True Crime All The Time - Thomas Meek

Episode Date: December 5, 2022

14-year-old Sonja Sanj went missing in June 1980. Nine months later, a man named Thomas Meek called the police to report that his step-brother Sean Ethington killed her, but Sean Ethington would testify that Thomas was the real killer. Join Mike and Gibby as they discuss Thomas Meek. The murder of Sonja Sanj was horrific, and it devastated her family. Police ended up with two men in custody. But, each one pointed the finger at the other. The case became murky, and it was up to a jury to decide who the real killer was.You can help support the show at patreon.com/truecrimeallthetimeVisit the show's website at truecrimeallthetime.com for contact, merchandise, and donation informationAn Emash Digital productionSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

everyone and welcome to episode 312 of the true crime all of the time podcast i'm mike ferguson and with me as always is my partner in true crime mike gibson gipy how are you hey i'm doing okay man how about you i am hanging in there yeah it's kind of what you have to do here in ohio when it turns dark at like three 30 now right you know it just seems so strange for it to get dark as quickly as it does plus you're a wildcat fan so you got to hang in there i got to hang in there man uh let's go ahead and give our Patreon shoutouts. We had Eileen Messina. What's going on, Messina. D.D. Pete's. What up, Pete's. Kimberly jumped out at our highest level. Hey, thank you, Kimberly. John Engler. What's going on, John? Radio Ranch Camp. Ah, Ranch Camp. Abigail.

Todd, Todd, Todd. Tadke Alston jumped out at our highest level. You're awesome, Tamika. Rose Smith. Hey, Rose. Sheila. Isn't that a print song or something? Yeah. Hey, hey, Sheila. No. No. There was Sheila E. E. Was she involved in something? I don't know. Hey, Sheila. Yeah, you're right. That's the song.

Yeah. I got it. It wasn't hey, hey, hey, hey, paula. Maybe. All right. Aiden Arnett. What's going on, Hartnett? Garrison Schaefer.

Hey, Garrison. Carrie Wyatt. Hey, there's wilderp family. You say wilderp? Wow. Yeah. All right. Moa Moore, Berg jumped out of our highest level.

Man, Moberg in the house. Paul. Hey, Paul. Cassandra. I appreciate that Cassandra. Christian Shook. Hey, Christian. Ryan Nellums.

What's going on, Nellum? And Kelsey. Good old Kelsey. And then if we go back into the vault, this week we selected Anna. Well, I'm glad you're still with us, Anna. Exactly. We appreciate all the support. We had a big donation for a happy birthday to Stefan from Jacqueline.

Well, happy birthday, Stefan. Yeah, absolutely. We had donation from Sherry Roar. Hey, Sherry. And Alana Zimel. Well, I appreciate that, Alana. Yeah, thank you to everyone. It means a lot to us.

Gibbs right now on True Crime All the Time Unsolved. We have an episode out where we're talking about two missing boys. Yeah. Christopher Dansby and Shane Walker. Yeah, this takes place in Harlem, New York. And it's a very interesting unsolved case. So look forward to having you all jump over and listen to it. Yeah, definitely check it out.

All right, buddy, are you ready to get into this episode of True Crime all the time? I'm ready. We are talking about Thomas Meek. But we start the story with 14-year-old Sonia son, who went missing in June of 1980. Nine months later, a man named Thomas Meek called the police to report that his stepbrother, Sean Ethington, killed her. But Sean would later testify that Thomas was the real killer. So a little bit of, he did it.

No, no, no, he did it. He said, he said. Yeah. And we'll find out probably not too hard to figure out since we named the episode, Thomas Meek, who the killer really is. Exactly. Sonia San was a 14-year-old girl from Boca Raton, Florida. Her parents were Stacca and Settamir son. Settamir was born in what was back then Yugoslavia and he immigrated to the U.S. with his wife Staka. They lived in Long Island, New York. The couple had two daughters, Sonia and her younger sister, Helen. Sonia was a ballet dancer and performed with a Russian theater troupe in

in New York. That's impressive. I would say so because the Russians are kind of known for their ballet. Yeah. And so I imagine this was kind of a high level ballet theater. True. I wonder if I could do ballet. No, no.

I'll answer that for you. I might be able to do that since I found out that I'm 98% Irish or whatever. I can probably do that river dance. Oh, I'm sure you could do that, Lord of the Dance or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we'll start practicing. The family moved to Boca Raton at the beginning of 1980,

set a mirror son, sold his glass and mirror business in New York, and he opened the new glasswork shop in Florida. And it was said Gibbs that the family wanted to move to Boca Raton because they wanted to live in a safer place. Well, people do that a lot. They do. You also hear in a lot of true crime stories, documentaries, things like people saying, well, we moved here.

because we thought it was safe. Yeah. And then obviously some type of tragedy happens. I think it just shows you these types of things that we talk about, they can happen anywhere. Right. They can. It doesn't matter, you know, what state it's in. Location, right?

Location doesn't matter. Bad things can happen to people anywhere. Yeah, they really can. So they were excited to start this new life in Florida. Sonia enrolled at Boca Raton High School. Her parents became concerned. though, when her behavior started changing. Her father told the Boca Raton news,

she started hanging around with bad people. In Queens, she always got good grades in school, even went to ballet school. She would never have run away from home in Queens. This town made her run. You bet I feel bad that we came to Boca Raton. So, I mean, that's a pretty strong indictment. It is.

Of the town in which they moved to, Sonia San Juan went missing in the early hours of June 30th, 1980. On June 29, she left home after dinner to go out to the movies. And she promised her family that she would be home before midnight. When she didn't come home, at first her parents were upset, right? She had missed her curfew. I think that would be natural for any parent. Oh, of course.

But then at some point, that anger kind of morphs into worry. Concern. And then when she hadn't come home by the next morning, well, then they're really concerned. That's when they called the police. Sonia was declared a missing person on June 30th. The police sent out a bulletin to their patrol officers with her description. One officer told Sonia's parents that she was probably with her friends, but months passed without any leads. And you and I talked about this on our Patreon episode that, you know, we watched a lot of true crime. documentaries and things like that. I forget which one I was watching, but it really talked about how, you know, in prior decades, police kind of had this thing that when people would go missing, it was very natural to say, well, he or she probably ran away. Sure. Or they're probably just somewhere with friends, no need to worry. Yeah. They're really kind of nonchalant about it. They were, right? And, and, and, previous years, a lot of that has changed for the better.

Thankfully, but you're right. I remember hearing the story about the guy that started Equus, the search with animals, with horses. Yeah, Equal Search. Yeah. Ted, I can't remember his last name, but he started this because his daughter. Actually, I think that might have been the one I was watching. The killing fields? The killing fields. Yeah. So that was the one I was watching. and I think they were really talking about that. Yeah. Talking it up. When you hear that, it's so disappointing to think that's how it was back then.

And that was back in the 70s and into the 80s, I think, where they were talking about that time frame. Here we're talking about 1980, but months passed without any leads. So, you know, I think at that point, when you get a little bit down the line, and for me, it wouldn't take long to know that, you know, my daughter's not just out messing around with her friends. Something wrong has happened. Yeah, because we would have heard from her by now. Yes. And if to say maybe she missed being in New York so much that she found a way to take a bus back up there to be with her friends, again, you would have heard something by now.

Something would have come out. On March 12th, 1981, almost nine months after Sonia went missing, a skeleton was found in a wooded area west of the town center mall in Boca Raton. And isn't that, that's interesting because we just covered some things that happened at the Boka Town Center Mall a few episodes back. We absolutely did. These remains were partially covered with logs and brush. A lock had found at the scene was determined to have belonged to Sonia Son. Palm Beach County Sheriff's Detective Tom Neighbors told the Boca Raton news that they received a phone

call from an informant on March 12th. And it was this caller who helped them find the body. So they hadn't been able to locate her on the. their own, but now someone calls in with a tip, with information. I know the police love good Samaritans. Well, I think pretty quickly they determined that this was not a good Samaritan. Because on March 29th, 1981, Los Angeles County Sheriff's deputies arrested 16-year-old Sean Duane Ethington and charged him with Sonia's murder.

Sean was a former student at Boca Raton High School. He was living with his father in Lennox, California. Sean Ethington was charged with first-degree murder and was held without bond. He pleaded not guilty on April 8, 1981. So Sean was scheduled to go to trial on August 3rd, 1981, but the assistant state attorney asked for an extension because they couldn't locate their only eyewitness. And the witness in question was Thomas Gilbert Meek. And this was the man who called the sheriff's office and provided the tip that directed, them to Sonia's body. It also just happened that Thomas was the 28-year-old stepbrother of Sean

Ethington. Thomas Meek was divorced. He had twin daughters. He also had a lengthy criminal record. Court records show that he was arrested 14 times for robbery, assault, forgery, larceny, obstructing justice, illegal drugs, and a handful of other charges. But he only had two convictions and those were for issuing forged checks a little rap sheet going on there it is but you know conviction wise it's not a ton you're arrested 14 times you only have two convictions i guess he was charged with four counts of forgery in in 1978 well forgery of the you know you don't hear a lot of that anymore right because not too many checks floating out there it's harder yeah it's harder yeah this is not catch me if you can days right you know you got a lot of electronic

transfers and PayPal and Venmo and things like that. I think you remember just as well as I do some of the scams back in the day where people were looking for checks in your mailbox. Oh yeah. Yeah. And they would get rid of what was on there and write in whatever they wanted to. I mean, that was kind of a whole thing of you better get your mail because you don't want your mail sitting out there, especially if you got checks coming in the mail. And it was pretty easy to make fake IDs too, as you know very well. As I know very well. According to the Florida Department of Corrections, Tom Meek was sentenced to two years and six months for a fraudulent check. He also received a two-year sentence in May 1978 for some other offense. I couldn't figure out what it was. But I think the key here

is that Tom was in custody from February 1978 to August of 1979. So not a long time, A year and a half is what he did. A little stint. He did a little stint. I think that's a good way to put it. On March 12th, 1981, the day that he reported his stepbrother, Tom Meek gave a recorded statement to Detective Tom neighbors. The following information comes from the state's probable cause affidavit against Sean Ethington.

So one night in the summer of 1980, Tom and Sean were drinking in a bar on Glades road. Sean said he had to pick up his girlfriend. Around midnight, they drove to a home on the west side of Boca Raton. Sean beckoned at one of the windows, and a girl came outside and got into their van. According to Thomas, she was a teenage girl named Sonia. So they're drinking at a bar. Sean would have been 15 at that time because he was 16 when he was arrested in 81. Must have been some really relaxed bars. But you know but you only had to be 18 to drink. So it's probably not too far off. Well, I do think things were a lot more relaxed back then as far as checking for ID. And we just talked about how easy it was to fake IDs. And this for me, that was in the

90s, the late 80s, 90s. I'm sure in 1980, 81, it was even easier. But how damning is this for Sean Ethington, right? This is your stepbrother essentially saying that you, were with this girl, Sonia. He went on to say that Sean stopped his vehicle near Verde Trail. He and Sonia got out. They talked. According to the Boca Raton News, Thomas then saw Sean hit Sonia with a stick or a board, and he knew from the force of the blows that Sean was hurting her.

Thomas said he ran away because he was on probation at the time for the fraudulent check thing. Sean found him near Glades Road and ordered him to come back into the van. Sheriff's detective said that Tom told them, Sean said he didn't kill Sonia. Instead, he buried her. Okay. I think from that you can only make one conclusion. Absolutely. And that is that he buried her a lot.

Yeah. So then later in March, Thomas directed officers to a location off of St. Andrew's Boulevard. And this is where they found Sonia's body. Sheriff's officers found a three-foot board and a substance that looked like hair on the end of the board. They also found a pendant with the inscription from Tata to Sonia. Tata was the nickname that Sonia called her father. It's really sad when I think about that. Oh, I think it's absolutely heartbreaking.

Now, while this was going on, Thomas asked Detective Neighbors for immunity after making his statement. but he wasn't granted immunity. So I wonder why is he asking for immunity if he's just the guy that gave him the tip? Right. He's the good guy, right? Yeah. He's the one who's turning on his own family to try to do the right thing at this point in the story. So that's why I said it's so strange.

And to your point, why is he turning around and asking detectives for immunity? Why do you need immunity? if you're the hero in the story. Right. There's no need for it. Well, obviously, it's because we're going to find out he wasn't the hero. We know that. It would definitely cast a shadow on him at that point.

Once you say, hey, I need immunity. I think anybody in that arena is going to be like, well, he just asked for immunity. Something's wrong here. I think the detective he asked it to would have thought, well, that is very strange. Same things that we're saying. In late July or early August, 1981,

Thomas Meek was located and arrested in Dade County. He was charged with possession of a controlled substance and probation violation. On November 30th, 1981, Sean Ethington pled guilty to manslaughter. So he was allowed to make a lesser plea under the Youthful Offender Act because he was only 16, right, at the time of the murder. He was only 17 at the time he made the plea. Judge Thomas Schultz said that his acceptance of a lesser plea was contingent on hearing the facts about the murder and questioning Sean about it. He wasn't just going to let him plead guilty. He wanted to talk to this kid.

Yeah, he wanted to hear in detail what occurred. Yeah, he wanted to hear him tell him exactly what happened. But then on December 1st, 1981, 28-year-old Thomas Meek was arrested in charge with first-degree murder. he was held without bond. And this happened, this arrest of Thomas Meek happened after Sean gave a sworn statement claiming that it was really Thomas who had killed Sonia. Sean gave his statement on November 30th after he pled guilty to manslaughter.

So now we have a real conundrum. We do. We've got one guy who has pled guilty for this crime. Yeah. Now, it's a lesser plea. but he pled guilty. And then says, you know what? It really wasn't me.

It was Thomas Meek, my stepbrother. So you got a kid underage. Then you have this other individual at, he's 28 at the time. 28. Yeah. Now, according to Detective Thomas neighbors, Sean's polygraph results indicated that he was telling the tree.

Thomas Meek's polygraph was inconclusive, and he refused to take a second exam. Now, you and I don't put a lot into polygraphs. we talked about that many times. But I could see, especially in the early 80s, when they did put a lot more stock into them, how this is really shedding some doubt now on Sean's plea. And it's casting, you know, the blame a little bit on Thomas. Maybe he's the one who did really do it.

According to the probable cause affidavit on June 29th, 1980, Sonia Sancted Sean Ethington to purchase Quayludes. Sean said he arranged a meeting with Tom so Sonia could buy the drugs. Sean told Sonia that he could sell her the drugs and she said she would sneak out of her house at midnight. Quatelutes haven't heard that in a long time. Yeah. Are there still a thing? I don't know.

But you remember they like seven, they had 714 written on them, Quayludes? Oh, I have no idea. I don't know much about drugs as you. you seem to. So that's just one subject. I'm going to have to take your word on. Sean and Thomas drove to Sonia's house. Sean told her that they were waiting for her and she got into Thomas's van. When they drove, Sonia took four Kualoos, which seems like a lot. I think that would be a lot. I don't know much about the dosage of Kualoos, but that seems like a lot. Yeah. Thomas wanted Sean to give Sonia even more drugs. But he said no. She became drowsy and she laid down in the back of the van.

Thomas drove to a wooded area off St. Andrew's Boulevard. Now, according to Sean, after he left the van, Thomas told him to hit Sonia. And he did. He hit her in the upper torso with a stick. But then Thomas picked up a stick and hit Sonia in the head three times. She fell to the ground. She was screaming. According to Sean, Thomas then choked her. The Boca Raton news reported that they both took off her clothes and attempted to have sexual relations with her. Thomas dragged Sonia to the woods and attempted to make sure that she was dead by putting sand in her mouth so that she couldn't breathe. He covered her with logs and brush.

When they got home, Tom told Sean not to say anything to the police. This guy's brutal. Yeah, I mean, you know, when you break this down, This was a very nasty, vicious murder. And it was much different from Tom's story. Right. In Tom's story, he said he only saw Sean hit Sonia. He said he didn't participate in the murder at all.

Right. He ran off. Yeah, he ran off. This is a complete 180. Thomas was granted $10,000 bail on December 30th, 1981. That doesn't seem like a lot of money. It doesn't. I know his percentage of the total bond, but still.

10,000 is not a lot. Doesn't seem like much because really less than two weeks later. On January 12th, 1986, Thomas Meek was indicted for first degree murder. Hey folks, can we talk about slotomania for a minute? This is a game that gives you endless excitement.

It puts 170 free-to-play slot games at your fingertips. They have huge jackpots, an interactive community, and a million free coins. It's the perfect escape from your daily routine. This game is so much fun. beautiful graphics. And for me, I love that rush. You feel when you win a big jackpot. You can also join the biggest community of slot lovers in the world. Interact with fellow players and form cooperative

slotto claims with new friends or enter electrifying live tournaments. You can become a VIP member to get your own personal account manager. Connect with millions of other slot fans on the Slotomania Facebook page, the biggest slots community in the world. When your day is feeling stale, just ask what will today spend. If you're 21 or older, you can join millions of players around the world. Download Slotomania, the number one free slots game on the app store or Google Play Store and get one million free coins. That's Slotomania on the app store or Google Play Store for one million free coins. Meridian believes that hair is hair and that the right way to groom is entirely up to you. So Meridian empowers people, regardless of gender, to trim on their own terms, whether they prefer bear, buzzed, or bushy style.

Meridian has the best trimmer tool on the market for a superior grooming routine that helps you feel confidently you. The meridian trimmer is designed for all body types and grooming zones, even the most sensitive areas. The trimmer has a 6,000 RPM motor and a high-quality ceramic blade that safely trims any part of your body. Even if you have thin or fine hair. It has an anti-nick shaving guard to prevent nicks and cuts. It's waterproof so you can trim in the shower. The trimmer even comes with adjustable guide cones to help. You help you trim at different lengths so you can achieve any look you're going for.

I have the Meridian Trimmer and believe me it works. So check it out for yourself. Listeners of the show can get 10% off their order with coupon code true crime. Go to meridian grooming.com today to get yourself a premium body hair trimmer. That's M-E-R-I-D-I-A-N grooming.com code true crime. Also available at Walmart, Bedbath, and Beyond, and CBS. on the 29th, Sean Ethington was sentenced to a maximum of four years in prison and two years probation under the Youthful Offender Act. Judge Thomas Schultz told Sean, I hope you've got common sense enough to know.

As far as the court is concerned, you've achieved all the justice in this matter that you're entitled to. Basically saying what? He got a fair shake or he got off light? I think both maybe. Yeah. Because he was so young that they couldn't maybe do what they wanted to. But let's not forget, he took a plea of manslaughter. He did.

So that was going to be a lesser sentence anyway. And then when you factor in the fact that he was only 16 years old and that he essentially turned on his step brother Thomas, that all factored in. Now, the Palm Beach Post reported that Sean said in court, I just think everybody deserves a second chance. I think it's weird to hear those words come from the person that participated in the crime. He did participate, even in his story, but he did what? He hit her with a stick. Yeah. In the torso, according to him. And that was it. Now, he gave her some quailudes too. So you got to factor that in. But as far as the murder in his story, he wasn't the murderer.

But as a family member, if I was there sitting, I'd be like, what about my daughter's second chance? Exactly. And I think even in the eyes of the law, you're a party to it, right? You were there,

you participated to some extent. And you never gave notice to the police. You're wrapped up in it. Yeah. In June 1982, a grand jury re-indicted Thomas Meek for murder. According to the Boca Raton News, prosecutor said that the new

indictment was necessary because there may be newly determined causes of Ms. son's death. So his murder trial started on December 13th in 1982. Assistant State Attorney Alessort said in his opening argument that Sonia's younger sister eventually told the police that Sonia left the house after midnight to meet Sean Ethington and Thomas Meek to get Kualoos. Okay. So that lines up.

It does. With at least Sean's story and really kind of even Thomas's to some extent. The Boca Raton News reported that Thomas Meek went to the police because he wanted to get a confession off his chest. So him getting this off his chest was this by putting them blame on his brother and that was going to make him feel good? Yeah, that's the way I took it. He wanted to get a confession off his chest, but he wasn't going to confess to what he did. he was confessing to the fact that his stepbrother Sean was the murderer. Sonia was murdered on June 30th, 1980.

Tom, Sean and Sonia drove around. They stopped in a wooded area. According to Thomas, Sean and Sonia walked away. And then just out of the blue, Sean picked up a stick and hit her. Sonia fell down and that's when Thomas left the area. So going kind of back to his statement. he really wasn't involved at all. He didn't even mention the quailudes, I guess, in his story.

Because when Sean told his story, it was all about Sonia going with them to get some quailudes. According to LaSort, they stopped the van a mile from Sonia's house. She was killed when she got sick from the quailudes. The Palm Beach Post reported that Al LaSort said he would call on Sean Ethington to testify that he and Thomas beat Sonia with sticks and that after she fell down, Thomas killed her, raped her, stuffed sand in her mouth, and concealed her body. He said in court, Thomas Meek choked her until the life was gone from her young body.

He pulled her clothes off. Then raped her as she was lying lifeless. Yeah, he's a monster. But aren't we still at the part where we're trying to figure out who's telling the truth? because we have two different stories here. We do. We have Sean's story and we have Thomas's story. Now, it's pretty easy to see which one prosecutors are believing more.

Sean's already going to do time for manslaughter. Sure. But obviously they believed his story because they're going after Thomas. Yeah, I mean, it comes down to who's telling the better story and who aligns with the facts, the evidence. the Boca Raton News reported that Tom's defense attorney Harvey Duvall argued that Sean never implicated Tom until right before his trial started and that this case would boil down to the believability of the witnesses. Kind of just exactly what you and I were just saying.

And I do think it's a good argument to make, right? Why did Sean wait so long to implicate Thomas Meek? He'd been sitting in jail for quite some time and hadn't. said anything about it. According to the Palm Beach Post, Deval said that Sean's story was the goriest, most horrendous story I've ever heard. Frankly, I don't believe it could possibly happen to anybody. He accused Sean of lying for a lighter sentence. He also said that he planned to call an expert to testify that Sonia didn't die from strangulation, but instead died because her left leg was cut to the bone and she bled out. Well, look, I have to just say that we

know that something like that could happen. Oh, absolutely. I think it's such a strange statement for a defense attorney to make. Right. That I don't even believe something like this could happen. Yeah, I get it. It's the early 80s. But by the early 80s, a lot of really horrendous things had happened. Obviously, this is one that could happen. It's not out of the realm of possibility. So to make a statement like that kind of blows me away, to be honest. Witness Karen Prince. one of Sonia's sister's friends testified that Sean Ethington came to Sonia's bedroom window after midnight on June 30th, 1980. Sonia said she was going outside to take Qualoos.

She crawled out of her window and said she'd be back around six. All right. So that's one witness. But really one witness that can only speak to what Sean did. Yeah, I mean, it puts her with Sean. That's all it does. But is that a big deal? because Sean already had put Sean with her.

Yeah. We already know that she was with Sean and potentially, and we know she was with Sean and Thomas, because Thomas has already said that they were all together. Yeah, he's admitted it too. Yeah. On December 14th, Sean Ethington testified against Thomas Meek. According to Sean,

Quayludes were very popular among the students at Boko Rotein Community High School. Sonia asked him to help her buy some. Sean arranged the meeting between Sonia and Thomas, so Sonia could buy $100 worth of Kualoos. Thomas had $7,000 capsules, but Sonia wanted to try some of the pills first. So there's a couple of things there. 7,000 capsules of Kualoond sounds like a lot. Definitely a lot.

And $100 worth of Kualudes in 1980 would probably be quite a bit. I would think so. I don't know. I don't know the conversal. of money when it comes to drugs. The quatelute conversion? You and I usually do property values and other types of values. I think drugs are a little harder because the demand is different.

You know, as the years go on, I go back to my statement. I don't even know how many people are taking quailudes at this point in time. I don't hear much about them. Probably over the counter medicine. You know, I hear fentanyl. Yeah. Meth. Right.

Those are the type of things that. that, you know, and then there, there was the crack epidemic. Sure. And all that. While Thomas was driving, he told Sean that he wanted to have sex with Sonia. So they attacked her when she asked them to stop to get some air. The Palm Beach Post reported that Sean said he hit Sonia with a stick in order to impress Thomas. He said at the time, I was trying to prove to him that I wasn't as big a chicken as he said I was. Sean went on to testify that Thomas choked Sonia to death and raped her in the woods west of Boko-Ratone.

He said in his testimony, I was pleading with him to stop. He said, no, then you'll get busted for aggravated assault and all this stuff. That's when he started choking her. Thomas dragged Sonia into the woods, raped her, then asked Sean if he wanted to rape her. Sean said, I was in the days. I couldn't. I was so turned off. I felt her neck.

I couldn't feel a pulse. He said he threw brush over her body and they left the area. So again, this is testimony by Sean, but I still think we're at the point where we're weighing the statements that had been made by both of these guys. And in Sean's case, he was basically a kid still. Yeah. And he sounds like he was kind of looking up towards Thomas.

as would be natural, right? You've got a step brother. He's 12 years older. You want to impress him. I think that's natural. Sure. But maybe do it on the baseball field. Do it lifting weights.

Not when it comes to attacking a young girl. Right. It seems so strange for him to say it like that. I wanted to impress him. So I hit her with the stick. I also thought it was strange for him to say, I couldn't rape her. I was so turned off.

I found that statement to be very odd. It is an odd statement to say. In his testimony, Sean said that he and Thomas bonded because they both had problems with Thomas's father, Paul Meek. Sean said that Paul was mistreating him. Thomas took Sean out to bars. He bought him clothes. Sonia's sister Helen testified that Sean came to Sonia's window after midnight on June 30th. She climbed out to go with him.

and never came back. So again, she's kind of backing up the testimony that other people had already kind of talked about. Henry Duvall spent three hours questioning Sean about his story. When asked, you were telling a story to get a deal, weren't you? Sean answered basically yes, but said he was telling the truth. When Duval said, you've given us four different versions, which one is correct? Sean answered, they're all correct.

sir. When he was questioned by Al LeSort, Sean said, I was guilty of being there, seeing something happened, and I'm paying my dues now. Well, he did participate in some of the actions, right? And he had already received a sentence for that. Devald questioned Sean in detail about the rape. He also asked why his testimony was different from his pretrial statements. There were differences about when and how many quailudes Sonia took, conversations before the murder, and the exact locations that the attacks occurred. Sean answered that he was under pressure because he was facing a first degree murder charge, but some statements were taken after this charge was dropped.

So I think you can see plainly what Meek's defense attorney is trying to do. Sean's the key. He is the key. So the defense attorney has to poke holes in. his statements. He has to trip him up. Get him to answer, why did you say this on one day, but then you changed it to this at another point in time. And I think you're also trying to point out to the jury that he did this to get a lesser charge. That's key. The assistant county medical examiner testified that he could not determine Sonia's cause of death, but did know that she

died in unnatural death. There was no damn. damage to her skull, but there was what he called a linear mark on her leg bone consistent with a knife. Now you got some issues. Yeah. Because I think in Sean's statement, didn't he say that Thomas hit her in the head like three times with a stick? With a stick. You would expect to see some type of damage to the skull. Thomas Meek got on the stand and testified that it was Sean ethnic. who killed Sonia and he walked away because he didn't want to get involved. Thomas said that he saw Sean hit Sonia once with a stick before he walked away. He said, I got scared. I didn't want any part of it. Tom said he accepted a ride from Sean after Sean left the crime scene and found him on Glades Road.

Sean said that he had killed Sonia. Thomas testified that when he asked Sean why Sonia wasn't with him, he answered, I buried her. And Thomas said he didn't. He didn't. He said, he didn't ask any more questions after that. So, you know, essentially you have these two guys saying similar things, but that the other person did those things. Yeah. Right. Sean saying Thomas killed her and buried her. Thomas is saying Sean killed her and buried her. Right. It's going to be up to the jury. Back to the he said. He said. Yeah. It really is. According to Thomas, Sean said that he killed Sonia because she wouldn't have sex with him after they stopped in the wooded area off st. Andrew's Boulevard Thomas didn't go to the police for months even when Sonia's sister and mother confronted both

of them he didn't want to violate his probation by being involved in another crime these are statements that he made sure the Palm Beach Post reported that about nine months later told his father about the murder his father convinced him to go to police but Thomas said he asked what happens if Sean turns around and says I did it? They said, don't worry about it, but here I am. Before Thomas testified,

an inmate got on the stand and said that Sean initially told him that Tom killed Sonia, but then later said that he did it. And there's stories flying everywhere. Yeah. A lot of inconsistencies. A lot of, I did it,

I didn't do it. I did it. He did it. Yeah. I didn't do it. On December 17th, in 1982, Thomas Meek was convicted of first degree murder. Tom faced life in prison with a 25 year mandatory sentence without parole. Prosecutors chose not to seek the death pill. Al LaSour said that

Tom went to the police and blamed Sean because he saw construction workers near Sonia's body. Al said they were getting closer and closer all the time and Tom Meek was sweating. So there's a couple of things here. First of all, you got you have to explain. why he came forward at all. And I think he's trying to do that through this statement. You also have to kind of explain why he waited nine months. And he's trying to do it through this statement as well. In February 1983,

Thomas's sentencing was postponed. Due to charges of jury members talking with the prosecutor, Tom's mother, Barbara Stanton, and a friend made allegations that they saw three jurors speak with the prosecutor and Sonia's parents. Judge John Bourne determined that he would subpoena all 12 jurors. In March 1983, Sonia's parents filed a damage suit against Paul and Jane Meek, the parents of Sean Ethington, alleging negligence for failing to properly supervise

and control their son. Sean Ethington was also named as a defendant in the suit. On April 1st of that year, jurors denied speaking to Sonia's family or the prosecutor during the trial. Four witnesses testified. that they saw Sonia's mother and sister approached the jury four woman and another juror during recesses. Tom's girlfriend, Jackie Altman, also said that she saw the four woman speaking to Alessort on December 16th. So, you know, big delay, right? Because of these charges of jurors talking to people they shouldn't be talking to.

But where are all the allegations coming from? it seems as though they're coming from either Thomas's family or his girlfriend. Right. So I don't know. Another witness testified that Sonia's mom and sister asked the four woman, what was happening when jurors were in the hallway during a break? Barbara Stanton, Tom's mother also said that she saw the four woman talking to LaSour, but she couldn't hear the conversation.

And then a family friend said he saw Sonia's mother sitting with the juror before court, and also witnessed the conversation between the four women and prosecuted. It didn't do a great job of keeping people separated, did they back then? Either that or this was a calculated tactic to try to throw this trial in to chaos. I mean, it's one of the other. Either these jurors really were talking to people they shouldn't have been talking to or this was a coordinated effort to try to get a mistrial or something. But the state produced affidavits from the four women and prosecutors saying they had no conversations during the trial.

All of the jurors that were questioned by the judge said they didn't see any of the conversations reported by the witnesses. One juror said she was in the women's restroom when one of Sonia's relatives asked for the time. She didn't say a word to them, but she did hold her watch out. Okay. That tells me that obviously they were told not to talk to people. And she was complying. And she was taking it very seriously. Not even giving her the time.

On April 3rd, 1983, Thomas's conviction was upheld. And the judge dismissed the motion to grant a new trial. On May 17th, Tom Meek was sentenced to life in prison, plus one year for parole violation. He was ordered to serve 25 years before he would be eligible for parole. Judge John Bourne denied a motion for a new trial, but agreed to consider further arguments that Thomas's rights were violated because he was not in court when jurors submitted a question during deliberation. The question was, if one person is guilty of premeditated first-degree murder and the other person meets all criteria set forth in Instruction 3.01,

and principal are both guilty of first degree premeditated murder. Thomas testified that he would have objected to this question because Sean pled guilty to manslaughter. Eventually, the court dismissed his argument that he deserved a new trial because the judge erred in responding to the jury's question while he was out of court. They also dismissed the argument that testimony from Sean's attorney about polygraph tests should have been excluded. The court also dismissed the argument of prosecutorial misconduct during the closing argument.

So his conviction was upheld. Well, they're going to try everything. Why wouldn't they? Yeah, there's no reason not to. And the court actually did come back and say, there were a few legal errors,

but they called them harmless. And not enough to cause for retrial or anything like that. Or overturn his conviction or anything like that. I mean, you know, if you really think about a trial, how many of them are perfect where, you know, the prosecution doesn't do anything that can be called into question. The defense doesn't do anything that can be called into question. The judge doesn't make a decision that is later going to be called into question. Yeah. I mean, the one thing we always talk about is a defendant is always going to say what? A defense did a terrible job. Yeah. I mean, that, you know, it comes up all the time, right? In a piece. appeals that they use a little bit more legalese than my defense did a terrible job. That's how it should be written on the paper. That is how it should be written.

Yeah. I think one of the things that came up was that Sean Ethington's attorney was called to testify at trial. The attorney said during cross-examination that he requested that Thomas Meek take a lie detector test. Thomas Meek's defense didn't move to strike this testimony or file a motion for mistrial. after the jury started deliberating, Thomas notified the bailiff and his attorney that he and his family were going to wait at a restaurant. And that's when the jury submitted this question that I read earlier. The judge met with the prosecutor and defense attorney. They both agree that the judge should answer the question in the affirmative.

But Thomas wasn't there and Thomas's defense never objected to the response to the jury's question. And that was part of his appeal process. We've already said all of these were struck down. On May 1st, 1986, the Florida Supreme Court upheld Thomas's murder conviction. But then on November 13, 1987, the Palm Beach County Circuit Court heard arguments in the case. And they ordered another hearing. Basically, Thomas Meek requested that his conviction be overturned because he said he thought he had immunity when he testified before a grand jury. We laid it out, right?

Thomas's stepbrother Sean was the first one charged in the case. Thomas was subpoenaed to testify in 1981 and he said he thought he was granted immunity. Didn't have that piece of paper it says, you have been granted immunity. Is that how they do it? Only you would know. Yeah. And all the attorneys that listened to the show. But outside of that, between you and I, only you would know.

Right. Yeah. I've never needed immunity because I walked to straight and narrow. I basically have a immunity gold gold card. I like that McDonald's gold card. Everybody's trying to get. I have the immunity gold card. It's like a get out of jail free card.

Yeah. I can use it twice a week. According to Meek versus State, during Thomas's first contact with the sheriff's office, he asked about transactional immunity, but was told that he wouldn't receive it because he was a voluntary witness accusing a third party. Basically, he claimed his step brother committed a murder,

but in no way did he implicate himself in his statement. That's what they said. Arrangements were made for Thomas to testify in front of a grand jury. He wasn't subpoenaed at first, and he did not receive any promises about his testimony. Thomas spoke with the assistant state attorney presenting the case. She said he wouldn't receive transactional immunity, but he would have what was termed use immunity, meaning his testimony couldn't be used against him. He was also told that he could be charged if they found out he committed the crime.

So this is kind of interesting, right? Different types of immunity. Yeah. And basically what they were telling him is that whatever he said in his testimony wouldn't be used against him, but he could still be charged if they found out that, you know, he was involved or committed this crime. there was testimony that indicated that Thomas requested to be subpoenaed so that he could show his probation officer why he left the county he lived in, also so that he could be paid, and because he was afraid of his stepbrother's family. So then he eventually was subpoenaed.

However, Thomas was released from his subpoena by the state before he testified so that his testimony would be voluntary and he would have no immunity. It's a real kind of cat and mouse game. It really is. It's almost like you got to make sure you have a lawyer involved with you. Well, I think that's probably good practice as we talk about all the time. But let's go back to him asking the detective about getting immunity. We thought it was strange back then. He's obviously wanting it at different points during the story.

It keeps coming up again and again. Hey, I need immunity. Can I get immunity? please give me immunity. Why? Is it because you're really trying to cover your rear end because you did something? Exactly what it is. Thomas testified at the 1987 hearing that he didn't want to testify,

but his probation officer told him he didn't have a choice. And that if he didn't appear before the grand jury, he would be violating his probation and go back to prison. So he had a choice. He just chose not to go back to prison. According to the jury. the Palm Beach Post at the hearing he was told he had no immunity because he was testifying voluntarily, but nothing he said would be used against him. At the 1987 hearing, Thomas Meek in court,

when asked by his lawyer what he thought that meant, said, then I couldn't be arrested, which I found a little strange because it seemed pretty clear that they told him he could be arrested. He could be charged. Right. If they found evidence that he committed this crime. It just seems like he conveniently forgot that part. He really wanted that immunity. He did. Tom said that he told another prosecutor he didn't want to testify. He admitted that he didn't tell his lawyer during trial that he thought he had immunity.

Thomas thought he would be acquitted because, according to him, I knew I wasn't guilty. I didn't see anybody die. It seems like this, do you have immunity, would have came up throughout the let's get ready for this trial conversations. Well, to my way of thinking, if he really thought he had it, don't you think he would have told his attorney that so that, you know, they could press forward in, you know, how are you even charging me? I have immunity.

But it doesn't come up until much later in the appeals process. Wouldn't you think if a prosecutor granted somebody immunity, they would say to the defense, hey, your guy has immune? so this trial's pointless. We're not going to take him the trial. They just wouldn't even get to that level. Now, Thomas's attorney tried to argue that only a judge can release someone from a subpoena. When the prosecutor said he had no immunity, she was going beyond her authority.

Attorney Bert Winkler said that Thomas was given transactional immunity. So he couldn't be prosecuted for possible crimes he testified about. Immunity laws changed in 1981. Witnesses cannot be prosecuted based on what they say during a grand jury proceeding, but prosecutors can use other evidence about the crime in court. In July 1988, Thomas filed an appeal asking for a retrial based on inadequate representation. His attorney argued that Harry DeVall should have called witnesses to undermine Sean's credibility. Three people were able to testify about Sean's violent tendencies, but they were

were never called to testify. There's that fancy word. Inadequate representation. Yeah. I like mine better. I do too. My, my lawyers did a bad job or whatever it was you said. But there's still this overarching thing kind of hanging out there. Did he have immunity? Was he given immunity? And what type of immunity was it? On August 8th, 1990, the fourth district court of appeal ruled that the trial judge must review testimony and evidence supporting Thomas's claim that he was given immunity when he testified before a grand jury about Sean's involvement in the murder. After Tom led the police to Sonia's body, the state subpoenaed him to testify before the grand jury. Tom believed that he had this immunity because he was subpoenaed. And according to transcripts of the hearing, the prosecutor said,

nothing that you say can be used against you. Okay, that's pretty interesting. It is interesting. Now, prosecutors argued that he shouldn't be able to raise the immunity issue because he didn't raise it at trial, right? This is many, many years later. And the trial judge agreed. But the appeals court determined immunity is a fundamental issue that can be raised after the trial and the judge must reconsider Meek's claim of immunity. Kind of agree with what was said. Yeah, I don't agree with everything that Thomas Meek has said. But, you know, when you hear that the trial transcripts indicate that the prosecutor said to him,

nothing that you say can be used against you. Okay. Now, is that immunity or is that exactly what it says? Right. Doesn't mean we can't go after you. you, it just means that we can't use anything that you said against you. Now, did they use? Right? That's going to, that's a question. You're absolutely right. So Thomas had all this going on. Then in 1991, he was charged with racketeering and criminal usury. According to prosecutors,

since 1989, he had been making thousands of dollars by loaning money to inmates at high interest rates. is basically loan sharking inside the prison. He told the inmates to send the payments to his mother and wife who then mailed him the money. During a drug investigation at the Glade's correctional institution, inmates spoke with investigators and said they took loans from Tom Meek to support their gambling and drug habits. He charged them 50% interest for the first seven days and an additional 50% when the seven days expired. Man, those are some seriously big race.

That's, uh, that's worse than some of those money stores out there. I think it's a lot worse. Deborah Breninger and Barbara Brown, Tom's wife and mother, received over $5,000 from inmates and sent the money to Tom. This guy was raking in the cash. And, you know, he was probably buying a lot of ramen noodles, little debbies. He probably had it all, man. A nice little, uh, pantry.

A cash. Yeah, cash. A cash. A foodstuffs. Tom's attorney argued that because he was grand immunity, he couldn't even go on trial for loan chart. Well, I guess if you're saying he shouldn't even, because he was granted immunity,

he would never been in prison. If he was never in prison, he would never have loan chart. I don't know. It sounded to me like they were just trying to make this immunity kind of overarching. And no matter what you do, you can't get in trouble.

So obviously Tom denied making these loans kind of doing this loan sharking, but the Western Union record showed transactions between inmates and Tom's mother and wife. So it seemed pretty clear cut that he was doing it. Tom claimed he was grand immunity

from prosecution when asked about corruption in the prison. The judge ruled that prosecutors could use evidence obtained through other inmates, but they couldn't use Tom's interview as evidence. So he went on trial for this. And according to his

defense attorney, the money was moved through the prison and transfer fees were added. Tom was actually operating what was what he called a brokerage. He was merely moving inmates money from one person to another and that the fee he was charging was similar to a broker's fee. Okay. It was a broker. Yeah. You know, like your typical broker. That's right. Who manages your money. The prosecution argued that Tom made thousands by loaning money to inmates at high interest rates and had them send payments to his mother and wife. According to court documents, if the money was not paid when due,

threats of violence were used. So this is real loan charting. This is, if you don't give me my money, I'm going to break your legs. Right. On October 17th, Thomas Meek was acquitted of racketeering and criminal usury.

On October 7th, 1992, the 4th District Court of Appeal ruled that a trial judge incorrectly ruled. that Thomas could not claim immunity after he was convicted. So the court ordered a hearing on the issue. So he got out of this racketeering loan sharking thing, but he's still fighting to get out of this murder charge. It sounds like he's doing a pretty good job of it.

Yeah, it actually does. So in 1993, arguments were made in Thomas's case. Thomas said he thought he was grand immunity, and he would not be prosecuted after. testifying before a grand jury. He also said he was pressured into testifying. Prosecutors argued he was not grand immunity. This never changed, right?

This went back and forth pretty much the same way in every hearing that happened after his conviction. Yeah, they're both standing the ground. And on March 3rd, Thomas's request to have his conviction overturned was denied. But this went on for many years, right? He just stuck to this. thought that he had immunity. He never should have been prosecuted.

And he just kept trying to get post-conviction relief based on this. And it went like that for appeal after appeal after appeal. He just got shut down pretty much at every turn. Now, there were a couple of times where it looked like he had some hope, right? Court said, no, judge needs to hear arguments. Okay. he's got to be feeling pretty good. I got a chance here. Right. But ultimately, it never worked. Thomas Meek is listed as deceased in Florida Department of Corrections records.

His date out of custody is listed as February 2nd, 2008. So I think as we wrap up this episode gives, it is a very different type of episode for us. You know, we titled it Thomas Meek because Thomas, was convicted of first degree murder. Sean Ethington was convicted of manslaughter. I really couldn't find much on him, but I'm assuming he got out. Yeah, I'm thinking he probably got out, maybe even changed his name. And went on with his life. I think the problem for me as we review this case is that do we really know what happened

in the early morning hours of June 30th, 1980. You know, essentially, you have two people telling stories on each other, right? Thomas Meek saying Sean was the one who killed Sonia, right? Sean is saying Thomas is the one who killed Sonia. Which one's telling the truth? I mean, essentially, they both served time. They did for this murder. Sean got manslaughter, Thomas got first degree. Could you flip them? You could. If Sean was the actual murderer and Thomas was there and participated in some aspect of it, I don't know.

I mean, obviously a jury heard enough to where in their minds they convicted Thomas Mika of first degree murder. I think the issue that some people have with this case is that there's no doubt both of these individuals. had a motive to lie. They did. And to tell on each other. But you got a minor involved. But minors kill. Miners do kill.

We know that. And we know sometimes minors are charged just as an adult. And he very well could have been, I think, at 16 maybe. We've seen that before. Yeah. I don't know. I just found it to be a very interesting case. I'm extremely sad for the San family.

Oh, for sure. You know, Sonia lost her life, her sister. her parents and all of that had to go through that grieving process. They lost her. But then after that, this kind of back and forth between the stepbrothers, you did it. No, I didn't do it. You did it. Like you said, he said, he said.

And then, you know, how does it wash out through the legal system? I think it's a pretty fascinating case. You just mentioned stepbrothers and I keep thinking about that movie stepbrothers. Oh my gosh, dude. It's funny. I'm telling you it's funny. A lot of people probably think it's the stupidest movie in the world. And to some degree it is,

but it doesn't change the fact that it cracks me up. Yeah, it's one of those, you don't have to think, just watch and laugh. Just watch and laugh. Unlike this true crime episode, you got to think and you got to, you got to grieve a little bit.

You got to, you got to feel bad for sure for the San family. And to some extent, I would think people would feel bad for Thomas. Meek if he didn't actually commit the murder. Yeah, if it happened the way that he initially said that he saw her hit with a stick and then ran off. Would he still be charged with something?

Possibly. I don't know. Now, if Thomas Meek was the murderer and it went down the way that Sean said, Sean would still be charged as he was, I think. And he would serve time as he did. But if it happened the other way or way. around Thomas wouldn't have been hit with such a lengthy sentence. But I don't know other than kind of going with what the jury heard because they heard all

the evidence and they made their decision. But that's it for our episode on Thomas Meek. We got some voicemails. You want to check those out? Yes, hear them. Hey, Mike and Gibby. This is with Tina from Toronto, Canada. Longtime listener.

Love you guys. I just wanted to share my thoughts on the latest episode when I was listening and I heard that Omar was Sydney's. I got excited for a millisecond because I'm also Sydney's American, Sydney's Canadian. And then I quickly remembered that this is a true crime podcast and that he's probably not being

mentioned for being, you know, the Nobel Peace Prize winner. Anyway, Omar definitely sucks, and I'm glad that he got caught. And I just wanted to say thank you for your great work. I love listening to you every weekend on Sundays, and I look forward to hearing more from you guys.

Love you so much. Ketima. Yeah, definitely appreciate the voicemail. I think it's always tough. We may have mentioned it, you know, recently. You know, if there's a person who, you know, is from the same country you're from, or even, let's say in the United States, the same state, the same town, okay, number one, there's going to be some shock that this person committed some heinous act. But then I think the second thing is you really don't want this person associated with you, right? This person is not representative of, you know, who we are.

Right. As a nation, as a city, even as a race, I think, in some instances. It can be very tough. Hi. My name is Emily. I am from Michigan and I've been a fan for quite some time. I'd say, I think three going on four years. And this is actually my second time trying to leave this voice.

because I forgot the name of the episode. But I was listening to the Thomas Montgomery episode, and I could not help but laugh when you referenced the Brad Paisley song because I did a little report on Brad Paisley and his songs, and that was one of the ones that I did. And I just thought it was so funny and entertaining, and I don't really hear people talk about country music, especially nowadays. So I just thought it was really entertaining,

and thank you for trying to connect a whole bunch of different worlds into one into the true crime. And I hope you guys continue to have a good one. I'm not surprised. I mean, you are a big country guy. I am. I've listened to country for probably the last 25 years. Yeah. I listen to a lot of other types of music, too. I actually don't listen to music much anymore.

I listen to more podcasts and audiobooks and things like that. but yeah Brad Paisley is one of my favorites. Yeah, and strange fact, you are close personal friends with Garth Brooks. That is true. Yeah, that is true. It's not something I brag about, but if you're going to do it for me,

I will. We'll let it fly. Hey, y'all, Colin from Knoxville, Tennessee here. I just got done listening to the Raleighall episode. I actually know Mr. and Mrs. Walker on that. I'm shortly after Emma had passed, maybe a month after she had passed. I was working landscaping at the time

and my boss was friends with them and wanted to redo their yard just to kind of give them to pick me up. You will never meet better people. They sat out there and touted with us all day. Mark went and bought us lunch. Their son, I won't mention his name because he's underage,

but their son worked with us for a while. I just, you won't find better God-fearing people. I just want to say that I think, think you done this episode justice. I love hearing from you guys. I've been listening for a couple of years now. And I'm team T-Kat. I love you both. Keep your own time ticking. You got to have a good one. Yeah, that was a strange case. We've kind of had a series of kind of different cases, you know, not so clear cut maybe in some people's eyes, not so straightforward. That one was kind of, yeah, it was a real heartbreaker. It really was. But I, but as we've said before,

we love it when people call in and especially have kind of heartwarming stories that tie into the episodes that we do. I also like to hear about people's brushes with serial killers and we've had that as well. But we appreciate the voicemail. Really couldn't tell that she was from that area, could you? No, couldn't tell she was from Knoxville. All right. We had no mailbag. So that is it for another episode of True Crime all the time. So for Mike And Gibby. Stay safe and keep your own time ticking.