Two Doting Dads with Matty J & Ash - #211 Ash's Sobriety & The Moment That Had Us All In Tears

Episode Date: March 17, 2026

It's a heavy ep today but an important one.  Ash opens up about his sobriety journey now he's made it to day 100... a day he and Matt weren't sure he'd make it to. Ash stopped drinking simply to have a break - but what it unleashed is something bigger than he could've ever imagined and now he's not sure he can go back. It’s a really honest and, at times, emotional chat. We touch on mental health and some of the struggles he’s faced along the way. Importantly though, Ash is in a really good headspace right now and this is him reflecting on some of the tougher times. As always, we’re super proud of him and grateful he felt comfortable sharing it with you all. If this episode makes you feel like you need to talk to someone about any of the topics discussed there is help available at the links below. https://reduceyourrisk.org.au/need-more-support/ https://admhss.mhc.wa.gov.au/get-help/alcohol-and-drug-support-line https://www.turningpoint.org.au/  https://www.fds.org.au/  If you need a shoulder to cry on:  Two Doting Dads Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/639833491568735/  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TheTwoDotingDads  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/twodotingdads/  TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@twodotingdads  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Should we talk about you just save my life? Oh, Georgia Love. Yeah. Yeah, I did save your love. You owe me, actually. But you've done nothing but put me down since. You love it. I do.

You love it. Ash sent me a message as I was, I was late to this record. Oh, big surprise. And I said, you want me to call in a bomb threat? And I was like, what do you mean? Hang on let me do the open and then we'll get into it. A little teaser. A little teaser.

You like that? Yeah, I do. Back to two-dating dads. I am Maddie J. And I'm Ash. And this is a podcast all about parenting. It is the good. It is the bad.

And the relatable. And one thing we will never do is give advice. Correct. So yeah, you were saying you could call in a bomb threat. I walked in. I saw that they were having an International Women's Day talk. I don't know. They had chairs set up.

They had stage set up. And I was like, I wonder who the guests are. I don't want to see. And one of them happened to be your former ex-flame, Georgie Love. Georgia, Georgia. Georgia. Okay. Georgia.

Sweet. From the Bachelorette. Nine years. ago. She actually broke your heart at the time. She did me a favour. She absolutely. I wouldn't, I wouldn't be here talking to you.

How do you know that? I don't think. I don't want to found you. But I just missed her. Just missed her. She's on stage talking. Yeah, we got you in strategically. Making it.

I know. I would have wished now, looking back, yeah. I wish I said nothing and just let it happen. I've seen it many times, bro. Many times Didn't look like it You avoided her

Who are your ex-girlfriends Where are they at? They're actually very successful Name one Natalie What does she do? I don't know Have you bumped into her?

No But you've been dating April since you're like Fucking seven You guys have been together forever 15 years Wow So do you have an ex Is there anyone before?

I don't really count anymore Have you only ever had sex with one person? It's true. It's out there. It is out there. Is that true? No. Actually, I'm still a virgin. Those kids aren't mine. Ash, we... Stacked. I feel like this is... You know, when people are like, we got such a busy episode, but it is, like, it's full. We can't dilly dally around like we always do.

I know. Although we are... It took us an hour from when we step foot in this studio to when we are recording right now. Sorry, sorry, Vick. Sorry, Vick's like, come on, guys. Sorry, housekeeping. It's busy. It's busy. We got a lot to get through. Busy day in the office, as they say. Have you heard of this group, Ash, starting off housekeeping with Dad's Steps? Dads Steps, not Step Dads? Dads, not to be confused with Step Dads, but they are a group on the northern beaches.

Your neck of the woods, they are on Instagram at Dad. You're going to throw me under the ass here, aren't they going to be like, hey, why don't you join us? Then I'm going to have to come up with excuse why I can't join you. I know you hate socializing with other parents. But some people out there find comfort in talking to other people. in their situation. You're like a lone wolf. I am.

I'm more like, yeah, lone wolf, leader, whatever. So what would you call a group of people that like to hang together

like ants? Sheep? No. We're just going to animals. A group of people who want to hang out together. Friends. That's what I call them.

Well, these friends slash dads, they walk on the northern beaches every Saturday and Sunday. So if you're a dad and you're like, you know what, I would no longer like to be the wolf.

With the kids? With the kids in prams. Oh, okay. All right, right. I was like, so if you're on the beaches, find them on Instagram,

and you can hang out with them. Ash will be there. Sorry. He does not represent me. I might be, you never know. You ever know? How much is it going to find me? No, I'm just kidding.

I do things for free. You've changed. I know, Matt. You've changed. Giveaway. We're not there yet. Far out this giveaway. But we're about to hit $102,000.

I checked this morning. We're like, maybe like, very close. Today we should go to $1002. So we're getting there. A little reminder. the goal is 105. If you pick the exact day and time, we hit that. No, not time.

No time. The first one on that day. No, come on, Ash. Ash, come on. I don't know anything about this podcast. You can't change the mechanics. We agreed upon this. Who's the mechanic?

What? We said, it's in the contract. There's a contract? Legal had signed this off. Legal being Vic. And it's just the time. No time. No, no, well, just the day.

The day. Okay, but it's the first person to give us that day. So you then have to send a screenshot. Not now. Not now, because a lot of people were like, here's my entry. And I was like, hold your horses there, Carol. Carol, just relax. Someone said to me a message every day.

It's just when it hits, if you are that winning date, you then, if there's multiple people that have guessed like the 26th of March, you then have to take your screenshot, send it to us. Whoever gets a screenshot to us first. Oh, so it's a. race on the day. Yeah, this is like a heptathlon.

Wow. I was not listening in that meeting. Sorry. First of all, sorry, guys, for not listening. Second of all,

I'm glad I'm up to date. And what else we got here? Solids. Oh, yeah, Poppy, just for those playing on at home, she has started the solids. And first of all, it's nice to see you got a name right.

Thank you. Thank you. Hey, I'm trying. So at least you could do. I'm trying. Except, well, my wife doesn't

feel like I'm giving her enough attention at the moment. Oh, there's only so much of Maddie J to go around. So we started her on the sweet potato. Laura. I was like, here you go, babe. No, she's boiled the sweet potato. So Poppy is currently having a bit of sweet potato. Do you like it?

Loves it. Loves it. And then Laura was like, cool. I'm going to try her on some banana. Oh, and? I mean, I was like, cool. That's great. Like banana, sweet potato.

I feel it. And she was there going. About the mar. Manara. Oh my God. What about the marinar? There he is. Fuck.

Very good. Thank you. Very good. You're on fire today. Oh, thank you. No, so she was doing the banana and I'm like, great. Who doesn't like banana? Well, yeah, yeah.

People are petrified of bananas. Do you know that? I got a friend who's petrified of bananas and my dad has a friend who's petrified of tomatoes. How these people have gotten through their lives to get to adulthood, I will never know. Imagine if they lived in the jungle. I mean, they're the type of people who should have been fucking, you know, Wow.

They shouldn't be pro-creating? Yeah, no, yeah. Give them a for a second. I think so. They're man too, straight up. They need to be, what's it called when you're a sex predator? Castrate. Castrate them.

How do I know that? I don't know. But Laura was like, Matt, come quick. Come quick. Get here right now. And I was in the middle of something. So I had the dirtiest joke then, but I'm not going to do it. Matt, come quick.

Come quick. Come on. She was pushed for time. Do you get it? Come quick. Okay, whatever. Next. Moving on. I'm just bullying you because I know.

Because I feel like you're an easy target right now. I am an easy target. Sorry. Sorry. You're very funny. You're regrettable. I fight the laughter. I know you do.

You're holding a back. Yeah. Carry on. Internally right now, it's hilarious. It's really hurting my brain. You're a great co-host. Thank you. Go, go around.

So Laura's, Laura goes, Come quick! Come quick! And I go, what is it? She goes, just come. Come here right now. I'm already done. Come, and I'm going, I'm in the middle of something.

be two seconds. She's like, you have to come right now. Get here. Do not delay. Come and see your daughter. And I'm like, okay, come over. What is it? Watch this. Oh. Spoonful, a little bit of mix of banana mixed in with some soup potato and poppy eats it. And I go, and? Okay. That's your third child. You know that? And she goes, what's wrong with you? And I'm like, what are I waiting for? What what are you waiting for? Look at your child at how she reacts to eating this food and I was like, well, fuck, she's eating it.

Why don't they have so many reactions that I can dish out? She's like, can you just give me something? Wow. Can you pretend like you're excited by it? And I was like, it just didn't, this didn't do anything for me. What else does she do?

I'm not going to pretend. I know, it's like, what do you want for me? You want me to be like, oh my God, it's the greatest thing ever. And then I was like, and then I faked it. I was like, whoa, that's a big mouthful that she just... Did you roll your eyes when you walked away? She's really enjoying the banana and she's like, well, now it just feels forced.

Well, it is forced. You forced me to do this. What are you what? You can't have it both ways. Marley and Lola were like, what the way? What about us? Solids was funny. I love it when they get something and they don't.

You're like, oh, they'll love this. Like, avocado is a good one because it's like, you either love avocado or you hate it. Right? So some kids are like, yeah, give me that. My kids, no. They didn't want to do that. Maybe I can take the initiative and start her on avocado. Try it.

And then call Laura Ian and be like, what's this, babe? And then see what her reaction is. Do the old flip a roo? I mean, it is kind. She does get pretty pumped, you know, when she's about to have it. Oh, they get super excited to that. Yeah. Unless they hate it.

I don't mean, now you make me feel guilty that I didn't react to them. You should feel terrible. Yeah, I should. No, no. You gave a fake reaction. It's better than no reaction. Ash. Little, little update on the fuel.

Oh, yeah. The debacle. The fuel. The fuel. The app. I don't use the app. I saw a message saying that you can pay at the pump. And I was like, I'm 36 years old this year.

I've just learned this. And then I had a quick squeezy. And yeah, but you need to be able to hack the mainframe to be able to get it to work. I couldn't figure it out. It's like entering the matrix. But also my attention span to things like that. Also, it's dangerous paying with your phone at the pump. I'll blow up.

Yeah. Well, do they myth bust that? I don't know. If my phone rings, do you answer your phone by the pump? No, not by the pump. In the vicinity, I have seen people there. People there just chatting away. Because I think...

That's fucking madness. The phone... The phone symbol. A death wish. Yeah. Death wish. It's a different phone. It's like...

Death wish. What about... Am I missing something? It's a death wish. I wouldn't wish that upon anyone. Anyway, so the phone symbol, it says no fun... See, it's like the old school. So it's those...

I think those signs are obsolete. I'm not picking this death wish thing up. I'm just sorry. You're really trying to throw me up today. I'm not trying to throw you. Okay. I'm coming out to thing. I'm not.

I'm not. I'm just trying to talk. I'm just trying to get on your level. I'm there. I'm paranoid. No, be paranoid. I'm not going to hurt. This is going to ruin me the rest of the day.

Thanks. No, we're like... It's a death wish. That's what this is. Isn't it? That's exactly what this is. Moving on, Matthew. God!

Ash, very quickly, I have a doter birth story. Yes. This was sent in and we do love a story from the dotas of this country. We love it. Slash all around the world. What do you got for me? What is this? This is from Matt, from Molly Mook.

Oh, what a beautiful part of the world. It is nice down there. South Coast, you've, I would say last time I went down there really sold it for me. I am the ambassador. You are, yeah. They should really think about giving you a job. Thank you. Like South Coast tourism.

How good is Aladala? It's very nice. But Matt from Molly Moch says, where he lives, Malamook, you can't give birth at the closest hospital in Milton. It's like an eventry clinic. They should be able to do it. Well, yeah, I think, I think, yeah, it's, you can. They keep bragging about it.

They can do anything. You can opt out. You don't want to be... Ruralites. Ruralites, yeah, next to the cows in the stables. And you're like, I don't know. Yeah, they're like, if that cow's going to give birth, I'm happy to accommodate me if it's a human.

Get the fuck out of here. But he's learned he could after they were on the way to narrow hospital while his wife was in the late stages of labor when a truck rolled on the road and he couldn't get through. There's only run one road in one road out, isn't there really? Well said. Well said. Pacific Highway, I believe.

It is the Pacific Highway. That was a guess. But, yep. No, very good. He worried his worst fear of having the baby born in the car on the side of the road was about to come true. Is it a worse fear for someone? I want that. Yeah, I'm like, that's a story.

That's like... We're telling your story. This is, yeah, obviously, but we run a podcast. For people like Matt, he's like, I don't need this shit. Yeah, he's like, I don't want to... I don't need the content. We want the carnage. You're like, Laura, give birth now!

Instead, they got an ambulance and a police escort out. out of the traffic cube back to Milton, where she ended up giving birth next to a cow in the stables of the... No. No, sorry. On the ED floor. So was there a cow or no cow? No cow. Oh, damn.

Sorry, your eyes lit up on the cow. I was going to say all that hate for the rural doctor chat. And it's true. But he says here a successful V-back. What, they pull it out from a back? A V-back. Hang on, what's it? Vic.

Vic, help us. A V-back is a vaginal birth after C-section. What does the back have to do? What, so second child? I thought it was a dress, type of dress. After cesareem. A V-back. So wait.

It's an acronym. In the one-go? Oh, the V-back itself is an acronym. Yes. I'm thinking like... So this would have been second child. Gotcha. I thought you meant like in the one-go.

Like they're about to cut you open. There's a traffic jam in there. They cut you open and they go, hang on a sec. We'll go the vagina. Yeah. We'll be right back. Well, Matt, that is a beautiful story. I think that's a great story.

Also, police escort, that's fucking Hollywood. I know, no one, I've never been police or escorted anywhere. That's a lie. The one time I had my hand behind my back. The one or two or three times. We've heard the story from your mother about you being arrested. So I've actually sent me a video as well if you wanted to. Oh, yeah.

From Matt. Of the V-back? Oh. Can't wait to see a V-back in real life. There may be times in your labour where there is too much stress going on. An extreme example would be Let's say you were on the way to the hospital And you came across a car accident

So they called it Oh my God I can take that out of the video That's just tempting fate I know I can picture everyone in that In that course going That doesn't matter to me It's like final destination

Yeah Except no one dies Just want to say thank you for sending that in If you got any good birth stories Send me in why not We want to hear more about the V-backs Honestly I've learned something new I thought it was a

all right I thought it was a type of dress fucking that feels good it does feel good I don't know what it feels like anyway we have 20 new reviews Matt is having a good day over here

I was like I cannot tell you one of the best days of my life This is the reaction Laura wanted to pop me eating And you're getting it off reviews I was like Laura quick What is it? Look at Apple Podcasts The new reviews.

And she was like, uh, I said, could you just fucking pretend for a second? Yeah, I pretended for you. Just for a second. I was like, amazing. Phenomenal. All the begging work. The begging in the tutorial video worked. I cannot begin to describe how much I appreciate the kind comments.

Thank you. I haven't read them yet, but I will. Ash. Yeah. Ash, we are going to change up breaking news. Okay. Ever so slightly. Again.

Because one of us actually has experience delivering the news. on radio and there's not me, it's not you, it is of course, producer Vic. I used to do the surf reports, does that count? Did you really? On radio, yeah. Did you really? What job haven't I had? Literally.

Maybe I should I write a book? No, no, I want to read that shit. You can't write, let's be honest. I could talk. Audio book? Podcast? Yeah, let's start a podcast. Vic, take it away.

Scientists have confirmed what mums have known for years. Rage cleaning actually works. Studies show that scrubbing, vacuuming and reorganising. when you're stressed can reduce anxiety and improve the body's stress response. The trend has exploded on TikTok, racking up more than 8 million views of parents furiously cleaning their homes to blow off steam. A global study of more than 11,000 people found 75% clean when they're stressed, with many reporting they feel calmer in as little as 13 minutes.

Experts say it's a healthy way to release anger, though most moms would argue they've been doing it for decades. There you have it. Can I just say, I didn't hear a word you say because I was fixated on your own news voice. That was outstanding work. I don't know what you're done with Vic, but this new woman in the room. I know. I was like, is this Channel 10?

What's going on here? I was like, oh my God. Sensational. So rage cleaning. It works. It's fact. That is a fact. Vic, do you rage clean often?

I think Dan wishes I did. Well, Dan, you know what you got to do? Mangaangria. People. I'm not the cleaner in our household. Oh, who is? Dan the man. Good for him.

Yeah. So he rage cleans. Yeah. I think actually when I do get angry, that's probably the one time I do clean. I just know when April's in a bad mood because she cleans things she wouldn't usually clean and overly clean. I'm like, you would never usually do that. She's like, I'm fine. She's washing the car.

Yeah. She's changing the oil. Or she'll be like, we really need to clean this way more. And it's like you, you were in a bad mood. And what is you pointing at? I have to think about it. Do you rage clean? No.

I do what dad's do and that's a void clean. So I clean. That's not funny, bro. That weaponise incompetence. No, okay. What I do, you're better than that. I know. Right, listeners.

Right? You're with me? Oh my God, you're really against me today. I, look, I would say we split the cleaning pretty evenly. Oh, fuck off. We do. How dare you try and backtrack now? But we clean different things.

It's like, if I'm going to, and April said this on the pod when we had it, it's like, I'll take the rubbish out, but she's like, but you don't put the bag back in. It's like, I thought you did it. And it's like, try and share the line. load a bit. But like, if she's in a bad mood, she'll clean. She'll rage throw a coffee table at the hand. Oh, she'll do that. She's not afraid about that. She's way more direct with a rage.

Like if Dan's trying to impress you, Vic, is there anything that he'll clean because he knows that's going to tickle your fancy? Oh, here we go. No, what he does now, actually, is he says, what can I take off your mental load? Oh, that's smart. I'm going to use that. That's an arousing phrase. It is. Ever I heard one.

It is the best thing that comes out of his mouth. Other than I love you, of course. Yeah. I'm going to write it down for sure. I think that's good gear. Is there anything you clean? Because, Laura, if I change the bed sheets,

oh, ha, daddy. Yeah, that's a good one. We do ours every Sunday. Every Sunday? But the Duna cover every two weeks. She loves clean sheets. Also towels. That's usually a pretty good one.

I do the lunches. That's not cleaning, bro. Oh, no, that's good. I get Dan to do lunches now. You ask me what gets it going? That's good gear. There's not a lot like, I would say, the sheets is a big one. Big one.

If she gets in fresh sheets on a Sunday night, bam. Who cleans the kitchen in your house after dinner? I reckon it's a joint effort. I usually eat later than April, depending on what we're doing. But she'll put the dishwasher on and then whatever's left out and about. I'll just, I'll clean that up. Match made in heaven. Anyway, I best be off.

I best be off. Thanks for asking me a question, Vic. That's a... Does Laura rage clean? That's a really... No, I didn't ask because I don't care. Let's back it up a little bit. What's that, Vic?

What's that? Does Laura rage clean in your house? Or are you the rage cleaner? No. Matt doesn't have a lot of say. I'll clean the kitchen. The kitchen needs to be clean. The bedroom's always messy.

There's always clothes on the floor. I did move all the clothes. You do the laundry and stuff, don't you? Everyone in the house does the laundry. What's Nana do? She does a bit of everything. Must be nice. Yeah, it is nice.

But on the weekend, Sunday, Laura started rage cleaning and I antagonized. It's not like me to antagonize. I was just going to ask you this exact question. But I antagonized because she was really barking orders at me. Stand up to her, bro. Don't stand up to it. Don't do it. I started calling her boss.

Oh, yeah, I do that too. So she was like, can you just move the box in the garage that's been sitting there? I said, yes, boss. They hate that. And then she's like, and then this suitcase needs to go into the house. I was like, absolutely boss. Right on it, boss. Right away, sir.

I did it for half of the day. Oh, that's good year. I like that. But I did do the garage, which only gets done like, you know, once in a blue moon. I think last time I did it was like four months ago. Because your garage, there's no storage in the actual garage itself. Yours is like under a separate space. Everything kind of gets pushed to the sides.

And then eventually gets too much that the car can't from the garage. And so the car's been on the street for last two weeks. So I was like, now it's time to clean the garage. Is the pram still there from City to Surf two years ago? No, we got rid of that pram. Because I went back a year later and to get something out of the pram and nothing had come out. There's food in there. I was like,

stuff it. But I didn't even get much of a reaction. Clean the whole garage. Laura gave me nothing. Oh. Yeah, I was like. We want to add a boy?

Yeah, I just want like. Or is it more like you, like you shouldn't be praised for that. Like you shouldn't be praised for just doing what you should be doing. I think even that case, you should be like, thanks,

like I would say thanks if she did it. I would say thanks if you did my garage. I said, I said we went to bed that night and I was like, you know, we all busted our asses today. And she was like, we wouldn't go that far.

And she's like, one of us did. And I was like, me. Sorry boss. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was like, was this a performance review? Then the hard thing with Laura was, she was going through the kids' toys.

Oh, I like, but does that all the time. Because there was just like mountains of little soft toys. You've got so many of those little things. Fucking just gathering dust. None of them get played with. So what do you do with them? So we're giving them all to the Salvos. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Donating them all. And then Laura was like, I feel really guilty because of the toys. Their feelings. The toys feelings? Toy story. She was like, you know when Andy's putting the toys in the attic? Yeah. She's like, these poor toys.

Yeah. Like, they're leaving our home. They don't have feelings, Laura. I know. I was like, uh, I think they're fine. Do you get the kids involved in the, of the declutter of the toys? Well, we did. Just because they were like, what the fuck are you guys doing?

Yeah. Nosey. So fucking nosy. What are you fucking in my room? Get out of here. And, uh, we were like, we're giving them to people who are really going to love these toys. We got too many. So you can choose five little soft toys and the rest we're going to give away.

April does a clean out of the toys with the kids all the time because it's just like you're saying, all of a sudden you've just like got a mountain of stuff that someone's given you. And it's like, I thought we just did this. But the kids are on board. We're giving it to sell us. Sunday, just gone. The rage clean was in full effect.

Sunday night, we all felt great. Good to hear. We all felt really good. We all made a mess again. Yeah, we just feel like we accomplished a lot. That sense of accomplishment was great. Very fulfilling. It's a good way to.

reset for the week. There we're. Nailed it. There it is. Nailed it. Hey guys. It is Matt here. As you probably know that.

This part of the episode is when we're going to take a moment to talk about Ash's journey of sobriety and just want to be completely honest and transparent that it does get really deep. And we're thankful that Ash is brave enough to talk about his journey in all its detail. Some of the topics will be quite confronting. So if you're not in a position where you want to. hear that, I would recommend tuning off now and join us on the next episode.

Hey Ash. Yes. I had been at you a bit this episode and I apologise. I've been in a funny mood. I've been bullied by Laura. So you're just passing on the bullies. So I come in and I'm like, I'm the bullied person becomes the bully. Well, at least I can take it.

But I do, and I am being so genuine when I say this, I do want to say, congratulations. Thank you. Because it's a huge milestone. You've recently clicked up, clicked over. Yeah, I'm over. 94? 93, I think, today.

93 days sober. By the time this comes out, it'll be like 100. Yes. It will be on 100, day 100. Yeah. Yeah, 100 days. I'm actually shocked.

So am I. I think, like last year was a very, very, the last couple years have been pretty big years for me. Just like travel, work. And you know what it's like doing this sort of work. they throw booze at your like, dance monkey, you know what I mean?

And so I sort of lent into that a lot, but then... Watching you enjoy a beer is not... It's art. It's... I remember one time our flight was delayed like 10 minutes and you were like, perfect and you came back with two beers for yourself.

Thank you. And you fucking just attack those beers like it was a man going... They hate seeing me coming. That's for sure. The bartenders are trembling. I know, there it comes. Yeah.

And you love a drink. I do. You love a drink. I do love a drink. But yeah, I sort of was at the point at the back end of last year where I set a date in mind in December, which is ambitious, considering it's the start of summer, right? And I had a date in mind because I was physically ill thinking about it. I was like, this has been a huge year. I've been to the States a bunch of times.

I feel like I just partied so much. And I'm not, let's face it. I'm not getting any younger, Matt. I'm not getting any younger. And I just felt, I just felt disgusting. You know, do you ever feel like, you feel like, okay, well, I just need a detox. And usually I'll detox for like a week or something. I'll be like, I'm cured.

But I put a date in place, which was the 7th December. And I was actually ready long before that, but I had commitments that I knew at that point that I was going to drink at. So I was like, I didn't want to set myself up to fail. From the 7th of December, I didn't say yes to anything. else. December, I think for the majority of people, is the month they drink the most. Yeah. And so you think, gosh, you've, like, started a marathon at the bottom of a hill where you're, like,

straight out of the gates, you're going uphill, nonstop for four weeks. Yeah, I was like, I was like, how is this going to go, first of all? Because is the first week the hardest, or is it peaks and troughs? It's rungs and troughs. So, say the first week, usually what people do, when they go, I'm going to have a break from alcohol, they turn into a fitness freak and they burn themselves out and then they just fall straight back in their old habits. And I have done that, guilty, big time. I've done that before. I've had months off where I'm like, all right, I'm going to run a million kilometers because I can't do

things in halves. I've got to do it in force. I was like, I'm not going to be that guy. Just goes an exercise. The first week, I'm going to go, give myself a break and go, all right, eat whatever you want. You're not drinking. Eat whatever you want. Enjoy that. Orias. Pretty much packets on packets of Oreos. And also it was, because I was detoxing that week, I felt horrible. It might have been our last record or something around that time and I was just like physically felt sick. Like I was like, fucking old like, how bad is this for me?

And then I sort of eased into the exercise and eased into eating better and having a bit more of a routine because I had no routine and that was part of the problem. My wife is king of the routines. Like she just sticks to it and not the opposite. And I was like, okay, eased into doing some exercise

and it actually made it so much easier. By the time I got to a month, was shocked that it was already a month. And I was like, wow, but I thought I was past the hardest part, but I wasn't. I was probably past the hardest part in terms of metabolizing it, trying to shake it, shake the daily habit and trying to form new habits for however long I was going to go for. Then what was the hardest part? The hardest part was about day 60. One thing was really hard that I wasn't expecting was the break that we had because this here is an outlet for me too. And I really was struggling with my mental load because I didn't have the outlet to go. I think I might have said

that to you midway through. I was like, fuck, I missed the, I didn't realize that how important it was to sit down with you on a Tuesday and just have an hour of bitching about the week that was, which is so relieving. And people, people underestimate the power of just talking. And when we came back from that, I was, one, relieved. And then two, I had still had my regular things. therapy booked in. And I remember... I need to start charging you for these sessions. You do. You can make some good money. Of me, especially. My therapist is rolling around in a yacht.

And, yeah, around that day 60, Mark, what I would usually do with alcohol, it would... Was that when you call me? Yeah. It would suppress the inner voice that I have, which hasn't really had a full platform since I was 14 years of age. So you put in 21 years of... suppressing that. It came thick and fast to the point where it's like, I remember waking up and like being fresh, which is nice, but my brain being like, you suck. Like that's my first thought. And I got to the point where it was like, oh, like has a trigger to anything or it would just come out with that from the get go? It would come out with that from the get go because I hadn't dealt with it.

I'd just hit it. I'd pushed it back down for so many years that it came at me with, it was so critical about everything that I was doing to where I would be like it would then completely ruin my day and ruin April's Day and ruin my kids' day. And there was plenty of nights there where it was like,

this is all too hard. Yeah. It sort of got to the point where it was like, I can't live, we've got like another 30 years of this. Of putting up with me. And then I spoke to you about it where I was at and trying to find tools to manage those thoughts and having to also like just like learn how to regulate my emotions again.

It was just like fuck. Like I was having worse days than good days. And it was tough because kids are on school holidays. we were away together, all these sort of things that, you know, I would be like, fine on the surface, but underneath that'd be like, oh, fuck, like, whatever it was that I was doing, my brain was like, we can fix this with just something really simple, and that was having a drink, because it would suppress it, suppress the negative thoughts, suppress the, the, you're not good enough stuff, and how do you battle that when you by yourself, in your own thoughts?

I think acknowledging it has been really helpful. I mean, my therapist has said, look, you're at a position now where the real work actually starts here. And it's so true because the start of it is like all habit and you don't think that it's a problem for you. And then you get to a clearer mind. And you kind of think, I can't wait to get to that 60 days to be like, oh, I'm fine. I'm over the hump. We're like in the meadows now and we can run free. Yeah. There's no safety net now. There's nothing to stop it. There's nothing to push it down. And I said to April, I said, I feel really bad because this was around that 60, 70 day, Mark.

I said, I feel really bad because my mood is, unfortunately, you guys have to bear the grunt of that. And she was like, I would prefer that than how you were. Like, that's, that'd hit me pretty hard. and then I sort of got closer to that 90 day mark and I started to realize that I started to feel guilty that I hadn't been giving 100% I haven't been giving 100% to my kids until now where I'm so present the relationships are better like I felt I feel horrible that like like these kids look up to me, but I was half there, half not. And that's the first, you know, I started this journey just to have a break. But the thought of not being there, the thought of giving it up,

giving up what I've built now with my kids. Like the relationship is so much better. I'm so more in tune with their emotions. I'm not snapping back. I'm not, I'm not short. because of my selfishness of the day before or the night before. I'm sort of in a position where I'm like, I don't want to drink again if that's what's going to, the impact is going to have. But on the other end, it's giving, giving that up. It's also like, it's heartbreaking because I've lent on it for 21 years.

It's like losing a best friend. but the impact it's having on me and my family is just I can't give that up. Dude, I'm so proud of you. You're doing such a fucking good job and I can't even begin to fathom how hard it is to be in your position. Like, you know, life is fucking tough, right? And I've, there are so many moments where I'm really struggling. and yet I'm not having, I'm fortunate to not have that internalized battle with myself

and when I hear you talk about, I remember you called me and you were saying, you know, it's like, why do I hate myself internally? Why am I fighting myself here? And I can't even believe how hard that must be to get through every day when you're not just battling through life

but then battling yourself as well. And you're just swimming, what feels like against the tide every single day. But to see you, come through that where you are now, like, I'm just bursting with pride and I think you were doing a phenomenal job. I know it's weird because you kind of think a journey like this is going to come with a big build up of like, I'm setting off in this big expedition, like, wish me luck. And it kind of just happened like under the radar. And it's built up slowly now to where you are now.

And like the healing that you're doing is just phenomenal. It's like, don't get me wrong, still every day is a battle with my brain, 100%. I think that's the hardest part is the trying to, trying to tame that beast that's been suppressed for so long, that now it's like, okay, well, it's so hard to explain, like, the continual conversation in my head. And it's like, I don't have anything to suppress that anymore. It's like, now I've got to hit it head on.

And I feel like I have as much as I can and as best as I can. And some of the moments up for the last 90 days have been pretty dire where it's like, if it wasn't for my kids and stuff, I probably wouldn't be here. I'm honest. I'm just kind of. I mean, I'm obviously very lucky to have the support and the family and friends and you and thick and yeah so I caught up yesterday with uh Andy Cooks who's nine years sober and Sassy Scott who's five years.

You got to spend that time with them and yeah, felt good. Feel good. Now you're making me feel bad for bullying at the start of this episode. Oh dude. Go to a commercial break. I know you've been on this. journey for a while now. And I've been very aware there's been moments that you've really struggled, but to see you sit here now and to talk about your situation and the hardships of what it's like

to go through this journey of sobriety with so much pain in your voice, it makes me really angry because it's so unfair. And I think when you're in your position and your work, working so hard to better yourself, to be a better man, a better husband, a better dad. And that's met with your body punishing you. You've got this internal fight that as you try and do better, it's doing all it can to try and drag you back into having alcohol again. And I think it shouldn't be like that. If you can't even rely on your own mind, your own internal monologue to try and give you

that little extra push, if that's working against you, then, fuck, I can't even begin to imagine how hard that must be for you. And I'm just so glad that you're still there fighting every single day. Everyone's going to be fighting their own demons, whatever that might be. Yeah, I think, like we mentioned it before, it's super important. And what's been important that I've always, I've always said that everyone should see a therapist once in their life regardless of what their circumstances are, whether they, especially if they've got access to doing so,

or talk to a friend like so many, you know, so many, you know, moms and dads and stuff that approach me and stuff and want, you know, ask me about it and stuff like that because they're worried that maybe their partner might be going through the same thing. Yeah. When you think through those, you know, 100 odd, 90 odd days, When there were moments where you were really doing it tough, what were the little moments that really helped give you that energy to keep going?

There was a pretty significant moment where it was a pretty rough day. It was already a rough day made rough by a drop-off of meds. Like the ADHD stuff with the meds is great, but then sometimes there's a drop-off, just you can metabolize things quicker some days. And it happens and I miss time it. And I was just like really down. Like I wasn't, I was just quiet. And that's not like me, as you know.

And then I remember it was shower time for the kids. I remember Macy just like, she was in the shower and I was sitting there sort of waiting. And she just like rubbed the steam off the door and looked at me and that was it. I was like, fuck. It was just a moment where you're like, fuck, fuck. I can't believe that I had missed so much of that. Yeah.

Like I was there but not. Yeah. And I would spend so much time trying to avoid the feelings, thought, the responsibility. But she was so happy and just melted me.

I think we've been doing this for three years now, so it's kind of just like muscle memory that we get up on a Tuesday and we start recording. But I think it's really important not to underestimate how brave it is for you to be open as you are right now about what you're going through

because there are so many people out there, parents, non-parents, who are going through similar battles and it feels for them easier to do it alone and to not open up to anyone. and to not give oxygen to the struggles and the thoughts that they're having. So I really want to say, like, thank you so much, you know, because, like, dude, fuck, it would, if you not to be here, would be, like, destroy me, you know, like,

and that's, like, a selfish way of looking at it. But, you know, like, I would much rather be up late, fielding phone calls with you than dealing with you not being here and I'm just so thankful that you are talking about it you know and you'll you'll feel confident enough to talk to me and like man it's the confidence that you have and the bravery that you have to talk about it with everyone listening right now on the podcast like it's I would never want you to underestimate the strength that you have to do that and I really want to just say well done. Thank you. It's amazing. And I think we're going to pull up short on this episode.

And I think we'll park everything till next week. And I think, and if there is anyone listening right now who has their own struggles going on, we will, of course, put some links and some numbers and some contacts for some really amazing organizations out there that you can reach out too, but also to your friends and family, please reach out to them first and foremost. And don't be too, don't be too proud. That's the thing. I've always been very vocal. I've always been very honest about my mental health struggles, but this has been the

hardest one. And I'm, I think if I let my pride get in the way of that or anything else, I'd regret that. I think anyone, especially a young dad, young parent, whatever. before you level up, that voice will tell you to step back before you level up. So ignore that and level up. That's what I can say.

If I can love you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, guys. You finally got me to cry. I've been waiting for this day for so long. I know. I know.

You told me. You told me you said, you said I pre-warned you. And I thought you were joking. Yeah, I tried to have this conversation a few times. but just to try and get it out, but it's just so, it's tough. Yeah. I hope this is the first of many. I'll cry every week.

We'll see you guys next week. Two Doting Dance Podcast acknowledges the traditional custodians of country throughout Australia and the connections to land, sea and community. We pay our respects to their elders, past and present and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples today. This episode was recorded on Gatigoland. land.