TRIGGERnometry - WORLD EXCLUSIVE: Nigel Farage SPEAKS OUT

Episode Date: July 18, 2026

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protection until the end of my dates. And frankly, and when it comes death, it's five million quite good reasons. I think there are two questions that genuinely are worth asking. Number one is this five million pound gift. And the other question is the posse George thing, who was convicted of wire fraud in the US. Well, I on, Louise Hay is a convicted fraudster about to go in Andy Burnham's cabinet. The police followed up in the spring of 2025. Why is it now a story? The reality is, though, that this by-election hasn't, it hasn't gone to plan, has it?

Nigel, welcome back on the show. Thank you. Originally, when we first booked to do this interview, we were going to talk about the by-election, your resignation, the challenges both you and reform are facing, but tragically, that has been overshadowed by events in the previous week, particularly the murder of Anne Whittickham. what is your reaction to that?

The two are linked. The two are directly linked. The full-scale attack on reform, which has really gone into gear since May the 7th. Why May the 7th? Massive set of elections across the UK. We wipe out the Conservatives in East Anglia. Unbelievable.

We take out Labour in the north of England, the Midlands. We make breakthroughs, big breakthroughs in Scotland and in Wales. And ever since that moment, the attacks on the party have been unrelenting. And really what's happening, whether it's the press, whether it's Ed Davy, whether it's other front benches, is, you know, we are extremists, racists, the most dangerous threat to Britain. We're more dangerous than Putin as a threat to Britain. We're all criminals. I mean, we're all criminals. Ties, posse, George, me, we should all be in prison.

And this is the narrative. that has been going out unendingly, and I've been in this game a long time. You know, I'm used to the rough and tumble of political debate. And that's fine. Actually, to some extent, that's what democracy is. You know, we have a pop at each other and let Joe public make up their minds who they believe.

But when it comes to stuff being published in mainstream national newspapers, there's just not true, just simply not true, or exaggerated beyond belief. What are you talking about this, not true? And one little example is posh George paid for all the computers in the reform office and did not. That was not declared in our donations. Well, the answer is he didn't.

So you told the Sunday Times again and again and again, he didn't. They publish it. And then the Times Daily editorial writes in its editorial. These are the serious questions. Just not true. And how are you connecting this to the murder? Do you know something that we don't about that murder? Yeah, yeah.

If you demonize, if you demonize people because, I don't know, in Anne's case, they don't believe in gay marriage, or they have strict views on abortion, or they believe in strict immigration controls. If you absolutely dehumanize people like this, is it surprising that living out there in the subculture of those who spend their lives online and struggle to get on with other people, that this doesn't engender a form of hate. And, I mean, clearly, Anne's murder is, I mean, a very, very deeply upsetting thing. And I've noticed, I mean, just interesting going around the doors here in Clacton.

People are really, really hit by it. I mean, just good, ordinary folk are really hit by. I can't think of anybody more famous that's been murdered for decades and decades. So there is a direct link between the two. That was no question. And it was so interesting to see the police, Devon and Cornwall police, or should we just call them what they are, plod? Absolute waste of space.

I think they're still looking for somebody that could have committed a burglary, you know. I mean, they were so wrong about everything. Obvious to me, right from the first minute, this was politically motivated, premeditated assassination of a political figure. And I would argue back to your question, directly downstream. of the kind of campaign that is being waged against the entire reform agenda by many online in mainstream media and in the House of Commons every single week. And, you know, it's not that I'm afraid of criticism, but, I mean, if we sought to demonise Diane Hubbard or someone

like that, I mean, we'd be made out to be the worst people in the world. Can you imagine if the murderer was a reform party member? I mean, we'd be closed down. We wouldn't even exist. And it's why when people say to me and commentators write, oh, well, Nigel Farage, you know, he's obviously losing his mind because he's getting angry with journalists. Yeah, I am.

I'm getting really angry with journalists, particularly Times journalists, who choose to publish photographs of where my daughter lives. you know she's not she's not she's not a public figure there is no public interest in this at all and i see what happened to anne five days after after that program and i begin to get very scared about things so so i called this by-election before anne's murder but i called this by-election because just the daily assault that the being found guilty in the media and in politics every single day without any means effectively you'll be able to come back at it and left the party in a state of paralysis and I saw this by-election as a fight back against that and to say right you be my judge

you the people be it if you think I'm a crook and a wrong and get rid of me in this election but if you don't think that and if you think the mainstream media are out of touch then vote for me on what is now August 13. Because it seems to me, and we're going to touch on the by-lection, we're just coming back to Anne's murder very briefly, this does seem like a watershed moment in British politics. We obviously had the murder of Sir David Amos and Joe Cox before that, but this is potentially, and I use the word potentially,

the first act of left-wing terrorism that certainly I can remember in this country, maybe ever. Yes, I mean, The guy that killed Joe Cox was sort of a nationalist nut job. The murder of David Amos was an Islamist, clear Islamist murder. Yeah, we're not used to the concept in recent times at all of left-wing terrorism, but it's pretty clearly what it is. But, you know, Adam Bolton, Peter Tatchel, other well-known figures in the wake of Anne's murder.

just saying the most beastly things about her. I mean, the old rule is, if you can't say nice things about the dead, say nothing, which I think generally is actually quite a good rule. And yet, they so believe in their own righteous virtue, that they feel allowed to do these things. And I do not know of a single, significant conservative commentator, a small-sea conservative commentator, who would ever say anything appropriate.

that on the death of a senior left-wing public figure. If Jeremy Corbyn died, I'd say, well, they didn't agree with him, but you know what? The man believed in what he believed in and fought for it for decades. So there was a very big difference here, between how the right thing can speak about the left and how the left, including public figures, now think and speak about the right. And I think there will be a major reappraisal of all of this in the wake of Anzmer. Well, I hope so because I've been talking about this for a very long time. I think particularly in the post-Charlie Kirk world, I just don't think, and you look at the facts of this, the Gen Z are seven times more likely to believe than people of your generation.

The political violence are sometimes justified. I don't think people understand the world we're living, and I'm quite relieved, actually, that it seems like both Shabana Mahmouda Home Secretary and Andy Burnham are starting to take this more seriously. And it comes back to some, you know, you mentioned the constant attacks and questions about reform. And I think it's undoubtedly the case that a lot of that has been really unfair and completely out of proportion to the questions that are being raised. Some of that I think we do need to talk about, and we will. But, you know, the security situation speaks to the point you made about the gift you were given that there's been a lot of questions about. I was doing the back of the envelope calculation of how much it might cost to have a five-man security team 24-hour.

You're looking at millions of pounds a year, potentially, right? So just to keep a person safe. And as we're recording this, this will go out a couple of days after, but as we're recording this, a news story is breaking about a man who's been arrested for threatening to kill you. And the times, I think it is the times, the hated times,

nonetheless reported that you've received more than 500 death threats in recent times. I mean, this is very serious. Oh, it's serious, all right. It's been serious in my case since 2013, but no one cared. No one care. It's farage, no one care. Begging Home secretaries to provide some form of intelligence support and physical support.

Home secretary, after home secretary, we asked, not interesting, not interesting. But now it's not just me. Now it's a whole group of political leaders within reform. several of whom are now well-known public figures and now they are beginning in the wake of Anne's murder to take this seriously. So this morning,

somebody has been arrested for a series of social media post in which he says he wants to shoot me in the head. Let me tell you, we have reported to the Met in the past whole lists of similar threats made against me which we were told did not meet the threshold, did not meet the threshold.

And yet when Lucy Connolly put out an intemperate tweet and then removes it four hours later, she ends up going to prison. So the approach to all of this, you know, gets to the roots of two-tier policing, two-tier justice, two-tier attitudes towards the way that we look at things. Maybe, maybe. after the horrific and deeply upsetting murder of Anne, maybe something good will come of it. Maybe the police in this country will start to take threats,

public and political figures equally, regardless of their opinions at which side of the spectrum they're on. So I'm pleased the police have arrested one. If they do another 300 in the next week, I'll have real confidence. So, it's a fair point. Nigel, you were sitting in Clacton here. You've called the by-election. This obviously happened, in mere days actually before Anne's murder.

Why is it that you called that by election? What made you decide that? Because I just can't put up with being called guilty every day. You know, guilty, guilty, guilty. Everything I've ever said and done, I'm guilty. You know, I've had no chance to really fight back at all, even when you try to. No one takes it seriously. So, you know what?

This is a concerted attempt to get me out of public life. That's what it is. Because they know after May the 7th that actually via the ballot box, our support is there and it's solid. So suddenly the reputation, try and drag reform down on the polls, put them in an impossible position, get rid of Nigel, and it'll all be okay. That's what's going on. perfectly clear to me. The level of coordination is astonishing. And the leaks of information from the National Crime Agency are just astonishing. They're the ins and outs of bank payments of all the senior figures in reform.

And it's made out, ah, it went to the National Crime Agency because they're clearly being looked at because they're suspect dudes or funded by the Kremlin or whatever theory is doing the rounds at that time. The fact is that our anti-money laundering regulations are so insane, something that I expose when I fought the banks back in 2023, but 800,000 bank transactions a year get reported to the National Crime Agency. If you received an unusual payment in your account tomorrow, you know, I don't know, a gift from a family member or whatever into your bank account, that would get referred to the NCAA.

And then from the NCAA, all this stuff gets leaked to the... the press. And I find that pretty unacceptable as well. It is. And I think you've, like I said, I think you've received a lot of very unfair criticism. But I do think there's a couple of it. We both think there's a couple of issues where the leak point, I totally accept, by the way, and it's something that troubles me. And Dominic Cummings did warn you. He did say they will break the law. They will do whatever they can. I hate to sit here and say Cummings was right, you know, but actually the warning he gave was a very good one. And he said they'll break the law and do whatever. However, I think there are

two questions that genuinely are worth asking. Number one is this five million pound gift. Personally, I don't give a shit about people who give money to other people. It's not something that particularly interests me. But what I think is of interest to the public is, were there any strings attached? Is your pushing of crypto with the Bank of England connected with that gift? That is one question. And the other question is the post-George. which is, this is a friend of yours who gave money to both you and reform, gave in-kind things to both you and reform, who was convicted of wire fraud in the US. Well, hang on, Louise Hay is a convicted fraudster about to go in Andy Burnham's cabinet.

But does every BBC News report say convicted frauds in Louise Hay, do they help? It does not. Let's deal with us. It's a fair question, Nigel. It's a fair question. We've always treated you fairly. No, no, no, no. But I'm just making the point.

George as a young man got into trouble in America. If you are involved in tax avoidance schemes, it is very easy in America to get into very, very big trouble. So he has a conviction. Maybe that conviction will be pardoned one day. I don't know. That conviction is spent. There used to be a thing in Britain called the rehabilitation

of offenders act in 1974. It meant that people actually, once they've done their time, were forgiven and given a second chance in life. He was 2021. At the time this happened, he went to prison in America, he came back. And everyone said to me,

oh, you must never see him again. You must never speak to him again. Well, I don't do that. I don't dump people. I do actually believe in Christian forgiveness. I think it's part of what we are as a community, as a society. There are many, many people who,

you know, fell off the rails as young men or women who have gone on to achieve great things in life for themselves and their communities. So that's the first point I want to make. I've stood loyally with George because I think he deserved a second chance. He is, of course, an enormously colourful character. You know, and I mean, great press. All the, were that the girlfriends he's had and the things he's done and all of it, you know, he's a very colourful character and, you know, Heskiths his uncle, of Formula One and mandated the man that's now the king. So, of course, there are great reasons why he's a person of interest. But, you know, the idea that in 2023 and 2024,

when I was out of politics that I perched in an office in one of his London homes and that he helped me with a camera crew so that I could go out into the English Channel, remember? and filmed the boats and advertise what was going on and try and give a warning to the nation. At that period of my life, from 2021 to the 3rd of June, 24, I was a broadcaster. I was someone that appeared on celebrity TV programs, right? I was somebody that promoted some financial market products, but I was an influencer. You know, I had a considerable, even then, over thoughtful.

5 million, social media following, and I was doing it. So the fact that George, you know, did me a favor with those things is not a matter of public interest or record. It's irrelevant. I wasn't in politics. It is literally no one's business. It is totally undeclareable in every single way. And what they've written and said about since I came back on the 3rd of June, I've taken

nothing from them since the 3rd of June. And he hasn't given money to the 1st. the party or any of these things. And the idea that his donation, or in his mother's donation, this was reported to the NCAA in September 2024. The police followed up in the spring of 2025. Why is it now a story? It's now a story because everything is being coordinated together to try and knock us out of the game. And that's why I'm finding this by-election. I'm finding this my election because I'm saying let the people decide. Now on the other issues that you're OK, can we just pause on the post-George thing very quickly? So just to be clear, because this is

different to my understanding, but I'm happy to be corrected. He hasn't given any money to you since you came back into politics or any in kind things and not to the party. So this is all related to the period when you weren't in politics. Absolutely. Okay. The only other question I had on that, I was reading a biography of yours. Oh, there are lots of those. And actually, Actually, the one thing that comes out of it from the telling of the biographer in that case was that you actually can be pretty ruthless when people, you know, stray off the reservation, so to speak. And Godfrey Bloom might say, you know, loyalty is, you know, something Nigel is selective about.

No, no, no. I'm fiercely loyal to everybody until they're disloyal to me. And that is over. Boom, done, gone. And that's why the people around me, and you know many of them, Been around me for a very, very long night. None of us plan our summers around insurance. We plan them around whatever life actually throws at us.

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from the top companies and see how much you could save. That's policygenius.com slash trig. Okay, now let's come back to the gift and the strings attached and the crypto stuff and the lobbying. Well, let's deal with it separately. Number one, Christopher Harbourn is an immensely successful man. We all say crypto, but actually that is but a part of what this guy does. I think there are some things that are known in public, such as his big stake that he holds in kinetic, the Defence Technology Company.

I think he probably owns the biggest jet refueling operation in the world, plus his crypto investments and things he's in. So there's some of the things that he does, but he does much, much more than that. He's my age, went to school, about three miles down the road from me, not dissimilar backgrounds. You know, he was a city trader as I was. in the early years and we have similar backgrounds the difference is he's saying so he stayed in

business and i'm loopy so i gave you all up to do politics and become a member of the european parliament christopher was politically radicalized by the mastic treaty i know that to your generation this is ancient history but to some of us this was the moment when the free trade club we joined went from being an European economic community to a European community to a European Union with a flag and an anthem. And for many of us, that was it. So we both became completely radicalized at exactly that same period in time. He's obviously someone I know as a friend and know very, very well. He gave me this gift. I'd ask for it. He'd given Boris a gift, by the way, a couple of years before. It doesn't get talked about, does it?

How much was it for? Just a remillion, I believe it. Wow. That's pretty good money as well. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he gave me a gift. A gift. Hey, you know what?

It's like winning the lottery. I mean, it's a very serious sum of money. And it's almost a sum of money that has caused the controversy as much as anything else until you start to think through what the implications of having security are. So he gave me.

this big gift and I have a legal document it is unconditional i can do what i like with it i can spend it on the horses i can go and buy ferrari i can do what i like with it there's an unconditional gift but on the understanding that i will need i'm afraid given the way the world is now to have protection until the end of my days and that there are others close to me that will need, do need now, a degree of protection. So it's unconditional gift, but for me, that money is there to look after me until I die. So there is a, and frankly, and when it comes death, is five million quite good reasons, perhaps in hindsight for what he gave me that gift.

Now, have I broken the law? Have I broken tax law? No. Have I fiddled my expenses? No. Have I misused public money? No. By the way, my personal MP expenses for the last two years are zero. I claim nothing. I don't need to. I've got outside income. I'm really well off. I don't need to unnecessarily take money off the state. What is my crime? What is my sin? Well, my sin is that the rules of procedure or parliamentary standards, which by the way state explicitly that these rules are to cover your conduct in public life, not in your private life, say that any political donations that you've received in the preceding year have to be declared. So I get elected on July 4th. And I've got to go in and meet the people you deal with outside income, etc.

I mean, within 10 minutes, I'm Terry Mahara. So you're telling me I have to record all my gross income, including VAT, but without the cost of running the company. Yeah, I mean, the commons is not designed for anybody in business. If I'd say to anybody, if you've got a business, forget it. I mean, the whole thing's impossible. So you're declaring all your gross income, not your net income, etc. But of course, this issue came up.

So what did I do? I went to a top international lawyer and said, look, you tell me what's it. You tell me what. Is this something I should declare or not? His advice to me was, no, this gift is unconditional, it's not political, it's not related to political campaign. it's not related to building political offices. It's not related to employing staff or political campaigning or any of these things.

You do not need to declare it, which is why I didn't declare it. Then what happens? Frankly, I didn't think I never hear any more about it. Until the NCAA leak it to the Guardian. They publish it and there's a huge Ferrari. So the question is, How will standards find, you know, a committee with four Labour MPs, one liberal Democrat,

you could make this up, really, and one conservative. I don't know. The problem is they can make a decision. I mean, I believe that they're objective. They'll say unusual, a large sum of money, but frankly within the rules, or they can be subjective and try and make life very difficult. The question that will be on people's minds, and I think you're right that the amount is so significant

that it's, you know, to the ordinary person who earns 30 grand a year, it's a sum of money that's unimaginable. I get that. Is what is this guy buying by giving it to you? That's what people will think. Okay. Nobody can buy me. Nobody can bully me.

nobody can tell me what to say you want some evidence of that Elon Musk who was holding out offers potentially of very large sums of money not for me but for the party but he asked me to do a series of things and say a series of things what happened with Elon by the way why did you fall out because he wanted me to come out

publicly and support Tommy Robinson and I said I can't do that I said you know he wanted me to come out and talk about deportations of illegals before we had a plan. When you're beginning, you know, an agitator, you can say, let's deport the world. Great for clicks. If you're a political party leading the opinion polls for 350 consecutive opinion polls in a row, if you're going to make big statements like this, you need to show you've done some maths,

some homework and thought it through. Now, we did, in fact, in the end, a few months after the fallout with Musk, published Operation Restoring Justice, with Zia Yusuf at the head of it, which actually showed what the command structure would be and how this would operate with the aim of deporting up to 600,000 people who've entered Britain illegally. But, you know, I could have just done what Elon wanted. Right?

I could have just said what he wanted, no problem. would have taken the money, everything would have been lovely. The point I'm making is you can't tell me what to do or say. Christopher, in return, what's nothing from me other than me to be secure

and safe and not to have to worry about money. And I don't now ever have to worry about money as long as I live. I'm not going to be fearful. Can I afford a driver? When I'm 84, if I get there. And long left public life, but because of the online world,

nothing will die anymore, will it, in terms of stories. You know what I mean? Kind of, you know, ex-politicians, ex-footballers, 20 years on could walk down the street. No one knew who they were. But because of the online world, you know, those of us that have been seen to be controversial will have to live with that forever.

So I'm enormously, by the way, I'm enormously grateful to him for doing this. It takes such a weight off my mind. Between 2021 and 2024, I was paying for all my own security during that. It was costing me a fortune. Now, I had much lower level of security because my profile was down, but it's still very, very expensive indeed. And yes, he's made money in crypto.

You're absolutely right. And yes, I've been an advocate for crypto since 2019. This isn't going away. It's not going away. I firmly believe it's not going away. The price may be wildly volatile, and it is. but in terms of usage, just go to Miami. How about the ATM machine?

They're all Bitcoin. It's all Bitcoin's a dollar. So you take out a fraction of a Bitcoin onto your card, you pay in Starbucks. You pay the hotel bill. You buy a new car. This stuff now actually is having usage around the world. And the worse and worse the banks behave, the worse and worse they behave, the more debanking, whether it's for political reasons or it's for

anti-money laundering reasons, that goes on, the more attractive Bitcoin becomes as a means of exchange. And, you know, you and I want to do a transaction, we can do it together in Bitcoin. You know, we're both big boys, we're grown-ups. So I've long believed in it. And what upsets me is, you know, I come from a long line of people who worked in the city of London, worked in financial markets. that London always did well wasn't because people wore bowler hats and it looked traditional and wonderful lovely though all that was it was it was a place of innovation London was always the first with new financial products with new financial markets as well we're world leaders at so many things and this whole space this whole space of crypto

you know of stable coins the means where money passes in and out of of traditional currencies and through into crypto and back, which is, by the way, fast, don't have the huge charges you have for many other forms of financial transaction and no wonder if it's booming, you know, back by blockchain the way that it is. It always seemed to me this was the perfect space

for London to become a global centre because there is demand for this stuff all over the world. And as it stands to the world, we do not have an exchange, traded, regulated crypto product of any kind at all. People think, oh, Nigel's arguing for the Wild West. No, I'm arguing for a regulated crypto market. It's the Wild West now. Now you can buy Bitcoin or Ethereum, you know, online from a provider that goes out of business.

you've got no protection of any kind at all. They're not regulated. I mean, all sorts of terrible scams have happened in this space. What I'm arguing for is a regulated market. What I'm arguing for is that this is here to stay. It's a big thing of the future. We should be in the vanguard. We should be in the lead.

And despite the fact we haven't got these things, already seven million. Seven million British people have digital assets of some kind. And when I swear to see the government in the back of England, wow, we disagreed on virtually everything. He's a very lovely man.

They don't misunderstand me. But we disagreed on Brexit. We disagree with everything. And he'd said that no individual should be able to hold more than $20,000 worth of stable coins, to which I said, well, that means most of my friends will have to leave the country.

He said, you're a dinosaur, Andrew. You're a dinosaur. is happening. Now, of course, that then gets painted, but I'm lobbying on behalf of a cryptocurrency guy. Well, hang on, whether London has a regulated market or not doesn't affect the price of Ethereum or Bitcoin. He holds this stuff. It doesn't affect the price of it. It just means that more of the transactions in it could be done in London rather than in the Wild West or other financial exchanges around the world. And those that are. argue that somehow I'm trying to manipulate the process on behalf of my friend.

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because of the fact that the other major political parties are not submitting candidates. it's not a good look, is it? Not for them, no. It's extraordinary. Do you know the Conservative Party in this seat, in 2019, seven years ago, got 31,000 votes. 31,000 votes. 72% of the vote. I think it's their second safest seat in the whole of Britain.

And you read the newspapers. There's a huge chemmy bounce going on. Oh, it's off the charts. She's amazing. Oh, yes, telegraph, times, mail. I mean, oh, I mean, this woman is sweeping the floor with everybody else. The Tories are on their way back to number 10. He's being sarcastic for the Americans.

Well, if that was true, they'd fancy their chances here, wouldn't they? Yeah. Because they could publicly take me on. They can raise the questions that you raised with me in our discussion today. They could prove me wrong or think they could prove me wrong. I don't they would. And they could witness. seat and then reform would be seriously damaged so why aren't they standing why aren't they

standing because they know they get wiped they know despite 30,000 votes seven years ago they know they would not beat me and that's why they're not standing and the level of collusion between restore the tour is is astonishing sort of mirror statements from kem and rupert let and labor new leader doesn't want to lead a party that's going to lose its deposit because the Makerfield message is we can beat reform. So, yeah, I'm disappointed. I'm disappointed. It would be more exciting as a contest if there were jeopardy, but it's still a real election. How is it that Josh Simons volunteering to stand aside in Makerfield is a legitimate by-election? And me saying that the people, with this constituency, do you think I'm a crook or not, isn't, is extraordinary.

And for them not to stand, frankly, I just think they're showing contempt for the electorate. So I'd rather there was jeopardy. I'd rather there was a big challenger. It would be a lot more exciting if there was, but it is what it is. And I will campaign and this by-election to get as bigger endorsement as I possibly can. Because the worry is, it's, well, the two candidates are you and a joke, candidate, let's be fair about that. It must be, it's not particularly edifying that every time your name gets mentioned in reference to the by-election, the comedy characters then reference

at the same time. Well, that's what they've done it. That's what they've done it. But I think it reflects more on them than it does on it. And I was actually, I'm looking at, I mean, there's a lot of the commentary talking about it, like it's like, you know, Count Benface has a real chance of winning. I mean, I looked at Calciards. It's like 90-odd percent. It's not a serious, it's becoming not a serious thing. Well, if anybody on 10% of Bimface wants to place some money, I'm quite happy to lay all of it. Probably illegal, I don't know what I'm saying that.

In private. Yeah, it is ridiculous. And I'd also say, I mean, yeah, it does show a level of content. So what they're trying to do by doing this, they're trying to make the number of votes I get be as low as possible. And the problem I've got is on the doorstep. People say, well, Nige, we love you, but you know, you're going to walk it, aren't you? You're going to walk it.

So without that jeopardy, it makes it harder for me to get the vote out. I get that. I understand that. I can see their cynicism and why they've done it. But look, all you can do is your best. And by the way, I have stood in the past against the original great screaming Lord Such. I've stood against the pub landlord and now Bimphate. So I've got the full, full of these candidates.

And by the way, BinFace isn't really just a kind of... He's a left-wing BBC comedy writer who's anti-Brexit. So there's a bit more politics there. Aren't they all? Well, BBC, certainly. Yeah. Look, I'd rather it wasn't that way. I agree with you.

Do you know what I found quite interesting is when I looked at everybody pulling out, I was like, okay, I understand the tactics. When the Greens didn't run, I was like, boys, girls, whatever you want, whatever you controversial but i was like guys like this would be the moment you could because what you could do is you could garner not the pro green vote which let's be fair as a small minority passion though they may be you can marketed it as the anti-forage vote and there's a you know there's an outside chance you could win or certainly do some damage here yeah and the greens too behaving like the union party behaving like the union party it's quite

quite astonishing. I agree with you. I think if the Greens have put a big run into this, they could have got a big score. And Nigel, you mentioned that you'd been leading the polls and have been. Again, I was, like I was saying, I was looking at Cali. I mean, the, you guys have been predicted to win the next election. And you've been leading that until about three weeks ago, which point Labor took over in the Calshel's that I was looking at. And it stayed relatively close. It's something's 37 versus 34%. What do you attribute that flip to? And do you think that will continue? Well, Starma going is obviously a plus.

I mean, you know, roll out the barrel. I think the rest of a party. Yeah, people like things that are new. And Andy coming in is new. That was attractive. And of course, the timing of him coming in and us coming under the cash. I mean, and the attempts to push Kenny and all the rest of it. I'm not overly worried about it.

I'm not overly worried about it. I think the fundamental problems that the country faces are not ones he's going to be able to turn around. And I think his early speeches and statements are just, well, vacuous, vacuous, as if devolution of itself is going to improve things. It can make things worse for all I know. And I think the centre of gravity of the parliamentary Labour Party has now gone so far left of what we thought we were getting back in July 24. and I think there is a major financial, fiscal crisis coming.

I've said it since 2024. I've predicted since 2024 that the election would not go all the way to 29. And just look at the numbers. You know, the five-year projecting borrowing figures for this government are two years in, out by 80%. It's just astonishing. I mean, they're going to have to find $120 billion quite quickly. And it would seem they're not willing to cut benefits in any way at all, which means higher taxes.

And we've reached the point on taxes where higher taxes mean lower revenues, not higher revenues. You get to that tipping point. Hill Africa. Yeah, where we're increasing taxes. It just starts to actually go the other way. And so I'm fearful, you know, and it isn't just, it isn't just. the non-noms and the wealthy leaving Britain. I mean, the Tories started that.

Jeremy Hunt started that. My real worry is the number of young people leave. Talented, you know, I'm talking the sort of late 20s to late 30s, people who perhaps have found their way in life or in their industry. And you know what? I want to have a go. I want to go on my own, build my own business. Well, to tell you what, Australia is much more attractive.

America's much more attractive. But many parts of the world that are far more attractive. right now they're staying here. So I see this exodus of talent, which really depresses me. I can't see Burnham reversing any of that either. So I think we're headed for a major, major financial crunch. I don't think it's very far away.

So look, am I worried? You know, you have good times and bad times in policies. We've had a remarkable run. We have had a remarkable run for a couple of years. But there is a baseline of support out there that is still incredibly firm for us, that is not going away. And I think as a party, you know, over the course of this year, we built out with spokeswomen

and spokesmen in different areas, new leaders in Scotland and Wales. I've been doing everything I can to stop it being a one-man band as CEO of an organisation with a big budget. Most of my life for the last 18 months, has been in the office in London, not in Parliament, not out campaigning, but acting as CEO to make sure we're building departments. departments that really work. And I can see that that's actually coming to fruition in many, many ways. And I think our basic, our basic slogan,

that Britain is broken, Britain needs reform. That hasn't gone away. I still believe that's enormously powerful. And I don't think you can even begin to prescribe the right medicine for the country until you're actually prepared to accept how all the patient is. And I think the Conservatives and Labour Party are both in denial over this. They both say Britain isn't broken. We've got our problems.

No, no, it's fundamentally broke. Nothing works at any level. And I think we're there. We're not going to move from that position. Our job, our job is to fully roll out a program ahead of the next general election that shows how it can be turned around, explains to people that it won't be easy, that gives them the hope and belief that it can.

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That's monetary dashmetals.com slash trigonometry. The concern must be, though, Nigel, is that Andy Burnham is going to come in. He's a better politician than Starmer. He's more charismatic. He sounds better. He wears T-shirts. He wears T-shirts.

He likes the Stone-Roses. Who doesn't like the Stone Roses? But the problem must be, the worrying must be, is that he has no mandate to rule. So he comes in, and in many ways, it's in his best interest to trigger a general election immediately because the more he speaks, the more he's going to piss off certain elements

of his party in the country in general. I mean, he's already come out and said, you know, the way that the Labour Party handled the Gaza situation was bad. Oh, yes, that's right. He's already cowtowing to the Palestinian activists. So, that being the case, isn't it in his interest to trigger a general election ASAP? Yes, you would have thought, say. Do you want him to? Interesting, isn't it? Interesting, isn't it?

Just before I come back to that. Here we are in Essex. because the ruling conservatives tried to stop the county council elections going ahead for two years in a row. They were only fought this year because of the court action that we at reform took.

She now doesn't want a general election and won't put up a candidate in the Clactin by-election. It's almost like democracy only applies when it suits us. I agree with you. I think Burnham's best chance would be in the relatively early months.

but you know what? You're a career politician, and he really is a career politician. This has been the whole of his life. He doesn't have, you know, other business interests or other careers he could pursue, not from what I can see anyway. You wait your whole life to become Prime Minister. You gamble it all and risk being a PM for less fewer days than Liz Truss?

I just think that's where the human nature bit kicks in. You know, I rationally. you're right, it sort of almost won't get better than it is. But I don't think you'll do it. I don't think you do it. A little like Gordon Brown didn't do it in 2008 and regressive that he didn't. I just cannot see him doing it. That could be wrong, but that's just my feeling.

Nigel, do you worry about, I mean, we've talked. All these questions are, do I worry? I mean, do I look like somebody he's worrying all the time? Well, I wasn't going to ask you about you, actually, but the state of the country in the sense of what you're talking about, because you talk about the coming financial, the fiscal crisis, which we've had plenty of guests on the show to talk about why that's coming. And I do agree with you. It's inevitable. And we've talked about violent extremism. But what we haven't talked about is that when things are bad economically, extremism in general tends to rise.

And you see now with the rise of restore to the right of you and also on the far left now, fairly. extreme voices becoming prominent. I think it's a testament to the stay of the country. Is that something that, you know, you think about? I'm worried about the rise of extremism. Yes, all so cutely worried about societal breakdown. Yeah. I've just, before I came to sit down and see you chaps today,

I've just been to a local business. About at half 11 last Friday, five people broke in, started stealing stuff. They were disturbed. They went away, cops came, cops left, the five came back to take more stuff. The cops then didn't return, too busy. But these five people were outed on a local Facebook group. So we know the identities of the five of them. They then returned the cash that had been stolen,

and the police have decided not to charge them. I worry about societal breakdown. I worry. I was with somebody else this morning who said he was in Bristol at the weekend. I saw a bloke in a supermarket with a rucksack,

filling it up with 40 quid bottles of gin. We're still in a text of saying, don't do that. I just call you walk out of a shop. I worry about that. It's a societal breakdown. The lack of sense of community, the way that lawlessness

is just expanding. in the most extraordinary way. I worry about that, too. I really, I genuinely do. Nigel, I want to get a few questions in from our supporters. So before we head over to that, the last question, as you know, is always the same. What's the one thing we're not talking about that we should be? Before Nigel answers a final question at the end of the interview,

make sure to head over to our substack. The link is in the description where you'll be able to see this. Would you make comments with Rupert Lowe and work together with the Restore Party? What is reforms planned to bring back all the talent and capital that have fled the country over the past decade? Please paint us the picture of what it would be like when you're the PM, locally, nationally and internationally. The one thing we're not talking about enough, and I was inspired a bit on this by Francis and the work you did about being a teacher in a London, out of London, borough. The one thing we're not talking about enough is the huge numbers of young people. kids who've got great potential and great talent be it in academics be it in sport being in whatever

feel of life it may be who find themselves going to state schools in britain cities which frankly in many areas barely look like britain because of all the different languages that are spoken and because of the sort of breakdown of civility and law and order and respect are not fulfilling their potential in life and even though this labor government tries to make it harder for anyone to privately educated with their VAT bills. The 7% that go to private schools are now dominating Britain in a way they haven't done for a very, very long time. And so social mobility is going backwards and not forwards.

And there was a tragedy going on in education in Britain cities where people are not fulfilling their potential. And that for them and for us as a country, is a disaster. There you go, Nigel Farage, endorse, is uneducated. by Francis Foster, available in all good bookshops, but sales might go down as well as up after this if such as thing as possible. Nigel, thanks for coming back on.

It's always great to have you. Head on over to Trigopod.com.uk. When Nigel's going to answer a few of your questions. Can you articulate examples of the laws and policies that you want to enact that would both demonstrate that you have comparison for non-native Brits and that your intentions are fair and reasonable?