Two Hot Takes - 15: Family.. The Good, The Bad, The Ugly

Episode Date: May 6, 2021

TW: child death  Two Hot Takes host, Morgan, is joined by guest co-host Alejandra! This episode is about families.. and how dramatic they can be. Stories include a mother who married her fiancé's father before they could walk down the aisle, a woman whose MIL harassed her at her child's funeral, a woman whose older brother tried to kiss her, and a girl whose best friend was sleeping with her dad!  BE SURE TO CHECK OUR PATREON FOR THE DEEP DIVE! The stories from this theme were so good, and the deep dive that will be dropping on our Patreon is sure to not disappoint. See you there!  Show your support (much appreciated): https://www.patreon.com/TwoHotTakes  Full length Video episodes available on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/c/TwoHotTakes

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It's everything you need to make a podcast all in one place. Download the free Anchor app or go to anchor.fm to get started. So I went on this little lunch date today with a new friend, and first of all, making new friends at 27 is the most stressful thing in the world. But there was a fucking horse walking down the street, and it showed up to this little cafe we were at. Burbank, California? Oh, that doesn't surprise me. Really? I feel like there's horses up north.

Not that that's up north, but north of LA. Oh, I guess, yeah, Griffith Park. People have horses around there. I was blown away. I was so surprised. Like a horse was just on the street? Two, yeah. One guy was riding one of the horses, and then leading the other one, it's called Ponying.

And I was just like, oh my god, I was in the middle of trying to make friends. Did you react, or did you get the act like you weren't excited? No, no, no. I fell blown, told her I was a horse girl. Okay, so she knew. Did you wear that shirt too, just to really hammer home? I didn't wear the shirt, but now I regret not. Hey, I'm a horse girl, and you're wearing that shirt.

I know, I showed her. I have a picture of my horse and me on my debit card. Oh yeah, that's right. I showed her that. I was the most embarrassing I've ever been in my life. No, I'm sure her debit card's like a dog. It's a picture of her. It was so funny.

Oh, it was, just her? Yeah, it's like a funny college picture. I tell people that I was drunk when I did it, but I wasn't. That is so funny. Yeah, you'll love her. She's going to be a good new friend. Good. But like you said, let's fucking ride.

Let's talk about these crazy families. I can't wait. Okay, let's just dive in. Crazy families. Hi guys, welcome back to another episode of Two Hot Takes. I'm your host, Morgan. And I'm Alejandra. Back at it again with my three Pete.

I'm here for my three Pete. Technically it might be on four though. But this is three, right? This might be the third topic for you. Oh, okay. There we go. Fair enough. Welcome back.

Thanks. You've been missed. Feels good to be back. Families, we all have them. They're good. They're bad. They're ugly. But is it truly family if there's no drama involved?

No. I don't think so either. Not in my world. I really, I don't think so. I think like there's drama is like family's middle name or whatever you want to say. I don't know. I'm trying to. Wait, hold on.

What is family's middle name? Family drama? I don't know. I was trying to be funny. Family is drama's middle name. Wait, what? Hold on. Say it again.

Drama is family's middle name. Okay. That's my bad. No, it doesn't work as much as I wanted it to. Drama and family go hand in hand. They truly do. They do. Did you just pick your family?

You can't. But sometimes you can because like my dad. I, my mom kind of just picked him because he was super nice. Like my, like I have my biological dad and my adoptive dad who you'll also meet in this family theme. Oh yeah. He's going to be, he's going to be coming on the pod. But yeah, I don't know.

I kind of like, you'll be my kid's fun aunt. I can't wait. I'm already such a fucking fun. If I, if I decide to go down that road, I'm still, you know, we through. We've talked about that. Yeah. We haven't decided. Teeter taught her a lot.

A lot of our generation is, it's tough. I don't know. I think I'll, most people still talk about having kids. I don't know. Most. Yeah. You know, it is, but maybe people talk about it because it's socially like normal. Trying to fit in.

Yeah. Like cause yeah. And then they hold it in that they deep down inside. They don't want to have kids, but they're not going to like talk about that. They don't want to be socially ostracized. Yeah. Of course. You just want to blend in.

Yeah. So families. They're, they're great. They suck. They're amazing sometimes and supportive. And then others, they're just a nightmare to say the least. To say the least. So some of these stories are good.

Some of them not so good. I'm guessing more of the latter. There's a lot of toxic families on Reddit. Yeah. And fortunate for us because these stories are just wild. Okay. Let's do it. Here we go.

Strap in. That's all for getting mad about my mom marrying my fiance's dad. Mom marrying what? These always like our brain games for me. I'm like, I have to sit there and like think about the Genesis. I'm like, okay. So I'm assuming they're doing that before they get married. That's weird.

I 24 female and my fiance 24 male have been together since our sophomore year of college. So around five years now. For context, my mom, 50 female had an affair with a coworker when I was 16, leading to my parents divorce. She has been single ever since going on dates, but no serious relationships. I have a good relationship with my dad and his new wife. Sadly, my fiance's mom passed two years ago due to cancer. And his dad, 53 male has been single since my fiance proposed last year,

but our wedding was delayed due to COVID. Our families had never met up to this point because his family lives in South Carolina. Whereas we're in North Carolina where we went to college around a three hour drive away from his dad. Three months ago in January, 2021, we decided it was time to have our families meet for the first time to discuss our upcoming wedding in June of 2021. My dad and his wife, my fiance's dad and my mom all met at our place to meet and discuss the wedding. This went well, albeit there was some tension between my mom and my dad. They're divorced, so yeah, makes, makes sense.

Yeah. This morning out of the blue, my mom called me and announced that she had eloped. I was shocked. Hold on. Okay, just keep reading. I'll let you finish. I was shocked as she had not been dating anyone to my knowledge. Upon questioning, it turns out that she and my fiance's dad had been dating in secret since that meeting in January

and had married in secret yesterday, making my fiance my step-brother. I can't believe this is a question. This is so sad because it's like this just goes to show, like there's some situations where I'm so in the right and I know it. Yeah. But when people make you feel bad, you genuinely are like, am I the asshole? You know what I mean? Yeah. I'm sitting here like, what?

You are not the asshole, but then I'm sure in her head she's been made to feel bad, so she's like, fuck, am I the asshole? Yeah. Especially if her mom is gaslighting her. No, you're not the asshole being a toxic mother. That somehow got worse than I could have expected. Yeah. What? Uh-huh.

Okay, so I'm sure there's more. I want to throw up just thinking about this. She said that I should now cancel my wedding because it would be inappropriate to marry my step-brother. The audacity. The audacity. After she's been married, would she say five years? Five years. Five years and they finally like joined forces to plan this wedding.

Yeah. And then she falls in love with him during that wedding planning session. It's been like how long since they actually met. Yeah, like maybe, when was this written in April? This was written in, I believe, March. So she said like we had a meeting three months ago. Three months ago. Three months of secretly dating.

And secretly. So it's not even like, how serious can you get with someone when you're secretly dating them? I don't think that's serious. Because you have to shut off so many parts of your life, like your kids to them. Yeah. Not all of your environments and your contacts are going to be influencing your life. Yeah. So if it's a secret.

Exactly. What? And then she comes, and says you need to cancel your wedding. I'd be like. Bitch, you need to go get in an annulment. I can't believe that. She like beat her to the punchline. She did it on purpose.

100%. Yeah. For sure. She was like, shit, the clock is ticking. June is right on the corner. We got to go. We got to go. We got to tie the knot.

Courthouse wedding just to, to seal the deal. Oh my God. I can't believe that. I know. I'm absolutely horrified. I shouted at my mom saying she just loves ruining my life and called her selfish. First she cheated on my dad and now she went and married my fiance's dad. Oh my gosh.

Knowing full well, I was about to marry my fiance. My mom then said I was still young and I'd have the chance to meet someone new. But she's old and quote, has to take every opportunity she's got. And so I was an ungrateful bitch for not approving of her marriage. She then accused me of wanting her to die alone. This is someone with a victim complex. Yeah. I'm shocked.

I'm genuinely shocked at this. That's, I don't even have words. Both of them would be uninvited. I would go. Yeah. I would 100% like whatever your fiance wants to do about his dad. Yeah. That's true.

I wonder how he feels. Yeah. That's fine and dandy, but like my mom, I would not talk to my mom if she put this shit. I don't even know what I would think because that's like, it's no, it's deeper than this. It's I'm like questioning who my mom even is, I think. Yeah. I'd be like, who are you?

Like, I don't know. You're very core like principles and morals. Yeah. So if you can do this to your own, your own daughter, like, you know, what else are you capable of? I don't know. That just freaks me out. The mom is so only thinking about herself.

And I feel like as a parent, you typically put your child above yourself. Yeah. So if that means like, I just think, I think about my mom and like most moms who are like my daughter can marry like true love is rare and it sometimes only comes around once in a lifetime. So if you really find that person sometimes, and I don't want to be pessimistic, like you can't find it again. But like if you're someone, a mother and your daughter has found a true love and she wants

to marry him, that should like take priority and everything. Like you'd be like, well, then I guess I'm going to die alone. Like I feel like my mom would be like your wants. Yeah. Like I'll die alone. Then if that means my daughter gets to marry the love of her life because I unfortunately fucked up in my first marriage, but I'm not going to give my daughter the same like path. Like she has this like, this great opportunity and good for her and I'll die alone if that

means that I like she gets to have the love of her life, you know? Yeah. And I think like to your point, I think there's some parents that live for their children. Like my mom and you know, our relationship has been like tumultuous at times and like obviously raised in a teenage daughter is never fun and easy. But at the end of the day, like I know my mom would go to bat for me. She would take a like to take a bullet. She would lay herself down on like, at the end of the day, like she's definitely not

what you would consider like a toxic mom, like this fucking lady. Yeah. This is like a whole nother level of toxic and selfish. It's like she's clearly selfish. And I know it's like almost toxic to say, well, you know, as a parent, why do you have to put your kid above you? But it's like, that's, that's typically how it works. That's like your child is big.

You always want your child to have it better than you had. So it's like no offense to this woman, but she kind of like sabotaged her first marriage by cheating. That was a choice. And if she wasn't happy in the marriage, then that's one thing, but like she did that. She made that decision to, you know, kind of ruin the marriage and her daughter has this like fresh chance. You know what I mean?

It's love. Yeah. No, it's, it's love. They, I mean, they met in college. Yeah. They've been dating for five years. Like this is the beginning of her life. Yeah.

Like, wouldn't you want her and your daughter to have it better than you did? You know? Instead of being like, I'm going to die alone. You have all the time in the world. It's like, what if she doesn't find anyone else and now your daughter dies alone because of your decision? Yeah. She's got, she's got a lot more life to live.

Yeah. That doesn't make any sense. Not to be like crass, but I think too, like when you decide to have children, you knowingly are signing up for sacrifice. You are sacrificing your freedom, your time, your energy, your money. You now are like committing to having another, raising another human. Yeah. And I think like in this case, it's like she had a kid, but like she's not committing

to that like role as a parent. Yeah. Yeah. That's actually true. It's like you, you chose this. Yeah. I didn't choose to be born. As funny as that line is.

I love that meme. As funny as that line is, like, I think, like I thought about it the other day when I was inside my mom. I'm like, I didn't, one of my mom was like, yeah, I have three kids and you're using all the energy. I was like, I didn't choose to be born. You allocate your resources better. Like if you, if I'm so energy sucking, like get it together.

I didn't choose to be born, let alone first. That's on you lady. Yeah. That's not on me. No. Sounds like you've energy management problems then. I fucking love that meme that's been circulating like literally word for word for what you said about not wanting to be born.

Yeah. It's like, I didn't ask for this life. Like literally. I didn't ask to be born and have to deal with capitalism and going to work every day. No, literally, no, but like, I, no one chose this life. No one chose to be born and then be forced to work a nine to five to pay your bills. Just grinding. Just like, I mean, I know that like there's a lot of other paths in life now, but like,

I did not ask to be born. It's like, you know what I mean? Like that line is like, it sounds so dramatic, but like, it is so true. It is so true. Like, I was about to just get off subject, but it's like, especially when like you hit your parents with something you learned from them and they get mad and it's like, Apple doesn't fall far from the tree. Exactly.

I'm like, there's a line that's like, you are the one who helped raise this monster. So it's like, I learned this somewhere, right? Like this behavior was learned. I didn't just come out of the womb like sassy, right? Yeah. It's an argument too. Like nature versus nurture. Yeah, for sure.

Some people do come out the womb just choosing violence. That's true. I actually might have kind of, I think about it twice. You're a feisty gal. Yeah. I've always been that way though. So it's like, my mom used to call me grumpy cat because she said I would like sit around the house just like grumpy.

Oh my God. But I'd be like happy. I just looked grumpy. Yeah. All the time. I have a really bad RBF. Yeah. If you ever see me in public, I'm, I'm nice.

I promise. I'm not intimidating as, as I've been told by multiple people, I look very intimidating and scary, but it's like that thing that's like, looks like a blueberry will kill you. Looks like she'll kill you. Is a blueberry. Yeah. Or like it's not blueberry. It's like something else.

But I'm just like a little marshmallow. I'm just soft and vulnerable. I look like I'll kill you and I might, but likely not. No, you're a good friend. So OP goes on to say, I don't think I'm the asshole, but I just wanted to make sure because ultimately I don't want her to have to be alone even though I think she did this to herself by hurting my dad. I think I should be allowed to marry my fiance as we met first.

I'm also 12 weeks pregnant with my fiance's kid. Oh my God. So that complicates matters more. I haven't told anybody yet. Oh. Am I the asshole for being mad at my mom about marrying my fiance's dad because she said I couldn't marry my fiance anymore? Absolutely not the asshole.

Like is that? Yeah. That's your response. Yeah. No. Fuck the mom. It's a no, it's a no brainer. Like no, you are not the asshole for being mad at your mom for quite literally hijacking

your relationship. She is a terrorist. Yeah. I thought she hijacked this situation. It's insane. It's just so, so yeah, there's not really a good word for what she did because it's just despicable. It's so, yeah.

It's despicable. So beyond selfish and toxic, like even if a friend did this to you, it'd be fucked up. Like it'd be like okay. Like but family. But like family? No. No.

She does give another little edit. I don't know how much about whether it's legal to marry your stepbrother. So if someone could confirm that'd be great. And then another edit. Many update. We just called his dad. Apparently he sees no issue with my fiance and I staying together. It was my mom who had an issue.

Honestly, I still don't know how to feel about this because this still kind of feels gross to me. We'll probably be going low or no contact, fair. Not that it matters, but like that's just so awkward to have to explain to people. You know? Yeah. Like if you have like a wedding and then they're like, oh, like mother of the bride and then they're like father of the groom and then later they like, you know what I mean?

Like that's a weird dynamic. Now like, you have to explain to your friends and family and other people like, yeah, my husband's dad is married to my mom. I just want to even disclose it. It has come up somehow though. Yeah. Think about it if you're my friend and you're like, hey, and I'm like, hey, I'm hanging out with my family this weekend and you're like, oh, that's cute that Brett's dad is

coming along and you're like, so is my mom. Then you know, I think I'd just be outright. I'd be like, my mom's a toxic bitch and she secretly dated my fiance at the times. Dad. Yeah. And went and married him first. So then she tried to tell me I couldn't marry my stepbrother and told us to break up. Like I couldn't marry my stepbrother.

I would just be so outright and point blank. Like I would make people like anytime they met the mom then be like, oh, cringed. Because that's like, that's not a fun life either. Like bashing your mom, like even no matter how wrong she is, it can't be fun. It can't be fun or comfortable. No, it's hard. It's a stab in the back, the heart. Like it is terrible to have anyone betray you in that way, but your mother, you have

half that bitch's DNA. Oh, I'd be so hot. I just wouldn't be able to handle it. No. Top comment. Not going to lie. I laughed. Not the asshole, obviously.

In a big part, not because of your mom hooking up with your fiance's dad, but because she thinks that you mean, but because she thinks that means you should ditch your fiance. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. They're definitely both selfish and insane. Facts. Ah, so messed up.

Yeah. Not the asshole. That mom. No, no, no. I immediately know. I could have told you, you didn't even have to give me context. I could have just said no. We could have moved on.

Like there's no way. Done. Done. Point blank. Yes. Period. No debate. No debate.

What are the kids saying these days? Period. No cap. Printer. No facts. It's like wild. You're like what? And then they like stitch it on TikTok and they're like, is this English?

What are these kids saying? I'm 27 and I feel old. Yeah. Yeah. It's a little dicey on TikTok some days. Very thankful for it because it's brought a lot of you guys out there to the podcast, but it's a little dicey on that app sometimes. For sure.

This one is a little tear-jerker. Aw. The Invigorating Performance Machine is now at Tim Daly Mazda Murray, the 2024 Mazda CX90. And for a limited time, Tim Daly Mazda Murray has 3.9% financing on the 2024 Mazda CX90, making it so easy to get your new Mazda. So don't wait. Head to Tim Daly Mazda Murray today and get your brand new 2024 Mazda CX90 with 3.9%

financing and own your own Invigorating Performance Machine. We see some restrictions apply. All for based on 24 months. See dealer for complete details. Okay. A lot of awards, though. Oh, wow. Am I the asshole for refusing to attend an apology dinner after my mother-in-law called

me a bad mother at my son's funeral? Okay, that's tough, but I feel like I need to hear more. I lost my son to congenital heart disease and he did not survive the open heart surgery at the age of one year and six months. He was the greatest blessing I had in my life. Everyone kept telling me things will get easier with time. I know that no matter how much time goes by, I'll still be missing my baby and everything sweet about him.

Mother-in-law and I were in constant conflict. Things always been bad between us, but in those months we reached our limit. She kept getting involved in my son's treatment and criticized every decision I made claiming I didn't know how to handle my son's illness. We went low contact, but she kept causing issues occasionally. My husband was torn between our son's illness and his mother's issues. When my son passed away, she came to the funeral and caused a scene by arguing with me knowing I had no energy for it.

Oh my gosh, can't imagine. Wrong fucking place, lady. She used the fact that everyone was there so she could say it was my fault my son was born sick and I didn't take care of him properly, that I didn't listen to her when suggested other ways to treat his condition. Yeah, because I'm sure you know fucking more than the doctors, right? In that I was the one who took their grandchild away from them and caused them heartache. She then loudly called me a bad mother.

I had no idea how I kept my composure and kept standing on my feet. My mom and sisters responded by telling her to leave. My husband was sitting down crying. She then went to tell everyone I kicked her out as a way to hurt her further and lied that I convinced my husband to ban her from visiting her grandson's grave. Wow. Fucking wow. What a narcissist.

Insane lady. Yeah. Like completely insane. Yeah. But you know what? I will say, not defending her at all, but like my dad was telling me this about people. It's actually such a good point. Like when people are facing grief or dealing with like that kind of trauma, there's like

phases and there's a phase and hopefully it's a phase and it passes, but there's this phase where you just need somebody to blame and it's not right. It's not right at all, but they like, she just needs somebody to blame. She can't just like leave it up to whatever higher power or God or the universe or whoever, whatever, to be like my grandson was taken and that was just meant to, that was written in the cards and it is what it is and I need to accept it. She needs to blame somebody. Yeah.

Instead of blaming the doctors or the treatment, it's easier for her to blame her, whatever, daughter-in-law. Yeah. She has an easy target. And it sounds like they already had tension. So yeah. Easier target. Definitely.

Mother-in-law dynamics can be really tough. Yeah. I can't imagine. Not there yet, but just, yeah. Yeah. You hear all those stories. I feel like, and you're like, that, that will never be me. Like just get along girl.

Like you know what I mean? Like just be like, uh, like agreeable or, you know, be a duck. Let it roll off your back. Yeah. But then again, then I see the older you get and the more, the closer you get to that possibility of like having this second mother. I think you start to see like, wow, I see why people get into it. Have these issues.

Like that's a really weird dynamic to straddle. Like, yeah. As someone who's like not your mother, but like acts like a mother and could be a mother in positive ways and not so positive ways. Yeah. You know? So it's like, I can see now where these issues arise. Yeah.

I think something that's really interesting too, because like, yeah, it's not your mom. So it's like, you don't have to necessarily have a relationship, but like say you guys have kids. Yeah. Like your mom and his mom, aka your mother-in-law are equally grandparents. True. And so it's like, it's like, oh my God, like it's gotta be tough when like your mom and your mother-in-law have like conflicting ideologies.

Yeah. You know? And you're like, well, I don't want to piss off because it's easier sometimes to go against the grand with your own mom because you're like, it's kind of like, it's what you do. And they'll love you anyway. Right? Yeah. Ask for forgiveness, not permission.

Like, oh, mom or whatever you'll come around. But like your mother-in-law, they don't have to love you. No. They don't have to. They just have to tolerate you. No. And you also don't, like if your husband is taking your mother-in-law side. Oh yeah.

Like that's such a big point of contention in your own marriage, in your own house. I definitely want to have another episode on this because like, I, yeah, and like I could go down a rabbit hole on this because there's something with being a woman. And we have an easier time setting boundaries with our parents, especially our mothers because it's something we've done throughout our whole lives. We've gone through stages in our life, like high school. You don't even know me. Like you're constantly battling with your mom and like trying to establish your own self

as a young girl. Yeah. That's true. And so we're setting these boundaries, whereas young males don't go through these same points of contentious. It would be so interesting to do an episode on this actually because we'll do it. There are very distinct parenting styles that I have noticed being as my mom likes to call me biracial.

I was like, I'll honor you are biracial. And I was like, tell that to everyone who calls me a white girl because I'm like, to the world I'm a white girl, but my mom's like, don't forget you are biracial. And so, cause she was like lecturing me on like Latin culture cause I didn't get it. But anyway, that was a rabbit hole. No moms and mother-in-laws would be a very interesting. We'll, we'll get there. We'll definitely get there.

Okay. So back to this poor woman who is dealing with a mother-in-law from hell. Yeah. Um, so she basically said like, she told everyone I kicked her out as a way to hurt her further. My husband later sent his side of the family an email talking about my mother-in-law's behavior during and after our son's illness and telling them he no longer will be seeing her. That had the family criticizing us saying mother-in-law was just trying to do what was

best for her grandbaby and called us selfish for assuming we're the only ones struggling with this tragedy. Yeah, I get that at the end of the day. But there's no comparison to losing a child pain, yeah, losing a child versus losing a grandchild. Yeah. No. A parent's pain.

Or like a niece or whatever, nephew. Yeah. No. Like the ones that are going to be struggling and hurting the most are those parents. Yeah. They do not need to be dealing with any more stress, fucking chaos at a funeral. Yeah. Already the worst day of their lives.

Yeah. Like slice it however you want. Yeah. But like there is, it's inexcusable to show up to a funeral in place. You can think that all day long and you can have that conversation later if you must. Save it for a rainy day bitch. But save, yeah. You don't show up to the funeral.

You fucking swallow that. You've put on your black shades and you sit there and you mourn with your mother and you give your condolences and you grieve. And then later on when you're level headed and the emotions have subsided a little bit, you calmly have this conversation and you say, hey, you know, if you must, but like, yeah. And if you even want to, you know, bring the heat and like talk shit, save it for fucking Thanksgiving.

Yeah. You have ample. Thanksgiving. Oh God. Thanksgiving is always rocky for, not always, but Thanksgiving's a rocky, rocky holiday for a lot of people. All the holidays can be rocky, but like save it for another time when everyone's together if that's.

No, no. Don't even. If that's the audience you want. I feel like, well, okay. She did it for an audience. She did it for a fucking audience. So it's like, if you want that. Yeah.

True. You know, it's more like schedule a dinner, not the fucking funeral. Keep it together. Exactly. On the funeral, that's like the one day where you should put everything aside, like everything aside. What are you there for? Yeah.

To grieve, to mourn. Be there for that reason. To be sympathetic. Yeah. We haven't seen his mom in one year and eight months. I'm now three months pregnant. No one knew only my sister-in-law, brother-in-law's wife, but word got out. Bitch.

Jinx. Ah. Yeah. What a bitch. Though we told her not to say anything, week later, I had family members saying I was invited to a dinner hosted by mother-in-law so she could both apologize in front of the whole family and settle this issue before the baby's born. They said mother-in-law was regretful and offered to financially provide for her grand

baby and they want to see that. I refused, but my husband surprisingly wants me to go. I had his grandparents calling me telling me that I'm a good person with a good heart and forgiveness is something I'm capable of giving. Yes, ma'am. Capable, but not willing. I'm literally going to pull up this quote by Taylor Swift because, amazing. I can't believe these people, like this whole family is like a little weird to me.

I think they're just like promoting this mother-in-law's toxic ass behavior. Also like, and they're enabling her. Calls and call me directly, why do you have people messaging this to me, like what? She feels regretful. No, she can call me grown ass woman, woman of woman and tell me how regretful she feels. And if you're fucking blocked, send a letter, plan this little shindig for two months down the road when she's even more pregnant, yay, then you get to see the bump. Plan it for down the road, send her a fucking letter if you're blocked.

She has to realize that the only reason they're doing this is because there's another child involved. Exactly. She wouldn't have heard from her mother-in-law. Also if this other child, like God forbid it's a genetic condition where this other child then has like a heart problem, can you imagine how batshit crazy this bitch is going to be? Yeah, absolutely not.

That's so tough, but I see where she's coming from. So in the wise words of Taylor Swift, sorry, sorry if you're not a Swiftie, you guys. You don't have to forgive and you don't have to forget to move on. You can move on without any of those things happening. You just become indifferent and then you move on. That's exactly my grieving process. That's how I start to finish. I really couldn't have said it better.

Fucking hard. Yep. That is exactly how it happens and everyone is like, you need to grieve. You need to be sad. You need to know. I don't give a fuck. Yeah. And I'm like, no, I'm like fine.

They're like, no, you're not like it's fine to be hurt. And I'm like, I'm herping in a very passive indifferent way. Like it's just kind of like a, I'm moving on, like life goes on and I don't have to sit here and have a kumbaya moment with you and forgive you. No. And I also don't have to fucking forget. So like it happened, but yeah, like I don't, I totally agree with that quote. Everyone deals with things differently.

And if you decide that indifference is how you deal with things and that's, you're genuinely feel like you moved on because there's one thing and we're like, you don't want to harbour anything. Yeah. And then like a year later, you just have a meltdown and you're like, oh wow, I wasn't over it. I was not indifferent. I've been harboring this for a year now and now it's all coming out.

I actually wasn't over this. Like saying like, I, I actually wasn't over it. I was like, what are you not over? No. I was like, what are you not over? Who hurt you? You're really scared. Yeah.

Okay. No, that's true though. Like she doesn't have to. And that's what sucks is like, I was recently in a position where it's like, I was like in a situation with somebody and everyone's like, you know, oh, forgive this person. But it's like, I don't have to do one. And two, it's moments like that where you're made to feel like you're the reason for the disruption.

Yeah. Like, oh, like she feels so bad. Just forgive her and come to the dinner and the family will be reunited and we can all move on. And now you're the reason that that's not happening because you are refusing to accept somebody's toxic apology and you just have decided that this is your boundary. Now you're the asshole. Why is this being placed on her?

Right. Because she, they're viewing her as the reason that like they're divided and that they can't see this new baby. But it's like, no, she does this to herself. She was her own fucking catalyst in this when someone hurts you. Like first of all, no one gets to decide how hurt you are. And second, no one gets to decide what you do with that hurt. So if her idea of rehabbing and moving on is, I just need to have a distant relationship

with my mother-in-law and that includes with my child, my future unborn child, then so be it. I mean, that's not ideal, but it's honestly not a loss though. If the relationship is so tumultuous and toxic and energy draining, like what kind of, I'm sure maybe she'd be a good grandparent, like maybe, but also, but she's shown you that when shit goes south, she blames you and not even like in a healthy, I mean, there's not a healthy way to blame somebody, but there's no respect. There's no respect and there's no like empathy.

Like at the end of the day, that was what she really needed to come through with is like, you can think like, gosh, I just feel like if Alejandro wasn't so stubborn and she had done this or tried this or explored this, the baby would have been alive. You can think that and maybe have a conversation later. But when it comes to the funeral and when it comes to me grieving, you should just be like the first priority is being empathetic and being supportive because regardless of loss is a loss. You know?

Yeah. The last thing someone needs is- Her first and only child. Yeah. Wow. I told them, I'll never be sitting at the same table with the person who called me a bad mother at my child's funeral. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, drop the mic at that. I still remember it vividly to this day. My sister said this change of heart from mother-in-law is probably for the new baby. It could be, but I insisted I won't come. They're saying I'm making it hard for everyone to move on and pass this unresolved pain and I should really go. Yep.

I think at the end of the day, kind of going with the Taylor Swift quote, like- Circling back to see Swift. I love the quote. No, it's a good quote. I watched the interview and it was spot on. But I think I've kind of learned this by letting go of toxic relationships that life is too short to waste your energy on people that are not deserving of it. For this, it's like, you're making this difficult on everyone.

It's like, if that's the way you feel versus recognizing the person who is truly at fault here, then you don't deserve me. You don't deserve getting to know this new child. Yeah. No, that's true. That's exactly how I felt with my situation. It's like, if that's how it's going to be viewed, instead of just hold the person accountable. If you're so upset, go hold the person accountable because we wouldn't be here if that person

hadn't acted this way. I can relate to that very strongly and I've been in the position where I'm like, am I the asshole? I'm the one asking the Reddit question, am I the asshole for not wanting to reconcile with this person? And it's like, no, if that's your boundary and you're at peace with it, because that's what matters at the end of the day, is she at peace with it? Is she just trying to prove a point or is she really at peace with this decision?

And if the answer is the latter, she's at peace with it and she feels good about it, there's nothing. I mean, it's tough because your husband is now like- Yeah. Especially with him being like, I think you should go. Yeah. Because that's a lot of pressure. Now you're like, you're kind of like on your own, like, you know, like nobody has your

back really. Yeah. Besides, yeah, her family, but like- Yeah, that's true. I mean, your person, your husband, the father of your now, your three months pregnant, the father of your next child, and the one you lost, like, that's a lot of pressure to be put in. And honestly, like, that is so annoying to me and something that is talked about like

throughout psychology a lot, where a big, big, big detriment in marriages is when one of the partners chooses their birth family versus the family they've chosen and created. Yeah, that's gotta be really tough. That's where your loyalty should lie. And so that is like a big reason for divorce. And it's like, ugh, it's just like, they already have bad stats working against them, like married couples that lose a child, like flip a coin on the divorce raise. So it's just tough.

That's yeah. I can't even imagine. And it's like, I'm putting myself in her shoes right now, which is tough because I've never even married, I've never had a kid, I've never lost a child. But if it were me, I feel like she's being really strong. Like, I think I would just eventually cave out of convenience. I feel like I would just be like, I wouldn't, which is really sad, but I feel like in my heart I would still resent that person and I'd still be like, I'm not never letting you

close to me. It's kind of like, I saw this thing on Twitter that was like, we're okay, but we'll never be the same. Yeah. I'm okay with you. Like neutral. Yeah. You're fine.

I'll come to your dinner. You can come to my baby shower, but we'll never be the same. No. I will never love you the same. I will never treat you the same. You never get access to the same parts of me that you had before. So the way that would translate here, like with the relationship with your mother-in-law is like, you could just be like, yep, you know what, whatever, let's put this behind

us for the sake of the child, but you'll never be the same. Yeah. You know? I completely agree. It's hard to come back from something like that. My dad said a quote to me once and I broke something of his that was like really, really precious to him. And he said, like after this all went down, he was like, you know, this is kind of like

a shattered glass. And this is like life. When you have problems with people and you do something mean to hurt them, you broke a glass and that glass will never be the same. You might be able to fix it, but it'll never be the same. Yeah. That's true. It's something that I, I mean, I fucked up and this literally happened when I was like

five and it haunted me since. So it's something I always keep in mind, but yeah, which all of us almost always fuck up and drop a glass at least once in every relationship, right? Yeah. A relationship from start to finish is never the same. Someone drops a glass at some point. Yeah. Yeah.

Definitely. It's just like, it's just. But it's like, is this new version good for you? Yeah. That's kind of the question you have to ask because it's never going to be the same. No. It's just pristine for years without dropping it, right? Like somebody drops a glass, you know, let me a little chip here and there for sure.

Say something that you can never really forget or I don't know, forgiveness has such an interesting topic. Like it is such an interesting, it really, it really is. Top comments on this one are really, really good. Not the asshole. I work in nursing in ICU and I see people like your mother-in-law often. You were done so dirty and no one, absolutely no one will ever understand what you and your husband went through and the kind of horrific choices you had to make.

People like to think modern medicine can cure anything and it's just not true. Yeah. That's a really good point. Next one. I felt sick to my stomach reading this. The pure audacity of this woman is beyond words. Yeah. It's crazy to hear these stories and think like, it's like humbling.

You're like, wow, my issue with so and so is not that bad. If someone can do this to someone else. It pales in comparison. Yeah, it does. Definitely. Next comment. I'm so sorry OP, I can't begin to imagine. Mother-in-law is a textbook narcissist.

She's staging this fake public apology and the flying monkeys have been unleashed. If OP plays along, mother-in-law will redirect the pregnancy attention onto herself. If OP doesn't, mother-in-law will bemoan her suffering to anyone who will listen. You can't win with a narcissist. All you can do is refuse to play and let them find someone else to torment. That was the best thing they could have said. That is so well said. You cannot win with a narcissist.

That's the best thing they could have said. You just have to refuse to play. You just have to tap out and be like, I'm not playing with you. There are people you just can't win with. You can't engage with people like that because no matter what you do, they'll spin it so that they're the most satisfied or they're the most assured in themselves. No, I wouldn't be dabbling with this fucking family dinner. No.

So you wouldn't go? I wouldn't go. So you would just continue to... Yeah, I would not allow that person access to me. They don't deserve it. Until she's like, I don't... Personally, once you burn a bridge with me, it's really burned. Yeah.

It's totally... It's totally... It's torched. Annihilated. Fucking torched. Ashes. It's gone. It's gone.

So I... Ugh, which is hard because I'm like, I look at what I've put up with in some relationships and I'm like, I'm only like that now because of the times I've given second, third, fourth, fifth chances and I've learned it doesn't work out. So that's why now I'm like, it's not worth it. It's not worth it to waste your energy on someone like that. Yeah, that's so true. And so I look at it and I'm like, it's a really tough situation because you're connected to

this woman forever. Yeah. And you're married and you share children with this person. Yeah, absolutely. So it's like, you don't want to say never say never or whatever. Yeah, true. But she would really, really have to start demonstrating. She's a recuperated fucking woman.

Yeah, I feel like that's one of those things where the only thing that can salvage it, semi is time and just the proof is in the pudding. So like actions. 100%. But more so time. I think that can't be understood. Cause someone can do all these great things in like a span of one month, two months, but that doesn't show consistent patterns and behavior.

Changes behavior has to be over time. So like, yes, people don't change overnight, you know, they can have revelations overnight, but in order to like act out those changed behaviors, it's just a matter of like building a habit. It takes 21 days, whatever they say, right? So like the same way with behavior, you can decide to change your behavior overnight, but it's not changed behavior overnight. So I don't know.

I think time. So important to give things time. I can't, I can't add anything better to that. That was perfect. Mic drop. I literally was. You said it can't drop your mic, so. No, it was.

I, I've never really looked at something like that where it's like, yeah, time matters, but like the consistency part of it too, because it's like, okay, they could be better for a month and then fall into treating you like shit and it's like, okay, well, then you didn't change. So it's, it's that combo of the two. Yeah. I'm really, I just have a revelation sitting here. So that was, that's great.

I'm like, I'm just thinking about like, I'm contemplating life right now after that. It's just, yeah. You think back to all the times people wronged you and you're like, oh, how long did it take? But it's always time. It is. It really is. Okay. Here we go.

This one, um, that's very interesting. The, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the,

the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, đ globe. My heart is racing. I've only shared this with three people in my life, my parents and my husband, I want and I didn't grow up close. Or even in the same household really. He was moved out by the time I was six. However, he always hung out at the house on weekends,

holidays, birthdays and such, and we had a pretty good relationship considering. When I turned 18, he really pushed me into drinking with him. I drank in general, so I didn't really think much of it, but there were a few times where I felt he made weird inappropriate jokes about me and my friends.

But having little life experience, I didn't realize how strange it was at the time. Anyways, he's always pushed boundaries, used to pick on me, but in a very physical way. He would hold my arms behind my back and bump me into things like the wall, a table, et cetera. My parents never asked him to stop despite him being so much older and way bigger.

Six, four, 240 pounds. Whoa. I'm just saying this to set the scene of him never expecting my boundaries my entire life. Fast forward to a couple of years ago, I visit him on his birthday. Earlier in the day, we went out to a pub and his creepy, much older friend said something gross to me.

My brother asked, is he weirding you out? I said, yes, definitely. He said, yeah, John's kind of weird. I thought by my response, he would tell him to leave, like what a good brother would do for his little sister. Instead, he invited him back to his place to continue the drinking with us that night. At that point, you just tap out and you gotta go.

My brother gets wasted, John gets wasted, but it's kind of normal, boring. John leaves, my brother's wife went to bed early. We're in the kitchen and my brother asks for a- He's married? He's married. Oh, apparently. We're in the kitchen and my brother asks for a hug

and apologizes that he hasn't been there for me. As he's hugging me, he's kind of breathing into my neck, which makes me uncomfortable, but just in like an ew hot breath, not a scared way. He then pushes me away and asks if he can twirl me. Okay, weird. I think to myself that this is getting weirder, but still I have no reason to be afraid.

It's my big brother after all, my protector, my family. He twirls me around in the kitchen in my dress. Honestly, all I'm thinking in this moment is how he needs help and how sad the scene is. Him being wasted and alone on his birthday. He then brings me in again for a hug and says, Oh, my name. And then leans in to kiss me on the mouth.

I was horrified. I ran out of the house and down the street. Oh my God. I called my fiance, but I couldn't really say what just happened. I was so embarrassed and ashamed and I was really hoping that I misunderstood. However, I did not misunderstand.

If this was any other person in any other scenario, I would have no question as to what happened. The reason I couldn't process it is because it was my brother. Once I came back to the house, I found my brother in the bathroom, puke all over the toilet and himself. I got him a cold washcloth,

got him a bottle of water, wiped him with a vomit off his face and told him to go to bed with his wife. This was a couple of years ago. And I feel like I haven't been able to move forward. It has complicated my husband's relationship with my family. I also told my parents and they have no idea how to process it.

And waved it off as a, he was too drunk. He didn't know it was you. At one point, my dad told me I was going to quote, tear the family apart if I asked them not to speak to him. Where do I go from here? The thought of telling him what happens horrifies me. What scares me even more is that he may remember it.

I'm so saddened over this and the loss of the relationship with him. Someone who is supposed to be so close. This would likely tear his family apart as well as mine. So a part of me just wants to pretend it isn't real. Oh, yeah, that's loaded. Wow, wow, wow, wow. I actually really relate to this in the way that

me and my older brother are eight years apart. And so not as big of an age gap, but when I was born, like my brother really, really, really resented me and we had a terrible relationship going up. Like I still remember him like calling me fat all the time. Like I was just a burden in his eyes. Like he was,

especially when he got his license. He had to pick me up, drive me around. But like we did become close. Like after, like I think in college, he would come down to Minneapolis, you know, a three hour drive from where he lived and we would hang out and like go out, whatever. And we started having a good relationship,

but I cannot imagine in one of those nights out, my brother like turning to me and fucking trying to kiss me. Oh, I can't imagine, but I also like the horror. I honestly, I don't know what you do. I feel like you can't pretend it didn't happen because it's going to eat at you. And you have, oh, I don't know.

I don't know. She's told, I'm glad you told her parents. Their reactions aren't a plus in my book, but like, but at least they're not, it could be worse. Her parents could have been like, well, what did you do to provoke that? You know what I mean?

Which is weird, but like at least they didn't go that route. And they were, they are defending their son in a sense he was too drunk, he didn't know who you were. But that's, I think that's the only place their mind can go. What's the alternative? He knew exactly what he was doing. You're hot.

He wanted to make out with you. I think it's, I want to believe what her parents said too. Like, okay, you're, you might be, you're probably an attractive girl. Yeah. He was probably so drunk that he just didn't even like connect. I mean, he obviously was throwing up.

So, but, but I don't know. I mean, like God, how drunk do you have to get to like? Try to kiss your sister. Yeah. Unless you don't really look at them like a sibling because of the experience. The age gap. Yeah.

Like you didn't grow up with them. It's just, it's maybe like a cousin. I feel like, That's still so bad. It's still, it's still so, so, so, so, so, so, so bad. I mean, I'm really good friends with my cousin who's a guy. We don't have a huge age gap, but I could never. Like I'd be, I would be

First cousin too. So weird and out. I would be so like, no. Yeah. But what I will say is like, I don't know, my initial reaction is just, I think she needs to have a conversation with him about it. I think she needs to tell him what happened.

100%. Because then you can both move forward. Just get it out. Yeah. And if, and hey, if he like, is like, yeah, I remember and he stands, but he doubles down. He's like, and? You need to go to therapy.

Then you need, yeah. Now you need like therapy and now you need to like have a conversation with your family and that's going to be difficult, but you can't just go through life, not just sweeping the sun of the rug cause. That's not healthy for you. It could happen next time and worse.

Yeah. It could happen again and it could make things worse. Exactly. I don't know. It's easy for me to say to just, oh, talk about it, but I just don't see a way around it. I don't either. I really think this is something,

unless you just completely decide that you don't want a relationship with your brother anymore, you'll tolerate him. You'll come around with for your parents' sake. Family gets together. You'll collab, but like you're not, no one-on-ones, absolutely. You know what I mean?

That's a route, but. And that's, yeah, it's fair at this point. But you might feel unsafe and unsettled when you're around him and that's not fair to you. No, and if this is something that's affecting your marriage and- Exactly. It is.

Oh, that's another thing. That's a component I forgot. Her husband now or fiance, whatever he is to her. Harbors that secret. Yeah, and at these family reunions, dinners with the parents, he's gonna be weird and you're risking- Yeah.

It's just a lot of discomfort. It is. And it's just like, honestly, he's the one that fucked up, so get it out there. But this isn't your burden to bear. I agree. Let it out. Yeah, so true.

That's what sex is a lot of these times. Like the perpetrator, whatever the offender, goes scot-free. Yeah, and then the victim has to bear the burden of being like- And the guilt. Yeah, and the guilt. Turmoil.

Yeah. What's her question? Am I the asshole or was it just, what do I do? Yeah, what do I do? Address it. I think address it. Honestly, if you wanna send him a letter, like you don't want the confrontation,

like send him a letter. Oh, that's true. I forgot about the component that'll fuck up his family. Yeah, like send a letter and just like be non-confrontational or literally like, hey, I need to talk to you. Can we grab coffee? Sit down in a very public space. If you want your husband to come join you, bring your hubby

and just get it the fuck out. Like this is not your burden to bear. And it's not. Ooh, that's so tough. I know. Top comment. I think you should find a good therapist if you haven't already.

Also that, I love- That, I forget that therapy is- I love therapy for everyone and anyone. Like I'm a true believer in, even if you don't think you need therapy, like everyone could benefit from therapy. Absolutely. I talk about this to Justin all the time.

Like therapy is like maintenance for your brain. Like we all, our cars need oil changes. Like everything in your life, like light bulbs expire. You need to change light bulbs. Like our brains need therapy. Like a rewire sometimes. Yes, like just get it out, talk to someone. Like even if you don't think you do,

like everyone could benefit from therapy. So yes to that. I'm sorry this happened to you. I'm sorry, your family is in denial of your experience. Next comment. True. Your parents are assholes. Well, I think it's hard as a parent

because you love your kids equally. Right. And you also like, you weren't there. So, I mean- It is a, he said, there's no pattern to think, this is, we totally see that happening. Like it's just like a, it's fucking shock. Right.

And you want to believe the victim. You want to support the victim. Like- It sounds like they do. It's not that they do, but they're like, yeah, you're right. In a way, I'm, now I'm seeing what they're saying. Like in a way you're not supporting the victim when you place, you're kind of gaslighting them.

Like he was confused. It is a lot. It's gaslighting. It's like, I saw what I saw in like, I'm a sister. So. Yeah. But I think at the end of the day, you're like, I raised this son of mine.

Like I, I can't imagine him being capable of this. So it's like, it's almost like they're maybe taking it personally on their own parenting and a reflection of them. And so then they're like, gaslighting her to like, hi, that didn't happen. And I think it comes back to what I said earlier. It's like, what's the alternative?

If you don't believe that he was confused, what's the other option? He wanted to kiss his sister on the lips. Yeah. That's weird. You don't want to believe that. No, you don't. It's like the brain's way of protecting itself.

It's like, I can't, I can't come to terms with that trauma. Yes. So I have to believe this, you know? And it's not right, but like that's the parents they're acting out of like fear and guard. Yes. You know, like it's not like, oh, we don't believe you. It's just like, we believe you,

but we maybe think that there's another reason for it. There's, there's more to the story. Yeah. So OP does comment on another comment, basically saying like your family's toxic, blah, blah, blah. She goes, it's true. I agree. My parents are older and I'm wondering if they are going

into this weird self-preservation mode, which is literally what you just said. No, I think it's what you just said. No, you were saying like they're trying to like, they're trying to rationalize it and like save themselves. Oh, okay, okay, okay. Yeah. It's a bummer regardless.

Yeah. For sure. And that's what I'm trying to, I'm like, obviously I'm not a parent, but I'm putting myself in their shoes and it's like. They're equally your children. Yes. Obviously this is the one coming to you.

Yeah. I'm telling you this, but yeah, you don't want to, you don't want to believe that. Yeah. You're one of your children is like capable of something like this. Yeah. I agree.

Yeah. Tough situation. I hope she figures it out. Let it the fuck out. Yeah, I think so. I just let it out. But therapy was a good suggestion. Oh, love it.

I absolutely love it. Yeah. Okay. Do that. Fucked. Last one. I, 22 female, just found out that my friend, 21 female, has been sleeping with my dad,

45 male for years. And now my mom and siblings hate me. Oh, she's married. He's married. And now my mom and siblings hate me because they think I destroyed our family. Okay. That's fucked up.

You can't control what your dumb ass friends do. Oh, you're fucking dumb dad. I'd be like, mom, what's that saying? If your friend jumps off a bridge, do you jump off a bridge? Like my friend chose violence and the whole life. That does not mean I chose it. Like how are you going to hold me accountable?

That's like when Jordan Woods did what she did. Yeah. And it was Kylie's friend. Like did the Kardashian Jenner clan turn their backs on Kylie? No. So you fucked up our family. No, Jordan Woods chose what she chose.

Yeah. I know that's a hot topic right now too because Tristan's making headlines again. I know. Okay. Wow. It all started when I, 22 female discovered he, 45 male, had a lot of sketches of her,

21 female naked. He also had a lot of photos of her. I confronted him and he just told me, Is it her father? Like this is her father. This is her dad. I confronted him and he just told me that he was in love with her,

but that nothing had ever happened between them. I talked to my friend and she swore to me that she only loved him as a father and that she could never think of him as a man to flirt with. And I believed her because I thought that she was in a relationship. I mean, she used to have a boyfriend

and then he suddenly moved to another country to study. So they had a long distance relationship. But apparently they broke up a few months ago after he moved. She made me believe that they were still together and that they were going to get married when he came back. But I found out that it was all a lie. I went to her apartment and saw that my dad's wallet

was on one of the shelves and I asked her what his wallet was doing there. And she said that he went there to talk about me. I believed her again. But then I told her if I could stay in her apartment for that night and she said no. And that she was very nervous. So when I went home and sent an Instagram message

to her supposed boyfriend, and he told me that they broke up years ago that I should know why I told him I didn't know and that I wanted him to tell me what happened. And he told me that he broke up with her because she told him that she slept with my dad and that she was no longer a virgin. He's a really religious man who believes

that you shouldn't have sex before marriage. Okay. This girl's been fucking her dad for years. They're 21. Yeah, so like. So at what age did this start? I don't know. Let's hope 18.

Is he a little fucking groomer? Oh my God. Oh my God. I mean, regardless, if she was of age, I mean, we don't want her to be underage at all. But if she was of age, it's still disgusting. It's still so bad. It's still disgusting.

She's actually way younger. She's married. This is your friend's daughter. She's vulnerable. She views you as your father figure. Oh my God. Oh my God. Yeah, like her parents are still together.

So like they're married. Not only is he having an affair, he's having an affair with her friend. Who's very much younger. Yeah. Whom he should view as a daughter. Yeah. And that shocked me.

I really thought she was a good girl. I'm doing math that happened for her 18th birthday. Oh. And that day, she didn't want to celebrate her birthday with her friends because she was going to celebrate it with her family. But apparently her family was my dad. Oh my God.

So he was grooming her before. I'm physically unwound. Cause you don't just fuck someone on your 18th birthday. Right, right. It does, oh, oops. Look at the time. It's like, no, you had to like. You've been fucking teaing that up.

Yeah, for sure, teaing it up. I mean, yeah, teaing it up. Literally, you've been. There's been. That's not a coincidence. No. There's been. That's so disgusting.

Grooming. You should be able, can you charge for that? I think you can. You can, right? I think you can. I think you can grooming a minor. Yeah, especially if you have proof that it occurred before she turned 18.

I think you can. Isn't James Charles facing, not to drag his name through the mud, but isn't he facing some charges for like grooming? There's some stuff happening there. Yeah. Yeah. He lost his like makeup palette with more

if they like mutually decided to separate. But yeah, there's like. But it's something to do with grooming. Yeah. I swear that it is like. He has like a lot of like screenshots coming out that he like offered fans money for sending nudes and stuff. A lot of them were like underage.

Oh my God, ew. Yeah. Stressed. I went to her apartment the next day without telling her and my dad was there. It's worse. I told her everything her ex told me and she didn't say anything.

She just cried like an idiot. And my dad told me that he was sorry, but that it just happened, that their marriage broke up when my mom got pregnant with my youngest brother on purpose so that he wouldn't break up with her. But honestly, nothing of everything he told me matters to me.

I feel like a fool. They have been having sex for more than three years and I was helping them with that without knowing. Oh my God. That makes me feel sick for her. Cause now it's like, you were never my friend. I was your scapegoat. Yes.

Oh. That she was a scapegoat. Thank you dad. For putting her in this fucking position. Right. She was like a member of the family and every time she went to my house, I used to tell my dad to drive her to her apartment

so that she could arrive safely. Oh God. And when he took longer than he should, he said that there were things like a lot of traffic and now that I know, maybe they use those moments to have sex. Oh God, no, this poor girl now, she's like blaming herself and like,

she's like, I had a role in this. Oh no. I feel sick as if everything was my fault and my whole family thinks it is. My mom doesn't talk to me because she thinks all that happened because I became friends with her. That I should have realized what was happening.

She blames me and I don't feel comfortable at home anymore. My siblings, 10 male, eight female also hate me. They're too young. Because they think I made this mess. And no matter what I say, they think it's all my fault. Well, they're young. Give them that pain.

They have to blame someone back to the concept of blaming. Grief. This is a loss. They're like, yeah, they have to blame somebody and you're easy. They're 10 and eight. They don't get it. And they're following their mom's charge.

You look to your parents for guidance in this moment. It's not on them. The mom is wrong. She's old enough to know better. That's wrong. You can't blame. I mean, you could use the same logic. How didn't you know what your friend was doing?

How didn't you know what your husband was doing? Exactly. Why is this just on the daughter? Exactly. You are just as like connected. Culpable, yeah. If not more connected to your husband. It's your husband.

Than someone is to a friend. I don't fucking know what half of my friends are doing. I can't manage them. No one, you can't manage another person ever. Ever. Doesn't matter when they have connection. Doesn't matter when they have connection. Absolutely no like,

liable, like you're married, you share a home, like. Yeah. You share expenses, like there's ways to find gaps and consistencies, but I'm right. No one's more culpable than the other. Yes. But you make a great point. Like, okay, if you didn't know what was going on

with your friend, like you didn't know what was going on with your under your own roof. Yeah. How do you then like stick it on your daughter versus just sticking it on the man that actually fucked up? Yeah. The one that decided to cheat, decided to groom a minor.

Yeah, people always blame the girl. Don't shoot the fucking messenger. Exactly. That's crazy. And she should understand like her daughter's heart too. Yeah. So I would understand if her daughter knew and then held it from her.

Yes. Different story. Okay, yes. Your mom is mad because you harbored the secret that you shouldn't have. She didn't know. She's just as shocked as you. You guys should unite and be like bad ass women together

and figure out how you're gonna take these people down. Fuck both these people. Let's put them in jail for fucking. Build a case. Build that case. Build a case. Oh, wow. What the fuck?

So top comment. I'm sorry this happened to you. Your father groomed your friend. Literally. And your family should have seen that and saw him as disgusting being that she is around your age rather than getting upset with you. Agreed.

Yeah. Yeah. Other top comment. The only one at fault is a lying guy. Slying guy? Sorry, pretty sick too. The whole family needs therapy. Yeah.

Yeah. Love therapy. Yeah. Big therapy gals. Everyone should do it. Everyone. I could not be a bigger promoter, plugger of therapy.

Promoter. I love it. I just started watching the show Couples Therapy. Couples Therapy, I gotta go watch that. If I didn't have Pilates at six in the morning, I would like put that on tonight. It's absolutely unreal. I was gonna watch it before coming here

because this might be a little primer for like. Download a couple for your flight back to Minnesota. Oh, good call. My flight's at 1 a.m. I need to sleep. Definitely don't download any. Yeah, no. Maybe on the way back.

It's the perfect thing to do on the way back. It's addicting. I went through the whole season and just it is such a really great, interesting show. And I know a lot of people are calling about it. Like if you do listen to Caller Daddy, like she's been a promoter of it. Yeah, she plugs it.

Yeah, the therapist is actually like going on one of her upcoming episodes. Oh, really? Yeah. I know that, good for her. Yeah, and so it's an amazing show. I mean, this woman goes through it with these couples and it just shows that at the end of the day,

like we all need a little help in bettering our relationships and working on communication, whether that's with fucking family or a partner. But I mean, there's always areas in our life that you can use a little tune up in. It's true. When I was, my parents got divorced and I was five. And...

You were a wee nugget. I was wee. So when you, I don't know the laws about this or whatever, but when you're like, when your parents get divorced and you're a minor, I don't know to what degree, if it's like 18 and under what age, obviously I was a very young five, the court actually mandates therapy.

Or like family counseling. That's nice. And let's put it that way for the minor children to evaluate them and see the fact that this is playing on their early development. And I literally think I went to a few sessions and they literally reported to my parents, like your daughter is like, could it be more unfazed?

They're like just the most well-adapted five-year-old. They're like so unbothered, like you're, she doesn't need to be here. And they were like, and I'm kind of pissed looking back. I mean, I'm fine. Like I've never really been like... I could have used that fucking therapy. I don't feel like I'm traumatized,

but like I've like kind of like annoyed that they just dismiss, like how can you really gauge? I don't think I went for more than a few months. Yeah. If that, I think it was a few, like I'll have to ask my mom, but my mom says like you literally like, you are so well-adapted that they were almost like, she doesn't need to be here.

She's like really doing well. She's doing great. And I'm just picked. And I actually remember, I have very bad memory, but one of my only memories is like, after the session, they typically talk to the parents right after, like when it's fresh. And I think they ask the kids to like wait outside

or the kids are like an ear shot, you know? Cause obviously they have to keep an eye on them. And I remember playing, do you remember those like those weird like things where you push the- The beads. The beads. I was, I knew.

On those like, they look like roller coasters. I knew what you were going to. I remember playing with one of those. And I remember getting like tidbits of the conversation and my parents just being like, really? They're like, yeah, no, like she, she's fine. Like take her home. And I'm just like, I always think about that.

This girl is Gucci. Yeah. She's chilling. I don't know about her. I don't know what happened with my brother, but like, I don't know why him. He was a lot younger. His story is a little different, but like, yeah, too. But for me, they were just like, go off this.

Yeah. Go home. Enjoy your life. Live your life. So love that for you. Love that for me. A little me. A little me was fucking chilling. But I mean, they were good in their assessments

cause my parents were like, you really were though. Like you grew up and you were good. Like you really were. You were never a kid who showed like troubled signs. Like anything to where they were like, oh God, like we really did our dirty like nothing. And so I would blame them if I had these like traumas today. I'd be like this fucker, like those counselors

should have paid closer attention, but- I know. Child psychologists, they got a tough gig. Divorce is traumatic as fuck. Any families can be traumatic as fuck in general. Especially when there's like weird dynamics. Yeah. Like I would say I have a great relationship with my mom now, but like it was not always that way.

And like I have a lot of trauma that sure we'll get to on this podcast eventually, but- Start with the lighter traumas. We like to delve into the deeper ones later. Yeah. We got Mother's Day coming up. I'm gonna- We're gonna keep it light for the moms. Straight before Mother's Day.

We're not gonna comfort their lives just yet. But after Mother's Day, it's open season, mom. Open season. No, but at the end of the day, like everyone is dealing with their own battles. We all have crazy families or a lack of family, which in itself can be, you know, traumatic. And just that's in itself as like a loss or, you know,

whatever feelings you have about it. So if you have experienced trauma and you are dealing with things like reach out to people, there's always people around you that would be willing to, you know, talk, turn to Reddit. We've obviously, we love this community and feel that it does offer great support. Yeah, online communities.

Yeah. And there's always people out there that are willing to listen and just provide support. So, you know, whatever you're dealing with, don't fight it alone. It is a mental health awareness month. So just a note. So an important month to seek therapy. I know, as we've been plugging it so hard,

but again, and on a light note, I'm going to literally start crying again. Oh wait, I'm like having cramps and I think you willed this into my life. Like I was fine. And now I'm like having cramps and it's like, you did this. You like summoned the gods. You triggered it.

You triggered me. I'm like, oh, but no, really, I really do have cramps. Yeah, fuck, okay. And I need to let you go to bed. So on that note, thanks guys for tuning in to another episode of Two Hot Takes. I absolutely love you all. We're so happy to have you.

And until next time. Yay. And bye. Bye. Bye. No. No. No.

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