True Crime All The Time - Benjamin Atkins

Episode Date: June 21, 2021

Benjamin Atkins was a serial killer and rapist who operated in the Detroit area in 1991 and 1992. He is considered by the FBI to be America's fastest serial killer because he murdered 11 women in such a short span of time. Atkins preyed on women along Detroit's Woodward Avenue and his M.O. remained consistent. He targeted sex workers because his mother was a sex worker who took him with her and he was forced to see things that no child should have to witness.Join Mike and Gibby as they discuss the horrific details of serial killer Benjamin Atkins. He took the lives of 11 women during an 8-9 month time span, but, it was his only victim that managed to escape who ultimately brought him down. Atkins experienced a terrible childhood, and his defense argued that it was this childhood that ultimately made him the predator he became. You can help support the show at patreon.com/truecrimeallthetimeVisit the show's website at truecrimeallthetime.com for contact, merchandise, and donation informationAn Emash Digital productionSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Hello everyone and welcome to episode 238 of the True Crime All the Time podcast. I'm Mike Ferguson and with me as always is my partner in true crime Mike Gibson. How are you? Hey man, I'm doing good about yourself. I'm doing really well. Good. You and I just taped a brand new Patreon episode, a very strange story about Joseph Callenger, a man who believed he was on a mission from God to kill every person on the planet.

Yeah, all four billion or whatever was. Yeah, I think it was four billion at the time back then. We have a lot more people on the planet today. But it's an interesting one for sure. We also have a brand new true crime all the time unsolved episode out. We're talking about the Atlantic City four. Yeah, it's a good one. It's a good episode. Four women end up murdered behind a kind of a city hotel. And, And in a short period of time, and then, you know, the investigation ensues. And we kind of go from there. Yeah, there's a possible tie-in with a serial killer. Yeah. So a lot of times you'll see this story referred to as the Eastbound Strangler. The Eastbound Strangler. But it's a good one.

Make sure you check that out. Not to be confused with Eastbound Down or whatever that show is. Oh, I love that. Eastbound and Down. Yeah. We're seeing some great support on Patreon. Let's give our shout-outs. We had Aussie Dan.

Hey, Aussie. Kelly Nelson. What's going on, Kelly? Gail Antley. Hey, Antley. Heather Thomas. What's going on, Heather? Kathy Voss jumped out of our highest level.

What's up, Kathy? Trescia Rawcliffe jumped out of our highest level. Yeah, I got some Rawliff in the house. Lindsay Peel. Hey, Lindsay. Sidney, Lorre. What's going on, Lord? Seth Lowry.

Hey, Seth. Boogie Mae jumped out of our highest level. Man, got to have a little boogie in your life. Mary Lynn Leadsstrom. What's going on, Leaststrom? Sherry McBride jumped out of her highest level. level. Well, appreciate that, Sherry. Emily Sanchez and Casey jumped out of our highest level. Hey, appreciate that, Emily and Casey. Jessica Bowserman. What's up, Bowserman? Gabrielle Kump.

Hey, you Komp. Christine Tafola. Ah, Tafolla. Ori Kachavi. Oh, man, Kachavi. Alicia Williams. Hey, Alicia. Jennifer Proudanovitch jumped out of our highest level. I like that. Provanavdiv. And Indy Mujer 3. Well, like I just wonder what happened to Indy Moher. one and two. All right. It's not Moheera, but okay, we'll go with it. You're still wondering about one and two. I am.

Then we go back into the vault, Gibbs. This week we selected Elizabeth Sir. Well, thank you, Elizabeth. So we appreciate the new Patreon support, the continued support. We had some great PayPal donations as well from Dawn Chick. Hey, chicka. Chris Chamberlain. Hey, what's going on, Chris?

Shannon Ash made a sizable donation. Oh, yeah. Thanks, Shannon. And Dana Mackey. Well, what's up, Mackey? So thanks to everyone who helps the show. It is very much appreciated. All right, Gibbs.

Are you ready to get into this episode of true crime all the time? I am ready. We're talking about Benjamin Atkins. He was a man given the title America's fastest serial killer, basically for the rapid pace of his killings. And this was kind of a name given to him by the. FBI and they still consider him as far as I know to be America's fastest serial killer. It's a strange title to receive. It's not an award that you should be striving to obtain.

Exactly. Let's put it that way. His primary targets were female sex workers struggling with addiction. And how many times do we hear that? We hear it a lot. And I know that in our unsolved episode this week, we talked about it quite a bit as well. And Gibbs, I think what we're going to see in Benjamin Atkins is a perfect example of how, you know, a lot of serial killers are a product of their life circumstances. This is a guy who had a tragic childhood that made him hate women so much so that he wanted to murder them as a form of revenge on his own mother, something that we've seen quite a bit as well.

We really have. You can take a look at a guy like Ed Kemper. Yep. And there's so many people. Now, I think for a lot of people, Benjamin Atkins is not a well-known serial killer. Probably there's a lot of people who have never heard of him. And I think that makes it even more important to share his case and talk about the 11 women whose lives he took. This guy was a prolific serial killer and an extremely.

short amount of time. Now, I will say this gives the majority of the information and all of the direct quotes in this case come from the Detroit Free Press. Their journalists provided extensive coverage of the mission to arrest Atkins and his trial. And, you know, the Detroit Free Press is a paper I'm very familiar with having lived in Detroit. Sure. Yeah. For a period of time. It was a paper that I always thought did a very good job covering stories. I remember reading it when I lived there thinking, man, they've got some good journalists. Right. And there have been a lot of good journalists that have passed through the Detroit Free Press. Benjamin Tony Atkins was a serial killer and a rapist. Most of his acquaintances knew him as Tony. He killed from December 1991 to August 1992. So we're

only talking about a nine-month period. And in that time frame, he murdered 11 women in the Highland Park area. This is a smaller town, a smaller suburb near Detroit. Highland Park is one of the poorest areas in the state of Michigan. It has an extremely high crime rate. All of the women were murdered on about a 1.4 mile stretch of Woodward Avenue. This also, earned Adkins a second nickname of the Woodward Corridor Killer. And for anybody that's not spent time in Detroit, Woodward Avenue is kind of like the main drag through the city. Okay.

So a lot of times if they have like a big parade or they have something that they have every year, most likely it occurs on Woodward Avenue. It's just kind of like one of the big streets. Like a main street. Yeah, kind of. Detroit's an interesting city because it's a grid city. Yeah. So you have the mile, like obviously M&M eight mile. Right. You have that all the way up. Those run east west. And then you kind of have these big streets that run north south and Woodward is one of those. But for me, it was always like a landmark street because if I was on the highway and I passed the sign for Woodward Avenue, I kind of knew where I was. Yeah. Now Benjamin's child. was nothing short of horrific. And I think Gibbs, this is where you and I get into the conversation.

Is it possible for someone to be born a killer? Or are they somehow made into a killer through the things they experience, oftentimes early in life? Well, I think if you listen to our Patreon-only episode this week, you can see that argument on how. someone who's treated can make them do really bad things as they grow older. Yeah, and I think it's probably true that the majority of cases that we cover,

we oftentimes when it comes to serial killers are talking about people who experienced some really bad thing growing up. And so you always wonder how that plays into what they later become. I mean, you've said it time and time again, right? You witness violence as a child, let's say specifically violence against women. You begin to think that's normal. And so, you know, that's the type of actions that you emulate later in life. Yeah, for sure.

Now, we've also done some cases of people who had great childhood. Yeah, it turned out to be very, very bad guys. And that's why that argument still remains. You know, nature versus nurture. I think it can happen both ways. But you can always ask that question, right? If things had gone differently, would this person have been a normal functioning, contributing member of society?

Benjamin was born on August 26, 1968. The Detroit Free Press reported that he had a tortured childhood. His father abandoned him shortly after he was born. Benjamin lived in boys' homes when he was taken away from his mother, which apparently was quite often. She struggled with addiction. And I mentioned it. She was a sex worker.

Gibbs, she often forced him to go to work with her. That'd be rough. And this is not the first time we've heard this. No, we have heard this before. She made him sit in the backseat of her car while she engaged in sexual activity in the front seat.

Yeah. He's witnessing all of them. He's hearing it. He's seeing it. That's a great point. Not just witnessing. hearing the sounds all of that plays into it at the boys homes Benjamin was physically assaulted by some of the older boys apparently

sometimes by the employees and at the age of 10 he was raped by a caseworker a caseworker yeah somebody that is put in place by the system to ensure that you're okay yeah they're to protect you but they're doing the opposite. They're harming you. When he turned 18, he left his mother for good. But as an adult, Benjamin was homeless. He too struggled with addiction. Occasionally, he worked as a pizza cook or, you know, had other type of minimum wage jobs. But really, he had no type of regular employment. In 1990 or 91, he began using crack cocaine. Not good. No. Because what did Whitney say?

Crack is whack. Crack is whack. Benjamin often smoked crack or drank liquor to keep warm on cold nights. Now, Gibbs, I talked about it, right? Got back from Austin where CrimeCon was held. They had what was a pretty sizable homeless encampment? Yeah. Along the river.

I know California has quite a bit of homeless as well. Detroit, Michigan is a terrible place to be homeless. Too cold. Oh my gosh. The winters are brutal. I'm not saying that any place is good to be homeless. So don't take it that way. But if you are homeless, if you're forced into that,

are you better off in Texas or California or Detroit, Michigan? And I think the answer is obvious. I'm going to Beverly Hills. You would. Yeah. But, you know, I remember living in Detroit.

and it seemed so much colder than where we are in Ohio. And Detroit's not that far from us. But you get that river. The lake. The lake effect. Yeah, you get that lake effect, the wind, the snow. It's just all a little bit colder, a little bit worse. Benjamin's killing spree began in late 1991.

So that's the year that I graduated from high school. He would have been, what, 23 at the time. He started his killing spree fairly young, 23 years old. 35-year-old Darlene Saunders was attacked and raped in Highland Park in October of 91. She's the only survivor of Benjamin Atkins' attacks. He became friends with Darlene that October. They picked an abandoned building on Woodward Avenue, and they went inside to smoke crack together. Afterwards, Benjamin raped Darlene and attempted.

to strangle her, but she managed to escape. And here again is something that you and I talk about quite a bit. Having some type of contact with a person who later turns out to be, you know, a big time serial killer. Yeah. And you look back and, and you think, oh, my gosh. I was lucky to escape that. Yeah, that could have been me.

And to find out that she was the only person attacked by him that survived, you And I get a lot of emails. We do. From people kind of sharing stories about these brushes that either they've had, their parents had, or relative had with some of the killers that we profile. They're scary. Extremely scary. And Benjamin definitely had an M.O.

His M.O was rape and strangulation. All of his victims were murdered in this fashion. Most of the women had their hands tied behind them, were partially. unclothed or fully nude and had something around their necks to indicate strangulation. Well, they were also found in vacant buildings. Yeah. And I think that, you know, factors into the MO as well. Sure. Their bodies were thrown into corners, shower stalls, closets. And we mentioned it, right?

He targeted sex workers and women who were addicted to drugs. he later confessed that he was motivated to kill by his hatred of sex workers. Well, Gibbs, why would he have a hatred of sex workers? Well, that's because his mom was a sex worker. And she made him go on her dates and made him watch. And he was exposed to things that no child should ever be exposed to. And, you know, I'm sure we'll get into it. But my assumption is he harbored a.

great deal of animosity towards his mother. I'm sure he did. For that and probably many other things. And as some of these killers often do, now sometimes they kill their own mother. They do. As in the case of Ed Kemper, but they also choose their victims based on, you know, the fact that they look like their mother or they have the same occupation of their mother or they just remind them of their mother. 30-year-old Debbie Ann Friday was found strangled in Highland Park on

December 14th, 1991. On December 8th, she said she was going to visit a guy in Highland Park and she never came back. 26-year-old Bertha Jean Mason was found strangled on December 30th. On December 11th, she left her boyfriend and four children to go to the store. She never came back. Bertha was five months pregnant when she died. 36-year-old Patricia Cannon-George was found strangled on January 3rd, 1992. Her body was discovered when the abandoned building she was in was being demolished. On November 30th of 91, she told her friend she was going to a crack house and she never came back. So Gibbs already in a span of less than three months.

we have Benjamin committing three murders and one attack in which his victim survived and got away. Right. Yeah. And, you know, again, we set it up front. These murders happen in very rapid succession. But he's not done. No, he's far from done. You know, we set it right up front.

He had 11 victims. 39 year old Vicki True Love was found strangled in room 68 of. the Monterey Motel in Highland Park on January 25th, 1992. In late January of that year, the police arrested Benjamin Atkins at a vacant building and they charged him with trespassing. They took him to the police station for questioning. And I think even at that point, Gibbs, they thought he could possibly be the Woodward corridor killer, but they didn't have any evidence.

They couldn't charge him. and so they released him. But he remained on the list of suspects. And that's a sad situation because we know he's going to go on to kill a number of women. Right. They were so close too. They were close, but you can't blame them. Right.

If they don't have the evidence, they don't have the evidence. And no matter what you think or how much you believe someone may have done something, you need the evidence. you need the evidence to take it to court to be able to prove it until then you got to keep searching. Yeah. And he'll continue to be on the streets. And it's just a sad fact that he was able to go on and kill more women. On February 17th of 92, three victims were found at the Monterey Motel in Highland Park. Benjamin abandoned their bodies in different rooms. 34-year-old Valerie Chalk was found strangled in room six.

her family had been searching for her since November 6th. 23-year-old Juanita Hardy was found strangled in room 35. An unknown female who has not been identified to this day was found strangled in room 18. All of these women had the same signs of rape and strangulation as the other victims. And again, how frustrating for detectives they knew that, the Woodward Corridor Killer murdered these women. Yes.

Struck again. Yeah. I mean, I think they knew it just based on how these women were killed, but they couldn't identify him. But I think this is interesting because not only are we talking about murders that happen in rapid succession, four of these murders happened at the same damn hotel.

Yeah. And so, I mean, I think that is extremely. scary. I mean, if you're a sex worker on Woodward Avenue, you're nervous, man. You should not be going to the Monterey Motel. No. And I just wonder if any of these three women, and again, I don't know if these were all sex workers or not, but I wonder if any of these three women knew about to previous murder. And if they were sex workers, did it dissuade them from going? Because, you know, if that's your job, If that's how you're putting food on the table for your kids, if you have them,

right. Are you doing what you have to do to make ends meet, to, you know, to buy cereal, to buy school supplies? Yeah. I just think it'd have to be scary. You know, I mean, you're going to these abandoned buildings, these abandoned hotels, motels, and knowing that maybe you won't come back out. Well, and you and I have said it time and time again.

We know that this is a very dangerous profession. Everybody knows it, right? It's fraught with danger because these women are extremely vulnerable. Anytime they go somewhere with someone, it's got to be somewhat private. Yeah. Has to be. Sure. And so they're extremely vulnerable.

38 year old Brenda Mitchell was found strangled in Highland Park on April 9th, 92. on April 5th, she left her two children at her mother's home to go to the store and never returned. Brenda was found in an abandoned house. She was naked except for a scarf wrapped around her neck. She had blood coming from her mouth and a mattress was thrown over her body. Now, Brenda had taken a lethal dose of drugs before she died and this led to a a mistake and determination of an overdose as her cause of death. So that's tough because that could throw the investigation off and lead the investigators

down a wrong path. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean, from the sheer fact that they would not include Brenda Mitchell at that time as a victim of the Woodward Corridor Killer, right? if the coroner, the medical examiner, places her cause of death as an overdose, well, then she's not a murder victim. 43-year-old Vicki Beasley Brown was found strangled in Highland Park on April 15th. Her body was put inside a closet in an empty apartment. On March 25th, she told her two children she was going to the store to buy them school lunches and get herself some cigarettes. And she never came back. And you think about that, Gibbs, you know, kids at home.

Mom says, hey, I'm going to run an errand. I'll be right back. Yep. Those kids are sitting there waiting on their mother. Yeah, where is mom? And she never comes back. 40-year-old Jamie O'Rourke was found strangled in Highland Park on June 15th, 92. Her body remained unidentified until after Benjamin Atkins was arrested.

22-year-old Ocenina Weamer was found strangled in Highland Park on August 21st. Her body was missing until after Benjamin confessed. So, you know, we talk about all of these murders and they were difficult to solve. First of all, Gibbs, there wasn't a lot of information on the women's background. Their families didn't all know who they spent time with. Right. And we mentioned it up front. According to the FBI, Benjamin Atkins remains America's fastest serial killer

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Join today and you'll get six bottles of wine for $29.95 and free shipping. Just go to TriFirstleaf.com slash T-Cat. Folks, that's six bottles of wine for 2995 and free shipping at tryfirstleaf.com slash teacat. The investigation lasted eight months. as soon as Highland Park PD realized that they were dealing with the serial killer, but they were unable to catch him. But I think the kicker is, so these months went by,

police weren't able to figure out who this murderer was. And they ignored a witness who had every bit of information they needed to catch the killer. This witness's name was Darlene Saunders. And she came forward and made a police report on March 6th of 1992. At 11.50 a.m. She flagged down a Detroit police car on Woodward Avenue. She told them she'd been raped and almost strangled a few months earlier by a man she knew as Tony. And Darlene had heard about the three women who were murdered at the Monterey Motel.

And she believed that Tony was the killer. She told the officer that they went to an abandoned building where he raped her and dragged her by her neck to try to kill her. She was afraid. She was bleeding. But she managed to escape. At first she said she was too embarrassed to report the incident. But after hearing about the other women, she changed her mind. She gave them a full description of Tony and gave the police her first.

phone number and address. Yeah, I mean, the sad thing is she was ignored for four months after she made her initial report. And we know, because we talked about her first, we know that 11 women lost their lives. Now, they weren't, they didn't all happen after March of 1992, but a number of them did. I think four women at least were killed after Darlene made her report. So to me, Gibbs, I understand how that might be embarrassing for Darlene to come forward and and talk to police. We mentioned it earlier.

She was there smoking crack cocaine. Right. It's not something that you normally want to tell the police about. No, you're not something you're proud about either. Or eager to disclose. Yeah. But you really have to give her a lot of credit because, you know, she finds. out that a number of women have been killed and she makes the decision that you know what,

I don't care. If I have to tell them I was doing something that I shouldn't have been doing, I have got to get to the police and give them this information because we're going to stop this guy before he kills more women. But like we said, it was kind of sad because her initial report really didn't go anywhere for months and kind of just got lost in the shuffle. Yeah, it was four months that they ignored her initial report. No one reached out to Darlene until early July. A key investigator later explained what happened to the Detroit Free Press telling journalists pretty much what you just said, Gibbs, she fell through the cracks. Her name just sat there. Well, you're going to have to explain it somehow. Yeah. Because journalists are going to want to know. and so was some of the family of the victims. Yeah, and they're not going to be very happy. It's not a great explanation, though, right?

She fell through the cracks. Her name just sat there. It's not what you want to hear from the police. I get it. It's probably the truth. Yeah, I mean, it's probably pretty busy, right, with a lot of different people calling in.

Oh, I'm sure. I'm sure. I mean, Detroit, we know, has their fair share of crime. For sure, yeah. Murders. there's a lot going on for the Detroit police. But after finding out that four more women were murdered

and the only thing that you can really come up with is that the tip just kind of fell through the cracks. Doesn't make the police look great. In late February, early March of 1992, Highland Park Sergeant James Dobson arranged an information swap between the Detroit police. and Highland Park, the two police forces had been arguing about the case for months. They showed up to the meeting place and the Detroit detectives grabbed Dobson's papers and went

out the door saying they forgot their paperwork and they told them, we'll call you when we catch him. So it wasn't so much as an information swap as it was the Detroit police basically taking what Highland Park had and leaving. So the bigger police department came in and kind of bullying them out of the way. That's what it sounds like. Yeah. But, you know, this is something else that really bugs me when police departments squabble and fight over jurisdiction and this and that. And it becomes more of a, you know, a pissing contest for lack of a better term.

Yeah. Then it is about trying to work together to catch the kill. killer. I hate that. You know, I go back to the Zodiac case. Yeah. And you really saw a lot of that about, you know, departments not talking to each other, not wanting to share information. And obviously, this was much farther back in time. But it did hamper the investigation. And it will every time. Well, it's because they want to be the one that solves it. Sure. Not the other department. And you see it in Hollywood, too, in the movies, right? That's, how prevalent it was back in the day.

I mean, I just remember watching the fugitive, just on that little escape, they're around that car throwing the map down, and everybody's trying to say they're taking the lead, and then finally, whatever his name is. Tommy Lee Jones has, you know, he basically takes over. And yeah, I get it. Nobody wants to be shown up, and everybody wants to be the group that catches this killer

who's terrorizing the area. Right. But we all. know us lay people not you know not being police yeah things happen better when you work together sure throw a task yeah or a task force you know at least put together a task force and bring people from each agency and department on to it in mid may 1992 a man who knew darling called in and reported her rape the highland p.d detectives were extremely busy and they ignored him that day the they just received a tip, you know, on a potential lead.

And a rape case was low priority in their minds because apparently gives a woman in Detroit got into a fight with her husband. She screamed at him. You hate women so much. I bet you're the one killing all those women in Highland Park. So that was the lead, right? That was the tip. And they put a lot of stock in that and kind of.

discounted this rape case when in actuality as we know this was the better information. This was the tip that was going to lead them to the killer. But I guess this husband said back to his wife, yeah, you're right. I am. So she called the police. They questioned him, but later figured out that he wasn't a killer. He was just a mad husband and was in a fight with his wife. and she accused him and he said, yeah, yeah, I am.

I'm the one killing all these women. You got me. You got me. So we mentioned a task force. And eventually the Highland Park PD and the FBI teamed up to put together a task force. It also included along with Highland Park, FBI, Detroit homicide detectives, state troopers. So again, this is what you and I were talking about. about let's get this going and they did. Now, one of the things that made this task force kind of

surprising was that the Detroit police didn't have a great relationship at the time with the FBI. Little tension. There was some tension there. I don't know if that still exists or not. But I think the fact that they were willing to join the task force, even with all of that tension going on, it shows you the importance of the case. And why wouldn't it be important? 11 women killed in such a short period of time, basically in a small area. Yeah. You know, again, this is one thing that we haven't talked about yet. What do we say? One point four miles or give or take. Yeah. This was not a large radius where these kill. You know, these killings were taking place.

It wasn't like a killer was crisscrossing a city or even like some that we've talked about going all around the state or hopping trains and going state to state. This was concentrated in a relatively small area that had to be very alarming. Yeah. And they need this task force. They need the experience from all these different agencies. and they were able to work together. It wasn't a great relationship, though.

No, because I think some of the rivalries kind of reared up. And again, I just think that's extremely sad that departments and agencies can't work together for the better good and put some of the petty rivalries behind them. Detroit Inspector Gerald Stewart was arguing with Highland Park about the case. You know, basically the two departments did their own police. were. Darlene's report was ignored. The Detroit detectives were swamped with a large number of murder cases. That caused them to overlook Darleen's report. And I think to put it in perspective, the Detroit police were dealing with 129 open homicides in the summer of 1992. That's a lot.

It is a lot. It's a lot going on. It's a lot of work. it has to be done. And at some point, Stuart, I think he admitted that they didn't even know what happened to Darlene's report, but argued that it should have been sent to Highland Park right away. And some Highland Park employees said they did receive it,

while others said they did, but it wasn't until July of 1992. So again, I think there might be some CYA there because who wants to admit that they got this report? earlier when they knew that additional murders took place after that, I think much better gives to say you received it in July when I think all but one of the murders had already taken place if you're trying to cover your own ass. Exactly. And apparently there were some notations on the report that said it was sent to an elite homicide unit inside the Detroit.

Police Department, but really no one knows where the report went after that. And most likely it was laying somewhere buried on somebody's desk or in a pile of paper. No doubt about it. I think all these agencies, these police departments were extremely busy. Yeah, we mentioned it, right? 129 homicides for Detroit Police. Highland Park was overwhelmed to, apparently their phone system was so old. they couldn't even hook up a tape recorder to accept tips around the clock.

So literally somebody had to answer the phone. You couldn't leave a message with a tip. On top of that, the Highland Park police were working their way through a list of 800 sex criminals provided by the state police. That's a lot of people to investigate, track down, look into. Yeah, you've got to have a lot of resources to do that. Definitely. On June 17, 1992, FBI agent Halterhood assigned two agents to do a two-week review of the Woodward Corridor Killer case.

Agents Paul Lindsay and Prince Ross were working the case. And it was Paul Lindsay who noticed Darlene's report. In mid-July, Lindsay, Ross, and Dobson knocked on Darlene's car door and they asked her to tell them what happened. happened. She agreed to help. I think it's quite possible that without the help of Darlene Saunders, the task force may have never found out that Benjamin Atkins was the Woodward corridor killer. I agree completely with that. Now, they might have eventually stumbled upon him. Maybe. But how many more women could he have killed or would he have killed? Investigator also learned about a man named Anthony Starks, a former psychiatric patient who frequented a local soup

kitchen near the Monterey Motel. Starks was known to have spent time with sex workers in the area. His record showed that in 1984, he was charged with assault and attempted rape. And I think he became a suspect after this information was learned. Agent Lerner, Agent Lerner, Lindsey in particular suspected that he was the killer and called in the Detroit police to help. On July 17th, the police raided his home, but they didn't find any evidence. But they did start following him around. Now, for one thing, his name is Tony. So that was a strike against him.

Sure it was. Because Darlene had mentioned that the man who attacked her name was Tony. on July 30th, Wayne County prosecutor John O'Hare and assistant prosecutor Michael Reynolds met with all the members of the task force to make an arrest plan. What they decided to do was to put Darlene in a squad car and cruise around Woodward Avenue looking for Tony. So basically, we're just going to cruise around until Darlene spots the man that attacked her. Say that's Tony right there.

Now, I'm not saying that's a terrible plan. at all. No. But they also were not giving up on Anthony Starks at this point. He was still in the crosshairs. And it was on August 5th, 1992 that police saw Starks take a woman into an abandoned house on the same block where Bertha Mason was murdered. The police broke down the door and they found Starks and the woman naked and asleep. They brought him in for questioning. he said he was innocent. It wasn't until a couple of days later that they brought Darlene in to identify him. Well, she's like, I know that Tony, but he ain't the right, Tony.

Yeah. So Darlene knew a lot of people. She knew both of these guys. But the big thing was that she said, no, Anthony Starks was not the man who attacked me. You got the wrong Tony. So she kept riding around in the, the, the school. squad car for days looking for Tony. She finally spotted him on August 21st. He was using a pay phone on Woodward Avenue. And it was that day, 23 year old Benjamin Atkins was arrested on rape and

murder charges. Initially, he was only charged with the murders of the three women found at the Monterey Motel. But more charges would come. That day, police interrogated him for 12 hours. That's a long time to be questioned by police. It really is. It really is. Yeah. I mean, he's going to sit there and deny being the killer.

Wouldn't you? Absolutely. With my attorney. Deny, deny, deny, deny. That doesn't shock me. You know what does shock me is when in the story, they start the interrogation and the perpetrator says,

yeah, that was me. I did that. That's the one that always shocks me. Yeah. Because I'm like, why would someone give us? up so easily. Why wouldn't you go down fighting? Now, I'm glad they do. Don't get me wrong.

Oh, no, I get it. But up to this point, you didn't give yourself up. So where's the change of heart? Yeah. And I always think that, you know, these killers, they want to be out so badly because they want to continue to do what they've been doing, right? How are they going to get their sick gratification if they're locked away in a cell, but yet they give up so easily sometimes. It just doesn't make sense to me. The thinking doesn't. I do agree that sometimes there's a handful out there that just are dying to be caught, right? Because they just want whatever is going on in their head to be over. I think that's a part of it. Yeah. I do think we've talked about people in the past who they're just tired. They're ready to be done with it. But, okay, they haven't, for whatever reason, walked into the police station and

turned themselves in. But when they're finally caught, it's almost as if, I don't want to say it's a sigh of relief, but it's, it's over. Yeah. Whatever they've been doing or whatever has been going on inside them, it's now over because you got me. Yeah. And I know I'm going to spend either the rest of my life in jail or on death row until my time comes. And I know, I'm going to spend. And I know, my time comes. But not for Benjamin. He's hanging in there strong. He's like 12 hours in.

I'm not the killer. I didn't do it. And I'm going to tell you something else. He goes on to tell the police that he's homosexual, that he's not even interested in women. So you definitely have the wrong guy. But he did admit to smoking crack. Yeah. Because why?

Crack is whack. But that's also a ploy that many guilty people use. Right. I'm going to say I'm innocent to the big thing. thing, which is murder, but I'm going to tell you that I'm guilty of X, which is not great, but much farther down the list of bad things I've done. And maybe you'll believe me because you'll think I'm being honest about this smaller thing. Right.

And then I'll walk. But the homosexual angle, that's a new one for me. I don't know that I've ever heard that from a killer. of women saying, you know, well, you can't possibly have the right guy. It can't be me because I don't even like women. Although you don't need to like women to kill them. In fact, it's actually the opposite. He's killing women because he hates women. Yeah. So really, whether he's homosexual or not, it's really neither here nor there. No, not to me. Now, you could make the argument that why would he rape women? And maybe that's what he's trying to base his argument on. But the murder,

to me, that has no bearing on it. Well, we also know that a lot of times rape has nothing to do sexually. Yeah. I mean, I think that's been pretty well proven. The majority of the time, it's said to be about power, not about sex. It's about the power over some. It's about the power over someone else. Homicide detective Ronald Sanders watched the interrogation. Apparently Gibbs, the guy was supposed to go on vacation in an hour, but he wanted to have a chance to question Benjamin before he went. So he sat down and he told him, you never had a father. I have a son exactly your age. You need to get this off your chest. Talk to me. And it worked. Benjamin gave a full confession. He identified his victims. He described what clothes they were wearing.

He even confessed to hiding a body in a secret basement underneath an empty garage. When the police found this woman, she had a cord wrapped around her neck and had been dead for several months. They eventually identified her as Ocena Weamer. What a horrific fine. That had to be. Yeah, we talked about her, but at that, time police hadn't found her. Benjamin told them about killing Juanita Harvey, who was found at the abandoned motel. He said, I never really planned to kill her. After raping her, having sex, and hating her for being a woman, I had the desire to kill her for being a woman. I just wanted to hate her and cause her harm. He told them about killing Patricia George, his first victim. They smoked crack together in

and abandoned building, he became enraged when she tried to leave. He raped her and then he strangled her. He said the main reason he killed all of these women was so that they wouldn't press charges for rape. You didn't want to go to jail? No, he didn't want to go to jail, but isn't that a little bit conflicting? Yes. So you have the, I hate women, and I'm killing because of that.

But you also have, I'm killing because I've done something really bad. I've raped these women. Yeah. And they either know who I am or can identify me in some way. So I have to kill them. Yeah, because I don't want to be arrested. So, you know, again, every story, you know, you get conflicting information. And, you know, when it comes out of the mouth of a killer, you kind of have to make up your

own mind. What's the truth and what's a smokescreen and all of that? When the news came out that the task force had caught the killer, but ignored Darlene for months. The women's families, they weren't pleased. I mean, they were pleased that the killer was caught. They were upset that the police ignored Darlene's information. Yeah, because I think they're saying, look, maybe my loved one would still be alive today. Vicki's sister Denise Johnson told the Detroit Free Press, look how many lives could have been saved. They ought to be ashamed of themselves. The police described Benjamin Atkins as pretty unassuming. He didn't look or act like a killer. Neighbors spoke to the Detroit Free Press and they described him as a pleasant guy to be around

until he smoked crack or drank liquor. Well, there's people out there that just can't handle the crack and can't handle the liquor. And can't handle both. Or both together. But there are some people like that, right? Yep. If they're not on any substances, they're pretty okay. And neighbors might view them as being just a good neighbor.

Yeah. But they turn into somebody else when they get high or, you know, they drink a lot. They do. A lot of the neighbors said that he was known as Ben, but also known as Tony. And I think that's where maybe the confusion would the, we need to find Tony based on what Darlene said came from. Many knew him as a homeless man. They occasionally gave food to or a place to sleep for the night. Nancy Townsend told the Detroit Free Press, everybody in the neighborhood talked to him.

My aunt and my mom used to feed him. He was pleasant. He would run to the store for neighbors to get pop and cigarettes. But one neighbor who asked not to be identified said that Benjamin became different when he used drugs or alcohol. He would explode in anger and call women bitches and hoes. Several neighbors said he was very unfriendly when he smoked crack, but they were still shocked to find out that he was a serial killer and a rapist. And I get that, Gibbs. I mean, even if you have a neighbor that you dislike and you think is not a great.

person, you'd still be shocked. Well, I think so, yeah. To find out that they were a serial killer or a serial rapist or something like that, you know, anybody that you interact with on a regular basis, regardless of whether you like them or not, I think you'd be shocked. Yeah, especially you've spent any time around them. One neighbor told the paper that they considered Benjamin a friend. He was a very personable, nice guy.

He would come into their apartment and bake a kid. cake or brownies. He didn't seem like the type that would kill someone. And I think there were a lot of serial killers like that, that when people find out, they look back and they think, well, no way. I would have never thought that this guy would be a serial killer. Now, I know a lot of people that I think could be serial killers, so it goes both ways. Neighbors and friends knew Benjamin had a problem with liquor and crack.

And I guess he would often tell people Gibbs that he was proud of himself. because he hadn't smoked crack for a week, but they said he was in denial about his addiction, and he always relapsed. His brother and sister-in-law were constantly trying to get him to quit smoking crack, clean up, get a job. I think everyone around him kind of hope that he would do this and turn his life around.

Unfortunately, all these people turned out to be wrong about him. Yeah, I mean, I know we thought about, crack being whack and all that. But seriously, it's a, it's a, you know, it was a huge problem. And I know that we've had some listeners that, you know, messaged us in the past where they had to overcome this and eventually got away from it and got their life turned around. But they mentioned it was not easy. It was a struggle to finally get to the point where they were able to break free of it. So, yeah, I, I, think there's some, some of these drugs that they're just so hard to get off. There are so, addictive. At a preliminary hearing in October 1992,

Darlene Saunders faced Benjamin in court and she had to recreate the attack. During her testimony, she said, he ripped everything off of me. He made me lay on the floor full of glass and debris. I had to lay down flat. He got on top of me and raped me. Relatives of the other victims watched Darlene speak. And apparently Darlene was arrested on September 23rd. Police held her for 16 days because they feared she wouldn't show up for court. But she told the paper that she always intended to testify against him. She said, I wanted him to feel the hurt and the pain and the anger.

I wanted him to feel it in my eyes. And that's something we don't always talk about. That cannot be easy for a person like Darley. who was victimized by this guy to get up on the stand and basically have to tell the story of what happened to her relive it. That's got to be extremely tough when you're basically eye to eye in that courtroom with the guy who did that to you. And you got to give those people a lot of credit for being able to sit there and do

that because it's a big part of the state's case you know it is it always is to have someone like that who went through it who lived so that they can tell the story and she was a star witness because i think the police thought they had to arrest her and keep her in jail until she gave her testimony though i mean she made it very clear she planned on doing it anyway yeah and i think you saying they thought they had to. That's the perfect way to say it because I'm not saying what they did was right. I don't even think it was right, but it does show you how valuable they thought her testimony was, that they even thought they had to do that. Benjamin's murder trial started on February 7th, 1994. The prosecutor described him as a sadistic hate-filled predator who turned Highland Park

into his personal killing fields. The defense argued that the killings could be explained by his tragic childhood, which should be taken into account during deliberation. At one point during the opening statements, Benjamin interrupted his defense attorney to order a juror to wake up. Gibbs, he yelled out, excuse me, I would appreciate it if the young lady in the back row with the glasses would wake up. this is my life here. I guess this woman issued an apology and said that her eyes were closed because

they were burning, but she wasn't asleep. Throughout the trial, Benjamin's defense attorney tried to convince the jury that he was a product of his terrible childhood. He outlined his early life, abandoned at age two, raped at age 10, forced to live in the St. Francis home for boys, and kicked out by his brother in late 1990. His attorney said that testimony from doctors would show Benjamin developed mental illnesses because he never received any love or affection. He used a portion of his confession to show how he learned to associate pleasure and power from killing.

When a humside detective asked Benjamin why he killed the women, he told him, it's not all women I hate. it's the prostitutes. This is what they want. His defense attorney argued that the full confession, the childhood trauma, and his willingness to help find body should be taken into account for his sentencing. So obviously Gibbs, they can't contest the fact that he killed these women. Right.

His defense attorney is trying to mitigate his sentence by essentially explaining to the jury all the mitigating factors. Yeah, he had his terrible life and this and that, but now he's trying to help. So can you give him a lesser sentence? But the assistant prosecutor fired back by saying that Benjamin Atkins was so in touch with reality, he used a condom. He may be the first safe sex serial killer we've ever had. So you have the defense attorney with basically a strong emotional argument. you have the prosecution with a mountain of evidence,

Darlene's testimony, and all of these descriptions of the brutal ways in which Benjamin murdered women. On April 22nd, 1994, two juries found him guilty of all 11 murders. So this is strange, right? Two juries deliberating. Yeah.

The judge basically consolidated all of the trials, down to one. But he had two different juries deliberate separately. I don't know if I've ever seen that before in all the cases that we've covered. In fact, I know I haven't. There was one juror, Deborah Evans, who was unwilling to convict him. She wanted to find Benjamin guilty, but mentally ill. She didn't want to put him in prison forever after learning about his childhood. But another juror changed her mind. This man, told her rape is a violent act, not craziness. Murder is a violent act, not craziness. They were still human beings. They deserved to live. So this is interesting because to me, the dynamic in the jury

room is fascinating. Sure. Especially when you have one person who is holding out because you know you have all this pressure from the other jurors trying to convince this one juror that they should go their way, make it unanimous. Yeah. And in this case, they were able to do it. It's like that movie I watched. It was good. Which one was that? All those guys sitting around the table, deliberating. Twelve angry men? Yes. Oh, okay. Yeah. It was good. That is a good movie. But you see him start at the beginning with this verdict. And by then, of the movie, they've all flipped, you know, to the other side. And you watched the original, right?

I did. Yeah. The original is very good. At the time, this case was compared to a series of murders in Gainesville, Florida. Now, the Gainesville murders were much more widely publicized. And after the trial, the judge said, I can't help but conclude that the fact that these were poor African American women, addicted to crack cocaine with histories of prostitution made them different to people than five Caucasian college students.

It's inescapable to me, that disparity. When it comes to crime against poor folks in urban America, nobody in mainstream America really cares. The judge also called Darlene a hero. He said no one has ever been able to see her as a person. They see her as some crackhead hoe out on Woodward Avenue, unworthy of respect. Without her, more people may have lost their life.

I have the utmost respect for her. She is truly a hero. Okay, that's a, it's a great sentiment. Yeah. I do find it very strange that the judge used the phrase crackhead ho, but other than that, I mean, and it's all true. And it's things that you and I have talked about before. And actually, it's something that's being talked about even more in our

society right this very minute. Sure is. And obviously Gibbs are talking about Danny rolling, who we profiled earlier. Oh, yeah. A long time ago in an episode of T-CAD, but he's the person that committed the murders in Gainesville around this same time. On May 11th, 1994, Benjamin Atkins was sentenced to 11 life sentences. Vicki's mother, Gloria Beasley, set outside the courthouse, we've had enough killings in the city. The thing that bothered me most was the brutal way he killed. Going after girls that were tiny and small as though he was hunting defenseless girls. Benjamin's sentence was enough to put him in prison for decades.

But Gibbs, he only served three years and four months of his sentence. Benjamin Atkins died at Dwayne Waters Hospital on September 17th, 1997, from an infection caused by HIV. He was 29 years old. His death was kept somewhat secret until October of that year when appellate courts announced that challenging his multiple convictions was a moot point. The prosecutor at his trial said, while no one takes joy in another's death, even one who has committed such hideous crimes, at least those who lost loved ones at Mr. Atkins' hands, and

can take comfort in knowing he will never be released back into society. His defense attorney said that society made Benjamin a killer. No one is born that way. He warned that there are others like him walking around and no one willing to help them to prevent more violence. If there had been more resources available to struggling children back then, would Benjamin have turned out differently? And this is something we asked on the Patreon episode.

Was he truly born a killer or was he made that way because of his life circumstances? It's a question that gets asked in so many different cases. Yeah. I think you could argue it either way. I think you can too based on the fact that we've profiled so many killers who had great childhoods. Okay. Well, what caused them to kill?

Now in this one, you can argue that he built up a hatred for sex workers. He built up a hatred against women in general because of what his mom did to him. You can make all of those arguments and you can make arguments about mental illness. And I get all of those. But when it comes down to it, do we really ever know? I don't know how to ever answer the question. You can talk about all the circumstances that someone, has gone through and they may even say and a lot do this is what led up to me doing X.

Yeah. So you can either take them at their word or you can say, okay, I get it, but you just wanted to kill again. To me, the bottom line is how do you ever really truly know what is in someone's heart or what really drove them to do what they did? Because, you know, to be honest with you, I'm always a little bit leery about what killers say because they say a lot of things. They do say a lot of things. And they often flip-flop and they change and they contradict themselves.

But there's no doubt the guy had a horrible childhood. And I think most people would look at it and say that played a big factor in what he ultimately did. I think that's what most people would say. Yeah. And I understand that thinking completely. I do too. But that's it, Gibbs, for our case on Benjamin Atkins.

I thought it was interesting just, you know, number one, because I lived in Detroit for a time. So I'm very familiar with the Woodward Avenue area. But also, you know, the number of victims in such a short amount of time, you know, with the FBI calling him America's fastest serial kill. I did find that compelling. Yeah. I mean, that's 11 people in that short period of time. And as far as I know that it still stands today.

I don't think anyone, now we're talking about serial killing here. Not spree. Not spree, not mass, not any of those, because obviously there have been more people killed in shorter periods of time. As far as meeting the requirement

of being a serial killer, I think it still stands. We got some voicemails. You want to check those out? Let's hear them. Hello, hello. I hope that you are doing great. My name is Victoria.

I am from New Jersey. And I am a little bit behind on the podcast episodes, but I just wanted to tell you that I love so hard on episode 50 when you guys mentioned that people are actually fully listening to you guys. Well, I am one of those people. So by the way, I don't get any nightmares or anything. So I hope that doesn't make me derange. All right.

But anyway, thank you guys. And I admire, I enjoy every episode so far. And I admire the perfect miss that you guys have for like eloquence and the logic and the humor. And I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one. So keep up that it will work. Thank you so much. Bye. Jersey in the house.

Wow. that was very nice and and there are a lot of people that either follow sleep listening to us um Gibbs i met a uh a great couple down in uh at crime con talk to them a lot we actually need to do a um i promise we do a new reviewser in okay for for him he loves the reviews are in their patreon gotcha members but that's how they fall asleep that's like their nightly ritual Yeah. They put on an episode. And now a lot of people just let it run.

Right. And they'll sleep all the way through. Now, I think that's the first time anyone has called us eloquent. I don't know that anybody's ever more geared towards me. Yeah. I'm sure it is because your level of eloquence really shines through. It does. Hi.

This is the first call that I've made. My name is Mary Schaefer from Michigan. And I was just calling, I'm listening to episode 170. Shana Huber's, and I had to get a kick out of the neighbor talk. I have a neighbor that I've lived next to for seven years, and he, I've done the same thing. I've waived every single time I've seen him, and I finally gave up because the guy is just totally unsociable, and I've had the worst neighbors in the world over the years. So anyway, thank you.

You guys do a great job. You keep me laughing. Every time I listen to the stories, and they're always very well told. And I appreciate everything you do and all the time that you guys spend. Thank you and keep your own time taken. Well, again, appreciate the nice words. And it's bad when you have a bad neighbor. Oh, man.

You know, neighbors make a huge difference. I got a gentleman that moved in across the street from me. He came over a couple of days ago, introduced himself. We talked for like 45 minutes. Yeah. Cool guy, 70 years old, a widow, but just a really cool guy. Oh, the guy cuts the grass all the time. No, not the guy that messes up our recording.

But, you know, this goes back to my very, my next door neighbor. They no longer live there. But just, you know, when you wave repeatedly at people and they literally act like they don't see you and they're looking right at you. Tries me crazy. I live next to them for like 15, 16 years. I bet you I didn't talk to them more than twice. Yeah. And it's not for lack of trying.

And that's just, yeah, the dude cannot abide. Hi Mike and Gibby. Just thought I'd give you a shout out from here in South West France, I live near Bergerac. My name is Edward. And you can obviously tell I'm not actually French, but English, but being working here for the last 10 years. And I work as a gardener out here. And podcast, and I've started from the beginning. So I'm up to about 50 now. And I've also got the ones at the other end. So I'm catching up slowly. I'm just listening to the episode with Herbert Mullin. And I heard you mentioned Sandra Cruz, which is where my brother lives in the States. so I just want to give a shout out to him. And obviously, Ed Kemper from there, so I just want to make sure he's keeping his eyes and ears open. But I really love the podcast. Really enjoy it while I'm working away in the gardens, although it's 30 degrees here today or plus.

But anyway, entertain. I love the banner between you guys without diminishing the actual crimes themselves. So anyway, speak to you soon and get your own time ticket. Cheers. Bye. Well, that's fine, because I'm British and I'm here in this date. The only thing you can say is British, British. And then the rest of it just trails off into something completely different.

So gardening in France, man, that seems like the place to be. Now, he said it was 30 degrees. I'm not in on that. Celsius, so I don't know if that would be in Fahrenheit. I don't either because we don't deal in that. Like 60 degrees maybe? I don't know. He made it sound like it was cold.

So whatever it was, it was cold. Hi, Mike and Gibby. This is Audrey. Great show. I really enjoy listening to you guys. I listen to you every day on my commute to work. I think you guys do a really great job. You're about the only podcast I listen to. But I have a case for you that I thought would be very interesting. It's about Lisa M. Montgomery.

Apparently she killed a pregnant woman. And, yeah, thought you might look into that one. She's from Missouri, Skid Row, Missouri. I think you guys are great. Keep me going through the day. Something to listen to you when I am on my way to work. Keep your own time. Take it.

Keep up the great work. Bye. Well, thanks for calling in. Yeah, that's actually a pretty famous case, Lisa Montgomery, and it's been on the list. I'm not sure why we haven't done it yet, but it's pretty horrific. So I'm sure we'll cover it at some point. We had no mailbag this week, but the mystery of the, couple at CrimeCon.

They gave us all of that awesome stuff. T-shirts. There were so much stuff I didn't even mention it. Coffee, a book. That's been solved. Okay, good. They emailed in.

It was Jeremy and DeVesca Dvor. Well, thank you. So I wanted to give them a big shout out. And, you know, what cracked me up was we're in Austin. Right.

It's pretty warm. Yeah. DeVesca was wearing like a parka. And I remember calling it out because it was fairly warm. Yeah. And she was like, it was lined and had something in it. Like, I'm cold. Yeah.

Yeah. So I appreciate that because I felt bad. Yeah. He's like, I don't remember names very well. And then when I got home, there was nothing in the, with all the stuff that, you know, a card or anything that said their name on it. So mystery solved. Good.

All right, buddy. That's it for another episode of True Crime all the time. So for Mike and Gibby. Stay safe and keep your own time ticking.