True Crime All The Time - Donald Pee Wee Gaskins Part1

Episode Date: September 13, 2021

Donald “Pee Wee” Gaskins was a serial killer from Florence, South Carolina. If his confessions are true, he murdered 80-100 people throughout his lifetime. Reports vary about his childhood but, according to Gaskins, it was a pretty rough one. He started his life of crime at the age of 11 and went on to kidnap, rape, torture, and murder.Join Mike and Gibby as they discuss the infamous serial killer Pee Wee Gaskins. Gaskins used his nickname and his unassuming stature to his advantage. People underestimated him his entire life, which allowed him to hide his true nature- that of a sadistic killer. In Part 1 of 2 episodes on Gaskins, we’ll discuss his childhood, his life of crime before he became a killer, his first murder, and what Pee Wee called his “coastal kills.” You can help support the show at patreon.com/truecrimeallthetimeVisit the show's website at truecrimeallthetime.com for contact, merchandise, and donation informationAn Emash Digital productionSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Hello everyone and welcome to episode 250 of the True Crime All the Time podcast. I'm Mike Ferguson and with me as always is my partner in true crime Mike Gibson. How are you? I'm doing good, man. How about you? I'm doing great. I just can't get over 250. Well, I have no problem getting over 250 if I eat more food. I mean 250 episodes. Oh, okay. You know, you and I have really been trying to do a good job of shortening the intro. We have. To get to the story quicker, this one might be a little longer because I want to ruminate a little bit over 250 episodes. That's a lot of episodes. You know, we're also getting ready in a couple of months to come up on our five-year anniversary. We are.

So you think about that, right? 250 episodes, that's just on true crime all the time. Right. Add in unsolved, add in what I do with Morph on Criminology. It's a ton of episodes. It is. And five years. It seems like it's flown by.

Thank goodness. You and I having so much fun. Yes. I think it's a big accomplishment. I'm not trying to pat ourselves on the back, but I'll pat you on the back because you're a part of it. And I'm proud of what we've done. I'll pat you on your back too. No, don't touch me. Oh, you still have that. I have that phobia of people touching me.

Restraining order. Yeah, and a restraining order on you, which you're violating every time we record. Exactly. But, you know, we're proud of it. We hope other people like it. And I think we've been blessed to have been over the years able to amass the listenership. And you and I are very grateful. We are. We get the best listeners ever.

Yes. And so we want to pat everyone on the back. I do for that as well. We've got some Patreon shoutouts. Let's do those. We had Gretchen Schultz. Hey, Gretchen. Acacia Baton.

Oh, Acacia. Erica Walter jumped out at our highest level. What's going on, Erica? Lisa Gray. Hey, Lisa. Danica Degree jumped out of our highest level. De Nica. Teresa Aslan.

Hey, Teresa. Ray, Ray. What's going on? Ray Ray. Sarah Rodriguez jumped out of our highest level. Hey, Sarah. Cassidy White. Hey, appreciate that.

Cassidy. Joseph Tatmina jumped out of our highest level. What's up, Tatmina? Leah Smith. Hey, Leah. Melissa Larson jumped out of their highest level. Hey, Melissa. Michelle Wal Raven.

Wall Raven. I like that. Edith. Hey, Edith. Becky Thrift. What's up, Becky? Flores Homestead. jumped out at our highest level. What's going on for us? And last but not least,

Lois Galloway also jumped out at our highest level. Wow. Appreciate that Lois. And then if we go back into the vault Gibbs, this week we selected Lil Winchester. Well, thank you, Lil. So we appreciate the new support, the continued support. We had some great PayPal donations as well. Angelique wanted to wish her hubby, Carson de Krona. Happy birthday. Well, happy birthday. Happy birthday. Happy birthday. birthday and thank you angelique tallia milliner what's going on milliner Lauren Porter there's Lauren and Sue Lewis so we appreciate all that yeah thanks Sue Gibbs you and I just got done doing our weekly Patreon episode and we spent the bulk of it talking about 9-11 we did and the fact that 20 years has gone by yes since the attacks so you know if you're on patreon make sure you check it out if you're not

now's a great time to sign up we put something out every week we put some stuff out every month full blown episodes we're getting ready to hook gibby up to a lie detector test we are that's coming up in a few weeks you can tell from my voice i'm so excited about that it's on order i'm waiting for it so gibbs i did want to let everyone know that you and i have switched companies for true crime all the time unsolved now switching companies there's a lot involved with it i won't get into it, we thought maybe we'd be ready to put out the episode this Sunday. It doesn't look like we're going to be. So I'm putting it out on TCAC because a lot of people listen to both to help explain why there's no unsolved episode and why we didn't say that on the last unsolved episode.

It's really because we thought we would be ready to go. And we're just not. Yeah, makes sense to me. All right, Gibbs. Are you ready to get into this episode? of true crime all the time. Man, I am ready. For episode 250, we wanted to pick a bigger case, a more well-known killer. And this is someone who we have received countless requests to cover, really going all the way back to when we started the show. Pretty big name.

Yeah. We're talking about Donald Peewee Gaskins, a serial killer from Florence, South Carolina. Now, if you look at all of his confessions and if they are true, he murdered maybe as many as a hundred people throughout his lifetime. That's a pretty big number. That is a huge number. And it would put him in, I hate to say the word elite category, because it's not a good thing. It would put him up in a very notorious tier.

There you go. Maybe that's a better way to say it. you know Gibbs this was a guy who used his nickname peewee and his unassuming stature to his advantage really people underestimated him his entire life which allowed him to hide his true nature which was that he was a sadistic killer pee we kidnapped tortured raped possibly cannibalized and murdered his victims before dumping their bodies in snake and alligator infested swamps. You and I have done a number of cases where killers have made the decision to dispose of bodies, let's say, in a body of water or swamp that was known to be

infested by alligators. Okay, it's gruesome. When you think about what those alligators would do to a human body, it also makes the investigation into those murder. is very difficult. Oh, for sure. Yeah. In early childhood, pee we definitely showed signs of antisocial behavior. And as he got older,

he has said he felt urges. You know, these were urges that he couldn't resist. He has described them as a need for blood. Okay. Sounds like a frog demon to me. And we'll obviously get into it. Did you just touch your frog demon?

I did on the desk. I was like, there's the frog demon. Right. Right there. So in this part one of two of the Peewee Gaskins episodes, we'll talk about his childhood, his life of crime before he became a killer, his first murder, and what Peewee calls his coastal kills. That's how messed up this guy is, Gibbs. He has named certain segments of his murderous life. He's got categories. Yeah. And I just think,

it says something about him, but we'll get into it all. So Gibbs the state newspaper out of Columbia, South Carolina, they interviewed a man who had served a prison stint with Gaskins. Now, obviously, this was after peewee was apprehended for the final time, but they quoted this man as saying, if you put peewee out in a desert with a frog and a cactus, within a couple of weeks, he'd know something that the other needed and he'd get it for them. them. Truly, if he had been a legitimate businessman, he'd have been a genius. He also had the kind of personality that could sell Eskimo's snowballs if they were sitting on snowballs. But in conversations about certain things, things he'd been hurt by, you could feel the anger and venom coming out of him.

evidently, the venom found a direction when he got to the point of taking people's lives without blinking an eye. So I thought this was very telling. And it's kind of how I wanted to start this episode, even though timeline wise, this happens way later. Sure. But I think it gives you a lot of insight into Donald Peewee Gaskins. Because this is a man who shared a sell with him, spent a lot of time with him, probably knew him pretty well and was able to break him down. You know, I'm getting the used car salesman vibe, the very manipulative type of person vibe. conniving. Conniving.

You know, how many times do we talk about killers, really especially serial killers? A lot of them are not what you would consider to be book smart. Right. You know, there's exceptions, Bundy, obviously, and different people. But I think by and large, these are not people who were going to be adjunct professors at Harvard at any point in their lives. But the things that they did and what they learned that aided them in doing these really bad things that they did, it made them seem as though they were smart. They were crafty. They were very clever.

Yes. And arenas that most people don't realize. Yeah. Right. I mean, we know we've all known somebody who was extremely manipulative. Yes. You know, sometimes little kids pit one parent against the other. And but it sounds like from what this guy said about peewee, he was able to break people down,

figure out either what their weakness was or what they really wanted. and play off of that and then provide something to them that kind of then made them either let their guard down or feel obligated to him. That's a very valuable tool to have. It is. You're absolutely right. And then you have to make the decision. Am I using this tool for good or am I using it for evil?

Unfortunately, I think a lot of people make that decision with a number of things. Yes. So, you know, obviously we're going to talk. about Pee We's childhood. The problem I found with really his biography is that it's full of inconsistencies. No doubt there's a stark difference between what he claims happened to him and what some researchers, family members and other witnesses have said over the years. So I think what's best to do, Gibbs, is to present all the details we have and some of the different accounts of Donald's childhood.

University of South Carolina researchers wrote an article on his life because of the lack of research that was out there on Gaskins. They compared multiple biographical sources and they created a chart comparing different facts about his life. In the 1990s, Peewee co-authored a book titled Final Truth, and it contained some of the only published biographical information about him. That was until other researchers started writing books and articles after he died. Wilton Earl co-author of Final Truth posed the biography as the full truth.

But here's the problem. Peewee Gaskins was a notorious liar as many serial killers are. there's no doubt right when you're a master manipulator well what's a big component of that lying sure in many cases and they're so good at it because they believe their own lie at a certain point i think they do grow yeah to to believe that what they're telling is the truth or maybe they know it's not the truth but they're so sincere because they've done it time and time again and they just know how to pull that off. Carolina's stories reported that Donald was also allegedly paid for this book and at one point

told his family, hey, they wanted a juicy book. So I'm going to give them a juicy book. Well, there you go. You know, if that's true, then at that point he probably told some stories. Or at least embellished quite a bit. I think the point is that it's hard to know, as it is in many cases. when really the majority of what you have comes from the serial killer himself or herself, how much of it is true, how much of it is designed to get some sympathy.

Sometimes you just don't know. Right. I can tell you what I do know. Peewee Gaskins was a rapist, possibly a cannibal. He was definitely a serial killer who murdered at least eight people. Those are confirmed. But like I said, he confessed to his many. as 100 murders.

So where's that number really sit? Probably higher than eight. Somewhere, my guess would be somewhere between 8 and 100. Yeah. Now, that's a pretty big chasm. Sure. So either way, he's a notorious killer. Yes.

Even at 8. But let's say it was closer to 100. Again, that is putting him in a category where very few serial killers have ever been. his murders involved extreme violence and sexual sadism gives he killed multiple children and even a baby. I think with a lot of serial killer cases, people have asked a number of questions, right? Who was Donald Gaskins? How did he grow up? And what life choices led him to become a serial killer? It's often what we're trying to figure out. And I think what a lot of people listening are trying to figure out as they go through these stories with us.

Donald Gaskins was born on March 31st, 1933, in Prospect, South Carolina. His real name was actually junior parrot. He was born to a young unwed mother, Yuley Parrot, who was 26 years old. When Donald was born, Donald was underway and underdeveloped from birth, which earned him the nickname Peewee. and really probably Gibbs, I'll be calling him that more than I will Donald. He was raised by his mother and his grandparents, Lewis and Fannie Parrott. They were farmers who grew up in prospect.

Donald had five siblings and a pretty large extended family. Now, his siblings have tried pretty hard to keep their names out of the media. And I don't see any reason why we would need to really name them or drag their names through the I mean, I don't think you'd want your name out there anyway. No. No, I can't imagine what it's like for the sibling of a notorious serial killer. My guess is a lot of them maybe look at changing their names because who wants to be associated with a person like this, even if it's your brother, your sister, whoever it is,

it's got to be really tough on the entire family once all of the nasty details come out. Exactly. Yeah. Donald later said he had no problems with the 15 members of his family. They got along well. But other people have said things that bring the truth of the statement into question. Prospect is a small coastal farming community near the larger city of Florence, South Carolina. Donald's family owned their own plot of land.

But they also worked on a bigger farm to make more money. And I think that was pretty common. You know, I think that happened Gibbs with some of my family in Kentucky. Maybe some of your family as well. I don't know. Oh, for sure. No doubt his family was poor. And his mother did occasionally turn to sex work as a way to make money.

So I think right here is where accounts of Donald's childhood start to differ. He has claimed that his mother beat him. and sexually humiliated him throughout his childhood. He's gone as far Gibbs is to say that his mother sold him to some of her boyfriends, some of her clients for sexual abuse purposes. He was sexually abused by these men. Right. Now, he's also said that from his perspective as a child, he didn't think he was being abused,

but did acknowledge that his stepfather's, neglected and beat him. If this is true, this is very disturbing and brutal. It is. Is it going to make what he later does okay? No. Do you have to look at this and say, did it play a part in it? Yeah, I think you have to look at all the aspects of his childhood. Again, we're not going to know which ones are true or to what extent. Everything is true. But if you, you're telling me that your own mother sold you to men who sexually abused and sexually assaulted you, okay, that's rough. Yeah. No doubt about it. Certainly sets the stage for what's to come later in life. Donald's daughter Shirley participated in a documentary produced by the real

crime YouTube channel. She gave information about her father's early life. She told their producers, most of my family was good Christian people. The parrot family were considered decent, church-going, and hard-working people. And I think you see this in many cases, right? The killer says this. Other family members come out and say,

no, it didn't happen that way. Now, did it happen that way and these people didn't see it? Could have. Or does a killer embellish what happened to themselves during childhood, maybe to garner some sympathy. Again, this is where we don't know, but we have to give all the different details.

The one thing that almost everyone agrees on is that Peewee was a badly behaved child. His mother told Peewee's daughter, surely, that he was always doing something he wasn't supposed to be doing. So his uncles and grandparents always had to beat him because he wouldn't listen. I mean, that's what they did back then, right? If you don't listen to me, I'm going to have to get that Twitch. Switch. That switch.

I don't know where the Twitch is, but let's go with Switch, because that's what I got hit with. Exactly. But you're right. You know, that was, hey, I'm telling you what to do or what not to do, and then I'm going to give you to the count of three. You can either comply or you're going to get beat. Yeah. And in a lot of cases, that's how people did parent back then.

Those parents back then wouldn't understand what timeout means. No. No, there probably wasn't a lot of timeouts in this household. Now, the one thing that I did read was that his mother couldn't ever hit him. She just couldn't do it. But Donald did confirm over the years that his aunts and uncles hit him with switches if he made them angry. It's also been reported that Donald was spoiled as a child. And he got whatever he wanted because his family thought he was a cute little kid.

they just had a very hard time saying no to him. Okay. I can relate to that. I try to be a good parent. But I also worry that sometimes I cross the line into spoiling. Now, my kids are great kids. I think you would back that up. Do they get spoiled from time to time?

Yeah. I don't think there's any doubt about that. See, I thought you were going to go a little bit different with that story. I thought you were going to talk about how you were spoiled by your mom. Because I was an only child. Exactly. And you were spoiled. I was spoiled.

And I'll tell you why. So as an only child from a family of divorce, I think I was spoiled because I had two different sides kind of, I don't want to say vying. Because my mom and dad got along really well. Right. But it was two groups. So two Christmases, multiple sets of grandparents. So, yeah, in a way, I do think I was, I was spoiled. Well, I mean, let's not forget you were a charming kid.

Yeah. Again, you know, like Pee Wee was a good looking, cute kid, charming, manipulative, all that. Sums you up. But, you know, in seriousness, I think, you know, probably back then at an early age is where Pee We learned to use this to his advantage and really how to manipulate or play on others. Yeah, I mean, once you figure out how it works and how good it works, why wouldn't you want to continue it and reap the benefits of doing what he was doing? Well, I think you're making the point exactly. Once you find out that you can get what you want by doing things this way, and here's the

mechanics that I have to go through to make it happen, okay, why would you not want to try to get whatever it is you want? Now, kids try to manipulate their parents day in, day. out. But most parents say, hey, I know you're trying to manipulate me. Cut it out. Yeah. You can't have this toy. You're not getting a toy every time we go to a store or whatever it is. I always say, hey, you can't manipulate the manipulator. No, you were the kid laying in the aisle at Kmart, banging his fists on the ground face down. Yeah, kicking my feet. Yeah. While the blue light was going off. Exactly. So master manipulator, right? That's what you. That's what.

what he became. I don't know at what point, but obviously we know he started that at an early age. Now, I will say most people who knew him as a child have come out and said Gibbs that his claims of abuse are not true. And they've also said the real problem is that he was never disciplined and never had any boundaries. You've got to give kid boundaries. Yeah. Well, we've seen what happens when you don't, right? We've seen in some of the stories that we've profiled. What happens to kids? when there is no discipline, no boundaries. That's not good. Obviously, abuse is not good, but there's somewhere in the middle that is good parenting.

Sources agree that Donald had multiple stepfathers throughout his childhood. Donald never knew his real father, but he believed his father was a wealthy and esteemed farmer and store owner named Henry Gaskins. Henry was married and had children, but it's not known if he was really Donald's biological father. But this is the exact reason why Donald changed his name from parrot to Gaskins as an adult. So if you were Henry Gaskins, you're probably wondering why this peewee is taking your last name. Oh, especially if you're not his dad. Yeah.

Yeah, you would definitely be wondering why he's doing that. And then obviously later on, when everything comes out about him, you're like, that's horrible. Yeah. That my name is now associated with this vicious killer, especially if the guy wasn't his dad at all. Donald started to show signs of antisocial behavior in kindergarten. Yeah, that's early. It's early, but it happens. You know, he was bullied in school.

He was often physically assaulted by the bigger and older children. they taunted him, they bullied him, they called him peewee. You know, it's been said that he got in a fight almost every day. But I think the other thing that happened beginning around that same age, kindergarten age, was that he started torturing animals. Well, to the point that it got the attention of his teachers, which they made several reports about. Yeah, we've told a lot of stories, rough stories,

about the abuse of animals by some of these killers. You know, Donald was said to be fond of pulling the legs off of frogs. I read one report Gibbs where he would pull one leg off just to see how a frog would jump around without that leg. Yeah. That's sick. That's twisted. This is a kindergarten.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. This is at a very, very young age. he killed baby birds, he would snap their heads off. So again, this is some really, you know, sick stuff. It's also a very bad sign. Now, I will say this. I have received a number of emails from some listeners who said they had a compulsion.

That's what they called it, to torture animals when they were young. They're not proud of it. They're not happy about it. But they grew out of it. And they went on to love animals, lead a very productive life. So I think it's interesting when we get that type of feedback from people who are willing to be so open and honest because the torturing of animals is never good by anyone. Is it a sign of bad things to come?

It can be. There's no doubt about it. Does it mean that your son or daughter, whoever's going to turn out to be a killer? No, it doesn't mean that. It's not a good sign, though. All right, Gibbs, let's take a quick break to talk about growth. Did you know 70% of people say they want to use natural products, but only about 2% do? Why is that?

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Peewee's life of crime started when he was just about 11 years old. Before he ever committed a murder, his criminal record consisted of assault and battery, accessory after the fact, murder, interstate transportation of a motor vehicle, rape, carnal knowledge of a child, and multiple escape attempts. So, you know, he headed down that bad path very early on. And he just never got off of it, right? He never turned around. He never changed direction.

He just kind of went down that path. Yeah. He dropped out of school at the age of 11. Got a job at a local garage. It was at that garage that he joined up with two other young criminals, Danny and Marsh. They both had also dropped out of school early. The group called themselves the Trouble Trier. Okay.

I don't know if that's great advertising for your gang. You're kind of tipping your hand there. Yeah. That, hey, look at us because we're about ready to start some trouble. No, we didn't do anything wrong, officer. not this troubled trio gang. The trio spent the next couple of years, burglarizing homes and businesses,

and Gibbs, they sexually assaulted other boys. And when they did sexually assault boys, they threatened those boys with more violence if they told the police. They also stole cars so that they could drive around and hire sex workers. So a lot of stuff going on at a pretty young age. Yeah, I mean,

they're stealing cars, they're intimidating victims. They're hiring sex workers at like 11, 12, 13 years old. The Trouble trio broke up after the gang raped one of the members younger sisters. And there's no doubt that Donald had a big hand in it. You know, he was only 13 years old when he committed this act of extreme sexual violence. So basically what happened was they lured this little girl into their hideout. and they attacked her. The girl told her parents what happened

and, you know, all the boys' parents beat them until they bled. Again, things that, you know, most people don't do today, right? We don't beat our children until they bleed. But back then, that type of corporal punishment

was, I think, fairly common. Belt, switches, paddles at school, you and I have talked about that. And probably almost expected in a instance like this. Well, I mean, let's look at the gravity of the crime. Danny and Marsh left Florence, South Carolina, after this incident, but Donald stayed,

and he continued committing crimes alone. In May or June of 1946, when Pee Wee was just 13 years old, he attempted to murder a girl from school. There are differing reports here. She may have been one of his cousins, but this is unconfirmed. what she was not was one of his cousins. That much I know is true. I think we saw out to find out that's ever been confirmed.

No, I think the jury's out on that. Okay. But what happened was he broke into her home, but she caught him in the act. As he was loading up items that he was stealing from the house, Donald may have tried to distract her by making some sort of sexual advance. Remember, he's 13 years old.

Yeah. She resisted. he pushed her to the ground. When she got up, she attempted to hit him with an axe, but he was able to take it from her. And as he fled the scene, he hit her in the head and arm with the axe

and then threw her into a ditch. Well, Peewee thought she was dead. But she wasn't. But I think it shows you how vicious this attack was, right? You're striking a little girl repeatedly with an axe. You leave her in a dead. ditch you think she's dead. Okay, that's a pretty brutal attack. Yeah, for anybody, let alone a 13 year old

kid. But I mentioned it. She lived. Now, I think the only reason that she survived was because when she landed in this ditch, there was a small stream of water trickling through it. She drank the water and she was able to survive until someone finally found her. I don't know how long it took. I couldn't find that information, but she was able to identify Peewee. After she recovered, he was arrested and convicted of assault with a deadly weapon and intent to kill. Again, 13 years old. I cannot stress that enough. One thing that that really hit me kind of hard, Gibbs, was that allegedly when Peewee was in court standing in front of the judge. That was the first time he ever heard his real name Donald. I don't know if he told that story or if somebody else has. That's why I said allegedly.

But apparently before this, he only knew himself as junior or peewee parent. Well, he's probably standing in court that day going, who's Donald? I thought I was up next. Yeah, I just found that very interesting. Peewee received the. maximum sentence for his crime. And the court ordered him to live at the South Carolina Industrial School for boys until he was 21 years old. So what he did was awful. But again, he was only 13 years old. Right. We've seen some kids that young who have killed get some really long sentences. Now, he was sent to basically a reform school for a maximum of eight years. but this reform school was really more like a prison.

Right. You know, the boys there had to do a lot of farm work, all kinds of different types of hard labor. I know in your head, you're thinking, Cool Hand Luke, I know you are.

I absolutely am. Now, from my understanding, the reform school and the staff there, they weren't physically abusive. What they did was they made all the boys, you know, do this hard labor.

as punishment for their crimes. But that doesn't mean that there was not abuse that went on. Because Peewee claimed that on his second night at the industrial school, he was gang raped by 20 boys. If that's true, that is so brutal. Sounds like maybe like it was an initiation. Yeah, again, you really have to look at it and wonder how much of his claims are true. We know serial killers lie.

we know they brag, we know they manipulate the truth. Doesn't mean it didn't happen though. You know, he said that he basically had to perform sexual acts in exchange for protection from a kid who he called the boss boy. So this was probably an older kid, a bigger kid who was kind of the leader of the pack. Yeah. This boy apparently picked pee-wee out as his sweetheart. which essentially just meant that he was forced to do whatever this kid wanted him to do.

Peewey claimed that this kid traded him as a sexual object for cigarettes and other things around the school. And according to him, the abuse lasted four or five years. So again, that's brutal. Like you said, that's not right. That should have never happened. Now, he never should have done what he did. No, he shouldn't have.

either. And while he's in there, he does the same thing. He starts to abuse and sexually assault other kids younger than him. Well, now he claimed that he had to do that, right, in order to be respected by the other boys. But, you know, that's kind of hard to wrap your head around. If you're suffering so much abuse, you know what it's doing to you, how can he turn around and perpetrate that on other kids? Right. It seems like, it would be hard to do. Now, he's also claimed that in order to get respect, he attacked a larger boy with a hammer, hit him in the knee, and bit his ear off, which we call him Mike Tyson. We do. Again, you just don't know what's real, what's a story. It's tough to know. Peewee did escape

four times from the school. When he was 15 during one of his escapes, he joined a traveling carnival as a mechanic. We know how much our carnies love us. Yeah. So he became a corny, which my thought is especially back then, that was a good way to lay low. Yeah. You know, carnivals move around.

Were they all that particular, what your background was, what your real name was? Maybe not. Probably not. Pretty interesting, though, that he was a mechanic at age 15. Again, I don't know how much they checked into age. I don't know how much they checked into what claims you made. Yeah, I'm a mechanic until the tilted whirl goes flying off in the middle of Podunkville USA with, you know, 15 people on it.

That's true. I guess I used to wrong bolt and screws on that thing. I know you were really bummed when you got turned down to be the pixie dust spreader on the tiltle world. You're still kind of upset about that. Never really let that go? But it was at the age of 15 while he was traveling around with this carnival that Pee we married a 13 year old girl. The marriage didn't last long.

Somehow, at least the way Pee we tells the story, his fellow employees at the carnival talked him into finishing out his sentence. So obviously at a certain point, they must have known or maybe he even told them that he had escaped. He was on the run. They said, hey, man, you got to go back. finished this out and he did. On February 28, 1950, Pee Wee was due for release. The head of the Reform School wrote a letter to the superintendent of the California State Hospital. It read, Dear Dr. Odom, the subject was committed to this institution on June 18, 1946, by the court of General Sessions of Florence County under indictment for assault and battery

with intent to kill. He pled guilty to this charge and was sent here until he reaches the age of 21 years or until otherwise discharged by law. We are not attempting any diagnosis, but we are sure from our dealings with abnormal delinquents that this boy is antisocial and there is something in his past development that is preying on his mind. We are requesting psychiatric treatment and proper placement in view of the fact that we are unable to adjust this boy to a group. And so I know that's a lot. That's a mouthful. But I wanted to read that because basically you have the head of this reform school saying,

I think you need to reconsider. This boy's got a lot going on to set him free, to let him loose, may not be in the best interest of the general public. At the very least, this person. is asking for some psychiatric treatment, you know, placement in a proper facility. You think any of that happens? No. No, of course not. But boy, were they right. Oh, yeah. There's no doubt that this guy had peewee pegged. But of course, they had a lot of dealings with him over the, what, four or five years that he was there. Peewee was set free on his 18th birthday. And when he got out, he found out that his

his wife who he'd married while he was in the carnival. She had divorced him. She was already remarried. So he got married to a local girl whose name is really hard to find. I couldn't find it in any of the sources. But they didn't stay together long, Gibbs. And it didn't take long at all for Donald to return to a life of crime. Yeah.

How often we see this? People just don't get reformed. and they go back to their old ways of doing things, back to the life of crime. Yeah, I'm just not sure how much reform work was actually done. I'm not even sure how much of it happens today. I really don't know. But I do think a lot of these people, when they get out, they just don't know what else to do. I mean, Gibbs, this kid dropped out of school when he was 11 years old.

Right. He doesn't have hardly any schooling. Now, was he a mechanic? Could he have gotten a job at a service station or a body shop or something like that? Probably. But outside of that, what do they really teach him besides a lot of physical labor stuff? Yeah, I think, you know, he probably looked at it as I've done this before. I know it works.

I can get some money. This is what I'm going to do. And not to mention the fact that he's, you know, we'll probably talk about it, but he's got a frog demon that is, you know, churning up the. urges to do some really horrible things. Donald's defense attorney later on in his murder trial was a guy named Grady Quarry. Quarry spent 12 years with Pee Wee interviewing him for his book. Pee Wee serial killer or homicidal maniac, Volume 1 and 2. Now this guy described an adult peewee as intelligent, polite, and completely unremorseful. And we'll talk about it.

probably more in part two, but, you know, eventually Pee We admitted to and then attempted to justify every murder of which he was accused in the days leading up to his execution. But I think what was interesting about Query's book is it really kind of contributed to this reputation that Peewe got as the meanest man in South Carolina. He wrote that Donald was a true sociopath. The only rules he acknowledged were his own. And if you broke his rules, your life might be the price. Peewee was a killer apparently devoid of conscience.

I'll tell you right off the bat, to me, that describes so many people we've profiled. It really does. You know, your rules don't apply to me. I've got my own set of rules because your rules would keep me from doing it. what I want to do. And if you get in my way, I'll kill you. And I think the, the lack of empathy, the lack of conscience, it goes right with it. It's like flipping a switch. I'm controlling whether you live or die. And if I make the decision that you're going to die, it makes no difference to me. I'm going to go on with the rest of my day. Yeah. All right, but let's get back to Donald.

He's out of the reform school. His first job was a worker on a tobacco farm. Now, of course, he couldn't just do that. Right Gibbs, he had to try to make a little extra money by stealing tobacco and selling it. He also started another business scheme, which was burning down farms for insurance scammers. So I'm assuming people would pay him to burn down farms so that they could collect the insurance money. And it probably didn't take long, right? For the rumors to spread about his past criminal history and for some of these farmers to reach out to him and say, hey, we know you're willing to do. certain things, will you do this? So he got himself a partner and he began collaborating with local tobacco farmers to burn down their barns for money. Now, of course, Donald would get a little bit,

a cut of that money, but it didn't take long for people to start to suspect that peewee was the kind of the mastermind or the person that was committing all these fires. You have an abnormally large amount of barn fires in a very specific area. Right. You have a guy who is well known for being a prolific criminal. Well, who are you going to think right off the bat is responsible? Good old peewee. Good old pee we.

Just one year after his release from reform school, peewee was back to committing violent crime. In 1952 at the age of 19, he attempted to kill another girl. This teenage girl was the daughter of his employer. And I guess what came out was that she was teasing him about burning down barns. And at one point, she threatened to report him to the police. Well, that turned out to be the wrong thing to do.

Yeah, with a guy like peeway, right? Because obviously he doesn't want to get in trouble again. He doesn't want to go back to some type of facility, loses freedom. He attacked this girl with a hammer, split her skull. Now, she survived and Peewee earned himself a six-year sentence for attempted murder. He was a very vicious guy, you know, at this point in his life and even earlier. It seems as though he was maybe trying to kill these girls, but he didn't succeed, thankfully. But that meant what, Gibbs?

They were alive. to then tell police exactly what happened and he later ended up serving time. What have we seen with so many killers? You know, at a certain point, something goes off in their mind saying, I can't keep leaving people alive to turn me in. Right. I need to make sure I finish it. And I think we're going to see that with peewee as well.

Now, this portion of Peewey's timeline is a little bit unclear. and all the different sources. Really, the only references to this incident are from the Florence morning newspapers, published back in 1952. From the research Gibbs, it seems like Donald was sent to the local jail for this crime, and eventually he escaped and was out for over a week. Well, I think he was good at escaping. It sure seems like that.

He had some Bundy in him, right? Bundy was really good at escaping. but during his time on the run, he committed another heinous crime. This was on September 20th, 1952, when Peewee raped another 13-year-old girl. He was at his uncle Weldon Parrott's home. He borrowed his uncle's truck to go to his house to get lunch. And when he left, he invited several children with him, including this 13-year-old girl. He lured her into his house and then attempted to rape her.

but apparently he was surprised by his wife and fled in the truck. His uncle's truck was found abandoned at potato bed ferry in Marion County. So I'm assuming Gibbs he got married at some point again. Again, the sources on this are not great. You are talking about newspapers going back to the 1950. Yeah, it's going to be difficult. But Donald was on the run again. Yeah, for a number of days.

It was on September 26th that Farmer J.C. reported that his shotgun had been stolen. The police searched the surrounding woods and they found remains of a camp where they believed peewee slept the night before on the 27th. A heavily armed posse searched the woods and swamps for him, but they couldn't locate him. And the search team had to call it off when it got dark. Peewee was captured at the end of September and he was convicted of arson, assault with the deadly weapon and attempted murder. He was sentenced to nine years at the state pin in Columbia,

South Carolina. So I want to take a step back for a minute and just kind of look at his life up to this point. You know, bad childhood. If you go with some of the claims he's made, sure, maybe they're all true. Okay. Committed crimes from a very young age and really just never stopped. I mean, even the times he was locked up, he was. He was. committing crimes. He was sexually assaulting other young boys. Now, he claims he was being sexually assaulted himself, and maybe he was, gets let out. What's he do? Just goes right back into it. Yeah. Gets caught, escapes. As soon as he can, he is trying to sexually assault a very young girl. So to me, the word that comes up is incorrigible. No matter what you do, you're not going to, quote,

unquote fix this guy. No, he's always going to go back to what he knows and what he wants to do because I think that's important. Sure it is. You say knows and I do understand what you're saying. I think he wants to do these things. He has a compulsion to do these things and he just doesn't care about the consequences. I think there's a part of that.

And I think you can say that same thing about many, many different killers. So when you grow up and you get accustomed going to do. jail. The threat of going back to jail is just not that scary to these guys. Oh, yeah, that's a great point. The deterrent is not there. Right. The way it would be with me, you, most people listening, who in the hell wants to go to jail? Exactly. I think these guys, not that they want to go, but that their need to do whatever sick, twisted thing they want to do. Outweighs? Far outweighs. The consequence of going to jail because they've been there, done that. And they know they can do it

again if they have to. Yeah. I think the problem for peewee is even though he can do the time, time for him was rough in the reform school. The same thing basically happened to him at the state pin. You know, you have these kind of big guys. These guys are leading groups of people ruling the the gin pop, right? Violent, feared inmates. One of these guys, again, chose Donald as his sex object. I think because he was so small, he was viewed as weak and maybe even prey. I think you could use that word by these type of guys.

Well, that's only going to leave him one option. Yeah, I think at a certain point, he realized that he had to kill in order to protect himself. He didn't just want to be respected. He wanted to establish a fearsome reputation. So he approached a man named Hazel Brasel, who was one of the most powerful men in the prison, and he slid his throat while this guy was sitting on the toilet. Well, you know what? If you're going to get somebody in prison, that's the time to do it. On the can? Yep, or when they're sleeping. Well, you've heard that axiom. You've heard people say that. That. You've heard people say that. in movies or whatever.

You know, as soon as you get in there, you find the biggest guy and you go after him. That will get you some instant respect. Donald somehow claims self-defense. You know, I think when you jump a guy who's trying to do his business and you slit his throat,

is it self-defense right in that moment? It's pretty hard to argue that. Right. Was it self-defense from something that had been happening or was about to happen? Yeah, maybe, but he got six months in solitary confinement. But what he did work, because when he got out of solitary, he was considered kind of a power man in the prison, right? He took out a powerful guy.

Now he's viewed as a powerful guy. So this elevated peewee to the top ranks among the general population. From that point forward, no one really messed with him. Again, his life inside became much easier because he had some respect. Yeah. And it cost him, what, an additional three years to his sentence? Yeah, I think originally they added on six, but they later knocked it down to three, something like that. But yeah, three years.

He was able to use the fact that people underestimated him to his advantage. We talked about that, right? After this murder, prison psychologist who examined him. him determined that there was nothing wrong with peewee except for the fact that he was just plain mean i don't know if that's an official diagnosis but that's what they came up with right we're not finding any indications of mental illness we're not finding this we're not finding that this guy's just a mean sob and he wants to hurt people trying to think of the name of that movie where that guy's like you're just mean and you probably won't get this one because it's a

Oh, who would? You were really giving me a lot to work with here. You're just mean. You're just mean. I can see it. I'm sure you can. All right. I'm not going to get this one. So let's not drag it out. All right. I think we're going to have to call that an L and move on. So while Peeley was in prison, he made a number of successful prison escapes. Like you said, Gibbs, he was pretty good at escaping from prison. He really was. And one of the one of the ones. And one of the ones. And one of the ones. He was in one of the prison. He was. And one of the prison. He was. And one of the prison. And one of, he made a number of, he made. He made. He made. He made. He made. He was. He made of them he rode inside a trash barrel that ultimately transported him outside of the prison. That's like some damn Superman thing where Lex Luthor comes up with the plan. Right. But hey, it worked here. It did. Didn't take him long for police to find him at the Troub's old clubhouse. Of all places.

Of all places. That's where he went. So I said it, right, a number of prison escapes. During some of these, when he escaped, he camped out in the Florence woods, four months at a time. He drank boiled water from ditches. He ate rattlesnakes. If he couldn't hunt anything else, he basically was a survivalist. He was playing Survivor without the million dollar jackpot prize.

He sometimes used women for a place to stay, for sex, and for protection. Somehow over the years, Peewee married six women and had two. children that he was aware of, Shirley and Donald Jr. Six women. That's kind of a large number when you think about the fact that probably a lot of this time he's on the run from the law. Exactly. But still able to meet women.

Mark Jones, author of Palmetto Predators, Monsters Among Us, wrote, the number of times Gaskins escaped from authorities would be humorous, if not for the horrific consequences of him being a free man. And I get that, right? You could look at this hiding in a barrel and getting transported out of the prison is almost part of some type of comedy. The problem is we know when he's on the outside, he's doing really bad things. Exactly.

Yeah. So it would be humorous in a vacuum, but not when you know what the results are of him being outside. In 195, Peewee's wife divorced him for unknown reasons. Well, we don't know what they argues, but I think we can speculate. The guy was doing bad stuff. He was a convicted felon. At one point, he got married again. That marriage only lasted two weeks. After a second prison escape, he became involved with a woman named Betty Gates. Again, how's he meeting all these women? I don't know. He is a player. That's a perfect word for it. They traveled to Tennessee to bail out Betty's brother.

When Donald came back to their hotel room one day, he found out that the brother was actually Betty's husband, who had recently escaped from prison. And this turned out to be bad for Pee Wee because the police found them both, two convicts, and they both got sent back to prison. So maybe this explains why he's able to meet some of these women. Maybe.

He's not meeting him at church, right? Well, that's for sure. You know, they've got their own things going on. Donald was released in August, 1961. And he went back to Florence. He burglarized homes in his spare time. He worked with a traveling minister as a driver and assistant. So you would think, okay, he's trying to turn his life around.

Now, basically what this did was it made it easy for him to travel to different towns, to burglarize houses without getting caught. Well, you know, by the time they might have figured it out, he's gone. And are they really going to look that hard at a guy who's assisting a minister? Maybe not. By 1963, he was back in prison for raping a 12-year-old girl. And we have to talk about it. Why is he getting the chance?

Why are they letting him out so that he's able to continue raping very young girls? At a certain point, and I'll use it. use the word again, right? Incorrigible. Somebody in authority has to look at this guy, look at his track record, his criminal record, and say, maybe this is one person we don't want to let back out. Right. He needs to be a lifer.

On June 8th, 1964, during an arraignment, Donald escaped from a second story window of the courthouse. He basically used a makeshift rope that he fashioned out of a prison. mattress cover. Okay, Bundy Jr. Yeah, a little Bundy-esque. It snapped when he was pretty close to the ground, but he fell, he hurt his leg, but he managed to run for about a block. He stole a car, and he ran into the swamps to hide out. The sheriff's deputy sent bloodhounds to find him. And apparently while they waited for the bloodhounds to do their work, they took a nap in their car. Okay.

probably not perfect police work well they certainly got a surprise when they woke up they did they woke up to a message written on the back of the windshield that said peewee was here pretty embarrassing the next time you walk into the station i'm sure those guys were the uh but of a few jokes at that point the FBI got involved with the search and they added feloniously fleeing to his charges shouldn't that just be there all automatically you was think a felon who flees they got to get some kind of charge right right pee we was free from nine weeks and during this time he traveled to north carolina south carolina georgia florida georgia officers almost caught him but he ran a roadblock wrecked his car and again escaped in a swamp this guy was

really good in swamps he wasn't afraid of going into the swamps no which would not be me because there's a few things that I am deftly afraid of. Alligators being very near the top of that list. Alligators don't mess around. Oh, they just get down. They do. Yeah. They roll you and then they take you to the bottom.

Well, not for you, is it? I've seen the movies. I don't want none of it. And you don't like those poisonous snakes either. I don't like snakes. I don't like alligators. Donald fled to Columbia. And there he started a relationship with the seven,

year old girl. This girl eventually turned him in for statutory rape. So he was recaptured on August 14th, 1964. On August the 29th, he was transferred from Florence to Columbia to service sentence. He had charges for rape, escape, unlawful flight to avoid prosecution, interstate transportation of a stolen vehicle, and auto theft. So his trial took place in October 1964. He was convicted, sentenced to a whopping seven years in prison. For all that. For all of that, on top of this laundry list of criminal charges that he had racked up over the years. This is my whole point, Gibbs, from the 60s, the 70s, it was almost as if what you did before,

what you had been doing since 11 years old made no difference. And let's say 18, right? Let's say from the time he was an adult, it was like it didn't matter. We're not taking it into account. Again, the other thing I think it shows is how disgustingly little value they placed on the rape of women. That's very true.

And it's it's sickening, right? It's, it's disgusting to think that time after time, he's raping sometimes very young girls but even a 17 year old girl and he is getting not much more than a slap on the wrist seven years and he's what paroled after four yeah he only did four years and i think it was after this point that peewey gaskins made the decision that he was never going to go back to prison again now a lot of times you would think okay guys great. That means you're going to turn your life around. You're just going to go the straight and narrow. Not to him. He just said, I'm not going back to prison because I'm going to become a full-time serial

killer. Yeah. I'm not going to leave any witnesses behind. And again, that's something we see so often, right? At a certain point, these people figure out that the only way or maybe the best way to keep myself out of prison is to not leave any witnesses behind. So he's out of prison. And Peewee posed as a roofer. He occasionally fixed up stolen cars to resell. I think to a lot of people in prospect, it seemed like he was reformed. But obviously we know that's very far from the truth. In 1969, pee we began hunting for victims along South Carolina's coasts and these murders. would be what he would call his coastal kills. So he traveled up and down the roads picking up hitchhikers.

He tortured them and dumped their bodies in the marshes, making sure to weigh them down so that no one would ever find them. Now, Gibbs nobody would find out about his, what he called coastal kills until his arrest in 1975. Obviously, we're going to cover, you know, more of that in part two. Well, that's where the 80 to 100 people come into play, right? Yeah, I think at that point, he eventually confessed to his daughter, Shirley, that he murdered 80 and 90, maybe 100 people.

I guess she begged him not to tell her any of the details. She didn't want to know, but he said he had to get it off his chest. This is information that Peewee also told Wilton Earl, co-author of Final Truth. So Pee We liked to visit the local hardware stores, but he wasn't going there for any type of business purpose. He went there to pick out tools to torture his victims with. He claimed that he murdered somewhere between 10 and 12 hitchhikers each year. And in his confessions to Shirley, he said that every so often he would get the urge to

see blood. That's the way he put it. He called himself a vampire. And basically what he said was that every few weeks, he began to feel anxious. He got shaky. And the feelings wouldn't stop until he killed someone. So you and I talk about, you know, a frog demon. That's it, right?

Getting this urge, this compulsion, whatever it is that comes over a killer that says, I have to take a life. and it's almost as if it returns them back to kind of a resting state. But until they do that, they're all over the place. We've heard it many times. So, you know, obviously there's something to it. We don't understand it. Investigation discovery reported that Donald himself said that the aggravated and

bothersome feelings made him feel like he had to commit acts of violence. His first victim was a female hitchhiker from South Carolina. In 1969, he raped and tortured this woman until she died, then sunk her body in a swamp. He later wrote, all I could think about is how I could do anything I wanted to her. So right there, you're talking about control, power. And that's a pretty common theme among serial killers. allegedly Donald became angry. When this woman resisted his sexual advances, he beat her until she lost consciousness,

then raped and tortured her. So, Gives, we talked about the fact that he made the conscious decision to kill. And once he started, that was it. He began a pattern of picking up both male and female hitchhikers, torturing them and murdering them. He stabbed, strangled, suffocated. and shot his victims. He then mutilated the bodies. He may have cannibalized some of them. He castrated some of the male victims. I mean, this was a bad guy before any of this ever started. This is a

whole other level. Well, now he's a monster. Yes. Right. He is a monster who is just out there killing. You know, one of the things that is interesting to me is that he's picking both male and female victims. Sure. You know, a lot of times we see killers have an M.O. Where they, you know, they stick to one gender. It's not always the case, but you see it a lot of times. You know, it was almost as if he didn't care. He's just looking for someone to torture and kill.

Peewey said this process of rape, torture, and murder was his vision into how to satisfy these feelings he had and make them go away. Urges. Urges. Yeah. Yeah. Sick urges, twisted. You know, over time, he said that he learned how to torture people so that he could keep them alive for several days. And for him, he probably thought this was an art. I can keep these victims alive longer to even satisfy my urges even greater. Yeah, I don't doubt it. He probably viewed this as being successful, right? I've learned. I've grown. I've gotten better at it. He occasionally made his victims watch.

watch him eat their body parts or force them to eat their own body parts. Okay. I think about threw up in my mouth. Well, this is some Hannibal Lecter type stuff we're talking about here. Between 1969 and 1975, the police found the remains of men and women along the highways confirming at least some of these coastal kills. There aren't many specific details about them. because I think a lot of people believe Donald made up some of these really high numbers to get

attention from the media. But these coastal kills, as he called them, eventually led into what he called serious murders that began in November 1970. I mean, break that down for a minute. You're telling me these other things that we just talked about were not serious murders. There's more heinous, brutal, gruesome stuff to come? Well, I think he referred to these coastal killings as his recreational weekend fun.

Yeah. This was just like what he did on the weekend. Yeah. Like, you know, a lot of us play golf. You might go bowling. You might go sailing, fishing, whatever it is. He's going out on his coastal kills. Yeah.

I'm going to capture torture and then eventually kill somebody. That's my weekend, guys. But then he gets into what he called. these serious murders because I think in his mind Gibbs, Peewee had some serious debts to settle because, you know, these weren't going to be just random people, right? In these cases, he killed people he knew that he felt had wronged him, owed him money. It was different. It doesn't make it better. But to him, this wasn't just simple pleasure as some of the other murders had been or to control or satisfy, you know, whatever was welling up inside him. Right. He was

going to kill with a purpose. Yeah. Yeah. He had a purpose for these murders. And one of his first serious murder victims would be his own niece. So we'll get into that in part two as well as his other murders, how he was finally caught, his trial and his execution. But no doubt. I mean, this guy, was an absolute monster and we still have a lot to go yeah he made me throw up there towards the end thank you yeah and i had to witness that yeah and uh you're welcome i'm scarred now but that's it for our part one on peewee gaskins more gruesome stuff to come next week man we got some voicemails you want check those out let's hear him hi mich and gibby it's rebecca from iowa again i'm still door dashing and listening to your podcasts.

I was just calling because I had heard of somebody call in about asking to hear about the McMartin preschool case, and I still haven't heard anything about that. But I grew up in Southern California, so I grew up around the neighborhood where Richard Ramirez was at, so that was frightening. We all were scared about him at the time. But a big one that did scar me for a life was at McMartan. preschool case. It was crazy and there's a little kid growing up out there. Like, you're like, what? The grandma and my grandpa, what? So I was just wondering if you guys had enough information on

that. If you ever were going to do that, that would be cool. But you just mentioned about how there's certain cases we all hear as kids that really impacted us and that was one of them. But it's great to hear you guys. You guys are still awesome and I keep your head on a swivel and keep your own time ticking and I can't wait to hear next week. Okay, see you soon. Bye. She's so excited. She is happy. Love it.

So the McMartin preschool case is one that has always fascinated me. It's on the list. It's been on the list probably since we started the podcast. Again, sometimes I just kind of forget about things. I see something else that piques my interest. We'll definitely do it. There's no doubt in my mind that there's plenty of information out there. For sure.

It could even have to be more than one episode. because there's so many things to that case. Hey, Fergie, this is Matt from Memphis, Tennessee. And I am calling because I want you to cover the case of Holly Boba from Darden, Tennessee. And I would honestly also like you. I know you did it on criminology. I would like you to cover Ted Bundy with Gibby. Please.

You two guys are awesome. I love you guys. great. But yeah, Holly Boa from Darden, Tennessee and Ted Bundy, please. Yeah, both cases are definitely on the list. I mean, a lot of people want us to cover Bundy, but, you know, for me, Gibbs, there was so much that has come out about him lately with the Netflix movies and the different books and things. I don't know. I felt like, you know, obviously every podcast at some point does Bundy and we will definitely cover him. But I kind of kind of probably I'm putting some distance between all the stuff that's that's been on him lately.

Hey, Mike and Gibby. This is the first time for me. Even a voice. My name's Stephanie from South Carolina. Listen, you guys have an amazing podcast. I'm actually addicted. I constantly listen to while I'm at work. Don't tell anybody.

But I spread the word to people at work who love true crime and now they're obsessed and now we talk about which case is which. And sometimes when we're listening to the same when we look at each other and we're like, oh, boy. But anyway, I love you guys today, especially giving your laughter, your humor in between such the seriousness of the situation with these cases. It kind of makes it easier to listen to because some of these cases are just horrible to hear. But with your humor, it makes it all easier. But there is a case here in South Carolina. It's a bit solved and somewhat unsolved. The Heather Elvis case, as you know, she was taken by a former boyfriend and his wife, and they never found her body.

But both of them are in prison right now for her disappearance and possible murder. And maybe you guys can look into that case. It hit this area of Myrtle Beach really hard, and it was shocking and sad, especially for the Elvis family. I can't imagine what they're going through, not knowing where their daughter is. But, yeah, I'm Team Giddy all the way. Sorry, Mike. But, yeah. But anyway, love you guys.

You have a good one. Bye-bye. She says from South Carolina. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah. Hopefully she likes this one. Yes.

That we're doing right now. Definitely, we'll look into that for a future episode. And I can't believe we've got a team Gibby finally. Yeah, finally, because we hardly ever have any. Exactly. Hi, Mike. Hi, hi, Gibby. It's Edith's White from downtown Iowa again.

Just wanted to call and let you know that I'm not related. to William Allendod, and I'm so relieved about that. Well, keep up the good work, guys. Love the show. Just became a Patreon and love the extra content on the website. I didn't realize how much extra content there was. So once I get done binging true crime all the time, we're going to go to Unsoft Criminology and try to do the website too.

I'll talk to you guys later. keep safe and keep your own time picking. Bye. Awesome. I know she was really worried about that. Yeah. Being connected to Dot. So, you know,

she mentioned Patreon. We appreciate that support. There is a lot of content. There is. Out there. And a lot of people are surprised when they actually get on to find out how much stuff is there.

And when you're there, if you can find the little tiny cowboy hat and click on it. It takes you to the special Rex West page. It does. Oh, all right, buddy. We had one thing in the mailbag. Melody Builderback.

Sent us in a care package. She sent you some Twizzlers and playing cards. She sent me some dukes. So obviously she listens to the show. She knows what we like. And she also sent me a Harley Challenge coin. So we're in the money.

We are. Loving it. All right, buddy, that is it. For another episode of true crime all the time. So for Mike and Gibby, stay safe and keep your own time ticking. Did you just belch into the microphone? as the music was playing?

No. Yes, you did. I just heard it. You didn't hear it? I did hear it. There's no way. I kept my mouth closed. No, no, no.

See, I only have one of my ear. I guarantee it doesn't come with it. My headphones on one of my ears. I heard that. Did you really? I held it in, man. No, you did not. And I'm leaving this in.

I want people to go back, rewind 15, 30 seconds, listen to that music. see if you can hear Gibby suppress a belch, but do it unsuccessfully. It was like the JFK video. Yeah, back into the left. Yeah. Back into the left. They will, I don't know if they'll hear it.

I heard it. The music's pretty loud. So, but I wasn't listening to that. I was listening to you, be Gibby. Is that pizza that you force fed me? That's true. That could be it.