Trump's Trials - Trump floats idea to make Gaza Strip 'the Riviera of the Middle East'

Episode Date: February 5, 2025

President Trump suggested at a Tuesday press conference that Gaza's nearly 2 million residents should leave the Palestinian enclave and proposed the U.S. take it over and redevelop it. NPR's Steve Inskeep speaks to Yousef Munayyer, a senior fellow at the Arab Center in Washington DC. Support NPR and hear every episode sponsor-free with NPR+. Sign up at plus.npr.org.Learn more about sponsor message choices: podcastchoices.com/adchoicesNPR Privacy Policy

I'm Scott Detro and you're listening to Trump's terms from NPR. We're going to be doing all sorts of things nobody ever thought was even possible. It's going to be a very aggressive first hundred days of the new Congress. Unpredictable, transformative next four years. The United States is going to take off like a rocket ship. Each episode we bring you the latest news about the 47th president and the policy changes he is pursuing on his own terms. We know from experience that means challenging precedent, busting norms, and pushing against

set ideas about what the federal government can and can't do. It all raises questions about how much Washington and the country will change over the course of this term. NPR is covering it all in stories like the one you are about to hear, right after this. You're listening to Trump's terms from NPR is covering it all in stories like the one you are about to hear, right after this. You're listening to Trump's Terms from NPR. big wins and breaking down the Grammys for Kendrick Lamar, Chappell Roan and Sabrina Carpenter. Listen to the Pop Culture Happy Hour podcast from NPR. I'm Steve Inskeep in Washington. A Wall Street Journal headline captures

one of the ironies of this moment. The headline says quote, Trump campaigned on ending foreign entanglements. Now he wants to own Gaza. So says the Wall Street Journal. The president did in fact talk of taking over the Palestinian territory, adding it to other proposed acquisitions such as Greenland, Canada and the Panama Canal. I don't want to be cute. I don't want to be a wise guy, but the Riviera of the Middle East, this could be something that could be so bad. This could be so magnificent. Removing 2 million Palestinians, more or less, and turning the area into a seaside real estate development. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu did not

exactly say no. He said it could change history. Trump's proposal would end hope of a Palestinian state in Saudi Arabia. An important country here has issued a statement saying that a two-state solution is non-negotiable. The countries that Trump would like to take in Palestinians say they won't do it. Palestinian reaction has been mostly hostile, although our colleague Eya Batraoui says some Palestinians might welcome the chance to leave. Let's get one more point of view about this from Youssef M'ir, who is a senior fellow at the Arab Center in Washington, D.C. He leads the Palestine-Israel program and has commented on events in the region for decades. Good morning, sir. Yusuf Muna'ir Good morning. Good to be with you. Dr. Seif What did you think when you heard of this

proposal? Yusuf Muna'ir Look, first thing you have to keep in mind is that prior to Trump's comments, I understood this as the meeting between a convicted felon in the white house and an indicted war criminal and Benjamin Netanyahu. So the expectation was there was going to be a conspiracy to commit further crimes once these two gentlemen got together. And of course, uh, I wasn't surprised when I heard Trump's latest outrageous idea to not just ethnically cleanse the Gaza Strip, but to actually have the United States engage

in the imperialist endeavor of annexing it and taking it over. So, you know, this is the newest outreach from Donald Trump and not something that was completely surprising given who he was meeting with, what their respect for the law and rights actually is given their track record, and his history of saying outrageous things. I want to understand if you take the Israeli position seriously here. Trump has been talking for a number of days about cleaning out Gaza, his phrase. And we asked Danny Danon, the Israeli ambassador to the United Nations about this just on Monday. And he said, Israel's policy is we don't want to take over Gaza, and the Palestinians will remain there, and we've got to find

some way to govern. And he wasn't talking about removing Palestinians at that time. This was a right-wing position, removing the Palestinians. Do you think that Benjamin Netanyahu is serious about pursuing this? I think Benjamin Netanyahu is mostly interested in remaining in power in Israel. He heads a precarious coalition that could collapse at any time. Remember, he presided over the single most disastrous security failure in Israeli history and he's yet to really be held accountable for that by the Israeli public. What he is seeking to do is to really keep this war going on for as long as he possibly can so he doesn't

end up facing the music. And if he can drag out the situation in Gaza for five years, 10 years, create a new set of challenges and problems that keep the accountability towards him at a distance, he'd be happy to pursue that, whether it's through this crazy Trump idea or the next one. I'd like to know what you think about one statement Trump made that a lot of people who might be skeptical of his proposal might sign on to.

He argues that the current situation in the Middle East is not working, that it's untenable, that it's been a failure for 50 years. And so he'd like to shake it up by doing this. Would you agree that the current situation is unsustainable and that Gaza is in fact a disaster at this point? Look, I think everybody in the region understands that, has understood that for a long time, but they also understand that the reason that is the case is because almost eight decades ago, hundreds of thousands of Palestinians were ethnically cleansed from their homes during

the creation of the Israeli state into surrounding countries. This has been the foundation of destabilization and conflict in the region for the better part of a century now. And the last thing that anyone in the region wants to sign up for or thinks is a path to stability is more ethnic cleansing of Palestinians. So Trump has obviously identified a problem here, but is, you know, really more like an arsonist than a firefighter. Yusuf Munaier is a senior fellow at the Arab Center in Washington, where he leads the Palestine-Israel program. Thanks for your opinions this morning. Really appreciate it.

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