Trump's Trials - How President Trump is changing presidential pardons

Episode Date: June 2, 2025

NPR's Mara Liasson explains how President Trump is transforming the power of presidential pardons.Support NPR and hear every episode of Trump's Terms sponsor-free with NPR+. Sign up at plus.npr.org.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

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Because no one's story can capture all that's happening in this big crazy world of ours on any given morning. Listen now to the up first podcast from NPR. I mean, Martinez. President Trump had a pardon pact May issuing 19 last month,, as according to the Department of Justice. He commuted eight sentences in May as well. The list includes GOP donors, gang leaders, reality stars, and top Trump supporters. President Trump has been doling out the string of pardons on a rolling basis.

Here to discuss how Trump is transforming presidential pardon power is NPR national political correspondent Mara Liasen. So Mara, as far as I know, president has no limits on pardons. How is Trump handling it? That's right. The pardon power is something that's reserved solely for the president. He can wipe away a conviction. He can issue a commutation to cut a prison sentence short. This is his power exclusively. There's no legal review, so courts aren't involved. Congress has no role. And even more than trade or immigration, this is an unchecked executive power, just the kind

that Trump likes to exercise. And you know, he did make a lot of pardons in his first term, but of course, the biggest one that really set the stage for his approach to pardoning was on his first day in office this time when he pardoned more than 1,500 of the January 6 rioters who breached the Capitol in an effort to overturn the results of the 2020 elections. Some of them were violent offenders, beat police officers on the steps of the Capitol, and it sent the message, if you engage in political violence on Trump's behalf, that's okay. And when Trump pardonardons Scott Jenkins,

a longtime, very vocal MAGA supporter, former sheriff in Virginia who was convicted of bribery and fraud, his lead pardons attorney at the Department of Justice, Ed Martin, tweeted, quote, no MAGA left behind. So the political message is pretty clear. Yeah, so how is this different then from other presidents?

Well, other presidents have issued pardons that were controversial. Bill Clinton pardoned Mark Rich, a fugitive who was indicted for evading $48 million in taxes and his ex-wife had been a very prominent Democratic donor. President Biden pardoned his son Hunter He also gave preemptive pardons to his family members and some administration officials He thought Trump might target and some administration officials he thought Trump might target. But those pardons were generally issued at the end of presidents terms because political pardons are controversial, or at least they used to be. But Trump has taken a much more aggressive and transparent approach to these pardons.

He actually ran on pardoning the January 6 rioters. It was a campaign promise. And what have Republicans said about this? They haven't said much of anything. When Biden issued his pardons, Democrats did speak out against it. Many of them were very angry about it, but Republicans have been silent. And this just shows the kind of rock solid hold Trump has on his own party. And we know that the traditional political rules don't apply to Trump.

He faced no consequences for his own convictions. All right. So who might be next on his possible pardon list? Well, Trump has talked about pardoning the people who were convicted of plotting to kidnap Michigan Governor Gretchen Whitmer. His pardons attorney Ed Martin has said, quote, these guys are victims, just like January 6th. And then you see actually Democrats who are trying to get a pardon from Trump,

like former New Jersey Senator Bob Menendez, arguing that they are the victims of political targeting, just like Trump has said he was. So they're trying to use the Trump playbook. Yeah, that's MPR National Political Correspondent, Mara Lyson. Mara, thanks. Thank you. Before we wrap up, a reminder, you can find more coverage of the Trump administration on the NPR Politics Podcast, where you can hear NPR's political reporters break down

the day's biggest political news with new episodes every weekday afternoon. And thanks, as always, to our NPR Plus supporters who hear every episode of the show without sponsor messages. You can learn more at plus.npr.org. I'm Scott Detrow. Thanks for listening to Trump's Terms from NPR. work like that. That can't possibly be right. We dig into the delightfully convoluted rules behind country of origin, what makes, say, a Chinese product Chinese, and how companies facing tariffs are getting creative. From Planet Money on NPR, wherever you get your podcasts.