Two Doting Dads with Matty J & Ash - #97 Gold Medals and Toddler Tantrums: Paralympian Vanessa Low

Episode Date: October 6, 2024

Paralympian Vanessa Low achieved Gold Medal status at the 2024 Paris Paralympics while bringing her toddler in tow.  Vanessa was just 15 years old when her life took a sharp turn in a small town in Germany. This would lead her onto a path where she would go on to meet her husband and coach and qualify in four Olympic Games as a long jump athlete.  Despite knowing how to face a difficult challenge, pregnancy with Matteo was on a different level.  Buy our book: https://www.penguin.com.au/books/two-doting-dads-9781761346552  Two Doting Dads Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/639833491568735/  YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TheTwoDotingDads  Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/twodotingdads/  TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@twodotingdads See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey Ash, you know there should be, I reckon, a medal for parents. Yes, I would love the opportunity to compete and win a medal for my dading efforts. Well, Paralympian Vanessa Lowe has earned herself a real gold medal after achieving a world record in the long jump at the 2024 Paralympics. Matt, it is an incredible story to drag a toddler all the way to Paris, compete and win a gold medal. That's five stars for me. And do it with a smile on your face.

Look, Vanessa has faced challenges that would leave most of us breathless, but she's here today to share how being a mom has made her stronger than ever. Do you think, Matt, that maybe she'll give us a few tips on how we can turn chasing these children into an Olympic sport. That is genius Ash, you're very good. Let's get stuck into it. Good day, how are you? Welcome back to To Noting Dads, my name is Matt. What? I am Ash.

And my name is Vanessa. Thanks for having me. That was very good. Thank you. That was very good. Thank you. I was... I shouldn't say that's very good.

How would I know? You could have just done editing. It almost threw me off. I was hoping for more of a reaction. I'm going to be honest, I've been saving that the whole time. I thought you were making that up. No, I did. I learned a little bit.

Was that good? No, it was spot on. It actually almost like threw me off. Very good. Thank you. Duolingo or whatever you've been doing. This is a podcast. All about parenting.

It is the good, it is the bad. And the relatable. And we never give advice at all. But Vanessa, if you have any advice to give, you're more than welcome to throw it out there for us, for the listeners. But Ash and I, for legal reasons, we have to say that we don't give advice.

Look, I'm still winging it, so I'm not sure if I'm really... Perfect. Right. We always like to start at the beginning. And we will, down the track in this interview, obviously talk about your recent accomplishments in Paris at the Olympics. But before we do that, I would like to know what a young Vanessa was like. Was she as disciplined and well behaved as what she is right now? I was a feral teenager.

I already am a bit scared about what's to come when Matteo is going to be a teenager because you always say, you know, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree at the moment. He's not. But I was wild and I apologize to my parents because I know no one understands how hard it is. And I was pretty wild. I did not listen. And my parents did an amazing job, but somehow I found a way to be really feral. Did you get in much trouble when you were younger? Oh, yeah. There was actually still a story that my parents only found out recently. how I found a way to be really feral. Did you get in much trouble when you were younger? Oh yeah. There was actually still a story

that my parents only found out recently. Like I was grounded for good reasons as well. And I managed to climb out the basement window to hitchhike to the next town. Oh my goodness. To go into a dance club, underaged. Worth it. Worth it.

Holy. How old were you? I was 16. Oh my goodness. I know. Do you know, it's funny when you're a kid you don't realize how dangerous it is until like now you're like, oh my god I'd never do that now. How long were you grounded for? Well I was grounded for a week, but my parents didn't find that one out so I never actually got punished for it. Oh my goodness. Do they know now? They know now. And it's like, don't tell us any more stories. Fair enough. Holy shit. That's I did not expect that.

No, I was not. I'm rattled. I'm just going to say it. So when did you start behaving? When did you get that reckless behavior on track? I think I just had my wild for years. And I think I just found sport. And it sounds silly because sport, I think is part of my teenage years. By the same time, I was almost like a way to find myself.

And I think we all go through these phases where we just reveled. And I think I did that and I was done with it and just moved forward with finding my passion. And I think just finding sport, like you had to find that discipline, right? And no one can find that for you. Like if you don't want to do it, like no one else will do it for you.

No one can force you to it. And was it always athletics? I was a long distance runner. Obviously very different to now being a long jumper. But growing up, I did, I just loved to run. And I grew up in a beautiful little town surrounded by the lakes and woods. And I just love being outside and running. And that was my thing.

When you were 15, you were involved in an accident that would change your life. What were the events that led up to that moment? I actually don't remember much. And I now got fed back some of what was happening around that time. But like a loss in my memory, just like from the bad injuries that I had to my head, as well as I think the body just going into shock memory just like from the bad injuries that I had to my head as well as I think the body just going into shock and just like putting everything aside that isn't essential. But I was told I was on my way to meet friends and it was really normal in Europe to just

catch the local train to meet up with the friends in the next town over. And the next thing I remember is waking up in hospital and I was told that I was struck by a train and I was essentially hit and overrun by a train. So just being here today and being able to tell the story, like it's incredible. Who was the person who told you that when you woke up in hospital? So like there were a couple of people on the train that told obviously their perspective.

There were a couple of people that were like on the train platform, but like it was dark outside. So like some of the things lined up, some of the things didn't exactly like, I think we all the same, like we don't really pay attention to anything that's outside our bubble. So no one was really paying too close attention to what had happened exactly. We think I must have been bummed, didn't pay attention, stumbled on the train platform and just didn't have the time to react. And so my goodness, when't pay attention, stumbled on the train platform and just didn't have the time to react. And so my goodness, when you woke up, were you with your mum and dad in hospital?

I eventually was. And I think now being a parent, actually, my heart sings a little bit because I was on my own when I was traveling. So I was meeting with my friends there. And so my parents just had to call up the police because I didn't come home. And it was really unlike me because I always like made sure that my parents knew where I was. And when I didn't come home, they called the police and they had to tell my parents that they found someone that is now in hospital that had an accident. And so they actually had to come into the hospital to identify their daughter. And at that point

I had already gone through surgery and had already done, I was already in a coma. And so I was, did not look like myself, obviously. Holy shit. And every parent out there right now is probably like, oh my God. Could you imagine, yeah. Just having to do that call. And I think it just like, really only like years down the road, like dawned on me how hard that must have been

for my parents and like how big of a shock that would have been. And he's so caught up. Obviously it was a really difficult situation for me, but for my parents, I think they did it a lot harder and just trying to deal with everything and their own emotions and questioning. How long were you in a coma for?

I was in a coma for two weeks, but I can't really remember probably about three months just before and just after the accident. So there's actually a fair chunk of memories just never came back. I was always waiting for it, like some of the bits to come back, but it just never did. And what were the extent of your injuries? So at the very beginning, I was told that my left leg was amputated on side and my right leg was amputated in the first surgery.

They had to make the decision whether or not to save it but I was missing so much blood and was yeah they had to decide to save my life rather than my legs so they amputated the second leg and I had a number of head injuries and a couple of injuries to my back. For the first five months I was just paying just to let my back heal and make sure that I don't have any further injuries to my spine. You must be lucky that you survived though, surely, you know, that the severity of an injury like that. I'm assuming that there's only a short portion of time with the amount of blood that you can lose before it's too late. Absolutely. I mean, like to be sitting here today and tell a story like it's still like it's a pinch me,

like once in a lifetime moment where you think like everything must have aligned in my favor for me to be here and the people like on site and in hospital just did an amazing job and yeah just did their best. I'm here. Wow what was your recovery like because you mentioned you were five months flat on your back trying to get back here and then what what happens after that? It was I had a really journey. And I think now that I'm connected to so many different athletes that all went through their own little journeys, I realized just how long mine was in comparison.

Because I was out for such a long time, and I went through nine surgeries and the whole process. After six months in hospital, I was finally able to not go home, but to go to rehab. I think even just recently realized that I wasn't going to rehab to learn how to walk. I went to rehab to learn how to do life in a wheelchair.

And I think it really didn't dawn on me because I had these goals of like, I just wanted to go home, wanted to sleep in my own bed. I wanted to, you know, go out with my friends again, go back to school, like all the things we hate. You know, I was really looking forward to. Cause also you're so young too. I mean, we're talking about this now. and as an adult, you are a little bit more

patient as an adult, you just, you just learn those skills. But as a teenager, you're not patient. You would have been itching to get home. I think just like when they announced that they had to do another surgery, it's like, no, like you said, the last one was the last one. And like, I'm not going to do this. And it was, yeah, I was definitely losing my patience along the way.

And especially once I was just like wide awake and well aware of the whole process. I think it really started to be like, no, I just want to go home now and I'll figure out from there. And I was in a YouTube era. Had already watched all the YouTube videos of people like walking on prosthetics. It's like, oh, this is not a big deal.

Like I'm going to get my first prosthetic legs and I was going to walk back right into the life, the way that I left it. Yeah. Well, when you're in that recovering, you're doing the rehabilitation. How much assistance is given from a psychological perspective? Well, you're offered like psychological assistance, but I felt like it was just not for me. Like I felt I was always a person that kind of makes things out with myself

or with the people that are really close to me So it felt really foreign to me Just like lean on someone that you know seems to be a professional what they do But like someone that don't know it's so like and I was still trying to figure this out myself So I felt like I was just not up for having those conversations yet And so I think that was something that I explored a lot later in my story, probably like 10 years. Wow. Down the track and even still today, I mean, it's now approaching almost 20 years ago.

But I'm still like, there's still aspects that I'm still healing and I think still aspects that I still start to understand now. And I think it was a good thing that I gave myself the time to be ready for it and not try to, you know, rush through the rehab process and trying to, you know, understand it all in the beginning. Mm-hmm. And do you remember the point then in your recovery phase where you thought, you know, I'm going to be an athlete still? I never grew up thinking I was going to be at the Olympics.

Like, I think a lot of athletes that you see competing now, they're like, yeah, I've dreamed of this since I've been four or five years old. And like, I was just a kid that loved to run. And so I think when I of athletes that you see competing now, they're like, yeah, I've dreamed of this since I've been four or five years old. And I was just a kid that loved to run. And so I think when I lost my legs, it was no question asked, I was gonna go back running and this was gonna be my thing. And I never did that to be the best in the world.

I never wanted to break records or wanted to compete on this massive stage. I just wanted to run again and do something that like felt like me. And so I guess that's what really drew me into the sport. And it wasn't until a lot later that I was like, maybe I can actually compete and maybe I can actually be pretty good at this.

When was that moment? Do you remember? When I first joined one of the sport clubs that actually had people with different physical disabilities that I discovered that you can actually compete in that space. Like I'd never met another person that wasn't an amputee before. Like coming from a small town, like I don't think I knew someone in a wheelchair before,

to be completely honest. So just like being exposed to that whole different world of like people with different abilities, like doing different sports, like all of a sudden discovered there was a different world. And I think I really desire to make the most out of that when I discovered that my disability actually didn't exist in that system. So I was always on my feet and I wanted to be back running on my feet. And everyone told me with your disability,

you do a wheelchair sport or do a seated sport. Yeah, right. And I was like, well, didn't quite sit right and it didn't feel right. And I was like, well, didn't quite sit right. And it didn't feel right. And I think the more people told me like this was, you know, a wish that was just too big and like unachievable. I think the more I wanted to try it. And I was probably like still the rebellious teenager.

I wanted to like just achieve things that people told you like I couldn't do. I think that's what really pushed me. So you spoke before about when you snuck out of home and you hitchhiked. That happened after your accident. It did. Wait, what? Oh yeah. It did not slow me down. Vanessa!

Anyway. How did you? Okay. Yeah, because you did, that was 16 years. That was a year on. It was a year on. Yeah, it did not slow me down. Yeah, I was still pretty wild afterwards. Yeah. So when you were hitchhiking, how many different rides did you need before you got to your destination? Oh, just the one ride.

It wasn't really far. Nothing was really that far from where I was. But it was a positive story. I mean, we had a nice person that actually drove us and it was actually a female and it was me and a friend. So at least it was the two of us, two young girls. I mean, I'm not sure if that makes it better or worse.

Vanessa, I'm in shock. I know. You guys have daughters. Are you ready? He's got two. Yeah, I've got two daughters. My version of naughty was like stealing a pot of noodles from tuck shop. My sister was pretty naughty. I was too much of a scaredy cat to go hitchhiking. No, I couldn't imagine that 16.

It's just crazy to think you go hitchhiking at 16, like in the middle of the night, I'm assuming. Yeah, of course. Oh my God. Do you remember then the first competition that you won in Long Jump? It was a really long time down the road because I was actually really not that great at it. Really? Yeah.

I think I'm now, cause I've won the last three titles. Like, I think a lot of people think I was so dominant, but like I didn't win until seven years of doing that, like full time. So I think a lot of people didn't realize that it actually took me really long time to be good at it. What clicked then? Did something happen that made you a hell of a lot better or was it just, it took a long time?

I think I've realized now that the best things in life come from the greatest adversities we face, right? And so I think for me, what changed really was going to my first games in London and I did not medal and I didn't do amazing. And I think it was almost like all the people that told me like, you were not gonna be good at this, were right.

And there was this big disappointment and I actually decided to step away from the sport. And I felt like maybe it wasn't for me, maybe it was just a hobby and maybe I just focus on my job and not do these big hours anymore. And then there was a friend of mine that I made this for that was competing for Germany

that had married an American. So she lived in the US that talked me into coming to visit them. And it's like, sure, I go for holiday. I just quit sports. So like I have all this time on my hand now. How much time had you had off from the sport at this point? Six weeks, six weeks.

And so I arrived in the US and basically what was a holiday turned into a training camp. Oh wow. Did you bring in equipment with you? No, I did not. I didn't even bring my joggers. So I was not prepared to do any sort of like training. And we literally just did weight training. Like I didn't even have my running legs with me. And I think it was her husband that challenged me in ways that I hadn't felt since I lost my legs.

And someone that for the first time didn't treat me like a person that had a disability. Like he saw me for me as a person and he wanted to challenge me in ways and wanted to find out and push me to see what I can do. And I decided in the last night out, we had a wild night out to like finish the holiday training camp and we made a bet. So he said, if you were to move to the U.S. I called you for gold medal. And I thought, if you were to move to the U.S., I call it tree for gold medal. And I thought, well, every good decision is made on a wild night out. For sure.

Agreed. Right. So I signed the deal and I went back to Germany to quit my full-time job and I sold everything that I owned and I moved to Oklahoma City and lived off my savings for the next four years. How old were you when you did that? 22. Okay, so really young still.

Yeah, wow. Left everything behind, living off my savings. Not even mentioned my parents quitting my well-paid job to do something that wasn't really that great at. What were you doing for work at the time? I was an editor at a TV channel. So I was working big hours, doing something that I actually loved doing.

So I wasn't even like leaving a job that I didn't like, but actually, yeah, leaving something behind that actually was really passionate about. Did your parents try and talk you out of it? They didn't. And I think that's what I really admire about my parents is like looking back now over all these years of parenting, they never told us not to do something. Like, no matter how stupid the decisions were that we made, they always supported us. And we always knew that if it didn't work out, we could come home and help us figure it out. Except for the hitchhiking thing. Didn't support that one, that's for sure. No, they'll probably never forgive me that one.

But they were always there for us. They always let us make our own decisions. Four years in Oklahoma training for the next Olympics. Okay, which was what year would that be? So that would have been 2012 I moved there and then preparing for the Rio Games in 2016. And was Scott in the picture, who's now your husband? No, he actually wasn't.

I only met him in 2013, the year after. So I met him at a competition in London out of all places. So I never would have met him if I would have retired from sport. I never would have. There you go. It's all falling into place. Isn't it? Was it love at first sight?

Isn't it? Well, if you ask him, I think he had an eye on me since we started competing. And like, I think we first met in 2011 and I knew he was there. I mean, it's a small world, like in competition world, you kind of know who's there, especially those guys that are in the shot for medals. But it wasn't until we had a quick conversation, we both won a medal at that competitions. We were both sitting in a room waiting for a medal ceremony.

Who had the better placement. Scott was definitely the more successful one. He would love that, makes it easier. No, it was great. We became Facebook friends after, which was a big thing back then. Like, I mean, not as many. The Facebook, yep. The Facebook, that was great. We became Facebook friends after, which was a big thing back then. Like, I mean, I mean, the Facebook, yeah.

And then I always think it must be such a difficult conversation to have when you're an athlete, when you're thinking, when will I have kids, knowing what impact it has on your career? How was that conversation between you and Scott? It's so interesting, because like when we first met, I was actually the one, like, I don't actually know if I want kids.

Okay. So I don't think I was there yet and I don't think I was there to decide. Like I wasn't necessarily a baby person, if that makes sense. Like a lot of females my age were like doting on little babies. And I was like, I thought they were cute,

but I was always happy to give them back. Yeah. Ash knows the feeling. Still the feeling. And I think it wasn't until like many years down the road when Scott and I were a thing and we were already married that I was like, actually,

maybe I do want this and I found the right person. What year did you get married? Oh my God. I think 2018 we got married. So you've been together for five years? Yeah, we became

officially a thing in 2014. And then we I moved to Australia in 2016, just after the games. And we got engaged a year after. So do you have to then map out competitions and dates to figure out when would be the best window to start trying then to fall pregnant, knowing how much time you're going to have away from the sport? We actually mapped out when we got married to when we would fit in between competitions. It's so funny, like that's how sport works because you're so like always in the schedule of sport,

but you kind of try to fit it in. We didn't really talk about kids up until after Tokyo, because I think we were both so immersed and so focused on our careers that we didn't really think that far. And we just, you know, we're just trying to not have kids up until then. Because like Tokyo was a weird period where we all had to go to quarantine on the way home after the games. And so that was the first time we actually had the conversations like, do you maybe want to try to not not have kids? And well, 10 months post quarantine, we had a baby.

So didn't go well. And well, 10 months post quarantine, we had a baby. So you can do the math. Didn't go well. Yeah, it seems it was more than a conversation. Yeah. When you're talking about pregnancy, how often are you speaking to your GP about what impact pregnancy will have on your body? So funny you ask that, because ever since I moved to Australia,

I never had a GP because I was always an athlete. So we have a medical system at our training center. So I had essentially confirmed my pregnancy going to the sport doctor doing a blood test. And so it was a really awkward conversation to have because I'm expected to be there to perform. And at that point being there was no policy in place. So I didn't know how that was going to go down.

Like, am I going to lose my funding? Am I going to lose access to all these facilities, including my doctor and everyone involved. And so it was really interesting because I felt like almost like a big part of me, which was me, the athlete was kind of like almost jeopardized by me, the wish of wanting a family and actually now starting a family. So it was really interesting to start the conversation. And my doctor was amazing.

He's like, well, obviously it's like with me and you have to decide yourself when you want to, you know, share the news. But just in that time period being there happened to be two other athletes that were still currently competing that were also pregnant. And so my organization athletics decided to actually introduce a pregnancy policy. Wow, that is huge. Yeah. So all of a sudden we actually did have a safe space to not only share the news,

but actually feel supported. It seems crazy. There wasn't a policy before. Yeah, it is. Cause like there's sport like netball and basketball. They figured out like years ago that if they want to send the best team, they have to find a way to, you know, allow moms to return back to the sport. Because otherwise they won't have the best athletes there.

Athletics for a long time, they just always had other people. So I feel like there was almost like a big turnover of people that either had a career or decided to move on to have a family. I think there was very limited amount of athletes that decided to do both. And I think it has really changed because I think now the organisation realised, you know, we're all peaking and 20s, early 30s. So if you want to send the best athletes, they actually have to allow those athletes to stay in their sport for as long as they can and as long as they want to.

At that point, how long do you continue training up until? To be honest, like in my first trimester, like I felt so unwell and I think a lot of females do and it's like, oh my God, I'd just rather sit on the couch and feel sick and then I realised I might as well be running and feel sick. Cause like, I don't know, sitting on the couch. Sounds amazing. But like my, um, the first trimester, like feeling unwell didn't go away. So it wasn't just, you know, the initial like morning sickness, like I was sick

every day of pregnancy until the end. And I actually trained all throughout pregnancy because that was the one thing that actually made me feel better out of all things. So I ran until 26 weeks. Um, and then I was just too round and too big to fit in my running legs. That was the end of that. But I did water running until the day before I gave birth. So I actually, what's water running?

Yeah. So you put like a big belt on, like a floaty belt, and then you can just run in the water. So essentially you still do floating. Oh, that's it. Yeah. There you go. So deep water, water running, water running.

We'll have to check that out. I was going to say, we actually run on top of the water. Yeah, yes. No, not quite. Not quite. And then how did your body react to the change of pregnancy?

It was like a big learning experience for everyone because like I'm missing both of my legs. So most of like females get a lot of like liquids in their legs. So like where was it going to go for me? Yeah. Like I still have the same amount of swelling.

It just went everywhere else. So like I was already out of my normal walking legs after 12 weeks of pregnancy. Oh my goodness. I had so much swelling so I had to get new sockets made, new prosthetics made. And I went through three sockets in the pregnancy. So three pairs of prosthetics. Three pairs. Just like to deal with all like the swelling and

the different point of like balance. Like that was really challenging. Yeah, true. And we warned by like, by anybody leading into like, this is what's going to happen or just have to adapt. No, we didn't really know because we didn't really know anyone that had a really similar circumstance because a lot of people with my impairment usually are in a wheelchair. So a lot of people aren't on their feet like I am and because I'm so active and I've always, always been running. So I'm just used to being like on

my feet and doing all these exercises and running. So the moment I stopped doing that, all of a sudden my body starts to change and like losing the core function was almost like the hardest bit because that's what I need to be like standing and walking. And it was a big learning curve and like I had to fall back on using crutches towards the end and then even using my wheelchair the last few weeks leading into birth. So it was yeah, it was quite interesting. I can imagine it would have been close to the end, then would have been really uncomfortable. I mean, our wives would have felt very uncomfortable.

I hit the 30 week mark and was like, he needs out. Get it out. And he came a bit early. Thank God. Oh, thank goodness. Was birth smooth sailing though for you? It actually was. So I don't know if it's just like a screwed memory

because you don't memorize pain really, but like I found the pregnancy so much harder than giving birth. Like I keep saying, I would do birth again, but like the pregnancy, I think someone else can do that for me. I had a really good birth and we ended up having an epidural and that was the best decision ever

because it puts so much calmness into the whole process and we had a really positive experience. I remember someone said to us, they were like, make sure you get the Epi early on because you don't want to get to the point where it's too late. So were you like, give it to me now? Yeah, I want it now. So funny though, I'm not sure if you know the process, but like you're already in labor, right?

But you have to sit on the bed and get that massive needle in the back. Yeah. And then they do like a test to see if the epidural is working so you don't feel pain, but you can still move. And she told me to like move, like flex my leg up. And my husband like looked around the corner and was like, that's not going to work. That's so funny. I thought you were going to say, they said, will you dose?

Wow. I do recall that big needle and it's traumatizing for me. I can't imagine how traumatizing it is for mom. When do you start training again then? I started my first water running session, I think two weeks post birth. Two weeks? Two weeks. And I think that is right, the time where a lot of females

would start going on walks with their little bubs. But I couldn't do that yet. Yeah. Because I was still recovering and I couldn't fit my legs. So I think I saw the recovery process in the water and it was really nice. And I started running again, I think 10 weeks post giving birth. And it was really just a trot. But it was so nice. And it was actually so lovely just to return back to something that was just me. Logistically, when you have a newborn, what makes it so much harder when you don't have the ability to just, you know, if baby's crying, just to like quickly go in and care for them? How much harder are those types of areas of parenting? It was really challenging the early stages because I was still recovering as well from

birth and like I still didn't fit in my normal legs and like my husband is on one leg so like between the two of us like it sucks but like the person with one leg has to go first. Just a little bit quicker putting one leg on and I still remember like our Baba was a colleague baby so he did not sleep and he just screamed cried for the first six months of his life. And so I still remember my husband butt naked, like doing squats, because that was the only thing that helped him from crying.

But I had this big dream of like, you know, I recover and after so many weeks, I'll be doing like this big walks with the pram, with the baba and he hated the pram altogether. So he never ever sat in it or laid in it so it was just literally having him in the carrier 24-7 and walking laps around the kitchen aisle at 2 a.m. so that was something. The pram is like for me anyway he was like when all else fails I'm gonna put baby in the pram and just that emotion would soothe her. We were the same as you that hated the pram. Hated the pram and the car seat. I always heard about people putting the kid in the car

so you didn't drive. Traumatizing. It was. Do you remember one of the first competitions when you were back after giving birth and you brought Mateo along? Yeah, that was an experience itself because, like, I mean, he was always there for training, right?

But he was a colic baby, so he was not really settled and you could never like lay him down anywhere. So it was always just like trying to manage him while training and my husband is my coach. So he was managing Matteo as well as me. But then we went to our first nationals and that would have been like maybe seven months post-birth. And we had lots of people there that could help,

that could hold Matteo, but he hated it. Cause like he could see me and he couldn't come to me. Couldn't get to. And like if, you know, athletics, like it's not as, you know, just doing one run, like as a long jump competition, you go to call room, then you go like that takes half an hour, then you go compete for an hour. So it's like a long process. And a Matteo saw me and then realized he's maybe hungry and then be like, he

was just like screaming murder the entire time because he did not want to be helped by any of these people. He just wanted to be with mom. And it was so distracting because I was like, I could literally hear him at the start of the runway, like trying to focus on the competition. And I still remember today, like how challenging it was

because like as a breastfed baby, like the mom hears the cry and the milk shoots in. Oh, you say it's a lactate. Yeah, because like you hear the baby crying. So the body knows it wants food. But like at that point being like already had like tried to like put everything up tight. So like it is like tucked away.

But like, oh, my God, it was so uncomfortable. It was horrible. Oh, my God. That is so unfair. I know, isn't it? Women have to go through this in Mendo. I know, I know. And like, what did you place in that competition? Do you remember?

I won national. That's great. I actually done really well and I qualified to go to World Champs. Oh, that's great. So it was great. Maybe a bit of lactating helps. Maybe. Maybe it's performance enhancing lactating. I have to ask Scott about that one.

I think there's actually some evidence saying that people like females returning back to sport after birth are actually having a second wind in their career. You're like super mum. Like seriously. You know when they talk about mum strength, that mum who lifts the car above the toddler. Well, it kind of like you look at your stats and you're proving

that correct. It shows how important it is to like allow people to do that. Like not just in sport, but like in any career, like you can really use like the things that shape you as as mum to to be better at your profession. I always find it interesting with athletes, especially with the Olympics, because you're like there's so many different factors that could impact you being at your absolute best leading into that competition. The Paralympics is just, it's the pinnacle, right? For yourself. How was your lead up into that comp?

Well, this year went really well and it was based on last year going really shit. I think we did like our first major competition as a mom last year, going to world championships, which also happened to be in Paris. So it was a really good test round. Oh, cool. And we got to the other end of competition. So this was not right. Like this was a horrible experience.

Just talk us through that. I think it was a, like I've never been a parent before, right? So I don't know what I'm doing. So like taking this little teeny human with me on a big trip overseas to try work in a team environment and trying to compete. Like, you know, they tell you like the day and the time, and that's when you have to compete. Like, the team did their best to...

You're like, can we make it over nap time? The hardest bit was because like the, because it was the evening competition. So it's in the middle of what I'm doing, like the nighttime feed. So like we were trying to work out, can I take my breast pump into the call room? Like, can I do like a last minute like feed just before?

And you can't do any of that. So you have to really try and to adjust your breastfeeding times, like leading into the competition. And it's like some of those things where it's like, it was really difficult. And Matteo now is a really good sleeper, but he always knew when I was competing. And the night before comp was when he was partying.

Like there was no sleep to be had between us. It was a big learning experience. Like I actually really lean into trusting what we think is right for us and not relying on the team to set up an environment for you as a family, because no one knows what you need other than yourself. And B is actually lean into support network. And actually this time I had my mum there and a couple of friends there that could help with the little ones.

So don't try to do it yourself because it's, it's impossible to do. Yeah, I bet. So you previously competed at other Paralympics. So you've done Tokyo, you've done London, you've done Rio as well. Is it all pretty similar in terms of when you're competing, you're standing there in the stadium, is there a bit of muscle memory where you're like, oh, this feels like the last one or are they all really different? They're all really unique. And like my first, like my first big one was in London. And that was one of those Paralympics. I was still like, it's still in the history books.

Like you walk into the stadium filled with 80,000 people and it took your breath away. And it was my first big competition. So I was so overwhelmed with like the impressions and the emotions and being there. And it's still something that sticks to me today because it gives me goosebumps to be honest, to think about it.

And then Rio was like the games where I felt like I was on the top of my games and I had these massive expectations for myself. So I was really nervous about it and I was like really focused on the performance and it was almost like my healing competition from London and walking away with the gold and the silver was really special. And then Tokyo was so odd because there was no one in the stadium, right? Yeah, that would have been really weird. That's it, but I had my husband there

because he was an athlete himself. So I got to have my loved one there, which was special. And then this time around having Matteo and Scott in the stadium, like that was nuts. Like it just reminded me of the journey that we had like the last three years of like pregnancy and coming back to the sport and like winging parenthood parenting.

And yeah, that was just very different. And I think this time around, I felt the pressure up until before my first jump, and then I stood on the runway and just all the pressure fell off. Like I felt like I was just accomplished like what I wanted to accomplish, just being there and coming back from pregnancy and returning to the sport. And yeah, I fell on top of my game. Your very first jump was a good one. When I say good, I'm selling it short because it's a world record.

Wow. When you're running down about to take off at any point, are you thinking this one feels like it's gonna be fucking great? Oh, you know, you know, it's like, I felt the takeoff, it's like, yep, that's it. Like I knew it was a good jump. And I think it just all came together because I think the pressure fell off

and I felt like so in control of what I was doing. And we know practices almost every day. So like, I kind of know what I'm doing, but when you get nervous, it's really hard. And I think this time around, I felt so, I feel like I felt so in control. And yeah, it was, it was amazing. How many times do you have to jump over the course of a Paralympic competition? So you have three jumps, and then the top eight have another three jumps, but you can

win and lose in the first jump essentially. So every jump counts. So you could say your world record jump, you could not jump it just say that's the leading jump you could not jump the rest of the competition and still win. Yeah. So you could just do it once and other people could do it like what six arms or something like that. To be honest I think in the first jump because I jumped so big the first round I think I ruined the girls' night and that first jump. I think I ruined the girls' night and that first stop. Yeah, yeah.

Thanks, Vanessa. Because I think you start just trying to chase it. And if someone jumps big, you're trying to counter it. And you can't help but to compete, right? And all of a sudden you forget everything that you did in the last few years of training. And so I think it was quite hard for the other girls. It's such an amazing achievement. And I have to say, well done. Like to be a multiple gold medalist at a Paralympics,

but also to smash your own world record is just unbelievable. Thanks guys. Wow. How did the family take the win? That's what we want to know. No, they were pumped. It was such a good experience.

Hang on, Vanessa, Were they all pumped? Because there's a video that you posted on social media, which is the most relatable clip imaginable. I know, yeah. It's of Matteo and his reaction to you winning gold. Oh, that was so funny. Because he loved the competition. Like, it was so different to, like, the first nationals,

where he's not old enough to appreciate it. He loves it. He knows, like, Mommy will be'll be like with him again shortly. But he did amazing until at the victory ceremony, which was about an hour after the competition. My Japanese competitor gifted him a little matchbox car. Very generous. Which was really kind, because she didn't medal

and it wasn't a great night for her. But then he dropped it and it rolled under the stands. And we couldn't get it. Scott asked one of the security guys and they couldn't help him. And then right after the victory ceremony, I just had the gold medal around my neck still. And I was on my hands and knees

trying to find this matchbox car. Cause like for him, it didn't matter. I won that gold medal. I didn't care at all, right? He wanted it. That is not your mom, mate. Mom fixes things. Mom fixes things.

Mom couldn't fix it that night. He was carried out kicking and screaming. Oh, wow. It was so devastating, but we got it back. Okay. Okay, wow. Good news. We got it back.

A photographer crawled under the stands the next day and he sent me a photo of the car and it was the best moment. Was Matteo like, nah, I don't want it anymore. I moved on. No, no, he's still in the top pocket of his shirt every day. So he still loves it. I suppose that's how he'll remember that moment.

Like, I forgot my car back. You know your mum won gold. Doesn't matter. I got the car back. So now are you thinking, look, I've, I've had such an amazing career. I've had so much success. Are you like, I'm going to hang the shoes up or are you going to still compete?

That's a good question. I think at this present moment, I don't step away from it just yet. I think it's going to be really difficult to say, like, I'm going to go for the next games in LA because it's still four years to go, right? It's a long time, but I still love this. I still love the sport and like, Mateo is still part of it.

And it's like, we all love this journey together. So, and I'm still getting better. Like, I'm still winning. You're getting better? I'm still getting better. Oh my goodness. So, I'm still improving. And I think I couldn't forgive myself in stepping away

and never knowing what I'm capable of. So I think I want to go until like my body had enough or whether I'm like maybe jumping the six meter. That'd be pretty cool. Oh, is that the goal? That would be the big goal. To hit it, to jump over six meters. That's it, that's a big job.

Is the current world record 543? 545. 545. You're good. 545. 545. You're good. 545? Okay, well, I'll be watching. I think it is possible. I'll be watching.

I don't know if this happens, but other people who have been a similar scenario to yourself when you were 15 and that accident, do many of them reach out to you and ask for help or guidance with their situation? All the time. And I think that's the beauty that we have these days, like with social media, I mean, it has some downsides, but this is our side. Yeah.

Like we can see things like so much more easily and we can just reach out, right? We can just send a DM and like, we usually get a response within a couple hours. So like, it's so special being able to do that. And I now have like a handful of athletes that I talk to like really regularly. And there's actually a little Dutch athlete that we've like guided since he was like,

I think 14. And he ended up winning a gold medal this year at the Games. Wow. It's so amazing to see like these athletes grow up and shows how old I am. There used to be 12 years or 14 years and now I was like there and winning gold medals. What event did he win? Long jump. Oh, it was long jump as well. Wow.

We always, like both my husband and I, we always send out messages, like young athletes coming through, like if you want a hand, if you want help, if you want to have like a conversation about how to set up a leg or what to do, like feel free just to reach out. And he was one of those ones that actually responded and said,

yeah, let's do this and let's find a way. Having that impact on such a young person for them to go through and win a gold must feel amazing. I think it was also really good karma because he came last year to train with us in Australia and he was on like really crappy technology on his walking leg. And it's like, hold on, I still have like something like, we have like a leg cupboard in our garage. A leg cupboard?

A leg cupboard, yeah. There's like all sorts of different leg parts in there, but just in case, like that we keep. And there was one of my old legs that was still really functional and really well usable. So we gifted him that leg, which is like $150,000 leg. Wow. Holy shit.

That's probably cost more than an actual human leg, I reckon. If you were to buy one on the black market. That's a lot of money. I know, they're so expensive, but he won the gold medal and he walked onto the podium with that leg on. Cause he's still working on that.

I just got goosebumps. It was like I'm in a movie. It was so special because it was like before I competed. So it was like, oh my God, I already had like one of her legs on the podium. So that was really cool. Does that want to make you become a coach then do you think later on? Oh, good question.

I don't think so. I don't think I bring the amount of patience needed. I think that's all useful, my own son. My husband is great at it and I'm more than happy to do like some guidance and some mentoring, but like coaching. Yeah, you can be there to inspire. That's it. It seems to work.

I'm there for a chat. Or lend a leg. Do you notice that does Scott parent in a similar way to how he coaches? He does. He's amazing and like he was the person that made me want to be a parent because I know like he's got to bring all the aspects that are simply lack like patience and he's so calm with, you know, all the big tantrums and the big emotions. Like he's so good in the way that he deals with that,

both with me and my toddler and like sport, I guess such a interesting environment where the emotions like always ride like a roller coaster with you, like throughout the competition as well as the season, like going through injuries and all the different hiccups that happen and he's always so calm through all of it and being able to deal with it in a way that allows me to chase my goals and a little one to be yeah it really switched on a little toddler. Yeah a bit of a super team action going on at your

house. Before we started recording you mentioned that this week in particular is gonna be a big one for you because Mateja was heading off somewhere. Mateja was starting daycare this week. Big mom moment. How does that feel? Look, the first day of dropping him off, like we had a horrible morning. He was just so feral and I was so happy just to drop him off and someone else to deal with it. I feel like there was going to be tears,

but not on that day. And that day I was just really happy just to get a haircut and have a bit of free time. But now definitely the emotions are set in because he was part of every bit of this journey. Like he was there almost every training session and it was so lovely to have him around. Like I love this little man.

Yeah, you go through a lot of days where it's like, oh, I like to have him around today. And it's like then some days I'll just drop him off. Yeah. Thanks. That's most days for me, if I'm being really honest. You also did come here with something very special. Did you say it?

Which I really, really want to see it. I'm actually a little bit sweaty. Just for those listening who can't actually see what I'm seeing, there is... Oh my goodness. It is a gold medal from Paris 2024. It's very heavy. It is. I definitely know it's a real deal.

Like that's not a knockoff. It's not a knockoff. I know. Oh my gosh. Oh my god. I've never touched... I've't touch the gold medal either. Yeah. So, congratulations. This is amazing. I am, I have goosebumps that I get to sit here in front of you and hold this. So, when you look at the front, so the dark bit,

that's the piece of the Eiffel Tower. No. So, you got to take a piece home, which is so cool. That's a nice touch. It is a nice touch. Well done, Paris. Did you know in the Athletic Stadium, so you know they're renovating the Notre Dame after the burn that they had. Yeah.

So while they're renovating it, they're put the big bell into the Athletic Stadium. So every person that won the competition got to ring the bell. The bell. And they're just really good, aren't they? They are. Some people are very clever. And like, if this is part of it, So every person that won the competition got to ring the bell. Yeah. So, and this is very good.

Some people are very clever and like, if this is part of it, so everyone got one. I did see the Eiffel Tower the other day. It's on a slight. It's not as tall as it was, but that is unbelievable. And thank you so much for bringing that in. And then on the other side, it's basically if you stand underneath the tower, that's the view up. That is true. That is the view. And then you have written in Braille, Paris 2024.

Yeah, that's sort of everything. Because you have people that are visual impaired, right? Of course, yeah. So they can't see. And then they have like a tiny little dot on the side as well. So the one dot is for the gold. That's Braille for gold. Yeah. Otherwise you could just hand the bronze and you know, they would never know. Yeah, just a heavy piece of metal.

No, that's awesome. Thank you so much for bringing that in. I'm going to keep it if you don't mind. Before you go Vanessa, we always ask our guests, when Mateja was a young man, he's no longer living at home, he's flown the nest. What's the one thing you would like him to remember about the house that he grew up in? I hope he remembers. I was always like, you could always show up as your full self. Like I think the door is always open. Like we always have so many random people drop in and everyone is just welcome. I think that's what he remembers.

I hope that, you know, just the feeling of walking in, feeling welcome, feeling you could like show up as your whole self. Don't have to hide who you are, but just show up the way that you are. And I'm sure he's also gonna, to add to that, be so proud of his mum. Oh, absolutely. I really hope that, I mean, at the moment, he's probably still too young to understand, but I hope that we get past that age

where he's embarrassed by us. Yeah. And then back to the stage where we can show him the medals and show him that we were actually cool one day. Guarantee he's going to be very proud. And I appreciate you so much coming in. It's a real privilege to sit in front of you and have this conversation and hold a gold medal.

The closest I'll ever get to one. Even though I'm in my mid thirties, I still think maybe I could be an athlete. That's just a dream. Thanks for having me guys. Love your podcast. Schön, dass ihr kennenzulernen. Wiedersehen. Bis bald. Very good. See you later.

Is that what he said? Close enough. I can't believe how heavy the metal was. And I can't believe you stole it from Vanessa. She doesn't need to know that. I've replaced it with something equally as heavy. One of Macy's nappies. If you've enjoyed this episode or any episode from Two Doting Dads we would absolutely love it. So would Vanessa. She said make sure you tell everyone to leave a review and I said Vanessa I would love

to tell them that. In those exact words and she also said make sure you join us on socials on Instagram or Facebook. The Facebook group is booming with full of potential athletes. Vanessa did say she would be in tears if you didn't. Exact words, we are not paraphrasing whatsoever. So don't do it for us. Do it for Vanessa. Do it for the country. Do it for the nation. Goodbye. See you guys later. Bye. See you guys later. Bye.