Two Doting Dads with Matty J & Ash - #246 First Foods & Lunchbox Hacks With Jules from The Bable

Episode Date: July 26, 2026

School's back, which means the guys are already feeling defeated by the daily lunchbox battle so they've called in the expert – qualified nutritionist Jules from The Bable (The Baby Food Bible) – to show them not only how to pack a healthy lunchbox the kids will actually eat but how to feed children confidently from babies right through to the school years. With Matt navigating solids with Poppy, Jules shares everything any new parent needs to know about breastfeeding, introducing solids, baby-led weaning, fussy eaters, family meals and some genuinely game-changing lunchbox hacks that even the boys couldn't believe. Then it's time for the ultimate lunchbox battle. The guys go head to head with their lunchboxes and Jules will be the judge. There are some brutal scores, plenty of laughs and one clear winner crowned the supreme lunchbox master. If mealtimes feel like a daily battle in your house, this episode is packed with practical advice you'll actually use. To buy a Baby Food Bible or Lunch Box Bible head here.  Or you can follow Jules here and The Baby Food Bible here.  If you need a shoulder to cry on:  Two Doting Dads Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/639833491568735/  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TheTwoDotingDads  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/twodotingdads/  See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

There's one thing that really drives me wild every weekday morning. I know what it is. Oh, go on. Probably traffic. Traffic, you get annoyed of traffic. That's up there. You don't like boomers. You're very attacking of the boomers.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. It's nothing to do with that. Okay. Is it... Making lunch boxes for kids. I was going to say hemorrhoids. Well, that's there too. Yeah, what do you like with making food?

How would you... We'll find out during this episode, I guess. So we are going to actually do a little test. on this episode. Ash and I are going to compete where we've made a lunch because we're going to get our guests on this episode to rate

what our lunchboxes are like from a dietary perspective. Yes. And good news is Matt, she's a qualified nutritionist. It's Jules from the Babel, I believe it is, which is the baby food Bible

and now the lunchbox Bible. Look, there's a lot I don't know about food. Yeah, look, I know where it goes and know where it comes out of and that's about it. That's about all I know. I mean, the kids, I try and give them a vegetable here and there.

I know, my kids are talking to me about macros. I'm like, what the fuck you're talking about? Spending too much time with April. Yeah, time. Let's face it, Matt, we probably most of us need help in this department. Speak for yourself. You fool? All right, well, let's get into it and find out.

Can't wait. Welcome back to two doting dads and one doting mum. I am Maddie J. I'm Ash. And I'm Jules. This is a podcast, all about parenting. It is the good. It is the bad.

And the relatable. And we never. give advice because we're not experts. However, Jules, you are the expert today. Welcome. Thank you. Thanks for having me. Can I just double check? You are, you are qualified nutritionist. I am a qualified nutritionist. I am. How we'll get into it later, but just quickly, how long do you study? I studied five years, but half of it was part time because it was COVID and I was having babies. So that's legit. Okay. You're not one of those fake ones. No, no. Yeah. One of those fake online ones who just likes food. Guilty. I'm a nutritionist because I like to eat,

but it's more complex than that. Eat Oreos. Oh yeah. I've had to go off the Oreos. I've told to that. I didn't know. For what reason? I think I was going to shit an Oreo at one point. How many are we talking about? Well, I sent Laura to the shops to get eight packs of Oreos. It's a problem. It's a problem. Hang on. I quit drinking. Okay. Yeah, you need advice. I understand that. Yeah, I've cut back. I've had to cut back. Maybe that's I'm so moody. Anyway, we usually start these episodes finding out a little bit about the person that is yourself. Do you recall the most trouble you got into as a child? I very much do recall. Okay. It's imprinted in my mind. Oh my God. When it starts like that, I know it's good.

A bit of childhood trauma? Yeah. No, this is what I... We don't have to talk about it if you're Yes, we do. Shut up. But it has created trauma for it for me and I'll tell you why. When I was 16, I had a boyfriend, who I'm not proud about. Sorry if you're listening. Can we get a name? Absolutely not. And my parents were going away for the weekend, and he was absolutely not allowed to sleep over because, you know, I'm 16.

I could even have been younger, but let's not go yet. Let's just stick with 16. 16, safe age. No, no, no, 16's fine. He was 35. The second that they left the house to go away, I thought I was messaging him to tell him to come over and stay the night. But of course, I messaged my mum because she was what was on my mind at the time, like, oh my God, I'm doing this, I'm messaging him. He's coming over to sleep.

And I think the message went something like, baby, because you're 16 and they've just left, come over, as in sleep. It was definitely a sleep over. And my mom messaged me, called me straight away. And when I saw the call coming in, I was like, that's weird. Oh, God. Like, they've just left, like, what's happening? And then she called me and she just started, like, lashing out. And then I had to pretend that it was my friend that I was messaging. And she's like, you don't call Mel Baby.

I do now. Oh, my God. And I just, it was just an absolute disaster. I was absolutely grounded for a month. Did you try and get out of it? I did. And I said it was my friend. And she's like, I know you don't call her baby.

I know you've invited X, not saying his name. name over tonight. This is absolutely unacceptable. Should we come home? Started ranting with my dad. Should we come home? Are you pregnant yet? Yeah. Did you marry that man? Absolutely not. And ever since then, you know, when you're writing like a tricky message or a message maybe about someone else and then I'm forever thinking, am I sending it to that person? So it's created this little bit of like, maybe good anxiety actually. I think I needed that. We've all done it, I think. I think everyone in some capacities, is I definitely done.

Do you know what? I actually did it to make you feel a little bit better. I did it last week. I did it with Nana. Oh, God. And actually very on topic because she was making chicken schnitzel. And she cut it up and gave it to Lola for school the next day. And my sister on that day then picked up the kids.

Both kids, chicken schnitzel, not touched. And they said, we didn't like it. And I was speaking to my sister. And then after I was like, oh. And went to message her to say, Don't tell Nana the kids to do like the food because she'll be devastated. And I sent that to Nana. To Nana.

And she was like, what? I think this happens with everyone at some stage in their life. Yeah, I think we've all done it. And the feeling, it's like, the feeling is pure dread. Yeah. That's how I feel. Yeah. I actually have a friend who did that to her boss.

Oh. I don't know if I can go into any more detail, but she basically had to resign afterwards. Oh. So I would say that definitely. trumps it. Yeah. It's never the same. Nana's okay. She'll be okay. Nana's used to like, we've given a shit about her cooking for years. I think she was, she was, oh, I thought this was actually. The chicken schnitzel, that's her like signature dish. She's moved on from the spaghetti. Well, that's just, that's the backbone, but the real hero is the chicken

schnitting. Yeah, but that's kids, right? We've got some, you know, kids aren't going to enjoy everything adults enjoy. You might be loving the schnitzel. I know. It just, it broke it hard. Yeah. Speaking of kids. Yes. How are your two? They're great. They're great. They're great. They're full on, but, you know, I'm just learning to be that mom that has very active, busy kids, defiant, headstrong. I feel like they're all like that, though. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. The age that my daughter's at, she's three, it's like nothing I've ever experienced. My son was absolutely not like that. Hang on, what do you mean? Because I have to also say that any time I make fun of little boys on this podcast, I'm very much joking. I love all children equally in a very platonic way. Yeah, Oscar hates you.

He loves you. I just think it's an age thing, but then it's also a personality thing. Like she's just incredibly independent and headstrong, and she has been from the very get-go. And I find it really challenging as a parent. There's a lot of, you know, like, I don't want to be this super strict parent. My husband's very relaxed parent, so that in itself is an interesting dynamic. But I also need to hold these boundaries. And I find it really hard when there's just your.

you're on something for an hour and you're not getting anywhere and then you're just kind of throwing in the towel and you're like, oh, okay, that was a waste of time. And I think it's going to be for the best when she's older. I think she's going to be an absolute go-get-up. But you're just riding through the storm right now? Yeah, yeah, it's a big storm. But how do you compare because you got three and a half and five and a half? She's three and he's five and a half. How do you compare this phase to the newborn phase? Oh my God. I wish that I knew when I had a newborn, how easy it was. I think about, if I'm comparing it,

a lot of people say when they have newborns, oh my God, this is so full on. Oh, but you've got two kids and, you know, I can't imagine. But I do think when you have a newborn, this is the first time you're a parent. It is incredibly new and overwhelming. But in hindsight, it was so much easier than having a toddler. Yeah, well, they can't move.

You sort of, if you stick to the routine and you're, I find that like as soon as they start to get on the move and they can do their own thing. It does. It's a different level of... Absolutely. I just, I wish I was a bit more maybe relaxed. Really?

Yeah, I found it really hard. I did. With both number one and number two? Especially number two. I found that really tough, the juggle. Okay, like the logistical juggle of it all? I guess for us, I never stopped working. I never had Matt leave.

I was always writing books and working on recipes and this was the business never stopped because it was kind of in its infancy stage. So having a second baby whilst trying to finish off a book, whilst having a two-year gap, really struggling with things like breastfeeding throughout the whole process. Like, it was just a lot. I am one of those people that if I'm going to write an email,

I need to focus on the task at hand entirely. And if there's a toddler or child crawling on the floor that's about to put a fork in a power socket, thankfully, I can't concentrate. Yeah. I find it, any little distraction, I find it very tricky. Absolutely. I couldn't agree more.

Could you breastfeed with baby number one or? I breastfed with both, but I struggled immensely with both. I don't know. From the get-go? From the very minute. Like I had every single lactation consultant in the hospitals both times around trying to get them to latch and neither baby did. And I was so determined to breastfeed.

I don't know how to explain this feeling, but like I just. As men, I don't think we will ever be able to truly appreciate the pressure that moms go through when it comes to breastfeeding. What does that feel like? It's a lot. I think as a nutritionist as well, you know, knowing how beneficial it is for our babies and then not being able to do it is a really hard pill to swallow. Why does it benefit more? Listen, I totally understand how many people firstly can't breastfeed or don't want to breastfeed and, absolutely no judgment. I think for me it was just you're setting them up with this incredible

immunity. You know, you were giving them these antibodies that can really, it's liquid gold essentially. And the benefits of the early days of being able to give that to them definitely sets them up to thrive. I'm not saying you can't get that from formula and good food later on, but those first six months are incredibly beneficial. Is it, I'm going to be, as I normally are on these podcasts episodes, a little bit stupid. Is it colostrum? So when it's coming in as colostrum initially. I got it right.

Yeah, yeah. You got that right. So you express colostrum when you can do it before the baby actually comes and then those early days. Can you guys give a bit more reaction? I was going to say calligraphy, but so you've done really well there. That's the first one. Thank you. Yeah, that's what he's looking for.

Yeah. Well done. And that's a hard word as well. It is. I didn't. Sorry to interrupt. No, that's okay. And that is that liquid gold.

Then did you struggle from Day Dot? Day Dot with both kids. I know. Was it latching or what? Both. So with my son, George, it was latching. And obviously I'd never breastfed before. So that was really hard.

I just couldn't get him latched on. And a lot of women do struggle with this. But prior to having babies, you don't realize how many people are struggling with it. It's not something that's ever entered your sphere. You know, you have no idea. You're like, oh, of course, I'm going to have a baby and then I'm going to breastfeed. And I think that this is a misconception.

People don't realize until they start trying how difficult it can be. And then you start to think, why me? Why am I not able to do this? So I remember with George, I had to use nipple shields. I had multiple appointments. I'm so sorry. What's a nipple shield? Sorry, yes.

I feel like there's going to be a lot of this. Get back. Shield is like a jousting stick as well. It's like a little. It's like a little piece of silicon that you put on your nipple that is like an extended nipple. So maybe sometimes your nipples aren't, I don't know, I guess the latch is too shallow. They're not grabbing on.

So if you're putting this silicon which replicates a nipple, they're then sucking on that. It's almost a bit dummy-like, but it's on your nipple. So if you suck hard enough, the baby sucks hard enough, they're then getting the milk out. I had no idea. I thought it was just to protect your nipple. And no, no, it's not. And it can be used to protect your nipple. And I actually use that with baby number two to protect my nipple as well.

But when you're trying to get a baby to latch and you're trying to use a nipple shield and you're in absolute 10 out of 10 pain, you can't just like have a newborn and be out at the cafe and just pop your baby on the boob. It's like really quite isolating. You're at home holding your breath for an hour of the feed, crying, essentially. Like it was, it sounds dramatic, but it is dramatic. Yeah. If they're not latching and they're really, their latch is basically giving you a lot of pain. Yeah, because there's also like, if they're not feeding off the breast, there's also risk of mastitis.

Yes. So I had a lot of mastitis. Like I've had mastitis five times. Wow. And mastitis is. It's an infection that comes because the milk is not coming out. So you start to get blocked milk ducks. So it builds up and you get this.

infection that often needs antibiotics to be able to clear. But when you're breastfeeding, you don't really want to take the antibiotics. Can you still breastfeed with the antibiotics? You can. And I had to take it two out of the five times because it was either antibiotics or you're going to hospital. So it can get really severe. And then eventually as you go, you kind of learn how to make sure that it flows through and any early onset signs of mastitis, which is like real red marks, which actually appear on your breast, that is when you can say, okay, something's blocked. Let's try and get it out.

So then you'll go and have an appointment with like a woman's physio, which I can't tell you how much money they took of mine to help me breastfeed. Physios are a problem. I'll just say it. So yes, I guess bottom line, it's not, it doesn't come natural to everyone. Yeah. And it's really easy to throw in the towel because it's a lot of power. For anyone who hasn't experienced mastitis, mostly men, myself included.

Present. Shock horror, I've never had it. I know. Not yet. What does that pain feel like? I thought after giving birth that I had, that was it. Like there's no worse pain that a woman can experience. I wouldn't say that mastitis is worse, but it's on par.

Like it's an infection in your boob. Even the wind, walking with wind kind of, Slightly moving your body or touching on your boob is like excruciating 10 out of 10. Like you have to walk around, I don't know if this is a bit like graphic, but you have to walk around holding your boobs when it gets so bad. Because any movement, you're like screaming. Oh, really? Yeah, it can be.

Well, until the infection is released. So I would spend like hours in the bath just trying to relieve the pain with hot water. It's a 10 out of 10 pain. And I think it's really cruel after a woman has gone through childbirth and then they're taking care of this little baby and then wham-bam, you get mastitis. It's really unfair. Fuck off.

Give me a break. I didn't know it was that painful. Like I knew it was painful, but like, far out. But if you get it when it's really early, then of course it's not going to be as bad. But if the infection really takes over your whole boob. And I remember at one stage, I had it in both boobs. And then just imagine.

Well, I don't know if you can imagine. But then. I'll try. You've got a baby trying to latch on to your nipple with mastitis under your nipple. Nope, not for me. And it's like you'd just cry while they're feeding. And then the lead up to the feed, okay, they're starting to cry. They're going to need to eat now.

Oh my God. And I just remember looking at my husband, he's like, you can do it. You can do this. I'm like, I don't think I can. And my kids didn't take bottles and it. Oh, my God, the anxiety and the lead up. And then they'd latch and you'd just start crying. It's just.

The pain was like nothing else, like on par with pushing out. Wow. Okay. Well, good to know. I'm so sorry to any mom that is scared of mastitis, but all I can say is look for the early warning signs of any redness on your boob or when you're starting to feel the pain, you've kind of got to like squeeze it out in the shower. But sometimes it doesn't work.

Oh, this is hopeless. But it's, yeah, if you can get it early, you should be okay. But also it's unfair because a first time mom has. no idea what to look for. Yeah. Like, what did I know about mastitis? And people like, put cabbage leaves on your boob. Like, that does not work if it's like a full grade infection.

Yeah. Cabbage. It never worked for me. I tried everything. Who was spreading this misinformation? I know. And men, probably. Oh, chocolate cabbage on it.

Yeah, just someone at a fruit shop being like, buy some cabbage. It's on sale. It makes me want to almost when I'm at the park. And if a mom's their breastfeeding just on the park bench. Yep, you're doing a good job. I want to be like, you're so lucky. Embrace every second. Do you know what? I feel that every time I see a new mom breastfeeding.

I was like, I wasn't at the park. I was at home like crying and then my daughter, my second, she completely broke my nipples. Like it was. I was then pumping at three in the morning so that I could then give her a bottle, but she didn't want to take a bottle. And I was just trying to pump to give her a break from my nipples. Like what women go through, like you think childbirth is enough. No, no.

Then let's ruin your boobs and let's give you this pain. And then let's get mastitis. It's like a big pile on, isn't it really? Because, I mean, there's already enough complications with the birth. And then no matter what happens there, you're regardless, you're in for this period of time of relentlessness. Absolutely. So how do you get in a good headspace then if you're juggling the business? You're juggling little ones.

Even when you've had your second, you've got two little ones running around the house, which is difficult. You sleep deprived. You're feeling like a bit of a failure because you're not doing what you always wanted to do, which is breastfeeding. How do you get your headspace on the right track? I think it's just you just don't really have a choice. You know, like for me, I got through the breastfeeding journey and I went on to breastfeed for quite a while because it was like I'm not giving up now.

You know, it took me three months with both kids to get it right. But then breastfeeding actually becomes really easy once you get it right. Once they latch, it's so much easier than bottles and formula and all the things. So that actually makes things easier once you get it right. But I think you're in this. bog and you don't really, you kind of have to laugh, otherwise you cry. The intensity of it all, looking back, you kind of laugh.

Like, how did I do that? Yeah. And people always ask us, like, how did you release a book with a newborn? And we're like, I have no idea. Like, I feel like I don't remember any of it. Wow. I'm not sure what happened. Did you pre-read the book and go, what the fuck is this?

What is this? Yeah, and I was actually, like, surprise with, wow, like, this is pretty good. Was that the lunchbox Bible? No, this was Baby Food Bible. Lunchbox Bible with the second. Yeah, which I will say it's pretty thick. Yeah. And like you did all that while having a second child.

And then you just said, I don't really remember it. It's like, well, have another kid. Look at the size of that thing. What was the first book? So we started working on Baby Food Bible when our first babies were one, just after probably one. That's when we were really feeding, starting solids. We'd been through the first six months. and we were really getting into our groove.

And we realized like how no one knew what they were doing. You know, for example, we were in multiple mothers groups. And the questions were all the same. What are we doing? What are we feeding our baby today? Is this good? Is that good? And as in someone that had already studied nutrition,

I was like, oh my God, I'm overwhelmed with this because you're not, the general nutrition degree, you're not honing in on baby nutrition for longer than, I don't know, a couple weeks. So people were really confused. confused and we were confused. And we're like, well, we need to do something about this because there is such a gap in the market. It's either like really relaxed or really intense. And we didn't really like either of those approaches. We wanted to find our own. So Loz, she started studying baby nutrition. So with my nutrition degree and her niche of baby nutrition together, we started coming up with

this like really well-rounded approach of what we wanted to do with our babies. started sharing it with our friends and our mother's groups and started doing it with our own children and quickly realizing that we're onto something. We're like, we've got this. We know what we're doing now and we're actually coming up with some really cool recipes. And then randomly on a walk one day, because Loz and I met when our babies were three months old and we just became each other's people through the trenches of firstborn motherhood. We thought, should we just write a book? Like, let's do a little passion project. Yeah. And we started putting all of our ideas together, started coming up with all these recipes.

And then we thought, well, how are we going to sell this book? And we're like, we should probably start an Instagram account. So, of course, we started an Instagram account and then started just sharing all of the things we were doing and very quickly realize, oh, wow, people need this. Yeah, for sure. Like, this is, you've just come out of the fog six months of newborn life. And now all of a sudden you've got to start feeding this tiny human, which is very different to how you feed yourself. We did a meal for Poppy. It was pretty simple.

It was just like sweet potato, zucchini. And it was just like boiled up, blended, and she fucking devoured it. How old is she? She is 10 months. Oh, great. And I did a story on Instagram being like, there's no better feeling than when your baby eats a full bowl. And everyone was like, what was in that?

Give it to me right now. They want to be told. Yeah, I was like, whoa. Yeah, because everyone goes through, I just remember us, we go through that phase of, let's try this, let's try this, which I guess works in some capacity, but if you want it to be successful and stick, I suppose you've got to have a plan, right? Absolutely.

Can I ask? Yeah. Those key timelines of, because I always get surprised at when you actually start. I was shocked. I was like, already? You're feeding Poppy already. Come over here. I'll breastfeed you.

When did you start? I think it was like six months. Yeah. I think. Is that six? She said that like, yeah. Yeah, that's spot on in my opinion. So dads, if you're listening, that's the answer.

Write this down. Can you give kind of key timelines? And I totally appreciate that every child is different. But what are some of those key milestone dates for newborns and introducing food? Okay. So there's a lot. People might be listening and think, oh, no, I disagree. But from our research and studies and experiences,

we believe there is no rush. So some people might start at four months. Some pediatricians might say, oh, start tollers at four months. Four months? They're little. They're not sitting. They have no head and neck control at four months old. They're not necessarily interested in food.

So those are some real key signs you want to be looking for. And we want them to be able to sit up on their own because we want them to be able to digest their food accordingly as well. You know, sitting at four months, you're usually in like a little bad. or you're kind of reclined and they're babies. Like, let's just enjoy the baby phase and the breast milk phase or the formula phase, whatever you're choosing to do. Usually all these readiness signs come around five to six months. So I was very much six months on the nose with both kids, even though one was maybe ready

at five and a half. I kind of waited because I'm like, I'm feeding this kid for the rest of their life. Yeah. Let's just enjoy the next few weeks of boo. Because it's a fucking, it's a mess. I shouldn't sweat so much. It's a lot. It's a mess. It is a mess. It's a lot. But I understand the excitement, especially as a new mom you get with, oh, it's time to start solids. But let's just take a breath.

And what, when you say, like we're not giving them a chop at six months. No, you can. What? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I gave my second daughter, I gave my daughter, my second child a chop at six months. Just a suck on, I guess. Absolutely, absolutely. Not to start. A lamb chop. Yes. Yes. We love it lamb chop because what they're doing, is they're sucking out all the iron-rich juices.

And iron is something, is the most important thing we want to think about when starting solids because at six months, their iron stores deplete. And they need a huge amount of iron in their diet for healthy development to thrive. I'm just stuck on lamb chop. It seems like, wow. But I also know that there is a lot of anxiety around things like giving them what we call baby led we eating.

baby lead weaning, which essentially is, you know, not purees. It's giving them pieces of food that they can pick up. And there is a lot of anxiety around that with choking. And I felt that with my first. Of course, with my second was very different because I knew a lot more than I did with my first. But a lamb chop is probably the exception of baby lead weaning in terms of that's something that's hard. And you know, especially when they're very young, they're not going to start to. taking bites out of. Yeah. So we kind of call it the squish test in general when it comes to

feeding kids of if you can squish something between your fingers, you know that that's a safe option to give your child. Like a boiled carrot stick. Yeah, exactly. So when it comes to the squish test, you just want to make sure that the food that you're offering can be squished in between your index and thumb finger. So if you're putting something in between your fingers and you're not squishing it all the way down to nothing, then I would avoid giving your child that food whilst they're learning. I would always just make sure that you are choosing foods that squish down between your index finger and your thumb so that they can then chew it with their gums, as opposed to trying to swallow something that's hard that could get lodged. But yeah,

a lot of parents start with purees at six months, which is a really nice safe way to do it, and you're giving them different purees to explore. Some of the parents, Sometimes you can load up the spoon and give them the spoon so they can practice taking it to their mouth. But then eventually we do want to move on to baby led weaning for them to feed themselves to be able to develop those fine motor skills. And timing wise, by nine months, you really want them to be having something baby led weaning style in their day. I'm going to tell you what we're using for Poppy. Yeah, great. And you can tell me if I'm doing a stupid thing or not.

I'm getting... Okay. I'm just going to come out and say it. Why am I so nervous? I can't wait to hear this. Pastor. Okay. Spiral pasta.

Aww. Okay. Is that good? Continue? Spiral pasta? Yeah? Full stop? Yes.

Spiral pasta? Yes. Okay. And she's 10 months old. Yes. She loves it. Okay. She loves it.

That's pretty soft, though. Thank you. Yeah, yeah. It's soft. Are we talking about nutritional value? Are we talking about safety? Wait. Did you do it?

Eldente or did you do it? It better be cooked through. She just devours it. So I'll give her some puree and that would be some vegetables that have been boiled and blended up. And then to like finish it off, second course, I'll give her like five little spirals of pasta and then she'll just like gnaw on that and really, okay, cool.

Yeah, no, that's absolutely fine. Can I give you a tip? Please. Okay. Yeah, stop that. No, I'm kidding. Here's a tip. Just don't.

No, not at all, but this is what I love to do and what we talk about a lot in our books of how we can really amplify the nutrition when starting solid. So a really good alternative still is spiral potentially and pasta, but we look for like a pulse pasta. So because they're not, they haven't yet tried all these things. You're giving them something and they're tasting it without any knowledge if it tastes nice or just because you don't like something, don't let that be the third. thing that you're kind of relaying onto them. Yep. So a pulse pasta would be made out of legumes.

So you've got a chickpea pasta or a bean pasta or a lentil pasta that they sell. I need to call Laura and put her on the speaker. In the major, like they're very accessible in the major supermarkets. Yes, we live in Sydney, but hoping that they are around a lot more than they used to be. I think it's the most amazing food innovation. So you're still giving them that pasta, but it's actually made out of 100% lentils or 100% chickpeas. And what is so good about that is that is rich in iron. Because what's pasta got nothing? It's wheat. It's carbs. And that is absolutely fine if they have a

decent size appetite and that's alongside something that is iron rich. But whilst they're little, we don't want to be loading them up too much on the white, more refined carbohydrates because we want them to be taking in as much iron rich food as possible. Can I ask you another question? question. Please. And I don't, this is not come from any research. It's kind of just, I feel like it's just a perception that has been passed on to me that when you are with a, with like poppy, again, 10 months, when you're creating these little recipes, so the one that Laura did recently was the sweet potato, potato and zucchini. I have this feeling that you shouldn't try and do too much sugary fruit like pear and apples because you don't want them to get like hooked on that sugar, the natural sugars.

Yes. It really depends on the child's appetite. So if they are. are a hungry 10 month old and they want all the food. That's absolutely fine and it is fine regardless. You're feeding your baby. But what we could do is give them some of the more sour flavors or the bigger flavors. For example, I'm going to use sardines as an example. Wow. My favourite food.

You went right there. You're like right to the end of the... Okay. So do you guys like sardines? No. I like sardines on toast. Oh, yuck. So, let's use you then now.

My bad. Let's use Ashes an example. You don't like sardines. Would you then not feed your baby sardines? No way. They're not allowed in the house. Okay. So maybe not a great example because they are quite stinty.

But sardines is an amazing first food for babies. It's got really big flavors. So instead of loading them up on the, you know, starchy carbs or the fruit, the sweet fruits, giving them big flavors is going to help adapt their palate. It's either that or everything else is better than this. Right? So it's like, this is the worst I'm going to eat. Everything else is going to be much better than this.

Honestly, I'm projecting ash. That's just, yeah, sorry. It works. Like, kids, babies love sardines. And what you're getting in that is something that's really iron rich, an oily fish, which is rich in Amiga 3, and it's also got the bones, which are absolutely safe. They can, they pass the squish test, and that's rich in calcium.

So they are like nutritional powerhouses. Why is no one telling me this? Can you give Poppy aside? I can't wait. It's because you need a baby food Bible map. There it is. Well, good product. Wow.

Wish I had those sort of plugging skills. But these types of foods, the big flavors, things like sauerkraut. Do you guys like sauerkraut? On a reuben. Yeah. Will my baby eat a reuben? So that's also another great example of a real sour flavor. So we want it.

Firstly, it's an amazing. gut powerhouse sauerkraut, but it's really good to be able to offer them these soury foods and not just the sweet flavours. So I think my biggest tip here is just because you don't love a food, don't let that stop you from giving it to your baby. I had this mindset of just vegetable, boil, blend, that's it. Sardine. Well, that's it. I feel like I'm going to do this. I mean, go to the shops, buy a sardine, buy a chop, give it to probably for dinner tonight. And Laura's going to be like, What are you doing?

The whole house is going to be like, oh, God. Things like tin fish can be your best friend, super affordable. Yeah, tuna, I don't mind. Wildcourt, and that's a really great baby-led weaning thing, as well as you can puree it. But that's super soft and safe for them to eat. So you just put them on the plate. Lobster. Wildcourt salmon.

Lobster. Caviar. Oysters. Kill Patrick. No honey, though. No, no honey before 12 months. Talk to us about that. Because I do remember, like, I've been a while since I've had about it.

baby, okay? Well, my wife's had a baby and I was co-parenting with her. Well said. Anyway, uh, thank you. Honey, what's the, what's the deal? Have you heard of the word botulism? I have. I have. So, so. No, you have not. Botulism, like a salmonella type thing. Yeah, so it can be present in honey, which is, let me just preface, it is so incredibly rare, but we don't want to take chances with our babies. Because if they contracted it, they could get very sick and it could be fatal. So we want to try and stay away from honey before 12 months. But let me also say that we don't really want to be giving them added sugars before 12 months anyway. This is this window of opportunity where we can be giving them the most nutritious

food, big flavours because they've never tried ice cream before. Hopefully not. I feel like I was stuffed up here. There's no stuffing up, right? Damn it. Now, one of my kids eat nothing but corn things. But this is it, Ash, like you only know what you know. So that's why we're kind of here to try and educate because we get it. Like if I hadn't studied, I would have no idea if we hadn't gone down this rabbit hole. So hopefully people listening will think, okay, firstly, we'll buy baby food Bible. And secondly, just kidding. No, please. I'm like, pitch it. All these little tips in the show notes. But yeah, it's just about thinking when you are young and a baby, the biggest tips I can give is iron rich. Don't go for the added sugars, try to reduce

those real sweet foods. Fruit is absolutely fine alongside an iron rich diet. Fruit has so many amazing nutrients, but I wouldn't be starting on going crazy with the fruit. Especially when they have tiny little appetites. Their tummies are tiny. So we don't want to be loading that little tummy with things that aren't going to be super beneficial in terms of like iron rich foods. Just a lamb shank. He's a lambdang. I can't believe that, honestly.

But I suppose they would just suck on it really at the end of the day. Yeah, absolutely. So I think, you know, sometimes I remember with my daughter when I saw that she started actually trying to take pieces out of it, that's when I stopped giving her the lamb shank. And that's when it really takes into effect the squish test. So it's also you have to feed your baby what you feel comfortable doing. What are your top three foods for a baby under 12 months? I love egg.

Egg is rich in coline. Scramble? Anything. Egg is super soft. So scramble it up. It takes like one minute. Yeah. Or give them a little omelet, cut it up for them.

And it's a really great baby lead weaning form. So egg is great. Rich and coline, great for brain development. Slow cooked meats. So if we're talking outside of our lamb chop, which you know I love, slow cooked meats are great or bolognaise. Bolognaise is great for. purring as well as I actually used to stuff things like bolognese or sauerkraut or bone broth into

one of those mesh feeders and give it to my kids so that they're practicing that whole developing their fine motor skills worked really well I love one of those mesh feeder can be messy though yeah but you know what like starting solids is messy yeah yeah I feel like it's part of the fun it's part of the fun though I remember Oscar we us trying foods with him and that was really fun. I know it was messy and a bit of a nightmare, but if you go into it thinking this is all like all a bit of fun, then you, the mess isn't that bad. I'm like, let's give her a lemon. But the thing is to say to that point is it's really important for their development and they're learning to actually create mess and immerse their hands, their tiny little hands in all these

different textures. So don't be that parent. And if you have been, that's absolutely okay, because we've all done things that we didn't know any better for, but don't have like a wipe or a rag where every bite they take, don't clean up after them. Let them get messy. Get yourself a catchy. I had a catchy actually. Because that actually promotes, like, you know, just let it fall, let them throw it and kind of just, you know, I guess contained. Catchy or a dog? Absolutely. Yep, you don't need both, one or the other. And is that, and what's the third food? Okay, sardines is my number one pick, to be honest. I can't wait to see Poppy try a sardust.

I know, I can't wait to give her one. But honestly, sardines, tin salmon as well, things like that. Wow. Macarole. You've gotten me excited about feeding my... You've got fishmongers. I'm going to come home and you've got fish hanging up down the hallway. Yeah, that one's drying out.

That's poppy's for later. Let's talk about when the kids are a little bit older. What are your kids like with food, Ash? Fussy. They go through... Both of them? Yeah, but at different phases. Like, I know Macy, I was always like, she's my eating.

her, but now she's just trolling me, I reckon. And she's realistically not eating anything. Like, it's such a struggle. She actually ate some curry last night when I wasn't there. That's what makes me feel like she trolling me. Oh, awesome. Yeah. That's big flavors.

Yeah, but like butter chicken, what was it? I don't know. I think it was one of those maly spoon curries. I wasn't there. I was absent for that one. That's why she ate it. But yeah, I think both kids are pretty fussy. Okay.

Oscar's getting better now. He's sort of getting older. And they do. they do grow out of it and it's very normal to have fussy eaters at some stage of their life. Some kids hit it at 18 months. That can be really popular to start going through. They're kind of like they've got these newfound independence and they're like, I don't have to have that.

I'm not going to have it. Mine will be moving out if that's the case. So yes, from 18 months they can have a real fussy streak and it's really frustrating for parents. and I've been there with one of my two children. And I've done everything the same way as I did with my son, with my daughter, but she's just a different type of girl. I think she's such a dick. She's like, give me the sardines.

She actually loved, both of my kids love sardines, but that's because I have been shoving them down their throat since Daydott. And I love sardines. So it's a whole other like... Runs in the family. It does, but it's this whole idea of monkey see, monkey do. Yeah. Because how can we expect our kids to love this food that

they're not really seeing you enjoy. And sometimes they do, but it's really helpful. It's a really good tip. If, like, I find when I'm eating a carrot, that's the one time my daughter will then eat a carrot. Otherwise, she's not interested in carrots, but she wants what we're having. Yeah.

So try and model that behavior. My kids won't eat hot chips. Oh, no. Yeah, see? Now you feel my pain. They've got you on my level. It's like, if in doubt, give them a hot chip. Nope.

No. No. They won't eat pizza, which, again, And bread, bread sauce. They have vegamite. They don't have butter. They don't have butter. They won't have butter.

No lurpack. No lirpac. No nut lex. No butter. Nothing. And it's like they want vegime. You're a child. They're broken.

They're right. They're broken. But they're like. You know what they're probably like hoping for? Chocolate. Cardines. Yeah. That's it.

I reckon someone's going to have to come to your house and do it for you. I'll do it. Yeah. I'm not doing it. Just try. But I don't, yeah. My mom's into sardines. Yes, I'll message her separately.

Skips a generation I heard in my family. But yes, fussy eating, very common. I don't know what your opinion on this is. But, like Lola, for example, very often she can go long periods. She's like a bear in winter. She just won't eat. She'll have a little nibble on something for lunch. But then dinner, she'll have a mouth and go, I'm not hungry.

And I know some people have the opinion that, hey, you've got a list. to your child's cues if they're not wanting to eat. You don't force them. But I'm like, then she's just not eating anything since breakfast. Has she had a big breakfast? She'll have a little bowl of porridge. Okay. And is that it?

Yeah. And then she'll have some, unless she's like hiding snack somewhere. She probably is. She's hot. Yeah. I don't know. But she just,

so I have to then like follow her around with the bowl and spoon to be like, just, you know. And then I'm thinking, am I that. She's got you sort of that. I know. She, like the thing is I think she's just manipulating you now. Yeah, because I'm like, am I setting up a really bad system here where she's expecting,

she'll only eat when I'm hand feeding her. Yeah, a few things on that. Firstly, it's okay if their favorite and biggest meal of the day's breakfast. Great. That is like the most important for kids because that sets them up to be able to concentrate. If you send them off to school and they haven't eaten, think about us when we haven't eaten. We're hungry. So your kids are going to be hungry.

It's like filling up a car with, you know, if you've got no petrol, It's going to start slowing down and eventually stop. Breakfast, I think, is load them up, especially if that's their hungriest time of day. So you could do things like load up those oats that you're giving. You could, and you're probably going to be like, oh, my God, what? You could stir an egg in those oats just before they're ready. You've lost your mind tools.

No, no, guys, hear me out. No, the egg in the porridge. No, no, hear me out. It makes it creamy and it adds protein. So just like crack the egg in the warm, the hot oats. Don't show what you're doing that. Like a minute or two before it's ready, crack an egg in, stir it around, and eventually you won't even see it. Okay, that's fucking, that's bold.

Yeah, don't let her see you doing it. Maddie, just try it before mocking it because I do it with my kids all the time. I'm going to trust you. Yeah. So when you're mixing an egg through the oats, it's actually making this really yummy, creamy custard taste. It's not tasting like eggs, especially if you're adding a little bit of cinnamon. It is really, it's actually quite sweet. So it's a really, really good way to be able to give them eggs,

even if they're not actually eating the eggs in their whole form and adding protein and coline to that bowl. And then loading up that porridge. So let's get some nut butter in there. So like some peanut butter, for example, let's get some hemp seeds in there. Things that are going to actually help bulk out that meal, add some more protein because oats is a source of protein, but not a strong source of protein. So you want to start bulking that up so that that's going to actually last a bit,

longer in her stomach. So you can just feel a little bit more at ease like, okay, you've had a really awesome breakfast. That's okay if you're maybe not hungry at lunch. But yes, that's not going to sustain her all day. And then it's about finding the right type of snacks throughout the day, if not a really good dinner, strong dinner that she might like. What are your thoughts on dessert? Have they eaten dinner? Are they just having dessert? We're pretty good. I don't know what you're like gosh, we don't give them crazy big bowls, but if they don't finish their, if they don't have a decent attack of the meal, we won't reward them. And people are going to come for me.

Because people are like, don't reward your child for eating the food, but, but I do. I reward myself. So I'm like, fuck. Like, the poor thing, it's like, you're going to eat all that. You're not going to get anything. It's just going to make it worse for me. Like, I won't say eat the whole thing. If they do, I'm like, man, good for you.

You know, like a bit of praise. But if they don't attack it. at all in any way, shape or form, then they know not to even ask. Yeah. Oh, it's a really hard one because if I were to say the answer based on psychology, we don't want to be rewarding them, right? So we don't want to say, you have to eat your dinner and then you can have dessert.

That's exactly what I say in now. That's, I'm going to, I got chills. Are you in my house? I would say that 99.9% of the population would do the same thing. So I get it. And to be honest, I would have if I hadn't learned all these, you know, tips. It's not just nutrition. It's the psychology behind feeding.

And it's really quite complex. But at the same time, whilst I say that, you also don't want to then let them get away with not having dinner. And their dinner is a bowl of ice cream. Oh, never. Never. So it's kind of. I'll eat a bowl of ice cream in front of them. So I think dessert is okay if they are having a decent dinner and some good nutrition throughout

the day. But if they're relying on that dessert as their dinner, then I would say it's probably time to take that dessert away or drop it down and slowly phase it out. I really want to come to your house for dinner, by the way. You're going to get some sardines. What are you serving? It's chaos. Like my son will sit and eat, but my daughter won't. Okay. Because she doesn't sit. We struggle to sit. So it's, you know, might take her like 45 minutes to come to the table and eat her dinner. So do you have the rule of like you'll let her kind of wander around and eat a chop in hand? I have no choice because she is so defiant. I've always been like, come and sit down. Yeah. But she won't listen to me. And some people will be listening and be like,

come on, be stricter. Yeah. I can't with her. You know, she's just that type of person. Yeah. I love that. So I try, guys. I try and let me tell you, I'm not perfect one bit. And I know what I should be doing. Does that always translate? Absolutely not because I'm just a mom trying her best. Yeah. I find it really hard to feed her. She eats like a bird versus my son is like this thick, chunky eater. I want two of those. Yeah, yeah. So when my second came along and she's like, I don't want to start solid six months or seven. It's great vocabulary for a six months. Maybe at eight months I'll start something. Yeah. It was tough. Yeah. Every child is just completely Some are going to be fussy, some aren't.

But just on this whole fussy concept, what we want to try and avoid is labeling them fussy eating, fussy eaters because it's so easy to say, and I totally get it. I've said it behind my kids back, of course. Because it's like, no one my three-year-old girl is a fussy eater. But the second we start, I've seen parents saying it in front of their kids' faces, like, oh, he's really fussy. He won't eat that. Of course they're not going to eat it.

Yeah. Now you've told them that they're not going to eat it. You've told them they're a fussy eater. They're taking on this persona and then you're also going to stop offering that food. But my biggest mantra that I would say I repeat daily to someone. What do we got? Is how can we expect our child to eat something that we're not offering? So we might be like, okay, our kid is eating five foods at the moment.

It's pasta, it's rice, it's toast, whatever else is beige. Guilty. Yeah. I know. Right? And I get it. kids can be like that. But what we want to try and avoid is only offering those foods.

Because then how can we expect them to try that broccoli again if they're never offered it? It's not on their plate. It's not in their world. So it's a fine line. You know, you want to try and still offer it, but alongside their safe foods. So their safe foods might be rice. Maybe we could add some bone broth concentrate when we're cooking that rice just to bulk up

the nutrients a little bit. So you're still off. sneaky, I like it. Cucumber, the savior of all meals. Right. Okay. She's like, put some cucumber on and then come back and make us eat the cucumber only. Yeah, so you're still offering the safe foods, but you're also giving them an opportunity to come around.

So like, for example, my fussier, I'm going against my great group. Yep. She's not going to listen. I hope. She rejected broccoli for ages. And then I kind of stopped offering it. Once again, not perfect. I know better, but, you know, I'm still human.

And then one day I was like, oh God, I haven't offered broccoli in months. And then part of me is like, they're not going to eat it. But then I'm like, no, stop thinking that. I made broccoli. I put it down. What happened? She ate it. My husband and I were sitting at the table, which is always super helpful.

Monkey see, monkey do. We're eating the broccoli. Do you eat it with them? As much as we can. Every day, no. I'll be honest. I don't. Read my book.

It's all about that. You have a book? It's a book exactly about. that. It's really helpful because they're seeing you eat and enjoy the foods. So I was like, oh, this broccoli is so crunchy. It looks like a tree. Very good, clever. What did Noah do? Oh, tree. And she, she licked it and then she took a bite. And that was like the biggest win. And of course, I had a poker face. And I did not say good. Don't react. Don't say good girl because they're like, what are you doing? Like, is this? Because if I'm being a good girl, I'm not going to keep going.

Yeah. Right. So poker face all the way. and just put it there. Don't say, try your broccoli, just one more bite. We want to try if we can catch ourselves before we start talking about. Try it because that's putting pressure on them. I always do that. And just leave it there.

Everyone does. Damn it. And you are like also, once again, 99% of the population. But now that we know maybe we just put it there without pressure, super helpful. There's so much I need to try. I know. Sorry, overwhelming.

This next part of the podcast is actually making me a little bit nervous. Oh, no. If I'm being honest. Now, Ash and myself, we have children that are at school. We both make our lunchboxes. Their lunchboxes. Their lunchboxes. We have brought in our lunchboxes for you to judge.

Oh, God. Do you want to go first? Oh, I'm excited and nervous at the same time. You go first. I'll go first. Okay, wait. How honest can I be? That's the question.

I want you to. be brutally honest. Okay. Whoa. Because you're with Ash first. Yeah. Oh yeah. And then go ease up on him.

I don't want to insult you. No, you're right. That's okay. This is Oscar's little bento lunchbox. So cute. Which are all the rave. Is that like, wait, Oscar's seven? Yeah.

Yeah. Is that a whole day? This is not a whole day. This is the main lunch. Okay. Talk me through what's in there. We have a veggie mite sandwich. No butter.

Okay. Crust off. I'm ashamed. I'm ashamed of that. That's okay. We have a little half packet of those mini shapes. Yeah. I may have had a few of those.

Okay. And then we've got two servings of fruit. We've got apple, of course it goes brownish, but he still eats it, and strawberries. Okay, can I start with the best tip that will change your life? Yeah. So to avoid apples going brown, all you need to do, once you've cut your apples up, put them in a bowl with water and salt for 10 minutes. dry them off, wash off the salt, and they stay.

We'll be late for school if we do that. Okay. Honestly. Do it the night before. I'll forget. April, if you're listening, write it down. Well, this is for everyone else that wants to avoid the apples going brown. It's like the best hack ever.

They just stay beautiful and pristine. Yeah, that sucks. Okay, so maybe try it. Okay, right out. So do you want me to tell you my thoughts on the lunchbox? Yeah. Okay. So firstly, the first thing that I'm not seeing in here is protein.

Now, protein is essential throughout the day to help them concentrate. It's super important. So if we think about how we are throughout the day without any protein, you can start to kind of get a bit brain foggy and lose your concentration. And they're supposed to sit in a classroom all day. It's a lot of brain power. So we need to give them brain food. Also, Oscar is very active. Does he like cheese?

No. No cheese. Okay. That's absolutely fine to have apples and strawberries. No vegetables? Not in this particular case. Okay. Would he eat vegetables?

He'll eat carrot. Great. Chuck a carrot in there. Yeah, sometimes there's some carrot. And maybe in his morning tea, there might be carrots. Oh, yeah. Sure there is, Ash. How dare you?

Do you know, just about to say, add some sardines in there. No, no, no. But there is a lot of, a lot of protein options. he eat like a meat stick. Yeah. Great. Add that in there. Twiggy stick.

Great. Okay. Add a meat stick in. There are some really good brands out there that are like grass fed meat sticks that are actually, we'll hit their protein requirements for the day. Okay. So that would be a really great addition. There are lots of other tips to be able to get protein in there.

But I would say if you know that he would eat that, do you guys ever make granola in your house? Yeah, yeah, yeah. He'd probably eat that. Okay. So what we do is, and that's recipes in our book, is we blend granola with. coconut oil and it makes a really great nut-free spread. So because, of course, your school probably wouldn't be able to have peanut butter. You could put like a granola butter in there.

I would just, I would really like to see that being filled out with a little bit of substance in the sandwich. Okay. What would you give them out of 10? Oh, I can't. You can and you will. Oh, no. Five.

Wow. Wow. Okay. Five. Yeah, it's a pass. Yeah, just. Because it's food. Yeah, exactly.

You're feeding your child. You're giving your child things that he'll eat. Brutal. I know. You're not going through to the next stage. I think five's okay. Five's pretty good. I'll take that.

Honestly, I'm not. Because at the end of the day, it's this whole fed is best, right? And you've put thought into it and you can see that. It's just about trying to bulk it up a little bit. He's definitely eating more protein at night. Okay. How about for breakfast? For breakfast, he'll have, I mean, they have a smoothie with mum in the morning.

Great. Which has got yogurt and some fruit and stuff. Nothing. It's not crazy. And then he might have some cereal or something or some toast, depending on how he's feeling. Okay. So if he, that is okay. If he's having good protein sauce at night, it is important because he's off to school or day that he's getting it before dinner as well.

Just to help him throughout the day. And it also satiates him. So he will feel fuller for longer if there's a source of protein in there. So if you can get that protein into breakfast, then already that's a win. Okay, all right. Lots of ideas of how to get more protein into your lunchbox. And that is literally what lunchbox Bible is. Okay, you're up.

This morning, we got up very early because Marley has dance. And Laura was like, oh God, what's this for? And I was like, well, we're going to be judged on the lunch. And she was like, put something else in there. Well, it's in there. And I do want to say that I boiled an egg. and I forgot to put it in there. Oh, I bet you did.

Me too. Do you really, though? Because that is an amazing addition to lunchbox. Don't you dare. That's such a lie. But can I say, hold on. With sardines. And a lamp chop.

It's all well and good to put an egg in there. But if your child's not going to eat it, lunchbox is not really the time to be exploring brand new things. Oh, beautiful lunchbox. It's a massive lunchbox. Okay. Here we go. Oh, wow.

Wow. Okay. This excites me. I'm sorry. Fuck off. Seriously. This is a G-up. What do you mean?

Who made that? You didn't make that. I made that. Okay, so well. Maddie cheated. So I will, okay, I'll explain what's in here. We have some banana bread homemade. Great.

Wow. Really? Yeah. Amazing. I feel like I'm being trolled. But I also, I cheat because my mum lives with us. Oh, okay. So she made it.

And so she makes the banana bread and she also makes the kishas. Oh, wow. So it's a beautiful egg keish. We've heard about a schnitzel. I wonder what they're like. I feel ripped off. Then we've got some carrot and some cucumber. We've got some grapes and some blueberries.

Two mini kishas with ham and some pretzel. A meat stick And I feel like I'm in jeep. I've been stitched up here for sure. What do you mean? There's no way! This is the meat stick I was talking about. They're really great.

Mini sticks. Not all meat sticks are really equal. Organic source of protein. Yeah. We love Kui, the brand. It's delicious. And it's available at the major supermarket. I had the petrol station.

Oh, wow. Yeah, get it from the diesel station ridden all over it. What else are you got in there? How far the petrol stations have come? We've got some pretzels. Kids love pretzels and I got a ham sandwich And you've got a little koja bite Yeah

We love coja too Are they good? They're amazing Feel stitched up What have you done? You really made me look bad What do you mean? I did nothing, you've done it to yourself

I feel like This is amazing Okay Sorry but I'm very I'm so impressed Can you tell me what type of bread it is? Helga's whole meal Okay

Whole meal So I would say That. Okay, so let's just, we've got our protein, we've got the ham. Okay. We've got egg as well, which is protein. We've got our fruits and our veggies. We've got a nice little treat.

Oh, we've got more protein with the meat stick. We've got banana bread, which is sweet. The Musley Bar is a really, it's a much better option. If you're looking at the supermarket, that's the one that I would definitely buy. It's got less sugar. But it's also got less additives. So we want to try and reduce. There are a lot of things that we can buy from the supermarket that are better for you.

Don't you think it's a bit much? I think it's just like outstanding. Damn it! Really? I'm so impressed. Really? Sorry, Adam. Oh my gosh.

Could it be overwhelming? Nope. Good answer. Okay, I tell you the answer to that. It all depends if the child's going to eat it or not. So it's this whole feedback loop. So you're going to pack this lovely, robust lunchbox. And if it's going to come home and it's not eaten, then it doesn't matter.

how beautiful it looks. It's not really doing its job. That's why mine's like that. That's exactly why mine's like that. So if Marley, would Marley eat everything in that? Or not everything, but... I mean, depends. Sometimes she will. Other times changes every day. It's nice to have options, I guess. I will be honest and I'll say I kind of go every day. You're telling me that every, and I'm going to get to the bottom of this because this is very out of, very out of context for your personality. Whoa. Every day she gets this.

I'm not attacking you. No. Okay. So I forced Nana to make a keesh yesterday. Have you judged this up for this? I would say the kees aren't normally there, but the egg would be there if the kees is not there. Okay. If Marley...

Don't attack me because I did well. There's a line of questioning not an attack. So it's not about if the lunchbox comes home completely empty. Because some days your child's going to be hungrier than other days, right? So what I do, for example, for my three-year-old, the lunch. box comes home usually a quarter full. She doesn't eat much at school, but then I'll re-offer it after school. Instead of her saying, I'm hungry, I'm like, oh, okay, let's have a look at your lunchbox.

You didn't eat anything or not much. And then more often than not, she will eat the majority of what is in that lunchbox. So I'm not having to firstly waste the food, which kills my soul. And I'm not having to then go and make a whole bunch of other food where it's just perfectly good food sitting there. So re-offer, firstly, if it's coming home full, but also if it's coming home full, maybe it is overwhelming for them.

But if they're eating majority, then that's an amazing lunchbox. I will also say that today is a big day for Mali because she's at dance from 7.30. She doesn't have a lunchbox. It's here. And so she's like, well, the fuck is my food. So she just dance.

And so she has a little nibble. Then before school starts, they also then they're at after school care. until like 4.30, 445. So they'll also then have like another snack. So that's going to last her a week. That's impressive. It was a really good effort, Maddie.

That's like an amazing. But I want to say that some kids would never even get through all of that. Like my son would demolish that. My daughter wouldn't, it wouldn't touch sides. So you have to know your child and kind of see what comes back every day and then act accordingly, right? Make those changes. You don't want to overwhelm them.

So pull it back. But if every day you're opening up the lunchbox at the end of the day and it's completely empty, maybe then you need to increase the food. That's going to cost you. Look at that. So like... What a great segment. I'm glad we did this.

I'm glad you're happy about it. We put our lunchboxes on Instagram a lot, like on our stories every day. Yeah, me too. That's what we do. We make lunchboxes. And a lot of people are like, wow, George eats so much food. My child wouldn't eat half of that. Honestly, he wouldn't even eat all that.

I want a rating. We already know. We don't have to if you don't want to rate it, but if you do... I want to say 10 out of 10. Fuck off. There is definitely room for improvement. Okay, maybe 9.5. Don't listen to Ash.

Stick with your guns. Stick with your first off. No, that's an awesome effort, especially if that... You did like that point for cockiness. Laura's going to be so happy. I know. That's good. It's the better for you snacks from the supermarket,

which I'm really big on. You know, there's a lot of noise. at the supermarket. Marketing gets people very confused. But those two snacks, the cojabai and the kui, are really better options. I'm buzzing right now. You are glowing. Well done, Maddie. Well done, Laura.

Well done, Nana. No, no, forget about Laura. Yeah, yours is a group effort. It's a team effort. Like you said, feedback, I know he'll at least have a crack at that and won't be a cranky shit when he gets home. Yeah, and once again, if you give a really good breakfast, then that is okay. And then he's got his protein at dinner as well.

Sometimes he's playing soccer at lunch and never eats. I don't want to shit on my mum here. Actually, no, it was more my fault, I think. So when we got to high school, that's when we had to make our own lunch. Yeah. Right. And when you're asking a 14-year-old boy, 15-year-old boy to make his own lunch, especially a young boy like myself, who's very lazy.

I used to have just a jam roll and a pack of chips every day, pretty much, from my whole high school. Really? I remember there was a mate of mine, his mom, was a stay-at-home mom, and she would make this like marinated chicken with semi-sum dried tomato sandwiches and I'd be like, oh, it must be nice. And I was just sitting there

because my mom was a single mom of five kids so she didn't have time to make lunches for everyone. I'm like, man, how did I? You survived, Maddie. I survived, yeah, honestly. Did you eat it every day? Oh, yeah, I love that. I didn't eat a lot of school.

If it makes you feel better, I absolutely was the same. I had a white sandwich with vegamite and an apple in a glad wrap bag or a little bread. That was the 90s. Or are we talking in 2000s by this stage? A bit of a boat. A bit of both. And that was just, that was the way.

And, you know, we're all okay. But we're about like kids these days are really struggling to sit and focus. And we also now know so much more about nutrition. So it's like, well, we know all these things. I mean, there's always room for improvement because I did get the 9.5 downgraded from the 10. Ash, thank you very much. Is there. Come, they're going to hear the end of this.

Is there anything you think I'm missing? is what do you think I could add to really solidify the 10 out of 10? Probably some humbleness would be great. You can go straight. Shut up. Well, okay. So I've got a few recipes that I brought today that helps to pack in nutrition to recipes that your kids will actually eat.

I can't help it. Notice you've got some chocolate-looking muffins on the table. I can smell them. So what do you think of the smell? It's good. So these... Sardini. No, I'm going to talk you through these muffins

because these are such a winner to put in a lunchbox. and they go, like, within a day with my whole family, my husband, myself and my kids. Hand it over. Now, there we go. Just know when you're biting into it. We're not eating a sugar-filled muffin. So what is in this is white beans, zucchini, spinach, tahini, as the main ingredients. It's lovely.

Do you like it? Yeah, really nice. What do you think, Ash? Yeah, it's pretty good. brutal. So what I love about... I'd give it a five. Oh no.

Daddy, what do you got? Ten. So what's so good about this? A lot of the things that we bake, we try to pack in as much nutrition as we can. Because we know there are kids out there that might not eat white beans in a bowl. We totally get that. Or spinach or zucchini. So all the recipes that we create, a lot of the baking, we really pack it in so that even if Ash,

There's no protein, obvious protein in your lunchbox. If you made these muffins and put half of them in the freezer, every morning you just whip it straight out of the freezer into the lunchbox, you know that they're getting some protein because there's white beans in there. So a lot of our recipes actually are, we love adding legumes because you really can't, it's not a strong taste. And legumes are a great source of fiber and protein and even iron. So adding it into these regular muffins,

disguising it with some chocolate, the kids will eat it. Genius. My kids absolutely go crazy for these. And these items are all in the lunchbox Bible. All in a lunchbox Bible. Can I ask, this is the granola spread. Yeah. So we love, okay, so we're all about trying to work smarter, not harder,

because we're parents and we're time poor. So we love granola and so do our kids. So we've made what we call in the book sprinkles. It is granola packed with seeds and oats and. and coconut and all the good things. And what we do is we add it to a blender with coconut oil. And what you've created, please guys, go for it. What you've created is a nut-free spread that you can add onto a sandwich.

Oh. Do you like it? That is fucking delicious. Wow. Ash. Yeah, that's good. Okay. And if you need it, if you need it sweeter, you can go sweeter, but this is.

It's got a little Anzac aftertaste. Yeah, because it is. It's the. It's the oats and the baked oats, sorry, the roasted oats. So that's a really good option instead of a nut butter because we can't send it to school. Yeah, of course. Potentially replacing a veggie mite or just a butter sandwich. So you're getting all the goods in that spread.

I love it. And the last item here looked like almost little lasagna kishas. Yeah, okay. They're not so aesthetically pleasing. No, they're beautiful. This is utilizing last night's leftover spaghetti and bolognades that maybe you've served up to your family, mixing it with an egg and some cheese, and then baking it into little muffin moulds. So instead of having to deal with spaghetti bolognades in a lunchbox, you've got a little

muffin that a kid can eat with their hands that's actually still ticking all the boxes. You've got your carbs, your protein, and it's rich in iron. And we're actually going to make these. Oh, great. We're going to do it as a separate video. So if you do want to jump on our socials, keep an eye out for this recipe. What do you call this recipe? It's the pasta muffins.

Pasture muffins. Yeah. Because these are great. My kids will love these. And also these are really good to freeze as well. So even when you're getting home late and you don't have time to make this elaborate dinner, you can just take them out of the freezer, heat it up. And you've got spaghetti bolognese, but in a really easy to eat form.

I love that we're getting fed during this time. That's all. That's my favorite part. Jules, thank you so much. Thanks for having for us, guys. I can't wait to just like, I give my child sardines and a chop. I can't wait for Poppy to have sardines. But just to mix up some of the items, like the lunchbox that I give Marley and Lola,

that is rinse and repeat every day. Imagine how my kids feel. But I just want to say, Maddie, that's okay. Like if that works, it's a great well-rounded lunchbox. It's not about trying a whole new lunchbox every day or every week. Just swapping out a few things. Maybe you swap out the veggie. you're giving them or the fruit you're giving them or how you're presenting something.

You know, if something works, great. We want them to eat it. That's the most important thing. But yeah, there's lots of awesome ways that we can add in some really good stuff that they might not eat in their whole form. I wish you were my mum. I wish I was my mum. Thank you so much.

Thank you so much. Thanks, guys. I appreciate it. I can't believe you know. I can't believe it. Go on. You know, there I am getting rewarded for all of my efforts this morning for my impeccable lunch 10 out of 10 and you're like

Hang on a second No one's perfect Maybe get a 9.5 you prick Look let's She's not here now You didn't make that lunch Did you? It was Laura

Ah Good because mine was April If you enjoyed this episode Please don't forget to review Okay Subscribe Leave his little comment You know the other week

I was like we don't get any bloody reviews on Apple Podcasts. It's been months. There must have been some kind of technical glitch because the other morning I woke up and I had a little skim over and it was like I'd just dug in the backyard and all of a sudden oil was spilling out.

I'd struck Gold Dash. Hundreds. That's amazing. Of reviews had come through. How did that happen? I don't know. Apple, if you're listening, I can get your act together.

You're making us work for these reviews. Also, you can join us on social media. Matt. Two doting dads. There's a Facebook group. Almost 5,000. members at the moment. It's booming. It is booming. Shout out to the boomers. And TikTok, there's also, it's on YouTube. Yeah, that episode will be on YouTube. And if you want to get your

hands on the book that was written by Jules, you can do that. We'll put the details in the show notes, because let's be honest, I have learned more in this conversation than I have in the seven years of being a parent. Facts. Goodbye. We'll see you later. Two Doting Dance podcast acknowledges the traditional custodians of country throughout Australia and their connections to land, sea and community. We pay our respects to their elders, past and present and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples today. This episode was recorded on Gatigal Land.