UAP Unidentified Alien Podcast - UAP EP 130 Exclusive Lue Elizondo Interview part 1

Episode Date: May 13, 2025

During this special two part episode, Lue Elizondo joins Stephen Diener for this exclusive interview as they discuss the fallout stemming from his showing of the mistaken UFO photo in DC, and what happened behind the scenes that led to it. Plus, why is there another delay in the latest congressional hearing on UAPs? All of this and much more is discussed during this revealing episode...See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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Stephen Mahoney.com. Come into this special episode of UAP. I'm Stephen Dean. We're back with you here, as always, on the Unidentified Alien Podcasts for episode 130, and what will probably prove to be a source of great controversy and argument. But, hey, if that's how it goes, that's how it goes. I just try to bring you everything that I can here on UAP,

because on this episode 130, I am, quite frankly, honored and happy to be able to bring to you an exclusive interview with Louelizondo. And this is actually just a few things before we get into the interview to set the table and kind of give a backstory on this as we get into part one here today. This is a two-part series, part one being today, of course. And just as we get into it, like I said, kind of setting the table, this has been in the works for a couple of months. So I want to tell you that as we get into this, this was been worked on behind the scenes well before Lou Elizondo showed up at the congressional roundtable there about a week or two ago with, you know, Representatives Burleson and Luna, Eric Davis, Avi Loeb, the different witnesses who were there to

testify to different things to Congress when it comes to aliens, UFOs, the existence, the study of it all, and what is going on and what they should be looking at and what they should know. So this was in the works well before that. And obviously that's where all the controversy comes from lately with Willizant. surrounding that event in D.C., which we do get to, by the way, at the very start of the interview. I wasn't pulling any punches. I actually tell him right off the bat, let's address the elephant in the room, which you'll hear me say, and just talk about what happened in D.C. So we get into that immediately as soon as the interview starts. But I do want to say that this has been in the works for a while, and I want to give a shout out to Dan Warren.

Dan, if you don't know him, I actually had him on the show here not too long ago, about a couple months ago. he's the host of his own shows, which is called the Fifth Pillar of Emphasis. And he does a great job on his show and his content as an awesome following on X, on TikTok, and does a great job presenting UFO, UAP, alien content to the masses to get the information out there. And he did a great interview with Uelizondo a couple months back. And after he did his interview with Lou, I decided I would love to talk to Dan about his interview that he did with. Lou Elizando. So we did that and I had him on the show and we had a fantastic conversation about that and a couple of other things. So if you didn't get to hear that interview, you could always

go back and listen from March when I spoke to him or early April somewhere in there. But when we were done, again, just to kind of give you the backstory on this, I asked him, I said, look, if you wouldn't mind, is there a way that I could get in touch with Lou? I would love to interview him. I've been wanting to interview Lou for a long time on UAP to bring you that side of the story to bring you directly from Louelizondo, his thoughts, his opinions and everything going on to you directly right here on UAP. I've wanted to do that for a few years now. And Dan was kind enough to do that.

So I just want to give him a shout out because without Dan Warren, this interview here today is not possible. So thank you to him. And because of that, I can bring you this interview. This, what turned in to be, again, wasn't planning on this to be such a, you know, a big thing because of the controversy that happened in D.C., but it kind of turned into this exclusive interview on everything that went down in D.C. where Lou Alessando mistakenly showed a picture of what was thought to be a UFO that he was

showing to the congressional members and was later found out to not be a UFO. It was a mistake. So we talk about that right off the bat. What went into that, the backstory and the fallout from it. And then we get into a bunch of other things here in part one as well. I do ask him as well, do you feel like you were set up? and he gives a very thoughtful answer on that. We find out actually that the pilot who gave him that photograph that he mentions in the details of the story was actually ready and set to be interviewed.

Like this was someone who wanted to come out and speak about his experiences as a pilot, what he's seen. And he's not going to do that anymore because of the negative backlash that came out from that moment in front of the congressional members with this mistaken photo. So we kind of lost that opportunity, unfortunately. but he gets into that and we talk about, you know, the responsibility that goes behind presenting these things when it comes to Congress or to the public and just lose really personal take on this. I mean, just for me, it was some of the most personal feelings, I guess you could say, that Lou has kind of revealed behind what goes into this for himself and the expectations that he has for himself and what he's trying to do. So again, all up to you.

I know everybody has their own opinion about Lou Elisando these days, but that's why I wanted to bring this out to you. So you could hear directly from Lou in a way that I don't think we have before or since this, you know, mistaken UFO photo that was shown in front of Congress or the congressional members anyway at that roundtable just about a week or two ago. And I think it is pretty revealing. And it's something that hasn't been heard yet until right now in this interview. So we're going to get into that. And also very importantly, we get into.

his feelings and thoughts and opinions on the task force, how they're doing. But more importantly, what happened with the hearing? There was supposed to be another UAP hearing as we speak. I was supposed to happen this week, along with a couple of other things. And we find out exactly why that is not happening. And it was actually an answer that I was not aware of. So Lou kind of gives an explanation to that behind the scenes, what's going on, and why the delay and when we might be able to see that hearing that was supposed to take place this week.

and I got to ask him a question that I've had on my mind for a while, really ever since I was working on making this interview happen over the past couple of months. And the question was, what is disclosure to you and what was that moment for you where you realized this was something that was real? That's, you know, other life and the biologics and the non-human craft. What was that moment for you? So I think it's really thought-provoking answer that. Lou ends up giving there. What is disclosure to him? And have we had it already in some facets? So a lot is covered here in part one and then stick around for afterwards because there's some important afterthoughts that I want to give some things that we weren't able to get to.

Just right off the bat, I want to tell you throughout the entire thing, part one and two, I'm sorry if you're disappointed about this, but I just want to tell you up front, we were not able to get to the drones. I wanted to ask him about the drones, ran out of time, and I wanted to ask him about the Las Vegas case. I know there's a lot of you who are passionate about the Las Vegas case with the Kenmore family, the aliens coming down. You know, according to that story, into the backyard. Of course, I covered that extensively with Scott Roder on every single angle.

I wanted to ask him about his thoughts on that because I've never heard him speak on it. But unfortunately, we ran out of time. We actually spoke for almost two hours, but there was so much to get to and so much to cover that, unfortunately, those two things were kind of left by the wayside. So I just want to put that out front right now. I was not able to get to Vegas or the drones, but we covered a lot of stuff. So stick around after this part portion of the interview, some after thoughts on one thing that Lou told me after we were done speaking, after we were done recording. And he wanted to clear something up.

And I asked him, is it okay if I mentioned that and kind of like a post interview thoughts? He said, yes, please, go ahead. So I'm going to tell you what that was and, you know, what was kind of left out there to this message to relate to you that relates to the UAP Disclosure Fund. and why Lue Luzondo is not part of the UAP Disclosure Fund anymore. I found out what happened there. So a lot of post-interview thoughts to get to. So definitely stick around and I'll preview part two as well after this part one is done. But enough of me talking.

Here is right now the interview with myself and Lou Elizondo that's exclusive on UAP. Hope you enjoy. And now here he is for the first time ever on UAP, Luella Zondo. So thanks for coming on to the Unidentified Alien Podcast. It's honestly a pleasure to have you. So thanks for making time to do this. Atlas is Stephen. My honor and privilege.

I appreciate it. I have been, forgive me for having to cancel the first time. My bandwidth was, unfortunately, was very stretched thin. But I really, really appreciate the opportunity to come on your show.

And again, a huge thank you to your audience and your listeners out there that are tuning in. Thank you sincerely. Yeah, absolutely. And it's my pleasure. So I'm glad we get to do this. and I'm looking forward to what should be a pretty interesting discussion, so I'm definitely glad to do it.

First thing is first, Lou, I just, you know, elephant in the room. Let's go back to D.C. real quick. On this literally list of questions that I have for you. Sure you do. I do. And, you know, we're in that room. We're at the roundtable. And a lot of people were tuning in, watching yourself. Avi Loeb, Eric Davis, Congressman Eric Burleson, Congresswoman Annapolina Lune,

and just the entire room there that morning. And what everyone ends up taking out of it is the picture that you showed of the mistaken UFO. So I know there hasn't been a lot other than a couple of statements on X that you put out there. So I want to just give you the moment first as we start off to address that and kind of get off what's on your chest since that's happened about a week or two ago. Sure. Well, I appreciate it. Well, it's not really weighing on my chest. I explained it and I'm happy to do it again.

So long story short is that we had spent some time arranging this forum for Congress and the American people to have a chance for experts to come in and talk about their experiences and why disclosure and greater transparency is important and why Congress really needs to be involved. And so about probably five, ten minutes while we're out there in a hallway before we get going. gentleman who I know for a little while, had some work with the U.S. government, and we can talk about that a little later, came to me and says, look, you know, I'm a private pilot, Lou. I've got this color photo. I had seen something similar before, but it was black and white, and it was kind of grainy, it was a printoff. This was allegedly the photo that a private pilot had taken and says, look, you know, I saw this over this particular area, and this is what my, looking at it, I'm saying it's these dimensions, what I think it is.

And I looked at the photo. I said, okay, well, there's some detail here. And he says, my point is that I have no way to report this information. And none of my pilot friends have a way to report this. He's a civilian pilot. Not a commercial aircraft pilot, a civilian pilot, right? So it's not like he can report things through his airline management or anything like that. And so I looked at it.

I said, you know, that might be a good point to use to say, look, you know, here's an example of something that a pilot saw. This is what he alleges. and this is why we need a more comprehensive approach to civilian reporting, because it's not just the combat pilots like the F-18 pilots, like running graves, etc. And it's not just the commercial pilots, right? There's this whole other category of pilots out there that need some place to report something that they've seen in the sky. And by the way, for years, I've talked to private pilots, and a lot of them report strange things.

So I took that opportunity, and at that moment, when I had the photo, I said, pull it out and I said to the group. I said, look, folks, this photo has not been vetted. So let me just say up front, I haven't had the time to vet. It hasn't been professional looked at, but here's the story behind it. And so I use it as an intent as an example to drive home a point for the requirement for civilian reporting. And then hopefully we could use as a discussion point later on with some of our panel members. And then I said it again. I caveat it again. I said, look, this is photo has been provided to me. It has and I've just been given permission to share it, so I'm sharing it with you.

Keeping my lot of the criticisms I get from people is, well, do you don't share anything with us? Okay, well, here it is. I'll share it with you as it's actually happening, right? Hey, look, I got this interesting photo, but it has not been vetted. And so I emphasize that twice. And unfortunately, a lot of people out there in social media who probably didn't see the interview or for whatever reason wanted to make an issue with it. And look, I don't know what to tell you, man. It is what it is.

You know, you're damned if you do, damned if you don't. In the spirit of trying to be increasingly more transparent with people, you always run a risk, right? You always run a risk, especially when information is not vetted. And that's why I think it's important that we do do the best we can to caveat that. And that's why I did what I did. And I said, this is the reason why I'm sharing it. And this photo has not been vetted. I don't know.

It's strange. The reaction was really strange. In hindsight, 2020, if I knew now, If I knew then what I knew now, I certainly wouldn't have shared the photograph because the intent was to be constructive, not destructive. And unfortunately, I think people in their fervor to either prove a point maybe or perhaps just, you know, random haters out there, people will take things and either take them out of context or blow them out of proportion. And I think that's what we had here. Now, is it possible, too, that I didn't spend enough time caveating it and emphasizing it? is true, but we had limited time in that space on the hill for me to talk. It was really about

the panelists. That whole meaning there had nothing to do with me. That whole meeting that we had up there for hours was really for you. It was for the American public to have experts come in from academia and from the National Defense industry, NASA, the scientific communities. That's what it was intended to do. And unfortunately, I think people missed the point. again, I said before, I accept responsibility. For some reason, people did not hear me clearly say twice. This photo was not vetted. I mean, I don't know what to tell you. I mean, the audio quality, maybe it wasn't good. Maybe I didn't speak clearly enough in the speaker. You know, maybe I didn't have enough coffee that morning. But, you know, it was a hectic week. And we were doing a lot. We had been there for a while on Capitol Hill for days and days and days before. So people don't realize you just sound like you show up and stretch from the morning bed and get some exercise and have. have some coffee and we're going to go to Capitol Hill.

Right. You know, I was, I was burning the candle on both ends for, for weeks prior to getting maybe two, if I'm lucky, three hours of sleep. And I'm not a, I'm not a young guy, man. I mean, it takes a toll on you, right? For sure. So that is, that's it. That's all there is to it.

And again, if, you know, people want to use that and continue to, to drive a wedge for disclosure, hey, man, I can't help you. You know, I think my track record's been pretty darn good. the last eight years on this topic. We've been able to come a very, very long way because of all of us working together. If there are people in the community that want to be divisive and divide,

then, you know, I can't help that, brother. I don't know what to tell you. You know, that's just human nature, unfortunately. And it's not just in the UFO community. It's in a lot of communities, you'll see people that will take things out of context or they will try to assign intent where there is no intent or malintent,

which is worse. They'll try to assign malintent. That wasn't a case here. This was simply a way to share with American public as information is coming to me. So you could see for yourself. Hey, look, this just came to me. Yeah. Anyways.

Yeah, no, and I'm glad to have you give that, you know, backstory to it because it actually touches on two questions specifically on that, Lou, that I think you answered within, which was one, do you feel like there was some type of intentional sabotage there, which was something that was going on around, you know, the interweb, if you will, people saying was Lou giving this on purpose? Yeah, it happened to me before. Yeah, I've been fooled. I've been fooled before even by people inside the intelligence community.

And I wasn't in the intelligence community. So there's always a risk when you make a decision like that. There's always a risk that it can blow up in your face, right? And that's why some people don't take risks. I wouldn't consider myself risk-averse. I would consider myself risk-aware. I try to be aware of the risks. But at the end of the day, sometimes you have to take those risks.

And there are people there that deliberately, look, just get on any. UFO web page and you can see a whole bunch of hoaxes and fake UFO videos. Why is that? Well, because people have imaginations. People want attention. People want, who knows what, right? People, some people want to control a narrative. And it is certainly possible that, you know, maybe somebody here wants to control a narrative by, let's say, forget about me, right? You find some guy who is, or gal who's, who's, you know, helping lead something to, for the betterment of a, for what they think is a betterment of the people. And if you are part of the institution, you know, if it's threatening to you, then yeah, disinformation works great because why do you use it? Well, you use it to

discredit people. And it is a tool of the intelligence community to do that. We do it with our foreign adversaries all the time. Via propaganda, you know, and making, making stories up to make someone look bad. Is that the case here? I really don't think so. I really don't think so. The individual would have a lot to lose because the individual has contracts with certain elements in the intelligence community and the Department of Defense and maintains a top secret security clearance because it would be very easy to expose that. If it was deliberate and I found out it was deliberate, then I would certainly expose that individual because I do protect my sources very well. Everybody knows that. Even when I first came out eight years ago, I could have

thrown people under the bus and I never did, even to defend my sources. So I'm not that way. I don't think the individual that provided, I think he had good intentions. I really do. Could I be wrong? It could be. I could be. But there's no indicators there. There were no microbehaviors or neurolinguistics or anything that that individual was doing. That would tell me otherwise. And the way we met was really by chance. I'm not going to go into detail here, but I do not see this as a setup, to be honest with you. Could it be? sure, and we know that these things have happened before in the past, and they're probably going to continue to happen, so we need to be aware of it. But just, I don't get that feeling in this particular case. Yeah, I'm going to be easy to blame it, right? Be easy. Oh, yeah, I was just set up trying to make me look bad. But look, look, I'm not going to say that because I really don't think that was a case. Okay, no, and I'm glad we addressed that. So I'm glad it came up there. And so, and also something that I kind of caught on to when you were explaining the situation was it wasn't, to me,

it doesn't seem like your mission in that moment was to say, hey, look at my scoop. Here's this UFO picture that you guys have never seen. That wasn't what you were trying to do there. No, it wasn't even about me, guys. This is why I said. That's why I was a facilitator. I just asked the questions.

And what I tried to do was create an atmosphere, an environment where we could share information as it's happening, right? People always will complain to say, you know, Lou, why don't you ever share anything new? Why don't you share anything this? what are this, that. So being mindful of that, you know, part of that is to say, okay, look, what I just got. And then we can, we can decide together later on, you know, the validity of it. But the point being is that we need a civilian reporting mechanism. I talked to some members of Congress. They, they have relayed to me that was their impression as well, that there was no malice

intended. So, you know, I think we have to avoid being, look, this is a topic that's very emotional for a lot of people, you know, ask me how I know. But we have to be careful being hyperbolic. We have to be careful overreacting these knee-jerk reactions. In the fervor that people want to know, there's going to be mistakes that are going to be made. That's fact. We're all human, right? They're going to be made by you.

They're going to be made by me. They're going to be made by everybody. The point here is not to deflect and, you know, try to, I don't know. not take responsibility. The point is to see, where did things break down if they broke down? And if they didn't break down, well, then that's just people's impression. That's too bad. Now, if things did break down, meaning there was something that could have been done and wasn't done, well, then that would be the responsibility of folks like us, right, who are presenting the information. So in this particular case, I think it might be a combination of both. Maybe I didn't spend

enough time foot stomping and saying this has not been vetted, right? I could have. I thought I did it enough, but maybe I didn't. And I also think that we need to try to withdraw our overreaction, because there are real issues in the UFO community, but we're not the enemy. You know, we're not your enemy. We're trying to help. We are all here working our butts off for free and spending our own money to do this and flying out and staying in hotels and driving cars and renting cars and gas. That's expensive, you know, and we're not made of money. Most of us, Maybe one or two of those guys, you know, has more resources and the rest. But for the most part, we're all doing this out of the goodness of our own hearts.

And the intent is pure. And I think there's a lot more real enemy to disclosure than ourselves. We really need to stop trying to fight ourselves, I think, because most people, most people that I know, at least, are trying to do a good job for everybody. And they're not being paid. They're doing it, you know, they're using their own resources. There are, I think there are elements within the U.S. government that are still very much against disclosure. And I think that's very important. These are the enemies of disclosure, right?

These are the true enemies of disclosure. And they're going to do what they can to try to obfuscate and confuse and redirect, right, the attention. And that may be also what you're seeing here a little bit on social media. Some of these folks have pseudo accounts and they will say things. You know, I know one, for example, there was one post, I think, on Twitter where they He said, oh, here's the geolocation of that photo. But when you actually look up that geolocation on Google, that wasn't where they were showing. They were presenting a picture saying this is the geolocation of a particular photograph, but it wasn't.

And so doing a little digging, you know, you start seeing some interesting patterns here. I'm not saying the person who put that up, those geolocations are part of the government and part of the conspiracy. But my point is that it's very easy to confuse and obfuscate in any. type of endeavor that you're doing. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S. from household names like Death Wish Coffee, Brook Linnon, and Kylie. But what if people haven't heard about your brand? Well, Shopify helps you find your customers with easy-to-run email and social media campaigns. But what if you hit that wall and you get

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Go to Shopify.com slash UAP. That's shopify.com slash UAP. Catch the NBA playoffs on Sling TV, the most flexible live TV streaming service, putting consumers in control to watch games their way with flexible subscriptions.

Want to catch one game or a full series on ESPN? Grab a one, three, or seven-day pass. If you want to catch as many games as possible, get a monthly subscription with our ABC, NBC, and ESPN, combo package. Either way, Sling lets you watch the playoffs your way with no long-term contracts. Learn more at Sling.com. You know, there was an individual that was, I'm not going to name names, but he was a deputy director of Arrow and has left. And, you know, he's attacking whistleblowers. I think that is,

I think that's deplorable. I think that is, that is disgusting. And now you have this new leadership at Arrow that's actually, I think, really trying to do a good job. They are, if you Notice the comments from the latest director of Arrow is 180 degrees opposite of what the other director of Arrow was saying. Yes. And so, you know, I think if people just take a breath, they realize we really, we're winning. We're winning the conversation or winning the discussion. We're making a real difference. And so perhaps we shouldn't fight ourselves so much, you know, or if there's a real criticism, say, hey, listen, there's an issue with this.

Cool. but I think when it devolves into, you know, just disrespectful behavior or just false accusations and lies or, or, you know, some cases, threats, I've received some threats as a result of what I did. You know, all I can tell people is, you know, look, man, I shared this photo because you want me to share stuff with you. That's it happening. I don't know what else to do. Yeah. Yeah, totally understood. And actually, on that note, with Ken, of staying in D.C., but moving away from that a little bit, there was supposed to be a hearing. Like, as we speak this week in D.C., do we know what happened there? Why the delay? And when do we think

that might actually take place this delayed? Yeah, great question, Stephen, great question. So, first of all, there's supposed to be several things, not just a hearing. There was a very sensitive, classified meeting. So I'll share this with you. I think, and this is going to sound kind of crazy because most people would be like, wait a minute, don't they do that already? No, they don't. One of the things that we have been trying to do, Chris Mell and myself, the folks at UAPDF, was to try to get members of Congress in the House and in the Senate. Now, believe it or not, the House and the Senate, there are two different houses,

the representatives in Senate. They don't always talk with each other. You think they would, but they don't. They don't. I don't know if that's because of culture or whatever, right? surprise, surprise. And oh, by the way, that entire element of the government, the legislative branch, doesn't always talk to or get to have conversation with the executive branch, right? Wait a minute. What do you mean they don't? They don't. So this was really historic. So we had

a range for the first time. We had elements of the intelligence community, elements of the Department of Justice, and elements of the Department of Defense all together going to show up one day last week and give a top secret classified briefing on exactly what each department knows about UAP, to who? To the members of the House of Representatives that are part of this new anti-secrecy or greater transparency task force led by none other than Representative Luna and her, some of her colleagues as well, Representative Burleson, Representative Bershett. And this was really going to be, I think, very helpful because the folks that I personally knew

that were coming to this meeting were actually, people would be surprised to know were actually involved in UAP investigations and still are for their organizations, right? Everybody thinks Arrow is doing it. No, no, no, no, actually, believe it or not, there are elements. I don't want to get too specific here, but elements of the Department of Justice, elements of the Department of Defense and the intelligence community right now that are actively working on this topic. And guess what?

They're finding some pretty incredible stuff. It's not my place to share right now. You know, we want to make sure that we give them time. Are you sure? I mean, you can share if you want. Well, what happened last time I did, right? So, you know, oh, wow. You really want me to do that?

No, the point is that there's a lot of this stuff is at the class, the reality is a lot of the stuff is at the classified level. Sure. And it's really not my place to say. What really needs to happen is that these folks need to brief Congress. And then Congress needs to brief the American people. It's not my job to brief the American people, even though that's what I've been doing for a long time. It's Congress's job. It's the executive branch's job to brief the American people.

Not Lou Elizondo. My job is to help the government work better and work better together in order to do its job and then inform Congress and then inform the American people. And so this is why we were doing what we're doing. And at the last minute, Senator, I'm sorry, Senator, forgive me, Representative Luna, I was just talking about the Senate. Sure. Representative Luna had said about 12 hours before we were supposed to go into this big skip meeting,

had postponed it. It was supposed to be postponed for this last week because she had indicated that Dave Bruch was unable to make the meeting. So that didn't occur. So this entire meeting was supposed to be on the heels and help inform the hearing, right? So you don't want to have a hearing before you have this classified meeting in the SCIF. You know, so people, the problem is because people don't say that, people start inserting all sorts of weird conspiracies why it didn't happen. The reality is it because you want to have an informed hearing. You don't want to just have a hearing for the sake of hearing. It's expensive. It's a pain and a butt. You got a lot of logistics and a lot of attention, right? And so you don't want to have another hearing where it's like every other

hearing. You want it to be informed. And so that's why having these classified meetings was so important. So those meetings have been pushed forward, which then subsequently pushes forward the hearing, if that makes sense. It does. Yeah. And I think it's actually great to hear that type of light shed on this because we haven't, at least me, speaking for myself, I haven't heard that detail that the hearing was kind of dependent on the skiff meeting. So it was supposed to be a step-by-step process. Yeah. Well, it makes sense, right? Because, you know, you have people flying in and you're going to be on public television, broadcasting live, you want to have informed, you're trying to get to the truth, you're trying to get to the bottom of things. And so to have that, you first have to a baseline

understanding of what is the truth, right? So getting the newest information, not stuff 50 years old, four years old, but stuff that happened last week, right? And getting that in the hands of Congress, directly to Congress, that is, that is, that's gold. And then that helps you then when you're formulating the questions, then to ask the right questions and ask for the right witnesses to come forward. Because if you don't have that information, who do you know to ask to come forward or in some case of subpoena? For sure. So do we know of any new timeline, Lou? Or is this all just kind of up in the air? Because like you said, schedules, you know, logistics, everything that goes into it. Yeah, there's a lot going on. You know, Congress has a lot more going on than just, you know,

these issues. They're dealing with, with, you know, big economical issues or have to come up now with a new National Defense Authorization Act and the AA. There's new legislation even on UAP stuff that's being worked on behind the scenes. And then you've just got the regular politics of being a, you know, member of the House of Representatives. Keep in mind, they're only in office for two years, right? The Senate's there for six years, each person. But Congress is there only for two. So the moment you get elected, you've got to start campaigning again.

I mean, you're about to run again, right? So that last six months of year of your tenure, you've got to be campaigning. So these folks are really busy. I will tell you that I was extremely, extremely encouraged to see Representative Luna and Representative Burleson and Burchett and another representative from Alaska who have a sincere desire. These are people that if you talk to them when the camera is off, they are exactly what you see on the camera. They want the truth. What you see is what you get. like, oh, well, we want the truth because, you know, we want to, we want to suppress it.

No, they want to amplify it. They want to tell the American people and their constituents what their money is being spent on. At the end of the day, you are having your taxpayer dollars spent on something that you're not being informed about, right? Well, what are you paying for? And so this is Congress's job for that oversight and to make sure that your money, your tax dollar money, is being spent appropriately. And every time I've met these individuals, either individually or as a group, they have always said the same thing to me. We have to get to the bottle. Look, I'll be, Eric Burleson, Representative Burleson, he's what I consider a healthy skeptic, right? He's not a, he's not a UFO believer, so to speak. But he is a, he is somebody who wants the truth.

And he takes his oath seriously to be a member of Congress and to always represent the interests of his constituents. And so this is why people like that are important. These aren't, you know, a bunch of crazy UFO believers. On the contrary, these are very serious statesmen and stateswomen that are doing a hell of a job for us. And there's other ones, too, that are remaining silent right now, so I don't want to call them out particularly. But, you know, there's people that have been briefed on this topic. There's people that know a lot more to this topic now. and are really trying their best to fulfill their oath to the American people.

And I've seen it. I've seen it. Look, I've also seen a bunch that don't care. And, you know, I'll call them out equally just as I do, you know, the folks that are really trying to help. And whether it's a UFO topic or not, I think at the end of the day, people like Eric Burleson just want the truth. You know, whether it's the JFK files, whether it's UFOs, whether it's the assassination of Martin Luther King. bottom line is that there have been questions that have remained unanswered for decades

and America deserves the truth. America can handle the truth. I keep saying that. America can handle the truth. America deserves a truth. Let's level with the American people. Yeah, I love it. And actually, just to speak from my own perspective, I've been lucky enough to have Eric Burleson on

UAP a couple of times and I'm still working on getting Bricette and Luda and some of the others on here. It's kind of, you know, it's like you said, very busy, so I'm trying to make those happen as well. Yeah, yeah, but they're doing amazing. Yeah. They're doing amazing.

And I think, you know, having a classified meeting, it's going to be extremely eye-opening for them. And I look forward to them having that because I agree with you. When it comes to Burleson, you know, and a couple times he's been gracious enough to come on here, I get that same impression. I mean, he's a real guy. He has a real interest in it. And it's not just, you know, oh, let me talk about this in front of the cameras and make people happy. Like he really wants to understand what's going on. what you see is what you get.

Look, there's things I'll never say publicly, but I've seen that man do things on a private level for people to help people in a way that very few politicians will do. And he does it and he does it time and time again. This is a guy, it's not uncommon to see him working in the office or on the steps of one of the buildings at 2 o'clock in the morning. 2 o'clock in the morning.

I mean, that's up for guys, you know, if we get north of 45, 50, you know, things he's a little younger than I am, but, you know, that takes a toll on you. And you've got to wake back up and get back into the gladiator fight first thing in the morning, right? He does it because he is truly an honest person. He cares. And this is why, you know, when you have the ability to have folks like that on your team that are, or you can be on their team, however you want to describe, it doesn't matter, you know, we're all working together.

That's a true honor and privilege. That's somebody that the country really needs. There's a difference between politicians and diplomats. Both of them are skilled in the art of negotiation, but typically politicians, it's a bad word because they use those negotiation skills for self-gain, whereas a diplomat uses those negotiation skills for the greater good of everybody, collectively. But there are some politicians on Capitol Hill that deserve a hat tip, that deserve a lot of credit. because even though they are professional politicians, they're really more diplomats. They're trying to do what they're doing for the greater good of everybody. And I've seen that.

Now, there's a lot that aren't that way, right, and that are corrupt as hell. There's an old saying, you know, I used to tell this to my daughter, politics, Polly being the Latin definition word for many and ticks being blood-sucking parasites, right? So politics. Bottom line, you've got some folks in Congress that are really working. hard for you. And we should be, we should be very happy about that. And also give them some slack. Cut them some slack. Look, if people don't want to cut me slack, fine. Whatever. You know, I'm just, just some of old dude with a funny beard. But give Congress some slack. These folks really are

working very, very hard and they're working for your benefit. And I think they deserve some of that slack. If something doesn't happen exactly the way they want or when exactly they're hoping to have it, you know, they've got a lot on their plate. They really do. Hey guys, so before we get back into the conversation, I just want to talk about something that affects all of us. And it's scary. Starting something new, right? It's hard and it is kind of terrifying because you think about all the work that goes into it. Are you going to be able to succeed?

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When you fly with Hawaiian Airlines, it's hard to tell where your flight ends and family vacation begins. From the moment you board, feel the Aloha spirit. hear the sounds of Hawaii and relax with local entertainment at your seat. Let us welcome your family to our island home. Hawaii starts here. What would be the aha moment for you, Lou? I've wondered this because I was actually at the hearing in November when you were there with Tim Galadette and others.

And you went up and said, we're not alone. You know, this is happening and we need to figure out what's going on. what is the aha moment for you that when something comes out when a report comes out or some type of statement from a politician or the president or maybe something that happens just organically? What is it for you that you would say there is the capital D disclosure. This is the moment. So let me see if I can break this down because I'm hearing two different questions. What was the aha moment for me personally and then? Or what would it be?

Or maybe it's already happened. It's already happened. Okay. And so and then and then the other question is what would be what would it take for everybody, the majority of people to accept that disclosure is here, right? So I think you're kind of asking me those two questions. Is that correct? Yeah, you got it. Okay. In my own convoluted way, but yes. Okay. I want to answer it completely. So I just want to make sure I don't, I don't confuse your questions. So for me, the aha moment came. There's two ways I've noticed people have, when they're met with the definitive proof. There's two ways, mostly people kind of internalize this. And there are some

people have this immediate realization like, oh my God, this is real. Like we're not alone. Whoa. Right. And all of a sudden you can see the the, the calibration of their brains of all the things that they were told and thought in the past and all of a sudden this, wait a minute, you mean to tell me that they're real? Yes, we're telling you they're real. Well, wait a minute. Does that mean we have crashes? Well, yes, we've had crashes. Wait a minute. Does that mean I've been lied to? So, The other way people internalize this, which is probably more like me, was a more slowly gradual realization that, okay, this is not our aircraft, okay, this is not foreign adversarial aircraft, okay, this is not some sort of non-state actor, breakaway technology, okay. Okay, this is a real thing, right? And so that occurs over time, and I probably fall under that second category, simply because what I was given access to at the Pentagon was,

beyond a doubt. Keep in mind my background, right, as a former special agent. My job is very simple, take information, package it up, present it to a jury and let the jury decide for themselves. And a jury in this particular case, with the information I've seen regarding UAP, I think if they were to see what I've seen, if they would have seen what I have seen, the jury would have no option but to convict. We are well beyond reasonable doubt. This is real. We have, so you have capabilities being picked up, intelligence collection platforms that are picking these things up at the same time. Radars are picking these things up at the same time. They're being picked up on electro-optical and gun camera footage and things like that.

They're being picked up with other intelligence assets. And at the same time, they're being seen by the naked eye, by an eyewitness to a military person who's usually a trained observer. So you have like five or six separate collection capabilities all reporting the same thing, the same event, at the same time, at the same place, under the same circumstances. This is not just, you know, grandma seeing some lights on the back porch. From the back porch, this is much different. And in some cases, these videos are,

you have these things 15 feet away from the cockpit. You have these things splitting. Imagine splitting a combat formation right down the middle. And think how close to those guys flying. Those guys and gals flying those fighter planes and then having something come so close, it splits them down the middle. There is ultra 8K or I should say 4K,

ultra 4K high definition video taken by some collection sensors. I can't discuss them because they're still very sensitive and where it was taken and under the circumstances. But I think anybody seeing the videos that some of my colleagues and I have seen from weapons systems and collection systems, you realize that we're dealing with something that's not ours. When I say ours, I mean collectively, I mean humanity. It's not ours.

We don't have those capabilities because we don't. even have the understanding of the physics yet, let alone the capability to build it. Do we have neat toys? Yes, we do. We've got some very sophisticated capabilities. And, you know, this is, I'm very happy about that. I would never want to compromise those. But there's other things out there that are, that are not. And this is why we have to have a conversation. Because I think it's up to us to decide as a country, as a nation, maybe as a world, what we should do about it, what we should think about it, you know. And unfortunately, when you leave it in the hands of a three or a four star general, their focus is always national security, which don't get me wrong. We have to consider that.

But it's not the only thing we have to consider in this conversation. I said many, many times before, this is a conversation that affects every human being equally and yet differently, depending the way you were raised and the way you were brought up in your culture. This is a conversation that involves us from a psychological perspective. It affects us from a sociological perspective. It affects us from a philosophical perspective. And it affects us from a theological perspective. And we don't want a three or a four star general sitting at the Pentagon

telling us what we should think about this, right? If you want to tell me the threat to national security or maybe our nuclear equities, great. You are qualified to do that. But don't tell me what this should mean. to me, or worse, sequester this information because you don't have the answers, right? Don't let this information come out because you, Mr. Three or Four Star General, don't have the answers to provide the public. You don't have the right to make that decision. And that is what's happened

over the course of many decades, historically with this topic in the U.S. government. Someone was making a unilateral decision. Despite the overwhelming evidence, everybody knows that it's real now. If you get into a certain sensitive program, it's obvious, right? And yet, nobody wants to tell the emperor he's not wearing any clothes. Nobody wants to be the one to come out and say, yeah, this isn't ours. And we can't, we can't do that. And now as far as for the aha moment, that's kind of answering, you know, the two ways. I fall under that second category. It's just, I was exposed to so much that it's beyond shadowed. Any reasonable person would look at this and be, would have the same conclusion as myself and my colleagues had.

The other question is, what is big D? What is big disclosure? Well, I think the problem is we're confusing the word disclosure with confirmation. To me, confirmation is someone coming out and confirming the preconceived narrative you already have in your brain of what this is. Little green men, it's little grays, it's AI, it's whatever. And someone coming out in the government saying that. Other people say it's someone come out and say, no, definitively, these things, are not ours and, you know, maybe non-human. And if you look at that, I think we've already had

that. We've already had, you know, a former director of the national intelligence, Radcliffe. And by the way, he's now the director of CIA. Right. That's right. Come out for the record, say, these aren't ours. We don't know what these are. We can't replicate it. And we have lots of data on it, right? So you already had that. You had a former director of CIA that was interview talking about a UFO incidents involving an aircraft. You've already had a president come out and say, yes, these things are real. We don't know what they are. They're not ours. And you have members of Congress and you have whistleblowers, military personnel come forward and intelligence personnel all come out. So we've already kind of had that. We actually have laws now

on the table written because of we've already had that governmental disclosure, but it's soft disclosure, right? And it avoids that other area that people in the government are worried about, which is the sense of what we call catastrophic disclosure. There was a long, for a long period of time, people in our country in the government were very worried about that notion of catastrophic disclosure. We had to keep moral fabric in order together because society depends on that. And so we did not want to rock the boat too much having this conversation. And so now we realize that, you know, again, maybe Americans can handle the truth, right? Maybe we should. have this conversation. We're in a different place than we were in the middle of the Cold War with

then Soviet Union, right? We can have this conversation. We have a new generation of scientists and academics coming forward that want to talk about this topic. So I think disclosure has already occurred, and I've said before disclosure is a process. It's not an event. It's not a single moment. It's not a flashbang. It's not a firework. Ah, there you go. Hooray, we have disclosure. No, it's a slow and steady socialization, acclamation, and realization that this topic is real, it's legitimate, and it involves every one of us. And I think we were there. Now, a lot of people want confirmation, and I think that's a little bit different because I'm not sure that when all is said and done, that everything regarding this topic is necessarily going to comport to what everybody thinks is going on. And so this is why we have to encourage our members of Congress to continue to pursue this conversation because there's a lot of things that we still don't know.

A lot of people think all the government's hiding the truth from us. Yeah, but sometimes we don't have the whole truth. And that's part of the problem too, right? And what you don't want to do is how do you broadcast the fact that these things are real to the American people and broadcasts that we're looking into them and we might have been able to successfully glean some technological. advantage without tipping your hand to a foreign adversary like Russia or China or a near-peer competitor and then, you know, them figuring out what we know. That's the original reason why I was hired into A-TIP was to be the counterintelligence and security guy because we knew the Russians were very interested in what we were doing. And they still are, right? And worse than that is what we don't

want to do is tip our hand to maybe some vulnerabilities, maybe some things we don't understand yet. and maybe Russia and China are ahead of us from that particular perspective, right? That's a scary scenario. Or worse, you get some bitrate dictator in some country that figures out how to reverse engineer some of these capabilities, right, and then deploy them against us. So that's like a worst case scenario. So the real example I like to use is the fact that we have made the statement before that North Korea has atomic technology and they have a delivery mechanism, right?

Now, how those things actually work, their effectiveness, the actual targets they have, that remains classified. You know, we don't have to have that conversation with the American people. I think disclosure is the same way. I think we can have a good conversation with the American people without the worry of compromising national security or national secrets. But it's not easy, right? It's a needle that has to be threaded very carefully because if you're not careful, you can wind up really making a very significant mistake. And so, I'll tell you another reason why I think overreaction we have to be careful of, because it's going to push people back in their cave.

Actually, perfect example was with this photograph that I was given by the pilot. There was every intent to have him actually be interviewed about his experience. But because of the reaction, he's not. In fact, he's worried his life is going to be threatened. And in his mind, he thought he was doing the right thing. So I don't mind taking the heat round for it. at all. But this is why we have to really be careful of our reactions because that scares people. That when someone wants to come forward and they feel they're going to be ridicule, then they're

probably not going to come forward. And this is true with civilian pilots. It's true with intelligence officials. It's true with other whistleblowers. You know, I'm very encouraged to see more and more whistleblowers coming forward. I think if anybody else out there wants to be a whistleblower, they can realize now that although things were very tough for a lot of us in the beginning, things are getting a lot easier. Congress is aware. People, the executive branch now want to help. And they, they, they, they, they want whistleblowers to come forward in a legal way. As long as we don't compromise national security and national secrets, I think we can have that conversation. But also it's imperative that they have the support from,

from the people, because they're doing this ultimately for the citizens. And the citizens need to, to, to have the grace to, to allow these people to come forward without the criticism, right? Whether it's someone like Barbara coming forward or this latest whistleblower, you know, people are very quick to criticize them. And instead, I think we need to really give them a round of applause for their bravery, what they've done. Some of these folks have also been threatened with their lives for doing what they're doing. And some of these by citizens within the UFO community, either A, there's some, I mean, mental

health is a real thing, right? In some cases or in other cases, people just don't feel that they're getting what they deserve and are focusing their anger out on whistleblowers. And I think that's a shame because we need to, if we want real disclosure, we have to give real protections and we have to afford grace to those individuals that are willing to come forward. And some of that testimony may seem pretty wild.

But, you know, we've done some pretty wild things before as a government. This isn't the first time. Actually, on that note, Lou, I was wondering, where you talk about, you know, wild testimonies or things that people have witnessed. Is there something or maybe a group of things that you carry around to yourself, where you say to yourself and just random parts of the day where something comes back into your mind, and you think, man, I really wish I could talk about that. I really wish people can know about this event or this thing that I saw or this craft

or biologics that I saw, but you can't say anything. Yeah, a lot of it. And that's where we're going to end it for now. Sorry for the cliffhanger. but I think you'll enjoy, or at least find his answer to be very interesting and thought-provoking, if nothing else. So stick around for part two coming up in a few days. I'm going to release that on Friday, which if I can just think ahead here real quick. That is, what, May 16th?

So on Friday, May 16th, you can expect part two to come out this conclusion of my interview with Luella Zondo. And in that part, well, you'll hear the rest of that answer. but also we get into more of the executive branch. You heard Lou kind of alluding to the executive branch. And of course, that means the office of the presidency. So that kind of led me down a path of asking about what kind of knowledge he believes President Trump to have about this and what he believes President Trump might do about the UAP issue.

And I kind of caught a couple of little facets there that I caught on to some of the famous Lou Elizando breadcrumbs. And so I think we got some interesting questions and answers in there. So you'll hear that in part two, as well as some great bits of conversation regarding his thoughts on citizen disclosure versus government disclosure. How do we reconcile it to? Which one should we favor or pursue? Or maybe it's both.

So that was pretty great. And also we get into zero point energy, reverse engineer technology. How does all that play in together? There's a lot of other stuff in there in part two as well. well. So a lot of great things to look forward to in part two of this exclusive interview with Lou Elizando. But before we're done here, I did mention that I wanted to say that there was something that Lou and I spoke about after we were done recording. And that was about his involvement in the UAP Disclosure Fund or UAPDF for short. And there was some news that came out over the past few days

that, so there was a lot of rumors spreading online about why that happened. Why that happened? Why the exit from Lou was he fired? Lou tells me no, that is not the case. He was not fired. In fact, he told me that it was something that he let Christopher Mellon know, who was on the UAP Disclosure Fund with him, that this was a limited thing. He wanted to help it get off the ground,

and then he was going to kind of let it go from there because he just doesn't have enough bandwidth in his words, or I believe he used the term with me, burning at both ends of the candle, to where he couldn't do it anymore. He just couldn't feasibly or physically do it anymore and be a part and offer his efforts to the UAP Disclosure Fund. So according to what he told me, after we were done talking,

after we were done recording, it was kind of like a post-credit scene there where we were just further discussing. He said, just something he didn't have time for anymore when it came to UAP Disclosure Fund and decided now was the time to step down from that role. And in fact, he said, and I wanted to impart this, that Chris Mellon basically said, no, you can't step down.

We still need you on here. He even offered to show me the text messages between he and Chris Mellon to show me that Chris Mellon was like, no, I don't want you to leave. But that's where it came down to. So I know there's a lot of drama. I know there's a lot of rumors from that that he was fired from the UAP Disclosure Fund and all these different things. But apparently, according to what Lou told me, that is not the case at all.

They wanted him to stay on, but it just wasn't something that he had the bandwidth to do anymore. So I wanted to get that last part out since we weren't able to get that on recording. I hope you found this to be at least if nothing else, something that made you think a little bit differently about the situation. And that's what I wanted to try to do. You know, I get a lot of people who write to me. In fact, most of the comments on social media have been very, very negative toward this interview before it even came out. When I released last night that I said this was coming. I put out a little clip showing, you know, like a couple minutes of the interview. Most of the comments go figure on social media were extremely negative, basically saying

Lou is a hack, Lou is done, why would you even talk to him? I'm not going to listen to this. I don't trust Lou anymore. He's, you know, he's a sigh-up. He's a government hack and he's just lying about everything. And I mean, it's kind of like overwhelming. Actually, funny enough, Lou said to me when we were done, again, off the recording, he said, get ready for the negative blowback man he's like you're gonna see what comes my way most of the time i said you know hey look i'm ready for it i've had it before um but this is like a different level you guys are some some of you guys don't want to paint with a general brush but some of you out there are just absolutely vicious my goodness gracious but my my overall point in saying this is not to attack anybody or single anybody

out it's just my overall thought and i said this before when i interviewed ashton forbes i am not shy whatsoever about interviewing polarizing figures and i uh completely understand that Lou Elizondo is one of those polarizing figures. You love them, you hate them, you trust them, you don't, or you're right. Maybe sometimes, sometimes you're down the middle and you say, well, I'll give it a chance, you know, and I'll see what he has to say. Sometimes that's out there. But most of the time, it's one extreme or the other.

And my thing is, and it continues to be, and this goes out to everybody who had these negative comments saying, why would you even do this interview, don't talk to Lou, I can't believe this, I'm not going to listen to it. And if that's the case, that is completely up to you, I am not here to convince you one way or the other. It's always been, UAP has always been about letting you decide. But I am never, ever, ever, I can promise you this, ever going to shy away from doing an interview with somebody

just because someone out there thinks I shouldn't do it. It's just not going to happen. I'm sorry. And if that turns you off, I apologize. But that's the way I am and that's the way it's going to be. I am never going to shy away from doing an interview with somebody just because somebody over here loves them or somebody over here hates them. or someone over here trusts it or someone over here doesn't.

My whole mission is to bring out the details to you. That's what it's always been on UAP, whether it's a story, an original episode that I write, like the previous episode on 129 about the end time prophecies of 2027. That was an original episode. I wrote that entire thing based off of research. And I knew, okay, some of you were going to agree, some of you won't. Perfectly fine. And the same thing goes with an interview.

You may like the person, you may agree with them, you may not. but I'm always going to do the interview if I can to present both sides and put the conversation out there. So I just want to put that out there that's no matter what kind of response you might have negative or positive. I just hope that you give it a chance and at least listen to hear where that person is coming from and how the interview goes and then make up your mind from there. All right. Enough preaching, enough pontificating. Now I will say goodbye, but I felt that was important to at least put that out there. and kind of give my overall view on this because I don't want to ignore it

and act like it's not happening but that's where I stand with it. So all that said, aside from all the drama and controversy, that is the end of part one, part two, like I said, coming out in a few days, Friday, May 16th,

and we get into all those other things I mentioned, which I found to be extremely revealing and very, very interesting, so I can't wait for you to hear that portion. But until then, continue to download and subscribe to the show, wherever you get your podcast, Just search UAP, Unidentified Alien Podcast.

As soon as you put in UAP, it should pop up on any of the platforms, Apple, Spotify, Amazon, any of those. And make sure you download, subscribe. Rate five stars, please, if you could. If you feel it is worthy, then please do that. And also follow along, like I always say, on social media, it's at UA Podcast 850. I'm posting these updates. I'm posting little clips and, you know, things from the show or even outside of the show,

just different little tweets here and there if you want to follow along. It's at UA Podcast 850. Sam on TikTok, by the way. You can follow along there. I get some videos up. And I'm doing more on YouTube now as well. So feel free to follow along on YouTube at UA Podcast. And subscribe to the show there at UA Podcast on YouTube.

And by the way, you can reach me on any of those social media channels through direct messaging. My DMs are open for better or for worse. They are open. So by all means, whatever you have to say. And thank you to everybody. I don't want to focus on the negative. Overwhelmingly, the response is normally positive to what we do here. here on UAP so I always appreciate that.

And if you like to send me an email, then feel free to do that. It's S-Dieneru-A-P at g-mell.com. It's S-D-I-E-R-U-A-P at gmail.com. If you want to do a direct message through email, then by all means, because I will get back to you at some point. I promise we'll get back to you. But on that note, that's going to do it here for today on this very special edition of UAP.

Thank you all again for everything. for all the support, truly. I mean, it does mean the world to me, so thank you for that. So that's it. Until next time, it's Stephen Deiner here saying, be well. Thank you so much. And we will talk again soon right here on UAP, the Unidentified Alien Podcast.