was about. because then they would be open up to a gazillion lawsuit. Which, by the way, I think is why we see these, you know, people like Jack, who's the CEO of Twitter, Jack Dorsey and Susan Wageske at YouTube, you know, they're always donating money to lefty causes and blah, blah, because they're basically just buying protection because they want to be thought of as good guys while they do a lot of shady stuff. That's the simple truth, I think.

See, my concern with, and we're exploring this issue with you, Dave, I don't have a fixed position on it. I'm happy to hear it. Yeah. I mean, my concern was something like Google is the idea that Google is, you know, just a private company. Google, I mean, look at what's happening in the streets of our countries right now. In my mind, that is the product of 50 years of progressive intersectionality ideology being indoctrinated into people on university campuses and college campuses in America that has been supported and enabled and guided by these big tech companies. So the reason black people are being shot in the streets of America right now, to some extent, is a product of the big tech companies doing what they're doing. So, you know, this idea that it's just a private company doing business, I don't buy that. Well, that's why I said I'm completely okay with hitting this in many different ways. So Prager using the legal means, me using the means of the market, et cetera, et cetera. And I'm not even making the argument that they are purely private. We know that these companies have. have all sorts of relationships with the government.

We know that there are backdoors. They've talked about this in Congress, where they can see data through the back door that's not publicly available. But again, I think that my overriding feeling on this would be, okay, so let's break up Google. Google has to be seven different companies. Those companies will be regulated in strange ways by the government. But then remember, let's say you guys are somewhat friendly. I sense you guys are somewhat right-leaning,

so you're somewhat friendly to either the Trump administration. I'm saying that, Dave. I'm trying to have a career in comedy, mate. Come on. By right-leaning. Even you are putting us in the box. This is terrible. Oh, Dave, mate.

I've got my bookings when I get back. Come on. I probably screwed both you guys. But all right, all right, right. Let's deal with that quick. But when I say right-leaning at this point, what I mean is you're probably old-school liberal. I mean, you're probably just decent free speech people who don't want the government to do everything.

That's become basically a right-leaning position. I know that sounds scary and a lot of people freak out, but that just sadly is. The right-left thing is all screwy anyway. But whatever it is that we all are, let's just say people who are open and want free speech and some liberal principle, something like that, we just need to be really wary about what we ask for. because imagine giving the power of big tech and then marrying it with government if you don't like who's in charge of the government. And this is what this is the, in many ways, the key flaw of all of the lefties. The lefties and then the birdie crew and all of these people, they rail against government all the time.

Government's evil. Politicians are evil. Corporations are evil. Everything's giant and evil. And their answer is, oh, if we could only give it more money, raise taxes on people, make the state bigger. And it's like, you know, what I would prefer to do is I think you're right about some of the things. Big government is evil. There are problems with central planning above us. I like bottom up growth. My answer would be, okay, so you starve the beast. You let people keep more of what they earn.

I want you guys to keep absolutely as much money as you earn as possible. And then I'm not a complete anarchist or a total libertarian that I think taxes are theft. I think, I mean, this would be the classical liberal position. You need some government. unfortunately, to keep the guardrails on society. But I can tell you this. I live in California. We have insanely high property taxes and income tax and everything else. There are potholes all over the street. There are homeless people everywhere. Texas, Florida, they have no state income taxes. They have a balanced budget. We've got massive deficits. So everyone looks at all of these things backwards. And when I say right-leaning, I usually mean decent human being. It's very much the opposite. We're in the industry that we operate in, Dave.

Officially, I'm a centrist and Francis is an old school lefty and nobody can tell us otherwise. Hey, listen, if you guys lose your gig after this, you can come work for me. How about that? But Dave, we're looking at society now. And I don't know about you, but I'm incredibly worried. We started off, as you intimated before, that the culture will always started off as this online thing. It's now bled into reality. How bad do you think things are at the moment? And do you think it's going to get worse? Yeah.

Well, it is going to get worse. I'll do that part first. We have not hit the bottom of this thing for sure. That's number one. We can explore that a little more in a sec. Look, there was a bunch of us. I would say about 40 or 50 people, maybe even less, actually, online over the last five years that we're talking about these issues, right? Brett Weinstein and Ion Herci Ali and Majid Noaz and Sam Harris and

Douglas Murray and a series of people that were talking about all of these things. That's really what put my show on the map, that there was something wrong with leftism and liberalism was being destroyed. I don't know if you guys are Star Wars guys, but I always make the analogy that the lefties, the progressives basically executed Order 66 on the liberals. They just decided to assassinate everybody. We've got a couple liberals scattered throughout the galaxy, but they don't have much power and they don't have how to communicate and they don't know what to do with each other. That's sort of the situation we're in right now. Now, this idea of intersectionality of collectivism, of postmodernism, that nothing is true

anymore. And history is actually just something that was taught to us by the white man. So history is not even history. And in the UK, we should be tearing down monuments to Winston Churchill, who literally stopped the Nazis. and we should be tearing down our monuments here and all these things. We really need to understand that destroying things is very easy. You guys, me, everyone watching this could commit our lives to destroying the existing world

because there's an existing world and an existing structure. We can see it. We can feel it. We live in it. And it would be very easy for us to just spend all our time trying to destroy it. That's what the modern lefties are doing. It is much harder to rebuild things. or to build things from the ground up.

We in America have built something that is so spectacularly precious and good and decent where everyone from every corner of the earth came here made a better life for themselves. Nobody comes to America and stays in America for five years and it's like, ah, can't do it here. I'm going back. Nobody leaves. Nobody ever leaves. Everyone that stays, it doesn't mean you get everything you want, right?

But it means most likely, almost without exception, that you will pass a better life to your children and then their children and so on, then anywhere in the world. This is an incredible experiment. America is just an idea, the idea that we can all come here and figure it out. America is not based on an ethnicity or religion or anything out. It's based on individual rights and the pursuit of happiness. This is a beautiful thing. But the set of ideas now that are bursting forth, that we're going to have white people bowing to black people and we're going to ban police departments and we're going to basically be this lawless state. And we're going to basically be this lawless And meanwhile, you know, the reaction to that is what's happening.

Gun sales are absolutely through the roof. Almost everyone I know now is buying a gun. Yeah, almost everyone I know is buying a gun. People that were always against guns, lefties in California are suddenly buying guns. You know, this is what the left has wrought. We warn them. But will it get worse? It absolutely will get worse because we have an election coming in November.

The left didn't accept the Trump election the first time and then ran with Russian collusion and Ukraine and a whole bunch of. of other stuff. So there's no way they're going to accept the election this time. And I do think Trump's going to win most likely in a landslide short of something really crazy. But not only that, we could have a bump in Corona. They're, you know, we don't know, like listen to some of the crazy things coming out of these rioters. They're saying that destroying property is not violence. Really? You know, if someone came and burned down my house, I would consider that a violent act. But they're literally trying to change the meaning of words. These are not,

good people at the top of this thing. I think the average protester and the average confused young person, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. I don't think they're out there trying to be evil necessarily. I don't think they know the statistics. I don't think they know the statistics related to police brutality or related to racial incidences or any of these things. And the left is really great at manipulating people's emotions. So I think it is unfortunately going to get worse. We don't have a lot of adults in the room. I'm trying to be one of them. but we need way more people than me. Well, there's three of us hopefully trying, at least in this conversation.

But this is what I wanted to explore with you, Dave, because Lou Perez from We, the Internet, who's a friend of ours who's been on the show, he posted something the other day saying, it's 2020. So silence is violence, words are violence, but violence isn't violence. Yeah, he's right.

I mean, literally they're telling us violence isn't violence. But words are, and so silence. I mean, it's... Right. So, so... So silence is violence because then that means you're acquiescing to the evil system. I mean, that's just bananas. You might just not agree.

Well, it rhymes. Right, it rhymes. So thus it must be true and good. But silence is not violence. You know, the idea that words are violence is also completely crazy. It's completely counter to the First Amendment and anyone that cares about free speech should understand that. But this next idea that violence is not violence, that tearing down monuments, that destroying cop cars, literally burning down buildings, looting stores.

These are not violent acts. Well, first off, you know, a lot of people have been killed in these riots. I think about six black people, including David Dorn, who was a 77-year-old retired police chief, I think. You know, so people are being killed, so that would count as violence. But again, when someone says attacking property is not violence, I wonder if they would think if someone put their house to fire while they were in it, would that be a violent after knock? And we all know it's true. But the left is really good about manipulating language and words. And it's deeply, deeply dangerous. And it's not also the fact that they're very good at manipulating words.

And I've seen it because my mother's from Venezuela. And what they're exceptionally good at is making you scared. Like there are aspects of the Black Lives Matter movement. And, you know, that defunding the police and everyone's going, let's defund the police. I'm like, what do you mean defund the police? That's insanity. If you have a crime problem, then would you want more police or less police? Now, that doesn't mean that you want an unending police state. That doesn't mean you want, you know, to be fearful of the, you know, living in a community where the police are patrolling all the time and they're just randomly grabbing people and

putting them in black bags and driving away. But generally, we know that when, you know that would be in a community, you know that would, you we put more policing in certain neighborhoods that things do get cleaned up. Now, that doesn't mean there aren't some bad apples. This is how you have an honest discussion about this stuff. But the idea of defund the police in the midst of all of this, look, the simple thing is this, anyone watching this, clip this and let's listen to it a year from now. And in a year from now, if Minnesota or Minneapolis has defunded the police, I will bet everything that it is going to be more violent and scary. And if it isn't, it will only be because people either won't report.

things, or people will basically be trapped in their houses or just a huge population transfer. I mean, if you're just an average, decent person living in Minneapolis right now and you like rule of law, basic law and order, you thought life was pretty decent before all this, would it make sense to stay in Minneapolis? You better get the hell out of there. So they're really good at taking bad ideas and making them sound just. And I think one of the things that conservatives have have failed at for a long time is that it it takes more effort and more intellectual heft to explain things to say well actually look at the studies in 2019 only nine unarmed black men were shot by police that's infinitesimal 19 were shot by white men

now you're going to have to really grapple with that and think and then what they'll say to you is well that doesn't matter the facts the facts of the case don't matter we just feel America is racist and America was founded on racism and the rest of it. And again, it's very easy to destroy. It is very difficult to create. Well, it's exactly the same thing that we have in the UK. You know, we had a massive furori over a government advisor who traveled to somewhere to be with his parents so they could look up,

like a non-story, basically. For weeks, it was covered like it was like our 9-11. That was the level of coverage. Q this week, we have massive. protests on the streets, thousands of people gathering. Now it's okay. And now it's fine. And like, no one's talking about it. The media have just stopped talking about it. And not only, not only is it fine now, but we've had, we've had New York City officials. One of them, I think, is like the deputy health official of New York City is, I think his name is Mark Levine.

He said that if there is a spike because of the protest, that it won't be because of the protests, it'll be because of racism. I mean, think how profound. profoundly ridiculous, that is. Like, that's idiocry on steroids, absolutely on steroids. So there are so many, and that's why to get to your earlier question about, will this get worse? In many ways, the entropy of it, the energy of it has to get worse, because it hasn't burned out yet.

But you guys might remember on January 1st, first day of the year, I always tweet out a thread about what I think's going to happen in the year. And I kind of look back at whether my predictions over the last couple years have been right. and I've been pretty good in this game. And my feeling was that intersectionality and all of the stuff we're talking about right now was going to collapse this year because the competing interests of it

would be too much to bear in an election year. I still think there is a chance if collapses. Now, it won't go away quietly and it will lash out in horribly violent ways. I mean, I think they're just beginning to show you how violent they are. This won't be just about blowing up buildings. I think we're going to see

a different level of terrorism with them and all sorts of stuff. I'm talking about Antifa specifically. I just don't think we realize what level they're willing to go to to cause chaos. But what I think is a Trump re-election in November would be another absolute just foot on the face of this thing.

But imagine if Trump loses. Now, this doesn't mean you have to be the biggest Trump supporter in the world. I didn't even vote for Trump. I'm basically okay with Trump. And yes, would I like him to tweet a little bit? differently, sure, everyone's been through that already. But imagine if Trump loses, and then, you know, again, I don't know that Biden's even going to be the nominee, but if the Democrats

who really stand for nothing, but, you know, they're all, I saw it today, Chuck Schumer's bowing and Nancy Pelosi's bowing, and the rest of them, all of the worst ideas of society will be, will be empowered in the scariest possible ways. And then when we all joke that the gulag is coming, it won't be a joke. Well, hey man, I'm from Russia, so I've been warning people it's been coming for a long time. You know, you talk about Antifa. We had Andy Noe on the show last time he was in London. So our viewers aren't under any illusions about who these people are at all. But I want to talk to you about the media because, you know, you and Joe Rogan, I guess, are probably the two biggest shows on these kind of issues in the US. We are probably the biggest

show in the UK talking about this stuff. And what I see with the media is that feelings world that you've been talking about where if you feel something's right, then that's fine. That seems to have completely infected the mainstream media as well, to the point where large sections of the media in this country,

the BBC included, simply refuse to cover the facts. And they present a picture that's completely inaccurate. The BBC is complete and utter nonsense. Every headline at this point that I see from the BBC, I've had the BBC run hit pieces on me where they don't even put the author's name.

They literally, just write a piece with uncredited to an author. That's what cowardice and, and lack of journalistic standards is happening at the BBC. Well, Dave, you're a great success. I hope one day to get to the level where they get the same ship for us, man. Yeah, I've only had a vice article, mate, so. I, listen, I truly hope you guys get there. It will be a pleasure, and that will be a great sign. But you, I'm sure you guys saw the headline. I'm going to slightly butcher it, but just in the last couple days, there was a headline in the BBC about the largely peaceful rallies where, what was it something like only like 19 police officers, 27? 27.

Only 27 police officers injured in largely peaceful protests. And in the picture, you see a horse being attacked. There's an officer on the floor. I mean, it's complete chaos. And in my book, by the way, I write about, you know, there's a chapter on how to spot fake news. And what we all think, I think what are a lot of people think, is that fake news is just fabrications. Like, it's just like a completely fake story. But that's not really what the scariest type of fake news is. In many ways, fake news is a headline that doesn't match the story because you, because most people just look at the headline. They don't read the article. Or another, another really dangerous type of fake news is when the media purposely ignores a story because it doesn't fit their

narrative. So if the media had been dealing with any of the things that we're talking about, honestly here, then we wouldn't be in this situation. Because if the media had been saying for the last couple of years, you know, there really is a problem at the academic level. And there really are some problems related to how we're talking about trans issues or racial issues or everything else. But instead, the media ran everywhere in the UK and here and in most Western places that all of our societies are evil and racist, no matter how much proof we have that they're not. There are no laws in the UK that stop anyone from doing anything based on the color of their skin. And if you guys can point me to a law that says if you're black

or you're a new immigrant or something like that, you can't do this, well, then I will gladly fight that law with you. And by the way, there are no laws in the United States that stop you from doing something based on this color of your skin or your sexuality or your gender or any of those things. But they have lied to everybody for so long to make it seem like that's how society operates that now we wonder why young people are burning down buildings.

And then, of course, the ultimate irony of this is that these buffoon newscasters who are cheering it on on CNN and these idiot, really awful celebrities, you know, Seth Rogan and Steve Carell and these ridiculous celebrities who live in multi, multi-million dollar mansions in the Hollywood Hills with security and gates and never have to go shopping for themselves because they have other people do it at the stores that are burning down, although they're, The stores burning down aren't even in their neighborhoods. It's like, you guys are the ones you think this is going to save you, you fools. Like Seth Rogan, they're going to burn down your house. And there will be those smell of weed will be all over Los Angeles, right? But they will burn down your house because no matter how much money you give them, no matter how many times you bow to them or put out your crappy movies, you will still be a rich white guy at the end, Seth Rogan.

So you're going to get what's coming to you, not by my law, by their law. So you heard it here first, guys. Dave Rubin doesn't live Seth Rogen movies. Anyway. I mean, a 40-year-old virgin, well, was that a Seth Rogen movie? Yeah, I'm not a huge fan of it. I don't know. He smokes pot and mumbles.

Okay, great. But it's really interesting what you're saying because there was a radio show host or somebody who worked in radio here who got in problems because he didn't agree with white privilege or he said that he didn't agree with the concept. it's now becoming the case where if you say that you disagree with certain political statements, you're done. Look, let's talk about the white privilege thing for a second. First off, I would say that in America, there's no privilege other than American privilege. Yes, some people are born with money, some people are born poor, some people are born with great physical attributes,

some people are born handicapped, some people are born smarter, some people aren't that bright. Those are all the things that's the good word. I'm going to give you the gestalt of life. That's just the mix of life. But all a free society can do is, hey, we're going to give you guys equal laws. Some of you are going to work really hard. Some of you are going to make your luck. Some of you are going to be lazy.

But we're a free society, so we have equal laws for everybody. Let's pretend that white privilege was a real thing. Let's pretend it was really real. Now, okay, white privilege is real. So what are you going to have to do? Well, that means you're going to have to punish white people. Now, should an 18-year-old white kid who's a, busted his butt, played by the rules, worked hard in school, did after curricular activities,

did athletics and everything else. Should he be punished as he's trying to get into college? Should he be punished and treated differently based on the color of his skin through no fault of his own to let in somebody else? My answer to that is no. That would be racist. And by the way, Harvard is doing this right now. They didn't want that many Asian students there. So they make it harder for Asians to get into college. Now, why would we, now that sounds like racism, right? We're taking people of a certain race and we're making it harder for them to come into school. Why should we punish Asian people? Asian people, whether they're Chinese, Japanese, Korean, whatever it is, they by and large are at the top of our socioeconomic ladder because they work really

hard. They care about education. There's the idea of tiger mom and they care about family. And they thrived in the American system. Why would you start punishing them for that? No one gave, when a Korean family moved here in 1950, did anyone give them anything? No. And by the way, if you moved here from Italy or Ireland or you were a Jewish immigrant or whatever it might be, no one gave you anything. You got here. You busted your butt. In my book, I talk about my two grandfathers who both fought in World War II. One of them was flying planes. One of them was a mechanic. But I remember my grandpa already He died when I was in second grade, but I remember him telling me when I was probably in first grade, he was handing me like some change or something. And he said that his first job was for a quarter, a quarter an hour.

And he grew up in a bedroom with six brothers and sisters. His father died when he was two years old. I mean, the things that the people before us have been through and that we're going to sit here in 2020 and be willing to throw that away or to watch just in the last day, you know, people in the UK tearing down stuff. statues of people and writing Winston Churchill was a Nazi, the guy who literally, you know, helped us defeat Hitler. I mean, there is no greater hero, a flawed man for sure. But in many ways, there is no greater hero of the last hundred years than Churchill. He's at least in that, in that parthenon of people. So we've done almost everything backwards and we need people to start getting braver. That's the only answer. Just for accuracy, Dev, I'll say that they put

Winston Churchill as a racist, so not quite so bad. Oh, not a Nazi. Thank you. Thank you for the clarification. Nazis is the three of us, as we know. Which was the statue that they did pull down just in the last couple of hours? Edward Colson, who was a conservative MP and the slave owning, you know, he profited from the slave trade. He built a city where I went to school, Bristol, large parts of it.

So I, listen, I won't pretend to know more about him than I do know. So I won't comment on that specifically. But, you know, we have to remember that all of us, including us right now, We are just people of our time. There are things that people in the future will think of us, like we meet, of how barbaric we were. And let's not forget, Barack Obama ran against gay marriage when he was first running for election in 2008.

The progressives of 2045 are going to burn down the Obama Library because he was an anti-gay bigot. That is why, again, this is a movement of destruction, not creation. our founders in America. They own slaves. George Washington owns slaves. His half of the slaves did not get freed until he died.

And then Martha, his wife actually kept her half. But you know what? He was also the man who led the war for independence. And people wanted him to be the president and the general leader of the army. And he said, no, I won't do both. And he voluntarily put his power down. That's an extraordinary thing.

Thomas Jefferson owns slaves while writing the laws that freed the slaves. It does not mean they were perfect people. There were a million. Thomas Jefferson wrote about how he was afraid that if he freed his slaves and everyone freed their slaves immediately, that it would create this giant underclass of unemployment and all of these other things. Now, that doesn't mean it's right what he did or anything else, but the idea that we're just going to burn all of the history as if we're so great right now. Does anyone think we're really so great right now? Look where we're at. Look at the things we're debating. I think there's even bigger issue, Dave, to be honest with you. I think that's certainly an issue. But there's a much bigger issue of play here, which is fundamentally, you know, the guy whose statues they pulled down and threw into the water, he was a slave owner. But the question is, do I, I come from Russia. I was born in the Soviet Union. Do I get to go and pull down a Karl Marx statue in London? Because I feel strongly about it. Is that what we're going to do? They ain't going to be, no, no, not the beloved Karl Marx. They ain't going to be happy about that one.

Every group gets to pull down whatever they want. We get to use just violence and destroy things because that's what we don't like. Is that the society we want to live in? If I don't agree with somebody and there's a statue of them from 300 years ago, I get to go and destroy that. What about a building that was built with that guy's money? Do I get to pull down a building? Do I get to kill his great-grandchildren?

I mean, where do we take this? No, you're making great points. And let's not forget, burning buildings doesn't count as violence. So I guess in that case, you're allowed to do it. But, yeah, of course, you're making a great point. And this is why we have to fight this crazy ideology because everyone has a grievance or a perceived grievance against someone or something. So if we want everything not to be destroyed, then we better start calling this nonsense out for what it is. I mean, even I'm fascinated actually by what's going on in the UK right now because you guys, there's no evidence that I've heard of that you guys have any problem with policing at any level.

separating whatever is going on in America, there's no evidence that you guys have it. I'm watching cops running. Your cops, I'm sure you saw it too, the mob chasing your cops away. I mean, the whole thing is backwards there. And again, that shows you that this terrible infection of postmodernism,

it's here to destroy the West. It is here to destroy capitalism. It is here to destroy freedom. They're doing it in the name of tolerance, but they are truly the least tolerant people around. Who destroys, who in the last couple years, remind me guys, who in the last couple years was tearing down a lot of monuments? Isis. Remember ISIS? Yeah, remember what they were doing in Syria? A lot of monuments went down. But the thing that I always find very interesting, Dave, is the left's

embrace of communism. And in fact, when they graffitied Churchill's statue, there was a hammer and a sickle on there as well. Why is it? We have suddenly gone back to one of the worst ideas of the 20th century It hasn't worked anywhere. It certainly didn't work in Venezuela. I saw it happen with my own eyes. Why are this young generation embracing it? Well, they've been tricked by easy answers instead of thinking. I mean, this goes back to how did this all start? Well, it's mostly a failure of education. You know, the bad ideas that have been imported into the West about collectivism and socialism and communism, the idea that taking from some and giving to others just because you feel like it, that that is a admirable position, That's called greed. That's called envy.

And yet we've imported this through Bernie Sanders in many ways, as if this is a good set of ideas. Bernie, you've never accomplished anything. How do you get to decide who can keep what they earn and who can't keep what they earn and who should get what? And what should be free, which we know isn't free? And what minimum wage should be when you've never run a business? I have a small business here.

I know a little bit more about running a business than Bernie Sanders who's never accomplished anything. I mean, that's the truth. He's just an old, failed. socialist. And by the way, they'll destroy Bernie one day, too. I mean, the next level of this thing is Bernie just failed twice and he backed Hillary Clinton and now he's back in Biden. So they'll take out Bernie. There's no doubt about that. And that'll be a pretty beautiful day. Well, you've got AOC coming up. So you've got someone to replace them. You'll be fine. No, we've got a much worse version of it,

a much scarier version of it because she's better on television and the rest of it. I mean, I think she's mostly a dullard who's just felt, you know, they give her ideas and then she tweets them. And it's like, Every time she tweets something that sort of sounds smart, it's like, who's tweeting this? Because this didn't come from you. She's just terrible. But why are these ideas proliferating? Well, look, I think you can explain it this way. If you're on the right, like you far-right maniacs that I'm talking to.

This episode is brought to you by Netflix's remarkably bright creatures. What if a Pacific octopus held the key to a mystery that could heal your heart? Well, that's Tova's reality. An elderly widow working at an aquarium. Kova forms an unlikely friendship with their crumudgeonly, Marcellus, whose remarkable intelligence leads her to a life-changing discovery. Watch remarkably bright creatures with your remarkable moms this Mother's Day weekend, only on Netflix May 8th.

You're on the right. I feel like you're pointing to my soul. Anyway, carry on. If you're on the right, what do you basically believe? I'll do this from an American perspective, but it'll very much fall congruantly with UK perspective. If you're on the right, you basically believe in individual rights. That's sort of the core belief. And from an American perspective, that means those rights are granted to you or really protected by the Constitution of the United States.

So everyone should have the same rights, regardless, as I said before, of sexuality, gender, color of their skin, or the rest of it. That's the core of what being on the right is. Now, the right doesn't always behave that way. And you can argue there's more libertarian versions and more conservative versions and everything else. But that's sort of the core belief of being on the right. that you have rights and that the government should stay out of your way is pretty much the underwriting principle. On the left, there's no underwriting principle anymore other than the state.

What is the thing that brings people on the left together other than they want the state to do everything? It's not individual rights. It's not limited government or some principle, right? Those things are principles. On the left, it's, oh, the government is supposed to do stuff. Well, if you take that to its logical conclusion, where do you end up? You end up with communism or fascism or socialism or something because that's where you've outsourced all of the power to the machine. So this is the irony. These people who think they're in the resistance are actually the biggest suckups to power. If you don't want something to have power, don't give it your money. Don't give it your rights. What they want to do is they love power. That's why every time you have a progressive who's, you know, they run around with their blue hair and they seem like they're for tolerance and decency and all that.

But if you scratch them for just a second, what you will always find is a really nasty authoritarian beneath that, who wants to control you. So a great example I can give on this is on the right, when you talk about wages, on the right, basically will say, well, you let the market decide if someone wants a job, the person who owns the business could decide what to pay them, and then that person could decide if they want the job. I think that's basically a pretty sound principle. On the left, now they'll say, no, $15 minimum wage. Now, who came up with that? Bernie basically came up with it. And how did he come up with it? Well, he just thought of a number that he seemed to think was right. He has no principle to pick that number. There's no economic principle

that says that's the right number. And there's, by the way, there's no ethical principle that says the government can force you to do it either. But what happens is he says $15. And then, because these people believe government is inherently good, Rashida Talib, who's like a side show of AOC, she says, no, it should be $20. And it's like, well, you know, he just made up a number and she made up a higher number. So she must be right. And why not $35? She must be better, Dave.

She must be a lot better. You're right, because AOC, what was one of her most famous accidentally poignant lines? She said, you don't have to be factually correct. You have to be morally right. And that's what she means. You don't have to think things through. You just have to feel. Because I don't know where her morals come from.

To say you have to be morally right, well, okay, there's something good about being morally right. But I don't think I share the same moral code nor to most Americans as AOC. But I think you got my point there, that then they get in, that's why everything on the left becomes a race to out government themselves. Because there's no unifying principle other than government. So every time you say the government should do more, it de facto makes you seem like you're a good person. Do you think there might be a part of it as well that capitalism for a lot of people, in particular the younger generation, Dave, has stopped working for them in that wages have stagnated, gap between rich and poor is increasing. For instance, in the UK, the chance of owning

a house is from a lot of people or property is rapidly, you know, evaporating. And a lot of these kids are going, you know what? Why should I buy into capitalism if capitalism gives me nothing? Right. So first off, I mean, we should blow up a couple myths here. Capitalism has freed more people and caused more prosperity than any other system. There's the famous quote. I forget who it is. I'm going to slightly butcher it.

But basically, capitalism is the best of all of the bad systems. Capitalism is the chance that you have to work really hard to build something good for yourself. Now, that doesn't mean it's going to work all the time, as I said before. And by the way, you are right that we're seeing the rich get richer and the poor get poor and what we need in a healthy society. You do want the middle class is what you want, strengthen the. the most. So that doesn't mean that capitalism in and of itself is perfect, because by the way, then what happens is the government gets involved. And then the government is constantly rejiggering

the economy and regulating certain things and not regulating other things and saying this is a monopoly and this isn't a monopoly. I honestly believe if you got the government really out of all of that stuff, you would see more competition. You'd see more competitive wages and the rest of it. So again, I still believe this to be a government problem. Their answer, though, is just, okay, well, then let's give it more government to make it so that more people are equal. All that being said, for the young person that sees a bleak future, that thinks, okay, well, how am I going to afford a house?

What I think is we should all right now, especially in the midst of corona and the riots and everything else happening right now, we should all really be rethinking our lives. if you are a 17-year-old right now, do you really think that you should spend $100,000 going to college when you can learn most of that stuff probably in about six months on YouTube? Now, there's still an argument I think you can make that college is a place for socialization and it's good for young people to be away from parents. And I think we can deal with all of those issues in other ways, probably. I have no doubt that we can.

But we should all be reevaluating everything we're doing. You guys, it's like we should be re-evalating. Do I want to work at an office that I have to commute to and drive in a car 45 minutes a day or spend 20 minutes in the tube? Can I work at home? Is my home big enough? So maybe I need a bigger house now because I'm going to work from home. Do I want to live in a big city that every few months is going to be ransacked by a bunch of jackals?

I mean, all of these things are up for debate right now. And I think if you have your head on straight, I think there's incredible opportunity in the future. So I'm actually very bullish that we will get out of this and get out of it well. But to bring it back to your earlier question, yes, it's still going to get worse before then. All right. Well, we're going to wrap up in a couple of minutes. But actually, you talk about reassessing a life. One of the great things for us doing the show is we do it full time now.

It's become a – It's awesome. Which is brilliant. And what I was thinking about earlier today is the most precious thing I think you can have in this society that we have right now is being. uncannceivable. Because once you get to that, that's when you can actually, you know, you can say what you think. You can be free to have your opinions.

You don't have to answer to anybody. And, you know, I want to thank you from both of us because you and Joe Rogan have led the way in allowing people like us to go, oh, that's possible. You can do that. You can build something for yourself and you don't have to be afraid of the people around you. You know, Francis was joking with you about comedy, but he doesn't need it anymore because of you, because us doing the show. He turned us into Nazis, Dave. Thank you, mate. Hey, it's my pleasure, guys, but that's a beautiful thing. But wait a minute, I want to understand something.

So how, if you guys are now free and somewhat uncancellable, I tend to think you're probably still more cancelable than you think. How are you guys generating most of your rev for the show right now? So it would be through YouTube ad ad revenue and then people support. us through Patreon, subscribe, to our PayPal, et cetera. Now, obviously, there's a level of cancellation that's possible, you know, with all of those things. But I'm talking about more like, you know, getting fired or not being booked for comedy clubs. But yeah, I mean, I can see where you're going.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So what you want to do is, and if my example has helped you guys in any way, that's great. So let my example light the way a little bit further. The next step for you guys is don't. be so reliant on YouTube. Certainly on Patreon, Patreon could boot you tomorrow. Let's get you guys on locals. I mean, nobody's going to boot you, and you'll have a much more robust tech backing than

anything the Patreon is going to give you. And I'm not saying that as a salesman. I'm saying that as purely, if you guys truly want to be independent, locals is not a giant platform. What Locals is doing is building digital homes. We're a tech company that gives you the tools to build whatever it is you want. But in terms of uncannceivable, it's ironic because where did we start this conversation with your videos that have been shadow banned, which then, of course, hurts your views.

And what happens? Well, now your views are hurt. Now your monetization is hurt. So you're not quite out of the woods. And by the way, I'm not quite out of the woods because there's still other things that they can do to get you. But I think if you just keep going in that direction, and we're working on a lot of really cool things with locals right now on the decentralization side and blockchain and the rest of it,

If you keep moving in the direction to free yourself, you guys will free yourselves. But you ain't uncancellable yet, my Nazi friends. All right. Well, you gave us the hard sell date, but actually, I think we applied some time ago and we haven't heard back from locals. So please expedite that process. We've been overloaded, but right when we get off here, I'll make sure that they bump you up.

We have thousands and thousands of communities that are trying to be created right now. But it's a good problem when you have too many people trying to get Of course it is. But Dave, thank you so much for coming on. Please keep doing what you're doing. We're big fans of yours. And people like you and people like us, we're making a positive difference in the world.

And the more people are inspired by your example, the better. We recommend everybody gets the book. Don't burn this book. It is really, really good. I've got to be honest, I don't know why. A lot of people have that same sense with us sometimes

where they come to watch our show and it's mainly about the person we're interviewing because that's how we do it. So when I was reading your book, I thought it would be maybe kind of a rehashing of the stuff that some of your guests have said or whatever. But it's really a fascinating read and they look into your life and the things that have inspired you to, you know, to take a big risk and to create something very special. But Dave, thank you for coming on. We've got one more question for you. And the question we always end with is what's the one thing we're not talking about as a society that we really should be?

Well, in many ways, I think we actually just hit it, which is that there is our. opportunity coming. I know it feels scary. I know people are freaking out. I know people, every one of us is thinking, wow, should I live where I live? Do I need to protect myself in a different way? You know, even think a lockdown itself. It's like, am I in, am I trapped in a house with a boyfriend or girlfriend or husband or wife or roommate who I like? Am I trapped in a house with someone I hate? Like literally, you know, do I, am I too reliant on the systems that deliver me food? Should I have a garden in the back? Or should I have some chicken? Dave, I'm sorry to interrupt, but your researchers are so good.

You hit straight up France's life story right there. Yeah, you got chickens? No, I don't, Dave, but no, carry on. No, you should have some chickens. Ironically, we used to have chickens here, and then our dog was elderly and had cancer, and we were spending so much time focused on her. We don't have the chickens anymore,

which I would love to have chickens right now because I'd be getting eggs. But putting that aside, I think I really believe this. There's incredible opportunity on the horizon. You know, speaking of Winston Churchill, the UK has had darker days than it's having right now. And it may seem scary and all of that stuff. But leaders appear, good people stand up. I think you guys are doing your part.

You're not alone in the UK. You've got Douglas Murray, who I think is like the best of the best. We had him on the show like three or four times now, yeah. Did you? I mean, I think Douglas is basically, the clearest thinker we've got going right now. You've got great people like Andrew Doyle and you've got Majid Nawaz

and a slew of other people that are fighting these battles alongside of you guys. And we will get through it. And when we get through it, be one of the people that leads, that blazes the trail to the new world because there is a new world on the horizon. Think about it this way.

February, so four months ago basically, Seems like an awful long time ago. Remember when you could just go out with your friends and you thought everything was basically okay? It feels like the good old days already. Yeah. Well, yeah, it was the good old days. And those days ain't coming back.

It doesn't mean we won't reset to something. But there is a new world pretty much staring us in the face right now. And to loosely quote Jordan Peterson, if you can stand up straight with your shoulders back and you can clean your room, you might have a chance to profit from it And I don't mean that purely monetarily. I mean that spiritually, morally and societally.

As you always say, Dave, what a great way to end the interview. I finally got one. Thank you so much for coming on, guys. Take care. We'll see you very soon with another interview and a live stream. Yeah, take care, guys. See you soon. When you fly with Hawaiian Airlines, the whole family enjoys free access to Starlink.

the fastest Wi-Fi in the sky, thanks to T-Mobile. Stream, scroll, message, and game while sipping a passion orange guava juice. Everyone stays entertained and your vacation gets a head start. Enjoy every moment of your trip, even before you land. Hawaii starts here.