True Crime All The Time - Joel Guy Jr.

Episode Date: June 15, 2026

Joel Guy Jr murdered his parents just after Thanksgiving in 2016. The crime scene that was discovered was horrific, and like many killers, this guy was sloppy and left behind a wealth of evidence.Join Mike and Gibby as they discuss Joel Guy Jr. He was 28-years-old when he murdered his parents. He had never worked a day in his life, and his parents had financed almost 10 years' worth of his college education. But, they had decided enough was enough, and Joel Jr. just couldn't live without the money.You can help support the show at patreon.com/truecrimeallthetimeVisit the show's website at truecrimeallthetime.com for contact, merchandise, and donation informationAn Emash Digital productionSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You know, folks, making that decision to start a podcast or really any type of business, it's scary. It was for Gibby and I as well. What if no one listens? What if we make fools of ourselves? And it can be really hard to get over that doubt. But choosing to make that leap was one of the best decisions we've ever made. Another great decision was picking Shopify to help with our podcast merch.

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It's time to turn those what-ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at Shopify.com slash T-Cat. Go to Shopify.com slash T-Cat. That's Shopify.com slash T-C-A-T-T. Hey, everyone, it's Fergie here. I'm on vacation Gibby's on vacation He's in Greece

Probably eating a bunch of good food I'm heading to Jamaica For my daughter's wedding So I'm probably there right now But we didn't want to leave everybody hanging So we wanted to put out A true crime all the time An unsolved episode

This true crime all the time Is a Patreon episode I think we did all the way back in 2020 but at least you have something to listen to. And for 99% of you, you've never heard it. Speaking of that, if you're not signed up for Patreon, now is a great time. Enjoy the episode. Hello everyone and welcome to our 51st Patreon episode.

I'm Mike Ferguson and with me as always as I'm a partner in true crime. Mike Gibson, Gibby, how are you? Hey man, I'm doing okay. How about you? I'm doing well. You know, it seems strange to announce who we are to our page. Patreon folks. That's right.

We just should say what, uh, this is me and that's him. And you know who we are, but, exactly right. You know, I'm like, I have a routine. I know. If I don't do the routine, I get off track. That's why you won't let me do it in reverse because, you know, it's going to throw you off. Yes.

You've been asking to do that for some reason. I have no idea why. But, uh, you told me you can speak backwards, which I thought was strange. Sound like a record. Yeah. Kind of like my. for my delaxia or my dyslexia dyslexia I should say oh okay all right here we go right out of the gate so you and I are taping the Wednesday before Thanksgiving we are obviously this episode will come

out Saturday night so we can't I can't ask you how your Thanksgiving was because I don't know But I will say I'm excited. My daughter's home from college. And so, and it's just the four of us. We have a lot of family that's out traveling. It's going to make it nice. It is.

It's going to be really nice. Just the four of us. We don't get a lot of that. So whenever we do, I'm very happy. A little movie trivia night or game or something. Something. We don't know.

Yeah. We don't know. Maybe some hunt a killer. Ah, I got one of those upstairs. But I do want to wish everybody, a happy Thanksgiving, those of you who celebrate it. Yeah.

Let's go ahead and give our Patreon shoutouts. We had Nicole Munoz. Munoz. Morbid God. What's going on, Morbitt? Ayla. Hey, Ayla. Karen.

Karen, Karen. Molly Powell. Well, thank you, Molly. Tabitha Church Ward. What's going on, Tabitha? Natalie Pasteura. Oh, Pastera. Ryan Hope.

What's going on, Hope? Lisa Marie Hawkins. Hey, Lisa Marie. Georgia Penny. Hey, appreciate that penny. Michelle Bennett. Well, Bennett. Randy Zair.

Oh, it's almost not like some Randy Sayers, but Zairs, yeah. Who's Randy Sayers? Isn't that the famous football player? Am I way off. That's Gail Sayers. Close. It's his third cousin from his mom's side. Randy, Gale.

Yeah. What's the difference? Adam Reeves. What's going on, Reeves? Nicola Furlong. Hey, Nicola. Melanie Houghton. Hey, Melanie.

Martin's Julie. Well, thank you. Appreciate that, Martins. I always think like sometimes the names are backwards, and it could just be how somebody entered them in. Could be. To the Patreon system, but I don't know. May not be.

May it just be the first name. Could be. Kelly Geis. What's going on, Kelly? And last but not least, Kimberly DeBean. That's it. The bean? Yeah, I thought there was something to come after that, but that's it.

The bean. The bean. Then if we go back into the vault. This week we selected Kate Fleming. Thank you, Kate. Yeah, we appreciate all the support. We always do. It's amazing.

All right, Gibbs, are you ready to get into this Patreon episode? I'm ready. We're headed to Tennessee to talk about Joel Guy Jr. Yeah. This is a guy who murdered and dismembered his parents at Thanksgiving time in 2016. So like I said, this episode comes out a couple of days after Thanksgiving. So I feel okay with telling the story. I wouldn't want people listening to it, you know, right before Thanksgiving.

Yeah. You know, hopefully by the time you're hearing this, all the turkey's kind of cleaned up. Your family is gone. Yeah. They've left. And you can just listen to the story. You're just laying on the couch relaxing. Yeah.

Now, I will say it's a pretty brutal one. There's no doubt about that. Joel Guy Jr. was born on March 13th, 1988, to, Joel Sr. and Lisa guy. He had three sisters. I didn't find a whole lot about his childhood. This isn't really a childhood type story. Right. But some of the sources said that, you know, he had sisters. Some called them half sisters. It was kind of hard to tell. He graduated high school, went on to college. But unlike you Gibbs, you know, he wasn't earning his degrees at in record time. It's hard to do that, you know. Well, not everybody can be like you.

Absolutely not. Let's just get that out there right now. I was not like you. I was no Dugie Hauser. I will admit that. So this guy attended a few different colleges. And, you know, he spent like nine or ten years in college without really accomplishing what he wanted to do.

That's a long time. It is. But there's other people that go through that. Yeah, I was going to say it happens to people. Yeah. especially if you don't know what you want to do. Yeah, exactly. Right?

Going into college, number one, college can be tough for many, many people. It can be. And sometimes it's really hard to figure out, okay, what do I want to do? And you might try this. And you go down a path of maybe a whole year and decide, I don't like this at all. Right. So you switch. And I get four, five, six years.

Now, nine or ten, you know, you should be a plastic service. surgeon doctor. At one point, I think he was trying to be a plastic surgeon. Some people just like to be a full time, all the time student, you know? And I think, okay, that may have been him, you know, bounced around a little. But it's one of the things that caused tension in, in the household because Joel Sr. and Lisa, his mom and dad, they paid for his tuition, you know, the entire time. Oh, well, that could be a problem. I mean, look, I still don't know what I want to do when I grow up. Yeah. You'll figure it out. Yeah.

Someday. Yeah. Someday. I think you should be a spokesman maybe for AARP. That would be a good goal. I could be. You could be one right now. You don't need to wait.

That's true. I've already hit that. I've already went over that threshold. But, you know, as a guy who has one daughter getting ready to graduate from college. And another one who's going next year, okay, I can understand kind of the financial implications of a college. I understand the equation. Yeah.

You know, it's tough. You want to help your kids out, but daggone, man, you look at the bills of some of these colleges and you're like, who am I, Rockefeller? They think you are. They think I am. Yeah. But you do what you can, right? I think that's what every parent strives to do.

Okay. you can't pay for everything. Not everybody can. I get that. We try to help out as much as we can. Now, they were paying for the whole thing. What I understood,

everything I read, for nine or ten years. And there'll be more that comes out about the financial piece. Maybe this is the year. Maybe this is the year that he's going to. I'm sure every year they were thinking that. It came out later at trial that Joe Guy Jr.

he'd gotten into some legal trouble while he was at LSU. That's one of the colleges he went to. And his parents even took out a mortgage to help him out of this legal trouble. So, I mean, they were behind him 100%. They were, you know, trying to help him succeed, no doubt. But as Thanksgiving 2016 approached, you know, there was a lot going on in the guy family. Joel, Sr. was six year, one years old and had recently lost. his job at an engineering firm. I think he had a really good job. I think he was making,

you know, some good bank. We had to if he's foot that university bills. Yeah. And because he wasn't the only child. There were other, you know, kids involved, you know, in the mix, too. 55 year old Lisa worked at another engineering firm. She wasn't an engineer. I don't know the exact title of her job. My understanding was that she stayed home, uh, with the kids. And then once they got to be a certain age, you know, she went out and she got a job. But she was helping support the family as well.

I just know that there was a lot in the research about the fact that she didn't make as much as he did. Right. She wasn't a full-blown engineer. And I think he was. So, but the pair had been married for like 31 years. They had six grandchildren.

Wow. Big family. Well, those are expensive too. Kids are expensive. I don't have grand. children yet. Find me some wood, please. But I know they're expensive as well.

Can be. So what happened was the couple made the decision to sell their family home in West Knox County and try to retire to a home in, I think it was Rogersville, Tennessee. Okay. And this was a home, I think, that was in the family. Oh. Maybe had been left to them or something. Limited mortgage, probably.

Probably. maybe no mortgage. Yeah, that helps out when you lose your job that you don't have to worry about a mortgage. Well, especially if you're trying to retire. Yeah. Kind of hard to retire when you got a big ass mortgage payment. Exactly.

That's for sure. So, you know, this family had been in the home for years. So I think Gibbs, from what I read, everything I read, and what friends and family said, obviously later on, was that the couple was really looking forward, to this 2016 Thanksgiving. I mean, I always look forward to Thanksgiving, but this one, I think they were looking at it

as kind of a really big deal. The last one in the family house, with everybody together. Maybe the last time we're all going to be together. I don't know, but for sure, the last time we're all going to be together in this house. And that would be a big deal. It would be.

It's a lot of memories right there. Yeah, you think about the house that you raised, you know, all your kids in. man yeah i think about at some point selling this home and it's going to be tough i've lived here uh 20 years oh yeah so essentially both of my kids it's the only house they really have ever um known and i know it's rougher when you think about the six years i've been coming here it is all those memories that's really what holds you back uh i would be a trillionaire if i had all the money back that i've spent on your dinners for the last six years

I would pay. I would. I would. You say that after the meal has already been consumed. Yeah. I just don't, really honest, I don't know where my wallet is.

I had it at one point. It's never here. It's never with you. Yeah, might have left it on my kitchen counter. I think is, is the thing. Yeah.

So the other thing is the house was already up for sale. And I think it was already sold, actually. Just needed to close. Yeah. I hadn't, I don't think it had closed yet. So,

like we said, last Thanksgiving, you know, in this house, the kids were already, out of the house, they were living on their own. So Joel Guy Jr. was 28 years old at this point, unemployed, and living in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, where

he had attended Louisiana State University. Yeah. The sources were kind of all over the map. You know, some said that he dropped out in 2015. Later on, sources said that he was a student. at LSU. Some referred to him as a non-matriculating student. Matriculating.

And I don't know. Was he enrolled, but he wasn't take, I don't know. Yeah. He wasn't getting all that far is what it sounds like. Maybe he just enjoyed the campus life. Well,

who wouldn't? The campus life. If mom and dad are footing the bill and you don't have any financial responsibility. Yeah. really to speak of, who wouldn't want to stay in college, man? College is awesome. Yeah. I think there's been a few movies made about that.

About college? Yeah, about being in college for longer than the normal three to five years. Yeah, maybe, I mean, I'm thinking Animal House. Oh, for sure. I'm also thinking that what's that one where they, they don't actually go back to college per se, but they start the fraternity? Oh, yeah, yeah. What is that?

With Wolf Feral and all those guys. Yeah. Vince Vaughn. Vince Vaughn. It's a good movie. Old school. Old school. Yeah.

And Ryan Reynolds is one where he plays a long time. Van Wilder? Van Wilder. Sure. Yeah. So I mentioned this financial situation, right? There are a lot of sources that said Joel Sr., losing his job, and really kind of everything they had going on with that was a determining factor.

And Joel Sr. And Lisa coming to the conclusion. that they had to cut Joel Jr. off. Yeah. At a certain point, if you don't have the money, you can't do it. Yeah, I mean, you say, look, son, we're coming up on year 10. Yeah. We're going to have to let you go at this point.

Yeah. It's a very important part of the story. There were some reports that there were emails, maybe shown at trial. Yeah. They went back as far as maybe 2012, 2012, 2013, where Joel Sr. was emailing Joel Jr. and saying, hey, what's going on? We can't keep this situation going. But for whatever reason, they didn't cut it off. It went, you know, maybe three or four years after. Strange what you do for your kids when you know that you probably should stop doing whatever you're doing, but you continue doing it because they're your kids.

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And Chime card provided by Chime's bank partners for more information on APY rates. My pay, Spot Me, and Travel Perks, go to chime.com slash disclosures. Optional products and services may have fees or charging. so Joel Jr. drove up from Louisiana for Thanksgiving in his 2006 Hyundai Sonata, the same exact model that you drove over here today. It's amazing model, man. 2006. Yeah. Why get something new? Uh, his half sisters, I'm going to call him his sisters, because I'm really on the fence with that. It was, it was not apparent in the reporting. They drove in for Thanksgiving as well. This is going to be the whole family together. They're all there,

the La Casa. And from what the sisters would later tell investigators, Thanksgiving went off without a hitch. It went well. A good time was had by all. It wasn't like that movie with Holly Hunter and the guy played a little circle on his chest. Robert Downey Jr. I have not seen a movie with Robert Downey Jr. and... Was that movie in Marvel with the whole... Oh, I've seen Iron Man. Iron Man, yeah. I don't...

I've never seen a movie with Robert Downey Jr. and Holly Hunter. Oh, yeah, it's called... It's a Thanksgiving movie. It's called It's a Thanksgiving movie. That's what they named it. It's a Thanksgiving movie. Home for the holidays, I think. Maybe I'm wrong.

That sounds like a Christmas movie. No, it's a Thanksgiving-only movie. It's hilarious. It's hilarious, man. I've never seen it. I've never even heard of it. Yeah, if you've never seen it, you've got to watch. I will watch it.

Yeah. When I watch the incredible Mr. Limpit. Oh, this is, this is, well, I don't know if it's better. Now you're in a, a real conundrum. It's a tough one. No, you're having to catch it out. It's a real Sophie's choice you got going on there. So the big thing, right?

They have the dinner. Yeah. Everything is fine. That's good. Good time had by all. Yeah. And even the sisters would later say. Everybody was normal.

Everybody ate, had their stretchy pants on. They were happy. And, but they all left, right? The sisters, they all left after Thanksgiving while Joel Jr. stayed behind for the weekend. The Knoxville News Sentinel reported that according to Knox County Sheriff's Office Major Michael McLean, sometime between Friday night and midday Saturday, they believe that Joel Jr. attacked his parents with a knife, possibly tortured them,

and dismembered their bodies, leaving remains in various rooms of this 2,300 square foot home. He said that the door was left unlocked, and they believed, right at this time, as the reporting was coming out, that it was Joel Jr. And he drove back to Louisiana.

Let me think. How could I stay in college a little bit longer? Oh, I don't know. let me take this knife and murder my parents. That's going to let me stay in college. Yeah, we're going to have to get into that. And, you know, this wasn't really a long drawn-out investigation. It didn't take long at all for the authorities to link Joel Guy Jr. to the murders. The Knoxville New Sentinel reported that Knox County Sheriff's Detective Jeremy McCord went to the guy home after they received a report from Lisa Guy's employer that said,

She didn't show up for work after Thanksgiving, the Monday after Thanksgiving. That's a concern. Yeah. And I think they got blown off at first. I read in one paper that they weren't happy, that police weren't taking it seriously, because she had some kind of big time meeting that she would have never missed on Monday. No doubt she would have been there. So they ended up calling or going up the chain and getting somebody that would take them

seriously. And that led to this Jeremy McCord guy going out to the home. And he said the for sale sign was still in the yard when he got there around noon on Monday. So still, you know, everything happening very quickly. Thursday is Thanksgiving. Yeah. They believe the murders happened Friday, Saturday.

Obviously, nobody knows until Monday that anything's wrong because she doesn't show for work. McCord later testified that he could feel heat emanating from a doorway and he caught a whiff of chemicals in the air. Not good. Potentially not good. But yeah, I would say probably never good. Yeah. I have a real sensitive nose. So I don't, my wife likes to burn a lot of candles. Yeah. dry and she has these plug-in sense things that spray oh missed every now and then oh my gosh

and if she puts it in a room that's too small yeah she put one in the laundry room a couple of weeks ago and I thought I was going to have an attack oh it was an attack on my senses yeah to walk through the garage just make this place smell good yeah I mean it does milk it up there by the way

it's like a cinnamon I get it fiscity field right now I get it. Yeah. My wife's already got the Christmas decorations out. Yeah, I've seen that.

Sometimes it's too much. Yeah. Sometimes it's too much. But what I didn't see was my present. But go ahead. No, no, you won't see that.

Yeah. Especially now, maybe no. This guy also said that he saw grocery spilled on the floor in the foyer. He later said in court that he was afraid something bad had happened to the guys. And so he didn't want to wait for a warrant. and obviously you can get into that whole thing of probable cause or you know you see something that allows you to not have to get a warrant when he searched the home he found what was an

unimaginable scene he said there was blood everywhere it was on the carpet it was up all the walls Gibbs he found lisa guy's severed head in a pot of boiling liquid on the stove. He found Joel Guy Senior's severed hands on the floor of the bedroom. And he found both of the couple's severed torsos in plastic containers in the bathroom. Wow. A lot of anger. Well, yes, on the part of the person who did it. Yeah. Absolutely. I also think it's kind of a tough day to be this police officer. Really tough. It's going to be hard to, not recall that again and again and again. Yeah, you're going to have to live with that.

He also stated that he saw scissors and clothing that appeared to have been cut from a body as well as a large knife. He saw bottles of peroxide, bleach, acid, and rubbing alcohol. He said he could smell the stench of death mixed with these chemicals. If you want to vomit. It does, but it's really painting a picture. Sure is. Yeah.

You know, the smell. You're finding. a head, boiling on the stove, severed, you know, hands, torsos, rough day. Extremely. For this individual who, you know, was the first on the scene and found everything. Major Michael McLean told the Knoxville New Sentinel that Joel placed pieces of the bodies in an acid-based solution in an attempt to destroy evidence.

Okay. He said that the solution that he used was composed of normal household chemicals and didn't require any special knowledge of chemistry. The type of stuff that you could buy straight off the internet. Well, can't you get off the internet? Well, yes, that's true. It's a little scary, I think. It's really scary. And that's not, we're not even talking about the dark web.

I don't fully understand the dark web. Oh, yeah. But only explained by what I've seen in movies and stuff. but it sounds like you can get just about anything you want. You can. Off there. Yeah. I don't even think he's talking about that.

I just think he's talking about Amazon. You can go on on Amazon, buy all these chemicals, put them together and. Definitely surprising what you can get off of that site. Well, but they're not made for that. No, no, no. Obviously, they have real intended purposes. But if you know how to use certain things or look up on, yeah, you can Google all just about anything, right?

Yep. That's a scary thing. information is great. Right. The ability that we have, right? The information at our fingertips is great. The problem is if you have someone who's intent on doing something bad, they can get that information that they need pretty quickly.

Exactly. You know, how to make a pipe bomb. I'm sure it's out there. I've never looked for it. Yeah. It's out there. Okay. I will take your word for it.

But, you know, the, the, the, the, the, well, What was the bombs they used in Columbine with the pressure cookers? Pressure cookers? Pressure cooker bomb. Boston Marathon, too. Yes, that type of stuff scares me that it's all out there. But, you know, it's kind of the price that you pay for having the information, the good type of information. Right.

You're going to have to live with that. Freedom of information. Being out there as well. The Knoxville News Sentinel reported that Lisa and Joel Guy Senior were last seen alive on Friday. when they moved a boat to a relative's house. So this is the day after Thanksgiving, the house is sold. They haven't transferred ownership yet.

They're still moving some stuff out, right? I did talk about the house already being sold. They're planning on moving. Apparently the new owners, the people that bought the house, they showed up while the forensics team was processing, removing evidence.

Can you imagine? No. Wow. You know, I again, I have no idea who bought this home. Right. It could have been their dream home, right? They're, they're moving from this or their first home. I don't know. But when you find out that not only were two people, not only did two people die. You are there. Because that to me would be something to process. Sure. We're talking about they were murdered. And not only that, they were dismembered. Yeah. In a very gruesome fashion. And found in different parts of the house. Yeah. Not one central area, but unfortunately scattered about. I think we got to figure out how to back out of this sale.

Right. And we'll find something else. Yeah. Because I'll never use that oven. No. Again. The stove. The bathtub.

We'll find out a lot of places were used for things that you would never want to have to think about again. Enough bleach in the world. Especially every time you used it. Or every time you stepped foot in that house. I just, I just wouldn't want to be in that house anymore. No, no, no, absolutely. I can't imagine anybody would. You know, folks, it's summertime. And that changes how I get dressed. You know, I want pieces that are breathable, easy, but still make me look put together. And that's why I just keep coming back to Quince. You know, Quince has high quality pieces that feel and look amazing. And the prices, are unbelievable. Everything at Quince is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. This is because

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That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com slash T-CATT for free shipping and 365-day returns, quince.com slash T-Cat. So I said it didn't take long, right, to link Jr. to the murders. by that Tuesday, the day after his mom didn't show up for work, he was arrested outside of his apartment by Knox County Sheriff's Officers. So they went down to Louisiana. That's where he was living. They were joined by members of the East Baton Rouge Paris Sheriff's Office, the FBI Andy Swatting. They had full force ready to go.

Well, they weren't messing around. No. Now, when he was arrested, it was not. noted that he had wounds to his hands. And we'll talk about those. Well, let's talk about them now. Basically what prosecutors later said at trial was that these wounds were slices.

Yeah. That he suffered to his hands while he was struggling with his dad. Because his dad just wasn't going to give up. No, and there was a lot in the information about the fact that his dad was bigger than him. Yeah. You know, his dad was not a guy that he was just going to overpower. Yeah. You know.

Oh, so you probably had to take him by surprise or some type of force. I'll tell you what, Gibbs. I don't care, you know, 55, 60 years old. Some guys just have strength. Yeah. And maybe a 28-year-old poses no shot at overpowering them. Now it can work the other way. They can easily.

Because we lose. muscle mass as we as we get older and all of that stuff. But I've known some guys in their 50s, even into their 60s who were, I call it Farmstrong. Right. Because of where we live. Sure. Yeah.

A lot of guys that I played basketball with when I was young, 40s, 50s and 60s, they would show up at open gym to play with this. Right. And these guys, their hands were like vices. If they got a hold of the ball, there was nothing you could do. because they worked in concrete. They worked laying bricks or they worked on the farm, bailing hay or whatever it was.

I can crack a walnut between my middle finger and my index finger. Okay, I thought you were going to go somewhere else with that. I can pick up a cord now. I thought you were going to go in a completely different direction. So how does one find out that they can crack a walnut between two fingers that shouldn't be used to crack a wall? I just did one day. I wanted to see if I could do it. All right.

So you got some digit strength is what you're telling me. Yeah. So Joel Guy Jr. was charged with two counts of first degree murder. This happened in 2016. But his trial didn't begin until late 2020. And this delay in large part seemed to center around a bunch of challenges by his public defenders on evidence searches.

We'll get into a little bit of what the, those were, but they challenged everything, right? The search of his stuff at the house where the murders occurred. He said, well, he wasn't a resident. So they didn't have any right to do it. They challenged the searches in Louisiana at his apartment. It was a battle that dragged on for years. And then obviously, once it finally got settled,

they could move forward with the trial. But, you know, even before that, prosecution came out and said that they would not seek the death penalty, even though a lot of outlets reported that guy wanted it. He asked for it. He did. We've heard that before. Yeah, sure. I don't understand it other than I think there are people who just say, I don't want to spend the rest of my life in prison. He was 28 years old. So, you know, it's a long time to spend in prison the rest of your life at that age. It is. At that age. It is.

So a jury of five men and seven women would decide his fate. It was reported by the Knoxville Sentinel that this was one of the first trials and definitely one of the most serious ones to be held in Tennessee since the pandemic started in earlier in March. Okay. So, you know, we're in that time frame, right? 2020. How many cases have we talked about where trials got pushed back, got pushed back?

Apparently, you know, he had tried to delay the trial citing his concerns about the pandemic. I'm sure he was really worried about COVID. Especially since he wanted to die. So why would you care? But okay. We know. Yeah. We know what he was trying to do.

And I'm not making light of COVID at all or the pandemic. But we know what this guy was trying to do. So one of his sisters came out against the delay. And according to the Tennessean, she appeared by video link in court from her classroom. She was a teacher. Yeah. And she told the judge, Judge Soard, that she was back to work. Her children were attending school despite the pandemic.

She said, the world is continuing. Why shouldn't the trial continue? Good point. Y'all are affecting the lives of other people. Yeah. I mean, it is a good point. I understand there were definitely precautions put in place, but the judge ultimately denied his request for a delay.

So authorities laid out their theory before the trial even started. And basically it was simple, right? They said that Lisa and Guy Senior told Joel Jr. That they were going to cut him off financially. And so he decided to kill them and try to get money from their deaths. Because he really thought that one through. that was going to work out in his favor. That's pure greed, right?

Right. I mean, we know he's not the, I was going to start to say, you know, he's really not the smartest guy. I was going to say that because he hasn't, he doesn't really ever finish anything. Yeah, it was said that he was competent. I saw one word used that academically he was competent. He wasn't the head of his class. He wasn't an overachiever or anything like that.

But obviously he graduated high school. school and went to college and and did that stuff. I called them floaters. He was a floater. He was a floater. He was just going to float through life as long as he could. Oh, I definitely think it by the end of this, that will become apparent. Yeah. Yeah. There's no doubt about that. So just before the trial was set to start, he essentially fired his attorneys and he made a motion to represent himself. Oh. Which I know you always love. Yeah. You get a kick out of that. That goes so well. And so they, they, went back and forth on that, but it came out in the end that he really only wanted to represent himself on one issue. And it was this motion to force the state to execute him if he was found

guilty. Okay. He really wanted to die if he was found guilty. Yeah, please don't make me stay in jail prison for a lifetime. For a lifetime. So from what I understood is the public defenders wouldn't file it. And so that's what he had the beef with. But once the judge kind of talked to him about it and they came to this understanding that that was really the only thing he was worried about, the judge said, okay. When it gets to that point, you can represent yourself and file your own motion. And so he allowed the public defenders to defend him. Yeah. And his trial, and his defense attorneys didn't make a bunch of motions, basically to try to, to keep people from testifying his some of his sisters.

Yeah, I'm sure it wasn't going to be good for him. No, no, because, and we'll talk about it maybe when we get to trial, but they're going to say some of the things that we've already said. Their parents were going to cut him off. Yeah. And some things like that. He also tried to keep out of evidence, a recording of a jail phone call between himself. and a guy named Michael McCracken. I don't really know who Michael McCracken is.

The papers didn't say, you know, what relationship the two had. But on this, he supposedly admitted to the murders. I guess he can't see that sign about the phones that says. Never. This call is being recorded. Yeah, never. People never see it.

They never think about it. So I said that authorities originally came out and said that he decided to murder his parents after they said that they were going to cut him off. When they got time for trial, though, prosecutors presented evidence that Joel Guy Jr. had a notebook in his backpack, which kind of detailed out how to commit the murders.

And he had it at the time that they all ate Thanksgiving dinner. Oh, so like they're eating dinner. He's over just like taking little notes. And they're like, He's studying for his test. I don't think he was writing in the journal. I just think he had it with him.

But what that means, right? Once that revelation comes out, it means that he had already made the decision to kill. Now, maybe he knew. Premeditated. Yeah. Oh, we're going to talk about premeditation a lot. Yeah. But maybe he already knew that his parents were thinking about cutting him off.

His dad for sure had brought it up before. But later at trial, prosecutors told jurors that Joel Guy Jr. began to plan the murders as early as November 7. Oh, weeks. Weeks. Weeks. Yeah. Weeks before Thanksgiving.

But I want to talk about this notebook, right? It was introduced at trial. It was a huge piece of evidence. And I want to read just some of the entries from just one page of it. It's a little lengthy, but it sheds so much light. And, you know, all the papers mentioned that the prosecutors, it just kept bringing this notebook up. They called it a book of premeditation is basically what they called it in court.

So these are just bullet points that he had written down. Right. Minimize things I touch throughout visit, wear gloves and socks to prevent fingerprints and footprints, drop something down the garbage disposal to break it. Get him on the ground. Kill him with the knife. Clean up the mess from him before she gets. gets home. Kill her with knife. Take dog with you. Place her in the shower. Turn on hot water to get rid of

forensics. Remove her clothes and take with me. Place him in plastic bin and use it to get him into the upstairs bathroom. Cut off his arm and plant his flesh under her fingernails. Place her hand with his DNA so that his DNA is not washed away by the shower. White-downed killroom set her phone to send me a text message on Sunday to prove that I was in Baton Rouge when she was still alive. So again, these are just some of the ones. I just cherry picked out some of the entries that he had in, that he had in there.

Disturbing. Oh, very disturbing. I mean, according to the USA Today, there were five pages. of this stuff in this notebook. The entries were very detailed and covered every little precise detail on how to commit the murders, how to dismember the bodies,

how to dissolve them, and even how much he would profit from his parents' life insurance policies. Of course. He did his homework. Yeah, he did. Yeah. It's a scary thing.

there were even balance sheets that kind of showed his parents' assets and life insurance policies. The Knoxville New Sentinel reported that Lisa's insurance policy was structured so that her son and her husband would split the proceeds if she died first. If her husband died first, then he would get it all. There you go. So, you know, when I read that, it does kind of make more sense that maybe these three sisters were half sisters. were half-sisters belonging to his dad. Right.

And that he was his mother's only biological child. Right. When you read the structure of the life insurance policy, that does make, that does make some sense. But I just read, you know, these things, right? It's kind of a to-do list. You and I talked last week about people who make to-do lists and like to check them off. I think there's a couple of things that,

you definitely see here. One is premeditation. I think that that's a no-brainer. If you're a killer and you want to leave evidence of premeditation, just do what this guy did. Just write down in notebook every single thing that you plan to do. And save it. And save it. The other thing you see is, is just how callous that this guy was. Extremely. I mean, as I was kind of reading those, you know, I'm, I'm, we always talk about the question. How could someone do something like this, like what we just talked about to their, a parent, their parents. How could you even sit down and write this stuff out?

Yeah, three weeks ahead of time. Thinking that I'm going to carry these acts out against my parents. Yeah. It's just, it's just so callous. And the way, the way that he wrote it was, you know, kill her. Yeah. Do this to him. Very cold.

Very, very cold. And, you know, one thing that I really found interesting is that it came out in court that investigators found this backpack at his parents' house after the murders in the room where he was sleeping. So here's the part that, well, besides murdering his parents, I just could not understand. When you think about this notebook, five detailed pages. Yeah. This guy went through all of the trouble and planning to write down all of these entries

to follow in a notebook. And you said, okay, write it all down. Yeah. Save it. Then after he commits the murders, he leaves the backpack with the notebook inside. Why? Doesn't make any sense. Does not.

Right? There were even entries about burning down the house to get rid of evidence, which we know he didn't do. Right. Now, prosecutors would later assert that the only reason he didn't follow his own entries was because of the injuries to his hand. From his dad. Right.

He somehow got sliced in this tussle with his dad. And they thought that that was the reason why he couldn't follow through on, you know, all of the things that he had in his notebook. It was also reported during the trial that, while he was in jail, you know, he's a waiting trial, he tried to collect on the life insurance. Really? Yeah. He wrote to the life insurance company, I hereby assert the continuing validity of my claims to the insurance proceeds totaling $696,66,66.6.6.6. Plus, applicable interest. So not only is he trying to get the money, he wants interest on top of that.

Yeah. Wow. Okay. While he's on trial waiting to go on trial for the murders. And, you know, I guess he spent a lot of time corresponding with this life insurance. And it actually turned in, I didn't go into it in detail, but it actually turned into kind of a courtroom battle as well, with the insurance company saying, well, we know we got to pay someone. Right. But we don't want to pay him. And what he would say is that until I'm a convicted murderer, that rule doesn't kick in. So you should pay me. Yeah. And it was a back and forth. And I mean, they never did, but he kept pressing it and pressing it. Yeah. Well, scary. So, you know, when you, you know, we're not going to get real in depth with the trial. But suffice to say, it was pretty hard for him to get out from

under this notebook, right? It was very detailed. Yeah. Not only gave the reasons for the murder, but also how it was to be committed. And, um, most of the, the paper said that his defense team,

they didn't ask a lot of questions. They didn't really present evidence. Yeah. I don't know what they could have done. Yeah, it didn't look good for him from the get go. So what are you going to do to, the, right. I don't think you want to give them anything more than they already have. And you could risk that by going too far with your.

Well, my, my kind of thought was you're probably not going to ask too many questions of these witnesses because you don't want to hear what they have to say. Exactly. None of the questions or none of the answers, I should say, are probably going to paint your defendant in a good light. Now,

you can be crafty in the questions, but you also, you have some people who can be rolled. crafty with their answers. Exactly. So I kind of get it. I think they were they were in a tough spot. Oh, for sure. No doubt about it. Prosecutors told the jury that Joel Guy senior sustained 42 wounds, Lisa sustained 31. And we talked about it, right? This was a very gruesome scene that jurors had to hear about. And you know that the prosecution had to lay it all out there. Every single nasty detail for his family to hear.

Well, yeah. I mean, but I think also you want to paint this guy truly as the monster he is. Oh, absolutely. This is the time to do it. So as much as you would really hate for these jurors to have to kind of see all these pictures and hear all the details, you kind of got to do it. This is your one opportunity to put the cases forward the best as you can. Yeah.

And you want them to see. him as the absolute monster that he was. His sister testified against him, as did some other people. Like I said, we're not going to go into a lot of detail about the trial. I wanted this episode to be a little bit shorter just because it's Thanksgiving week. Yeah. I got four things to edit. Right. But I also thought this was a very fascinating case. It is. But again, I want to go back to the the notebook, right? Such a huge piece of evidence. Basically, what the prosecutors did with it is they would read entries out of the notebook and then they would tie evidence that they had to the entry. Right. So one would be like get sledgehammer crushed bones. Well, they found a sledgehammer at the scene.

Yeah. So pretty easy to tie those two together. Another red get. Get. killing knives. They found the knives at the scene. Everything was lining up. Yeah. And, and, you know, just like leaving the notebook, it seems to me as though he followed some of the instructions that he had written down, but he didn't really follow any of the instructions regarding cleaning up, disposing of clothes. Get rid of the notebook. Get rid of the notebook. Get rid of the notebook. Disposing of the bodies, you know, and you kind of have to think about okay, why was that? Was it as the prosecutors asserted that, okay, he got his hands cut up and he just couldn't do certain

things? Or was it that he got to a certain point in this whole nastiness and just was like, I can't do this anymore. Right. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know that he, he's ever said anything about it. He didn't take the stand.

So it's a possibility, though. I thought maybe it was because he would have sustained those cuts before he did some of the nasty things that he did. So he was able to to use his hands at that point. So I wasn't sure about that. The Knoxville New Sentinel reported that prosecutors Sanchez and Nassios told jurors in their closing arguments that the guys were planning to retire and they were planning to quit paying their son's bills. Joel Guy Jr. was then 28 years old, had never held a job and had been taking college courses for a decade.

Wow. By that point. Sure. Yeah. You know, they're trying to hammer home. The reason why him being cut off would be devastating to him. The guys wanted to retire and they deserve to retire.

The motive is pretty apparent in this case. It's money. Half a million dollars in life insurance. proceeds. That's what this case is about. They brought up that date, November 7th, as the date when he decided to kill his parents. And they backed it up by, you know, telling and showing the jury that's when he started going out to, um, different stores and buying knives, chemicals. Yeah. Plastic sheeting. All the stuff that Dexter would have bought would have bought would have had on him all the things that this guy would have needed to carry out his plan. And they obviously had done all

the research and investigation by this point. They had the receipts. They, they could tie him to all of the stuff. And that's really how they came up with the November 7th date. You don't go out to buy all the stuff that you eventually use in a murder if you're not already planning on, you know, doing something, pretty bad. It was definitely true. Now, Speaking of Dexter, I think anybody who has watched that show kind of knows that Dexter went out of his way, right? He might buy plastic sheeting here. Yeah.

He's going to buy something else in a much different place at a different time. Yeah. That's why Dexter was Dexter. Yeah, part of the reason why maybe he got away with it as long as he did. Right. I also think about Breaking Bad. You know, Walt kind of did the same thing. He did.

He wouldn't buy all of his supplies at one store. So he didn't have a big shopping cart full of everything that he needed to make the meth. He'd buy a little, you know, he'd buy one thing here and one thing over here. Not to sit off any radars. Yeah. Guy Jr.'s public defenders, like I said, they really presented no evidence on his behalf.

Joel Jr. didn't take the stand. I already said that. Really, all his defense team tried to do was to call into question. any forensic testing until the jury that this wasn't a man set on committing two murders. And they tried to back that up by saying, you know, he was happy at Thanksgiving. Even his sisters said he was happy at Thanksgiving. Yeah, but they don't know. What was he thinking before he got there, right?

Yeah. Those weeks that added up to Thanksgiving. Well, also, if your plan is to wait for everybody, you know, a lot of the family to leave. Yeah. And you're planning on doing this the next day, the day after. Are you going to sit there and be sullen and nasty? No.

No, you're going to put on your happy face, which is actually what the prosecutors came back and said. Sure. You know, he put on an act because that's what he wanted his sisters to think. Hey, he's doing good. He's happy. He's in a good place. They got his sisters to leave.

I think they were going to leave anyway. Yeah, but they got them not to think or. you know, question what's going on with Joel Jr. Right. No, he seemed, he seemed fine. Even normal. We're not worried about him.

But really, you know, when it comes back to the defense, what could they do with this kind of mountain of evidence against them? Attack the science, the testing, which defense attorneys always try to do. And then use the old, the old, use his own sister's testimony kind of against him.

Yeah. in saying that he seemed fine at Thanksgiving. Oh, well, then he couldn't be a murderer. Yeah. But we know that's not true. That's not true. Exactly right. His trial only lasted four days, pretty short.

It is short. After three hours of deliberation on Friday, October 2nd, 2020, the jury found him guilty of two counts of first degree murder, three counts of felony murder, and two counts of abuse of a corpse. Judge Sword imposed an automatic life sentence with the possibility of parole after 51 years for each of the murder convictions. Okay. We already knew he wasn't going to get the death penalty. Right.

They weren't even going after that. But they didn't rule at the time or the judge didn't rule at the time whether these sentences were going to be consecutive or concurrent. That's a big deal. It is a big deal. Right. Concurrent. There's still a life sentence. you're still not coming up for parole for 51 years. Yeah.

He's going to be, what, 79 years old? Yes. No, no, I'm sorry. Because by, no, well, it goes back. It goes back. It goes back. So 79 years old, 80 years, whatever, give or take. So basically what the judge said was that he was going to have a hearing later on to

determine it. That hearing, um, as reported by the Knoxville New Sentinel, was held on November 19th. And at the hearing, the judge ruled that the life sentence sentences were to be served one after another. Okay. So two life sentences? Yeah. But to me, the parole. Right.

Is the big deal. Yeah. Right? Because now does that mean you're not eligible for 102 years? So I look at it. Because it's not concurrent. It's consecutive. Right.

Either way, it doesn't seem as though this guy will probably barring some type of. of appeal or something happening. I just don't think he'll ever get out. No, I don't think so. And I don't think he should get out. You know, I would have been okay if they would have gone after him for the death penalty, if he would have, you know, ultimately been executed. I would have been okay with that. I'm totally fine with a life sentence. What I would not want is for this individual to really ever reenter society. Ever. No, he shouldn't. You know, the judge also tacked on an additional four years for abusing a corpse, but he really chastised this guy. He called the crime pure evil overkill. That sounds like something you would say. I would. Because you do like to talk about overkill.

I say it a lot. The judge said, this is the most extreme abuse of a corpse case I've seen in 25 years. And I hope it's the most serious that I'll see in my career. It was bad. I don't know how many judges have seen that type of stuff. Yeah, I wouldn't want to see those photos,

those videos of the crime scene, none of that. I mean, judges see a lot of really bad stuff. They do. We always talk about juries. We don't really talk about judges. judges that much because it's kind of their job. But I think it's got to be rough on them to see so much carnage and death and just bad people

doing bad things. He also said, I don't see potential for rehabilitation of Mr. Guy. I was watching him during the trial. He showed absolutely no remorse or despair over seeing what he had done. quite frankly, Mr. Guy, you look like you're kind of proud of what you've accomplished. And I thought that was a very interesting statement by the judge. Sure. You know, if you think about it, the judge is kind of watching the defendant.

Yeah, you're observing for sure. Observing everything that's going on throughout the trial. And at the end of it, he's basically saying, you know, hey, sit, we sat here for four days. I've watched you, and not just the four days, because they had a lot of other hearings and things. Yeah. He's saying you're a POS. You've been a POS.

You'll always be a POS. Yeah. There's, you know, whatever rehabilitation efforts there might be in prison, they're not going to work for you. No. This is essentially what the judge is saying. Or he doesn't believe they were. Helpless calls.

Incorrigible. Incorrigible? What it? Includgeable. What? That's what it sounded like to me. Who said what? I don't know.

Where what? Who's on first? Incorrigible. Yeah, he just basically came out and say it. But, you know, we've heard that as well. The no remorse thing we hear all the time. Sure, we do. Especially with serial killers, because I don't think there is any remorse.

Most likely, in a lot of them, there's no empathy. No. Speaking of empathy, I'm watching the patient. Yeah. Yeah. With my wife. Yeah. And we're almost done. We're like, I think we just finished episode eight. There's 10 episodes. And he talks a lot about empathy. Yeah. And that, you know, that young guy, he was really good actor. He does a really good job of kind of portraying what I think kind of a serial killer or a lot of serial killers are life. Right. You know, it's like he doesn't understand what someone else is going through or, or, and doesn't care. Care. Does not care. And you can see it.

This actor does a pretty good job. Yeah. Um, I recommend it if, you know, I'm, I'm seeing the whole thing. So I don't know how it's going to end. And it's good. Well, that doesn't give it away. Well, that doesn't give it away. It means it's a good ending.

Doesn't mean it's, now you're giving more way. Now it's a good ending. It's a bad ending. I don't know. It's an ending. Don't give anything. No.

But I, I, I really, I think he does a pretty good job of kind of putting it out there of what, at least I think a lot of killers would be like in real life. He's a little obsessive compulsive. He is. You see him every now and then like straightening things up and I'm not giving anything away. But yeah, yeah, I got it. But that's it, man. That's it for our episode on Joel Guy Jr.

I just found it to be such a, such a waste. Oh, for sure. You know, on all fronts. Sounds like this guy kind of just wasted his life. He was aimless. You called him a floater. Yeah. His parents gave him so much. Well, the opportunity. They were paying for him to try to make something out of his life. And for whatever reason, he never seemed to quite get there. And then at the first inkling that, okay, they're not going to help me anymore instead of, you know, putting on his big boy pants and saying, all right, I got to get a job. If I want to go to school,

I got to get a job, pay for myself, maybe take out some loans, do whatever I got to do. No, he went as some people do this route of what's the easiest way. Yeah, let me take a shortcut. Yeah. Where's what's the shortcut so that I can get my hands on a bunch of money? The sad thing is the shortcut involves killing your parents, these people that have been behind you your whole life. Right. And that's your first thought. It's unbelievable to me. It is.

But like you said, all this stuff happens. It's, to me, it's just a nightmare that it happened the way it happened. Yeah. You know, just. And it was like the judge said going on about how's one of the worst case he's ever seen. I mean, dismembering your. mom and dad and that on the pot on the oven oh just just nasty stuff happy Thanksgiving happy Thanksgiving but that's why I wanted to do it once Thanksgiving was over yeah you noticed I didn't

put it out last Saturday right yeah I don't want people thinking about that as they were you know kind of going in for the turkey now you and I have to because we're taping the day for Thanksgiving but that's just on us just watch out when you reheat your leftovers exactly but that's That's it. We love you. We do. We appreciate everything you do for us. We'll be back next Saturday with, um, with our normal weekly sneak previews. Yeah. And then I think the Patreon episode next month, it's probably going to come out early. Okay. I think because we're trying to take a vacation. Yeah. Trying to take a week off. So may try to get it done early. I get to go with you now. No, you do not. You just said we. We as in separately, we are taking,

a week off and you keep you know changing it up I can barely afford this vacation as it is man I definitely cannot afford to fly your ass all the way to Orlando and and pay for your park tickets and all that you take care of all that I'll get my own breakfast actually that's that's saying something because I don't know when the last time you were at Disney yeah but the food is outrageously expensive the hotel we're at or is there going to be free competition Oh, well, let me rethink that. No, this is not the Holiday Inn Express or the Clarion that you stay at all the time. Let me just get a little box of cereal, some milk.

On business. It's not one of those business hotels. That's a problem. Now, every meal is going to be $8 million. Yeah. Well, that's because the pancakes have to look like a certain, you know, personality at the park. That we can't name for trademarking for anything. All right.

We will talk to you next week. See you. Bye. Thank you.