U Talkin’ U2 To Me? - R U Talkin' R.E.M. RE: ME? - Slowin' It Down with Ben Lee

Episode Date: April 17, 2020

Scott and Scott aka The Dubious Brothers discuss their vast Easter traditions, Michael Stipe’s recent performance on The Late Show With Stephen Colbert and check in with another episode of “I Love Films.” Later, musician Ben Lee stops by to answer the Scotts’ most important question: When did you first hear of R.E.M.?. He also shares memorable conversations with Michael Stipe and plays a cover of “Nightswimming.”

🎵 From Chronic to Collapse Town and into now that is... This is... Are you talking rem remade the comprehensive and can encyclopedic compendium of all things rem this is good rock and roll um music welcome to the show. How's everyone doing out there? Hey, everybody. Yeah, buddy, everybody. Hey, everybody.

Everybody. Welcome to the show. Big episode today. This is a patented slowing it down episode. Oh, did you go out and get it patented? Yeah, I did, yeah. Oh, wow. Well, it's patent pending.

Right, of course, it's pending. The paperwork is in. Don't you any motherfuckers try to do your own slowing it down episodes because we got it fucking patented. I'm so glad that you got that patent attorney so we could patent the slowing it down episodes he's super expensive but yeah totally worth it i mean it was like five hundred thousand

dollars an hour and now yeah and he worked you know obviously he worked guess how long you worked an hour and five minutes just so he could just so he could bill us for the extra 500k yeah i like to call that a rounding error if you know i wish you'd round down instead of um but we have a you want to you want to brown down with him i want to brown down with our is that what you said attorney no i did not it, but now I do want to say it. Welcome to the show. We have a patented Slow It Down episode coming up a little later. We have a wonderful guest,

a musician whose work has meant a lot to me, and who reached out, who wanted to do the show, and has some great stories about interacting with the titular Hariam. Hariam.

Ben Lee will be on the show a little later. That's exciting, isn't it? And he will also be playing a certain wonderful song as well. So that's very exciting. Wait, what do you mean? Think of all the wonderful songs. Okay. I just thought of all of them.

Yes. Okay. Now, think of, like, pretend that I'm doing a card trick and I'm fanning them out. Pick one from the middle of the deck. Okay. Here I go. I'm going to take this one. Okay.

Would it surprise you to learn that Ben Lee is going to play this song? What? Are you serious? Yeah. Does it match the one you picked? Yeah, Perfect World by Huey Lewis and the News. Yes, that's right. He'll be playing.

Is this an episode of Huey talking Huey to me? I believe so. From back in time to a hundred years from now, this is Huey talking Huey to me, the comprehensive and encyclopedia compendium of all things Huey Lewis and the news. This is good and the heart of rock and roll music. This is Scott. And this is Scott. And what's going on in the huey lewis camp this week well i was just uh thinking

about that song perfect world because we're in the middle of uh essentially the perfect world right now everything is going great i mean this is perfect yeah i don't know how else to explain it remember when you could enjoy songs about golfing and going down on the beach and it not seeming weird? Or going down on a golfer? Did I say going down on a beach? Yes. Anyway, Perfect World. Remember, that was a pretty big hit.

I would have thought that was like early 90s. It was late 80s. Ladies. Hey, early 90s. It was late 80s. Ladies. Hey, late 80s. Hey, late 80s. Get funky. Well, we'll see you next time. Thanks.

Bye. Bye. Not that good of a follow-up, Ab. know i'm they should have stuck to the one one and done dubious dubious brothers you and me we should be the dubious brothers oh yeah i love i love the dubious brothers uh what like they're they're more kind of, they're early stuff anyway. Yeah. Oh, speaking of the Dubious Brothers and Michael McDonald, Christopher Cross was sick recently with COVID-19. I don't know if you saw that.

No, I heard about it. I didn't see it. What, how's he doing? How would you have like seen it personally? Is that what you're saying? Well, you said, I don't know if you saw that. And I heard about it from Naomiomi i didn't see it so you didn't see christopher cross on his sickbed that's what you're saying that's right i heard about it yeah you we all read the same article about it you

that's what i was trying to say you i didn't i didn't say that I actually went to his house and looked at him. No, but I'm saying I didn't even see an article. I heard about it. I know. I'm trying to do a bit here. All right. In any case. Wait, I think we were each doing our own dead-end bit.

Mine was not dead-end. Mine had a lot of shelf life oh okay and you shut it down i shut it down with my dead end with truth um but yeah so hopefully he's feeling better he he had a bad case from what he was saying as well yeah i hope uh i hope they're all okay everyone who if anyone's sick out there jesus christ i'm so sorry and i hope you're getting better quickly look i'm gonna go further than that i hope no one ever dies again oh me too me too i hope we just keep creating new babies and they all everyone lives forever? Yes. Yes. Thank you.

Because you know what would happen then? The Earth would get crowded, and we would have no choice but to make space stations. Thank you. What are we waiting for? How big does this population have to get before we start making the big space stations that we all want to live on? We all need a space. Every single person should have their own space station. One space station for every family. One space station for each person.

By the way, I got to introduce you before the show continues too far along. He's coming from his house. We're recording this remotely in different, I mean, we're on the same earth. So that's, I mean, technically we're in the same place. Yeah, we're all in the same world, as they say. But we are remote from each other's houses.

We swapped houses. I'm over at Adam's right now, and Adam's over at mine. That's how we're supposed to do this quarantine, right? Yeah. By the way, you should flush your toilet. Why don't you flush my toilet before I get home? Do me a favor.

The rule is if it's brown, flush it down. I thought it was if it's brown, let it mellow it was if it's brown let it mellow if it's no let it mellow no if it's yellow flush it down if it's brown let it mellow did i ever tell you about when um tall john loaned cool up and i his uh parents cabin up in big bear and um right before we left i took a big dump in his toilet and took a picture of it and then uh sent him the picture on iphones but this was when iphones were still relatively new and there was some sort of error on iphones where if you weren't getting the right signal it would send something a bunch of times and like as it tried to get the signal he just was inundated with pictures of my dump in his toilet

oh boy ah good stuff did i ever talk about the what ken marino and i would do to each other on Party Down to each other's trailers. No. What you do is you take a dump in the other person's trailer and leave the bathroom door open and blast the heater. But see, you would do this to each other, so both of you had terrible, terrible trailers. Like, what good is this this doing it once is funny but by the time you're just doing it to each other every all day every day no i did it to him and then his payback was giving me a folgers coffee can with his dump in it

did you actually think it was coffee like hey thank you so much yeah i made a whole pot of coffee before coffee you ever had it's delicious um but i do want to introduce you before we get too far down the road uh he is of course uh you know him from such classic films as stepbrothers and i'm trying to think of another classic film you've done. Seven and a Match. Seven and a Match? I'm trying to think of one that... If you stopped at seven and you said you were in seven,

I'd be very impressed. Okay, how about Match, a Match, a Match? Hey, here's something that we should lobby for. Okay, that movie Seven, you're watching it and you're enjoying yourself and like, wow, Brad Pitt and Morgan Freeman, this is a great movie. Sure.

Suddenly, spoiler alert on, by the way, a third, halfway through the movie, two thirds of the way through the movie, an actor comes up who is uh shall we say persona non grata at this point oh yeah why don't we you know how they did this with uh all the money in the world they put christopher plumber in there and just like computer put him in on top of kevin spacey and every once in a while he moves around and you can see kevin spacey under him kind of moving around.

Is that true? Yeah. That's so, yeah. No. You gotta watch it really slowly. You can see Kevin Spacey like peek out and wave to the camera? Yes.

It's crazy. And I'm sitting there going like, why was he waving at the camera during the movie in the first place? But we should lobby to replace, have you replace Kevin Spacey in all of his previous movies like american beauty and glenn gary and gary glenn ross like all of these classic movies that go to lunch will you go to lunch let's get lunch right now let's eat lunch like that yeah oh oh i thought you were asking me to lunch. I was very excited.

I haven't been out of the house in a long time. No, I was doing that, that kick-ass scene from Glengarry and also wondering if you would like to go grab some lunch. I would like to go grab some lunch, but nothing's open. What do you,

I mean, where would you like to go? Oh, I know this place that's open. Wait, let me check here. No, they just closed. Wait, are you talking about your own kitchen?

Yeah, they just closed, unfortunately. What, Naomi closed the door to it? They close at 324 every day, and they open again the next day at 3 20 your your kitchen's only open for four minutes a day four minutes and if you and it's not even breakfast lunch or dinner no it's it's essentially whatever you can get in four minutes and i was doing the podcast with you so oh such commitment to your fans well that's shit out of luck that is something that i did want to mention in your your intro you have an incredible commitment to your fans and you like to say hello to all of them please welcome to the show adam scott hey everybody hey anyone you want

to say hello to yeah i would like to say hello to my family i would like to say hello to my family. I would like to say hello to my friends. And I would like to say hello to my fans. And I would like to say hello to you. Thank you very much. That's so kind of you. I appreciate that. At a time where we're not getting a lot of human connection. It's nice to get some in there. How wonderful it is to hear a friend say hello to me. Thank you so much. Oh, no problemo. And will you introduce me or should I introduce myself? Yeah, introduce yourself.

Here I am. You know me from other shows like Comedy Bang Bang. Directed of one movie in my career. A lot of people saw it. Who knows? Who knows if you saw it out there? But I've skirted around the edges of show business for knocking on 25 years at this point.

Please welcome me to the show, Scott Aukerman. Hello. 25 years in showbiz. Can you believe it? This is my 25th year. This summer will be my 25th year in comedy. Jesus Christ. Can you believe it? For a guy who, I mean, I was, obviously I started very young. I was four years old. I'm 29 years old this summer, but it's just incredible. Yeah, you were hilarious. That first album of yours when you were four, that stand-up record? The seven dirty words that I can't even pronounce?

Yep. Goo-goo what? Hearing you- Goo-goo-ga-hoo? You as a four-year-old trying to pronounce cunt is really funny i almost got it um welcome to the show this is the show where we talk about rem exclusively how have you been adam how's uh how you holding up you know um okay i'm you know it's always been like a week and a half since we did this since we talked last we spoke uh yeah probably a week ago you had a birthday since we spoke last

happy birthday to you thank you very much um yeah weird times are you used to this new normal here? It's, you know, it's a bit much. It's a little extra, if I have to admit. Have you had that moment yet where you just stop and go, I don't know if I can do this, like, this is really not ending. Like this is fucking crazy. And then, and then that lasts for like five minutes and then you're like, okay, let's just, you know, whatever. Have you had that yet? I believe that, that Coolop and I, by the way, I'm married. I don't know if you know that. Um, her name is get married i got married i don't even remember but um we we each separately kind of have had our days where uh i was stricken by a panic attack on one certain day when i i think it was when it was when, honestly, it was when people, like friends of friends, started passing away.

Yeah. And people my age and stuff. And so I was like, kind of paralyzed. And then also realizing that it's not going to end. Yeah. We're just kind of flattening the curve at this point. It's not like in the summer we can all get this disease and be cool yeah um so anyway so and then cool up is added at certain

points but i think uh you know i i do have to say i'm i'm very glad that i am here with her uh during this time and i wish all of you could be here with her yeah i wish you could be here with her. Yeah. I wish you could be here with her and... Oh, everyone wants to be there with Gulab. Just come over. I think it's sort of common knowledge. Just come over. Okay, I'll be over in 10 minutes. That goes for the listeners too.

Just come on over. Yeah, I'm kind of the same. I was supposed to be in New York right now. The big pizza city. The city of pizza, yeah. The big pizza. And like if through whatever reason, if I was stuck there away from my family, it would have been a real drag. Like if you had moved there a month earlier, you probably just would have gotten back on a plane and come back.

I probably would have just flown home. So what are these fantasies? Yeah, I don't know. You ever think about the Empire State Building having a big, you know that needle on the top of it, the big sharp point? Sure, I've heard of it. Having a big piece of pizza stuck into it? Oh man, that would be really funny. Yeah. a pizza stuck into it oh man that would be really funny yeah um but uh yeah i think just even today naomi just said like just kind of stopped and went i can't believe we're in quarantine because of a

virus like the whole world the enormity of it is just hard to take sometimes and it's just no it's uh doesn't end makes you think of i mean obviously everyone is still trying to work but it's very difficult too because what does work even look like on the other side of this especially yeah um in this business of show what is you're trying to reflect the world and what does the world even look like uh a year from now who knows so um but of course that's not what this show is about this isn't a look i'm gonna be honest we thought of we could just start a quarantine themed podcast like everyone else but it got boring for us so so we we decided to go back to the old reliable. We're here to talk about those boys in blue,

the wonderful members of the Athens favorite band, Harriyem. Harriyem. The boys that never wear anything but blue. That's like their trademark, isn't it? Their trademark, boys in blue. It's incredible. And a lot of people don't remember that about them

because they didn't like to advertise it. Right. But if you go back and watch their videos and watch them on, say, David Letterman or The Tonight Show with Reed Carvey, and watch their videos and watch them on like say david letterman or um the tonight show with uh reet carvey um you'll notice that they're always wearing blue and you'll be like oh wow that's such a crazy like easter egg which easter easter by the way we just celebrated uh the other day he is risen i wanted to say to you um and uh yeah he looked around. There's no one there because everyone's in quarantine.

It's like, hey, Jesus, thanks for coming out of that cave. Why don't you go back for a little bit? Thanks, but no thanks. Yeah, none of us are leaving at this point. But how did you celebrate Easter? Well, you know, it was uh it was it was incredible we we had a ham and yeah you you baked a ham baked a ham um and then ate it while uh watching television incredible so you ate the entire ham how big is this ham uh it was as big as uh do you know like this the saying as

big as a bread box i know this there's a similar saying that i'm familiar with bigger than a bread box okay um let's meet right in the middle and say uh was it as big as a bread box or was it bigger than a bread box so right right in the middle of that is slightly bigger than a bread box? Slightly bigger than a bread box. Like one millimeter bigger. Yes, like a millimeter bigger than a bread box. Okay. How about you?

What did you do for the old Easter? You know, I get pretty traditional with it. um you know i i get pretty traditional with it um you know egg rolling on the front lawn and um you know the candy hunt and um you get up really early and hide candy around the house all around the house and i just hide chocolates uh for my dogs to find and uh they love it the dogs love to just find all those uh chocolates and eat them and um it was really go to the vet oh yeah well it's strange that you mentioned that it's a coincidence but yeah we it was weird um after our easter celebrations um our dogs just started puking for some reason i think they caught some sort of bug or something and we had to go to the vet and um get their stomachs pumped and um i wonder if it was because of all the the chocolate

you fed them or they probably maybe their eyes were bigger than their stomachs if you know what i mean like uh it's sort of like me on halloween when i'm done trick-or-treating it's like all this chocolate hey why not eat it tonight? Well, yeah, but you're not supposed to feed dogs chocolate at all. It's poisonous to them. It's what now? It's not good for them at all. It's poisonous to dogs.

What does that word even mean? Poisonous? I've never even heard, I've never heard that word. It means that it's not good for them. Like if they eat it, they could die. What is that? What is, what? Die? Die, well, the one meaning of the word is to change the color of using artificial means.

Like my Easter eggs. Yes, your Easter eggs. Oh, okay, I see. So you see what I mean? I see. So they're gonna be in charge of the Easter eggs next year? That's right.

No thanks. Next year, your dogs, your dog, no, it's now a rule because they die, because of die, they are now in charge of Easter. They're probably gonna be better at it

than I will anyway. Maybe. Those rascals um it's uh it's obviously april and um all the all of the uh all of the movies have all been postponed every single day it seems like uh another new story comes out that's like hey guess what guess what guess what black widow you want to see black widow you're not gonna see black widow for months and months and months mon frere what have you been watching uh any movies like i know some movies they put out right away on the old itunes um i i find i did i did think it i i was kind of laughing

because i was like is really by the way is this an episode of i love films yeah hey everyone welcome to i love Films. This is Scott. And this is Scott. And we're, look, I'm going to be honest, we normally love to talk about films on this show. Oh, yeah. Because of the quarantine, we might just be talking about movies today. So if you're a true film lover, you may want to skip this episode because the standards have slipped yeah i've just been watching movies at this point it's it's basically been movie after movie uh during this quarantine

no films no film i mean for instance i uh i was watching age of innocence which is like second tier scorsese that's how far i've fallen yeah that's one of scorsese's few movies that and shutter island i mean that a minor work at best exactly you know what about what are some of the movies you've been watching, Adam? Movies? Well, I watched certainly a movie. Or you know what? I'm going to make an exception. I'm going to say I saw a film. What? Yeah.

Bad Boys for Life. Whoa. Have you seen this? You got a copy of Bad Boys for Life? Got a copy of bad boys for life got a copy of bad boys for life i managed to get one and i watched it that is a f-i-l-m capital m yeah you got to capitalize that m film film and just scream the ma when you're talking about films i love film exactly um that's amazing how did you enjoy that uh pardon the pun bad boy uh i don't get it yeah it was great it was really really really good how bad were they and how masculine were they on a scale of good to bad

and feminine to masculine where did they rank it's weird because they're both clearly fully grown men um and they got pubes they both have tons and tons of pubes and just sticking out of every costume and as far as i could tell they're in law enforcement uh so they're not bad that's not very clear to be honest from what i've seen of the film the fact that they're in law enforcement i'm not i'm not quite sure you have that right well i i also i watched it while i was hanging upside down and i had the vote i had it on mute so i'm not totally clear um are any of the characters ever upside down in that film well there's a car chase where one of the cars flips over and you can see that the guys in the car upside down for a brief

millisecond yeah so i just paused it on that for like half an hour. And what were you doing upside down by the way? I was doing my upside down exercises. What are those? Well, it's where you hang upside down for, I don't know, the length of a, of a movie, say four or five hours. Sure. And you just hang there and, and watch a, and it gets you in great shape. Wow. Do you mind standing up so I can see what's going on down on legs down there? Sure. Check it out.

Boing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing, oing. Those are amazing. Yeah, that's from five hours of hanging upside down every day that's crazy man thank you wow well hey um look it's clear we love films we'll see you next time bye pretty good i don't check i like checking in with those guys. Sure. Listen, they know what they're doing. Speaking of knowing what we're doing,

I know that we need to take a break. When we come back, we are going to talk a little bit about Michael Stipe has a new song that he premiered and then he sang on Colbert. We'll be talking about that, amongst other things. We are going to come right back with a little more of this show called Are You Talking R.E.M. Remy?

We will be back on the other side of this. And by the way, Ben Lee will be here. Oh, Ben Lee, yes. We'll be right back. Welcome back. Are you talking Ari? I'm Remy. I believe this song came up on Shuffle the other day, and I sent you a screen grab of me listening to it or my iTunes or something.

You did? Didn't I? I sent you like five texts the other day, most of which went unreturned. Until finally I, yes, I did. Okay, so should we go through our text exchanges? Sure. i did okay so should we go through our text exchanges sure uh okay here's here's me on friday new peter buck and scott mccoy album the no ones is really good no answer from you wait when oh yeah you you know what it's weird though because

i saw your text and I downloaded the album. And you didn't care to write back. I, in my mind, I had written back. What would you have written back? Oh yeah, this is awesome. Which I meant, I thought in my mind I had, I totally did that. Okay. Well, that was Friday at 11.04 AM. Yeah. Cut to Sunday, 8.02. I've grown tired of waiting for your response.

Yeah. And I had just checked in with Ben Lee, our guest coming up soon on the show. And I write, Ben Lee would like to do an REM app. That's Sunday, 8.02. Yeah. Monday at noon, still no answer from you. I say, record this week?

Now, here's the thing. On Sunday, I got that text, Ben Lee would like to do an REM app. And I was like, huh, how does he know that? And I went on Twitter. I found the entire exchange with you and Ben. And I was like, oh, that's so cool. And in my mind, I had gone, I just saw that and that's awesome. Let's do it. So anytime, but I see here that I did not do that. So what I should do is when I, when I don't get a response from you, I should assume that you wrote something like, hey, that's cool. or something like that. I'll feel better about myself. And you've just forgotten to do it. Because now looking at this, actually looking at the text exchange or lack thereof,

it's horrible. It's horrible behavior. Yeah. Followed up by at 8 p.m., I send send you three things including one the third one finally i say what do i gotta do to get you to text me back and then you you finally write back sorry yes let's do it bro and then i sent you a bunch of pictures of me listening to various things including you too rem and billy joel um anyway so i thought that was funny but uh oh i don't think i understood what those i thought those photos were like sent by mistake or something i didn't know what that was oh no uh just trying to provoke you it's almost like me poking you trying to get you to like but then you said thursday it's good for ben i said sure you said okay it's a quote-unquote date and i say cool man it's a

quote-unquote date and then i sent a gif of a hamster of two hamsters on a date yeah and i never wrote back yeah you didn't respond to that um mainly because you pronounce it jif which i find disgusting oh it was a gif disgusting isjusting is what I think. But yeah, why were we talking about that? I can't remember. Ben did this really great. Yeah, yeah, we'll talk about it. Yeah, we'll talk about it. But there's a little bit of news coming out of the REM camp.

out of the REM camp, Michael Stipe has been releasing songs, I guess, in a way. I don't think we've ever talked about his first two songs that he released, Your Capricious Soul and Drive to the Ocean. I don't think we were doing eps around them. But didn't we talk about it at one point? Maybe, I can't remember. I don't feel like we did apps around them but didn't we talk about it at one point maybe i can't remember i don't i don't feel like we did but maybe we did but um this is the uh third song

that michael stipe released and he performed it on uh the colbert show now colbert has been doing what we've been doing essentially which is he's been staying in his house and doing remote live hookups with people um basically like every celebrity is doing podcasts now and it's like celebs stay in your fucking lane right um like get out of here we we it's bad enough that the conan o'briens of the world and the the the who are those dudes from scrubs got us to end the office ladies and come on get out of here celebs let us let us non-celebs like adam scott over here do the dudes from scrubs have a uh a podcast they do a scrubs podcast i think that two of the sopranos dudes start doing a sopranos podcast it's like come on

we know that we've influenced so many artists out there and look we appreciate it this whole like breaking things down uh genre sub-genre of podcasting and we we get it we're the forefathers of that but um we'd rather you just stay away was the you two thing um the show we did yeah the show we did about you two you talking you to me was that like uh going album by album had no people had done that before right no we were the first people to ever listen to album all albums from an artist yeah wow that's incredible we're really we were ahead of our time wow yeah. Yeah, we're good. I mean, obviously, we've been doing this now for 25 years.

25, 26 years. Yeah, so we've been doing it 26 years, and I started doing comedy 25 years ago. So the first year was really dry. Yeah. No laughs. So, so yeah so wait so so colbert has been has been doing his show at night and he's been having people sort of he's either been talking to them via satellite or or they'll send things this was kind of the latter where stipe, I think, performed this song and then sent it and wasn't doing it live, essentially.

But did you see it? Yeah, it was great. I really liked that song a lot. Let's play a little bit of it. This is... This is not him. Hey, welcome back, everybody. Obviously, this is Colbert.

I'm just gonna skip this part. Performing No Time for Love Like Now. Ladies and gentlemen, It's cool to have Colbert on our show, though. Yeah. By the way, Stipe is wearing a, I don't even know. No time for breezy.

I don't know what color this is. What would you say? No time for love like now. What would you say? What, his sweater? His sweater and his house. His house and his sweater are the same color. Yeah. Am I right?

Yeah. What color would you say that is? That's aquamarine? Yeah, kind of an aquamarine. But more on the green side of it. Yeah, I think you're right. Speaking of green, this guy, I mean, he would know green. Wait, let's get to the chorus.

Talk to him. He's the one singing the song. Hey, get to the chorus, man. Dude, this is the pre-chorus. Come on, get to the chorus. Dude. Dude. Dude.

Are you talking to me? Get to the chorus. Hey. Dude. Dude. Dude. Hey! Dude! Dude! Is this the chorus was that the chorus yeah oh okay all right i assumed that couldn't be the chorus. No, that was it. That was it. Um, but a cool song kind of, it reminds me a little of like,

uh, uh, late, late period. Yeah. Up, uh, uh,

era REM. Um, excited for the new record whenever it comes out. Yeah. I hope, um, he puts out like a whole, remember when, when we interviewed him,

you said like, we know you have a new record coming out. And he was like, no, there's no album. Maybe he wasn't ready to announce it yet, but I think he has an album. By the way, that song was a collaboration with Aaron Dessner, who people mainly know from the Comedy Bang Bang television show and the Comedy Bang Bang podcast.

He also is in a band called The National. But a cool song. Yeah, I like it a lot. What do you think of it compared to the other two singles he's released? I like this one the best out of the three. Yeah. What do you think? Yeah, I mean, I like they they all go together well

they feel like they're all from like shamalama dang dang yeah yeah exactly um yes so that was uh anyway that was uh it's cool to see i mean i honestly i was like did he buy this sweater because his house is painted that color? Or did he paint his house because he owned that sweater? I really don't know. And did he do it just for the Colbert appearance? I don't know. Because the video he put out of the song previously on like Instagram, he's wearing a different sweater.

So that implies he bought a sweater the color of his house. so that implies he bought a sweater the color of his house maybe he has a different sweater and a different color uh sweater but also a different color room for each time he performs each one of his songs maybe every room in his house is a different color and anytime he walks to a different room he puts on a different sweater yeah that. That's probably it. So he has like a sweater dispenser at the entrance to each room. It's a lot like a Pez dispenser with his own face that he opens up. That's right. And takes out a sweater and puts it over the previous sweater. Doesn't replace the sweater.

By the end of the day, he's wearing like 25 sweaters. He's just sweating sweating he's so hot but also he's just huge because he has all these sweaters on he's sweltering but also swole now now what about um this new peter buck album that you were uh yes telling me about no ones do we uh i'm sure uh they would not mind if we played a little bit of that i uh i really liked this by the way and one one thing i would say okay so peter buck put out that um michael stipe put out uh these songs uh mike mills remember your promise to us remember when you said you were gonna release that solo album

what are you up to none of us have that anything to do at this point the end of the year and that was last year yeah um I remember when we saw him in September he kind of said like oh it may be a little longer than a year and i was like ah no no dude no dude no no no no no no so i want i want that shit to drop um so if you're listening to this and let's be honest we know you are um that's right put that shit out brother now now do you want to play a moment from that or uh let's play let's play i i love this first song this is called no one falls alone this is from the great lost no one's album by the no ones this is in the classic tradition of having uh your band name in not only the album title, but also in a song title as well. Oh, yeah. I mean, that is a tradition for the ages.

From Bad Company to General Public, we all know these bands that have done that little trick. So let's hear a little bit of No One Falls Alone. Here we go. If I last another hour Without some better bitter news Blame the lack of all precaution Cause the light has left the tunnels And with no more options Save to let the darkness through

No one falls alone When it's raining stones And your cover's blown Be kind to no one falls alone

Be kind to no one falls alone Pretty, pretty good. Yeah, it's really good. You know, Peter Buck is one productive person. He really is. one productive person he really is he um and it's not like us where yeah we put out brilliant podcasts um he's putting out brilliant albums yeah but it takes a long time to make an album or maybe it doesn't i don't know but he this takes a long it takes a long time for us to do this every it sure does every like few months, there's another album of his.

This is one of my favorites. A new band. Yeah, this is really good. It reminds me of stuff from the mid to late 90s, like Teenage Fan Club or Gigolo Aunts and stuff like that. Really good power pop stuff. I really enjoyed it. And it's a great Scott McCoy on lead vocals there.

Yeah, yeah. And he's right there on the cover too. Look, if you're a person who doesn't like music, but you love pictures of Scott McCoy, you're just like, I can't get enough of him, buy the record and throw the CD in the trash because he's right there on the cover. Yeah, he's right there.

Now, what about that new stroke song okay so i listened to the most of the new stroke the new strokes came out on friday so yeah i listened to most of it actually right before we started recording okay um and i okay do you want to hear like the the kind of it's not the official first single but the kind of more real strokes first single bad decisions let's hear oh yeah that's great okay let's hear a little bit of strokes Draw down the lights, I'm sitting with you Moscow, 1972 Always sitting nicely

I will leave it in my dreams I'm making bad decisions. I'm making bad decisions. I'm making bad decisions for you. So, I like it. So, I like it. But the thing I gotta ask about the strokes is like, okay, so this song is a Billy Idol, I won't call it a rip-off because they actually credit him in the writing.

Yeah. And then the song right after it is a Psychedelic Furs song that they have interpolated. Wait, which song is that? Eternal Summer. They basically rip off Ghost in You. Oh, can you play that one? Yeah, yeah. They give Psychedelic Furs a writing credit on it as well.

They do? Yeah. But it's like, I mean, Oasis used to do this where but they always did it the Strokes this is kind of a new thing like now they're just like putting out old songs as their own songs yeah but then there's what seven more that aren't that yeah but it's only nine songs too Brooklyn Bridge to Chorus is great, and I love At the Door. At the Door is incredible. At the Door, I really like.

I just don't. I wish it wasn't the first single. But is it a single, or was it just kind of that first song they put out there? Because Bad Decisions is like a video. That feels like the real first single, but At the Door, they were saying, is the first single,

and so I listened to it. I was like, well, this isn't a very good single necessarily it's a cool song yeah okay the uh the psychedelic first part is coming up in a sec this is a cool song but i would say if you realize you've ripped off the psychedelic first sing something different There's a million other. You could go la la la la la la la la. Just change it? Just change it. Here it is.

I guess, but they're probably also like, fuck it. This is awesome. Inside you, the ghost in you. Is this the part? Yeah, this is it.

See, then there's someone like me who doesn't know that psychedelic first song and doesn't care at all. Well, you're a piece of shit. I think it's just awesome to hear a Strokes record that sounds reinvigorated and Rick Rubin's producing it. It's kind of great. Some of it sounds like the Strokes. I would say Strokes, we want you to sound like the Strokes. We like the Strokes.

You can sound like the Strokes. What, you think some of it does not sound like them? Some of it's a little more like the Voids, I would say, but... Like At the Door? Yeah, and just some of the other songs on it. I know you haven't heard the whole thing, so I'm... You know what's good, though, and doesn't sound too much like...

And we texted about this. This is one that you actually did text me back about, is Pearl Jam just put out. And I know that, yes, of course, we're talking about dad rock. But we're of a certain age. Sorry, we like this stuff. But Superblood Wolf Moon, the Pearl Jam single, that's but we're of a certain age sorry we like this stuff but um super blood wolf moon the the pearl jam single kicks a little bit of ass i would say yeah it's uh it's really good let's hear some

of that Oh, that isn't even the song that I meant to play. I meant to play Dance of the Clairvoyants, but Superblood Wolfmoon is really good. Oh, yeah. Dance of the Clairvoyants is the single, right? Yeah, let's say. Well, Superblood Wolfmoon is also a single, I think, but this was the first taste that we all got of the record. Kind of like a Talking Heads vibe. Yeah, it's really cool. I'm bummed because I think Pearl Jam was supposed to be playing maybe this week even.

Here in LA, yeah, and Jason Manzoukasoukas and i were gonna go and obviously we are not any longer everything's been postponed thanks for inviting me on that uh would you have a would you have written back well i would have actually if this wasn't happening i wouldn't have been in los angeles hey you know what's great too is that Killer single. Oh, the new Killer single is really, really good. Let's hear a little bit of that. I'm going to find that. Yeah, I think it's a pretty good time

for bands that have been around since the 90s or the early 2000s because some good shit. Yeah. Oh, and there's some new Foo Fighters coming up. Well, it's not out, so why are we talking about it i don't know here's the new uh killers from imploding the mirage which i is this still going to come out or a lot of albums have been delayed because of this because not because they're not done

but because people can't go on talk shows to promote them like they normally would so it's it seems like everything's being pushed back but the strokes album did come out and i think the killers one is still scheduled when does it come out pretty soon i think like maybe may or june oh the hamilton leithhauser too yes that just came out i believe on friday it's so good have you heard that one? I haven't heard it yet. It's awesome. Hamilton, of course, from the Walkmen.

Yeah. People would know that band mainly because a couple of the members were in the Between Two Ferns movie. Right. Oh, and the Haim, the new Haim stuff. Haim, stuff hyam yes their their record got pushed back oh it did well the songs that are out the single came out the single came out but they're they obviously they would be on a lot of uh talk shows and doing a lot of promo for it so they decided to push theirs back you want me to get to the chorus on this good shit yeah it's really good brand Flowers, I hope you appreciate us giving you a little boost here on our show. Is that his real name, do you think?

No. No? What, did he see some flowers lying by the side of the road? He's like, yeah, that'll do. His name's probably like... Johnny Dipshit. Brian. Brian Buttfuck. johnny dipshit brand brian butt fuck

um adam uh uh we uh not to not to get uh turn the mood back to somber but uh we uh this week look the whole reason we're in quarantine is because of this terrible uh look the whole reason we're in quarantine is because of this terrible uh virus that's going around and um someone that i met through you at a u2 show um just passed away did you want to mention him how wilner is uh was just a terrific guy um i knew how because he worked on Step Brothers as he did lots of Adam McKay or Judd movies as a music supervisor and just kind of general music empresario person. He's just the coolest guy, knew everybody. You could just bring anyone up and he would tell a cool story, anyone in Music Up, you would tell a cool story and just chat with you about rock and roll for as long as you wanted. And he's not like snobby or anything. He loved it all and would talk about any of it and uh really tight i remember that night we ran into

him at u2 lou reed had just passed away and he was pretty broken up about it because they're close and so we talked a bit about lou reed and do you remember the stay awake compilation he put together and like yeah that was the first time i ever saw his name really i i must have seen it in credits of snl or something if he had worked on it at that point but i remember reading a lot of the press about that stay awake record which was a a compilation of various artists doing reimaginings of disney songs um and uh some really great songs on there baby mine by bonnie ray it is so good and james taylor's second star to the right i sing that all the time that's such a beautiful version um but the replacements were on it and michael stipe and natalie merchants and los lobos and

so many great people i remember seeing his name and that's i i will always remember his name from that because i just was like fascinated by this guy who put together such a wildly eclectic album yeah of cool people of a really specific sort of subset of songs really cool someone i wish i could credit the original uh tweeter the writer of this tweet but someone said it's such a bummer that john prine passed away and how wilner is not there to put the tribute concert together oh my god that's so true it's such a drag john prine also just incredible um but uh i knew how just a little bit. There are people that knew him a lot better than I did, but I was lucky too. And it's a real drag.

He's a terrific, terrific guy. Well, everyone stop dying. That's my wish. Yes. Everyone ever. Ever. But you know who is alive and who I um i'm very excited to talk to you is ben lee you excited about this yeah ben's just rad dude and uh looking forward to talking to him yeah so

we're gonna go to a break when we come back ben is gonna be here's going to play a song. He's going to talk about REM. This is exciting. We'll be right back with more. Are you talking REM? Reme right after this. Yeah. We're back. Are you talking REM? Remy. That, of course, is the opening chiming chords of Discoverer from the Collapse Into Now.

Deluxe version. Whoa. Weird drag. of discoverer from the collapse into now deluxe version whoa weird brag oh i sprung for the deluxe um what do you got adam you got just the uh the regular version of that uh no i got i have the deluxe but i'm just more low-key about it i guess oh you don't oh okay so you actually boughtuxe. You have the money for the Deluxe version? Had the money for the Deluxe version. Oh, that's right. And then the quarantine hit. That's right.

Well, as soon as you get your surplus check, you can buy the Deluxe version again. That's right. You just took off your sweater, by the way, and you're wearing a jaunty yellow striped shirt. But I just want to let the listeners know what's going on. Thanks for doing that. And you know what else?

You know, one of the reasons I just took my sweater off just now, as you described previously, is because I just, before the recording, I wolfed down two Trader Joe's burritos. Two of them? two entire burritos two entire trader joe's burritos are these regulation size burritos or are these mini burritos these are regulation size which is three feet long so you ate like a six foot party sub burrito style, essentially. Well, it's a six foot party sub in the style of a burrito, which is essentially what you said. That's exactly what I just fucking said. I know, but the way they phrase it is in the style of a burrito. Oh, in the style of a burrito.

Not burrito style. I apologize to Trader Joe's or as they call all of their Mexican offerings, Trader Jose's. Yes. This is definitely, definitely a Trader Jose's experience. In the subset, Trader Jose's. Yes. This is definitely, definitely a Trader Jose's experience. In the subset of Trader Jose's. So you ate two burritos during our break? That's right. And it has exhausted me and made me very hot.

Our break was only three minutes long or so, and you ate two entire burritos. Incredible. Well, I do want to uh look why are we wasting time i don't know i mean you could call that the title of this podcast why are we wasting time that's for sure um but i do want to get to our guest we talked about him before the break uh very exciting to talk to this person i'm a big fan have all of his records uh we'll talk yeah sorry sorry i jumped i jumped your introduction i didn't say

his name i did not mean to do that i don't know why why did you just blurt out his name that's one of the weirdest things you've ever done a mid introduction you just go ben lee like you're surprised he's here what no i wasn't i wasn't i was i wasn't it wasn't a question i was saying to myself i was saying ben lee like just saying his name like it's cool it's like the they're not booing they're saying bruce right you're not you're not introducing him you're just saying it excitedly that he's here. It's very strange. It is very strange, but you buried the lead a little bit or tipped the moon, I don't know exactly what the... Ben Lee.

Yeah, Ben Lee is here. Let's welcome him to the show. Please welcome, Ben Lee is here. Hello, Ben. Hello. Is that embarrassing for me to play one of your songs to introduce you? It feels like I should be walking on, and there's nothing to do during this intro. Thank you for just miming.

Yeah, I feel like I'm waving at the audience. Is that how you walk, by the way? Your fists were so high. Yeah, like Mario. Okay, yeah. If you could jump over a flower for me, I'd really appreciate it. Is that what happens in Mario? I have no idea. Yeah, something like that. He jumps into a tube, I know that. How are you, Ben? Good to, I mean, the three of us I don't think have ever met before, is that correct? It's, I, you know, I do the very LA, you know, good to see you, because it has been many years on the peripheries of show business that I've crossed paths with many people.

I can't remember exactly. All of us have been on the peripheries of show business. I've been in a room with you, Scott, before. Really? A room? At Jake Fogelmest's thing. Oh, okay. Yes. I saw you and I didn't say hello. Oh, I didn't know you were there. I did not see you.

And I'm not sure, Adam, if I, anyway, you know, we all, whatever. Hello, hello hello hello i think we've been at the same party a couple of times but i i i've never met you wait you went to a party a couple you went to a party a couple of times i think we've been to the same party a couple of times i'm just so you went to the party then you left and then you came back and then i came back and ben was there both times he was there both times did you leave in between adam leaving ben during that party do you have any idea no no i tried to stay there and just mark like timing his entrances and exits you know that's right i will proper record i will say ben we were in the same room uh once when i saw you perform at largo circa if i had to guess let's see what album would

it have been behind probably 2002 right around the hey you yes you years all right is that old largo or new lago old largo does that sound probable it's very likely okay uh you were great my wife and i really enjoyed you and i believe believe I messaged you at one or at least said publicly that Breathing Tornadoes, the soundtrack to many years with my wife and I. So thank you very much for making that. And Adam, any opinions on Ben's work? Yes. Ben is terrific. I've been an admirer for years. And I'm starting to remember

one time when I did see you, and this must have been circa 2005, 2006. Were you living in Los Angeles? For sure. Yeah. I was a bit nomadic in that period, but I was staying on various people's couches often in Los Angeles. So yes. Is that because of women? I was very bit nomadic in that period, but I was staying on various people's couches often in Los Angeles. So, yes. I was very dedicated to meeting women in that period. Is that because you didn't want to pay rent or what was going on? Sort of. I'd lived in New York for like, you know, seven or eight years and was in a long-term relationship and was sort of single for the first time in my 20s and realized there's all sorts of experiences I could be having

rather than paying rent. And why not have them on a friend's couch? Exactly. Instead of your own bed. There you go. Yeah. Do you guys believe in the saying, or do you agree with the saying? I believe in it, definitely. That guests are like fish, they start to stink after three weeks three weeks how long is long how long is it before you're eating your fish i save fish for at minimum three weeks at minimum oh my gosh um ben thank you so much for doing the show uh you we've messaged each other a few times but uh you you i don't know whether you listen to the show or are just a a fan of the subject matter but uh

there there's so much that we wanted to ask you about this so many questions kind of like bubble up and and go through our brains and adam and i talked before you came out here during mid burrito i think it was like mid burrito number two we were talking about like what do you want to ask ben what do you want to ask ben yeah and i think we we wrote down a list of questions um approximately two regulation size papers uh full of questions and that's right and the one that really sprung to mind the the one that we really wanted to get out of the way first and and ask you first um when did you first hear of rem um you know so i was i'm australian and um what yeah and australia

you know the sort of college rock scene and everything like like pre-Nirvana, it was just not as vibrant an influence on culture. Also, I was very young. I'm now 41. So what was going on pre-Nirvana? You had the Hoodoo Gurus. Yeah, there's Hoodoo Gurus. And there was actually a bunch of punk bands I would go see in Sydney and indie bands.

But I just wasn't. And I remember Mudhoney and Dinosaur Jr. coming out and stuff, but I just didn't, you know, it was a little generation above me a little bit. Also, is that a radio thing? Were the radio stations not playing those bands? I think it was probably more just to do with the way touring worked. Like if you think about alternative music and the roots of it, it was really based in touring. And before the early nineties, you didn't really go to Australia unless you were a massive band. It was like,

you'd get Madonna and Bon Jovi and stuff, but you wouldn't get like smaller bands. When we went to Australia on the comedy bang, bang tour, it is such an ordeal. And then it just getting there is so hard. And it's a massive country. And I kind of assumed it was smaller.

So we were playing four cities. And they said, do you want to play Perth? I said, yeah, sure. Add Perth to it. And that is like going from Melbourne to Perth is like traveling from Los Angeles to Chicago. Essentially it's like takes, it's a four hour plane trip or something. I had no idea how big the country was. So it's just like a massive, massive thing. And everyone in Australia that I would talk to, they would say like, thank you so much for coming here. No one comes here. I can't believe you're here. Why did

you come here? You're crazy for coming here. here um and then everyone in perth said i can't believe you came to perth we would have just went to melbourne or the physical distance is a factor but culturally before the internet there was just sort of this cultural distance that like yeah somewhere like perth would be 10 years behind sydney and sydney would be 10 years behind Sydney and Sydney would be 10 years behind Los Angeles. And ideas just took a long time to filter through. So all that being said, I became aware of REM at losing my religion, basically, like when most people around the world did that were not highly tapped into what was going on with college radio in America and stuff. highly tapped into what was going on with like you know college radio in america and stuff right so that yeah i know that they they started both the green tour and the monster tour

in australia there you go i i stand corrected no no i mean i i mean i i just wonder if that's this is this is adam's thing by the way he he reels you in he's very silent he's like the silent killer he lets you you know hang yourself with your own rope and then he focuses in on his rem trivia and just to figure out your lies maybe australia was being treated as like the toads of new haven of the world where like you go there you figure it out and then you take it on the road that's what i was gonna that's what i was gonna ask is what did bands do that like with these big tours go down there and and work it out like in a totally different media market i mean it's not like that anymore of course but a completely separate media market so they could work out the kinks

well i do remember they labels would do that like Like Jeff Buckley was one of the first artists that labels really tested out the marketing of it in Australia and broke it in Australia and then applied it to around the world. So I think there was a little bit of a sense. It was this smaller concentrated market with like one big alternative radio station. So you could sort of see how things went and if they had a life there. Interesting. So I, I remember being in Australia too.

One of the promoters was telling me that the big, big bands, and I think he mentioned Weird Al Yankovic, um, they had to ship their, uh, concert sets by boat that they, they essentially like everyone,

everyone had to just all the sets, these massive sets people had would have to get to Australia by boat. And then the artists would come there a few days later or something like that. Does that sound plausible? At the heights of my most victorious moments in the music industry, I've never been involved in shipping sets anywhere. So I really do not know the answer to that one. But that's kind of normal like even like

when like say stadium bands like the stones tour they often have two setups going and one of them will go ahead because it takes a full 48 hours to set it up and the stones oh you like the stones yeah sure i'm gonna play i'm gonna play a little stones for us here uh if i can find some the uh we're talking about of course the rolling stones which um i've always thought about the rolling stones it's like what a racket that they had that that magazine called rolling stone magazine it's like having an advertisement for uh for your own band coming out every single week. You ever hear this song? My career would have been so different if they'd been family weekly.

Exactly. Comedy Bang Bang monthly, at least. Come on. You ever hear this one, Adam? I wish it was a lot louder. I'll tell you a little bit of REM-related trivia with the Stones. For me, the night I fully got The Stones was at a party in an apartment in New York, and Jimmy Fallon told me, get into Some Girls. He was like, that's the album. Get into it. Get into it.

Because I'd never really been open to The Stones in a way. And that was also the night that Michael St stipe turned me on to this mortal coil song to the siren really one of my favorite songs it came on and he said does this song mean anything to anybody else here and he was so visibly moved by it so let what part what party is this you're at a party with i think it was like jane pratt's house or something who's jane pratt she had um sassy magazine oh okay okay, right, right, right. The titular Jane. You know, it's an interesting little piece of trivia,

Jane Pratt related, is that around the time that I saw you walking on Franklin Avenue in like 2004, 2005, 2006, we moved into an apartment that had previously been occupied by Jane Pratt and her husband and I think her baby. You think the baby came with them?

Well, I don't remember if they had a kid in it. But after we had moved in and been there a while, I found a Polaroid in a kitchen drawer of Jane Pratt just sitting on the staircase in the apartment that i was living in wow that's the entire story was moving it was a moving story yeah well jane pratt and um julie panabianco do you guys know her she went to she was she's still i think best friends with, that, that, that there was a whole world of, um, very like vibrant nightlife happening in New York, um,

mid nineties to sort of early two thousands. And I think, I think Stipe and Jane lived in the same apartment building from what I remember, like maybe across from each other. So yeah, it was like a whole interesting sort of part of New York history that was almost almost like still connected to 80s new york where everyone was going out and mixing in different from different backgrounds and different cultures and like high culture and unsuccessful and you know very successful and all that yeah right when did you first meet stipe was this party with jimmy fallon who told you to get into some girls and was stipe telling you about this mortal coil your first interaction with him or was was this? Oh, look, it's so funny. Cause I knew I was coming to talk to you guys about this. I started like reflecting a bit about, um,

Michael Stipe and his, um, the role he played in my psyche and in my social circle because he was, um, so yeah, it was Nework and we were all going out all the time it was like literally every single night like me calling up jake fogelness and being like what's happening tonight and we're going to go do something and um and uh it was you know michael stipe was like um he was like the king of a certain segment of new york City intelligentsia kind of nightlife, you know, like, like, um, cultured and alternative, but like super famous and successful and really good at being a celebrity. So he cut a certain figure in every room he walked into, which he still does, you know,

just part of his aura of sort of who he is. But so I have a lot of memories and really part of the reason it's sort of like, I've been trying to piece all these thoughts together, how to articulate them, but they're hard to, but, you know, this cover I did the other day of Night Swimming, part of the reason it's emotional for me, that song, is the song's so much about memory and looking back on a younger self and the innocence and the arrogance and the insecurity and all that. And that is how I look

back at the time when I was bumping into Michael Stipe a lot. And I look at all those interactions as sort of humiliating because they reflected so much of my own desire to be sort of culturally impactful and socially impactful and cool. But also it's like what I realized about Michael Stipe through all these interactions was he was actually a really good socialite. Like he was someone that understood the power of being in a room and being charming and authentic at the same time and intelligent. And in a way, like the essence of socializing comes down to the value in community and where I like artistic community. Right. Like he really fostered a lot of community. And as I learned more about him, I was thinking about how he produced Vic Chestnut and would get behind all these Athens artists. And I think what I didn't realize at

the time, I was 19 and I was an asshole. I feel like I was so ambitious and kind of needy and arrogant at the same time, which is the worst combination of qualities. A lot of hubris. Yeah, yeah. Just terrible. By the way, you're describing Adam right now. So I get it. And it all would come to a head in these various conversations with Michael Stipe at two o'clock

in the morning in various settings around New York City. So there's like a lot of these just awfully humiliating memories. That's how we, honestly, that is how we feel. Awfully humiliating memories. That's how we, honestly, that is how we feel. We've had the great pleasure to interview

the subject matter of these two shows that we've done, these three shows that we've done. Well, we've done four shows, but we haven't talked to Stained, although we did talk

to Todd Glass, so I consider it to be like three and a half subject matters of our four shows. It's essentially like talking to Stained. Right.

It's better, I would say. Yeah. But I think we feel the same way of like i treasure those moments that we've hung out with bono uh and michael stipe but i'm also deeply embarrassed for whatever stupid things we said oh man but i don't know if you feel like this but i i feel like there are also these people who operate at a very kind of high level artistically and culturally. They also impart lessons just through the interactions. And when I look back on a lot of my interactions with Michael Stipe, it's like I almost feel there was like a teacher scolding me on how to behave in a way that was a little more mature and a little bit more dignified. Interesting.

For instance, I just remember one night when he was talking about the Backstreet Boys, Larger Than Life. And he's like, it's like the best Peter Gabriel song. And I sort of rolled my eyes or something. And he just looked at me and he said, you can't be snobby and pointed at me. Wow. And I was like, dude, how long't be snobby and pointed at me. Wow. Great. I mean, this is exactly- How long has that lesson taken to sink in for me? Oh yeah. This is exactly Adam's experience with John Paul Jones. And who did you ask in REM about John Paul Jones? Oh yeah. I was in Extra and an REM video,

the drive video. Do you remember that? Like crowd surfing surfing i was one of those people in the crowd and the rem guys were just sort of would come and hang out and just talk to the to the extras and fans and stuff and i asked mike mills because at the time i was 19 and i was throwing away all of the classic rock that i was into in high school and only about like what's new. And I don't want to listen to, you know, shit made by like these old classic rock dudes. Yeah. So I had just gotten rid of all my Zeppelin and, and hearing that John Paul Jones was on the new REM record, I was a little like, whoa, what the fuck is going on? And so I asked Mike Mills, like in a friendly way, but also with probably a tinge of snobbery to it, I said, so what's up with John Paul Jones? As if me, 19-year-old unemployed student,

As if me, 19-year-old unemployed student could commiserate with him on this level of like. So dumb. And plus he's on their album. They like him. And you're trying to be like, oh, what's up with this guy? Like he probably sucks, right? Exactly. And also think about like a musician like Mike Mills, a person who's at the kind of top of their craft working with john paul jones who is uh one of the few real geniuses like it was just so stupid so i

think about an interaction like that thankfully uh he had no idea who i wasn't not until yeah until you were reminded of him told him about that conversation 25 years ago. He thinks of it anytime he sees you. Every single time. I also, I don't know if I've ever told this story, but I had a very similar story to yours, Ben, where the one time I've ever run into Adam Sandler was in Santa Monica out on the street. I was with a couple of friends who knew him because we had just done a stand-up show. And he was coming out of a movie theater and my friends knew him and were like hey adam and we we all talk i didn't have much to add

to the conversation because i didn't know him and they were like so what what did you just go see and he goes corky romano and i i had the same reaction you did and I kind of rolled my eyes. I was like, how was that? And he just smiled and he said, we laughed. And I think about that all the time of like, oh yeah, you don't have to be snobby about stuff. Oh yeah. You can just enjoy whatever you enjoy

and you don't, I think so much of our 20s is maybe spent being that kind of a snob trying to find your place in the world and thinking well at least i'm better than this even though i haven't made it or whatever totally it's such a it's a real young person's um means of gaining an identity is like bonding through negativity it's almost like in a group like if you have nothing to say like you can start about someone that isn't there and everyone would be like hey now we're connecting you know but no i there was a lot of that that i think of with um what stipe had kind of mastered was moving between worlds he would be able to hang out with you know indie martians grungy dirty people

and then also he was like already by that point like producing hollywood movies and having these like big power moves kind of thing and and for me i think it was it was sort of triggering because he had so clearly manifested this ability to kind of decide what his destiny was going to be as a member of show business and i was so far from that like i'd had some certain waves of like impact but I didn't feel in control of it at all. I mean, I still hardly do. So I found him a very provocative figure in that way. Another, we also talked about In Excess. And I was like, as an Australian kind of punk kid, like In Excess was so uncool. They were like, they were almost our like, just like corporate rock that we were like backing up

against and i was like and he was talking about in excess and i was like aren't they kind of just slick like too slick and he said not kick it's big and hairy and up your butt um just speaking of uh that's a great way to describe that record i will think of it now every time i listen to it but speaking of being nostalgic about night swimming and hearing those songs your recent album quarter century classics um is sort of about that in a way at least the the the video that you made with jake fogelness the previously aforementioned Jake Fogelness. Which song was that that you made? That was Sugar Cane.

Sugar Cane, yeah, okay. I'm going to play a little bit of that here underneath as a bed. You guys made a video that was kind of moving and really cool where Jake had sort of, well, you describe it. You can do it better than I can. Well, he just dug up all of this old squirt tv footage

of us like kicking around new york and you know because we knew each other since we were 16 and um and we sort of cut it all into footage of us now as like balding middle-aged men who still love music and are passionate about it it almost took on a like kind of like high fidelity type tone where you realize that like friendship and music and how it all goes together especially for guys that sometimes have a hard time connecting emotionally what we can share as fans of music is so profound and deep and so he just made this either gorgeous video about just really about that yeah it's really cool it's uh the the stuff from back in the 90s is you guys hanging

out in a record store and sort of other music and a meeting factory yeah yeah like picking out records and pointing to them and obviously like so excited about them and then it it intercuts with you guys today over at jake's house i'm assuming or maybe yours yeah that was at your house okay and then pulling out kind of the same records and pointing to them and talking to them. And still loving them, you know, but there's a degree of kind of like, you know, again, just coming back to this sense of like hindsight or memory

and the way you look back on yourself. Like, it's like you can listen to the same record in a different way and still love it. But, you know, for me, songs like, say this, say sonic youth the way i understood it as a 16 year old versus the way i understand it now um you know these people were older than me too i was a kid going into adult life and creation and relationships and they were already you know whatever 27 they were kids too but but the early 30s. But it's like to revisit some of this music

and still honor it, but admit that you've changed is quite powerful also. It's a really pretty cover. Yeah, I should mention Quarter Century Classics is a covers record of all songs from, it seems like they're all songs from the past 25 years, is that what they... Yeah, they just all

seem to be roughly 25 years old, like Arches of Loaf, Fugazi, Dinosaur Jr. Built to Spill. They were just all songs I loved. Breeders. Round... Yeah, the Beatles. No, Breeders. I said not the Beatles. Because I sort of thought about it, the reason I called it quarter century classics was

I thought, it's weird how if this was 1990 now, and you said 25 years before, music would have been, that would have been 65. We'd have had completely shared cultural reference points, whereas culture has become so splintered now that my classics are not the next person's classics. And I kind of wanted to just dig just dig into that a little of like,

what is classic rock? You know, it's totally different for me. Yeah. No, it's a great record. Uh, people should definitely pick it up.

I'm going to fade, fade this song down. Yeah. It's really pretty. Really pretty. Who do you, who do you sing that with? Oh,

that's Juliana Barwick. Who's an amazing, amazing, um, artist. Yeah. Great. Very cool.

All right. So your first R.E.M. record was Losing My Religion. So does that mean, did you get the album that it was attached to? Yeah, but what's funny is I sort of like viewed them as a little soft, you know, which is funny. Ironic for me, who's basically built a career as an acoustic kind of ballad like um but but at the time i viewed myself as quite hard um like punk rock and yeah just sort of like it didn't it's you know it had cellos on it and it's like it all just sounded a little like light to me um and it took it it kind of took me time to uh yeah i mean i don't know it was weird like rem because they

were a generation older i mean i had the thing where like i knew kirk cabane thought they were cool so that to me was like a stamp of approval that like allowed them in it was acceptable to like rem but i still had a certain kind of maybe like a snobbery towards REM or not knowing what to do with him in my mind. Yeah. So you, you had snobbery to REM, the,

the band that made this song. You thought this wasn't hard. I love that. Actually, I knew that record, so I must have known Green. I must have known that record. I've sort of got it out of the order of my mind. Do you remember the first record you bought by them? Yeah, I mean, I remember.

I think I had this. I guess I had this. You probably had this. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're right, though. I remember that being have this. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I, you're right though. I, I remember that being a huge deal when Kurt Cobain started talking about REM

and interviews and stuff like it really legitimize them to, uh, because the whole, you know, Nirvana hit and stuff right in the middle of REM becoming this global phenomenon with like really lush, quiet music. And so that really-

Whoops. Thought I paused it. Sorry. Just interrupting a very tender thought. Yeah. I mean, honestly, it's all for the best. Adam would have kept talking forever. And you're actually not going to let him finish the thought? No, I don't think so. Adam, you've said it before. So. And you're not, you're actually not going to let him finish the thought.

No, I don't think so. Adam, you've said it before. Sure. So, so you, when did you move to New York?

You. I guess around like, well, I graduated high school in 96 and it's probably right around then, like 96, 97. And when did, I mean,

you, you had a record or a one full length with noise addict no i'd already made a few i was already on my like second solo album when i moved to new york right um and uh yeah it was a it's an interesting time you know really interesting time musically because also like that was i remember um okay computer had just was just about to come out or something like that i did not like that record at all really that record stood against um so much that i liked it i've come to appreciate it in hindsight but um the theatrics of it this i'm just trying to give you an insight into like why certain things were acceptable and some unacceptable

right in my mind but the theatrics and the emotional extravagance of it, to me, totally cut against what I thought indie rock was meant to be about. What did you think it was about? Was it about authenticity and immediacy? It was fast, cheap, and out of control. You know what I mean? Don't take too long. Don't labor over things.

Don't polish them up too much uh i mean authentic is like a complicated word but at least you couldn't make it look like you were trying too hard and radiohead were clearly trying really hard and to their credit that's why they built such an amazing body of work i uh like yeah it's interesting because in the in the movie business you don't really have that like you need to try the in the movie business, you don't really have that. Like you need to try hard in the movie business. But but still, we always admire the magical thing that seems to come out of nowhere. Yeah. Like there is a bit of like superstition around that.

Like, you know, whether. Yeah, right. Exactly. Adam, any thoughts on that? Well, no, I was going to ask, like, is it because it was like it was like a Like a big theme like a it's it's almost like it's a yes album or something It's not cool in my mind. I remember like I a friend of mine started dating Colin the bass player and Gossip, okay. It was really saucy Um, and he invited me to the show at Roseland. And I watched it. This was right at the beginning of the OK Computer sort of cycle. And he came up after me and goes, what did you think?

I was like, not for me. So this is the type of arrogance of childhood. That's great, though. You know, it's like, in a way, 18-year-olds are the ones who are meant to say things like that because no one in their right mind at 40 would say things like that yeah but also at the time everyone was like this is the greatest album of all time like someone had to say it sucks yeah well it's it's almost i think partly i've always disliked status quo sort of acceptance of things like sometimes there'll be a movie that i know is going to be amazing but i feel like i

don't even have the psychic space to watch it because i've got everyone's opinions and i hate it honestly tiger king was like that for me because uh cool op started and was like everyone's talking about tiger king which immediately was like made me go and then i looked at it and it was i think eight hours long or something i was like i don't have eight hours to put into watching something that people are talking about for these two weeks you know just so i can contribute to like with one funny tweet so i yeah so i walked through the room a couple of times i got the sense of like it's about a dude who owns a zoo and he sings and he's crazy i was like yeah i get tiger king but um, but, um, yeah. So cool, Scott.

So, okay. Computer. It was the tiger King of the nineties just for people who weren't alive back then. Yeah. It really, um,

it's hard to, um, I mean, it's weird. I know this podcast is not about radiohead, but it could be, wait a minute, wait a minute.

I'm really into radiohead, you know, are we, is this, is this an episode of, are you talking radiohead to me? Sure. Hey, everyone.

Welcome to Are You Talking About Radiohead to Me? This is Scott. And this is Scott. And our guest for today's show, look, this is the show where we talk about Radiohead, obviously. You brought in a real expert, someone who didn't like them. Well, for our first episode, what better guest could we get than someone who did not like them? Please welcome to the show, Ben Lee. You're like the least qualified expert.

When did you start liking Radiohead? I liked Radiohead when Kid A came out and when they did Idiotech on SNL. Yes, that version of Idiotech. Because that was punk to me. That felt punk. It was more... It was minimalist.

It was... And it was unhinged yeah i remember i remember sort of uh listening to it on kid a and being like yeah this is okay and then when i saw that snl uh performance and i remember it very vividly i was in atlanta uh we were making the mr show movie and i was alone in my hotel room no one to talk talk to. Bob and David were filming and I was not allowed on the set any longer. And just seeing that and being blown away by the passion and what they did to transcend the album version of it was amazing. And another band that I verbally disparaged in front of Michael Stein, because they played the same night as me in New York. disparaged in front of Michael Stein because they played the same night as me in New York.

And I saw Michael Stein the next night. He said, sorry, we would have come to your show, but Radiohead were playing as if it was like some blasphemous thing to miss a Radiohead show. And I was so insulted. I was like, Radiohead again, like with the eye rolls of the 18 year old. And I was like, are they actually that good? Like I just was being straight ahead. And he said it's all about when tom sings he opens his mouth and a light comes through his head and i was like okay that's pretty cool i want someone to say that about me no one's telling me i open my mouth a light comes through my head would would he come up with these beforehand do you think or or was this off the cuff for stipe well they were almost like paris is burning like bitchy

slapdowns you know what i mean like that he kind of is like really he's really good with words another great reveal right yeah oh reveal is this an episode of are you talking rem me uh yeah i think i think it is from chronic to collapse this is are you talking rem remy the comprehensive and encyclopedia compendium of all things REM. This is good rock and roll music. Welcome. I guess this is a different episode within our previous episode. Well, it's within the Radiohead

episode, actually. Yeah, so we're within a different show. I'm Scott. This is Scott, obviously. Our guest today is Ben Lee. And we're talking Reveal. The REM album album of course uh you ever heard that one i never listened to reveal all right well thanks we'll see you next time bye all right so we're back in the Radiohead podcast. So did you ever meet...

What's his name? Tom Jones? Tom Green? Tom York. I don't think I did. I heard he's very grumpy. Really? Yeah. Is he... Okay, do you think that he could reboot the grumpy old

men franchise with another like with neil young would that be fun a marky smith from the fall if he was still around that would be where he's still to be here yes or marky mark i'll take him too marky mark and tom york marky playing marky smith, or we can call him Marky York. Just rebooting the Grumpy Old Man franchise, or at least what was that one where they were on a boat, Adam? I think Out to Sea. Out to Sea, thank you. I think we could just,

I think someone can make the poster with Tom York and who is the other one? Either Marky Smith or Marky Mark or Neil Young. How about the four of them? All of them on a boat i went to a tiny radio head acoustic performance some weird like music industry type thing and it was just tom and is the guy is like the really pretty one with a long johnny johnny johnny yeah um they were playing together it was it was gorgeous it was really really nice but there was a sound issue and um tom just put down his guitar in the middle of the song and went, fix it, chaps, and walked off stage. And I was like, wow, I want to be able to do that. That was so badass.

I was so confident. That's how I treat Engineer Ryan, by the way. Fix it, chap. And then you walk out of your house. Out of my house and into the COVID-19 air. And I immediately get sick and die. All right. Well, that was another episode of Are You Talking Radiohead?

We'll see you. Thanks. Bye. Bye. good ep oh yeah i mean good shit those guys talk about i mean we look we've been getting requests to do that show for a long time so to have the first episode be premiered like this this is incredible it's organic it truly truly is so um any other rem uh memories ben um re emery's uh there was yeah i guess i've got uh a couple more that came to mind and they all that there's just one more that was like a real wrist slap from michael steib and again i say i love these

wrists i say these with gratitude like these gratitude. These were part of my learning experience about being a human being, like not being an 18-year-old idiot. Because I just thought, I saw it as show business as kind of like this ride that I would take for a little bit, and then it would crash and burn and go on to other things. I didn't look at it as like, are these humans that I would know potentially in the 25th century? Right, right.

So I remember this one very weird night at, I don't even know, this story is so bizarrely name-droppy and maybe not that interesting. Hey, you're right in our wheelhouse, honestly. Do you remember Spy Bar? Did you guys ever go to Spy Bar? I think I went once. Where was that? So it was like a nightclub downtown in New York.

Oh, no, then I never never then i can't remember that yeah so i was sitting um on these couches with stipe winona rider and courtney love and um this was prime like late 90s early 2000s just golden just you know really i did it i was there and. And I remember Winona saying something like, I won't say who the artist is. Well, she said, I never tell someone I like their work when I don't. And I said, well, actually, remember you told that guy X. I'm not going to say who that was. You told X I liked his band and I really don't.

So you tell her. And Michael said, just look to me, he said, we don't do that. I was like, whoa, damn, this is real social etiquette class. And Michael said, just looked at me and he said, we don't do that. I was like, whoa, damn, this is real social etiquette class. Because I'd literally thrown someone under the bus who was sitting in. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. I don't know if your listeners actually care about this stuff, but this is to me about how you become a human being in a community with some level of dignity to it why why do you think that you

didn't have the basic uh social graces ben is because you got famous so early i it it's more than that it was like it was it was more that i came from a like search and destroy mentality rather than like respect like like my whole ethos was like see who you could piss off yeah rather than see who you could befriend like i just sort of a mark of success of a great night was if you did something totally humiliating that um made someone question your sanity i guess you know this is how this might in my late teens early 20s but then it all sort of like um it all sort of like wrapped up with um i just it's going like this because i actually made a list of these things because i was like i haven't thought about them in so long oh that's great i remember the night um as i was starting to mature through this period and it was like kind of like

humiliating that every time i interacted with michael stein I'd come away feeling really bad about myself with good reason. So I just, I was, and then my dad got sick and I kind of, it seemed like he was going to die and he did, he did end up dying. And it was, Michael Stipe used to throw this Christmas party every year with, I think Helena Christensen and Julie Panabianco, they do this at Casa La Femme, this restaurant. I went one year yeah yeah yeah yeah so um so um and it was really weird because especially around my dad's death i guess it was sort of when i started to actually grow up and have real human feelings and not just try and be this sort of what do you call it like infant terrible or whatever it is you know like just like just like a nightmare human being and um we pronounced it uh all right there you go that was a real that was a new scott

ocherman slap on the wrist yes you'll walk away from this feeling like a terrible human being and i remember i saw i saw michael in the corner he's talking to bono and um and i that's him in the corner yes i'm in the corner of this party and bono was going in and we're going out the back door i remember that clearly and um and i said to michael uh i've i've got a i'm gonna i've got to leave i'm getting up early i'm flying. My dad's really sick. And I'm going to go back and be with him in Australia. I'm concerned he's going to die. And from Michael, who's someone I thought didn't even particularly like me, he just looked at me and said, I'll include him in my prayers.

And it was such a sweet thing to say. And that might be actually the last time I bumped into him. Wow. So it's funny, there's a whole arc in terms of my own, like the heartbreak of being a young person around my interactions with Michael Stipe. Yeah. You know? Wow.

That's amazing. I wonder if it's really interesting because on one hand, on one hand, I'm so glad when i was that age i wasn't around uh michael stipe or any like influential figure like that because i would have uh embarrassed myself but in a way it's you like you said like it's really great that you did because you looking back you learn so much there are all these like really valuable lessons and stuff yeah i mean they look they're the same lessons you would learn through probably like interacting at college and meeting professors you admire you know right my right he's he's sort of he's kind of the professor of music in a way like the way honestly the way he sort of

would reach out to younger artists and befriend them and sort of teach them. So, yeah, I mean, you're maybe his teacher's assistant. I think we all, I think like, you know, us three, say, like the paths we have taken in show business have been, I imagine for you guys also, it seems like that from outside, have been, I imagine for you guys also, it seems like that from outside, very influenced by the way Michael Stipe rode his relationship to the underground and the mainstream and wanted to be in multiple conversations at once.

And I think that he was the first artist that I saw that actually did that successfully. And in that way, I think none of us would have kind of the types of careers we've aspired to have without the influence of someone like him. That's interesting. I've mainly tried to stick to the mainstream with my art, but I can see how Adam, maybe you do one for you and one for them, right? Yeah, I do one for me, one for them, and then one for them, and then one for you and one for them right uh yeah i do one for me one for them and then one for them and then one for them and then i do some for no one as well i think i've ended up doing a few of

those um well those are amazing stories yeah and and what what an incredible experience i'm sure uh adam and i have had those types of experiences with various people. I with people in comedy and Adam with whatever he does. And I think that that's just incredible. And for you to be an artist that young and to still not only be doing it, but to be so relevant is incredible. And I would imagine that you are in that role for younger artists yourself at this point. Well, I've actually felt at times, I felt that bristly energy from young artists who I relate to what they're doing. Like I remember there was this kind of someone in sort of a cool band in

Australia who had gotten side of stage passes when I was playing a show or something. And he was sitting there with his legs stretched out, like he leaned against the wall while I was playing. And I sort of like was, you know, moving, dancing around the stage.

And I felt someone kick me and I looked down and there was this kid he's just like this punk kid like totally interfering in my show like casually kicking me and i just it was when i sort of realized that like oh yeah you you know it's that old you don't know it's a truism it's like first you throw stones at glass houses then you become a glass house like you got to go on the receiving end of that type of arrogance if you're going to give it out as a young person and then as a parent you learn to like oh man you're going to receive the whole thing you know whatever it was you gave you're going to get it amazing just yesterday um my wait a minute is this an episode of just Yeah, it is. Hey everyone, welcome to Just Yesterday. This is Scott. Oh, this is Scott. And we're talking about things that happened not too long ago, in fact, just yesterday. coincidentally this just happened yesterday the thing i was going to talk about that's right within our time period so this is perfect for this show

well i better hurry up before it's tomorrow because we don't have that show yet you son of a bitch how do you do it no but just yesterday my son went to make a microwave macaroni and cheese, right? And we were gone. We had gone grocery shopping. So he was doing this at home and he put it in, but hit a wrong button or something. And it came out and it was like still partially frozen. And so he was just like, oh like oh okay and he just threw it in the garbage and when we got home he told us he's like you know this thing something with the

microwave was messed up so i had to throw it away we were like wait what what are you talking about so like yeah you just don't you and then it was like why didn't you just cook it more and he's like i don't know so you just don't grow up and you figure shit out oh man that is so much funnier than anything that happened to me just yesterday um but so that's that's to wrap it up for this episode. We'll see you next time. Thanks, bye. Bye. Good app for the first app.

Really good. It seemed like it was less about things that happened yesterday than you wanting to talk shit about your kid. Yeah, well, that's a whole other show we could start. Speaking of family, Ben, how are you doing during the quarantine, everything going on? Undoubtedly, you're holed up with your family. Yeah, it's pretty weird, but I've got to say there is good stuff happening in it. I am seeing a refinement of ideas by being forced into sort of weird creative challenges. You know what I mean?

Like, it's not as easy to move forward with all the things we were previously planning and our ways of doing things. And it's almost like there's a kind of purification. Like I really liked this. There was a philosopher called Gurchiev who used to pick up and move to countries where they were having political uprisings and upheaval because he believed that like in those stressful times

of social change, you actually found something akin to, you know, personal truth. And I see something like that happening it is weird it's like um i don't want to be too uh i don't want to like it beats premature like make a big statement about this but there is something about i'm noticing a very subtle form of insecurity i've had about my place in the world creatively, like forever. You know, I'm like 27 years into my career, and I still have big questions gnawing at me about does what I do have value? And is it useful? Is it important? I mean, we all just want to contribute things of value, you know, and there's been something

about seeing the way my audience has turned to my music and taken comfort in it that I have a feeling it's like, it's sort of put that to rest. Like we don't all get to make music that people want to listen to every day. Like if you make music, that's like, Hey, let's go to the club and party. That's music. That's going to be like used every day by people. My music that's like, hey, let's go to the club and party, that's music that's going to be used every day by people. These are my favorite songs. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. But if you make music that maybe is about connecting in harder times and about vulnerability, maybe I'm realizing people don't turn to that every day, but when they do turn to

it, they need it and there's value in it. So there's something profound that I've been experiencing as an artist just by kind of leaving this out. Amazing. That's cool. And who was the philosopher? Oh, that was Gurdjieff. I stole Adam's joke. It's still funny. It's still good. Well, I got to say, Ben, you're far too smart to be on this show. You have so many interesting things to say. We are slightly running out of time, but we do have time. You were kind enough to say that you would do a live version of an REM song here on the show. Yeah.

Yeah. So like a week or two ago is REM's 40th anniversary of them forming. And I just tweeted out like, oh, night swimming, man, that song, that,

that, that song is like so meaningful, meaningful to me. I remember my friend Matthew, he edited together. He went to a flea market in New York and he bought, you know, you could sometimes find people's old family movies like on, or something. something. And he found them and they were footage of someone like in the

Catskills or like, like families in black and white jumping off piers and things. And he edited it together to night swimming. And, um, it was my, that was the moment where I understood that song. Um, and it was so beautiful. And anyway, I just tweeted about that. And I was blown away by the amount of people who came back and were like, that's my favorite R.E.M. song. That song changed my life. It's a song I turned to. It's a song I'd forgotten.

And so I just covered it. And it was weirdly like it's one of those songs that I don't think, was it like even a single? I'm not sure if that was. Eventually. Yeah, eventually. Yeah, I think it was like even a single i'm not sure if that eventually yeah eventually yeah i think it was like the fourth or fifth single from that it was not what you'd call like one of their sort of big world domination hits but it is a song that has lasted in sort of the canon of great songs in cultural memory and um it's just it's just was a joy to like reconnect

with it and those songs kind of linger under the surface i think until until you need them that's great and a song that i did not hear the rem version of first i heard uh previous guest april richardson's husband do it first with his band jean oh yeah and i was like oh yeah that's an rem song and then i investigated the rem song because i was in a period where i didn't really wasn't into rem, but I heard his version of that song and I was like, wow, what a beautiful song. And I went back and really got into Automatic for the People because of it. Oh, it's so good.

And it's so complex, the story he tells through the lyrics. And it's just gorgeous. Yeah. So you are, and you're going to do, essentially you covered this, you put it up on Instagram. Was that right? Yeah, I put it up on Instagram. It was just for fun, but people really responded.

So I'll play it for you guys. That's awesome. So are you all set up? Everything ready to go here? I'm ready to go. All right. This is Ben Lee. What a treat.

We're going to hear REM's Night Swimming, Ben Lee 2020 quarantine version. Is that the appropriate amount of parentheticals? Yeah, that's in parentheses, but yeah, for sure. Okay, great. All right, here we go, Ben. This is Night Swimming.

Night Swimming Night Swimming deserves a quiet night. The photograph on the dashboard taken years ago. Turn around backwards so the windshield shows. Every street light reveals the picture in reverse Still it's so much clearer I forgot my shirt at the water's edge

The moon is low tonight. Night swimming deserves a quiet night. Night swimming deserves a quiet night I'm not sure all these people understand It's not like years ago The fear of getting caught Of recklessness and water That cannot see me naked These things they go away Replaced by everyday Night swimming Remembering that night

September's coming soon I'm pining for the moon, what if there were two Side by side in orbit, around the fairest son that bright tide forever drum could not describe night swimming you I thought I knew you

you I cannot judge you I thought you knew me this one laughing quietly Underneath my breath, night swimming The photograph reflects every streetlighter reminder Night swimming deserves a quiet night Deserves a quiet night Ah, incredible. What a performance.

Adam, what do you think? It was beautiful. Thank you so much, Ben. I think better than the original. Ah, that's a big call. Something I would have said at 18 years old, but not today. than the original. Ah, that's a big, big call. Something I would have said at 18 years old, but not today.

Well, Ben, thank you so much for being on the show. It means a lot to finally get to talk to you. And, you know, I do believe your music is a salve during these troubled times.

So I would encourage listeners to go check out your discography. Is there a certain record of yours that you would say to people like, oh, check out this one if you've never heard what I do? No, not particularly. It's like, you know, it's such a long, I've been making records for so long and I have some people who are so passionate about different phases of my career

and believe that was the only time I was good and the rest of the times were terrible that I couldn't even, I can't even begin to think like. You do go through a lot of different styles. Your early records are a kind of acoustic troubadour stuff produced by, your first one was produced by Brad Wood who did his fairs. And then you added synthesizers into the mix and then started kind of writing more beat songs at a certain point. And really, so you can find something for any mood you're in, in the discography of Ben Lee. So what I would suggest is to buy all of his records and listen to the first 20 seconds of each one.

And if you're not into it, go, nope, throw it into the trash. There will eventually be one that you enjoy and just listen to the rest of that. Ben, thank you so much for being here. Quite a pleasure. And Adam, thank you so much for doing another episode with me. Are we going to do more? Maybe. Maybe we have a surprise coming up. I don't know. What do you think? I have no idea. It's so hard to get you to text me back okay great i don't know all right um we are going to uh that's going to be it for

this episode so until next time we hope that you have found what you're looking for bye Bye.