TrueLife - Tanya Griffin - Sex, Drugs, & Counterculture

Starting point is 00:00:00 Darkness struck, a gut-punched theft, sun ripped away, her health bereft. I roar at the void. This ain't just fate, a cosmic scam I spit my hate. The games rigged tight, shadows deal, blood on their hands, I'll never kneel. Yet in the rage, a crack ignites, occulted sparks cut through the nights. The scars my key, hermetic and stark. To see, to rise, I hunt in the dark. fumbling, furious through ruins maze, lights my war cry, born from the blaze.

Starting point is 00:00:36 The poem is Angels with Rifles, The track, I Am Sorrow, I Am Lust by Codex Serafini. Check out the entire song at the end of the cast. ladies and gentlemen welcome back to the true life podcast i hope you're all having a beautiful holiday season prepared to be inspired by a force of nature in entrepreneurship and women's health she is a serial visionary who has built scaled and transformed businesses across two continents and an extraordinary range of industries from cpg and retail to fintech reg tech med tech healthcare, pharmacy, restaurants, manufacturing, distribution, and now boldly pioneering into sex tech. With unrelenting passion, she turns dreams into thriving realities, adapting, innovating, and leading with integrity every step of the way.

Starting point is 00:01:44 Her superpower pairing razor-sharp business development acumen with an infectious positive spirit that restores balance, common sense, and heart to everything she touches. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome, Tanya Griffin. and thank you for being here. Thank you, George. Wow. That was quite the intro. I appreciate it. I'm stoked you're here.

Starting point is 00:02:08 Like you have been crushing. We've been talking on these back channel forums for a while. And of course, our work has been intersecting here and there. And so the conversation is long overdue. That's right. I agree. Man. You know, before we got started, we were warming up.

Starting point is 00:02:25 And we were talking about poetry. and you were giving me some awesome compliments on my poetry. I was. Thank you. Thank you. And I wish I could take 100% all credit for the poetry. But for everybody listening, checking out my poems, I got to tell you, they are inspired by me. I am merely the trembling hand.

Starting point is 00:02:44 And I use AI to clean up all of my stuff out there. And I highly recommend everybody do it. You should be using AI and these tools to create the very best versions of yourself. Don't be afraid, my friends. They're not coming to get you. They're really not. They're really not. How have you been using AI these days, Tanya?

Starting point is 00:03:03 You know, like you as a tool, and we'll get into WeFlowyo, but when you start building tech stacks and, you know, med tech and all that kind of stuff, if you don't use AI, you don't have a product. You don't have a tool. So it's short-sided to say that we have to, that we can be Luddites and sort of bury our head in the ground and not participate in this technology for sure. Yeah, I think that's really well said. You know, I was talking to someone last week and we were talking about AI and people were

Starting point is 00:03:39 talking about all the videos that are watching and consuming all this stuff. But I really think, Tanya, the answer to consuming is creating. And these tools are so powerful no matter what you're building. Like you have these tools at your disposal where you have the same technology that a Fortune 500 had, you know, five years ago. There's really no limits to what you can create out there. Well, I think that's a great point, George. I mean, it makes us singularly more powerful. So if we can compete with those big guys, I do toggle between making sure I maintain my authentic self and my, you know, tone, my voice. But you know, yourself, AI can mimic that tone.

Starting point is 00:04:23 So we just haven't really, I'm still learning. I am not an expert in AI yet, but I know that I need to be. Not that experts, a big, strong word. I'm still trying to grapple with how to use it as a tool, which is what we're talking about. I don't want my voice overrun, but I certainly want to lean on time-saving solutions like AI. It would be silly not to, short-sighted. Yeah. Well, I think you're an expert, like an experience. And I think that that's where, I think that's where people are old, George. I see you over there. That's my age. The no king's protest with the sign. I see you out there living in your life. Oh, yeah. Well, I'm shameless in the sense that I'm not going to hold my voice back. And I do have decades now under my belt.

Starting point is 00:05:18 Yeah. For that. Yes. You know, when I think of authenticity, like I think, that especially with AI, I think the spoken word, like what we're doing today, like that's a real form of the authentic way in which you can't hide, like the way you express yourself, dancing, being out in the street, getting to use the spoken word, going to these different places, like building these things together. I think that is the way in which we can really read our authenticity out there. And it seems like you've been doing it for a long time. Yeah, you know, I'm first restaurant when I was 20, 30 years maybe, 30 plus years. I've been doing it for a minute.

Starting point is 00:05:57 You have. Question. Yes. So 30, is that how you got started telling you? You started in the restaurant business? Well, when I, you know, I was, I'm the oldest of 10 kids. So I grew up just dirt poor, you know, half the time the lights were being turned off. So from a very young age, I started.

Starting point is 00:06:19 waiting tables. You know, by 15, I was lying about my age and waiting tables. I love waiting tables. And so, you know, fast forward at five years doing that, you end up in the right position to, it was a turnkey. My first restaurant was a turnkey. I took it over for a Lebanese restaurant. This is in the 90s. Remember in the 90s in Lebanon and AIDS? Everything was just a mess in the 90s. So I was in the right place at the right time, and then I ended up opening a falafel market on St. Louis Hughes campus. And then I, you know, started having had my first child, and the restaurant business is hard when you're popping out babies. So that's when I started kangaroo kids. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:07:05 So, but the restaurants, that was my first, that was my first entrepreneurial sort of dance, I shall call it. Man. How old were you when you had your first kid? I was 27, I think, 1995. I had Sam in 95. I was born in 1968. Somebody out there's got to do the math. But those are the raw numbers too. I think I was around 26 or 27. Something in there. I think I was 37. I think I was 37.

Starting point is 00:07:42 Yeah. Doing at that point, I like it. yeah I that's what I tell myself I tell myself I know what I'm doing but there's so much uncertainty out there and how much does the world change when you have kids like all of a sudden like you're given this whole new window into like whoa what's going on over here it's it changes you know and again I my world when you're the oldest of 10 kids I would argue you have minions of course but you know I if that's in the world of I was changing cloth diapers dunking him in the toilet from the time I was, you know, eight, nine. So that was just so much a part of my world.

Starting point is 00:08:22 And then I transitioned directly into marriage. I didn't, you know, Irish Catholic. You don't fuck before you marry. I didn't know the difference. So I married. First one was an Irish poet. Learn your trade. That means I supported them financially. Of course. that's why when I saw your poetry coming after me I was like is he a working poet what's going on what's George up to over there yeah I had my step with a poet and then the next stop was a guitar player

Starting point is 00:08:54 so what do you do you know man you are sex drugs and rock and roll from the beginning through and through baby you feel like sometimes I feel like we're in the midst of that transition again I grew up like a gin exor. So I didn't catch the 60s too much. But I was a huge fan of them, like all like the Ginsberg and like the music that came

Starting point is 00:09:16 out of there and the weather underground, like all this turmoil. Like yeah, these guys are doing it. Well, George, of course, you know, I mean, I don't know what your collective Spotify age was, but mine was 74. Like that I live in that space of, you know, I would get down with Mick Jagger in a heartbeat. So, I mean, it just depends on. where your music vibe lies, but mine is certainly pretty set in the mid-60s, I would say. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:09:49 Push it up a little into the 70s, but, you know, mid-60s, late 60s is the sweet spot for sure. Do you feel like we're coming back to that? Like when I spend all this time in the psychedelic world and like I go to some of these places and I'm like, oh, I can see it right here. Like maybe that's why I'm drawn to it. But I kind of feel like we're on the cusp of this creative explosion. Am I being too optimistic? Oh, gosh, I hope not.

Starting point is 00:10:14 I kind of live in counterculture myself. And, you know, if you saw my house, if I gave you the full 360, you would see just everything is mid-century. So you would have thought you had walked into the 1960s if you're in my home, for sure. And everything I wear. So I haven't, I have revisited and decided not to leave. no i don't want to go back to the 80s and 90s remember that george oh you know come on i don't want to go back to the big hair and some of that music was good but i'm i'm sticking with the 60s yeah i'm not um there's a great book called back to the 80s and in that book

Starting point is 00:10:58 they talk about uh how like that's when propaganda really started kind of folding out and you looking at all messaging that was all in in the eighties i do right yeah well you and i were probably about the same age so we were just you know coming out of high school so it was kind of our jam but it was a punk scene like the dead kennedy's like it didn't it was changing a lot it was big hair and yeah confused disco like where were we 80s it was a rough it was a rough spin for sure do you feel like i kind of feel like i want to be an agent of bringing back this counterculture and i see all the things you're doing i think that's why we align so much i'm like tanya gets it like she is like a midwife of this new counterculture wow that's quite the i

Starting point is 00:11:55 hope we're going back i mean if we look at like you know 1967 of course that was the summer of love But it went bad. It started to turn. Right. I thought when I was born, it started to turn. But there was something beautiful and poetic about, you know, dial in, drop in, tuned out, you know, all of everything where we had some respect for the classical psychedelic, LSD. Yeah. So, well, Simon even took a bad seat to LSD back in, you brought up Ginsburg and, you know, and those.

Starting point is 00:12:33 guys, I mean, I certainly appreciate that time period, counterculture, and the, and the confrontation it created against the status quo. And I think there's an energy right now in the world that says, we've had it. We don't want this anymore. We're going to fight a little bit. Yeah. I see it. I know. Me too. I get excited. Like, I drive. I drive. I'll drive my daughter to school. And there's like people on bridges holding signs, you know. And for me, it's not even so much about like what the sign says. It's just people in the streets that have had enough.

Starting point is 00:13:16 And I'm like, look at these people, man. I got to get out there. Look at these guys. Well, I think there's, I think for a minute, you know, we can use LinkedIn. Because I think some of some people have jumped on through LinkedIn. You know, recently I've seen a change where, where you. can speak your voice, you can speak out against certain things. But early on, even at the beginning of the year, let's say, there was a fear out there. It was palpable. You know, you could feel

Starting point is 00:13:46 it that individuals were not speaking up and that's kind of changing. And I think we need more of it because collectively we're a force. Yeah. You know, if the one percenters and a fraction of the one percenters are really what's controlling the dialogue and how we operate. Do not stand a chance if we stand together and have a voice. And you're bringing that. You're bringing that to the forefront, not only with your poetry. So let's know. I think we have to stand up and stop being, living in fear and shame.

Starting point is 00:14:29 We know collectively those of us. who dig into sex and drugs and even rock and roll. We know collectively that prohibition and fear mongering and stigma and shame were counterproductive, so much so that they were absolutely dangerous, dangerous to our young people. It incarcerated whole groups of people. I mean, all of this.

Starting point is 00:14:54 We all know who are listening here, but we've had enough. This is enough. We've got to push it back now. You've written quite a bit on shame when I was looking through some of the some of the newsletter. Like I've seen a few different articles on there. Like maybe you could talk a little bit more about that.

Starting point is 00:15:12 Like it's a really powerful force in our in our world and in our families and in our communities. Yeah. And I agree. I do. If I have any so much, George. Yeah. It is pushing back on shame and stigma. And yes, around drugs and the egg in the frying.

Starting point is 00:15:32 pan and dare, all of those things that were so relevant to us growing up. I mean, let's talk about shame in our generation versus the new kids. We grew up in a lot of religion, whether it was Catholicism or any kind of Christianity which had opinions on how and when we had sex on abstinence. It terrified us around drugs and put all of our drugs into one. bucket very very dangerous not to allow discourse and education to sign through it's super dangerous to our children that we're that we have no differentiation between cannabis and heroin cannabis and fentanyl psilocybin and fentanyl so that is dangerous and i think we need to

Starting point is 00:16:25 stop that from happening and part of that is to have discourse about it the reason i'm so Fourth right, maybe that's the word, I don't know, about having sex every day or talking about sex and talking about using drugs is I have multiple companies, I have six kids, I have grandkids, I do prioritize having sex every day. I double down on the weekends, of course, but at least during the week, you know, I make sure that's a priority. And if I don't talk about it and make it normal for others. How can others feel at ease in that space? They're going to bring forth, you know, the don't have sex till your marriage. By the way, till you're married, terrible idea. I tried that. Couldn't have been a worse idea. Of course, I proselytize to my children who your children,

Starting point is 00:17:23 George, as you know, will generally, it's the whole concept of reverse psychology, right? They will do the opposite of what you say so of course i was always about you know go explore fuck everyone boys girls go just just dig in and and have fun and learn and of course they didn't have my boys they're both married super monogamous children so you know ladies and gentlemen out there if you want your kids do not do what you do be a leader in that space no that's unfair to say and then they do that but i do think that we have an obligate i personally have decided that that that in this space of shame i am fearless and if i don't get out there and you know i have a sex brand where it gives me a platform to go talk to others about

Starting point is 00:18:23 you know something as simplest oral sex when i first started this a decade ago i'd speak to groups and I'd get this fear around oral sex or I don't like it and I would say why let's talk about it and of course even the most prudent of individuals work up they listen they're no longer in fear and headlights you know people are interested in these things whether it's sex or drugs or you know oh we take in media all of these things we're better off discussing them with each I think yeah what kind of pushback do you get like I would imagine yeah I would imagine that there's tons of people that talk about like wait what if they're not ready what if they make a mistake or you know what are you doing you get to have a pushback there's always pushback

Starting point is 00:19:15 and in my instinct when I get that fear and shame is to lean in you know what I mean I would I breastfed my kids like an African woman came her kids was basically a resale and maternity words that are and I'd always get this I'd be nursing one of the kids and I would get all of this resistance how can you do that that's you know and just the the shame just emanating from someone and so even back then I said you know I may be done when they when they hit prom so what I tend to do is lean into that shame with others and let them see that you know what maybe I am on the other extreme meeting them so again until we talk about it until we open dialogue how do any of us face our shame why do you think that there is so much same like you know it's interesting to think that

Starting point is 00:20:10 a woman would be shame for breastfeeding in public oh listen it's crazy to think about women are shamed for our sexuality so let's be real about what it means to be feminine okay and female and that it is scary for others who aren't at ease with themselves to watch open sexuality or breastfeed. Any of these very natural things, these very feminine things, we collectively as the world, but we as religious institutions have worked very hard to not allow women to be authentic. So breastfeeding, that should be the most base of things, right? That is the most healthy way of getting your child, your offspring sustenance, and then take that to procreation. So wearing the religious hat, we are all about procreation.

Starting point is 00:21:17 All of our religions are, you know, go forth and procreate but don't have sex. Like, I love confronting the hypocrisy and the contradictions there. I don't know what to say about that other than we are, I think, culturally terrified of female sexuality. And by extension, if anyone thinks that female sexuality is a part of breastfeeding, that is just, we have so much work to do there. But we got to start somewhere, and that is confronting all of their puritanical views, which are not necessarily healthy. That's bringing it. That's not how we are as humans.

Starting point is 00:22:02 As humans, we want to have sex with each other. It's pleasurable. As humans, we absolutely want to get high. Come on. I don't know which of us don't, but as someone who does get high, I can tell you, dialing them. that in and hitting that sweet spot consistently, that's a win. That's not something in my life I'm going to give them.

Starting point is 00:22:28 And I hope others are as lucky as me to be able to find that. I agree. I really think there's something to be said about, you know, experiencing life and all of its heights, you know, I've, I'm no stranger to different kinds of drug use and everything I've done is on my podcast right here. I'm pretty open about it. Let me play devil's advocate on this. I would love to get your opinion.

Starting point is 00:22:54 What about the difference between open sexuality and like the porn industry? Because sometimes in the porn industry, you see like a lot of radical abuse. Like some of it's way out of control. Like there's a lot of violence and then there's a lot of trafficking and stuff like that. How do we send out a clear message like sex is okay? But hey, there's some lines we probably shouldn't cross. Like how do you delineate that? It's such a good question.

Starting point is 00:23:18 and here's what i want to bring a height into it okay we do about it and let's talk about it in the framework of something like lincoln where which is where we the older people go and communicate and share you know papers and ideas and stuff like that so on lincoln and i'm going to get to the porn issue so we can go all the way to fisting in porn where it's extreme and it's abusive or or pedophilia or any of those things. But then to the other side of the spectrum, we have shamed basic education and female sexuality. So why can't we differentiate between pedophilia and strangulation without moderation

Starting point is 00:24:06 and all of these things that we know inherently, and I think AI can figure it out, If they can fix and upgrade your poetry, why can't we differentiate between what is educational, what is inherently authentic female sexuality and pedophilia to be the extreme version of pornography? So I think that we have to stop letting the pendulum swing to the extremes and live in the nuance here for a minute. because we can't push back on who we are as individuals because of the extremes. And I am always concerned, George, about the slippery slope of censorship, right? So not that I'm with regard to pornography, if you want to know what I love, I love a good Tito brass.

Starting point is 00:25:04 So this is, you know, this is, I like the old school pornography. Yes, it has the male gaze, you know, these big, breasted women in this beautiful photography. So I take my porn in snippets like that. And I'm going to argue, you know, if you're having sex with a partner and you can lock down that media, you know your camera broadcast to your TV, make your own porn, my friends. You know, that one's cleaned up.

Starting point is 00:25:34 So I think to answer your question, It sickenes me to see that we're letting child pornography and some of these extreme, aggressive, abusive pornography take down what is good and authentic about male and female sensuality and sexuality. So we don't need to live in these extremes. We've got to come back to a happy medium here and be able to speak freely. That would be my answer, I think. No, it makes perfect sense. I mean, we are adults. Like, you know what is right and you know what is wrong.

Starting point is 00:26:16 Like, it's just, I think there's a money aspect to it too. It seems that like you would mention the extremes. People gravitate towards the extremes. And even when you watch the news, like you're focused on the car crash, you know, the same as you're focused on the fisting or something crazy like that. Like, you don't have to be right there. Like that shouldn't be like the. the be all like you should that i don't know that shouldn't be something that is i don't know if i

Starting point is 00:26:42 can think of the right word for it but the mainstream of of that aspect of the industry well i here's here's where we have a problem and i think i i saw a reel on this i can't remember your man who speaks on this but i think it was a little real with opra but we used to when we were growing up it was sex cells right it was always sex cells that's what doesn't but apparently what sells now outsell sex is rage in our social media algorithm so if you and that's a quick Google for everyone to go down the rabbit hole on that but that's sad and depressing I would prefer that we were selling sex yeah or rage and if we look at the creator economy um I mean let's let's talk about only fans yeah great point I mean highest revenue I think they did six billion

Starting point is 00:27:36 So they beat out Zuckerberg and all these other yahoos. And this is a way for us to allow women and men to be creators, get the money themselves. So there is benefits to that. Come on, Onlyfans. I don't take my close up, but I share my articles because I do have respect for platforms that allow an open dialogue and don't censor behavior, especially something that I as a grown-up, as an adult, feel that I should be able to communicate to you, George, a fellow adult with no harm. So if we take it back to the base level, I am not hurting you, other humans, or myself. I mean, this is obviously a libertarian view that I am,

Starting point is 00:28:29 that is deeply entrenched in my being. But if I'm not hurting you, please, let me. me be let me have my drugs let me have my sex um and i'll be a kinder person for it i promise you right because when you take those things away from you from me um and i of course i don't i keep them at play in my life i think i'd be pretty grumpy george if you took my sex and drugs i might want to live in rage with the rest of these yahos Yeah. There's such an interesting parallel between sex and drugs because everybody, at least, I would say most people I know have been to a party where someone took some drugs and they were way out of control. And then that ruins it for everybody. Right. And same thing with sex too. Like all of a sudden when someone takes a, it turns into rape instead of like a pleasurable thing or turns into this thing. I think that on some level, you know, it's not so much the sex or the drug.

Starting point is 00:29:35 It's the individual's inability to sort of bridge that gap. You know, maybe it's their own personal trauma. Yeah. Yeah. Maybe it's an IQ thing. Maybe it's a pain thing. I don't know. But like that's part of the problem.

Starting point is 00:29:49 We really want to go down the IQ thing because you and I, we could do that, George. I know. It might be. I don't know. I have no idea. I think it's probably trauma on some aspect, you know. Or IQ weighs into it. Okay.

Starting point is 00:30:04 Let's hear it. I think trauma is there. I think, you know, that self-awareness is a big deal in the world. And, of course, drugs used in moderation can certainly elevate self-awareness, elevate your senses, awareness of yourself. They can hit your default mode. They can hit your ego. So there is value in those things.

Starting point is 00:30:31 But if you take it too far to the other side, by contrast, you lose that self-awareness. So there's something to be said about, you know, not obviously moderation. We should all be considerate of moderation, but dialing in that sweet stock. So microdosing when we're talking about these drugs and doing things with intention where there is an objective. So when I do drugs, I do them with crazy intention. I track them. I know the application.

Starting point is 00:31:04 I've been doing this for years. That's we flow you because I understand that I can get to a very exact, crazy, incredible place in terms of elevating my senses and self-awareness. And that connects with sex, obviously. That when you learn and you practice doing that, there's something very magical in that space once you've dialed it in. Yeah. I remember being like a Gen Xer and you would always hear about some of these crazy parties.

Starting point is 00:31:40 You know what I mean? It's a great way. Like if you're going to have some sort of parties, it's probably be invite only. You know what I mean? You're like all these parties or like full on day parties? All of them. I don't know that I'd want to go to a ditty party. I don't think he's having any right now.

Starting point is 00:31:57 You're going to have to wait about 50 months. He might be having some parties in prison. He might be the bell of the ball. That's right. it's so crazy to think about all that aspects of that what you brought up floyo like what is going on over there like what yeah stage i've been working on this for a while now george but my my interest and i come out of a world that uh over the last 30 years maybe the last really 20 that was hyper focused on med tech i built a solution called connect with docs that created a

Starting point is 00:32:31 a primary care solution that allowed you to do hippocomplying communication and lower the cost and then got into reg tech and thin tech software and cannabis space around banking. So that development phase and using tech to make us better as humans has always been of interest to me. What I understand about drugs and particularly drugs and flow states. So for me, let's define what a flow state is. Absolutely right up there at the top, for me, orgasmic pleasure is a flow state. But so is my runner's high.

Starting point is 00:33:13 When I swim and I get into that single thought, you know, just drop into that one moment. That is a flow state. You know, when you write your poetry before AI steps up, that is a flow state. right? So for me, a big part of this counterculture and getting back to, you know, the world of LSD and dropping in and dialing in is being able to understand microdosing and dialing in these drugs and stacking these drugs. I mean, we can look at Paul Stamis, for example. So he, obviously, he's a big man of psilocybin, right? And he also believes in stacking these things. So whether that's, niacin or lion's name. When we look at these drugs, we need to understand the dosing. We need to

Starting point is 00:34:08 understand the application, how we're tracking it. And I would argue as important as any of those three, the contraindications. So, for example, you know, psilocybin and LSD, they don't go great together, but did you know that? Whereas LSD stacked with MDMA, that's a good marriage if you do it correctly and you get the dosing doubt incorrectly. MDMA, for example, at the wrong dose is going to make you very sick no matter who you are. Its job is to turn your stomach and make you nauseous before you finally, you know, get rolling. So I think that what we've lost in this demonizing and fearmongering around drugs is the safety and education around drugs. And so if we start encrypting, you know, so obviously you don't want me to know what drugs

Starting point is 00:35:08 you're using. However, if you're grace plus wobly with hero hearts and you're running these studies, you would like to have that data, anonymous data, so that we start as a, as a, as a culture, you're having benchmarks around how to use those drugs. Now, you and I are in the, in the psychedelics world. So we can go to wikycyconot.comnet. And that, that website keeps falling down. And we can kind of read through and figure out contradications. But guess who doesn't?

Starting point is 00:35:44 Guess who doesn't get good drugs? My kids, my kids get drugs because the drugs are everywhere. They're readily available. we all have access to drugs, but because we have chosen not to allow education and information about dosing to proliferate and that we have access to, we've created a very dangerous situation. You're handed drugs at a party. So I, because I preach on this and preach is a big word, I think I'm going to pull it back,

Starting point is 00:36:20 even proselytizes. There you go. But because it's my soapbox, you know, years ago, I started a nonprofit called saved my life. So for example, what that does is I give out free Narcan, which is naloxone navel spray. So if you are at risk of an overdose or you have taken a pill, hand it to you at a party, and it happens to be laced with fentanyl, you could be dead. So we should all have Narcan with us. If we're at a party, it doesn't mean that you're a junkie, there should be no shame or stigma around that. But if we don't educate each other and speak openly about it, we're killing our kids. We're killing our family members, our neighbors, our loved ones. That is absolutely unacceptable because we've got a few right-wing, you know, zealots who think that it's okay to withhold this information from each other.

Starting point is 00:37:17 That's not okay. We need to be open about it. And we are doing drugs. We've never stopped doing drugs, George. They just bubble up into different caldrons. That doesn't mean we've ever stopped doing it. We just change the way we shamed them or prohibit them, which we've done for 100 years. That's unacceptable.

Starting point is 00:37:41 It's out of control. It's out of control. Not only have we not stopped doing them, but we've glorified. like the worst of them like I don't have any problem with alcohol like I've drinking so much in the past it's ridiculous it's out of control however in my older days I'm like man I can't even I would rather do like an eighth or I would rather do some microdosing or if I'm going to be home you know what I'll figure out some LSD or something like that but I think I'm going to go out and drink like a seven jack and red bulls you know just be wrecked for two days like we run on

Starting point is 00:38:16 alcohol and it's glorified. It's in the music. It's in the bar. It's everywhere out there. George, here's what's so exciting to me about watching alcohol. Here's what we're watching from the data. Gen Z, which you got to always follow the younger generations. We're old people, but when you look to the younger generations to drive culture, Gen Z is ditching the alcohol. Furthermore, they're leaning, of course they love the classical psychedelics. So, DMA. They're a big fans of ketamine, obviously. But psilocybin, LSD, pink cocaine, these cosmetic drugs, these are their drugs. And they're not going to bars. They love social wellness events. They love yoga and dance. And, you know, the rest of us are going to follow suit. But the fact that

Starting point is 00:39:10 alcohol is taking a back seat to even THC in our liquor stores right now, I know that's getting pulled back with the recent, you know, big, beautiful bill. And we want to separate D8, D9, D10, beverages. And that's something that we're going to have to navigate. But here's what we learned when those numbers hit the double-digit billions overnight is that if there's a good alternative to alcohol, which you can't sleep well on it and makes you mean and angry, in, you know, I'm an Irish Catholic. So alcohol, George, has just ripped through my family trust. It's destroyed family members in such an aggressive way that as someone inside of that tragedy,

Starting point is 00:39:59 you're like, yeah, 10 mix of LSD, that's not a bad solution, you know, to a fifth of Jack and Red Bull. I don't know, which is worse. I don't know if it's the Jack Daniels. or the sugar in the Red Bull, which are those white powders are more devastating to individuals, right? So I think we got to be smart and we got to see. For me, again, you brought it up, but it starts with stop shaming my sex and trots. Let's talk about it. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:40:35 And when people get upset and they do get very upset with me when I speak this, this language and how dare I. I think it's, I, I lean in and confront them. I think, well, why do you think the sugar and the alcohol is okay? Because those are just, you know, that's killing humanity for sure. More than the cannabis is. Cannabis just is not killing us. Yeah. It's, you know, you don't ever see the studies on that.

Starting point is 00:41:06 Like, those are kept quiet or they don't do them. But how many of the violent crimes are adjacent to alcohol? Like I would say the majority of them Like you were just in the wrong state of awareness Like it puts you Much like psychedelics put you And do a different state of awareness So too does alcohol

Starting point is 00:41:22 And these other drugs put you in a lower state Like a lower vibration of awareness So kind of a base level You're doing all these base things You know you're like what are you doing That's such a base level We try to live up here and see the world A little bit more clear

Starting point is 00:41:34 Yeah to be in like Well if you look at you know If we look at the homeless crisis And it's like moses around You know meth and what's happening with tranks and the escalation, even in fentanyl, you start to understand that, yes, those are completely different vibrations. My little bit of LSD is very different than the psychosis put upon individuals.

Starting point is 00:41:59 You know, we give them homes and they rip them apart, not because they're bad individuals. These are not bad individuals. This is a drug that is putting you into psychosis. alcohol, you know, could be a lesser version of that. But, you know, we always got to up our game as humans. So, and that includes when we're getting high. That's the danger, of course, in getting high is that people don't understand microdosing and how to dial in moderation.

Starting point is 00:42:28 Because if you do, my goodness, can the world be perfect. My little bubble's perfect. I can tell you that. I have orchestrated, George. the most perfect of worlds, but it's because it's done with intention and deliberate. Yeah, and like a big dose of self-love, which is the opposite of some of these other drugs. Absolutely. It's happening.

Starting point is 00:42:55 I talk to so many people in startups, in the tech industry, and psychedelics, and they're all using these the same way a functional person might use a cup of coffee. You know what I mean? And there's a coffee machine in every break room and every building and every part of the world. Maybe there should be like a microdosing station at every building and every place somewhere. That's right. Well, that's interesting. And of course, we come in, George, with so much fear around the classical psychedelics. And let's just say LSD and psilocybin.

Starting point is 00:43:31 Let's just use those two because all of the fear mongering around. around the outliers. So if you're predisposed to psychosis or schizophrenia or something that it can trigger and for me, that is enough to say, you know, I have a sex brand, oh yes, and I do put cannabinoids in it, THC, CBD, CBD, CBG to our beans.

Starting point is 00:43:55 I'm okay with that. Where I'm not selling classical psychedelics, that's the choice that even that little margin of air is not okay with me. So on that side of the work, That's where we flow you comes in. It's very important to me to educate people so that they can figure this out for themselves instead of just taking a pill at a party and not understanding how to navigate that experience.

Starting point is 00:44:22 That's where the danger lies, in my opinion. It's not that these drugs aren't good. I posted something the other day. I have five drugs I'm taken to my grave and I'm going to tell you what they are. Obviously, right up there at the top of my list is caffeine. is copy. Every day, I have myself a Cortado. We sold some, you know, like a Wollitzer and a Gibson amp and a little guitar and got a magnificent Italian espresso machine, right? You know, right off the boat from Italy, because that's a drug I want every day. I love that one. I'm an old lady. So I'm

Starting point is 00:45:00 throwing topical estrogen and oral estrogen in that mix. I will die. popping that pill. And let's see, what are my other drug? Well, of course, silicone lube. I wouldn't go a day. I have vaccinated in every room. I wouldn't go a day without silicone lube. And then my classical psychedelics are crazy important.

Starting point is 00:45:24 Did I forget a drug, coffee? Certainly lube. Cannabis. You know, cannabis is an anti-inflammatory. It lets me just drop in. and be chill. And that doesn't mean that I, I'm shy all the time. I'm certainly not high now, not during working hours usually, but if I'm creating, if I'm in a yoga class, there's something wonderful about a 10 milligram gummy that lets it come up in the right in the middle of my hot yoga

Starting point is 00:45:59 class. It's just me and my mat, baby, like no one else exists. And that's okay. That's a good thing but those are all done with intention um and drugs aren't bad but don't let's not pretend that sugar isn't a drug that these other drugs that we alcohol these are all drugs that as a society we've embraced you know we love a snickers yeah we're you know jack daniels and five bull or you know all day long so we got to get an even playing field and stop pretending that some of of these drugs are worse than others, let's discuss them all and put them out in the open. I love it. I love it.

Starting point is 00:46:44 You know what, if I bring it back to the idea of counterculture. Yeah. Yeah. And the idea of you spoke about how flow yo and some of the test you're developing allow the individual to be responsible by understanding what dose is right for them, how it makes them feel, how it interacts in there. And I can't help but think maybe part of the reason for this just say no that we grow up in or the abstinence is that these sort of drugs raise your awareness and they break down boundaries.

Starting point is 00:47:13 They allow you to see like, wait a minute, this is fucking bullshit. This right here, this is bullshit. I'm not going to do this anymore. So you think that maybe like that's part of the reason for, you know, maybe this pullback on cannabis is like the alcohol industry saying like, hey, whoa, well, our numbers are way down. We need to get back to this. Or maybe even some people in the, you know, if you look at the people out in the streets right now, maybe the last thing they want is a populace becoming. self-aware of all the bullshit around them. You think that that's part of this sort of medical container and this sort of pushback?

Starting point is 00:47:43 How can we not think that? Knowledge is power. So when we empower others to be self-aware and self-actualized, that is dangerous. I am dangerous. You are. I'm annoying to people. I'm out there screaming. Why are you so afraid of LSD?

Starting point is 00:47:59 You just say the word upsets people, the word LSD. So when we open that dialogue and we, we pull apart what scares you, then it doesn't scare you anymore. Right. Now what we have? Now we have individuals who are blowing open neuroplasticity. I posted on LinkedIn, George, the other day, this is mind-blowing, and I'm bringing it up. Because it's so fascinating.

Starting point is 00:48:25 They discovered, what they did is they took the rabies virus, which is unbelievably aggressive with regard to neuroplasticity. And it basically works backwards in your brain. They took the rabies vipris. This is in mice. And they reconfigured it and attached psilocybin to it. And they matted. It was about, they lit it up with neon green.

Starting point is 00:48:53 And then they spliced open these brains. And they trapped half a million connections, neuroplastic connections. So we now know what is that. lighting up your brain, which parts of the brain are being lit up, very particularly by Cilicin. What? That's so incredible and it's such power that we can use about not only self-actualization and, you know, when you're out in nature and you've taken a magic mushroom and you're and all of your senses have exploded and you're dropped into that moment, but trauma, memory,

Starting point is 00:49:35 dementia, all of these things. So we have not allowed that research to happen because we're afraid. Come on. That's not fair to humanity. We got to stop. We got to do better as humans. Yeah, I could not agree more. And it seems like so many of these ailments, so many of these labels that we put on ourselves, be it depression or anxiety, they come from a society that's fearful. It's almost like a contagion of a sick society as being, is causing the dis-ease inside all of us. And psychedelics, you need only look at some of the anecdotal evidence, some of the brain scans, some of the work around the default mode network being turned off, depression, veterans coming back. Like it's healing so many people.

Starting point is 00:50:22 It's allowing them to live a life worth living again. George, absolutely. So there's all of that. Yeah. All of these things that we can use as treatments for, I don't want to call them disabilities, but if you're severely depressed, that's a disability. It's wrecked your world. So there's all of these things that we can do better.

Starting point is 00:50:46 You know, we can do better than our SSRIs are doing that. And we need to open our minds and explore that. But let's go the other direction. So what happens when you are from a part where you're trying to really self-actualize? Like move the dial in the other direction. Be the poet. Be the musician. You know, drop in as Paul McCartley and John Lennon.

Starting point is 00:51:15 What do we do as humans when we're able to take this stuff to the next level? That also is something that at some point we have to acknowledge we're not only putting out fires here. You know, of course, I'm, I'm all about sex and drugs and marrying those two because I got to tell you, fucking awesome. It is awesome. You guys can figure this out. Most of you are listening and it takes a lot of practice. I mean, I put in my 10,000 hours for sure. But if you make that a priority and really learn how to dial that in, life is good, my friend. It is good. For sure. So there's that other place, too, where we're just next level, taking it to the next level, essentially.

Starting point is 00:52:07 100%. It's the, it's beyond the medical container. You know what I mean by that? That's what I wanted to. You said it better than I did. We get hung up. Like when I was doing the cannabis fight 15 years ago, we'd go into these, you know, we'd go into these little municipalities trying to get a medical dispensary in and all an nimbia.

Starting point is 00:52:27 would come out and I'd be wheeling in the, you know, the epileptic kids and the PTSD because there were certain words that we could use. We could talk about veterans. So I'd have all my veterans and I'd bring in my kids with epilepsy. And all I could talk about was cannabis is going to help this medical condition, knowing that it's a much better drug to alcohol, that I'm protecting my children from drinking and driving and doing stupid things around other drugs that aren't as safe. But I can't say that because as soon as I bring up getting high as humans,

Starting point is 00:53:06 that is just, you know, I am crazy chick over here, you know, trying to convince people to get high, which nothing can be further from the point. We as humans, we relish and escape. It's not like we don't binge television or sugar or. or all of these things. So we're looking for places to drop out. Let's make it safe and talk about it. It's not that we're not doing it.

Starting point is 00:53:35 Yeah. All these ideas of escape. What if you could escape into your own life that's beautiful? We need to be doing more of that, right? I do it. I don't hear it. It takes one to know one, right? Right.

Starting point is 00:53:48 But it's about time, too. And as soon as you start leaning into that presence and valuing time in that way. And that includes, you know, using tools like maybe cannabis or classical psychedelics to drop in and doing it with intention. It is, you really don't want to give that time back necessarily. And it does make you incredibly creative in this sense. I'll tell you where it is, it affects productivity and creativity. Time, as you know, because we both use classical psychedelics, and we both understand what happens to time.

Starting point is 00:54:31 It slows. So you're in this present moment and you're thinking of one thought, which is a big accomplishment, George. To bring one thought through, it's magical in terms of what you can accomplish. I get most of my work done, you know, on the yoga mat, swimming, in a runner's high. I jump out of that and I'm thinking or solving that problem. And then, of course, I use my technology, my AI, I hit my notes, I write it down, I send it to the team.

Starting point is 00:55:04 But there's a reason why Steve Jobs, you know, there's a reason why all the tech guys aren't afraid of psychedelics because they too understand that there is this space that you can drop into that accelerates creativity. It accelerates your senses. Now, a hero's dose means that you have dropped out of that presence. That is the other side of things. But if you learn how to use it with intention and with, you know, some degree of strategy, meaning you know where you're going every time, George, that's why I choose LSD, for example. over magic mushrooms it give you know because one takes me for a ride and the other I can dial it in in such a way that I know right where I'd go right that and it's all about dosing and

Starting point is 00:56:03 practice in my head hence we flow you right it's teaching others to kind of practice this and get better and better at it without the stigma yeah so much like that That word stigma is, you know, it's interesting to think about that's where the anxiety comes from. Hey, I'm doing something society says I shouldn't do it. Even though you could be doing something totally innocent that may not even be wrong, but because society looks down upon it, all of a sudden, you feel this weird pressure in your life. Like, oh, no, what's someone going to think about me? Oh, no, I can't live on to do. What would they think?

Starting point is 00:56:40 Like, who cares? Who cares what they think? How do you feel right now? George, a lot of drugs to speak those words. I know this. I've had a home. I know. Right?

Starting point is 00:56:54 Because we have blown open all of that, that shame around us because we have practiced dropping into that space, which you couldn't deny is healthy. When we live in shame, whether it's religion, just pushing us down or, you know, sexism or racism or racism or climate. classism. Those are things designed to push us down and help make us live in shame. If we can break free of that, we will be better as humanity. Obviously, it's not healthy for us to live in shame. Yeah. That's so well said. It's been a while since I thought about those particular modalities as not a bug but a feature. You know what I mean? Like those are a total feature in society. Again, more drug use that you come to these incredible conclusions like, oh, that's not a bug. But, George, here's something interesting about moderate drug use in my opinion.

Starting point is 00:58:00 So part of this is about that discussion we had about the new study where we are tracking neuroplasticity. So we know that when we hit our brains with either any of the classical psychedelic psilocybin or. or LSD, for example, that we're triggering those 2A serotonin receptors. And we're blowing open neuroplasticity, sometimes temporarily, but also we're formulating new connections. That is so good for us, George. And if we learn to work in that space and practice.

Starting point is 00:58:39 So, for example, I, you know, use my drugs strategically to do very particular. things. And a lot of it is on the weekends, starting on a Thursday, is when I double down into my sex and drugs bubble. It's around that. But because I have so much practice, years of practice at this, when I go into my yoga mat in the mornings, you know, before I argue, you know, whatever time that is during the day, when I drop out of work, hit the mat, I can go to that same place. That's because my muscle memory and that neuroplasticity is already open. So I don't need drugs. I can use breathing to get there.

Starting point is 00:59:20 I can use, you know, mantras to get there. So part of this is we need to be practicing how to get to that self-actualized space. And it's not always with drugs. I certainly don't use drugs to get there all the time. Now, when I do, I enjoy them 100%. I have no problem with them, but I don't need them every time for sure. I think that should be part of the education, you know, for so long. Like we think, oh, you're a drug addict.

Starting point is 00:59:50 Maybe you're just learning how to see the world differently because you're right. Once you build the pathways, you don't necessarily need them to get there. I think it was Alan Watts who said once you get the message, you can hang up the phone. Once you've made those connections, we know this from studying memory. Once you establish a memory, that memory becomes cleaner and more vivid and you can go back and be in that space. The same thing with these new neural connections, right? the more you use, whatever it is. For me, it's usually LSD or mushrooms,

Starting point is 01:00:17 but once you figured out a way to process information in different parts of the brain, you don't necessarily need the stimulant or the bridge to get there. You already have it. Now you can get back to that spot. That should be all in the education. Well, it absolutely should.

Starting point is 01:00:32 I'm trying to do that. You're doing a phenomenal job. It is. Well, remember, George, you and I both know this because we've been practicing. Yes. But once you've gone to that space, Your mind can get there without it.

Starting point is 01:00:47 I mean, you can see the bit, for example, visuals. So even if I'm not using LSD and I'm in a place where I can close my eyes and do it, you know, the visuals that you get on classical psychedelics, that vividness, your brain can still take you there without the tool. Right. But it's muscle memory and it's learning how to go to that place. And the only way I think that you and I get there so easily is practice. in listening and knowing how to revisit, you know, that same space again and again.

Starting point is 01:01:20 And it's exercising. I don't know this. I'm not a neuroscientist. I wish I kind of was. I love that space. But understanding and sitting in that dance of neuroplasticity, the fact that we are not stimulating these connections and that we are capable of it is that for many people that have to live in a box where their brain isn't firing as rapidly as you're an eye brain's fire.

Starting point is 01:01:50 Because you know what that feels like. You know how quick you think, how productive you are, with or without AI, my friend. Yeah. So that's, yeah. I see it as a radical upgrade in pattern recognition. You know, sometimes you get these visuals and you see these incredible geometric images. What is that? But later in life, all of a sudden you realize, you know,

Starting point is 01:02:12 there's this thing I do in my relationship is very not constructive, you know, who am I fighting with? But then you all of a sudden you see it in someone else's relationship. And it's like once you've, you know what it is? It's like getting a new car or a new shirt. Like once you get it, all of a sudden you see it on everybody else. Hey, they got the same choice. They got the same car. Yes. Yeah, there is that common bond that yeah, between each other. And I, and I hope the more we get to talk about it. Yeah. At humans, the more we will advance in these practices that are indeed healthy yeah without a doubt without a doubt i got a couple questions stacking up for you over here are you ready okay this will comes to my friend from maya what's up

Starting point is 01:02:55 mya mya's coming from brooklyn and she says tanya you've scaled businesses in some of the most regulated industries on earth what intercomposed do you rely on when the rules haven't caught up the human truth especially in women's health and sex tech whoa maya thank you great question And here's why I like highly regulated space. It's because other people are afraid of it. So I have always, I mean, I got into the cannabis industry in 2011, and I didn't know what I was doing. But I cold called the biggest players in Denver, Colorado, where I now live. I ended up building the first vertically integrated national cannabis franchise and having good exits.

Starting point is 01:03:37 but it's because I knew that I could solve that problem because everything is just a widget. So as long as you can, you know, work within the rules and I love an industry. And this applies to sex tech as well because we've shamed it so vigorously. So there's so much opportunity, in my opinion, in Femtech, in sex tech, and in the drug space because you're forced to work within a set of rules or in the case of, you know, have been THC in the cannabis space, no rules. So if you're able to move and pivot, pivot's a big word in my world. So when I build companies and I own the companies that we've talked about, I own them

Starting point is 01:04:23 myself. So I don't answer to a set of investors. That probably needs to change in the near future for me to scale these things. But the point is, in a fledgling industry where we've got so much regulatory change moving at all times, that ability to pull back and pivot makes you nimble and agile and let you pace yourself ahead of others who are stuck, who can't think outside the box. So I love those industries. And of course, sex and drugs came naturally to me.

Starting point is 01:04:58 Once I figured out how great they were, there was. Of course, that's what I was going to go sell. That was a no brain. I joke, George, that I've gone from colostrum, which is, of course, by kangaroo kids. I'm a lactation consultant back 30 years ago and did that for years and years and years. So colostrum to cannabis to come. Because that is the journey of my life. And I think I'm going to have to end on orgasmic pleasure, right?

Starting point is 01:05:28 that's so awesome yeah uh thank you myo i got daniel coming over here daniel coming out of austin texas what's up daniel thanks for being here austin's a great place man and he says how do you convince investors to take seriously markets built around intimacy pleasure and embodiment without diluting their depth their power uh huh interesting it's it's tough daniel because it is, which is why I am to date, you know, self-funded. What I did very strategically is I have, I have two CBG brands. Oh, yes, which is an ecstatic, the fly-fow brand and, uh-huh, honey. And because the cannabis industry, I put cannabinoids, both CBD, CBG, and THC into these products,

Starting point is 01:06:19 and they sell in dispensaries and direct-to-consumer. So all that being said, that's very difficult to get investors. for not only is it a volatile industry that could go away tomorrow um so one of the strategies i've had is to stay lean run it like a mom and pop grow it with just a lot of authenticity and then when it's ready to pop whether that you know in my case it's not an exit right now but it's bringing on strategic partnerships you're ready to grow aggressively like i entered this space back in 2017 through 19 there was interest in cannabis and sex and some of the bigger VCs did throw money six to say 12 million at different companies like this and they've all not

Starting point is 01:07:11 made it they have they they they all went belly up because they spent too much money too fast and they didn't let it grow organically and weren't able because they had a C suite that was top heavy to pivot. So I think there is growth. If you want to start a company in this space, I've always spend 30 minutes with anyone if you need some help. But don't get too big for your britches. You know, the only way investors invest in this stuff is you need some sort of track record,

Starting point is 01:07:44 which is a carpet for the horse situation that is very, very hard to attain. They want to see these aggressive sales. You know, they want to see revenue. in an industry that is always holding you back. On the sex side, whoa, is it tricky? Because in the sex side, what's happened is sex and drugs, but I would say the sex side is even more problematic because what used to be even five years ago,

Starting point is 01:08:13 even pre-COVID, influencers, social media, you could build yourself up organically, have a good message and let that disseminate through social media platforms. That has really, really changed. So the way you have to do it now is it's everything is a pay to play. So whether the ROI is digital marketing or buying off an influencer, if you don't have money to acquire that customer,

Starting point is 01:08:43 let's say anywhere from $10 to $25 in the sex space, it's going to be really hard to break through the noise. That's the biggest challenge. So when you go to your investors or potential VCs, you really are going to need a strategy and understand what it takes to acquire that customer. And then once you get them, you got to keep reselling them. So you've got a big lift. But guess what people do want?

Starting point is 01:09:11 At least George and I want it. Sex and drugs. So the Gen Z kids may not be having the same amount of sex that George and I are wishfully having. That has changed to someone, but it's not that they don't want an orgasm. Like, we can meet in this space for sure. My answer to poor Daniel and Austin is it's a tricky space to raise money. Where I can raise money is tech. So when it comes to them tech and sex tech, we flow, you know, even really this is about

Starting point is 01:09:47 dialing in drug use. There is a space for that because you. you are working with data and analytics and bringing people into your ecosystem before you push them back out into yoga classes or CPG brands. So you got to be really, none of this is easy, Daniel. And it is a particularly censored industry to raise money and to answer your question. 100% is challenging. Beautiful answer.

Starting point is 01:10:20 It makes me curious, do you see this world of psychedelics playing out the same way cannabis has? Do you see some similarities and differences? Or what are your thoughts on where we are now and where we might be headed to? Yeah, I definitely see a lot of differences. Where the similarities go is, you know, back in 2008, and we can go back to the California legacy market, but let's just, you know, speak to when we started adopting regulated, legalizing medical, cannabis, the train left the station. And we learned a lot from cannabis. Cannabis, having said that, is a very different drug than the classical psychedelics, even MDMA. So I don't think

Starting point is 01:11:05 that we're going to see the same journey in psychedelics that we did in cannabis because of the risk and the dosing issues. I think we will see it run the line of pharmacies a little more. I I think that if we can, if churches and the indigenous and some of these peripheral professionals, therapists, for example, and I don't mean they're peripheral in a sense that they're less. I mean, let's say they're not MDs or medical doctors or psychiatrists. We are going to see that opening up a little bit. But here's what we need to talk about, in my opinion. we have we all have great access to these drugs these drugs are not hidden away hard to get so once you

Starting point is 01:11:57 have opened the door to accessing these things they're there my biggest concern is that as we navigate this space it gets rolled up into pharmacy you know we're about to see maybe monday cannabis move from Schedule 1. So Schedule 1 means it is no health benefits and it's going to kill you. It's there with fentanyl and heroin. That's where we put cannabis. So when we see if our fearless leader moves it to Schedule 3, which he is motioning will happen, we're going to see on the good side of that, we're going to see that dispensary owners

Starting point is 01:12:39 aren't subject to a tax code designed for Al Capone. called 280E. That means no standard deductions. So when we see that alleviated, that 25% net profits that you currently send to the federal government are going to be back into the coffers of cannabis homes. The negative side of this story, when it goes on to Schedule 3, it's going to sit fully under the purview of the FDA. I'm not thrilled about that. That is dangerous in a lot of different ways. The DEA also sits in and takes a look. Where I'd like to see all this go is ATF. Why are we not putting cannabis particularly into a long-site alcohol and tobacco from a recreational standpoint? So if we overregulate this and we put it under some of these things,

Starting point is 01:13:35 big money is always going to take this. Big money is overrun cannabis now. Now it's little big money. Multistate operas, you know, the $500 million club, these guys just pushing a billion, those are very, very little players relative to pharmacy. So we'll see what happens. I don't think these two are going to be created equally. Cannabis and psychedelics, I think, are going to be bifurcated, in my opinion. And we'll see which regulatory body grabs hold and decides their fate. I hope it's decriminalized, but I'm not holding my breath. Let's look at what happened in Oregon, right in Oregon we they did what Portugal did they decriminalized all drugs but they had no regulatory backstop to catch it Oregon's always been notoriously bad about governing their people

Starting point is 01:14:23 never have they been good and so to let that be the first to fly in Oregon they've already pulled it back so now with psilocybin with magic mushrooms you could be in Tillamog you can be in one county and have it be legal and have be in another county and have it not as a consumer you have no idea which is which we don't want that either so we'll see what happens i don't have a lot of faith in government um as the rule so my my instinct is that uh it could go very wrong here instead of well unfortunately yeah time time will tell for sure We got a girl coming from Oakland. Shout out to Oakland. Isha, what's cracking?

Starting point is 01:15:10 She says, what did you have to unlearn about femininity, leadership, and success to build companies that actually heal rather than extract? What did I have to unlearn? That's such a good question. I'm very lucky growing up, being from so many kids. and my father was a failed entrepreneur across. I mean, he put all of his energy into us kids, I would say. But what I got a lot of son of her face there.

Starting point is 01:15:45 Well, I don't know that I had to unlearn as much as some. I have been, I haven't had a lot of fear around taking entrepreneurial risk. And that doesn't mean I haven't failed because I have so failed. in my time. But I think I've also understood that I've never chased money. I've never, ever, ever chased money. It's always been about solving the problem and the sort of the high that comes with building something. Where I've had advantage, I think, is that I am not afraid of my femininity. So I manage and I build companies in my authentic female self.

Starting point is 01:16:37 So that means I operate different than men do. That's a gross generalization. Just as I said it, I want to pull it back. But there's something very feminine about how we run a household. By extension, the way we can run companies is empowering others. we empower our kids. We want them to be the best they can be. We want to give them all the tools.

Starting point is 01:17:02 Well, the same when you build a team of employees. I'm not the plumber, the accountant, the lawyer. There are people that are way smarter than me when I build companies. And what I've learned, and I'm hoping this is divine feminine, is that that comes with empowering others to work as a team. I'll tell you something from a business structure that I'm. I am enamored by and strive to build my ecosystem of companies around are ESOPs. Now, that's a tax situation, but what an ESOP does is it forms a big bubble around you so that you're not paying taxes, federal, state, city taxes, and instead, all of your employees own that company, and they're the benefit. factors of those tax breaks. To me, if we can move to a space where we're including employees

Starting point is 01:18:06 as part of the team and empowering them to do better, that's the win as a female. And you have only to gain. You know, we don't all need to be trillionaires. To me, that's a disgusting display of ego. I never need that much money. I mean, in fairness, you can easily blow through a million dollars. I can attest to that. Money goes fast these days, but you don't necessarily need a billion. Can we cap it, George?

Starting point is 01:18:38 Yeah. And a billion? Is there a cap for this nonsense? There needs to be. There needs to be without a doubt. There used to be. There used to be, it used to be, you know, you made a certain amount of money. You were taxed like 70%.

Starting point is 01:18:52 You know, and we were doing just fine. We were doing just fine, so, Isha, that's an awesome question. Sophia, my girl, Sophia coming in from Toronto. We're multinational over here. Thank you, Sophia, for being here. She says, you've moved fluidly between fintech, med tech, and now sex tech. Do you see these as separate industries or as one evolving ecosystem of human trust?

Starting point is 01:19:18 I see it more as one ecosystem. for sure. And once you have navigated wire framing and development with developers on the MetTech or the FinTech or RegTech side, something like We Flow Yo is just another widget, you know, so you're figuring out, you know, essentially just how to build, in this case, tracking around that. So to me, they're kind of one and the same. And once you've experienced building one, you use those. that experience in those twos to go build the next one. Great questions, guys. Yeah, we're crushing. I have the best audience in the world. Thank you, Sophia, for being in. Well, I have the best guest, too.

Starting point is 01:20:05 I'm looking at one right now, so thank you. Who else do I got coming in over here? I got Elena. What's cracking, Elena? She asks the question in cultures where women's pleasure is still taboo. Elena's coming from Mexico City. Nice. In cultures where women's pleasure is still taboo, how do you build products and narratives that liberate without imposing?

Starting point is 01:20:29 Nice question, Elena. Thanks for having that's a good question. The way I do it is I push back on that shame and that narrative and I don't reshape it for a culture that is more inhibited. So I think that's how I would answer it. You know, I put it out there. I am obviously more careful if you know you've got to read the room so if I'm speaking to an audience that is that is concerned you reshape the narrative to some extent but I do think even there's there's just the value in in it's not shock for shock's sake but just waking people up there's so much noise out there that it's hard to even get people's

Starting point is 01:21:19 attention so sometimes that shock value is warranted to get people to listen yeah i think it's i don't necessarily i don't necessarily and i think there's a big difference between shock value and things that people are genuinely curious and worried about at the same time like when you can reach you can bridge that gap right there people perk up you know you mentioned earlier in the conversation people like, well, I want to hear this. You know, like, what is this about? Like, what are my preconceptions about this? Or it's a great point out there.

Starting point is 01:21:56 Who else do I got over here? Liam, Liam says, what does entrepreneurship taught you about the relationship between risk, love, and trust? Oh, boy. Yeah. Your audience. What a great question. I think it is, it's taught me that you can take. risk and trust that the sky will not fall. So the more you push up against that risk and test it,

Starting point is 01:22:26 and that goes with fear too, in my opinion. So whether it's risk or fear or, you know, starting a new company, the more you push at it, the less fear you have and the more trust that you have that you can accomplish those things. And if you fail, you still have not failed because you've learned that whole process on how to do it better the next time. So there is no failure in that risk. So trusting in yourself comes with the experience and practice of just doing it. So go do it. Is I guess what I would say. That's a fantastic answer. Fantastic. Anya, I'm bringing you right up here to the hour and a half mark. I feel like we're just kind of getting warmed up over here. So we need a more of these conversations. Yeah, without a doubt.

Starting point is 01:23:16 Out of doubt, we'll make it happen. For the people that are listening right now, like let's say they want to reach out to yourself. Let's say they have some questions on some of the things you're building or ideas that they want to run by. What's the best place to get a hold of you, to find you? What are you coming up? What are you excited about?

Starting point is 01:23:31 Yeah. So, gosh, I mean, my social media, my brands are on all the social media, but I don't operate those as much. But I'm on LinkedIn. Boy, like, I'm showing my age. But follow my newsletter. I'm on substack, YouTube,

Starting point is 01:23:45 like follow yes to sex if you're interested i am uh i'm pretty much an open book i'll talk to you if you reach out to me on linton like no sales calls but if you mean my help like mentorship i am always there for other humans but don't sell me stuff please because i wake up to like dozens of solicitations and that's being um as underestimating it for sure but i am very available on LinkedIn. We're in dispensaries all over Illinois, in Missouri. We're coming in Nevada, Colorado, New Jersey, Oregon. I build dispensaries. So we have dispensaries in Illinois. And just come find me. We're doing sex talks. So I'm doing live, you know, yes to sex drugs and flow talks where we'll kind of just open this up and let people ask some of the questions.

Starting point is 01:24:40 So all that's coming. And then you can always find me on. LinkedIn. Ladies and gentlemen, go down, scan the QR code. If you're watching right now, that'll take you directly to her LinkedIn site, I believe. Go to the show notes, reach out to her and be part of the counterculture. It's coming here and reach out to Tanya. Tanya, hang on briefly afterwards to everyone within the sound of my voice from Liam, Nore, Camille, Priya, Jonas, Elena, Sophia, Aisha, Daniel, and my friend Maya.

Starting point is 01:25:08 And of course, we got Caesar over there, Adam Butler. Thank you all for hanging out. That's all we got for today, ladies and gentlemen. Aloha. Aloha. George, thank you. Yes, it's the earth Yeah, yeah

Starting point is 01:25:46 That's all no, you can't You can go Better know You're like Oh, Oh, Oh, oh

Starting point is 01:25:58 la la la la la la la la la la la I'm I'm I'm I'm trying. I'm just me.

Starting point is 01:26:14 I know I'm trying I'm going I'm going I'm going I'm going I'm going to

Starting point is 01:26:22 never never trust I'm going away I know I know I know what you want

Starting point is 01:26:30 at you know that you can't go die die die die

Starting point is 01:26:42 away turn away turn away I don't know I'm not I'm not I'm not I'm trying

Starting point is 01:27:10 I'm trying I'm going to pay I'm going to say I'm going to say I'm going to

Starting point is 01:27:21 my goodness I'm going to I'm going away I'm going to go I just think you But I just... But that you're just going to die.

Starting point is 01:27:34 Oh! So, Oh, So do you Oh Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da Oh

Starting point is 01:28:11 Oh Oh

TrueLife - Tanya Griffin - Sex, Drugs, & Counterculture

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