TrueLife - What Kat Walsh Saw in the Dark Will Change the Psychedelic Movement Forever

Episode Date: November 29, 2025

One on One Video Call W/George https://tidycal.com/georgepmonty/60-minute-meetingSupport the show:https://www.paypal.me/Truelifepodcast?locale.x=en_USThe Lila Code: https://orcid.org/0009-0008-4612-3942🚨🚨Curious about the future of psychedelics? Imagine if Alan Watts started a secret society with Ram Dass and Hunter S. Thompson… now open the door. Use Promocode TRUELIFE for Get 25% off monthly or 30% off the annual plan For the first yearhttps://www.district216.com/Kat Walsh Founder and host of Trip On This,psychedelic advocate, storyteller, DJ of altered wonder. Kat has become a bridge, a lantern,guiding newcomers across the thresholdfrom ordinary life into extraordinary possibility.Featured in Forbes, beloved by seekers,Kat is proof that purpose isn’t found, it’s remembered.She left comfort for calling,certainty for soul,and now devotes her lifeto helping others reclaim their own inner infinite.This is Kat Walsh. a storyteller of metamorphosis,an architect of awe,and a reminder that every life,no matter how familiar,can become a miracle the moment we dare to leap.Visit Kat’s Website:https://www.lifewithkatwalsh.com/Social MediaInstagram: https://instagram.com/lifewithkatwalshTikTok: https://tiktok.com/@lifewithkatwalshTwitter: http://twitter.com/lifewithkatwFacebook: https://facebook.com/lifewithkatwLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/katwalsh8/ One on One Video call W/George https://tidycal.com/georgepmonty/60-minute-meetingSupport the show:https://www.paypal.me/Truelifepodcast?locale.x=en_USCheck out our YouTube:https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPzfOaFtA1hF8UhnuvOQnTgKcIYPI9Ni9&si=Jgg9ATGwzhzdmjkg

Darkness struck, a gut-punched theft, sun ripped away, her health bereft. I roar at the void. This ain't just fate, a cosmic scam I spit my hate. The games rigged tight, shadows deal, blood on their hands, I'll never kneel. Yet in the rage, a crack ignites, occulted sparks cut through the nights. The scars my key, hermetic and stark. To see, to rise, I hunt in the dark. fumbling, furious through ruins maze, lights my war cry, born from the blaze.

The poem is Angels with Rifles, The track, I Am Sorrow, I Am Lust by Codex Serafini. Check out the entire song at the end of the cast. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the True Life podcast. I hope we're just having a beautiful day. I hope the sun is shining. I hope the birds are singing before I get started here. Let me go ahead and just show everybody what I'm working with. I want everyone to reach out to my friend Ryan Latrell at Kana Extracts.

Use promo code True Life out there. Do yourself a huge favor. Check out Kana, see what it can do for you. And reach out to my friend Ryan Latrell at Kana Extracts. Use promo code True Life. Ladies and gentlemen, Cat Walsh, founder and host of Trip on this psychedelic advocate storyteller, DJ of Altered Wonder, Cat has become a bridge, a lantern guiding newcomers across the threshold from ordinary life into extraordinary possibility.

Featured in Forbes, beloved by seekers, Cat is proof that purpose isn't found. It's remembered. She left comfort for calling, certainty for soul, and now devotes her life to helping others reclaim their own inner infinite cat thank you so much for being here today how are you dang thank you for that intro i'm really good i'm really good we were just talking about the thanksgiving holiday coming up here but i love that we are getting a chance to do this now like this sounds like this sounds like a perfect send off into just holiday feasts and then back into creativity you know like i'm feeling pumped and excited in a way that i haven't uh honestly that i can't remember feeling in a long time

like i usually am like in shutdown mode i want to but that's because i was just feeling really uninspired in most of my life. And right now, it's nice to say that I feel inspired in my life. And therefore, it feels fun to think about creating and not just how I need to disconnect. Yeah, you got a lot of stuff coming up. You've got a Vegas trip coming up. You're always over at District 216, crushing it out there. What do you got coming up? Let me hear what you got going on. Yeah. So District is actually, hopefully, hopefully. It's still kind of TBD on that one. But if I am, I would be there December 3rd for MJ BizCon. I think they have, it's to be behind the scenes, it's, they have to get a whole like set up for music if they did that.

And I don't know if they have the proper sound system yet for all of that. So TBD on that. My stuff coming up right now is actually more internal. Like I've, like I was just mentioning, I just been working two months on my website, which is just tied to so much of what I'm kind of. re-emerging into the world as and calling forth and just been creating a lot of content and I've got a couple shows that I can't quite announce yet, DJ-wise. So a lot of things, but I wish I had something a little more concrete for you to give you, but hopefully December 3rd. We'll see.

Nice. Yeah, it seems there's so much happening right now in the world of psychedelics and creativity and explosion. Like you've been in, you have been in this game for a long time. I'm not only doing solo what you're doing now, but behind the scenes and television, up in the making, making media. What are you most excited about right now in the world of psychedelics or culture or what are some things on your radar? Yeah. Oh, gosh, there's so much to be excited about right now, you know.

And when it comes to psychedelics, I think I'll say just, so when I, when I launched trip on this, it was in 2020. And I just remember like the whole, when I came out was like, I'm starting a podcast about psychedelics. Like I'm basically like telling the whole world like, I do drugs, you know. I remember, I just felt like one giant side eye from like every bit of my community who has never known me for that. And also like how to change your mind from Michael Pollan had come out one year before. But the mass like awareness and consciousness, by the way, we're still not there. it really wasn't quite there yet. It had just started to kind of break through. And so to see just how

far we have come, even for me, five years later, to see just how many people now come to me as the bridge, people who would never have talked to me about this. And now we're like, hey, look. And not necessarily because of what they heard from me, but because this willingness for so many people to finally like come out of the psychedelic closet and talk about it, especially our veterans and our first responders. Some of these like you know, real macho

guys that do not want to talk about healing and what they don't want to that's not what they want to talk about and hear. And yet when they can hear Navy SEALs talk about it and they can hear themselves in these total badasses. It's really, really

changing things. And then I become somebody they know they're like, hey, cut. We're going to get mushrooms. I'm just kidding. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that and then obviously the legislation, right? Like there's such like just yesterday I saw again, like New Jersey has just pushed through another.

It's going to be medicalized first. But there is breakthrough with that. We've got three states now that have legal psilocybin. Different parameters around that. But Colorado, Oregon and New Mexico. Mexico. We also have, not Maine, I'm sorry, Maryland has just also put through a task force that has an epic potential plan of not just we would start therapeutic. We, as if I live there, I'm in California, but they, we isn't a community. Yeah, we're part of it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Maryland would start with therapeutic, but then it would go into supervised just adult use, So not necessarily for like depression or PTSD, but just your ability, you know, human potential, right? Like your ability to explore your own consciousness. And then ultimately have a commercially viable path for adults to use it at home. And that's that's big. Yeah. It's gigantic. You start to see it popping up all over the place.

Yeah. I've got to be honest. Like my hope is that what we're seeing right now is sort of the late 50s and, starting to see a little bit of the legalization or maybe the decriminalization, but I'm kind of pushing for electric school buses to be touring college campuses and like see this outbreak of music and just I can feel it like right on the cusp. Like I feel like we're right up against the boundaries and you see all these young people coming out with new music and new sounds and new artwork. It's like, oh shit, here it comes. We're going to be part of this. We're going to be part of this

right here. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, no, me too. I think there is. I mean, obviously we're in such an interesting precipice between psychedelics, but then also like AI, right? Like, and social media. Like, it's a weird time to be alive, but also really exciting. Like, it feels like every day there is, there is really headline news, you know, obviously for many reasons. But like, in the positive side of things, there's just headline news in terms of like just

our progress has been crazy fast. Yeah. it seems like it's exponential i had a guy telling me yesterday about this thing called the acriman function and it's not so much exponential as it is like numbers you can't even think of so instead of like one plus one equals two or one two four eight it's like one plus two plus two times two to the fourth like we were just going into how fast technology is moving maybe this is a good segue you and i were talking a little bit before the show about this whole longevity movement i want to be clear cat like i am four people living well longer. I'm for that. When I see some of this talk about, you're going to live

forever. My favorite one is this. If you live for 10 years, you're going to live forever. No, you're not. Like, you are going to die. And like, it just makes me so mad. And again, I'm for people living well longer. But this sensationalism, this idea that you're going to live forever, it seems like cancer to me. Am I being too negative on that aspect? What's your thoughts? No, I mean, I get it. I think the So the don't die platform, right? We were talking about Brian, Brian Johnson. I was really curious, actually,

because there is this obsession with not dying. This is what the transhumanist movement is, like, literally like, how do we, if we can't preserve biology, how do we actually preserve the consciousness of that person by creating potentially a mine file to put in maybe a non-human form. I'm, I'm more with you with this. I mean, I think ultimately trying to escape death. I guess because I'm spiritual, I don't think that there really is an end. Yeah.

Do I want to hold, would I like to live? long in this life and healthy, not just long. Like, do I want, do I like the fact that my body ages and that it hurts to do stuff? Like, not really. Like, I would love to stay young. I mean, I think nature had a certain kind of genius, right? With that, that by making old age, it makes you not want to live forever, right? Like, this is the cycle of life. Because if we were, if we never aged, why would we want to die? Right. Like, there's so much to live. Unless, obviously, you're going through a very dark depression. But aside from that, most people would like, when they're in feeling good in their

life, they like to stick around. And, you know, I think, here's where I think Brian Johnson has made some interesting points. Is like this idea that basically a lot of us live with like a death wish, like that this life is such a gift, that this ability to have this life. And yet our destructive behavior and patterns, the foods we have, alcohol, parting, drugs, right? Like, honestly, the phones, screens, not sleeping, that on the very basic level that we are actively actually taking years off of this precious life. And I was like, that's an interesting, that's interesting. Like that is a whole consciousness shift around do I, it's that, I, it's that, I'm

I'm not here for a long time. I'm here for a good time or that kind of mentality has been, has been a very dominant part of our society. Right. Like I used to date a fireman way back when and that was his thing like he's going to live hard because he's going to die young. And I'm pretty sure he's still around and I'm sure his body's fucking feeling it, you know. Sorry, the square. I will try not to do that. But but yeah. So I mean, I think it's I think it's both. I think it's nice that we still have people that are wanting to preserve longevity. And I don't know if that's necessarily the goal, but the goal to live well. Also, people die in non, like, nonphysically.

If aging could stop, I mean, or slow way down, I guess it's easier to just say, like, oh, no, but like, practically, like, would it be nice to live to, like, 120 and that at 80, you're almost like you would be at 60? maybe you know like i i i honestly don't know and i think a lot of the fear is the projection of yeah that the world looks like it does right now and if it looks like it's right now then i don't want to keep going but if we can project if the world actually gets better and there's something worth living and that you want to do maybe that is something you would want to do so i think that was a really long-winded and unclear answer that's not all it was beautiful i i echo so much of that

sentiment in that I feel like you do get to live forever on some level. Like if you want to live forever, you should live in the hearts and the minds of the people you love the most. Like you should volunteer your time. You should write a really cool book, do a really cool podcast. Or more than that, just give to people without wanting anything back. I think you do live forever, but just not in this form. Yeah.

I think when we get caught up in this idea of I want to be in this form forever, it seems like a prolonged adolescence to me. And another part that really bothers me is this idea that if aging is a disease, doesn't that mean that old people are diseased? And then like, how do you look at people like that? Like, oh, that person's disease. No, they're not. Like, wisdom comes from age.

Wisdom comes from experience. And when we start conflating this idea of aging as a disease and wisdom, I think it gets into like a pretty slippery slope. But you've done some work on like transhumanism too. Like you were going to produce a, you produced a film or a movie back in the day. What was that all about? Yeah, that's probably why I have like a little bit of a soft spot. And I wouldn't say, I wouldn't say soft spot, but it's more just a general interest, right?

Yes. Of possibility. I think I'm always inherently interested in what is possible. And I also don't think, like our ability to create is also inherently spiritual. You know, I think even creating AI itself to me is a spiritual act. that through the incredible creative power of the human we have created more create like incredible creative uh like basically another form of like consciousness yeah and um do i think that we also make mistakes because we just keep building a thing that we don't understand i think

we all saw Jurassic park right like when we that goes when we we can build the thing just and just because we can should we um i think is definitely more of like a philosophical question. Yeah, this show that I created was called, This is Not My Life. And it was around the idea of in a post-singularity world. So the technological singularity is an idea by this man named Ray Kurzweil, who's one of the top futurists in the world and has been for a very long time. And so the show was actually based around him as our inspiration, if you will. And it was both the themes of kind of like a mid a midlife crisis but also in a transhumanist world so he wakes up to not recognize his wife and his kids and his family that he's built and so we we played with

these themes of some really like relatable human aspects of did i not live the fullness of the life that I really wanted to live. But and it was also this idea that the technological singularity had already happened. And what does that mean for the nuclear family? What does it mean to, if you lose a child, to be able to have a hologram of their, all of their memories and personality traits and all these things where you can potentially interact with a memory file that feels very real of your deceased child. So it would be very provocative for people because there's going to be people that really hate that idea. And then there's going to be people that are going to go, huh, that's interesting. Like would I want that feeling of comfort even though I know it's not real?

And so yeah, I mean, we really looked into all the different transhumanists, some of the big principles. So like both biologically, how do we live longer? But we really focused on consciousness. So, like, creating mind files, like basically consciousness imprints of every memory, how you talk. This is real science that is happening through Martin Rothblatt. And her wife, Bina, is also one of the first robots, AI robots. And she's been using, like, creating this advanced, basically a copy as much as you can of her wife. So that, she can ultimately live forever, right? And so we brought in what sounds super, super sci-fi into some real, some real questions of like what happens to the soul. Like, you know, is this,

is this soul? Is this just what makes soul? Like, it really, really asking some of those deep questions. And I think those are the best shows personally is the ones that make you think. yeah i i love it it is interesting to think about what on some level it sounds to me as if when we make these copies or if if you have this sort of you know when android's dream this pkd understanding of like what the world may look like or you see people creating sort of copies of ones they've loved on one level i'm like that's like such a creative genius then i wonder like what atrophies like on some level are you denying yourself a new love? Are you allowing yourself to move forward if you are constantly going back and

revisiting it? And I can speak to this because my son had died and I have pictures of him and I think about him all the time. But I don't know that I would want like a robot of him. Of course, I don't have one, but I could see how people could fall or grow into that idea of always having around someone you love. It's fascinating. Are there episodes of that show? Did that show go live? No, it unfortunately, we got to the, I know, we were, we had it set up with a studio, but it's, if anybody that's in Hollywood, it's, it's very hard to finally get that, like, last green light, you know, to do it. It was going to be done with a Canadian, uh, Canadian broadcaster and an American broadcaster. And yeah, we got close, but it didn't, it didn't go. And, um, I think it was a little ahead of its time, actually, because this was, I don't know. know 15 years ago or something this way before AI that we know like this is way before so we it sounded really sci-fi to the network and today it's still pretty would be pretty sci-fi but like the technology is much more well known now it also played with this um idea that once we get to this

post singularity world and we have basically like bcIs in our brain which is a brain computer interface and are communicating that there is no almost like separation. You're almost like a little bit more, it forces transparency. So we were dealing with this, we were working with this idea that like while it's going to be uncomfortable, like the uncomfortable truth in the beginning that actually through transparency, we end up coming more into a state of like oneness with each other. And so again, like those spiritual ideas of like separation and non-separation, but that's kind of what those brain computer phases might do. Like they create potentially a hive mind. Obviously, we can look a very dystopian version of that and that can not be a good thing, right? So it's a it's a, it's a, it's a, I don't want to say it's a brave new world that we're coming into because hopefully it's not all dystopian, but I'm sure there's going to be. I think it's going to be both. You know, I think there's going to be some great. things like science and medical. I mean, I do think AI is going to just blow us away when it

comes to health. That is the one area where I'm like, oh, well, it's going to be able to sequence and see patterns in DNA and papers that we have never seen before. I mean, we might have precision medicine individually, you know, imagine a little AI that's just monitoring your body. it's in you, okay, you give up that, on one hand, a little bit of your own privacy, whatever that looks like. On the other hand, it's fully just scanning your body all the time to make sure no cells are radicalizing. Or, right? So, like, it might solve all the major diseases or catch it way early so that you can actually heal it. So on that end, I feel very optimistic and hopeful, as long as our mental health and our ability to socialize is intact, you know.

it's fascinating to me to think it I think as we begin to learn more about the ailments inside our bodies we begin to learn more about the ailments of society you know when you think about cancer in the body and rogue cells like you start thinking about like rogue ideas of economics and rogue ideas of all these things happening and stuff but if I jump for a second yeah cat I think that Like for me when I talk to you, and I've gotten to talk to you a little bit in Denver and hang out with you a little bit, I think you are really this bridge because you have not only made, been creative in the space before like podcasting or people becoming influencers kind of jump that, jump that lake over there.

But now you're doing it on the other side. Can you talk to us a little bit about what it's like, what you saw when you were, you know, making movies and making films and then now that you're doing it on your own? How do you see creativity evolving? in that space. Are we moving into this space where everyone's their own brand? Or maybe you could speak that idea a little bit. Yeah, yeah. I think that's a great question. Yeah. So when I, my, just for anybody listening, my background was, I started at a large talent agency called CIA. I was a baby agent, essentially, in the talent department. And for about three years, which I would equate to about 12 in regular years, three extremely long years. And then I went into TV development, like we've been talking about as the director of development, so like identifying projects and what would make interesting shows. And then, and then I went into

influencer marketing, ironically, on the other side of things, on the business side, talking to brands about why they should talk to, you know, they should utilize people that have a platform on social media. And then I was in creative marketing, so working with big brands on overseeing accounts for like BMW and HBO and how to market their movies and entertainment and stuff. And so having that, having that background, first of all, was the greatest gift for me. You know, because every moment of that is like not realizing, right? If we don't see the whole tapestry of our life, not realizing how every moment of those jobs understanding, like, what is it to represent talent? What is it to,

develop story and tell a story. What is it to literally create social media marketing campaigns for something? So the idea of getting to finally step into that honestly took me a lot longer. If only I just used my training for myself, but it's funny that when we, and I'm not the first one to say this, like oftentimes we can easily dish out what people should do in order to grow and do things, but when it's us, I think we have to come up against ourselves and our stuff. You know, I think being on it, being an entrepreneur is so spiritual inherently. It's such a deeply personal development path because then you have to come up with all of your self-limiting beliefs and the things that you don't realize, like, how you self-sabotage

and you wouldn't call it that, but like you are, you know. And so at that time, it was still like very gated. like social media had obviously been around but the power of the studio the power of the talent agency was still the dominant force out there and what that meant was less opportunity for more cats of the world that didn't wasn't in this small sliver of people that got their break, right, in that world. And I mean, the explosion of TikTok, actually, particularly in 2020, right? It really took off during the pandemic. I mean, what an explosion for creators, really and truly. And now TikTok ends up being the thing that like the studios and TV shows

and everything struggle with. That kind of new media is taking the attention. And eyeballs from you know from the screen from the normal tv screen and so i think there's always going to be a place for like that really like beautiful robust storytelling a bunch of people come together and i love i love a great show i love the creative you know the thoughtfulness and and the fact that like all those people got together to create that um and and there's so much more opportunity now to to create the art that you want to create because we have something called an algorithm. And that algorithm is so powerful, especially on TikTok and YouTube, but they're, it's so powerful that you can make this niche, whatever, you want to make heavy metal electronic

about outer space. And like through your little niche, you can find. And people that also want to listen to metal about being on another planet, you know, like, okay, because of this. And so I think there's going to be a boom ultimately in creativity. And it's going to allow a lot of people that never thought of themselves as creative or never thought they were going to make it down that traditional path and probably weren't because it was such a limited amount. Now you can.

Whether it's for an outcome or not, the creating, the act of creating will keep you out of depression. It is when you are in the seat of the consumer and you're just watching TV or like, I know after one scroll too many, I suddenly feel the drop in my mental health, 100%. And so I was like, but when I'm in a creative seat, whether that's just creating content or creating on my website, you know, it could literally be anything, but that I'm in the creator seat, that flip and that sense of purpose returns to me. that is wonderful i i couldn't agree more i think the answer to consumerism is creativity and like we all have it like you just got to find that that little imber inside of you and blow on it and watch it burn and then watch it keep other people warm and you're like look at this this is amazing and you just kind of flow into it that's amazing yeah i think about that aspect i got um who do we got coming i got some questions stacking up over here shout out to uh everybody

watching us over there polar nights who cares i see you guys all over there thank you for being here and hanging out with us joshua moyer says did someone say heavy metal electronic i was just thinking of that i'm like she talking about joshua moyer over here that's hilarious yeah i uh it's so fun it just happens to be very much in like the zeit guys for me right now because i made a a a very viral video a couple days ago about base face also known as stank face fizz face depending on who you are and whatever genre that you listen to. And funny enough, it was, I was specifically talking about electronic music when it comes to bass, but it found its way into the heavy metal stream as well. So now I've got heavy metal electronic all up on my stank face slash bass face

when I'm listening to music. So there is an audience. Yeah, without a doubt. It's interesting to see that aspect. Let me jump over here to, um, this comes to from Hannah. Hannah from New Orleans says, Kat, in an age where truth, uh, where truth is a hologram and lies wear business suits. What compass do you trust to navigate your way through it? That's a really beautiful question. Yeah. Well, and well put. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, this is, I don't know how it doesn't make this not sound cheesy, but my own heart, right? Like, if I'm living from a place, like a part space, I trust myself. It is when I start mentally like trying to look out to the world for something that feels right to me. That's when I can get lost on that. And so for me,

it's really about getting quiet and I have to hear myself. And I have to oftentimes I'll ask myself out loud and like challenge ideas and beliefs if something doesn't quite feel right. And if something doesn't feel like, it's as subtle as I had made a video on my TikTok. It was about I was giving an opinion about 5MEO DMT that was recently synthesized and patented by a company, which made it so that the DEA could pass it. And I gave a quick talk about my feelings about it. And while it did well, I felt a real hesitation in myself to post it then again on Instagram because there was some part of myself that wasn't sure if I understood what I was saying enough.

I didn't understand. Is that really true for me? Like I'm, I don't know, not that it wasn't true. I wasn't not true, but it wasn't so firmly rooted in like, do I even know enough to have that feeling and opinion? I don't think I do. And it was a learning in that moment of don't speak unless you really, what you believe in your heart is true.

Now, what I believe in my heart is true might absolutely not be right to somebody else. But that's how you withstand the opinions of the world. is you have to be anchored in what is right and true for you and not necessarily just to be loud. There's a lot of people out there that can just get views. And I mean, it's very easy to go viral if you just want to piss people off. Yeah. But I mean, that's not my interest is to lift people up. So how to make that interesting, you know, and still viral is a whole other question.

But yeah, I hope that answer your question. It's just about that like that truth and not moving forward until that real sense. of like, yeah, no, this is right for me and then go for it. And then that might change. You might learn as you grow and whatever, like, actually, you know what? New information I've changed and now I can look at that. But don't let that stop you. Some future version that has grown and changed. Don't worry about that. I listen to like old trip on this episodes. I'm like, believe, okay, a little, little, I wouldn't have said it like that now, but okay. You know, that's where I was then and that's fine because I believed it so fully then and not

that it was wrong, but just how I said it. You know what I mean? I love that. Like, Hannah, that was a great question and it makes me have all these follow-ups, this idea of, I think for anybody who's creating out there, it's imperative that you understand the feeling of what you're creating before you put it out there. Sometimes you just put stuff out there and it works or whatever, but maybe we could dig into that feeling.

I know there's been times for me where I'm like, my heart will start racing. I'm like, do, should I post that? And I bet you other creators come up against that, too. Like, is this something that you want to post? Because you're already thinking about what may happen, what might not happen. But maybe you could like dig in a little bit deeper and talk about, do you get that feeling sometimes when you have something that's really good? Or maybe you could talk about that a little bit.

I think it's going to be great for me. Yeah. Yeah. I get that feeling, especially when something is a little edgy, you know, when I perceive it as, okay, am I ready to be disagreed with? Am I ready to be misunderstood potentially? am I ready for just the experience of perception in a big way? So I think that there's one, there's a nervous system response that happens.

There's two experiences that I feel sometimes with that. And this is discernment at the end of the day is, am I, is the nervousness I'm feeling because I'm sharing something that is vulnerable and true, but there's something so deep inside me that knows that this is for me to post and that there's some growth aspect of posting this that I need to do. And then I think there's another version of that feeling that could be more of like a heads up warning. Like this, cat before you like mayday a little bit like and and that i if only there was only one feeling you know like if only that would really simplify things um i dialogue it out i actually before i

post it i really get clear first i get i i do my best to get it i will i will draft that until i can come into a place of power and fully recognize whatever is happening inside me to do it because I do think that when you put anything energetically out in the world, that energetic signature is on it. When I am nervous about something happening and I put it out there and there's like one thing, that thing almost always happens. It's like it's embedded in the energetic of the creation itself, the message itself. I mean, I know this is a little esoteric, but it almost happens all the time. The thing that I think I'm afraid of shows up, you know and um and so i think it's just so important i i just and this is just a little detour but

like i really try to if i'm feeling like not great resistant um not in a good mood not burned out i step away from my creative projects because that is the last thing that i want to put into my baby usually i just need a nap you know i need to rest or i need to like take a walk or something. And then I'm back and I'm enthused to do it. Um, so I do think it's just so important that the, like, my posts that do well is because I am genuinely excited about what I'm saying. Like, that genuine excitement and joy is the thing that people feel before they even know what you're saying. And I think that's really where the energy, that's where energy is the highest currency beyond what you're saying. You know, like I think that the, the, the, the, there's a

communication that's happening the second you begin. I love it. It's so interesting. And I think this is, I think back in COVID, when everybody moved to TikTok or Zoom, there was this real question about, can you project the felt presence of the other through media this way? And I think for a long time, it was like, it's different, doesn't quite work. And there are some aspects that are different.

Like, if we're sitting next to each other, I'm going to get a lot of different cues, is like some body language or maybe some pheromones or something like that. But I really believe that we're getting to a point. Maybe it's the language we're using. I love the idea of the energetic signature. But I really think that's beginning to translate, like a real transmission of like the felt presence through sort of the virtual world. Am I imagining that or what are your thoughts on that?

No, I think you're right. And I think it's also because we're all just getting better at being in front of a camera. Yeah. Forever I would say, man, I wish I could. could create content in the same flavor and flow and ease and humor that I am when I talk to a friend without this camera on. Suddenly, I could be flowing and funny and da-da-da-da. And then the camera comes on. I'm like, you know, like, I suddenly don't know what I am saying. I think I need to do more, you know. And so this is, I think, we're all in media training at the

end of the day is the closing the gap between who you actually are when the camera comes on and who you are in real life is the gift those that are really really captivating and good on camera is because that is who they are you know as close close to that gap is closed but the further the gap the more it feels real cats over here and here's camera cat doing over here it it's flatter I think that's where people have that, that's where we, that's where we grow into. I mean, I look at my old content. I was like, yikes, yikes, yikes, yikes, but bless her heart, that is where I was at. We all have to start somewhere.

And like, George, you are who you. I've met you. So, like, you are who you are all the time. But, but, and also you've done, like, I was so impressed when I heard like over 700 episodes, it shows that you're able to just translate you. so well through the camera and that and that is a gift that we're all getting better at yeah i think so shout out to tanya griffin tanya griffin has an incredible channel people should be checking her out she's a cool rock star tanya thank you for being here i'm looking forward to our conversation

coming up in a little bit you know and it kind of brings up this question for me cat as someone like you have played really big venues you like you've played music to large crowds is it similar like the feeling you get performing in a live audience versus saying putting out a video to like a virtual audience. You get like the same feeling in there? Um, no, I would say it's a little different for me. Um, it's going live is going my own live. Like for some reason, going live with you is, is different than me just going live on social media. But that's me just trying to think like, how do I entertain you? You know, like I just really, really neat. That's an area of growth for me is to just go live on my own. Um, but having,

music is specifically feels different for me because music is well first I first I go through is this the moment I forget how to DJ okay so there's always like a stage

performance moments typically unless I've played a venue quite often like little less now with district but but there there does there comes a moment almost every time I was like and this is moment i forgot how to beat match you know like in front of this huge crowd um i think that's probably just a product of just the more that i do it the less that that will happen um i haven't hit

that point yet where like because i'm not just a dj i'm not i don't have those reps in quite the same way as a just a pure traveling DJ that's doing it probably more even though i play in my room often um putting together mixes and stuff to keep my skills up really like so that i can minimize that that fear but you know there's such a joy and a self-expression and a physicality to my sets like I dance like as hard as anybody else would be dancing on the dance floor so for me it's really more flow state when I can get into that place when and that's why I like to I mean this is just a personal taste for me as a DJ my best sets are more prepared I know the journey that I would like to take my take the audience on and because of that the not only the transitions and the way in

which I have a lot of vocal tracks in my stuff so the way in which I'm phrase matching but I'm out of my head so that I can actually be in the performance more so it's a little bit more in the performance mode of like I'm dancing I'm having fun so it actually the technical part is secondary for me um so yeah it's there's there's both a when I'm Hosting and like hosting on a stage and DJing, there's always like a performance moment. But then the the energy of a dance floor is just pretty, it's magical. Yeah, like you're in it. You're part of it.

You're not only creating, but you're part of the whole on some level. Jesse, my friend Jesse, because what's up? Jesse, thanks for being here. Everybody should check out. Jesse's got new books coming out. Jesse, one of those going to come out. Jesse, let's see him. She says, I love the idea of creativity as a mood elevator, anti-depressant, engaging your imagination for the purpose of creating, giving it a job, a project.

The direction means it's not being used for rumination, anxiety. That's beautiful. Thank you, Jesse. Yeah. Honestly, like, I would just the one note I would say to that is like if there's one anecdote to like if you're feeling in a funk or if you're feeling depressed or anxious is to literally not do nothing is actually. to just channel it into something because there's just too much energy in the body. Like it just doesn't even know what to do with itself and then it can manifest into anxiety or depression because then you're not doing something.

And look, I get it. I've been at the places where I'm like, I know I should do something and then I don't. And then I feel either worse about myself, you know, for not doing it. But if you, if the more that we can just, it's like, it's like if you're depressed to help somebody else, you know. It's actually like if you're feeling, if you're not feeling great, be in certain. to someone else, take the spotlight off yourself and move it towards something either artistic or something that's helpful. And it's amazing how it can just boom. And moods change like this,

you know, good or bad, you know, but we're not as stuck if we just sometimes just move our body. Yeah. That's beautifully said. It makes me think, Kat, like you are always in community, Like whether you're playing music, whether you're doing some content for other people, always around people. Like, what is your relationship to community? Like, what do you think about when I say community? And how does it play a part in your life? Yeah. Oh, I mean, I love people. Like, I really, life is worth living because of others to me personally. Like, it is, it's fun to have your own solo experiences, you know, and I actually, ironically, I spend a lot of time alone. Um, but, But my, to like, just come back to dance again, you know, when I think to my friend Megan is coming up for me, we both love house music.

Like, we are obsessed. She's my dancing queen and partner. And we've had just the joy that we have shared on a dance floor was just, it's so special, you know, and it doesn't have to be said. and then the community of a bunch of adults here dancing the house music and a park, y'all are my people, right? And then community continues. It's like these little, it's like that little Russian dolls of community, you know. And then through the community on the internet, which is such a cool way to connect with so many people that we might have not been able to connect with. I mean, as much of a, of, you know, how difficult social media can also be for mental health.

It's also an amazing gift to be able to do this. Like what a cool thing that, that again, like when we talk about access, normal people to have access to create their life, amazing. Yeah, that is amazing. I love the idea of access and how pretty much anything you want to be part of is that your fingertips, if you're just willing to go out there. And if you have a little bit of courage to put yourself out there, to put your ideas out there, to put your thoughts out there in a way that's engaging and respectful of others and helpful and maybe even a little challenging. But man, that idea of just getting to be part of something bigger than yourself really breathes life into you and who you are. And let me bring up. I got some more people stacking up over here.

Owen Vale. Owen Vale from Kyoto, Japan. What's up? Owen, thanks for being here. He says, yeah, shout out to Japan. Owen, it doesn't sound like a very Japanese name there, Owen. He says, if history is a psychedelic feedback loop, what moment do you think we keep reliving? Hmm. Okay. The first thing that's coming up, I can feel my heart being like, do I notice?

Okay, so I think the moment that we are reliving right now is the, it's one of two things. either the railroad moment when we built the railroad and or the invention of the internet. We're at the precipice. And, okay, let's take the internet, the invention of the internet, which is actually not that long ago. That was met with an enormous amount of fear, right? First, Y2K, hilarious. Hilarious. If you're, if you, I'm a millennial. So you might not remember y2k if you're if you're a gen z but we we thought the world is going to end basically when the clocks uh changed anyway the clocks could handle the year change into 2000 and um but also it was also a scary time for brick and mortar businesses right like nulls and and and then a

legitimate fear because that did fundamentally change everything right like there there was going to be was growing pains with the internet. Certainly with businesses and factories and we're seeing it still with malls. Like that time is evolving and changing out. And what's come in its place, this thing called the internet, which actually created way more jobs, right? Way, way, way, way more online stores. You know, the influencer, right? Or a content, digital content creators. so many just like people being able to create films themselves, right, beyond just like social media. And so I think that's the moment that we're in is we're in that fear state moment with AI like that this is it. This is the collapse because we can't see what's coming yet. We actually

just don't know. And hopefully it's not just dypia. Maybe it is like I think there's going to be jobs in the same way that the internet took them out. That's going to happen with a. AI, but what's going to arise in that void space might be completely new if, you know, AI doesn't do all of that. It doesn't literally do everything. But I do think getting together, you know, like what can AI not do is it can't human, you know? Like, and I think the hope is that it actually pushes us back into community, you know, and that we use AI to actually give ourselves more time back. Not now in your 40-hour work week, here's how much more we can do. That's a very capitalistic. You're still working you 40 hours. But now you can get a month worth of work done

in a week. That to me is not a consciousness evolution. What would be really cool is as a business owner, it was, okay, I want you using AI. Obviously, I want you doing this. I want you to use the resources. And full time is now 30 hours a week or 32 hours a week. I want to give you your life back. I want to give you time to go do more stuff. Then I think AI would, people can get on board with the fact that they can actually get their time back, which is the most precious thing that we have on this earth. I love it. There's so much to think. about on that aspect of it, I do. There's a great quote that says the inventor of a technology is usually the worst person to tell you what that technology is going to do for people.

I think for a lot of the time, you know, we, and we're seeing it now. There's so many layoffs and there's all this talk about collapse and these things. And in some way, we've been using or AI has been told it's going to make you more productive at your job. Maybe. But I think what's also happening is it's making you more productive as an individual for your own goals. And maybe this sort of, um, this sort of a contraction that we're seeing in the labor market, this contraction that we're seeing in society is just sort of a regrouping so people can bloom again. If you think about the world as like seasons, the same way an apple tree or a deciduous tree loses its leaves and then it grows back fuller.

I think like we're in that aspect. You said something earlier too about how the idea of, um, we went from Bruce, brick and mortar to online. I think you're seeing that transition back. I know I work at a TikTok studio sometimes and they sell blind box toys. I don't know what a blind box toy was. And then all of a sudden, not only are they selling them on TikTok, but now they're opening these stores and you're starting to see individual creators open stores. So you're starting to see this ebb and flow back into the world. I think it's an amazing time to think about. That's a great, a great one. I like the positive. I mean, I think it's just important that we continue to remember to like have our

eyes wide open with what's happening with tech and also to imagine the world that we want, you know, like we have to keep project, we have to know the future that we want to have and what that looks like, you know, and I think that's having vision ultimately. Yes. And vision is, is, we need to define the vision certainly for our life, but I think it's, I think it is important. And I think it is our responsibility as people in a, society to also envision the community the society that we want to live in in the community and what that feels like and you know when we see the the the wealth disparity like do we want to see that like is that does that feel good that we see that there's that this is you know like

and not to say that you have to be the ones necessarily solve it I wouldn't know how to do that but just but just but just allowing you're allowing the even the thought process to be there and not just shutting down of this, I'm so powerless in this whole thing. And just, you know, the more that we can just vision our life and then vision for others, I think is, that's how we ultimately change the world incrementally. But I think it's individual. It has to start individually and then it, that's the ripple. Yeah, I love that.

My friend Lila Ling, I got her up on the stage over here, which says, love equals resonance with another observer, observes creativity, equals resonance with the field, everything else is an illusion, usually messy. For those listening, if you guys should click on Lila Lang's pot on her, link right here, or just look her up and look at some of the papers she's written. She's really, her and I have had some pretty cool discussions, but one thing that we were talking about, Kat, is this idea of remembering. And a lot of people think of remembering as going back and replaying a moment in your life,

but whatever remembering is actually remembering yourself, like putting yourself back together in a way. I think that speaks to your idea of becoming the best version of yourself and rippling out. But what do you think about the word remembering? What comes to mind when I say that? Well, I mean, I would absolutely, that's how I think of it, you know, whether it's remembering self-discovery to me is the same. It's the discovery of just the vastness of power and love and joy and limitless possibility that exists in all of us. You know, I think that's on a, from that spiritual aspect, you know, just remembering that that seed of the creator, right?

I don't mean that in a religious context, but just that create the ability to create is inside of us. And I think that it is the most exciting thing that a human being can do is to know thyself because within knowing thyself and remembering just how amazing. you are and powerful you are and able-bodied you are to change your life. That type of empowerment brings so much joy and wonder and it brings a vibrancy back to life. I was so bored and stressed for most of my life. Bored and stressed, I feel like the world to me looked like a muted palette of colors. And I would have pops of good times through going out. I've always been good at having fun, you know? Yeah. And but oftentimes they were really blurry good times, you know, and but I would live for the weekends and everything else was about passing time,

everything. And that's because I lived out here, you know, I didn't have any connection to myself and really getting quiet with myself and, and really knowing that, like, I have all the answers, what I need here inside me. That's not to say that you can't, part of that, knowing that is to call upon the people that feel right to you to also help guide your path, right? It doesn't mean you're solo doing it. But that even the guidance to talk to someone is still a starts with your own inner guidance system. And yeah, I mean, I think it was once, that's what psychedelics did for me, right?

It's like it connected me back to the, that was my divine connection back to God. source, universe, self. All of those to me are synonyms. Those are synonyms. That's a synonymous thing. So by connecting myself back to myself and doing all the things and self-love and really understanding what does it mean to, what is self-love? Like, what does that mean? And all the ways that I would dishonor myself and da-da-da-da, you know, like, and as, and this is not a, this is not a quick process. I don't know how else to like, I think we wish that there was like this quick path to, it and maybe for some but like for me it has not been it's been a slow and steady process of peeling away just things that were you know i that i that i adopted whether it was from family

from from society from the world itself that is the world itself is living in the illusion you know like it's madness you know like what is actually happening you know like and and realizing like okay once once you start to discover all of your amazingness like the world comes alive it comes alive and then everything that you ever wanted starts to happen because you are the thing that is so attractive you know i know i i wish i brought that home a little closer clearer but you know what i'm saying i know exactly what you're saying like i just speaking to my heart right here when i think of transformation like you're right it doesn't happen you know i was reading i think it was in lila's papers again she was talking or at least what i discern from them is that the new

pattern of you can probably take up to three years like if you think about this idea of saying yes to all the things you've ever wanted to be without and you got to say no to the parts that were holding you back and like that is not an easy process like you fall into old patterns but if you continue to say yes, it's almost like you don't collapse that wave function on some level. Like you're saying yes, like you're creating this new neural hardware. The same way we see in those brain scans of psychedelics where new neural networks are being moved and the default mode network is turned off. Like you're literally changing your perception of yourself and you're changing a relationship

with everything in the world. So when you said all of a sudden the world starts answering you and start showing you and giving you all these things that you've always wanted, it's like you are rewriting the code of who you are and attracting all those things into your life it's pretty amazing yeah it is and it's actually simple but it's simple and not but it is simple in that like it's literally you like yeah i one of my big mushroom trips i thought i was going to my intention was like i'm going to blast off into the ether and i'm going to see guides i'm going to go beyond the veil and it was so human it was just as human as you get and then i some you know

grace comes in and it just goes what what were you looking for you know like what was it and and and i just i laughed and i smiled and i said i am my prayer i am my prayer i am the thing when i pray i am praying to myself the aspect of myself that can do it all and that all of it is holy, you know? Like, when I'm fearful and small, when I'm contracted, when I'm falling into my stuff, like, it's all it. You know, like none of it, it's not when I'm just in my elevated state and I'm feeling and trusting in this and that, you know? And so, yeah, just that knowing of like, I am my prayer. Like, yes, okay. And it changes everything. It really does because it, it brings a level of empowerment back.

That doesn't mean that I'm not in constant communication with my own spirit realm. But I try to. Like I catch when I feel like I'm high arching, high arching, I can't even say it. Something outside of me. You know, it's very easy to feel like the universe is out here. And I'm speaking to it and this and that. But I have to keep reminding myself, like, you are speaking to the universe within and around. but it's it's all one here but yeah it's a it's an interesting process they be the

awakening process if you will yeah it is interesting what is your what is your relationship with psychedelics like maybe I'll start with me and for me I went through some phases until recently where I would do like really big doses and then I would use like particularly mushrooms like I would do some large doses like six to 10 grams and then maybe once a month and then I would back that up with like smaller micro doses throughout the week and that will kind of keep me in touch. That was probably like a year ago I was doing that, but I sort of moved on to like like 10 UGs of LSD for maybe once a week or twice a month or something on that aspect. And that seems to be something that grounds me and keeps me

in that zone a little bit. But I'm curious if you could talk about like your psychedelic use and how you use them. If you have a regiment. Yeah, yeah. Great question. First of all, Shout out to the 10 micrograms of LSD. If only, if only, unfortunately, that feels like LSD is such a scary one for our country, certainly, certainly the government. But boy, would we have a much more productive, sharp society? And we would probably ditch Adderall. It's such a better, it's such a clear creative focus.

For me personally, obviously, I can say that for everybody. But yeah, I love that little shout out. I too like to have, I go in like little phases. This is how I would say it. I mean, when I first started my like really, I mean, I did mushrooms when I was 16, but that doesn't really count. I didn't do it again for 15 years if that tells you anything about my experience. And then I did it again, big macrodose, very emotional, wasn't fun.

So I was like, okay, I don't need to do this or like, at least you. year. And it wasn't until in 2019 is really when I started doing a bunch of mushrooms. And I did a lot of mushrooms at that time. I also was pairing it with MDMA. And I was in community. And so it was fun. Right. Like when you suddenly when you pair it with MDMA, the emotional stuff of mushrooms is met with something that just chemically feels really good. Right. You just have so much dopamine and serotonin now dropping into your system because of MDMA. And so that was, I was doing it a lot then. And I think it was part of my evolution at the time.

I was on a quick hyper. And by a lot, I mean like probably like twice a month in like bigger, bigger experiences. Yeah. And in fun. Like it wasn't like ceremonial at the time for me. And then the following year, it was more. ceremonial probably I would do a big one once a quarter because it's still a lot you know mushroom ceremonies are just a bunch of crying revelations they're beautiful but like they're not like

a walk in the park necessarily even even if you've done it a bunch and and then I never really I microdose actually for three months in a row when I was just launching trip on this and I really do credit that to I was learning like 27 new things I couldn't believe the amount of like new information I was self-teaching myself. And I do think that the having and I was on the stamet stack, which was five five days on, two days off for three months. So my brain was constantly in a more flexible state and psilocybin puts your brain in a flexible state for learning. So there is potential that the rigidness of thought is now softening so that you can learn something new, easier.

That's still being studied, but that would be essentially the idea. And now today, I haven't even done a big mushroom trip this year. I've done bigger social experiences with, certainly on my birthday. But again, like not like, not like, not like. I'm not, not even a gram, you know, not even a gram at once. And by like now, I feel like my sensitivity is also less. So like I'll have a little square of new tropics and I'm like, I'm good. Like I'm very much feeling it.

And so I'm not even a big microdozer these days. Although I've had a couple in the last couple days, I've been feeling really good. I mean, I think this is part of, part of what I think psychedelics do is that they come into your life when you need them. Yeah. But right now I think I'm just, I'm in that state. I'm in a receptive, open state. I'm listening. I'm carving out that time every morning and quiet to meditate, to journal, to get myself ready. I'm at night. I'm carving out that time for myself to get into a meditative state, to do whatever is calling to me to take care of my spirit. And I think that's always what the mushrooms were asking me to do. And now that I'm doing that, just because it feels good, because I can actually see the difference in my life, it's like they haven't really, like, called me forward as much. And then I would say the other times, like, I do love to go dance.

And so I'll take mushrooms dancing with me, or LSD, up to about a quarter dose. So, like, 25 micrograms. I am kind of tripping on 25. I'm yeah that is that is a lot that is an experience yeah by that point by that point so yeah that's kind of my my regimen at this point but it's it's varied over the years I love it it reminds me of the Alan Watts quote that says once you get the message you can hang up the phone right I think there's a lot of truth to it and I love the way it echoes my it echoes my experience in a lot of ways too like I think it does come to you when you need it and like there are some

tremendous learning curves that you can overcome if you're in the right frame of mind and if you're in a good place and you're using it in a way that is creativity that is this creative i think you can really step up your game with imagination and take it to the next level and obviously i'm not endorsed i don't i'm not telling anybody listen to this they should go out and do psychedelics i'm just speaking on my own my own experience on that aspect of it yeah it's thanks for sharing that i got a rene sinclair coming from kingston she says what art forms do you believe will become the next political revolution? Oh, political revolution.

I think dance. I mean, I know that's not even a new one necessarily, but I think physically moving together in unity and whatever that means is going to be the thing because, first of all, the tech domination that we see is counting on our eyeballs and our fighting we are both fights and our attention are the two like main ways that they can get us you know like and they can really and it's getting so sophisticated with like how to really plug you in you know the algorithms like fighting and

discourse does well it wants that and once we know that and once we know that that this is designed to get me mad. This is designed to make me other myself from this person or to, you know, it gives, it's almost like mustache twirling villains out here with social media sometimes. And the algorithm loves that and the people that run the tech. And so I think what's going to be so radical is it's like putting down the phones and literally getting together, like, and whatever we can. And to me, moving the body is the thing that many, many, many people, I think are missing now because we're so sedentary.

Most men are not like, I mean, they're still obviously like men that pick up and do labor and stuff. But a lot of work for men and women is no longer with our hands, some, obviously with blue collar, but so much of it is not. There's so much video games and so much this. And so we need to get embodied. this is like, this is where we release oxytocin. This is where the serotonin comes. When you hug a person for like 27 seconds, that's when oxytocin is released in the body. And all of these feel good loving chemicals happen in the brain from just getting together and hugging another human. And so I think that's going to be the radical act of loving rebellion is to just call back our humanness.

I love it. That's an awesome aspect of it. There's something so community-based about it, too, when you see large people dancing together. Like, there's this feeling of joy that comes. It's almost like it's contagious and it radiates outwards. It's some interesting experiments where there were some people at a concert and they were just dancing all crazy, like way over there. And at first people were like looking at them and laughing. And then somebody got up and joined them and another person joined them. The next thing you know is everybody dancing together.

It's such a beautiful form of communication. I love that answer. If there's one, most people don't, but once the second person comes, that second person, if you ever, if you ever see one person dancing, just know that the second person is the one that can shift the entire, like the trajectory of that dance floor. So if you ever get the opportunity by having two suddenly, that can ignite a whole different vibe. Three, forget it. Now we've already got it going.

Yeah. But it's, but it's, it's, it's, it's joining that first person that one is not necessarily going to be it. That's still too scary and too isolated. I forgot where I had either read that or watched that, but I was like that that checks out. So yeah, you can, you can literally create a dance floor if you see just one person on there, be the second or third. I think that also speaks to ideas too. Like if someone has an idea and then someone joins that idea, it's like pretty soon you have a whole movement right. Totally. Exactly. 100%. Yes. Yeah, people don't want to like be out in a limb, you know, like that's just, that's just, that's just biology at its best. That's that is this that's Maslow's hierarchy of needs. We want to be accepted by the group. We don't want to be the weirdo that's separated from the group. So that person's the scary person. Yeah. They have separated themselves and they're doing something that the group is not doing. And as a we have to look around, do we agree? What do we do? It takes the next brave person to say, I like that. But there's, they're, they're starting. the numbers, you know? Yeah. That's, it's interesting that you brought up dance as the next revolution. Now we're talking about ideas. We're pretty much talking about revolution on that level. I think you're right. I think dance might be the way to go. I just think we need, it's joy. Joy is, joy is the most powerful, joy in love are the most powerful forces in the universe. And the thing is

on a dance floor, when you are outside of your mind, especially off a screen, and you're a and sharing the dance floor with so many different types of people in this shared experience with the music, with the ability to even like, it's self-conscious to dance, even the ability to say, I'm going to do this anyway, even if I feel silly, and that we're all going to do it together. And like, that is so, it's just so powerful. And I think this is, you know, this comes back to actually the days of the 60s, right? Yeah. Part part of. Part of. of really the main reason why we have the Controlled Substances Act is because the government lost control of a bunch of people

that did not want to go to war, they did not want to fight, and they were starting to think for themselves. They did not want to subscribe to what the government's, that control, fear stuff. They wanted to dance and play and have fun, and they became hard to control. And then they shut it down, you know?

It was a way to shut down black, brown, and the anti-war movement. That is what, and that was who was against Nixon, you know? Like, it was a way to target those that weren't politically aligned with him. And so there's still power within that. I'm not saying that we should all just do. I think there was an over probably use of LSD also in the 60s. Nobody knew what it was. There was no, there was no set and saying there was no education around it.

So maybe people probably overdid it at times. But that's just human nature. also. Humans overdo stuff. We overdo it with alcohol. We overdo it with parting. We overdo it. So I think it just ultimately comes down to education at the end of the day. I love that. There's a great book called when it's called, what is it called? I think it's called Black Elks Speaks. And it's the story of a medicine man talking about when we were moving west and they rounded up all these indigenous people. And I forgot the exact battle this was. But people should read that book when Black Hill speaks. And he was talking about they were, all these soldiers had rounded up, all these

indigenous people. And they were up in this camp and they started dancing. And like when everything was fine until they started dancing. And then it made all the soldiers really nervous. Like what are they doing? What are they celebrating? Why are they dancing? You know? And like all of a sudden, just everything broke loose. But it, it reminds me of that because you were talking about the 60s in education. What do you think about this idea? I'm working with some people that it's called Reform 2025, Dr. Stephen Bezell and Julia L. Hodge, and they're talking about this idea of reforming the idea of health in the U.S. and they want to bring it to the government. Could you see in this, in today's day and age, people going and speaking on campus about health

reform and that becoming a movement? Oh, absolutely. I think we, I think we, I think we're hungry for it. Not only do I think it can happen. I think it's ripe for it. I mean, we're seeing it right now with our healthcare. This is, this is the idea that so many, that healthcare still is the thing that bankrupts people here in the richest country in the world is crazy. We are the richest country in the world and we are like, we're like 73 in health. We're like 34th on the list of. healthy countries. There's at least 20 countries that are in the 90% in health. That's that shouldn't be acceptable for us, right? Like that means this is like twofold. Like why, why? I will forever be upset that organic is you have to be well. That is a premium to not have poison crops. Like what are we

talking about? That's that's ludicrous. I was like, wait a minute, wait a minute. So I have to be well off in order to not have my food poisoned or all these growth hormones and it's a it's a it's a premium to to have food like that like round up like the things that we are are doing and it's just there's so much we can do for health and medicine because it's both like yeah it's we taking care of our body and our vessel and that also means that's that's a systemic thing as well right like raw whole foods should be accessible for everybody not just processed crap yeah and um fast food that we know makes you sick it's okay you can have it a little bit but that's what it why like having like um actual like chicken and and and crops and things the fact that that's not an even accessible thing for so many

people is inherently the thing that needs to be reformed um and we can we can and I think enough people just I think it does take some organization at the end of the day right like it it does take the people that are putting forward the stuff but I mean I know for myself and maybe this because I've just grown up being liberal all my life and a democrat but I'm like I don't mind my taxes going towards something like that i don't mind helping the whole society lift it up i'm not saying not to be in a ridiculous level but like when we help each other we help ourselves like even if you want to be self-serving it helps ourselves when everybody's thriving it helps it helps business it helps everything except maybe the the the business of medicine you know that's the only thing that

maybe and I'm not a medicine hater but obviously you know I think the first thing with diabetes it's like we should also you should also it's great that there's insulin especially because there's diabetics that are one and two like I know I've got people in my life that have that but their doctors never said and by the way what are you eating like you know I think there just needs to be a little bit of an education around it all and a bigger push yeah I'm so excited to see this this like the next generation of people that are just standing up and regardless of where you're at like when I see people in the streets with signs like I get excited like these people have had too much these they are not going to take it anymore and it's it's so interesting being in california like

you see there's all these protests that are going on and i i can't help but think like we're really close like there's just these little things that divide us like these little wedges that get put in between us. But in reality, people want to have a house they can afford. They want their kids' life to be better. They want to have good food. And like I can really see it. I can see an outbreak of radical health reform, something that unites everybody, the younger generation, the older generation, Republicans, Democrats. I think we're really close to that. It's something that I really feel is on the forefront. So I think when we get it together, I think you should come and speak at some of these college events. What do you think? Yeah, I'd love to. Yeah, definitely

love me. Let me know. I mean, I'm not, I'm certainly not an expert in them, except to say, like, just however I can lend my voice to better living, you know, at the end of the day. Like, I, and I, here's one that I would really love to create accessibility around, personally, is around fun and joy. I think, I think accessibility is missing in, like, the absolute privilege it has been be able to go to music festivals for me life changing it is so fun it is so amazing to be in that kind of community yeah and it's really expensive that is a real luxury to go to and a lot of people that's they don't they can't do that right now and uh and i feel like that kind of communal joy um needs we need an a new i would love like a non-profit to help with like creating

create it is not a nice to have i think i fully believe it's a must have we are missing the joy and the fun for so many because so many are in survival which aptly so obviously going to going out dancing doesn't seem like a priority when you can barely eat and that's why i feel like there should it would love it maybe it'll be me one day to like create even if it's like you know having like like dance okay so in in la there's there's always like festival type events like day events in parks here so like ground park um and a la historic park and all these other ones and so but insomniac and all these big companies are putting it on it's an event they make a lot of money from it that's great um but i was like but we can do this for the community actually like if this all we need is a sound

system you know we need the sound system get that sponsored by brands that are looking out for the community i mean i i know brands have to figure out an angle but like more science and more realizing like the bring people but bring people together give them real experiences of this kind of like the joy and the fun and that is fuel you can hold that kind of love and community and it It's hope. It actually, it fuels hope because if you're just, it's hard to feel hopeful when you have no, like, little cracks, cracks to even, to even to move into that space. And, yeah, I would like to bring fun as an accessible thing for us and as a priority. Man, I'm in.

How do I support your nonprofit over there? Let's do that. That sounds fantastic. It sounds pretty fun, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We'll see. We'll see. It's definitely. It's my highest joy, you know. I mean, obviously not everybody's joy is going to be dancing, but I think a lot of people would like it more than they think if they've never been. It reminds me, too, of like, you know, we talk a lot about, in psychedelics, there's a lot of language around, like, the medical container. But the recreational container seems to be almost just as medicinal. Like, we do have lots of people that can benefit with, like, PTSD or something. some mental illness. But I think recreation, like recreational use is just as positive. And it may

stop people from having these mental crises if they just had a little bit more recreation in their life. I truly believe that. I mean, and maybe recreation makes it sound too, that's the word that I know is used really often. But, but I think, yeah, I think it just sounds like it's like it's too light when actually it could be like the best form of therapy. You know, like you want to know how I can really get my mind, like move. I don't even have to go to a place. I mean, really just putting on music and allowing myself to dance in my room and getting past my resistance, especially if I'm not feeling it. I can eventually like kind of charge up some of that good old pharmacy in my brain here. I've just, you know, dopamine and serotonin and it feels really good. And I, I, my personal

journey has been through joy that like my opening into my spiritual path. And, becoming the woman I am today has was through joy that was my that was my healing was through joy then I found my way into crying and contemplation and and stuff but it was through psychedelic joy to be to be very clear psychedelics plus community like I was with friends like six or seven friends psychedelics bomb ass music just completely cracked my heart open and and once there's an opening that's all it takes then it's then the opening it's begun you know and uh you don't need to continue to do that like once that little opening happens you just get to feel like you know when you're when you're happy when you're joyful when you're trusting when you don't feel the weight of

the world and that that fear of survival on you when you can get those glimmers those moments that i'm okay we're we're better friends we're better lovers or better spouses better to our you know like There are children, parents. And that's why I think it's a necessity is because, like, our well-being affects everything and everyone. And it's time to, like, just prioritize that and whatever it is for others, you know, and find ways to, like, literally, like, support that, support that financially, you know? Because right now that just gets always put to the side and understandably.

And yet, then I think it creates. it's a vicious, but that's inherently the paradox is because when you're, when you don't have that, then life feels hard and frustrating and scary. And so it's hard then to get yourself even into a magnetic place to change your life. So there's, there's a real need to connect to joy in order to get to break through just the density of the fear. that so many of us can feel yeah I'm reminded of the roomy quote the wound is where the light comes in yeah you can just open get if you can just be cracked open a little bit like everything will flow the way it's supposed to flow out there can't wash you are amazing I'm so stoked to get to

talk to you and hang out with like this conversation I was only supposed to take you to an hour like at an hour and a half over here oh cool I'm grateful for for all the work you're doing for you being someone's an advocate for joy and love and psychedelics and the podcast and all the media you're putting out there. I think you're a phenomenal creator. And before we land the plane over here, I was hopeful that maybe you could take a little bit of time to tell people where they can find you, what you have coming up and what you're excited about.

Yeah, yeah. Thank you so much for having me. This is really fun. This is one of the actually the most fun conversations I've had because I love that we got to just talk about so many different subjects. Oftentimes people just ask me about psychedelics and it's so fun to talk about transhumanism. Like, excellent. Cool.

Um, I'm Life with Cat Walsh, Cat with a K on all social media. I'm basically just on Instagram and TikTok. I will be launching my substack in the new year. So that's coming soon. That will also be at Life with Cat Walsh. My website, my new website will be launched next week, which is really, really exciting. You can find all the things that I do and how we could work together. I'm a host, whether that's a show host or a onstage host, like an MC. I'm a digital creator, so I'd make social media content. I work with brands. And then what else do I do? Oh, my DJ. Hi. My DJ alias is called Katz Meow. And through, you'll see that also tagged with my At Live with Kat Walsh. That's just kind of how I funnel everything. And yeah,

just creating content i'm letting life kind of guide me and show me where to go next um don't have any uh DJ shows coming up yet but if you follow me um in my link tree on any of my socials you'll see a mailing list to add for my sub stack and that will have like all the uh all the info about upcoming shows and things like that that's going to be kind of like my email list going forward so thank you all so much for tuning in this was so fun to just go down all these wonderful roads. And George, thank you. Yeah, I'm grateful for your time.

Everybody that hung out with us today, thank you so much for hanging out with us for Hannah, Jack, Renee, Owen, and of course, Tanya, Lila, Jesse, Joshua Moyer. My friend's on YouTube over there, Who Care, Polar Nights. Everybody, thank you so much for hanging out with us today. I have a beautiful day. I can't hang on briefly afterwards. Everybody else, have a beautiful day.

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