UAP Unidentified Alien Podcast - UAP EP 120 This Week in UFOs...

Episode Date: March 19, 2025

What are the aliens? Where are they coming from? Can some people perceive them while others can not? And why is a man named Dr. John Blitch so important to this conversation nowadays? Stephen Diener discusses all of these questions and so much more with fellow podcaster Pavel Ibarra Meda as they dive into some of the biggest topics, as well as some forgotten ones, and try to answer the most intriguing questions surrounding the UFO topic today...See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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cash account offered by Wealthfront Brokerage LLC member FINRA SIPC, not a bank. Investing involves risk, including possible loss of principle investment advisory services provided by Wealthfront Advisors LLC and SEC registered investment advisor. Right. Welcome back in to UAP for episode 120. Stephen Dean are back with you here, as always, on the unidentified alienated to alien podcast. Thanks for coming back.

Thanks for sticking around here with me for another new episode here today. And this is a really fun one because I was thinking about it earlier in the week. And I said to myself, you know, a lot of times when I do an episode, it's really focuses on one specific subject, right? whether it's an interview or just a storytelling aspect of an episode. There are sometimes, you know, I branch off into a few different things for sure, but there's usually a specific topic involved. This time I thought I really want to have just a general conversation about the lay of the land,

about the UFO topic, really just in general, all the different things going on, all the different aspects, the facets, the angles about the conversation and the hot topics involving it. and even some ones that we forgot about over the past maybe year or two. And so in order to do that, I reached out to a great voice in this field. His name is Pavel Ibarameda, if you don't know him. Pavel is great. He has his own podcast called Sico Activo and does a lot on YouTube and Spotify. And he has on some fantastic guests.

And recently I saw he had on Dr. John Blitch, who is involved with the Skywatcher program with Jake Barber. And I thought, you know what? I would really like to talk to Pavel not only about that interview because it was really interesting as they got into, you know, consciousness and abductions and, you know, psionics and all those different things. But just to have the general conversation about the UFO topic and go over all the different stories. And like I said, all the different angles and aspects of this. So I was really excited to do that. And I'm glad I did because I think the conversation just came out great and I think you're really going to enjoy it. So that's what we got here today for episode 120 of UAP.

So I don't have a long preface for this one. I just want you to hear the episode. I wanted you to hear the conversation because I think it was really thought-provoking, at least it was for me, and I think it will be for you as well. A lot of different angles again with this one. So something after you're going to enjoy, look forward to you hearing it. So I'm going to stop talking and bring it to you right now. And, of course, stick around for after we're done talking for some final thoughts right here on this episode of UAP.

So it's myself and Pavel Ibarameda from the SICO Activo podcast right here on UAP. Enjoy. Pavel, thanks for coming on to UAP today. Hey, Stephen. Thank you for having me back, man. I'm glad to be here. Yeah, absolutely. Thanks for making the time to do it.

Man, there's so much that's been going on. And I just want to kind of just have that back and forth with you, like I said. And, you know, there's very few people I can kind of one hand on how many people I would, A, be able to do this with and also be want to do it with. and you're definitely on that short list. So I'm glad that we can dive into a couple of things today. I want to start with some of the things that you've actually done recently. You spoke to just a couple of days ago, Dr. John Blitch, who I think people may not know the name off the tip of their tongue,

but if you watch some of the Skywatcher content with Jake Barber, he was on that. And he was interviewed by Ross Colthart as well recently. and he has an unbelievable story of his own when it comes to abduction and what he's doing on his end. So it was pretty awesome that you got to speak with him and cover a bunch of topics with him. So I just want to ask you first on that end. What did you learn from Dr. John Blitch? What really stood at you during that interview? There was a little bit of confusion when he first came out because I didn't know who he was either before he came out.

I think nobody knew. Just the people like on the inside knew about him. And when he came out, he gave me the impression that whatever this intelligence is, is all benevolent. And that's what I gathered from him from his first couple of interviews. But then I started looking at him opening up to the possibility that there may be some kind of malevolent aspect to this too, not just benevolent. And I've always said that I find it really suspicious when I see someone who is either either says it's all malevolent or it's all benevolent. There needs to be a balance with everything.

It's the universe we're talking about. It's chaotic. So I asked him about that. And now he gave me a more nuanced kind of response because he thinks that for the most part, they're not not benevolent per se but more like indifferent and like treating treating us the human species as a lesser species that they want to take care of which i found really interesting because there are many books from the past for example the john keel literature Disneyland of the gods for example or there's a writer from spain called salvador frechedo who has a book that is literally called the human farm. Because he has this theory that we are, the entire planet is a farm, so to speak, like of all the species that exist and that includes us.

And I got that sense from Dr. Blitch that during his experience encounter, so his abduction experience, he felt like he was being treated like a laboratory, Labrador is treated at a veterinarian, which was really weird to me. But it kind of makes sense, though. That's what really struck me the most. I also spoke to him about the nuclear weapon connection to UFOs. And I found out that he has a group of all the people that have had experiences with nuclear energy and UFOs. And they just, like, talk often.

and amongst each other. And they have like this brotherhood, you could call it, where they talk about this, and they've been talking about this with Robert Hastings and Dr. Jacobs and Bob Salas and him. Keep in mind, he carried the nuclear football. That's no small thing. Wow.

Wow. Yeah, that's a very big deal. I actually didn't know that. Can I ask you to expand on that a little bit? Who was the president when he? had the nuclear football i am almost certain that it was bush junior okay but what i what i i didn't ask him that detail specifically but according to the timeline because when uh september 11 happened he was already doing um stuff with robotics and he's actually he led the very first

team that used a robot to find people in the rubble after after 9-11 and during the at the ground zero wow and when i read that i was like well yeah he if he climbed positions that position wasn't yet on the level of the nuclear football so i would think that after that he was like promoted to something to that nature you know so maybe bush or i don't know if obama i'm not sure uh we would have to ask him though but that's that's That's really interesting to me, though. And the resume on the guy is just ridiculous. Yeah, I mean, and that's the thing about him.

And the reason why I wanted to bring him up first is because he is just such an interesting character to come out from the Jake Barber saga. You know, everybody paid attention to Jake Barber and rightfully so, incredible story. And he tells it very well. But when you have a guy like, you know, Dr. John Blitch, who, like you said, and I didn't know this until this very second that he carried the nuclear football. and just his resume in general in the military and professionally, education-wise. And you have a guy like that who comes out and says that he's been abducted, that he experienced some incredible otherworldly things where he had these firsthand encounters, not only with crafts, but with beings on the craft.

So when people hear these unbelievable abduction stories, unfortunately, you know, it carries a stigma of like, oh, that's just some crazy, dude or some crazy lady saying that. We just talked about his resume and he has one of the most unbelievable abduction cases I've ever heard. So, I mean, it's, it's really, he's a unique case of someone that has that type of, you know, second to none resume in government, military and everything combined and someone who's had this unbelievable close encounter. Yeah. And it's becoming more apparent that people that credentialed are starting to come forward more with these stories. That if you look at just like a decade ago, that rarely ever happened.

Yeah. Like people so high and with such prestige because to me, for example, Dr. Gary Nolan, he was nominated for a Nobel Prize. and he talks about his experience, about the little beings that he encountered when he was a child. And that didn't happen a decade ago. We just heard Jacques Valet, who has been doing interviews lately promoting his new book. And now he is coming forward, talking about out-of-body experiences and interacting with an entity, a shadow being of sorts. And Dr. Jacques Valais is also one of the. most prominent people, not just in euphology. He basically co-founded the precursor to the internet,

ARPANET. So he's like a really big person, like really credentialed. And I think that's, that's going to be happening more often in the future, in the near future. I think that Dr. Blitch is just the latest of a lot of people that have experienced stuff. I also, I forgot to mention Jim Semiband who basically has the rank of a general but in the CIA and you know his story is like really wild even his wife had this abduction experience so yeah I think it's needed too for the topic in general we need people that credentialed to say these things not just us that are podcasters or and I'm sorry but every abduct abduction uh victim has some story to tell that it is important. But unfortunately, we're still living in

this world where people do look at these credentials as sources to find stuff more believable, you know. Yeah. And I think that's an important point to make him. I'm glad you said it because you know, when I say someone who has his credentials, I don't want it personally to come across as like disrespectful to any, you know, normal person like you or I who might have an experience and then they feel unimportant or undeserving of being heard. That's not the intention. What I think what we're both saying here, if I may speak for both of us, is that it's, it's helps normal people like us when someone like a Dr. John Blitz or a Jacques Follay

or someone of that stature or Dr. Gary Nolan, you know, someone like that can come out and say, yeah, I had an experience like them. And people, for better or for worse, end up paying attention more to the credentialed person, you know, the Tim Galadette's, they pay, you know, or the Lou Elizondos or whoever it might be, they pay attention to that person that has the background and has the long resume because that makes them seem more, you know, I guess more believable, right? Because what do they have to get out of this? Right?

And if anything, they have a lot more to lose than they have to get out of it. So I think that's what we're both getting out there. Yeah. And it's part of the conversation I had with Blitz of this stigma because even he told me that he was, he felt stigma against his own story. That for a long time, he thought all of that he experienced was a dream. And then he realized that there were just too many similarities between his history. story and other stories, and he was like, this can't be a coincidence. So he started looking into it more. And that's why he became, that's one of the reasons he became a behavioral psychologist.

And I think it's the perfect way to keep exploring this, because we can't discount the possibility that, because we don't, unless you have actually seen something tangible within this reality, you know, 3D world, we can't discount. the possibility that it is happening at a subconscious level all of this stuff. Not that it isn't real, just that it is, it is happening like that, like as if it was a dream. And we can't discount that yet until we prove that it's actually, you know, real, real, like in 3D world. Yeah, and it's, it's a, I think it's a good point because you have so many people who have that description where they say, I felt like it was in a dream.

Or they say, I'm pretty sure it wasn't a dream. But, you know, it felt like a dream a little bit. And then, but all of a sudden I woke up, I was back in my bed and they have trouble making that distinction. So what is happening, right? Is it really a different realm? Or is there something happening that is, you know, advanced technology is being used on the abductee to put them in a state of some type of trance. And that is something that's, I mean, it's, well, we don't have. the answers to unfortunately but it's a question that kind of remains out there and it's an important one yeah

it is and talking about it is going to help more because there is the part of this whole topic that has the most stigma is still that yes right you know that's what like most people don't want to even touch at all and i found that a very bold move from both news nation ross and also dr blitz because he's the one who ultimately decided to step in front of the camera and talk about this. I think that was a bold move, but I found it refreshing. There's people that didn't like it that were like, whoa, whoa, whoa, too soon. We want nuts and bolts first, you know, but I think that the topic needs to keep advancing. It can't get stock in a single thing.

That's why I talk a lot about consciousness too, because there's also stigma there. People say that it's like new age stuff, you know, as in a derogatory term. But it is also essential to this conversation. And we need to keep moving forward on every single front, every single avenue that touches on the phenomenon. We need to talk about all the aspects of the phenomenon at the same time, not just focus on one. That's a bad idea. That's why I talk about consciousness so much on my channel because I think that consciousness, this abduction phenomenon, those topics that people think are woo or not real, not tangible, I think they're just as important as the nuts and bolts or the potential that there has been some type of a contact with or agreement with a non-human intelligence.

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It feels like a continuation. Explore your options at kingsley manor.org, a nonprofit month-to-month senior community within the Front Porch family. Yeah, it's really interesting because I've heard that from people too. It's like, you know, which way do we want it, right? Because a lot of people, we clamber for information. We clamber for the truth. We want the truth.

And then when a whistleblower comes out or a witness comes out and they have an unbelievable story. We say, well, that can't be true. This guy is just in, you know, in for clicks or for money or he's trying to write a book. And so it's always like a give or take and a back and forth. And it's okay to be skeptical. We don't want to, you know, just jump right into something. But there also has to be that healthy give and take.

And also to your point, when it comes in, I think that Jake Barber's story is a really good example, because that's where I think for the first time, the idea of, of, you know, mixing in this, this level of consciousness and the psionics, really mixing those things together. It's always kind of been a sidebar discussion in euphology, the psionics. And it really kind of got pushed forward with the Jake Barber and Dr. John Blitz discussions that came out recently. And you had people, like you said, saying, let's bring it back a little bit, let's rein it in.

And so it's like, well, which way do we want it? Do we want to approach this as, say, like a school level? Let's start with two plus two and work our way up to calculus. Or do we want to have, here's the whole binder on everything you need to know in the discussions that are taking place? I guess it depends on the level of upbringing that you had. because, for example, I like to talk about consciousness because that is something that in my family, my mother made us read a lot of books when we were younger. And I read a lot of philosophy.

I read a lot of Carl Jung, I read a lot of other types of literature like novels, Alejandro Dumas, all this stuff, and also Latin American authors. I love Eduardo Galliano, for example. And all of those talk about a different aspect of consciousness, just under a different kind of lens, you know? And if you are not someone who has been getting ready for that, I know it can be very overwhelming because it's something you don't know. Yeah, it depends on that. Do you think that this was part of specifically talking about Dr. John Blitch and Jake Barber? Do you think that was specifically part of an effort to introduce this part of the?

conversation to the masses because you know i mean like you and i can have this conversation and we can talk about it with with guests on our show or we might do a you know 45 minutes on the topic and present it in a certain way but to present it in the way that they did to the masses that come out with ross cold heart and then for jesse michael's to have on jake barber and it felt to me and i could be off on this and i don't mean this in a bad way but it felt coordinated yeah i think it is you know what i mean like so was that you feel like that was that you feel like that was a way for that part of the conversation to say let's take the next step here it is it's it's an attempt to try and get it into the sidegeist from them and yeah of course i would have planned it too

you know because it's not an easy thing to do uh especially in today's society which is very reactionary and the attention span is so short uh and everyone who's doing using the internet it, you know? And for me, for example, I focus on consciousness, but I know that there are a lot of other topics. So I tried to cover most of them if I can. But it's difficult to like be extremely knowledgeable on everything. It's it's really hard. Doing it in a more like mainstream way through News Nation, I think that there was a lot of people that felt a connection to these people that we're speaking on the camera and on the microphone. There was certainly for me, you know.

Sure. And actually on that note, as far as like, you know, trying to keep our finger on the pulse of as many topics as we possibly can, I want to ask you about something that's, I really give you a lot of credit on, actually, for really kind of hammering home on this topic of the NASCA mummies as it became known. And I know people say that's not really the correct term. There's some other ways we can talk about it, but that's kind of how it became known was the NASCAR mummies.

And it was kind of like a hot story, maybe about a year ago, a year and a half somewhere in there. And then like a lot of other things, it kind of gets pushed to the side because something else happens. But you've done a lot of work on this. And it's something that kind of stays in the back of my head because it's important. And there's still research being done on this. So I want to ask you, where is that, Pavel? What should people know about the NASCAR mummies? What have we found out within the past?

year that people don't know about. First of all, there are like groups that are trying to put this out in the open and in the public. That they both have access to people close to the mummies. And they're like contentious groups, so to speak. And that makes it already problematic to cover because you're like getting, if you're an outsider like me who's trying to do this, you're getting yourself into some type of a battle that is taking place to like be the first who make this announcement official, you know? because as far as the data that I've seen, the larger bodies that are called the M-types for Maria the mummy, those are real according to the carbon dating, according to the craniometry, according to the DNA, and according to the morphological anthropologists who have. looked at the feet and the hands that are tridactyl. I was going to say, just to remind anybody who might have forgot about this,

we were talking about, I mean, beings that look like, just maybe straight up, they look like aliens. I mean, they have the big heads and they have, you know, long fingers. You mentioned the tridactyl, so they have three fingers and three toes, right? Yeah, and that is natural. Those grew up naturally. Right, right. They weren't added, right?

That was found out. Or cut out. out, you know, because they could have been cut out. But no, they have natural morphology, which makes it really wild because there are some that are like the craniums are more human-like, still a little bigger than ours, but there are others that are like way bigger. And the angles of the cranium is way different than ours. and that makes it really

diverse and kind of hard to comprehend in some ways because we can't really tell where they come from. All we know now is that there was a time when these creatures were alive, they have tridactyl features and they have a lot of features that are human-like too, which is really strange.

So we don't know. I don't think that trying to say, oh, they came from Sadat Reticuli or from another planet right out of the bat. I think that is jumping the gun for me because, yes, they are really weird. They're not completely human. That's for sure. So what are they? And that's where we are right now because there needs to be some kind of confirmation from the Peruvian government who actually last year, late last

year, they had their first hearing that was like taken more seriously about the mummies. And yes, two doctors there confirmed that Maria has tridactyl features that are natural that weren't like added or tampered on. Now, I see what makes this so intriguing and what made it so intriguing to begin with is that when people saw these mummies, again, we look at it and say, oh, my gosh, that's an alien. And if that's the case, we're talking about skeletal remains of an otherworldly being. And ever since then, since these things were made public, there's been studies and they're finding more and more information out. Like you said, you just pointed a few things out there.

So, I mean, it's, but again, it's one of those things that's not really spoken about. And I think it should be, which is why I wanted to bring it up to you, because we're talking about skeletal remains of an alien. That's proof. I mean, that's proof that people say, show me something okay well here's an alien skeleton and and what did they say that's fake right or you know and that's because of the disinformation campaign that has been taken place for since 2014 uh as every topic that is controversial in the world whether it's aliens or whatever if it's controversial it definitely has some kind of a pushback or a disinfo campaign from someone because it is potentially essentially something that could change things, you know?

So yeah. Yeah. It's and it also it also makes you think about the effort that is going on in the US. Why are they ignoring something like this? If there's already data that proves that it needs to be investigated more and like more collectively, not just Latin American scientists or just French scientists or, you know. Yeah. I think that's, I won't make any judgments, but I think that's not a good idea to ignore that, to be honest with you.

I'm with you, and I'm really interested to see what kind of comes out of, you know, an interest in disclosure when it comes to, you know, current cabinet members and current administration. We have this transparency task force headed by Annapalina Luna and a lot of different congressmen and women on there. and they're supposedly going after, you know, truth on a lot of different things. And I actually spoke to Representative Eric Burleson not too long ago here on UAP, and he's a part of that task force. And, you know, he's very sincere that they want to find these things out. And I think what now the NASCAR mummies didn't come up, but a lot of the other things did, like, you know, just whether it's any of the classified files on the terrestrial or non-terrestrial

side, you know, is what they're kind of looking into. but you know one of the things that really struck me when I spoke to him Pavel was the the actuality that they have a lot of stuff hidden from them and it's super frustrating for them I mean this isn't like you know Annapalina Luna or Scott Burleson or Timberchette go up in front of the cameras on an interview and BS people on you know well aliens or drones or you know the Epstein client list or whatever it might be a lot of things are spoken about and they say well we're trying to find that they really are trying to find out information. So I think to that point, what you're saying is, you know, why isn't this stuff brought up more within the researchers in the United States? It's a great question and it's one that I find kind of to be inexplicable. Yeah, I don't. There are a couple of reasons why they choose not to like touch it. Yeah, please go ahead.

told you about the disinformation campaign. I already told you about that. But there are also some other researchers who don't have the best reputation in their eyes that are too involved with the case. And that also makes it problematic because let me give you an example. Matt Ford wrote a tweet a few months ago saying that people owed Jaime Mao Zan an apology. because he looked at the data and he realized that yes, some of these specimens are real. And he wrote that tweet. He wrote it honestly and, but there's a lot of people that don't like

Mr. Mousin. And honestly, I don't know why. I mean, he's been wrong in many cases. I know and I believe that, I believe that he was probably set up in many of them because he reached a level of like popularity within the uphology community that I'm not sure if it just robbed people the wrong way, you know? And I don't know. I just think he's trying to make this case happen because he sees that. he sees that there is something that he can do really do. Because data is very compelling, man.

I'm telling you. Yeah. So does it really just come down to the source then you think? Rather than the data or the situation, it just comes down to the source. In this case, I think it does because of that. There's people that just don't. And I think that Matt Ford was, he, He erased a tweet later, but it stayed there for a while and it made a lot of impressions.

And after a while, he erased it, I would think that the people that don't like Mr. Mausanne were talking to him and told him that it was a bad idea to lead the tweet. So I think there's a cognitive dissonance or some kind of a disconnection between this camp of Mausanne and the rest of Uphology. And I don't know why it exists. It could be something, some type of epistemic injustice like Professor Stephen Brown says, that it's non-intentional, but it still happens, you know? And that's something that I think still happens, definitely, especially in euphology.

If they don't see you at their level on some way, you know, they don't, they don't, paid that much attention. And I think it happens. Hey guys, so before we get back into the conversation, I just want to talk about something that affects all of us. And it's scary. Starting something new, right? It's hard and it is kind of terrifying because you think about all the work that goes into it.

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GuardianHR.com. Are you talking about controversial things? One of those controversial things, and one of the characters actually that is controversial is someone like Ashton Forbes. Now, I've spoken to Ashton here a bunch of times. I can personally say that I really enjoy talking to him. A lot of people don't like that. A lot of people don't like Ashton Forbes. But I bring him up because he talks about the MH370 case.

And he talks about free energy and all those things. And I think that is one of those taboo controversial subjects within euphology. So I want to just throw that out there for you and kind of leave that carrot dangling. for you to kind of take and run with and get your take on things like free energy in the MH370 case. Yeah. When I first got into this space,

I started doing like a year before I became public of investigating every player. You could say podcaster, Twitter account that was like very much involved in the UFO topic. and I saw a couple of cases like four or five that I, when I saw them, I instantly thought, I'm not going to touch this.

Because there's just like way too much toxicity around it. So it's gotten, I've seen it, it's gotten really nasty between people, you know? And I'm like, I don't want to be part of that. So I refrain from commenting on MH370 specifically. But free energy, that's something different because that's been in the conversation for decades now. It's been talked about. I remember that documentary of the Mark McCandlish story that I saw a few years ago and the ARV and all that stuff.

That's a really interesting story that. that talks about essentially cracking free energy with reverse engineered technology, obviously. But yeah. So I think there is smoke, you could say. There's also the Thomas Townsend Brown story. I don't know if you're familiar with it. Yeah, go and give some of the highlights of that. So Thomas Townsend Brown was a scientist who is.

believed to may have cracked some type of new propulsion back in the 50s. There was like, I think it was 1952. I'm not especially acquainted with the date, but there was like a meeting, like a summit between physicists who talked about anti-gravity at Chapel Hill University. And there were like two groups and they didn't really come out with a final decision on whether they've cracked it or not, but it was talked about there. There are many hints that simultaneously at the same time, T.T. Brown was cracking anti-gravity in private on its own.

And Jesse Michaels has a great documentary about that whole story. It's really, really interesting. Yeah, he's doing a good job with that. I don't know. You can just imagine, though, what if something was announced tomorrow? What would happen to all the structures that already exist of oil and other stuff that depends on oil? That'd be really hard to take, I would say, no? It would be an absolute. We would talk about paradigm changers. That is the paradigm changer. I mean, if the concept of, or even, dare I say, the reality of free energy came out.

I mean, it would truly, truly change the world in an instant. And I think, and I'm curious to get your take on this Bible, I think that's one of the main things. People have asked me before, you know, Stephen, why do you think it's so controversial? Why do you think that people don't tell the truth when it comes to aliens? Why hide it? And I give the same reasons all the time. Religion, I think it would cause some upheaval there. Inevitably, people are going to have a lot of questions.

I personally think it strengthens the case for higher power, but that's just, that's just my opinion. Money slash power is the other one. And then that kind of goes hands in hand with the free energy aspect. It would be a domino effect. Do you think that's one of the main players? Do you think I'm on or off on those things? I think that if somebody is trying to prevent for this to be announced, if it exists, maybe doing it because they fear this happening,

you know, this domino effect. If they had like a justifiable explanation to why they're preventing for this truth to come out, it would be because of something like that, you know. But I think that it's been almost 80 years and I think people need to know at least something, you know, whatever this is, is happening. I'm not convinced still that we have visitors from other planets, you know,

to be honest with you. I'm open to the idea, but there needs to be way more evidence shown in order for that to happen. What do you think is more likely? Because that's another facet of the conversation that intrigues me. This is why I really wanted to talk to you today, was just to throw all this stuff out there and have this general conversation about uphology because there's just so much, like I said at the beginning, there's just so much that, you know, I hate sometimes putting myself in a cage and say, well, I'm only going to talk about this and I'm only going to talk about this because there's so many different facets and angles to this. So what do you think about the discussion about when we say, well, where do they come from? Because you mentioned beings coming from other planets. So is it interstellary travel?

Are we talking about cryptotrestrials? Are we talking about something like, you know, Dr. Michael Masters, where he says that maybe. it's people, future humans, or even people who were already here. You know, that's a theory coming from underground or civilizations in the ocean. There's so many interdimensional. I think Tom DeLong talks about that. So is it all the above? Is it one of the other?

Where do you think we kind of lean? What makes sense to you? I know there's no right answer to this right now, but what makes sense to you when those theories come up? But the theories that I like the most are Jacques Valet's theory, that the phenomenon is like a trickster that. plays with our perception. It's, I don't think it's tangible.

Because there's also what I've experienced, which I had a fear-death experience, you call it. I spoke to Nick Cook about this. I asked him if I didn't go unconscious, and he told me that was a fear-death experience. And it has very similar effects, only it's way more traumatic because you live through it. And when I suffered that, I felt like I was communicating with something.

I was speaking to something. And I don't know what it was, you know. And there were a lot of things that happened there that just made me think that, yeah, it could be something from somewhere else, but not necessarily on this dimension, you know? Right. And that's another part of this discussion that I think. failed to bring up, and that's my fault, we're talking about the spirituality. And people say, there are people in the government, Pavel, that absolutely believe in that they actually want to

stay away, at least these are the reports, that they want to stay away from this discussion because they think this is either angels or demons or both. And it's just way over our head. I mean, so that's another facet to this. Yeah, and we don't know exactly. Dr. John Blitch gave a wonderful response when I asked him about that. he said that he was perfectly okay with whatever people think it is. And I think that's the only real response you can give to that because nobody really knows what it is. So you can't discount anything because we don't know. Yeah.

I think it's even worth bringing up. And this is one of those things where I think it and then I say it and I say, Stephen, you're crazy. But I think it's even worth bringing up the idea that some of these things, things that we see in the sky could actually be sentient beings in a way. Yeah. You know, and these are things instead of we're conditioned to think about it's some type of mechanical craft, right? Because we think about airplanes, we think about helicopters, blimps, whatever,

things that use motors or some type of propulsion to fly. But what if what sometimes people are seeing are not craft? What if they're at the actual? beings. That's a key word sometimes, you know, because there's so many different accounts, though. Some are physical. And that's, I mean, that, how do you tell them, no, you didn't see that or you didn't, you can't say that to someone who experienced something and just like discounted like that, dude. It's, and especially because it's happening to so many people. It's, it's not just a dream. It's, and it's not a coincidence either.

Well, I mean, yeah, right. I mean, because you think about all the different, you know, societies and cultures, parts of the world, whether it's from Chile or whether you go to Japan or to, you know, Russia or England or the United States anywhere, Canada, Mexico, any of the islands, African countries. I mean, you know, the Zimbabwe case. I mean, that's one of the most unbelievable cases of all time. It was it 1990, somewhere in the mid-90s? 96, I think. 96, that's what I was thinking, right? You know, where the school children see the UFO come down, the alien comes down,

and they all described, yeah, it was somewhere in there. You know, they all describe the same thing. And those types of things, Pavel, match what other people saw 500 years ago or 1,000 years ago in different parts of the world. So to your point, a coincidence is just in my book, and I hate to speak in absolutes, but a coincidence to me is impossible. Yeah, exactly. And it just played with their perception. Can you see that? Because in the 1900s, for example, there was like the airship phenomenon. Right. People were seeing like airships. Because that was the time back, way back when people talk about angels or the Ezekiel wheel, which was a really weird one.

Correct. So, yeah, it depends on the times and it plays with people's perception. that's as far as I've gone so far. Again, it's just so fascinating to me, and I get so energetic and hyped up when I talk about it because it's just those possibilities just really exciting me of like, what is it? You know what is really out there?

You mentioned Jacques-Fillet, and I think he had one of the most vivid explanations that I've heard somebody give on interdimensionality when it comes to the possibility of interdimensional beings. And forgive me, I'm incorrect by I believe it was shockfully who gave this example where he said think about a fly we are the fly and a fly is inside of a box and you take the top off now the fly is used to flying around and it can't get out of this box and you take the top off the box and now the fly doesn't know that the top is off but there's this whole other world outside of the box And I just thought that was such a vivid analogy to think that that's how, you know, a 4D world, a 5D world would work. We can't see outside of our 3D stratosphere, if you will.

Yeah. And there's also this book from John Keel called A Tower where he talks about this concept of the super spectrum, which is like a number of electromagnetic waves that animals can see and we can. or we can feel and they can't. And I think that is also related to all of that, you know, the super spectrum. Because some people, like, see something at a certain frequency, and it can be a mass sighting, and somebody sees something very different than the other. And somebody, others don't see nothing, like, at all.

They just stay there. And I think that's the super spectrum at play. and how we are tuned to the super spectrum at play. It depends on also, I think I connect that to like things like near death experiences or, I don't know, meditation, you know, stuff like that or even traumatic experiences like a car crash or stuff like that. That stress inoculation that Jake Barber talked about. Right. Yeah.

I think it works with everybody and it changes your frequency so you can see more things and think about different things as well. Yeah, psychedelics is another one. Things that people have different perceptions or can change the perceptions go to a different state to, well, see or perceive different things. And it's just so fascinating to talk about all the different possibilities with this. before we're done, Pavel, I want to ask you about something else that kind of went away and I still, the reason I want to bring this up at the risk of anybody rolling in their eyes like

and saying themselves do to get over it. No one cares about this anymore. But I have a lot of people who still message me about this topic and that is the drones. The drone phenomenon that happened. And I speak in the past tense, knowing full well that it's still happening, but it's just not spoken about anymore. What was, I wanted to get your opinion on that when it was at its height back November, December, and where do you think we stand now, given all of the details and happenings that have gone on since then?

I think that the administration tried to kill the story with that announcement. I don't know why, but it was like kind of evident for me. I don't know what's going on. I'm not sure if there really are just sanctioned, but really secret. So you can't really ask about them because it's a really big technology. But in the West Coast, back in December, something did happen in Oregon that wasn't drones. Right. There was an audio of some pilots talking about this.

There were like red orbs that were going at super. velocities and stuff like that. So honestly, these others do seem to me like some type of a human-made drone with new capabilities that we've seen.

But I don't think that's all that's going on. Yeah, it was very strange just in the aspect of you know, for the Trump administration to come out and say it. I know, again, at the risk of being a dead horse, but just in the context

of the discussion from the command say that it was, you know, authorized by the FAA and there were just drones, you know, doing research and experimentation. It's, it just, it didn't make sense, right? Because there were so many conflicting reports with that. And just speaking with all the people that I speak with, that's just not how it works. You don't fly those things over a populist unless there's a specific reason. And I had somebody tell me, uh, who was, you know, who works behind the scenes saying that, you know, this was really scary because they're obviously lying. And it was such a bold-faced lie that they have to be doing that for a reason. And you probably, if you probably heard me talk to me before, Anthony Williams, who is the military intelligence analyst I've had on here many times.

He's the one who said that to me. He's like, it was the most scary report I've ever heard in my career when I heard them come out with that. Because, and this is a guy that's dealt with like, you know, near war. been in wars and on the back end side dealing with you know what do you think they are though it's something that i really don't know um but it's something that it's so consequential that they will just lie to our face and and not mind lying to our face just so they can cover it up and say that there's nothing to see here and what's really you know what I mean? And that was, that's what really frightened Anthony Williams when I spoke to him

a couple months back and why he said it was the scariest report he's ever seen in his career, because it was so obviously incorrect that there's a reason why they had to come out and do that, even though it made no sense. And they knew that it wasn't going to add up. So why do that? Why go to those lengths, you know? And on top of that, too, Pavel, you have two different administrations, right into very different um outlooks on how to handle policy when it comes to the Biden administration outgoing and Trump incoming and both administrations essentially didn't tell anybody anything about this it was like the only thing that they agreed on and and you had Trump coming in who said that he was going to tell everybody what it was and didn't understand why they couldn't say it and then

they come in and say well nothing to see here so it's it's to me and not that's why again at the risk of be a dead horse but to me it just it's just one of those things that continues to confounds me that i can't help but to continue to pay attention to and say why did they lie about this so boldly what you know what what what is so terrible about this that they can't say what it is or won't say what it is did you ever get to see the interview that david more house did on danny jones no i didn't david morehouse is a former cia agent who worked a little bit on Stargate and he like explained to Danny a bunch of different secret aircraft that they made the US government and he showed them a few and man a lot of those really do

look quite anomalous yeah for sure and it really could just be that I mean you know as not to get too nefarious on it really could just be something that um It is just, you know, really, really top secret U.S. tech. And for some reason, they're breaking the mold and flying it over a populace, which is never done and never would be done. That's why we have proving grounds out in the desert where nobody is. But for some reason, maybe they felt like they had to do it this way. And it's just super secret U.S. tech. I actually had somebody write me a message just today.

I got to it. I think they wrote it to me a couple weeks ago, but I just got to it today where they said that they live in an area of Virginia where there is a Lockheed facility and they have people who tell them, hey, they see these types of drones coming in and out like every night and where they're filming them. So maybe it is something, not to sound trite about it, but maybe it is something that just is as simple as that and they don't want to talk about secret tech that's being used. I don't know. Yeah.

And I don't think we like you and I are going to get to know the full details. of that ever, you know. It's, looks that secretive. If you do, let me know. That's right. I'll be the first to tell you. Before we're done here, Bob, I want to give you a chance to vote quick just to kind of touch on one thing that's really kind of been on your mind lately in the UFO topic, the UFO world, and talk about some things that behind the scenes you're working on, some of the content that you have in the works that's going to be coming out. Yeah, well, I got an interview that I'll released of Lembo Logan. I did that on Tuesday. He was on with Jason Sands on Joe Rogan, right?

Lenvo Logan. Okay. Yeah. And I heard him talking out of space a few days ago. Our interview was already scheduled by then. And he revealed some things that I found really interesting. So I'm going to bring them up. Like he said that David Grush approached him as one of the first people from the task force. I found that really interesting. He claims to have seen a craft back in the early 90s when he was living in the UK. And when he saw the Calvin photo, he was like, that's what I saw. Wow. I want to ask him about that.

That's interesting. And a couple more things about generally the UAP Task Force and the Stick Mine, all that stuff. I want to ask them about that. And right now I'm just focusing on the interviews and just trying to create more content. But I do have a couple of things that I'm working on. One of them is not my own to tell. Okay. But the other one is I am becoming more active on KGRA, which is,

the radio station where I published my interviews on Fridays. So I'm just going to become more active there with them and help them do more content. That's what's coming soon, though. All right. We'll keep it out for it. Great stuff, Bobel. I mean, it just personally like to say congratulations on all the work. You know, you put in the work.

I see, you know, guys like, I'm not, this isn't like me patting myself on the back, but guys like you and I, Patrick from vetted. You know, there's a lot of guys who really put in the work on this topic and they reap the benefits. And I think you're one of those guys. You put your head down. You grind. And you've grown in the process in audience and, you know, in attention. So kudos to you, man.

Great job and doing all that. Likewise, man. Likewise. Thank you so much. Absolutely. And on that note, before we go, where can everybody find you? How can they find your content? Yeah.

Yeah, you can find me on YouTube and Spotify and KGRA as SICOAQAGIOA and on X, you can find me as Pabel Ibarra Meda all together. That's my main account, but I also have the Sicoctivo podcast X account. I'm very active on X. I don't want to shy away from it because people who shy away from something that is like, where the reality happens. The reality is that the world is accessible. It's not just Twitter, you know.

That's fair. Put that on a shirt, brand that. Why would you run away from something that is reality? That's the world we live in. And we got to learn how to move through it, you know, and get used to everything we see. We need to do that. Outstanding.

Yeah, I completely agree with you. It kind of is a microcosm of the world. A lot of different viewpoints. and sometimes they can be an echo chamber, but sometimes there's different viewpoints. And we need to learn to get along. So I'm with you on that. 100%.

Well, Pavel, I can't say your name as cool as you do, but Paveli Bauer made it from the Seco Activo podcast. Thanks so much. Awesome conversation. Really happy to talk to you again here on UAP. Thanks for making the time to come on here today. Thank you, Stephen. Thank you for having me.

And hi to everyone. Absolutely. Anytime. Thanks, Bob. We'll talk again soon. And there we have it. Thanks again to Pavel for joining the show. Be sure to check out his stuff.

again, he does a great job. Actually, he mentioned that interview he did with Lenval Logan. He was just on Joe Rogan with Jason Sands not too long ago. And so check that out. Check out the interview with Dr. John Blitch and just, you know, all his stuff there on YouTube. The Secoactivo podcast does a fantastic job and always enjoy talking to him. And I'm sure we'll be talking again in the future. Maybe I'll be on his show.

We'll see. I'll let you know if and when that's happening. And he was on, like you heard me say during the interview, I had him on, I believe it was about a year ago, to originally speak about the NASCAR mummies. You heard us refer to that during the episode. I'm glad I was able to bring that back up, you know, all this time later, because that was, it truly was such a hot topic. It was the topic of conversation. I mean, quite frankly, in the UFO community. And just one of those things, like I alluded to during the conversation, there, is just one of those things that kind of got pushed to the side as more and more different things

began to happen, you know, in the UFO world. There's just so much that goes on these days. So that one kind of got pushed to this side. But the fact of the matter is, you know, just to touch on one of the things we spoke about, that's something that if they really can prove that we're looking at, you know, alien skeletons, that's scientific proof. That's hard proof. And so it's just amazing to me.

I'm with Pavel on that one. It really mystifies me as to why. I know he had his reasons for it, but just overall as to why it's not brought up more. You know, we have skeletons there. These are mummies that are not human. So, you know, come on. Like, why is that not a bigger deal? So I'm glad we got to talk about that.

And, you know, it's not that I think people say it's not a big deal. I think it's just people forget about stuff. You know, we see the latest thing. we start talking about it and we get quite frankly maybe distracted sometimes and i do the same thing it's like okay i talked about that time to talk about the next thing so i totally get it but that's why i like to rehash some of these things some time to time because it's not like it was solved it's not like there were definitive answers one way or the other it's still an active conversation it's still an active investigation so i'm glad we got to bring that back up as well as talking about

the drones and things like that because i have just thought to myself before and i've I've studied here on the show before where I said, I'm just going to stop talking about the drones. I'm not going to bring it up anymore. And I can't tell you the amount of messages I got from, you know, people like you who listen to the show, say, no, no, no, please do not stop talking about the drones. It's too important. I still see them where I live. Please don't stop talking about it. Please continue to bring it up.

So I said, okay. You know, I again, you know, I said it while talking to Pavel at the risk of beating a dead horse. I just don't want to sound like a broken record and talk about things that. you know, maybe people don't care about it anymore. I don't think it's worth talking about or they're sick of hearing about it. That's not what I want to do. But if it still feels important to you, then it's important to me. So I guess I should say I'm glad it's still important to you because, again, that's one of those things.

It may not be at the front of our minds, but it's still a big question out there of what was going on and what is going on. So I'm glad we've got to bring that up. And so many other conversations, you know, just the origin stories and abductions in general. consciousness, the psionics aspect and how that's evolved in the conversation. Just really, really great stuff that I was happy. And so much more that I was happy I got to talk to Pavel about and just bring up in a general conversation today. I really wanted to have that general conversation about the UFO topic and all the things

involved with it. So hopefully you were satisfied with what you heard. And I got to touch on some of the things that you were thinking about yourself. And I know there's so much more that we can get to. And hopefully, Bill, do that again one day. future. And who knows what might pop up before the next episode of UAP, which will be episode 112. But until then, make sure to follow along wherever you get your podcast, continue to download and subscribe. Five-star ratings are always very much appreciated on whatever platform

you download from. So that's always a great thing. And I appreciate those. So that's Spotify, Apple, Amazon, wherever you get your podcast, you can find UAP to search for UAP, the Unidentified Alien podcast. Also follow along on social media. I try to update there. I actually got some new little videos up on TikTok and YouTube this past week. That was pat to myself on the back for that one. I've only been meaning to do it for like two months. So you can follow along on YouTube.

It's at UA Podcast. And on TikTok and X, it's at UA Podcast 850. So I add the 850 there on X, Twitter, and TikTok. So you can follow along and get all the latest updates and little things that I put out there. for the podcast and just a topic in general. But with all that said, be sure to stay up to date because you never know what's going to come next year on UAP, but I will let you know. So with all that said, thank you all again so much, truly for everything, for all the

support, for all the kind messages. And just, you know, I read the messages and it's just amazing. It's always so flattering and humbling is maybe the better word. Humbling is probably the better word. It's flattering too, but humbling more than anything to see some of the, just incredibly kind and uplifting messages that I get of people saying, you know, I'm a part of their daily routine. They listen to the show where they listen with their kids or with their spouse. And it's just, it's just unbelievable to me. So thank you so much for that and for making me a part of

your daily routine or your weekly routines and for trusting me enough within this space to keep coming back and listen to the show and hear these conversations and, you know, hear what's going on as I try to do my best every single time to give you all the details about. about what's happening in the incredible world of UAP. So until next time, it's Stephen Deaneer here saying thank you again. And we'll talk again soon right here on UAP, the Unidentified Alien Podcast.