TrueLife - Lewis Goldberg - Crafting the Psychedelic Narrative: Inside KCSA’s Media Strategy

Episode Date: June 22, 2025

One on One Video Call W/George https://tidycal.com/georgepmonty/60-minute-meetingSupport the show:https://www.paypal.me/Truelifepodcast?locale.x=en_US🚨🚨Curious about the future of psychedelics? Imagine if Alan Watts started a secret society with Ram Dass and Hunter S. Thompson… now open the door. Use Promocode TRUELIFE for Get 25% off monthly or 30% off the annual plan For the first yearhttps://www.district216.com/Lewis Goldberg Ladies and gentlemen, seekers of signal in the static,allow me to introduce a voice forged in the alchemical fireof policy, purpose, and paradox.Lewis Goldberg is not just a publicist.He’s a linguistic locksmith,a master of messaging who doesn’t just shape narratives —he whispers to the current underneath them.With the war drums of old Washington echoing in his blood,he cut his teeth in the mythos of power:Clinton’s campaign trail, Torricelli’s tightropes,the ever-calculating eye of a First Lady named Hillary.But then —like any good archetypal wanderer —he turned toward the plant path.Toward cannabis, toward psychedelics,toward the revolution happening beneath our feet.He didn’t just pivot — he prophesied.In 2015, he helped launch KCSA’s cannabis division,giving shape and story to an industryrising like smoke through the cracks of a crumbling paradigm.He co-hosts The Green Rush,a podcast that is part intelligence briefing,part esoteric transmission for the business-minded psychonaut.And while some men worship quarterly reports,Lewis builds cathedrals in the stock ticker —rooting for the underdogs,channeling the sacred absurdity of Mets games,Jets heartbreaks,and the eternal optimism of Rutgers fanswho believe — against all odds —that truth, like victory, can be summoned with enough heart.So today, as we stand on the thresholdof Psychedelic Science 2025,we welcome not just a strategist —but a conjurer of attention.A myth-maker of market forces.A Blakean bard in a tailored blazerwho reminds us that even in the most corporate corners of culture…something sacred still wants to break through.Give it up for Lewis Goldberg. One on One Video call W/George https://tidycal.com/georgepmonty/60-minute-meetingSupport the show:https://www.paypal.me/Truelifepodcast?locale.x=en_USCheck out our YouTube:https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPzfOaFtA1hF8UhnuvOQnTgKcIYPI9Ni9&si=Jgg9ATGwzhzdmjkg

Darkness struck, a gut-punched theft, Sun ripped away, her health bereft. I roar at the void. This ain't just fate, a cosmic scam I spit my hate. The games rigged tight, shadows deal, blood on their hands, I'll never kneel. Yet in the rage, a crack ignites, occulted sparks cut through the nights. The scars my key, hermetic and stark. To see, to rise, I hunt in the dark, fumbling, fear. Hears through ruins maze, lights my war cry, born from the blaze.

The poem is Angels with Rifles. The track, I Am Sorrow, I Am Lust by Codex Seraphini. Check out the entire song at the end of the cast. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the True Live podcast, Psychedelic Science 2025. Seekers of Signal and the static allow me to introduce a voice forged in the alchemical fire of policy, purpose, and paradox. purpose and paradox. Lewis Goldberg is not just a publicist. He's a linguistic locksmith,

a master of messaging, who doesn't just shape narratives. He whispers to the current underneath them. With the war drums of old Washington echoing in his blood, he cut his teeth in the mythos of power. Clinton's campaign trail, Torchelli's tightropes, an ever-calculating eye of a first lady named Hillary. But then, like any good archetypal wanderer, he turned toward the plant path, toward cannabis, toward psychedelics, toward the revolution happening beneath our feet. He didn't just pivot. He prophesized. In 2015, he helped launch KCSA's Cannabis Division,

giving shape and story to an industry rising like smoke through the cracks of a crumbling paradigm. He co-hosts the Green Rush, a podcast that is part intelligence briefing, part esoteric transmission for the business-minded psychonaut. And while some men worship quarterly reports, Lewis builds cathedrals and the stock ticker. rooting for the underdogs, channeling the sacred absurdity of Mets games, Jets' heartbreaks, and the eternal optimism of Rutgers fans who believe against all odds that truth like

victory can be summoned with enough hearts. So today, as we stand at the threshold of psychedelic science 2025, we welcome not just a strategist, but a conjurer of attention, a myth maker of market forces, a Blakened Bard and a tailored blazer who reminds us that even in the most corporate corners of culture, something sacred still wants to break through. Give it up for was Goldberg. Thank you for being here. That was awesome. It was really beautiful. I love chat GPT. It's so fascinating.

It is amazing. And I know we're here to talk about psychedelics. Anything we want. But there is such an intersection between AI and this space between AI and neural science, AI and psychedelics that I love the tool and I use it daily. Yeah. And I can tell that that intro was. You fed it a lot of stuff about me and then it reflected it back in your voice.

Yes. And that was really fun. And it's fun to, it's uncomfortable to hear me talked about that way. But I'm appreciative of your art in delivering it and appreciative of what was written. So it's pretty cool. Thank you for that. Like I talked to a lot of people in psychedelics and there seems to be this merger between AI and psychedelics. In my opinion, it's almost like an evolution of language.

Like we're beginning to see CHAP-G-T help people talk more meaningfully. And in psychedelics, you become a, you have this newfound awareness that seems to be more meaningful. What are your thoughts on the intersection of AI and second? Well, I think that it's really interesting. Psychedelics is about neuroscience, right? It's about how these chemicals interact with our brain to allow us to have and achieve mystical experiences, meaningful experiences that can reshape the way that we perceive the world, both in the moment and in the future.

And if you, you know, as you know about AI, the way that the computers are structured are in neural networks. Yeah. So there is a level of similarity both in language and in structure. And, you know, while we think that we understand how these chemicals actually affect the brain, we don't. Right. And while we think we understand how the neural networks in AI actually works, we don't. So, you know, it's really interesting. And, you know, I think one of the really cool things for me about both is they allow me to express my curiosity and go in unbelievable different book paths.

Yeah. And as a storyteller, which is what my job is, both have empowered me to be much more effective in different ways. I think psychedelics have helped me. become more empathetic, that the person I'm talking to, I'm able to sit in their shoes and feel what they're feeling, reflect it back to them so that they understand that they are being heard. And then AI allows me to work faster. It has become a writing partner, not a replacement, but it is able to create the content and then to reshape it consistently and iterate much, much faster than I've ever been able to. Yeah, it's really well said. I think

it's also interesting to be in media and have all these tools with you. I was wondering maybe if you could share a story about how psychedelics have helped you see what your role in media. Maybe we should tell people KCSA and what you do. Oh, forget that. Of course. I'm Lewis Goldberg. Thank you. I'm a partner.

I'm one of four owners of a public relations and investor relations firm called KCSA. And for almost 60 years, which is older than me, you know, we've been helping shape the public understanding about companies. And most of our work is in like science and technology and finance. And 10 years ago, a little more than 10 years ago, I was a personal cannabis enthusiast, but I was exposed to the business of cannabis. We helped the company apply for the first medical license in New York State. And I learned the vertical nature of the industry. How is the plant grown?

How is it processed? How is it transported? How is it financed? The security, the real estate, the entire, like, it is a big industry. industry. And I turned to my business partners and we had been working with with banks and pharmaceutical companies and technology companies. I said, that is a multi-billion dollar industry that is in the birthing. Nobody is willing to go in there and do traditional public relations. Right. Financial investor relations. Let's go there. And they were like, uh, are you crazy?

Yeah, pretty much. But we did it, right? They were willing to take a risk on me. Right. And we became very successful in the space. And a few years later, after reading Michael Pollan's book, I said to them, guys, this is even bigger. This is, you know, where cannabis is a multi-billion dollar industry, psychedelics, because it is treating mental health, that's a multi-trillion dollar industry. Let's go there. And they said, well, you were right about that. We're willing to go with you. There wasn't even a moment's hesitation.

And, you know, none of my business partners are psychedelic enthusiasts. They are supporters. They are definitively supporters, but they're not enthusiasts. But, you know, so we went there. And we have taken the vast majority of the companies in this space public. We took a tie life public. We took Saibn public. We launched field trip. And since 2019, we've been the agency of record for maps. We do the public relations for psychedelic science. And I'll tell you, okay, when we first started, we had no exposure to the space. and I reached out to a guy named Ronan Levy. Ronan founded field trip, which is probably, I mean, it's a wonderful, sad story, but they're the second biggest brand in psychedelics. But I said, I really want to work for Maps. And I was able to manifest it through lots of different ways.

And met Chris Lottlicker, who is the former executive director of Maps, who has become a dear friend of mine. And, you know, met Rick Doblin and he understood that we were getting involved in the space not to make money. We're getting involved in space because we lost. The war on drugs has harmed millions and millions of people for 50 years. In part, psychedelics was criminalized through a lack of proper communications. You know, a lot of people hold Timothy Leary liable for that.

Yeah. For right or for wrong. there was the society wasn't ready for his message. And he scared the shit out of the straits. And I said, I can't let that happen again. That there is too much science that is going on to help too many people. And I have a responsibility to help shape the message so that we can help these companies get the money that they need from the capital markets to do the research. Communicate to the regulators at both the state and federal level to get them to understand what's going on.

and then communicate to the psychedelically naive and let them understand that they're they who are in pain can find relief and it is coming i love that it's a beautiful answer you know there's so much happening in the psychedelic space one of the thorny issues that i kind of see is that some people think like the certification is taking the place of initiation now those words are kind of nebulous you know what i mean by that like it's kind of a very slippery slope there's a there's a fundamental attention in the psychedelic community. Yes. Between those who want to medicalize and those who want to experience. Okay. And it is a real challenge. Of course. Because while millions and millions of people in the United States have tried LSD or psilocybin, now we're going into ayahuasca, you know, thousands.

Yes. are have done ibegain and tens of thousands maybe hundreds of thousands have tried five m eo um that's a a minuscule portion of the the entire population of the united states they the the vast majority of people understand medicine yeah right well said and they know that if i have a headache i can take aspirin or i can take a uprofen or i can take acetydomin right and they trust for the most part that this is safe and efficacious because if it's has gone through the FDA process. I mean, I'll take the politics of the CDC and the FDA out of this.

But the experiential side is the woo side, right? There are so many people who have done psychedelics. Right. It is such a profound experience that they come back and they are in the woo. Yes. Right. Of course. And if you haven't had that experience, it could be incredibly off-putting, right?

And, you know, there are. millions of people who suffer from CNS disorders, you know, central nervous systems disorders. PTSD, addiction, TBI. TBI, TBI, TBI is more of a physical disorder than a chemical disorder, but, but OCD, depression, yeah. Again, manic depression is also more of a chemical disorder. Okay, nice. Yeah, but but more like OCD, right? Like the people who have to wash your hands all the time. Yes. That is not a chemical disorder. Behavioral. It is a behavioral disorder that is often related to trauma, right? And what psychedelics do is allow you in a medical setting to revisit that. Now, do I think that there's anything wrong with going out and eating a fistful of mushrooms and going to a Grateful Dead show? Hell no. I did it when I was young.

Right. That's wonderful. And that is not what the, what MAPS was founded on, which was to medicalize MDMA plus therapy right right it is not what compass pathways is doing which is using psilocybin and therapy right it is not what a tie is doing it is not what delix is doing it's not what all of these companies are doing which is trying to find a path to get the people who need medicine the medicine and also couple it with therapy because the medicine is a door right the therapy is the way to get to where you need to get to that's a beautiful answer thank you yeah well this is what i do for I know. It's literally what I do for a living. So how do you, when you say like the woo, I think ineffable.

Like a lot of people that have this idea of ineffable. Because it's ineffable, it's really hard to wrap a message around that. And it seems like that's what you're kind of tasked to do. It is. Can you tell us some strategies? What do you think about when I say ineffable? And then maybe you could apply a strategy. So what ineffable is actually, I love the word because it literally means you can't describe it.

You can't use words to describe this experience. Right. Of course. So I don't. I just don't try. I surround it. Right. And also, I actually try and meet the person I'm talking to where they are. If I am talking to a scientist, I do the best I can to use very technical language. Well, I wouldn't say necessarily technical, but very descriptive and specific language. Right. If I am speaking to a policymaker, right, I'm also very intentional in the language I'm using.

If I'm speaking to an enthusiast, it's a very different conversation. It's much more heart-centered. Yeah. So I'm focused on meeting them where they are so that they can then be receptive to what I want them to hear. Because if I am speaking to a MAGA person about the power of psychedelics, and I come to them and start talking about heart opening and the impact on acceptance of ecology and the environment, I may turn them off.

Absolutely. Right. So if I'm talking to a MAGA person, I tend to talk to them about, you know, there are so many of our soldiers who have served overseas who become addicted to opioids. And there is no good solution for them but for Ibogaine. And Ibogaine is a long, a long lasting single use psychedelic, which allows that soldier who is suffering from PTSD to work through the pain of whatever that is so that they no longer are having a negative impact on themselves, their family, their community, in the country. right i i talk to them you know where they are i don't want to pull them or force them it's much more like who are you what do you want and how can i love it speaking of igo gain shout out to gareth moxie

and debra mash i love you was fun talking to you yesterday oh debmash is an awesome holy cat we had a long conversation yesterday deb is like legit she's serious she is and um hereith moxie too that guy's i don't know garret i'll introduce you to him you'll love them um debt but dev is amazing and And, you know, honestly, I'll tell you, it's like one of the gifts of working in this space is I get to meet all these some people who are having such massive impact on people's lives. Like, I would encourage you if you don't know them to talk to Tom Fiegel and Talia Eisenberg from Beyond. Okay. Beyond is a Mexican-based Ibogaine clinic. Right.

That is doing amazing work with using Ibogaine to help. Right. Help addiction. Help PTSD. Help. Like if you have pain that you can't find, you have psychic, spiritual, emotional pain that you have not been able to find. Right. I would encourage you to go to beyond because it's a very intentional place.

It's beautiful. I've been there yet, but I'm hoping to work with them. Yeah, absolutely. I think there's going to be some people at Psychotic Science from Gabon, like the Boititi tribe here that is going to come. It's really authentic to get to see people from the region where that plant comes from and moving on. You know, I got an interesting question. Sometimes I've been going through these ideas, and it seems to me psychedelics comes in cycles. And I feel as if we're kind of in the late 50s entering the 60s.

Like when you look at the chaos kind of going around and the move from medical into like spilling out into the artwork and stuff now, what are your thoughts on that? Is it cyclical? And are we at the 50s moving into the 60s? I don't. I actually have thought about this a lot. Okay. Please tell me. And I'm not sure the answer.

Okay. where we are in the 50s and the 60s. In the late 50s, in the 60s, there was this unbelievable acceptance, right? Yes. And curiosity. And then when we got into the mid to late 60s and then in the 70s, when the war on drugs began, psychedelics were demonized. You know, probably starting with Michael Pollan's book, there was this unbelievable. And it's called the psychedelic Renaissance, right?

But for the last two years, three years, the bloom is off the rose. Oh, well said. You know, I think the challenges that stemmed initially from Compass Pathways, Phase 2 trials, really hurt from a financial perspective. It sucked all the money out of the room. And clearly last year's failure with the FDA by Lycos was a kick in the teeth to all of us. You know, there was, if you had been here two years ago, it's psychedelic science in 23. The energy was just electric.

Like, everybody was sure that this was going to happen and that this was just the first of, you know, a series of dominoes to fall not only about psychedelics, but just overall drug policy. Right. And, you know, MAPS's failure really hurt. And Rick Doblin talked about it this morning in his plenary. But the reality is there is yet still hope. Yeah. Because there are a tremendous amount of companies doing research. Yeah.

There are many drugs that are in phase two, phase two B, phase three that are going. One of them is going to knock down the door, right? It's going to happen. And that will then open the door for everybody else. But to take it from a cultural perspective. Yeah, please. Which is one of the things I really love. Okay.

I think about Cheech and Chong. Like, ah, I've been smoke. Yeah. So they're not just, by the way, cannabis. They are drugs. Yeah. Like all kind of drugs. And if you think about Cheech's career, not Chong's career, but Cheech's career, I think parallels a large part of the way that our culture has looked at drugs.

Yeah. They started in the late 50s, in the early 60s as comedians, drug comics, right? Right. And they were incredibly popular. And they made their movies. and they were incredibly popular. And then come the 70s, they got less popular. And Cheech, and it broke up.

And Cheech went and did straight movie. Yeah. He did mainstream. He did mainstream. He did, not Nash, not Nashville. He did. One of those cops. He did, yeah, one of those cops. It wasn't a sick company.

The ultimate procedural. And he did 10 cup and he did all this stuff. And it was like drugs were out of favor. And as soon as cannabis got, became adult use in 2012, he started to get more popular again. and more popular again. And now, you know, they are back to being chitin-chom. And I really kind of like, you could, you could do this graph of like Cheech's career

versus cannabis or psychedelic acceptance. And it's on the uptick. That is a beautiful story. I never thought about it like that, but I bet you have maps on perfectly. I don't know perfectly. And I don't know right, but it's something I, like, I'm kind of crazy.

So I think about it that way. Well, I'm glad that you're kind of crazy. Because I think with language, too, how do you think psychedelics has changed? your behavior with language? Well, I mean, full disclosure, I've been clean and sober from, you know, all subcommittee since 2020. So I don't know that it has impacted me.

I don't know how. I don't know. I mean, words have always been a tool for me, you know, and I'm really thoughtful about what I say, what I write, right, and how I communicate. I think what psychedelics did for me was really allowed me to start to flex and work on my empathy muscle, which makes me, I think, more able to connect with the person I'm talking to. But I don't know how it has changed my use of language. I may have in ways I don't know.

I just, I don't know. It's ineffable. You know, the governor was here today, and he had a pretty powerful message. I was wondering if we could talk about that message. Sure. Can you, would you be so kind as to tell the audience myself what the governor said today? You are all free. Freedom. Well, I think what, and I didn't hear word for word, what he said. I do know what what he said was that in Colorado, if you have been incarcerated for a drug crime related to a drug that is now legally in the state, you have been pardoned and you will be released, as long as it is not a violent crime.

Right. So if you were arrested for holding an ounce of mushrooms, be free. If you were arrested for holding on to Ibogaine or other plant medicines, you are now free. And I think it is a huge move not just for Colorado. Colorado as a state is amazing, right? It is a progressive state, not in the way that you would think of the word that the way the word progressive has been used. But it is a forward-thinking state. It was the first state in the country to allow for adult-use cannabis at the same time that Washington State.

Yeah. It has set up, you know, a medicalized psychedelics community infrastructure here, and they just started serving patients here. So it does not surprise me that Jared Bullis said, how can we keep people in jail for? crime that is now legal. It's raw. And I think that's beautiful. And I think it will, it will spread across the country to other states with leaders who are as forward looking as him. And I don't think it is to be the color of your shirt. It's not a red-blue issue. Right. It's a justice issue. Yeah. You know, when you look at Texas, for example, they just passed a law that is putting $50 million towards Ibegan research. I mean, you don't get redder in Texas.

Right? You know, Ken Abbott is the governor of Texas is a died in the world conservative. And, you know, he has been exposed to enough people who suffer from opioid use disorder and said, how can I as a God-fearing man deny them access to a plant that was put on this planet by God? I think we all know the answer to though. He didn't. He said he let that. He's actually supporting it. He's actually supporting it. And you're like Rick Perry, the former governor of Texas, who is not somebody who is an enthusiast, right? He is not somebody who uses intoxicating substances, said, I can't allow our veterans who have been so honorable in serving our country, not be served by our country. Right.

Yeah, truly an amazing time to see what happened in Texas with Ibo game. It almost happened in Kentucky. And we see all these things that have you talked to Brian Hubbard? I haven't, but I would love to. I would encourage you to talk to my team. I will try and set them up for you. Brian's awesome. And he was in Kentucky.

Okay, very nice. He's, well, he almost got it across the finish line in Kentucky and then he pivoted. So Brian's awesome. Yeah. And he's just awesome. Yeah. I've heard so much cool stuff about him from so many amazing people. I'm like, how do I get to talk to this guy?

I think I found my bridge here. Yes. You know, I know you have a lot of things to do, but I have one last question. True. And you can. me a couple of them okay fantastic okay so um if you had to if you had to craft a campaign slogan for humanity's future with psychedelics what would it be breathe breathe us okay tell us about that look the the there is a real problem with the way i think that most people view the world

which is that they see it as you and me right we right and that there is this um and they also look at themselves as this is my mind and this is my body and they are not connected right and um i think i think one of the things that psychedelics teaches people that um connection teaches people is that we are all together one right um and for me i have to remember to be in my body right right yeah i am not my mind and by the way my mind is both here and literally my gut right because i had the entire brain down here. So if I am able to slow down and take a slow, deep breath in, it centers me, and I can hear what I need to hear. And when I can hear it, then I can do it. So if we can all just take a slow, deep breath together, things get a lot easier. I love it. I heard a great quote that said,

the difference between illness and wellness is eye and we. Yeah. You know, it's pretty profound when you start thinking about the way words are crafted. Well, look, addiction is a disease. at its core of isolation. Yeah. Right. Yes. But recovery is based on community. Like, one cannot be healthy alone. There's a difference between loneliness and solitude. Solitude is being comfortable in your own body by yourself, but nobody wants to be by themselves forever. We are as animals, right, communal and pack animals. We need to touch and be with other people. right um and we need to connect so i love that the difference between illness and wellness is i and and and we get goosebumps when i think about yeah you know it's profound to think about the

idea of just breathing and slowing down and illness and wellness and all these things that are happening around us today let me jump over here to another one sure what's the truth you've learned through this work that you would never say at a press release oh that's an easy one it's here i need Well, that's a tough one. No, it isn't. It's an easy one. Is it an easy one? My God, most people don't want to do it.

Well, I can't speak for anybody else but me. Right. But I think we're all taught to be strong. Right. And the definition of strength is the ability to do one by, to be able to do by oneself. I don't, that was not me. I tried that forever. And the reality is I am way stronger when I'm with others.

Yeah. And when I can lean on somebody else. Right. Right. Like, you know, there's a saying that the chain is only a strongest, weakest link. Yep. That's bullshit, right? A chain is only as strong as all of the links together. Right. Because if that weak link isn't supported by all of the other links in the chain, then the whole chain falls apart. That weak link needs to ask for support and from help from other people so it can be strengthened. So, yeah, that's that for me is asking for help. Like asking for health has actually help is honestly a sign of strength to know where I end and you. begin and how you can help me to be what I need to become.

Yeah. It takes a lot of courage too on some level. Yeah, fear is a liar. Woo! Break that down for us. Fear is a liar. Did you ever see the movie Animal House? Of course. John Volusia, you can...

But there's a scene in Animal House where one of the characters has the devil on one shoulder and the angel on the other, right? Most of us have that devil in our shoulder telling us, if you do this, this bad thing is going to happen. is going to happen. If you do that, something bad is going to happen. And it wants us to not, to not be authentic, not to be honest, not to be present. It wants us to listen to the lie that is telling us of the consequence of not. And the reality is that lie is worse, by the way, than whatever is going to happen. So for me, I just have to remind myself that I just have to be

present and honest and fear. And it's all going to work out. Like, I'm going to be fine. Yeah. It's a brilliant point. I think most people, whether it's addiction or other things, it's the fear. You make up all these excuses around why you can't do it or why you're not good enough to do it. But at the end of the day, I think that's fear.

It's fear of actually touching the person that you really are, trying to become the very best version of yourself. And accepting who you are. And I think that's the gifts that psychedelics can bring people. is that they can look in the mirror and like what they see. Right. And that's a gift. You know, psychedelic seems to have this sort, at least for me, in my experience, it seems to have this ability to turn you into the observer.

And you can walk through the places without the shame and guilt really pushing on. Have you ever noticed that? No, I can't say I've had that experience. I understand what you're saying. But look, especially with MDMA. I think what things about my understanding of that DMA is, especially and for somebody who is suffering from PTSD is it allows them to re-experience the traumatic event right from a remove and to move it from the frontal lobe into the back okay so that

it is no longer present right because somebody who's suffering from PTSD the shit that happened to them is happening to them constantly constantly so um i get it i just haven't been called to it in my experience it's beautiful let me sum it up here with this final question and that is What's the message beneath the message you spent your career sending? The one only that psychonauts might hear. Be here now. Beautiful. Yeah.

Cool. Be here now. This was beautiful. I'm really grateful for your time. And thank you for everything you're doing here. Thank you for allowing me. Yeah. And that's all we got for today, ladies and gentlemen.

I hope you had a beautiful day. Talk to you next time. Aloha. Are those old people who watched?