TRUNEWS with Rick Wiles - Holy Land Day 9: Dr. Talal Abu-Ghazaleh: New World Order Rising from World War 3 Ashes

Episode Date: May 6, 2022

On the last day in Jordan, TruNews host Rick Wiles sits down for an exclusive interview with Dr. Talal Abu-Ghazaleh. Dr. Talal is one of the most respected and influential businessmen in the Middle East. He speaks with Rick about World War 3, the New World Order, and Global Government. Rick Wiles. Airdate 5/6/22.Holy Land Day 1: Ancient Roman City and Elijah's Mountain - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/49569185Holy Land Day 2: The City of Aqaba and the World’s Oldest Church - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/49573636Holy Land Day 3: Wadi Musa, Moses’ Spring, and the Gateway to Petra - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/49587574Holy Land Day 4: Explorations at Ancient Petra - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/49599828Holy Land Day 5: From the Dead Sea to the Mosaic Churches of Madaba - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/49630066Holy Land Day 6: The Journey from Mount Nebo to the Jordan River - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/49644875Holy Land Day 7: The Revelation Church City of Philadelphia, Today’s Amman - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/49660019Holy Land Day 8: Matthew 24 and the Refuge City of Pella - https://www.spreaker.com/episode/49681755

The following program is made possible by the faithful prayers and financial support of listeners just like you. To find out how you can help, visit www.truenews.com. In 2019, I interviewed one of the most influential Arab businessmen in the Middle East. He presides over a vast international network of corporations and employees throughout the Middle East. I am now standing in front of his international headquarters here in downtown Amman. In fact, I'm looking across the street at the headquarters of his mobile phone company. His name is Dr. Talal Abu Ghazala. He is respected in the Middle East as the godfather of Arab accounting. He is also an expert in intellectual property in the Arab world. He is the founder and chairman of the Jordan-based Talal Abu Ghazala Corporation. He started over 140 corporations providing specialized professional services such as accounting, business management, consulting, legal services, intellectual property, and information technology.

He is highly connected to powerful and influential people in organizations around the world. His membership in various international organizations are too numerous to mention, but they include the United Nations, the World Trade Organization, and the Bretton Woods Committee. Let's go inside and meet Dr. Talal Abu-Ghazala. Well, Dr. Talal Abu-Ghazala, thank you for welcoming me here into your beautiful office here in downtown Amman. I appreciate the time. I interviewed you in 2019, and the world has changed. It is completely different than it was. We've had, the world has gone through lockdowns and a pandemic and now we're in a war. When I interviewed you in 2019, you warned about a coming economic crisis for the world and a world war,

and you said a new world order will emerge after the world war. Do you still believe that? It's not only that I believe that. It's more than that. I think the world now believes it. Because when I made these statements, they seemed at that time absurd to most of the world's communities. Now all of a sudden it has become a common word, World War III. We hear it now from leaders warning of the

possible event that they refused before 2019 to call it World War. Yes. Now President Biden said it, putin prime minister putin's and president putin said it um most world leaders now are talking of world war ii which i I believed it was coming even earlier than 92, in 99.

And I made that statement, and I think, and I'm sure everybody will find it strange that I say what I want to say. I would love to see it happen very soon, so that we can get out of this mess that we call world order. There is no world order now. The world does not have a single global organization that is operating. Security Council does not work because any of the five parties fighting would say veto. There has not been a recent vote on anything at the Security Council, and there will not be because it will be vetoed by any of the five super countries that have given themselves the right to own the veto vote.

So the World Trade Organization, which we have worked so hard on, I personally on its council and served on its board, and we spent years, years, of working to develop it. And as you may know, the World Trade Organization was, I agreed at the Bretton Woods meeting after the World War II, but it never came to existence

until 96. 1996, it took that long period to negotiate it because after every discussion and every round, the U.S. delegation had to go back to the Congress because, as you know more than I do, the trade is under... The treaty. It has to be approved by the Senate.

The Senate and not by the executive arm. That's right. Dr. Cholong, let me ask you this. After World War I, we received... The world was given the League of Nations and it failed. After World War II, the world was given the United Nations. Yeah. And I believe what you're saying is it has failed.

It has failed, definitely. So will there be a World War III? Mm-hmm. And after World War III, will the world be given a new global organization? Absolutely. That is why I'm very eager to see this war happen, because after every war, whether it's regional, bilateral, or global, the parties sit around a table like this one and negotiate new agreements. So when you say you're eager to see a world war,

you don't mean you're eager to see destruction. You're saying you're... You just want to get this fight over with and the world works out a new system. Is that what you're saying? I will be criticized after the statements because

some people would like to interpret my statement that i want to see destruction but i want to get out of this great unfit fair world world orderless world and disastrous conditions not only economically we're now going into a very serious stagflation period. Stagnation and inflation together, which is a disastrous combination. We have serious social problems. But on top of all of that, and I want to make this statement and warning through you. What I am worried for is the complete ignorance of the leaders of the world to the climate issue. Climate is the greatest challenge to humanity and is the greatest

threat to the future of humanity. After 26 summits, 27 in fact, zero action has been taken. There were lots of resolutions, but none of them was implementable or implemented. And we are heading to a stage that every scientific study indicates that by the year 2050, humanity will face this complete distinction if nothing is done about climate. This is the greatest threat to our lives. The immediate threat is the possibility of war between Russia and the United States. I read your article that you wrote, I believe, March 1st, just as the war in Ukraine started. And you laid out what you saw as the issues in that fight.

Has anything changed in your thinking now that we're in May? That's a good question. I think events have proven that what I was predicting is happening. And from day one, I said this war is not an Ukrainian war. This is the beginning of World War III. And it is going through stages. What I want to say now is that This is the beginning of World War III. And it is going through stages. What I want to say now is that the economic,

and this is the only difference between World War I and World War II. It's not the only one. It's one of the major differences, is that World War III is a combination of destruction and economic and social destruction. So far, the previous wars were wars. Physical destruction. Fighting, winning, destroying, overtaking countries, etc. Now, this war can be fought while you and I are sitting in our own countries and deciding how to kill people through famine, through unemployment,

through complete economic chaos. You mentioned the climate. Have you thought about weather warfare? Sir, I was commissioned by the United Nations Secretary General in 1989

to present a study on the threats of climate change as early as that. And I called a meeting of all the accounting societies, CPA in America, Chartered, etc., of the world. And I chaired that meeting and submitted a report. When I presented the report on the day of presentation of the report, I was told by the Secretary General then, and it was Kofi Annan, he said that the U.S. ambassador to the United Nations and the UK ambassador wanted to attend the launch meeting.

We were launching our report. After I opened the meeting and started my presentation, His Excellency, the American ambassador, said, Sir, Mr. Chairman, you're wasting your time and our time. This report will not be considered unless it is approved by the Capitol. And viciously I asked, which Capitol? He said, you know what I mean, Washington. I said, oh, that's up to you then.

But we proceed with our work as experts. And you decide what you decide. Rightfully, the report was shelved. It was not even looked at. Well, the question I was getting at was military warfare. You were talking about the destruction of societies, the destruction of civilization. There's not a lot of information available about what powerful militaries can do with the climate, with the weather, that they can make droughts appear in a country

or floods. Is this the kind of warfare that you think is going to be waged? This is why I'm saying I would like to see this World War III sooner better than later. Because while this damage is continuing, and while we are only meeting and talking, I'll give you an example, the actual, and with all my respect for the U.S. and its leadership of the world. When President Trump was conducting his campaign in 2016, he said,

climate issue is a farce created by the Chinese to destroy our industry. And I will not tolerate any discussion on the climate issue. Biden, for whom we were waiting, said in Glasgow meeting at the World Summit on Climate, he said, of course, we have to deal with the climate issue, and it's a great threat, but we will not allow it to damage the interests of our industry. The US, and I'm hopeful now, because the US was the number one polluter of the world. Now it is China, because China has become

the factory of the world. There is more pollution from China. However, the U.S. has not changed its attitude on the question of climate, and they would like to limit it. You can do anything about the climate, but don't touch our industry, which means don't do anything. Okay, I get it. So let's go back to Ukraine. Did NATO provoke Russia to attack Ukraine?

That's a question which nobody has asked me before. And I would try to be very honest and very, I'm always honest, but to be very transparent. I think it's much more than that. I think the issue that everybody in these superpowers, whether it is NATO, and NATO means US, because as it has become very evident, every event that took place in Ukraine was conducted by the superconductor, the US. And on the Russia side, everything has been coordinated with the Chinese. And I was smiling when I heard one statement, official statement, from the U.S. saying that Russia did not yet make up its mind on the Ukraine issue. I had the chance to talk to a Chinese leader.

And I said, do you fully support Russia in all what is happening? He said, support? We don't support. We are one party. What did he say? We don't support. We are what? We are one party. We are in it together.

Russia is our, and again, let me just make it together. Russia is our and again, let me just make it loud. Russia is the only partner for worse

or good with China. And Britain is the only partner with the US for good or worse. Yes. These are the two superpowers. I agree.

And with Britain and the U.S., I'm not sure who's on top. It could be Buckingham Palace. I'm very impressed because very people say, oh, no, no, there are lots of other countries that are very close to the U.S. equally. No, there is no equal partner since World War II. The Queen Elizabeth has ruled longer than any monarch in the history of England. She's a smart woman. I think she has more power than what we know. This thing about China and Russia, have you thought with a battle between Russia and the United States, China is the winner?

Both the United States and Russia are weakened and China wins. Not really, if I may disagree. Because there are two countries in the world which cannot be conquered. There is no, when it comes to Russia, sorry, to China and the U.S., nobody wins. They both lose. Can you think of any reasonable plan to overtake America or similarly in China? These are the only two countries in the world that I can think of which can never be conquered. They would have to use a biological weapon on the American people because the American people have guns and they will fight. Right, so you would have to exterminate

the population of America because the American people will fight. Yes. Otherwise, yes. So I'm not talking about any of these two countries winning or losing. What I think is they need the war to be forced to sit down and work out a new world order. They both know they need it. And I was approached, officially, to be a mediator at the non-governmental level.

And they both realized that they need it, but they're not willing to do it. What do you mean you were approached? I received a delegation from Fulbright organization. Fulbright, yes. Okay. And they said, we'd like to see if you can

organize and moderate a non-governmental meeting between the two powers, the US and China, to sit down together and try to negotiate a new structure, a new world order, and a new leadership of the world. How long ago was that? Do you know what year?

This was about eight months ago. Oh, recent. Yes. And I said, why me? I said, because you're acceptable to both an independent, objective, independent partner. To both China and the U.S. And in all honesty, I tried to do that with the Chinese, and the reaction was,

we do not think that is the way to do it, because the minute we sit together and try to organize an agenda for the meeting, we will fight and leave the table. The differences are so great. And this is what what I'm again go back to original question. Why I would like to see this war happen and finish with it. What agreement can you imagine on the question of global currency, the dollar?

I was at the meetings, at the discussions in Geneva to help for China to join the WTO, the accession negotiations, and China said one thing we're not willing to discuss is our currency. And China is the only currency in the world that is not linked to the dollar. What is going to happen? Is China willing to change this position which was for them a religious dogma? Don't touch my currency. And that's why when corona started the fictitious feeling that the current the economies were prospering it's because both countries were able to go to use their printing machines to print currency there is no control over either of them so they could print currencies as as they want and throw money to the community.

So are you going to agree on how to change the rules of the world trade, of the intellectual property world? I served on the board of the World WIPO, World Intellectual Property Organization, again. And the U.S. was leading the process of drafting rules. I was in the meeting to draft the rules for

protection of trademarks, which is right. And this is right, and I fully support. Now, presidents in the U.S. say this has to change. Rule one is the definition of what is an invention. Under the World Agreement, which was endorsed by the u.s every word in it it says that any new innovation of an existing invention which has adds value and is useful is a new invention this is a mic yes I can develop another technology of this mic.

And it's still called mic, but it's a new invention. And I can register it. And under this principle, China registers every year 300,000 inventions. Because there are developments and improvements on existing inventions. Yes, I understand. because they are developments and improvements on existing inventions. Yes, I understand. Now the US says China owes us billions and trillions of dollars for stealing our inventions. What do they mean? They mean that I was the first to invent a watch. Any watch development has to be accredited to me. And you have to pay

me because you took my invention. These are the issues that the nations are fighting over. There are 12 of them. Each of them is impossible to agree on. I have a theory about the Russia-Ukraine war. Tell me what you think. I don't think the West, particularly the United States, wants to get into a military conflict with Russia. I believe they baited and goaded Russia to enter Ukraine, and the sanctions were planned far in advance.

And what they did is that for the first time in the history of the world, a nation was ostracized, deplatformed. We call it deplatformed in America. You're taken off the Internet. You're banned. They banned Russia. Russia is no longer, in the eyes of the United States, Russia is no longer allowed to be on the planet. Something has to happen to Russia. And so they baited Russia to come into Ukraine, not for the purpose of fighting Russia, but for the purpose of destroying the Russian economy with the sanctions to eventually force Mr. Putin to pay for his goods with the gold that is in the central bank because they I think they want to get rid of his gold

because he's moving towards a gold backed ruble a Central bank digital currency That would be backed by gold does that idea have any? Validity or is that just a crazy idea? I think it's a crazy idea. Okay. All right. I'll take it from you. Because China has been developing a digital currency without gold. And it is based on the principles and rules of any currency and the currency and cryptocurrency or digital coins that you we know and we see are not currencies these are games yes now for a currency the rules

of the existence of a currency is one, to be issued by a central bank. Not everybody, not you and me, everybody, any person can issue his own currency. It must be issued by a central bank. Number two, these currencies should be governed by rules and principles that apply to every user of the currency. And this does not exist in any of the cryptocurrencies that we hear of. Number three, there must be a

dispute settlement body. Now, that's why I said that these are games because if you want, tomorrow I can set up for you a system of your own digital currency. But it is not reality. This is sham. No. China developed a digital currency. Obviously one, the same currency, but digitally. So they did not invent a new financial system

or monetary system, to be correct. It's not a monetary system. It's digitalization of the existing system. So there is now in China two currencies, but they are one currency. One is for the digital dealing, and one is for the traditional paper money. And both are operating in China.

They did a very intelligent approach to the issue. America wanted to protect and keep the world digital and non-digital to be a US dollar, but they did not have a plan. Now, and this really shocks me, a week ago only, Biden announced that we should start planning for a digital currency.

What? China has been doing it for five years, and your intelligence system did not discover it? Why now? So China is ready to, once day one comes, unfortunately or unfortunately it's going to come decides that the currency of the world shall be the digital one. They will have a currency that works.

And this is one of the objectives of the Ukraine war. China wants to govern the world again like the US did with its own currency. So this is what the war is really about? That's about, exactly. It's about money. Money. But not in the sense that gold.

Gold is like any other commodity. I can now decide that the reserve money should be wood. Gold is a valuable asset, but it's not a current reserve for currency. And currencies of the world are all using partially gold as a reserve, but as the dollar is the reserve currency, thanks to the UK, United Kingdom, who gave up the sterling as a reserve currency and said to great America, you are the only reserve currency of the world. That is one of the very important issues, but it's only one of 12 major issues.

And the Chinese, and the Chinese remind me always when I meet with them, that this country is 7,000 years old. Yes. 7,000 years. And in 7,000 years, once I, in my capacity as the leading organization for intellectual property globally, I was attending a meeting and next to me was over dinner a minister, a minister of science and technology. And it was that day the US had an agreement which is called bilateral intellectual property agreement. And it dictates in the agreement what China should do.

And it doesn't say what the US has to do. Because China never had an intellectual property system. And in fact, we are the only consulting members of the Chinese Intellectual Property Committee. So the agreement was signed by the Chinese in spite of the fact that it's one-sided. And I said, it must have been hard to you, I was whispering. He said, no. In 7,000 years, we learned to keep shaking our heads,

saying yes to everything, until the day comes when we say no and keep our head up. Until that day, we shake our heads. Yes, yes, sir. Yes, sir.

Yes, sir. But then one day we will say, no, sir. And we'll shake our head no more. This is one of the principal culture. So are we very close to China lifting its head and saying no? No, we are not. We're not there yet? No.

This will not happen, and I pray that it should not happen, because instead of a new world order, we will have a world worse chaos. We are already in chaos. There is not, and I repeat, and I challenge anybody, that none of the UN organizations and none of the world global organizations can take any decisions because of this way, stalemate in global order.

If China says this, and we say, yes, we are going to have a disaster, which is worse than the disaster we are in. That is why I say, please, fight, and sit and talk, and develop the new world order. We know it's coming. It's coming. It cannot go on. You cannot go on in a world which is... What do you think the new world order is going to look like? It's very obvious now.

And I think every scholar like you and world thinker, you can see that it's inevitable to have China recognized. We still refuse to recognize China. The world, the Western world refuses that this is a culture different, these are people different, this is another world this we don't you have to recognize they are not just a force but they are part of the world like we are what is going to happen is i think and i'm convinced incidentally i will tell you a very short story. In 1999, I attended a meeting of the National Science Academy

in Washington. And the theme was, where will the US be in 2020? And the conclusion was one, after three days of meetings, which included only American decision makers and thinkers. One in 2020, China will be the threat to America because of its growing economic power. Number two, economic power is powerful.

As we have seen in the Soviet Union collapse, the Soviet Union was more powerful militarily. But it was overcome by being economically weak. Only economic power means anything in this world.

China will be the superpower economically. They missed a few years. China is not yet the superpower. But it was, as was said in the meeting, it will become a threat to the economic superiority of the US. And as now, we reach the stage where China is the number one trader in the world. And I was talking to one of the responsible authorities, Chinese, and I asked, how much do you

want to control of world trade 50 he said no 70. because at the time of the silk road which is now become called developed into the belt and yes and We were controlling 70%. This is our share. And like Putin said, Putin, in one seminar that I attended, was saying, we have to, now that we consolidated the Russian Federation, we need to look at our neighborhood. What's your neighborhood? It's the former Soviet Union countries. to look at our neighborhood. What's your neighborhood? It's the former Soviet Union countries.

They belong to us. They will have to come back to us. So the issues are very complex. In this world, there is no one single reason. So if you were on a global committee to write the rules of a new New World Order because this New World... We've been in a New World Order

since post-World War II. There was a New World Order. But this New World Order is dead. It's dead, absolutely. So there's a new New World Order coming. If you were on the committee to write that New World Order, briefly tell me what it would look like.

First, in all modesty, I cannot claim that I would be able to do a mission like this. But I think that those who are going to draw this program would have to recognize that there are two super leaders, not one. Which means we are going to move into a bilateral

leadership of the world. It will have to be two. And that was what happening in the Soviet Union period for a very short time. We have two superpowers. Secondly, we need to sit down, the two parties have to sit down and produce a blueprint of a new order in everything. Not a single agreement that exists,

is valid for the future. Now, number three, these two superpowers need their brains with them, meaning Russia and Britain. So there will be a board of directors of the world with four governments, four countries, with two and two as the leading delegates. And this will create balance in the world. It's not bad. It's even good for the US, which is now supposed to be responsible for every malice that

happens in the world. It's always nice to have somebody who would share the burden and consult with you and advise you, etc. So I see... Will there be new institutions? Everything will have to be new.

Everything. Nothing that exists now is acceptable to either parties. Nothing. So a new UN, a new World Bank, a new IMF, everything. The experience has taught us that the existence of the Security Council and of the Assembly is ridiculous. Watch the words of the UN Secretary General. He talks of the Council as a foreign body When he says the Security Council is not able to achieve its goals, to the average person like me,

we think that the Security Council is one of the arms of the United Nations. It is not. It's a separate entity. It does not go by any of the UN rules. I didn't know that. The Security Council is a separate entity. It does not go by any of the UN rules. I didn't know that. The Security Council? The Security Council is a separate entity.

Of course. It has its own rules. It has its own systems. The UN Secretary has nothing to do with it. He can be invited sometimes as a guest. He cannot sit on it. He cannot decide anything on it.

The UN has two systems, it's two parts. The UN, and that's why when Ukraine or the European community failed in getting a resolution at the Security Council, they went to assembly. And they took a resolution to assembly because it's a completely separate body where there is no veto, where every country is represented by equal vote.

Will this new system... Do you see a world government where the new United Nations is literally the government of the world? Will we be voting for senators to go to a new United Nations?

Of course. The U.S., the leader of what is called quotation, democracy, which has to be revisited also because democracy is under great threat by what is known as popularism.

What I mean by popularism is populism. Populism, you have a person sitting in a square in Lebanon, in Beirut, and say, the president offered to meet with us to discuss problems and solutions. Who is the president? We are the people. We elected him.

We are his boss. And in fact, President, one of the U.S. presidents told me, I work for the American people. I am, my employer is the American people. Okay, if I am your employer. An American president said that to you, yes. Yes, he said that to me in person. So the system now is under great pressure. So with this new system, will the people that run the world not work for the people? Or will they work for them?

We have now to observe the democratic rule number one, which is the people elect the government in fact the american constitution starts with a statement we the people decide yes okay did we decide to appoint these five countries as veto holders no did we decide who is going to be on the five countries? So are we going to have global elections? We have to have them. If you believe in democracy, you cannot believe... So will there be one man or woman at the top, like the president of the world? Absolutely. But this would be a committee instead of one person. We will need to develop a process whereby people of the world elect the governing bodies of the world. We have to.

So we're going to global democracy. We need to have a global democracy. It is not fair and it's not at all conceivable that you say I want democracy in these countries only and not in these and not in the systems but only in the countries and not at the global level. We have to realize that the world has changed as every American president says or or every thinker says, and to realize that we need new rules now.

Yes. I have one more question for you. You've been very generous with your time, and I know you're very busy. I know. I'm honored. We have a lot of young people who watch this program. I understand. I read your biography you started in business your office was in the trunk of your car right you've come a long way you're not working out of the trunk of your car anymore what would you say if you were um if you were 25 30 years old now what career would you go into now knowing what

you know about where the world is going what would be your choice of a career it's it's I'm very very very flattered with this question because I would like to use this opportunity to say that my mission in life now, you know, at various periods, I had to change mission. But my mission in this time now is to be able to lead the process of digital transformation in the world. I had my first computer course in 1965.

I don't know if you were born then. I was born, but I wasn't developing, I wasn't taking computer courses. I took my first computer course at an IBM center in a city, a village called High Wycombe, outside London. And it was larger than, the computer was larger than this room. The computer.

My brains told me that this is the beginning and not the end. So where are we going? And I think this is where the whole world is heading. I keep addressing and talking to students, to colleges, to media and everything, say we have one of two choices in life now, to become an innovator or to become distinct. Okay. Now, that is why, and to put my words in action, I started the first college university of its kind in the world, and I'm

not at all modest to say that, where students do not study material to remember and memorize and be examined for their ability to memorize which is our education system now and i said this at harvard i spoke at harvard university i said give me one professor who knows more information than his students because every information any professor knows is already on the internet now professors do not own the knowledge anymore it is students who owe the knowledge so okay now since if we admit this it's really a waste of time to to see if the students remember what you teach them and you examine them on their memory. Because they can find it.

Because it's there. Why should I remember what is the longest river in the world? I can go to... So the important thing is to know where to get it and what to do with that information. So our college does not examine you to graduate. There is no examination. There is invention.

To graduate, you must invent something. I love the idea. I love it. You know, some people said, but if he cannot invent, I said he cannot come to the school. This is a school for inventors, for innovators. He can go to do his own thing. What we need is inventions, innovators in this world.

So if I had the chance, instead of having to go and listen to a professor who teaches what I already know. And I have my evidence that I have challenged my professors because I was a good student. I'm still a good student. If you ask me what you are now, I am a student. I learn every day.

Every day I study like a student. But I study to innovate. I don't study to test my memory. I study to innovate. And that's why every discipline that we use in our organization, every program is our own invention. And that's the reason for our superiority.

Driving over here to your headquarters, I drove past a store in Amman, and it's your laptop store. You're selling laptops. You have your own laptop computers now. Absolutely. And I saw a mobile phone store also that you own. We are very proud that we were able to produce laptops, computers, and smartphones at the highest quality and at the cheapest cost. It is a remarkable achievement of what you have done in your lifetime here. We have been here for two weeks. I love Jordan. I love the Jordanian people.

They have been gracious to us. I have been fed so much good food everywhere I go. The Jordanian people love. So you ate the Mansaf? Oh, yes. Oh, yes. That was first, that was the first, okay, but everywhere we've gone, people have invited us to dinner, they have fed us, they've been so gracious and kind. I really love Jordan and the Jordanian people. I want to thank you for your time, you've been very gracious with your time here today and looking forward to another interview in the coming future.

Anytime. I am very honored to be interviewed by you. And I consider you as a friend, just like I am a friend of America. Thank you. Well, my guest today has been Dr. Talal Abu Ghazala. And this is our final day broadcasting from the wonderful country of Jordan. Take care. God bless. I will see you on Monday.

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