TRIGGERnometry - LIVE Reaction to Manchester Terror Attack - Ex-Police Detective, Peter Bleksley

Episode Date: October 3, 2025

Apologies for the Sound. This was an Impromptu Live. Join our exclusive TRIGGERnometry community on Substack! https://triggernometry.substack.com/ Triggernometry is proudly independent. Thank you to the following sponsors for helping make that happen: - GiveSendGo: the free speech crowdfunding platform https://www.givesendgo.com/#triggerpod - Protect your wealth with The Pure Gold Company. Get your free investor guide at https://pure-gold.co/trigger - Battle of Ideas Festival 2025: Book your tickets at https://battleofideas.org.uk. Use code TRIGGER25 for a 20% discount on all tickets. OR Support TRIGGERnometry Here: Bitcoin: bc1qm6vvhduc6s3rvy8u76sllmrfpynfv94qw8p8d5 Shop Merch here - https://www.triggerpod.co.uk/shop/ Advertise on TRIGGERnometry: [e-mail] Find TRIGGERnometry on Social Media: https://twitter.com/triggerpod https://www.facebook.com/triggerpod/ https://www.instagram.com/triggerpod/ About TRIGGERnometry: Stand-up comedians Konstantin Kisin (@konstantinkisin) and Francis Foster (@francisjfoster) make sense of politics, economics, free speech, AI, drug policy and WW3 with the help of presidential advisors, renowned economists, award-winning journalists, controversial writers, leading scientists and notorious comedians. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Not loving your AT&T or T Mobile Bill? Yeah, we've been hearing that a lot. Good news. Bring your AT&T or T Mobile Bill to Verizon and we'll give you a better deal. And we'll give you a better deal to Verizon and we'll give you a better deal on the best network. That's Verizon. Best Network based on Route Metrics, Best Overall Mobile Network Performance U.S. Second Half 2025, all rights reserved. It must provide a recent consumer mobile bill in the name of the person who gave me the deal. Additional Terms Conditions and Restrictions Apply. USAA knows dynamic duos can save the day, like superheroes and sidekicks or auto and home insurance. With USAA, you can bundle your auto and home and save up to 10%. Tap the banner to learn more and get a quote at usa.com slash bundle. Restrictions apply. Hello everybody and welcome to this episode of unscheduled episode of trigonometry, of course related to the terrible attack in Manchester on a synagogue yesterday. joining us again, returning to the show,

is former police detective Peter Blacksley. Peter, welcome back. Thank you for having me. It's a terrible thing for all of us that we only get to see each other when terrible things happen, but that is where we are. What do we know, first and foremost,

about what happened yesterday? Okay, at 9.31 a.m. yesterday, Thursday, the 2nd of October, 2025, a member of the public, dialed 999, calling the emergency services. and they reported that they had seen a car drive in to people and that the driver of that car had got out and was attacking people with a knife. So that was the scene setter for the people receiving that call

and the information that's then going to be relayed to the police and other emergency services. What we then know is that at 937am, probably based on other information, that had come forward. Greater Manchester Police declared this as a major incident and that means that other resources basically can be deployed to it. And at 9.38 a.m., we know, and the footage has been widely available on social media and elsewhere, the armed police officers shot a 35-year-old man. Jihad al-Sharmie, who was apparently born in Syria and came to Britain as a child, he was shot dead by armed police. Jihad al-Shami had had what looked like a potentially explosive device

strapped around his waist. Again, the images are widely available on social media and broadly mainstream media. After he'd been shot, because he has a device that the police do not know whether that is a viable bomb or not, they have to work on the theory that it is. And so, of course, huge caution

has to be exercised here. A bomb disposal robot was deployed, which then carried out a controlled explosion of what appeared to be the device on Jihad al-Shammi's body. They later told us

that, in fact, it was not a viable device. And I would imagine, in my opinion, something designed to spread fear and terror into the very hearts and soul of anybody that saw it, along, of course, with his murderous actions. And as we move on to that, tragically, two people were killed by him,

was stabbed to death by him, although there has been recent reports that one of the victims, one of the dead people, did in fact have a gunshot wound. And Jihad al-Shammie did not have a weapon. So that gunshot wound must have come from a weapon fired by a police officer. I'll perhaps touch on that in just a little while.

Three people remain in hospital, seriously injured, and that is with a very broad brush, the dreadful, appalling terrorist events that happened and a synagogue in Crumps or Manchester yesterday. Now, one of the things that I think it's really worth saying, well, two things really. One, of course, the thoughts of everybody will be with the victims, their families, the people who are in hospital, we hope for the swift and speedy recovery and full recovery.

But the other thing, before we get into the other ramifications of this, is, you know, on this show, we are often critical of certain aspects of what people have described as two-tier policing. There's criticism, rightfully, in my opinion, under police. But in this instance, you have to say that this is an incredibly fast response to get there in seven minutes and deal with the terrorist threat in this way is a testament to their professionalism. Was there also a stroke of luck, do you think, in them getting there that quickly? Is this a standard speed of response to this kind of incident? your show, when justifiable, I am a very fervent and vocal critic of the police. Likewise, when they do brilliant things, and our police do do brilliant things, they are rightfully

deserving of praise. What we don't know about yesterday's timings, in other words, they were there and they'd shot him dead within seven minutes. We don't know if those armed police officers were nearby by default, by design or by luck. We just don't know. That will come out, I'm sure, in the ongoing inquiry. Perhaps they were deployed to be close to synagogues because, of course, it was the most holy day in the Hebrew calendar yesterday. Yom Kippur, it would make sense if the police,

given the heightened tensions in the world and in Britain today, had deployed more armed police officers to be in those kind of locations. We don't know yet. Either way, what is clear to me from the footage that I've seen, everything I've heard, everything I've read, those police officers having initially shot Jihad al-Shammie,

sawing fall to the floor, and then he starts to move again after having been originally shot. Those officers, without any concern for their own safety, by the looks of the footage, were less than 15 metres away from Jihad al-Shammi as he laid on the ground. As he tries to lift himself back up, I don't know, but I would imagine that perhaps the officers saw,

is he going to come at us again with a knife and he's already wreaked so much havoc? Or is there a possibility that he's going to detonate that device? And had that device been viable and had he detonated it, then in all probability those police officers would not be here today. But they got close enough so they could engage him and they then shot him again as he tried to get up from the ground.

And I would imagine it would be perhaps the final fatal shot, but all of this will come out at a later inquiry. Peter, so we know that the belt wasn't viable, the bomb wasn't viable. Is there another reason why these terrorists wear those belts is so that they almost ensure the fact that they're never going to be captured? Because the police really have to kill them. They have no other option because you simply can't risk the detonation of a bomb in a crowded area like that next to a place of worship. Yeah, I think you raise a very good point here.

Perhaps it is in their sick, twisted, evil minds, perhaps this is a way that they can try and claim some form of martyrdom by being shot dead by the police. They're not martyrs. They're cowards. He is a murderous, repugnant. repulsive piece of garbage. And the good thing about the police shooting him dead is that he will never be able to carry out such despicable acts ever again. One of the worrying things about the, I mean, there's lots of worrying things about the case, but one of the particularly worrying things for me was, is that he wasn't known to the authorities, he wasn't known to counter terrorism, which then begs the question, well, if somebody like him, who is clearly as extreme as he was.

And there were reports which haven't been confirmed that he sent death threats to a Conservative MP. Why am they thinking, well, how many of these people? How many are the jihad al-Aashamis? Are they wandering the streets who we don't know about as well as all the people on terrorist watch lists who we do? Well, we know that of the people that are of interest to the security services and counter-terrorism police,

around about 75 or 80% of that workload is radical Islamists. So that's a huge, huge chunk. The breaking story about did he send death threats to an MP or not, I think he's yet to be confirmed either way. Let's just say he did. Then if he did do that and he has not been referred to counterterrorism police or even local police, at the very, very least, that will be a major failing,

but we will have to wait and see what happens as a result of that. But while we're talking about MPs, and I'd just like to echo your words right at the top of this interview, and thank you, of course, my thoughts with the family and the loved ones of those who lost their lives and those who are still in hospital, and all of that community. But let's think about MPs,

because of course we've had two. two MPs murdered in recent times to David Amos and Joe Cox. We've got a lot of bloodshed in this country, unfortunately. So there should be huge attention and suitable resources when required deployed to the MPs where we do feel there's a risk. And on that very note, what happened this week? we heard that the Home Office had cut the funding for Nigel Farage's security by 80%. And they'd offered up a kind of mix and match whereby 20% of funding,

so 20% of security staff would come from the Home Office side of things. And the remainder would have to be made up from private costs and a different security company, which would have been, of course, largely unworth. So these things are all linked. MPs, danger to MPs, terrorism, bloodshed, but they're inextricably linked. Peter, can I take you back a little bit? We'll talk about the political ramifications of this, I'm sure.

You mentioned that almost immediately the decision was made to designate this a major incident. Why, how would that decision have been made so quickly? Is it because there was reports of somebody stabbing numerous people or would they have had some other information going, this guy is actually potentially a terrorist? How did they know so quickly that it was a major incident? There's a number of criteria that have to be met by somebody senior within the control headquarters of Greater Manchester Police. I'm sure that the 931 call wasn't the only call they got.

We know there were other people there. some people were filming it, and these things come to the attention of a considerable number of people very quickly. Whatever it was, the information that went into that control room, it filled all the criteria, ticked all the boxes, and so they were able, in a very short space of time, so yeah, this is a major incident. And I've also heard that two other people have been arrested. Do we know anything about those? Have they been released? Have they been charged? Do we know anything at all about them? Three other people are powerful.

Three. Yeah, it's three. Two men in their 20s, I believe, and a woman in her 60s have been arrested. We know nothing about them as we speak, but they were arrested nearby. And again, it goes back to my earlier point, which is this is so incredibly worrying because he wasn't known to the authorities. Look, the question I'm going to ask you is quite a blunt one, but how big a problem is radical Islamism jihad in this country at the mother.

This is going to sound like a preposterous question, given the guy's name, but do we actually know that he was a radical Islamist at this point? No, to the point of being able to confirm it live on air? No, we don't. The media have not said that. Yeah. But I am quite happy to stake whatever shredded reputation of God. In fact that he has been radicalized, he's an Islamist.

Of course, let's look at the facts. You don't have to be Sherlock to work out what his motivations probably were. Right. Yeah. So how great a threat does this ideology pose to the country, to the stability of the country and to the safety of people? 80% of the workload of counterterrorism police in MR5. Radical Islam. That's a huge chunk of their workload.

And they're just the ones they know about the security services and our counterterrorism police. While we sleep soundly in our beds, together with some hugely courageous people are out there, thwarting plots, observing people, endeavoring to frustrate and otherwise stop murderous terrorist plots. And they do that 365 days of the... year and we owe them all a huge debt. Of course with the scale of the problem, as it is, there are going to be individuals that act alone or in a small cell that does not come to the attention prior to the police or the security services. That's inevitable. It's going to happen and it's going to have tragic consequences. We only have to look back at

People like Axel Ruda Bacana and his murderous rampage in Southport. He was on the radar. He'd been a part of the prevent program in the past because he'd been radicalized or was regarded as such a threat. So even people that have been on it at some stage have gone on to commit atrocities.

And now we have this character with his murderous actions of yesterday. It's a problem. It's a considerable problem. We have getting on for four million Muslims in the UK, many of whom, of course, are law-abiding, peaceful, worship as they want to, contribute to the country, pay their taxes. But there are some that don't, some that make up that 80% of the security services and counter-terror police's workload

and bear with me one moment while I just delve into my phone because this is apperzite and relevant as I see it in the last five days for the figures that are available in the last five days two thousand and thirty-seven illegal migrants have entered the UK on 30 dinghies. 2037. People who I am not with a sweeping statement

going to say they are all Islamic jihadis, right? But we don't know where they've come from. We don't know their backgrounds. We don't know their intentions. And we don't know how they're going to fill their time while they are in the UK. And because we have had an abhorrent government followed by another pathetic government

who are not gripping this problem, who are allowing these people into our shores, in fact, with the help of border force and such like, facilitating it by bringing them in on their vessels, and so it goes. Smashing the gangs? It's almost abhorrent for me to say that phrase, because it's clearly not happening.

And there has to be an element of danger to the UK, to the citizens of this once great nation. And it is negligent. It is abhorrent. It is an absolute disgrace that our government are not stopping it. Because time, sadly, will tell us that amongst that number are people coming to our shores who are a threat. If not a terrorist threat, then a threat in terms of so many people that we've seen arrested for sexual offences and the such line. And it's a great point because, look, we can then turn around and point the finger of police, counter-terrorism.

But then the police and counter-terrorism can go, look, there's only so much we can do. and we're working as hard as we possibly can, eventually one is going to slip through. Well, on that very thing, I was speaking to somebody earlier today who isn't, I won't give the details, but who's familiar with the security case workload. And he was saying basically, there's so many plots now being stopped, everybody always knew at least one, maybe more, I hope not, would get through by the year end because there have been so many of these. Because the scale of the problem now is so.

vast. Yeah. And let's face him. Let's talk about some more uncomfortable truths, shall we? Many of these people, and I'm talking about immigrant populations that have come together, live together. They occupy street after street in their own little environment, their enclave. And I can see why people who come to this country as a migrant might be attracted to wanting

to live in the same street as another migrant, but it's not really integrating, is it? If all you're doing is living with people that look like you, talk like you, sound like you, as an immigrant, you're not really integrating, are you? If ever I was to live in another country, the last thing I'd want to do is live in a community surrounded by expats, British expats,

that wouldn't be the point of going to live abroad, would it? Anyway, I digress somewhat. So when you've got, you know, we have a huge number of people that are off the radar, live in the black economy, we know all this because we see so often when immigration officials or border force or people from HMRC carry out searches, raids on premises, and they end up levying fines because people here illegally and working illegally. The bottom line is

our nation does not know the identity of everybody here and we don't know how many undocumented people living under the radar there are. Well, up to a million at this point from some of the figures. Peter, I know it's a tangential question because this person, as far as we know,

this jihad guy, was not monitored by Prevent. Do you think Prevent is working? Prevent being the government program to de-radical. Do you think de-ridicalization is working? When I was a detective and you'd get a new young officer, you know, come to work with you for a while and you'd talk to them about criminality and we can say the same about terrorism and the such like...

I used to telling the story, it's like we cast a net, okay? As police officers, we cast a net. and we hope that that net is going to scoop up every bad boy, every bad girl, and we're going to live in some kind of crime-free navana. But it's not like that. When you cast that net, exactly as if you're casting a huge, great fishing net into the ocean, you're not going to scoop everything up.

Things are going to get through the mesh up over the top, Round the side, fall out, whatever. You just hope to scoop up as many as you can. And that's how it is. That's how it is now, I'm sure, counter-terrorism police and security services know that it's imperfect. They can't stop every plot. Yesterday's tragic events showed us that.

I'm never going to hang them out to dry it because they do do astonishing work. And believe you me, as somebody who has worked with people and done an element of being out there in the dead of night myself climbing through quarries and up ill and down dale to get a suitable observation point where you can watch people having worked with colleagues that shall we just say without giving away too many secrets

are brilliant at conceding themselves in places where us three just would never want to go in order to keep surveillance. Of course, it's 2025, so there's also huge elements of technical surveillance. We're very much in the digital world, but it still needs courageous people, and they're still out there.

And they'll be out there on Christmas Day. When we're tucking into a bit of turkey or whatever takes you fancy, pulling crackers, drinking, surrounded by our loved ones, there will be people out there like there are every other day or year trying to stop people blowing us to smithereens

or stabbing us to death and the threat is out there. It's very, very real this will happen again and I feel it is in the here and now just another symptom of the decline

of this once great notion Peter, when are we going to start talking openly and honestly about this? I don't mean here or in certain podcasts. I mean out in the media because I used to go to football. I went to football a few times with Sir David Amos. He was a wonderful man, English eccentric in the best sense of the word. And he was murdered in the most awful, brutal way.

It still has a profound effect on me now. And I remember watching the news coverage afterwards. and they were talking about online hate. And I was saying to myself, this isn't about online hate. This is about radical jihad. This is about radical Islam. This is about people who feel entitled to kill and maim and destroy other people's lives purely for a political and religious ideology.

My question is, when are we going to just be honest about this and talk about it bluntly instead of hiding behind terms like, oh hate and hate must never be allowed to exist and all of this quite frankly bollocks that we're talking about yeah but I'm 65 so terrorism driven by a faith and political kind of motivation is no stranger at me because I grew up every time going on a bus or the underground or an overground train looking for an unattended bag because the IRA carried out attack after attack after attack after attack during my childhood and into adulthood

and of course the Harrod's bomb took some of my B-division colleagues with it tragically and injured many others so I've had a terrorist threat virtually for as long as I can think of or remember that threat of course was tackled by politics because we eventually

thanks to the brilliance of and he never gets very much pressed for this, the process being started by John Major. Then Blair, of course, who took all the glory, but people like Moe-Molem and many others

who, I hope they'll forgive me because I've forgotten their names. Many, many people played a huge, huge part in bringing about the Good Friday Agreement. So, when he politics, essentially driven by faith, I think it can be tackled. When, however, somebody's grievance and their hatred is driven purely by a religious

ideology without kind of trying to establish any acceptable political norm, how do you tackle it? I don't know. And is it going to grow? When I was, I was born in 1959, the first census of my lifetime, was in 1961 when 21,000 people in the UK identified as being Muslim. There's now nearly 4 million as a significant growth of that population in my lifetime. I think those figures understandably alarm many people. A lack of integration, driven by hatred, an ideology of,

religious ideology, which people certainly are, and I would fundamentally suggest Jihad al-Shameh was yesterday, is a deeply worrying thing. And I don't suspect there's going to be any simple answers to it, but there may be multiple answers if only people were willing to grasp the nettle, stand up, be courageous and say, this is what needs to be done. But what are the answers though, Peter? What are some of the answers to deal with it? Because I've heard a lot of people make the comparison with Northern Ireland.

And for the reasons you give, I think it's completely inappropriate for the very reasons that you state. Because Northern Irish terrorism in the mainland of Britain was about achieving the political end of a United Island. Yeah. And let's say the government of the day had been willing to do that, we would not have had terrorism in this country. But I don't even know if the British state was prepared to surrender to Islamism. might well be at this point, frankly. What the surrender would be? Like, what do these people want from us exactly?

Why are they killing our fellow citizens? What are their objectives? What is it that they want? Exactly. I don't think anybody knows. I do. You do. Okay, tell me.

You don't have to delve too deeply into social media to find many, many videos of people saying, we're here to take over. Oh, you can see them. You can see them. on social media. They're quite simple to find they will pop up on my timeline

from time to time. People saying, we are here to take over. Simple. It's a plan. Now, of course, I sincerely hope that's a plan

that will never come to succeed and can be thwarted and won't be the desire of the moderate Muslims, but is the desire

of the lunatics off the scale radical Islamists. You know, it's Friday. So I'll probably go for a curry tonight. My local curry house is amazing and it's run by it. Muslim fellas, right?

The father, who's since retired, originally came over from Bangladesh 40 or years ago, ran the business, drew it, wonderful restaurant, amazing. a real kind of centre point for the community. And he's handed it over to his boy now.

Okay? It was a lovely fella. And I say to him a few weeks ago, getting me to curry, I said to him, you know, what do I say to people who are concerned about the rise of Islam and are concerned about people who claim that they're here to take over

and not to live side by side and contribute? And he says, well, he says, it's them not, isn't it? Because, of course, there's a huge great division, isn't there? In Islam between Sunni and Shia. He said, it's them. He said, it's not us. He said, my dad came here 40 years ago,

built this business, provided our family with a great living. He said, why would I want to change anything? He said, I love this country, I love running this business, I love customers like you, Peter and everybody else. I don't want anything to change.

But of course, His moderate, as I would call it, version of his faith that he follows, is very, very different, I would suggest, to somebody who went to a synagogue in Manchester yesterday. So coming back to ways of dealing with this problem, what are your thoughts? What can be done? I'm not the most learned man on the planet,

as I've made blatantly obvious. I'm an ex-cop and a keen observer of life. I think the problems are probably multiple. How do we stop people being radicalised in this day and age of the internet? Very, very difficult, I would suggest. I think there's a huge responsibility on people that come to this country or live in this country

to have concern, compassion for their fellow citizen. If I knew that either of you were a danger, I would be on the phone within the blink of an eye because I love my fellow citizens and I love this nation. If anybody has a suspicion or they know that somebody is a danger and they do not notify the authorities of that,

then they are an enemy of this state. But the problem is, Peter, there is a lot of people like that. We've seen it, we're not just with this particular crime, but crimes going back 20, 30 years. You look at the member of the grooming gangs, family members were covering it up. And you just go... Wives.

Wives. Covering up for their rapist husband. Daughters, sons, all the rest of it. And you think to yourself, These are people who have no alliance. They have no connection to this country. Their only connection is to their clan, to put it quite frankly, or to their religion. And you go, this is not sustainable. And I genuinely think that unless we are prepared, and by us, I mean the political class, to have a very uncomfortable conversation about this, that's got to be the first step. But we can't even have an uncomfortable conversation. without saying, oh, we need to stop online hate? I'm up for the uncomfortable conversation. I'm up for, I'm up for seeing people deported out of this country, and I don't care how bigger the numbers are.

If they've come here illegally, they break our laws, they don't contribute, then ta-da. I mean, give me the shackles, I'll gladly wrap them around the ankles and the wrists and fog march them onto an aeroplane. But the problem comes when you have people like Jihad himself. He came to this country, he's a British citizen. Now he came here as a young boy, so you can have made the argument,

okay, well, he could be stripped of his British citizenship. But we know that's not going to happen. What are you going to send him back to Syria? There is no way in a million years that that was going to be allowed to happen, even if he provided the level, if they knew he provided the level of threat that he did. And he hadn't been sent to his maker by it. great of Manchester police yesterday.

Yeah. It's complex. It's very complex. And I completely agree with you when you say it's going to require brave conversations. I look at some parts of London these days. Oh, and of course I'm old enough

to remember Brickstead and Nottingill when they became centres for Afro-Carin, Caribbean communities. that drew one another together and lived together, and of course I policed Beckham where there was a sizable Afro-Caribbean population. But some of the swathes of East London and other major cities, there's talk about Urochdale's, Alderms and so on and so forth, where there's communities that don't look very integrated to me in any way shape or form.

Is it an intractable problem? Do we all just have to say, well, that's how it is. Governments aren't going to do anything about it. It's too difficult. So we're all just going on that slippery slope to however it might end up. I'll tell you how I think it would end up if things are not done. I don't think we'll have a civil war in this country because I don't believe there's that greater division, to be perfectly frank.

But I could see a holy war at me at some point down the line. What do you mean by that? I could see people rising up to fight against. If there became a significant amount of people that followed one particular faith that was hugely damaging and wanted to take over, like some of those clowns on social media claim they do, then I could see a huge number of people rising up to take that on, head on.

This is the worrying thing. The fact that you actually said that, And a few years ago, I'd be like, oh, come on, Peter, chill out, mate. Let's, let's, let's, let's, you know, let's keep within the realms of reality here. But you're saying that, and I'm going, well, that's not outside the realms of possibility, because that's where it feels that we are. And I don't want to see it. Of course I don't want to see it.

But there is so much discontent out there in a country. Or is it, 2037 in the last five days, I know that's a very visible and visceral and emotional side of the whole migration debate. Look at the figures last week. The UK's population increased in a year by what? 750,000. What was that almost entirely down to? Migration.

Right? It's... But see, we talk about having uncomfortable conversations, but even in this conversation, we're conflating things that I think are... I understand why people keep talking about immigration. But I think we have to be honest. Ukrainians are not storming synagogues with knives. Hong Kongers are not blowing themselves up on tubes.

Polish people aren't doing jihad. This isn't an immigration problem. And if we were to Google, terrorist attack carried out by Jewish man in northern Europe, you wouldn't find it. So this isn't about immigration. And that's where I think we get into a lot of difficulty because the mainstream media is already in overdrive mode to, you know, the Emily Maitliss and John Sopple on their podcast yesterday.

They were talking about the fact that the real problem is the right-wing journalists who are exploiting this tragedy. They're unhinged. Just move on from those two. Well, you say that, but I think if, If this was just random people on social media, I think we would move on because, you know, there's a spectrum of opinion. Some people are stupid. Some people are devious, frankly. But Emily Maitliss and John Sopal are two former respected, I'm using inverted commas of people who are listening, authoritative using inverted commas, balanced inverted commas,

unbiased inverted commas, stalwarts of the BBC, the national broadcaster until like two years ago. Right. So we are talking about the very core. of the center of the mainstream media in this country. And what they're already attempting to do is to distract people's attention away from the fact that this type of terrorism and this type of incident is coming from a very particular subset

of the migrant population. Radical Islam. Radical Islam. And the reason they're doing this is very clear because one of the things that you see Shabana Mahmoud, the Home Secretary, talk about this. you know, this guy was, how did she phrase? I don't want to get her wrong,

but he is the only one responsible. Something like this, right? So attempting to make this a kind of lone wolf type of situation. When I, we don't know exactly what's happened here, but if you call your son jihad, it sort of feels like that might cause some problems down the line. No, no struggle to live. Nothing to do with Holy War.

No, not at all. And so I guess what I'm saying is, One of the reasons that they're attempting to say that this is not, that Islamism has nothing to do with Islam. I mean, how, how you can say anything of that kind with a stray face is hard to understand, is that the inevitable logical conclusion of believing that Islamism has something to do with Islam is what you said, which is if you have four million people who are the overwhelming majority of whom are peaceful and law-abiding and wonderful people and so on. But if a small percentage of the Muslim community are prone to this kind of extremism, then the greater your Muslim population, the greater the absolute number of people in your country who are prone to this kind of extremism.

And the logical conclusion of that is you have to stop pretending that all immigrants are the same. You have to stop pretending that all cultures are the same. You have to stop pretending that all religions are the same, as you pointed out, about Jewish terrorism in Europe. It is not happening, right? And then, unfortunately, you have to start dealing with the reality that not everyone is the same. And that is the greatest threat to everything that we are forced to believe, because then you have to start treating different people differently. You have to start saying, well, according to the numbers, people who have come from this particular part of Syria are way more likely than other people to commit terrorism or rape or whatever. And therefore, if we are going to allow people from that part of the world to come, if we are going to do that,

all. We have to have extra vetting. We have to be extra thorough. We definitely have to close the bloody border because when your border is open, you don't know who's coming in, right? But all of that makes our elite so uncomfortable that what they would rather do is what Francis is talking about. When David Ames gets murdered by an Islamist, let's talk about online, hey, when this happens, let's talk about not looking back in anger as they did after the Manchester Arena bombing. and that's why you guys are talking about having an honest conversation the honest conversation is

not all cultures are the same and not all religions are the same and until we recognise that we're not going to do anything about this problem I guarantee you that I agree entirely yeah of course not all cultures are the same

and not all religions are the same unfortunately not to be burdened by religion I ran down my throat as a kid but I'm not a person of faith as an adult and I like being and deliciously unburdened. I've got time, of course, from faiths and so many of my friends

have faith is really important to them. So I respect it, and I've got a bit of an obsession with religious architecture. Go to the Milan Cathedral, if you... And I can mention other places that I've been there. But getting back on message, well, soap will the mate this are an irrelevancy as far as I'm concerned,

because I would never listen to them. I had a misfortune to read something of theirs once upon a time. And they're, quite frankly, in my opinion, unhinged and such a lunatic leftist that they're not worth. But they're the mainstream. I'm not trying to put a target on their back or get people to dislike them more than they do. I think they do a brilliant job of that themselves.

My point about them is not individual to them. My point about them is they are the mainstream. They are the people who are just like you had religion rammed down your throat. These are the people who have been rammed down our throats for the last 20 years by the neutral, unbiased BBC. That's who is setting the narrative on this stuff. But now they're not at the BBC. We all have the power to go off.

That's true. Or change the channel. We don't have to listen to those people. I occasionally listen to another unheaval. hinge lunatic left broadcaster just because I want to know what the enemy are thinking, right? But I normally suffer it only for about 10 minutes and then I have to get a grip of myself once again and move back to sanity. Because the big issue that's coming out of those appalling events of yesterday now is not only

the protests that took part last night in Whitehall, but the protests that are planned for tomorrow, Saturday. it's defend our juries, isn't it, in Trafalton Square on Saturday? And I don't know what rag tag and bobtail lot it was last night in Whitehall, but I saw many of them. I was travelling through Westminster Tube Station, and they come with these packages over their shoulders. The poles of the banners are poking out in front of them

and the sort of part of the placard is over their shoulder. I was attempting to go and buy some of them some soap, but anyway, moving on. Yeah, should those... But the language that came out from Shabana Mahmoud and Robert Jenric today was pathetic. They were like, oh, I think Jenrich said, do the decent thing and don't protest tomorrow.

And Mahmood said something else along very similar lines. Well, if you're displaying such weakness and not being fervent and not saying, actually, you're not having your protest tomorrow because it's inappropriate because we may have received some information that there might be disorder, some intelligence, for example,

and you've only got to look at last night to know that there's disorder. Talk to the last night, right? The amount of people that met in Whitehall for that protest, which turned ugly early, was tiny compared to the Unites the Kingdom Marsh. Okay? Unite the Kingdom, correct me if I'm wrong,

there were 26 arrests. Did you see how Shepana Mahmood got up at the Labour Party conference and banged on about it? Okay? We did. Not only that, by the way, Peter. I'm sure you know this.

Most of the arrests were actually among the counter-protesters too. Let's just give her that one, right? Okay, let her have that, right? And of course, there was some assaults on police officers. And let me just make it clear, if you assault a police officer, you're an idiot. Right? If you misbehave yourself at a protest or a demonstration, you're an idiot.

And I don't want anything to do with you. Anyway, so last night, there were 40 arrests, regrettably six police officers injured. So on a pro rata basis, last night was way, way, way, almost infinitesimally worse behaved, more dangerous than the United Kingdom March ever was. So they can ban a march if they've got credible intelligence, there will be disorder. I would say, well, last night's protest, if it's anything to go by it, would give me plenty of reason to suspect there will be disorder on Saturday. Ban it. Stop them.

Don't have it. I mean, how disrespectful last night and Saturday? I mean, look, I completely agree with you. I think her argument was, is that legally that she can't. That was her argument, which you're disputing. Well, if the police can't gather intelligence to say that there would be significant disorder, let's just wait and see. I guarantee there'll be significant disorder. So why haven't the police got their ear close to them?

the ground. Why are they not gathering that intelligence? Why do they not, why are they not privy to that information? It makes them, it makes those pro-Palestine demonstrators look absolutely abhorrent. When I saw that that was going ahead, I was genuinely shocked, Peter. I thought there has just been a horrific. Why are you shocked? You don't remember October the 8th? Yeah. So, look, let's stop pretending. On October the 8th, there were people who were protesting against Israel. Before Israel had done anything. Yeah. They were not protesting against Israel. They were celebrating the mass murder of Jews. That's what they were celebrating. They were celebrating. Let's be honest. So why are you shocked? Let's stop being shocked. Now, I know there are some Jewish people that go on these pro-Palestinian

marches. I've heard some of them on the media talking to me and the such like, and of course there are, but I believe overwhelmingly these protests are filled with Jewish hating people. Absolutely convinced of it. Because are you really going to be fervently pro-Palestine if you don't really dislike Israel? There are, you know, for our channel, I've gone along to a number of those protests and I talk to people there. And I think it's fair to say that, of course, the hardcore you're talking about definitely exists. I also think, actually, the majority, I would say, of the people there are people who are very captured, you might say, or very badly affected by the horrific images they're seeing

from the conflict in Gaza. This is really the first conflict, urban warfare type of situation in human history where it's been broadcast through the smartphone into people's living rooms in that way. And a lot of the young people in particular who go along to those protests, they're not there because they hate Jews or even hate Israel. A lot of them are just horrified by what they see and they don't have the understanding of war, urban warfare, conflict, history, to contextualize it in any way. So all they're really there to say is I have these horrible images on my phone and it makes me feel, bad and therefore I feel like I'm doing something. Have they not listened to the stated aims and the

primary goal of Hamas? No, they haven't. Really? No, they haven't. Oh, so I, there's a clip on our channel, Peter, that I go and talk to some young people and they have a sign which is, which says something, something socialist interfaida. They have a sign which says socialist interfaida. And I go up to them and I say, what's a socialist interfaida? And the guy, and I say, what's a socialist interfaida? And the goes, well, I actually don't know because I picked up the sign over there. And I said, well, do you know what the word intifada means? There was about five

or six people in that circle. Not one of them knew what interfaida means. They don't know anything. It's hard to imagine. They don't know anything. So the reason I'm interjecting with this is I think it's really important for us not to dismiss the entire group of people

as Jew haters or whatever because we have to believe that young people, look, we're all young people once. Were you the most educated, the smartest, knowing... I'm still not, and I thank you, by the way, said, putting me straight. Well, well, what I'm, I'm not putting you straight. I just think we have to believe, always, that young people can be persuaded with knowledge, information, maturity, time. You know, I have lots of opinions that I've changed in the last 10 years.

Francis has, you probably have as well. So I don't want to dismiss all of them as that, because we're going to have to win a lot of them over to the side of the. of sanity. We're going to have to persuade them to look at Hamas' stated goal, to understand the history of conflict, to understand what war is like generally and why you ought not to start wars that you then end up losing, why you shouldn't use human shields, why you shouldn't take hostages, you know, all of this stuff. When you educate yourself about things, it gives you a different perspective. And we are going to need those young people to open their minds. If we just dismiss them as haters now, I think it's a bad part together.

Thank you. And it's also as well, look, we know that when you're young, your friends are the most important thing to you at that time. And if all of your mates are pro-Palestine and talking about a genocide, and it's not just, by the way, I was in a cab on the way here to the studio, James O'Brien was using the word openly genocide several times

over a four-minute period on LBC, which goes out to 1.4 million people just in London. and that's just one person. Think how often it's been repeated, not just in the mainstream, but on social media. So these people think that there is this genocide happening. So to them, it's the morally right thing to do. And I just think that we all need better messaging

and we all need to be able to connect and go across the threshold and actually be able to persuade these people. This path that you're going down is not. not a good one. It's not a good one and it's going to lead to something very, very ugly, which is what we saw yesterday. Indeed. Well, Peter, we have lots of questions, I think, suspect for all of us coming in. If people are watching, if you'd like to submit a question, of course, our substack supporters,

you have first dibs. We've got a bunch of your questions that we'll read out in the moment. In the meantime, do, if you want to send on the super chat, we'll try and get a few of those in as well. we're going to go to an ad break if we're ready and then when we come back we will look at all your questions put them to Peter, we'll discuss them among each other and continue the conversation. We are that close to a situation where you basically need a digital ID to go online.

The right to work is the first one, then the right to rent, banking, education, childcare, voting. Five billion was wasted last time this country tried to introduce digital IDs. That's about 50 times. the amount of the border security command. Very, very clearly this isn't about immigration. The Stama government has just introduced

mass bank spying powers on the premise of rooting out welfare fraud. The Home Office right now is supporting essentially an expansion of live facial recognition across multiple police forces. The time to really put up a fight is now. Relax, relax, this is not an ad. I just wanted to let you know that you can watch this video without any advertising at all. No interruption.

no pop-ups, nothing. Just go to Triggerpod.com.com. or click the link below and join thousands of our supporters who watch all our interviews with exclusive bonus content, ad-free. In an era when free expression feels under threat, the Battle of Ideas Festival stands out.

Its motto is, conversations for the public with the public in public. Co-organizers, Alice O'Donald and Ella Wheelan say the festival aims to tackle everything from the vibe shift of a second Trump presence, to the fracturing of global alliances and the challenges of economic and tech innovation.

Over two-packed days, the 18th and the 19th of October at Church House in London, you can join around 100 discussions on politics, science, culture, law and more. We at Trigonometry are regular attendees at the Battle of Ideas. It's one of the few places where we know we'll find proper debate, lively discussion and people unafraid to speak their minds. If you believe in free debate, I want to explore the toughest issues facing society,

this festival is for you. Put your tickets at battleof ideas.org.org.uk and use code trigger 25 for a 20% discount on all tickets. That's battle of ideas.org.org. Let me introduce you to the people I work with to protect my family against financial instability, inflation and turmoil. For me, one of the best ways to safeguard your wealth

is by investing in gold. And that's why I trust the pure gold company. Here's a smart tip. If you buy UK-minted gold coins like sovereigns, you won't pay VAT when you buy them or capital gains tax when you sell. All the profit is yours to keep. And the best part, gold is a completely private investment. It's outside the banking system so it can't be manipulated by governments or anyone else. Unlike digital assets, it's yours in the truest sense.

The pure gold company is trusted by first-time investors and seasoned professionals alike. What I really appreciate about them is a knowledgeable pressure-free. approach. They explain everything clearly, so you feel confident about your decisions and they never push you to buy. Physical gold has stood the test of time as a store of value and it offers peace of mind that other assets can't match. It's reassuring to know that even if the banking system falters, your gold and its value remains safe. Whether you're looking to diversify your investments, protect your savings or just gain the security of owning a real physical asset, we highly recommend the pure gold company. Click the link in the description of

or go to pure-dash-gold.com slash trigger to get your free copy of their investor guide. That's pure-dash-gold.com slash trigger. Take control of your financial future today. You, the Trigonometry audience, understand how vital free speech is. That's why we're proud to reintroduce you to our long-standing partners, give, send, go. We caught up with their founders at Jordan Peterson's Alliance for Responsible Citizenship Conference this year, and it was clear. They are not just running a crowdfunding site, they're defending a principle. Take one of the most powerful examples, Daniel Penny.

He stepped in during a dangerous subway incident in New York and was laid to charge with homicide. His Give Send Go campaign raised $3 million, allowing him to mount a strong legal defense as his case moves through the courts. That case made headlines, but the biggest story was this. While other platforms shut campaigns like his down, Gibbs Send Go stood firm. So if you want to support causes that matter or raise funds yourself, whether it's for free speech, helping a friend in need, or disaster relief, visit givsendgo.com and use the code trigger for a special 2.5% processing rate. That's give sendgo.com, the platform that doesn't just talk about free speech, it protects it. All right, welcome back. Thank you for sending in your questions. Keep sending them in,

particularly in the superchats. We will be able to get to those as we go. We've got a bunch of questions from our substack first, though, Francis. Go ahead. J.S. Powell asks a great question, which is Stama's responseless attack seems woefully inadequate. What would be the right response and associated actions thereafter? I think Stama gets blown by whatever political wind is blowing on any given day, to be perfectly honest with you. It was a very predictable photo opportunity of going up there with his wife, but I could imagine why his wife would want to go there. She is of Jewish heritage.

So that I think is understandable. I think I would be saying, if I was the leader of the country, which of course I'll never be, saying to the police, give me the intelligence that says there's going to be disorder at the protest on Saturday,

then we can stop it. This is from Helen, who says, what legal consequences should and will there be for the imams of the four British mosques recently shown on videos encouraging their followers to kill Jews. I'm not aware of this.

I don't know if this is... I haven't seen it. Yeah. But if that is happening, is that a crime? Yes, of course it is. It's a crime to call upon people to kill another person.

It's very much a crime. If there is such footage, please send it to the police. I beg of you, send it to the police so that they can deal with it appropriately. You say that. Peter, and I'm sure that's the right thing to do. I'm just remembering only a week ago there was a trial for a man who wielded a knife and attempted to stab someone who was burning a Quran.

He got off with that a custodial sentence. Yes, he was convicted of crimes connected to that event, but he didn't receive a custodial sentence. I think the whole different issue now of activist judges within the UK is something that very much needs to be looked at. And we are, fortunately, having people that are exposing the background of many of our judges, particularly those who sit on immigration tribunals, for example, and make decisions relating to deportation. We're seeing so many of those who have previously been attached to either chambers,

barristers' chambers, that did human rights work, So you would imagine there could be a bias there or people that have judges who are now judges who have worked for refugee charities, for example. Then how on earth could you expect anybody to give an impartial and unbalanced judgment when sitting presiding over such cases?

They need exposing. And you know, it's interesting, I was talking to a judge some time ago, basically talking, and he was saying, look, I don't say this publicly. but our profession has been captured. There you go. There you go. Nail Bunny asks,

are the police prepared for what may be coming? Do we need the military involved? There's been many an occasion when I've thought should we get the military involved? I mean, what does that mean? What does that mean to get the military involved? Because many people wouldn't understand it. I was not in Egypt.

I was in Uzbekistan a couple of months ago, right? Outside of every mosque, because they used to have a problem with Islamic terrorism. They don't anymore because they dealt with it. There's a couple of guys with AK-47s, right? Yeah. And if there was a guy with an AK-47 outside of that synagogue yesterday,

this jihad guy gets sorted without any casualties, right? Possibly. You don't know. You've got to remember. I'm more like the attacker has the element of surprise. Okay. So I wouldn't want to downplay any potentially heroic efforts made by the security guard yesterday and the such like.

That's the trouble. The attacker's got that element of surprise. But that's the point of when we say about getting the army involved. You want to equalize that element of surprise with superior force, don't you? Yeah, but our army, of course, are not particularly trained to carry firearms and behave like a civilian police. They are, of course, the army. So it would be a huge, possibly a mission on behalf of the police.

police that they failed, I think first and foremost, they would see that like that, and they would argue very strongly against it. I'm just putting myself... Look, have it praised the police as the very outset of this interview. I sort of think the egos of police constables and chiefs don't matter as much as the safety of people in this incident. And I echo those words entirely. Funny enough, you've said about the judiciary being captured. Right. Ditto senior police. Right. Right.

Go for it. Rob says, do you feel the only way to protect our Jewish community is to change our feeble government, sack the duplicitous mayor of London, and root out the culture of appeasement amongst senior police officers? Well, I'm no fan of Sir Sadiq Khan, sticks in the back of my folk that I have to call him a sir.

But anyway, I'm really not a fan. Sack the government, I'm afraid, the Jewish community, is going to have to do more of protecting itself through the Community Safety Trust, which has had some government funding to do that. They're going to have to do more of it. And you know what? They are not alone.

There are now leafy suburbs and nice parts of the home counties where private security companies are patrolling the streets, paid for by residents, protecting them because the police can't do it. We are on this inexorable slide towards all having to pay other people to protect ourselves

because the police can't do it and because division, divisiveness and hatred is so prevalent in our society. Peter, can I ask you something, this is along the lines of something Katie's asked on Substack, but I want to expand her question a little bit. And it's something I genuinely don't know what the answer is, I'm just thinking out loud.

We have seen case after case after case where there have been various failings, whether that's at the level of immigration. I remember, I think the guy's name was Abdul Yazidi who threw acid on a woman. And I think, if I remember correctly, in his instance, he was given asylum based on fake claims that he was a persecuted Christian

when it was blatantly not true. I don't understand the legal system well. I'm sure you understand it better. Is there ever any room for repercussions for people who make these terrible decisions for them to be held to account? No. None whatsoever.

None whatsoever. they are utterly intouchable in that regard. Should there be? It is, of course, not the criminal law we're talking about here. It's the whole immigration process, which, interestingly enough, of course, Shepana Mahmood, the Home Secretary only this week said the Home Office is not fit for purpose in many regards.

This all needs gripping. The whole Home Office, the Immigration Department, the borders, it all needs gripping because it is simply becoming the number one issue on the doorstep as political campaigners tell me. They say when they're leafleting, when they're knocking on doors, people are saying immigration.

And then secondly, when they say, and who are you voting for, people increasingly and increasingly and increasingly are saying reform. I guess what I'm asking is, again, I'm just thinking out loud, this may be totally wrong and un-British or illiberal, or I don't know what the words are.

But if you're an activist judge or if you're a home office employee who's rubber stamping these people and letting people through without proper checks, you're letting people off having committed crimes that then go on to re-offend. If there are no sanctions for that and you are an activist, well,

carry on, wouldn't you? Right? Wouldn't you just? Wouldn't you? So presumably, I think that ought to be looked at. Are there some repercussions to be had for people who are negligent in their duties? I mean, if you were guarding a military base, right, and you just waived people in who don't have the right pass, presumably you'd be punished for that in some way. Would you know? We'll look at Palestine action who got into a military base very, very reasonable. It should have been shot. And who that protest tomorrow, I believe, is in support of. Right. So we're going to have more idiots with their life of political action banners getting arrested. clowns, thereby draining police resources away from dealing with crime anyway, preventing

crime and protecting the Jewish places of worship. And of course, you know what's going to be protected this weekend. Mosques are going to be protected. The police will have additional patrols around mosques because they'll be thinking once the full background of jihad, I'll say that again, Jihad al-Shammi is revealed and his devout Muslim beliefs become public knowledge.

I'm guessing that's what will happen. We don't know yet. Then, of course, they'll be thinking, oh, will there be retaliatory attacks on mosques? Not by Jewish people, they won't. Well, I really very much hope that churches are also protected this weekend because I don't think Jews are the only group of people

who are targeted by Islamic terrorism. I mean, we know from their very statements they consider Christians and Jews infidels in the same way. and would happily kill them both. So I hope our Christian friends are also kept safe this week. As was dreadfully exhibited at an Ariara Undergronde concert on London Underground trains and elsewhere.

They don't care. If you're the infidel, you're the infidel, and you need to be blown to smithereens, according to their perverse, vile thinking. And on that subject, Mickey says, does Peter believe there are very likely to be further attacks of this type in the near future. And will it lead to this pitiful government taking serious action to stop illegal immigration?

Answer to the first question, sadly, regrettably, yes, I think there will be further attacks. This government getting a grip on immigration for the birds, sadly, no. Yeah, it's, you know, it's so, so worrying that when you saw yesterday's attack, one of the emotions that I went had, I was just actually, I'm surprised it took this long. That's one of the, it's not an emotion, that was a genuine thought that went through my head.

I went, I'm surprised it took this long. Yeah. Yes, I can see entirely why you feel like that. We live in an increasingly dangerous nation. We really do. This is a question from Sammy T40 who says, every Jew in the entire world knew something terrible would have. happened on Yom Kippur. It's sad, but it's true. We were all on eggshells waiting for something

to happen because I'll lead us throughout the world, do nothing, all talk and just stay stupid things and forget about it. I agree. That is very sad indeed. Marco asks a great question. He says, hi team, any practical solutions to issues discussed, to issues discussed? As plain and practical, as plain and practical as possible, step by step, thank you all. I've got loads. Okay, let's crack on. Let's go it. Right. The very, very sad reality of life in Britain is that we have to protect ourselves. Okay, we've got to protect ourselves, not only from the potential of a terrorist attack, but from criminals.

So what do we do? If you own your own home, protect that home. I'm talking Burger Alarm, state-of-the-R CCTV system. I could go on and on about what you grow in your garden if you've got a garden and such like which stuff that burglars and intruders and other people don't like do the obvious don't leave things in the back garden like shovels and forks and all of that which burgers can sell with

and you can find lots of that crime prevention advice online when you go out onto the street don't wear headphones it's utter lunacy and I know people do You know about the element of surprise that I was talking about with a terrorist attack? If you've got your headphones on, in all likelihood, you can't hear and you won't be focusing on the world around you. You are giving the terrorist an even greater head start.

In all likelihood, you might be killed or seriously injured before you even realize anything's going on. Whereas if when you travel, when you walk, when you are out and about, when you're driving, use these senses that are given to us. Don't shut them off. And even on a very basic level, if you're on a train and you can't hear the train announcement, that again could be something really, it could be in life or death.

Listen to the podcast when you get home. Listen to the new album when you get home. You need these, you need those, and you might well need these, and to be on your dancers in an emergency. And I think those are great. great points. But I think what Marco was really driving at is

what practical solutions does this government, let's say we had a brilliant government, okay? Let's just play that little thought experiment. Yeah. What policies do they need to do in order to really get a grip of this with this problem? Out of the

Muslim Brotherhood, make it a prescribed organization. Correct. Yep, that's a day one thing. People won't understand what the Muslim Brotherhood is, Peter. Can you just explain that to the people who don't know. Well, Constance Hill know far better than I, the full history of it, but it's basically a very dangerous organisation,

which essentially, from my standpoint and from what I've seen, spreads a lot of bad stuff into a lot of decent places and therefore needs to be stopped. By the way, the Muslim Brotherhood, this is one of the great ironies that I've talked about often, is Muslim countries are much better at dealing with this. Islamist extremism than we are. The Muslim Brotherhood has been banned across the Muslim world for decades now in most countries. Because they don't pretend it's Islamophobic to be concerned about Islamic terrorism.

They know that these people are extremists and they don't pretend they aren't and they deal with them. We obviously, we banned Hizb ut-Tahrir, like last year. Hizb ut-Turie has been banned in the entire Muslim world for like 20 years. This is the shocking irony of this. We are more permissive towards Islamist terrorism than Muslims are. It's unbelievable. I hear stories and I'm afraid I can't disclose my source, but people from the Middle East that speaks to somebody I know very well

and they say, why do you let all this dross in here? We wouldn't have it in our country. We don't have it in our country. We don't allow them anywhere near us. and yet you have them flooding him. Well, there we go. Peter, thanks for coming on. Obviously, it was a tragic day yesterday. We all hope this is the last one of these we have to deal with.

Sadly, I think a lot of people are concerned this not. It won't be. I said nothing but thoughts and best wishes to everybody affected by it for what that's worth. I was having lunch with a great mate of mine who happens to be Jewish on Wednesday. And of course, one of the great things about having friends from other faiths and people of faith,

you get to learn so much about their faith. And, of course, he was saying, yeah, it's Yom Kippur tomorrow. I said, tell me all about it. You know, what do you do? What's the point of them, why, you know, all of that. So I then see that horror unfolding so early on that day. And of course, the murderous bastard knew it was Yom Kippur. and planned it for Yom Kippur.

Because in the way that many people might be Christian, but don't go to church, so many of them do on Christmas Day, don't they? Yeah. And it's kind of, and I know if it sounds clunky, it's not meant to be an insult anyway, but it's kind of that sort of equivalent. Jews who don't go to the synagogue very regularly

will go on Yom Kippur, which is why they get vast numbers. Same as like Church of England churches, get packed on Christmas Eve or Christmas morning. You know, it's that kind of thing. So, Ghead Al-Shameh knew exactly what he was doing. He plotted it. He planned it.

He chose the date. I bet he'd sussed out that location. And, uh, yeah, sadly, we'll have to wait till the next time. Peter Wlexey, thanks for being here. Thank you for watching, and we'll see you soon. This episode is brought to you by Netflix's remarkably bright creatures. What if a Pacific octopus held the key to a mystery that could heal your heart? Well,

That's Tova's reality. An elderly widow working at an aquarium. Tova forms an unlikely friendship with a crumudgeonly, Marcellus, whose remarkable intelligence leads her to a life-changing discovery. Remarkably bright creatures is now playing. Only on Netflix.