UAP Unidentified Alien Podcast - UAP EP 193 Jeff Nuccetelli Bombshells: Spies, threats, and UFO Landings

Episode Date: March 20, 2026

From threats against his well being, to sabotage within government intel agencies, and even a giant UFO landing on base, Congressional witness and Air Force veteran Jeff Nuccetelli, reveals absolutely shocking and disturbing details about what he and other witnesses have had to endure before speaking with Congress. And if that wasn't enough, we will also learn more regarding a seldom spoken about UFO landing event that took place on a US base. This could be one of the most significant episodes ever of UAP...See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

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number 193. And this is a doozy. I've used that word before in other episodes, and it's, I feel always warranted when I decide to use the doozy word. And this one absolutely deserves it because it's so. important. That's the word I'm going to be using here today. It's so important the information that you're going to hear that I decided to abruptly stop production on my three-part series that, as you know, it was just in the middle of the case for aliens, the good, the bad, and the others.

The first two parts had already been out working on the third part for the others to finish off the series. And I've said, I got to pause this because what ended up happening here during this conversation with Jeff Nusateli was way too important. to hold off on. So Jeff, of course, if you don't know or maybe aren't completely familiar with, recent congressional witness from the most previous hearing back in September. He was on Vandenberg when the famous Red Cube siding took place for that craft. And since then, he and I have been able to talk and develop a really friendly relationship, actually, which I'm thankful for over the past couple of years.

He's been on the show before. He's worked on some other private. projects with me on UAP, and we have been planning for a while for him to come back on and catch up on some things. And I figured, you know, once we were able to do that, I would get the episode ready and, you know, release it a few days later like I do with a lot of other things. And I thought, okay, cool, let's talk. I'm going to finish up the three-part series, the case for aliens, and I'll put this out next week. All good. But then I realized as we were talking and having this conversation that there was no way I could delay this and it needs to come out as soon as possible. So the case for Alien series will finish off next week on part three right now.

What you're going to hear is way too important to delay my conversation with Jeff Nusatelli. Again, witness at Vandenberg to the Red Cube congressional witness and someone who's really, thankfully, because he deserves it, has become very, very noticed as far as a witness, someone who's willing, an Air Force veteran, someone who's willing to testify literally in front of Congress and someone who's willing to put himself out there. And what we learned was at great risk to himself and his family, even more than I ever thought, to come out and try to tell the truth for anyone who's willing to listen about what is going on with disclosure, with reality.

As you hear him say, reality is classified. It's something that you're going to hear him say throughout the episode here. So really important conversation where Jeff goes over, the things that are happening behind the scenes, the bad guys doing bad things is probably the easiest way to put it as he discusses what actually Matthew Brown was just discussing, a fellow witness who were probably really more of a whistleblower, who was just on with Jeremy Corbell and George Knapp on their weaponized podcast. And Matthew and Jeff are really close.

They work together a lot behind the scenes for disclosure, being, you know, military backgrounds that they both have. and Matthew kind of talks about what Jeff talks about here and Jeff kind of brings it that step further as we talk about the threats that they endured, the break-ins, the intimidation, the real-life stuff that they have to go through that I had not heard before,

that I didn't know that Jeff was experiencing leading up to the congressional hearing and even during it while they were in D.C. So shocking stuff and way too important to delay. So we're going to get to that. And we even went into, I asked him toward the end, you're going to hear toward the end where I said, was there something that you wanted to say at the congressional hearing back in September that you didn't really get to get off your chest? He goes into an unbelievable story about the UFO landing, landing that took place at Vandenberg in October of 2003. I didn't know about these details for whatever reason.

I didn't know that this was a thing. And he's like, you know, I didn't really get to acknowledge and really push that story forward as much as I wanted to in front of Congress and in front of the world. And I was happy to have them do that here today during this interview. There is so much that happens here. So I'm just going to get to it. So here is Jeff Nusateli right now on UAP. And I will come back with some afterthoughts once we're done. But for now, sit back and enjoy.

all the time is now. Jeff Nusatelli, a man who needs no introduction these days, a friend of the show, and just a friend in general. Thank you so much, Jeff, for coming back on here to UAP. It's a real pleasure to have you back on here. That's great to be here, Stephen. I'm glad we can finally connect again. Yeah, I know. It's hard.

You know, it's gotten a little bit harder over the past year. Since a lot's been happening, I'd say, over the past, yeah, probably over the past 12 months, your world has gotten very, very busy, and I'm very happy to see that, especially ever since the congressional hearing back at September six months ago now as we speak. So I do want to ask you about that, but we'll get to that a little bit later. There's a lot to discuss here today, so that's why I'm really happy to have you back on. I want to start with actually something happening right now with somebody that we both have come in contact with. you know them a little bit better than I do, but with Jeremy Corbell and George Knapp, they have their show weaponized. They obviously do a great job on that with YouTube and everything.

And they just recently had on Matthew Brown, who, of course, if you're into the subject, you know Matthew Brown is a whistleblower. He's worked a lot behind the scenes with Congress. I'm sure you can speak on that a little bit more than I can as far as what you've been able to accomplish behind the scenes on the subject. But he's got a new interview out with them. and a couple of things that caught your attention with that that you seem to be directly involved with, apparently. So let's start there, Jeff. What the heck is going on with some of the things that were said in that new interview and how you're involved? So after the September 9th hearing, we really made an impact behind the scenes with that testimony.

And it kind of ignited a fire in the intelligence community. And basically what happened was Tulsi Gabbard put together a working group called a dig to investigate claims of whistleblower retaliation and provide some protection. So they put that program together over a period of a few months. And then whistleblowers were invited to come to the intelligence community. and be briefed about this program, this protective program. And basically what happened was Matthew Brown, working in good faith, went to ODNI and met with these people, these intelligence agents. And he came out of that experience with the understanding that there are probably people

working for Tulsi Gabbard that are bad actors that are doing the opposite. They're not trying to protect whistleblowers or trying to hurt whistleblowers. So that is the crups. And Matthew and his team have uncovered sufficient evidence that this is going on. They've identified actual individuals

within DOD that are acting against whistleblowers, like Matthew Brown, Dylan Borland, Lou Elizondo, David Grush, and me. I'm not actually a whistleblower, but I've been targeted by these attacks. And that information has been provided to the federal government. And the other part of it is, after the hearing, we all decided that we needed to take some ownership and responsibility to protect ourselves. UAP witnesses and whistleblowers, right? Because over the years we've been promised multiple times for support, financial support, legal support. Little to none of that support has ever manifested.

So we realize we have to take care of ourselves. So we put together a plan and we've been working over the last five or six months to put together a nonprofit. So Dylan, Borland, and Matthew Brown have put together a non-profit. And more information will be coming out about that. But the idea is the nonprofit is set up to provide those services to witnesses and whistleblowers. So it's going to be us taking care of ourselves from now on. Wow. So that's basically what came out on weaponized.

I encourage everyone to go watch that interview with Matthew Brown. Yeah. I think some people will be sure. shocked at the information that is coming out and will be coming out in the future. Wow. So that that's pretty big. I mean, a couple of things right off the bat that's, you know, strike me from that. Number one, just to kind of start in order of what you mentioned, the fact that Tulsi Gabbard was taking this seriously, you know, as the Director of National Intelligence, her name has been brought up a lot as, and she's brought it up herself. I mean,

in confirmation hearings and in other interviews or statements that this is something that she takes seriously and I think a lot of people wanted to see that that seriousness those statements kind of come to fruition to have it something be tangible right where there's results to her saying that she takes it seriously so to hear you say that that there was this behind the scenes effort in coordination with her departments that she was helping to spearhead to have protection for whistleblowers to come forward and have that confidence that they can talk about it but now we're talking about So that's the encouraging part. The discouraging part would be that there's these, I guess, allegations, I suppose, is the right word to use right now that Matthew Brown and your group are coming out with saying that there's a little bit of kind of sabotage going on within the Department of National Intelligence saying that you have people working against Tulsi Gabbard as the head of the whole thing.

So, I mean, that's pretty concerning, Jeff. I mean, is this something that is being, as far as you know, worked on behind the scenes, that they're trying to uncover these alleged moles within the program that are trying to target you guys? Yes. So the information on the moles has been provided to the appropriate agencies. And we also have a framework to try to deal with this in the judiciary. So we have a plan to try to take this to court. So, you know, we've already, we've dealt with every branch of the government up to this point, right?

We've been hoping the executive branch will provide us with relief and support that has not manifested, you know, and Congress has done what they can and they're still working on it. But now it's time to get the judicial branch involved. right that's the next phase and so i mean it's it's i don't mean this in a way of like oh you know how much evidence do you guys have do you really have something on them when so when i ask like you you actually have that much to feel confident enough to bring this to a to a judge and possibly you know name names in an illegal setting to say these people are actively working against the, you know, the U.S. government to try to go after witnesses and whistleblowers who are trying to push this, you know, disclosure error forward.

Like, you guys have that much information to bring this to a courtroom setting? Yes, we do. Wow. Yeah. We feel like we have a very strong case. Wow. Okay. No, that's really big.

Again, discouraging to a point where, you know, it's kind of the old, there's a, it's a blood sort that's good and a bad, at least that's my read on this initially, because this is the first time I'm hearing this. My read is the bad part would be that we're still getting that pushback, that we're still, after all these years, we're still getting that, you know, sabotaged within the government of people working against disclosure. The same stuff that we've been hearing about since the 1940s and 50s essentially would still be happening now from the allegations you guys are putting forth on that. The good side is, is that you do have the allegations set up. You have the names that you guys feel like

you've been able to track down that are doing these things that are trying to come out against you. So hopefully there can be some type of retribution here, which I assume is what you guys are going for in order to not only protect yourselves, but in order to help to continue to push the disclosure mission forward. Am I wrong in saying that? No, 100% correct. And that's what we've been saying in order to get the whistleblowers on the stand or behind closed doors to give Congress or the American people the information that we want, there's a lot of work that needs to be done before that can happen. And this is all part of that. You know, we have to prepare the battlefield. And it's, it's going to be a long fight. Wow. Yeah. And it's, you know, I think back to when we

first started talking, well, I don't know, maybe two years ago. I, I guess. I guess. I so, right? And to think about where we started there and where we are now, I mean, I give you guys all the credit in the world for continuing this fight, especially when you have these, you know, shadowy figures in the background. Speaking of that, though, I mean, what type of targeting are we talking about, if you don't mind me asking? Are we talking about character assassination type stuff? Are we talking about actual, like, physical threats where you feel like, dang, if we push this anymore, like myself or my family, might be in real physical danger? The whole gambit. Physical danger. Cyber attacks.

We've had break-ins. We've had people approached in public and threatened. So leading up to the hearing was very intense. Really? We were under intense surveillance. We were receiving threats. I mean, it got pretty ugly. Oh, wow.

Yeah pretty scary. You know, because a lot of us have, you know, families and I have children, you know, and the message was like pretty direct. You better shut up and not testify. Really? So, I mean, was that something that people were actually saying to you, you or Dylan Borland or anybody else? Or was that just kind of like a, you got the message through some type of, you know,

indirect action? Indirect and direct. Wow. Faceless? I mean, were people coming up to you? Like you saw people coming up to you, like, kind of giving you the hint. You better be quiet. I could approach in public.

Really? Yeah. And does the same go? And, you know, if they want to talk about, I'm sure they will. But, and, you know, so you don't have to answer it if you don't want to. But would the same go for the other witnesses like Dylan Borland, who was on the stand with you that day? I won't say specifically who, but because we're dealing a lot of the people that we're working with and helping are unknown. Okay.

But yeah, it's a mixed bag. We've all been under surveillance. We've all received messages of various sorts. So, yeah, there's definitely an intimidation campaign. That is scary and disturbing. I mean, if I'm being totally up front with you, Jeff. I mean, I hadn't heard that before. I didn't know that was something you and the other guys had been going through.

I mean, how are you able to respond to that, you know, kind of going forward. Like we said, six months since the hearing, and it sounds like even before the hearing that you've been going through this. I mean, how have you guys been able to kind of push through and put those threats aside? Yeah, it was difficult. After the hearing, as far as me personally, things petered out. Like, and that's what they were trying to do. They're trying to, to frighten you away from testifying. And then after we testified, things calmed down for me. But yeah, it was very difficult to deal with leading up to the hearing. You know, there's really not a lot of places to go.

So, you know, we did what we could, but we have a pretty good network where we could support and protect one another. And we, that's just how we got through it. You know, we stick together, we keep our mouths shut and just keep doing the work and not allowing ourselves to be intense. intimidated. So. Wow. How nerve-wracking was it for you guys that day? Because I actually remember running into you guys, I was going one way towards the media session, and you were going the other way towards the witness session. And so, I mean, you know, you looked pretty calm, cool, collected, but now knowing kind of what was going on behind the scenes, how nerve-wracking was that for you guys as you took the stand and took the oath and started your testimony? It was intense.

and very nerve-wracking. Everyone was very nervous leading up to it. But that was the good thing. We got to spend time together the day before and form a team and form a friendship and it made it a lot easier to do it. But I'll tell you, walking into, I have a video that I captured

right before we walked into the building. and I mean it was dead silent and everybody was just focused and yeah it was very it was a difficult thing to do but we were able to do it all together but yeah if you watch the hearing

I mean some we were all nervous and even George you know George Knapp was you know he he was like he was having a out of body experience he was so you know nervous there was a lot of pressure yeah you know on us and we knew we had to go out there and perform yeah we couldn't look nervous

and we couldn't you know we had to be on point and prepared so yeah we were we were able to pull it off wow but it was tense and there were there were moments there was a moment where uh Alex Wiggins and I uh we were after the hearing um we were pretty sure we were about to get shot Hey guys, so before we get back into the conversation, I just want to talk about something that affects all of us. And it's scary. Starting something new, right? It's hard and it is kind of terrifying because you think about all the work that goes into it. Are you going to be able to succeed?

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in D.C. leading up to the hearing and afterward, and this was afterward. And we were out in public, and Alex and I, we were with Jeremy. Jeremy was walking in front of us, and the other guys and ladies were behind us and there was a guy acting odd and we thought he was about to pull a gun out of his bag and Alex and I picked up on it at the same moment and we focused our attention on him and either we were just paranoid or the individual or we misinterpreted you know but nothing happened right wow we we got about 10 feet and I looked at Alex he looked at me and and he's like I thought we were about to get smoked, man. I'm like, me too.

Wow. So, and that's the thing. You end up in a paranoid state, right? So that could have just been somebody maybe digging for their wallet or whatever. But this is the psychological outcome of these operations on people. Right. You know, you're watching, crossing the road. You know, you've got that hypervigilance.

Right. So, wow. It's just incredible. I mean, to learn what was going on behind the scenes. Again, you know, because I don't want to try to make this seem like this is, you know, I'm faking reaction here. I'm not. I had literally never heard any of this from you over the past six months. And we've spoken a few times over the past six months just privately.

And this is the first time I'm hearing this. So I am legit shocked right now hearing a lot of this. What kind of surveillance do you feel like you guys were enduring? I mean, I guess just kind of specifically, like the surveillance, the intimidation that was happening, how was it happening, the tactics. And who do you think it was? Did they ever present themselves as I'm so-and-so with this department? No, and I can't get into a lot of the details right now. A lot of that information will be coming out or possibly.

But you can think, you know, hacking attempts, digital attacks, being approached in, public, things like that. Like I said, there have been break-ins, like physical break-ins of our homes, right? Messages have been left, physical messages. Wow. So you've gotten, like, in the mailbox or they break into your home and leave a piece of paper saying, you know. In the home. That's unbelievable.

Yeah. That's unreal. Did this happen to all of you? Not all, some. Some, okay. Multiple people, yeah. Did you have a break in? Did you suffer a break in?

I had someone in the house, yeah. Wow. Were you guys home or you came home to find it? We came home and immediately knew. Oh, my gosh. They leave a message. They leave, you know, when you walk in, someone has been in your home and they have done something to let you know that.

Right. So they're not hiding the fact they weren't being sneaky about looking for something. They're sending a message. They're breaking in to send you a message. Yeah. And the message is we can reach you anywhere you are. It doesn't matter if you're with your children. It doesn't matter if you're in public. It doesn't matter if you're in your home. Here we are. My gosh. And I've been sent that message multiple times. And in one case, I was with another whistleblower in public. And someone came up to you guys in a public setting and said something? They didn't say a word, but they left a message.

Is that right? Yeah. This is wild. That was a couple of years ago. So this has been ongoing. Oh, wow. Okay. So this is something, right, before you even got into the congressional setting.

Yeah. Are these now, when we say a message, okay? I'm sorry to harp on this so much, but this is just unbelievable. Are we talking like they're leaving you a. note with something written on it or they it's just like it's something that's giving the message along right something you see it and you're like oh okay i know what this means it could be a variety of both but typically it's it's not a handwritten message or explicit it's inferred so i could give you an example uh that matthew brown has talked about he had a variety of these things happening

and then at one point they uh he came home and they had desecrated his grandfather's ashes. Oh, wow. So things like that. They'll hit you where it hurts. That's unreal. Yeah. Just incredible.

I mean, were you guys able to go to the police at all and file reports? Or was it's, I mean, how did that work? Yeah, in some cases, yeah, that's been the appropriate response and that has happened. Like, for example, with right before the hearing, David Grush. had a gun pulled on it, right, right outside of Congress. So that did happen. I heard that was a, I heard that rumor so that he actually did have a gun pulled on him.

Yeah, that was not a rumor. That was happening. Oh my goodness. So he was heading into, I believe he was heading into a skiff to do a briefing prior to the hearing. And this is how it plays out. It could have just been a random lunatic in D.C.

Or it could have been a message. That's the amb, you know, the ambiguous nature of it. Right. Right. Like who broke into Matthew's house and desecrated the ashes in, like, we don't know, right? Right. So that's-

You don't know who pulled the gun on David Grush or why. Right. But there's a pattern that emerges, right? If you've got five people and they're all having these strange encounters, right, over a period of a few months, it could be a coincidence or not and now we're we know like we've we've identified some of the bad actors we know who they are we know where they work and that that's what and that's incredibly important obviously um and i was going to ask that and i know it's yeah i've i've asked it i guess it already in a couple of ways and i don't want to push it too hard but just to throw it out there one more

time and if you can't talk about i completely understand but do we know where this was coming from and what I mean by that is is this was this a directive do you feel anyway from a government agency or was this a directive from you know

one of the so-called shadow governments contractor type thing or a little bit of both just you know from what you've been able to find out or your personal feeling on it a little bit of both the way we're defining it is

it's coming from the legacy program security apparatus basically. Right. So this is a shadowy organization operating within the government. Right. It's incredible. I mean, you know,

and just I guess to to paint the picture, right, for people who might be hearing something like this for the first time and they're shocked by it. And I'll just use as an example for my own personal life with my wife. But I say this because just to paint the picture of how much regular everyday people don't know about this stuff.

We were driving through St. Augustine not too long ago, and I passed the building for Northrop Grumman. And I'm like, oh, shoot, Northrop Grumman. I didn't know they had a facility here. And it's all boarded up. You can't see anything in those buildings.

I mean, it's all boarded up. There's barbed wire everywhere. And she says, why? What's Northrop Grumman? I said, how long you've been married to me? You don't know what Northrop Grumman is? But so she had, and I started to explain it to her,

you know, just in layman's terms about, yeah, you know, they do this, they do that with the government, and they might be behind some of the things with, with aliens and reverse engineer technology. But I say that because when we talk about things like this, this might sound outlandish to people. And it's just to paint the picture of how much everyday people who don't pay attention to the topic are so in the dark about what's going on. So when you talk about people who are threatening you guys, like this is something. something that is really happening. Like you're going through this.

Yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. And that's the thing. That is the problem we're having with the public, right? In getting the public engaged. We're in this world. So we already, we already understand the landscape, right?

But if I were to go out on the major media outlet today, you start speaking about this, people would have no idea what I was talking about. They're like, this guy's a lunar. Right, right. You know, he, so, and that's the problem. Yes. Right. We're trying to, to not only let the public know that UAP, the phenomenon is real.

The government is not only aware of it, but they're covering up that, that truth. Reality is classified, right? Nature is classified. And that they're also retaliating against government employees and civilians for just trying to educate the public about it. Right, exactly right. And how many would you say, Jeff, and I actually asked this question to Representative Burleson not too long ago. And his number was fairly high. I'm curious to get your thoughts on this and your answer on it.

How many witnesses and whistleblowers would you say are out there, government, military and otherwise, that are willing to talk about, you know, even legacy program, people who want to come out and talk, that want to come out and talk, that want to. that want to talk about this stuff but are too weary to do it because of exactly what you're going through. Where would you put a number like that just based off your experience? It's hard to say, but many, many, many.

The issue is, I mean, I know personally a few people that could provide very valuable information to Congress, right? And I believe there's many, many, many more out there. the problem is we have to make it safe for them to even speak with Congress and even secretly, right? Because what we're dealing with, like if you take Dylan Borland's case, for example, he went to Congress. He did the right thing.

He provided the information about what he knows about these legacy programs and the crash retrievals and on and on. They vetted him. They're like, okay, this guy's legit. It looks like credible information. They send him to the agency responsible for vetting, which is Arrow. Right. Arrow takes the testimony. They immediately classify it top secret.

They tell Dylan Borland, don't ever talk about this again or you're going to jail. Wow. You're done. Right. We've classified your life. Wow. And then, because of that, he has to go to the inspector general for the intelligence community. And he tells him, I'm being retaliated against it, say, classified this information.

And then things get worse. You know, the intelligence community is like, that's right. You had better shut your mouth and never speak about this even to Congress or we will put you in jail. Right? So that's what's happening. So people are clamoring for like, just bring out the whistleblowers. It's like if they're willing to do that to Dylan, what are they going to do to the people that actually worked on a program?

Yeah. Right. So that's what we're dealing with. And that's why Tulsi Gabbard set up this dig. The dig is a working group. And they offered Dylan Borland and Matthew Brown and these other people to come in. to share what they know for exchange for protection. But we've got bad actors in that community.

So now that's the problem. We're trying to work with the government, but there are too many bad actors in the government, right? So we need to protect ourselves and find a way to continue to work with the government. just amazing it's it's it's it's frustrating i mean if i'm you know being honest to throw a word out there it's frustrating in the sense of for you guys you know you're you're putting yourselves out there and there are you know along with all the other people who want to talk about this stuff and they feel like they can't and you're still you're you know have all these people working against you

you have people for you and against you and you have to try to work through all this essentially on your own. Imagine the burden, right? So imagine like you're in a company and you know that the company is defrauding people, right? It's stealing Social Security money or something like that, right? And most of the people you're working with, they know about it. But they don't have the courage to do anything about it. Right.

And then you go to Congress and you're like, listen, I've got evidence. This is happening. And they're like, wow, this is terrible. And they send you to, let's say, the FBI to report. court. And you give them all the information. These are the people stealing. This is how they're, they're laundering the money. These are the people that know. And then the FBI is like, thank you for the information. We're classifying that. If you tell anybody about this, you're going to prison. Right. Not the people stealing. You're going to prison. That's what we're dealing.

Man. This might sound like an elementary question because, well, you know, I would ask it. And then, of course, the answer would be, well, they just don't want people to know about extraterrestrials. But why? I mean, it's just the simple question of why. Why is it that reaction? Why does the Intelligence Committee or community go to those lengths where they threaten jail or they threaten the end of your career? You know, they threaten your retirement is gone, all these different things that will ruin your life and ruin the life of your family. what is making them so stand firm against stuff like this coming out?

Because reality is classified. Literally, like we are not allowed to know the full nature of reality. And the government is more aware of that reality than the public. And they will do, they have done whatever it takes to keep that secret. Now, the why, it's a multitude of things, right? Crimes have definitely been committed, right? The government has committed crimes to cover this up. And then you take the whole financial aspect of it, if that part is true, the reverse engineering,

where they're giving some corporations, you know, advantage over others. That's a big problem. And then you have, you know, all. It becomes a culture of secrecy, right? And I think it boils down to nature is more, reality is more mysterious and beautiful and incredible than we can imagine. And I think that human beings know that instinctively, right? If you look at all of our observations from recorded history to now,

humans have been observing and recording the anomalous. That's what we focus on. All of our religious texts, which are our most important human texts and literature ever produced are about lights in the sky and in the ocean and things that are not supposed to be real. Yeah.

Right? And then we've been taught in this new materialistic world that that's all folklore and nonsense. Right? we've been told not to believe that. Despite all of human history recording weird, things happening, right? Interactions with non-human intelligence. That's right.

And I think that's what the cover-up is. I think part of the phenomenon is bizarre and alien and terrifying, and part of it is liberating and wonderful and, you know, incredible. and the powers that be understand that if we know those two truths, their power structure will collapse. Right. And it's controlled. They're controlling the narrative.

They're controlling what we think. They're controlling where we look, where we take our curiosity and attention. You know, they don't want physicists exploring physics, right? Because what they might uncover what is actually going on. So you tamp down curiosity, you stigmatize curiosity and wonderment, you tell people that they're stupid and they're ignorant for exploring strange ideas, and you keep us all locked in a materialistic box. There's nothing to see here.

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It's control. Yeah. That makes perfect sense. You know, and it's a shame, obviously, but that's, it's, I agree with you. I think it probably comes down to all those elements. Just incredible stuff, Jeff. I mean, you know, to learn about what's been going on before, during, and since the hearings. Where do things stand now for you guys?

Have the, has the intimidation, the three. the break-ins, all those different things? Has that stuff calmed down? Is it still happening? And, you know, I know you talked about the judiciary process as well. So is it still happening? And what are the next steps? What are you guys trying to do next?

So we've, so for me, it is, I've had no incidents since the hearing. Okay. Things have been cool. I'm like, okay, you know, I'm not 100% sure on the other people. but things have definitely been toned down. I mean, leading up to the hearing, it was insane. And now what we're trying to do, we've been gathering evidence.

We've identified some of the bad actors that are, you know, conducting this operation, this counterintelligence operation on us. And we're going to move forward with legal action when we're prepared. You know, we've got evidence. Wow. It's not just rumors, speculation. I mean, we've got data about who's doing what and how it can be.

Because that's the question, right? How can we move forward? How can we get more witnesses and muscle blowerers to come forward? And obviously, it's those protections. So how does this all change? I mean, is it really just as simple as trying to name names and, you know, take the hood off and see who's under the hood and, you know, what mask they're wearing? Is that the first step? that's yeah that's part of it and we start to expose with evidence the people that are conducting

the counterintelligence operation on us and the american people and the congress how is this being taken in the intelligence uh communities jeff as far as mean even tulsi gabbert herself as far as you know i mean i would assume they would find it pretty disturbing and and disheartening that they have agents working against their own agenda? I mean, do you know how this is being taken within the intelligence sectors? It's being taken seriously. That's what I'll say.

Okay. No, and that's perfectly fine. As long as it's being taken seriously and they're not trying to brush this away, right? And they're saying, oh, well, yeah, okay, we'll look at that later. But they are taken seriously and they're disturbed by this. And behind the scenes,

in my humble opinion, The UFO topic is the most important topic in the federal government. Well, it's really interesting you say that because of two things. Number one, with a war going on right now, it's very understandable to think or to have someone say to you, we'll get to this down the road. If that's what somebody is saying, then it's understandable because they obviously want to concentrate on the task at hand. But it's also interesting because it goes hand in here. hand with what Congressman Burleson has said here and on other interviews and other statements, which is ever since President Trump said, I want this stuff to come out there, that truth

social post that he put up, I guess, about three or four weeks ago now, Congressman Burleson said that agenda, that that mission went from number 599 on a list of 600 things to now number three, two, or close to one, maybe a 1A. So now you're seeing that same thing. Mm-hmm. Absolutely, yeah. So what do you think that means going forward as far as those in charge? Like, you know, whether it's FBI or D&I, CIA. I mean, John Ratcliffe's, you know, CIA, head of the CIA, the director, spoke about

this openly a few years ago, ironically enough on Fox News, when Pete HECDeth, the current Secretary of Defense Secretary of War was a correspondent. Fox News, they spoke about it together there. And John Ratcliffe, the current head of the CIA, was very open about, yeah, there's stuff there and it might be extraterrestrial. So now they're both in these positions of power. And the president has told them to take it seriously. So do you see Jeff something really moving forward here, maybe even sometime this year before

2026 is up? I hope so. What's happening is the congressional hearings have lit a. fire in the Fed that cannot be put out. And there are enough people in the government that are aware that this phenomenon is very, very real, that now that it's public, they have to address it. And, you know, it's gone up. We've had multiple presidents talking about it, multiple CIA chiefs talking about it and on and on. So we're beyond the point. to where there's no question the phenomenon is real.

It's just, do we have the courage to face it, right? That's what I said in the hearing. Right. And you're seeing the political capital and courage to face it now. Right. That's coming from the president on down to Tulsi Gabbard, the CIA. All the leadership in these important agencies are openly discussing UFOs. Right. Right. Yeah, that's true.

Everybody from the, you know, the Secretary of State to the CIA, to the DNI, to the president, to the vice president has spoken about it in the last year. So there's no putting this genie back in the bottle, but we have to address it now. Yeah. So the more pressure that we, the people and the podcasters can keep on the media and the government, the better. We can't let the fire go out. Yeah. I think that's perfectly said,

and I think that's probably the right framing with all this right now. I think you're absolutely right. And it's important, I think it's an important acknowledgement to say that's kind of a landscape right now.

And it's, yeah, I totally agree with you. Did you notice a difference after the hearing, say, before you came in, and of course, you know, Burleson and Burchett and Luna have all been very interested in this.

They've kind of been the big three. I would say probably Jared Moskowitz is very interested in this as well. Congressman here from Florida. And that makes it, you know, bipartisan. He's Democrat, the Republican. So you have that bipartisan support and interest in this. But aside from those who have already been interested in it, did you notice a change in tone from other congressional members after the hearing was over?

Absolutely. Yeah, we really made an impact. And we had multiple staffers in Congress, men and women, come up and tell us that we really made them think and opened their mind about the topic. So, yeah. And we already had, you know, David Grush has been doing a lot of work behind the scenes, making alliances and allies. And so a lot has been going on. in the government that UFO Twitter will never be aware of. So a lot of work has been happening behind the scenes.

So, yeah, we made an impact. And the whole topic is really rising to prominence now. That's great. Well, actually, kind of speaking of which, when we talked about not being able to put the genie back in the bottle on the federal government side, they just came out with within the past couple of days, a new website.

and I want to get your reaction to this. We saw the news that's, and this is verified, it's a real thing, that the federal government has registered the domain aliens.gov and alien.gov. So what do we make of that? I mean, is this referring to what we think is referring to?

Who knows, man? I almost think they're trolling us you know, half the time. So I don't know. You know, if you look back, okay, the president, President Trump, you know, I think was that last year, he was on Rogan. Right. Rogan asked him about it. And he started talking about the space people coming down, right? And then he kind of changed his tone.

And, you know, who knows? Yeah. Who knows, man? Me, my first reaction is, and maybe I'm way off base here, but my first reaction was they're kind of laying the groundwork, and maybe this is wishful thinking, but that they would be laying the groundwork for a place where they can upload files, right? The announcement is made, it's post-announcement.

The announcement has made those websites go live. Hey, we told you what's going on for the most part. If you want to learn more, go to aliens.gov, and you can read the history on this and see some pictures and videos that are newly declassified. That was my first read on it. Again, maybe wishful thinking, but I mean, I don't know. What do you think?

Yeah, it could be something like that. Or it could be what we're all waiting for. And it could be President Trump comes out in a couple weeks. He's like, okay, the aliens are here, the space people are here. Just post the link on a truth social post. Go here. Have fun. I don't know.

It could be. It's just unreal. There was something that actually, one of the main things I want to talk to you about, and I'll bring it up here towards the end because I just didn't expect. all the other conversations that come up with, which were hugely important, and I'm glad we got to cover all that. But I wanted to ask you about

what's going on with the Varsinia case. I had on James Fox on the show here back in late December, and it turns out we were going to do the show before his new film came out, kind of a sequel to what he had already done with the Varsinia case.

and turns out that I get an email the day before saying, hey, if you don't mind James is going to be in Brazil, is it still okay if we do the interview like an hour later than we originally planned? I said, yeah, sure, you know, I can be flexible. And we did that and we spoke about the new film. We spoke about the new interviews he had in there with the neurosurgeon, just incredible stuff. And then I come to find out there's little old Jeff Ducatelli in Brazil at the same

time as I was talking with James Fox, you guys were there together and you were there to help investigate this case. So what have you learned behind the scenes when it comes to Virginia? What have you guys been working on with what I think, the reason why I bring it up now, because I think this is, if not the most, it's one of the top three most important and credible cases in all of UFO lore. So what's going on with that that you've learned? Yeah, I agree. Right now, it is the number one case, right? There's a huge, amount of collaborating data. So many witnesses, it's like mind-boggling.

But yeah, I went down there. James invited me down. And I got to meet all of the witnesses, the ones that are known in the film and unknown. And we got to spend a lot of time with them. You get to know these people. You get to know their families and their children. and their friends.

And then you come away from that experience with very little doubt, right? There's like no doubt that these people are making it up or lying or grifting. And yeah, and that's the thing, man. It's like if that case isn't real, I don't know what is real. And it was incredibly powerful and emotional and, and life-changing to meet all those people and get the firsthand accounts. And, you know, I got to meet the military people that transported, you know, that drove the trucks and everybody in between.

They drove the body and everything. Yeah, man. You know, and they know where it was taken. And they, so what we're doing now, you know, James is like that close to the video. Oh, wow. multiple times. Like, if it exists, he's been within, you know, arms reach of it a few times. And this is, this is the legendary video that purportedly shows the actual alien outside of the craft, right?

Like that video in the hospital room. In the hospital room. Okay. In the hospital room. Yeah. And, you know, we've got verified witness testimony that that video was real. And it was shot. And it's just trying to get our hands on it.

And we're also, like James wants to get the flight logs if they exist. And we've got some really good people on the team now. We've got some ex-air force people like Colonel Fred Claussen. You know, he's helping trying to track down some of this information and figure out the logistics plan, like how they would have had to get to Brazil and back. And we're hoping, you know, the more we push and more we dig, we're finally going to get a break and that video is going to manifest or the flight logs or more information.

Right, because as far as we know, the flight log would include U.S. military craft, right, that supposedly came to Brazil to pick up the alien body, right? Because those are the reports that the U.S. military took the body back to somewhere, I guess, within the United States. Yeah. So if we can find a flight log that matches that, then obviously that's. It's a nice smoking gun. Yeah, right.

And I mean, that video, do we know, as far as from what you and James have been able to uncover, I guess, you know, over this past six months, let alone the past years that he's been working on it? Do we know who took the video as far as private citizen versus hospital staff versus government military? There were multiple videos alleged, right? Some were by hospital staff. Others, I can't remember off top of my head who made that video in the room with Dr. I don't remember if that was military or hospital staff. But allegedly, what was happening was the Brazilians were getting angry because the Americans showed up and just started bossing everybody around.

Like they came into the hospital and, you know, and people started getting angry and they're like, go get a camera and they started filming. Like we need to document what is happening here. Okay. These Americans coming in. So we think that there's multiple videos. We're pretty sure, you know, that that one is out there. Wow.

And it stays covered up, obviously, I guess, for the same reasons we've been talking about here today, which is out of fear and intimidation, I suppose, right? Yeah. There are, from what I remember, there are people shown in the video. you know, there were just bystanders to do not, do not want to ever be public, right? Yeah. So it might have to take until those people pass away, you know, so that might be another 20 or 30 years, you know, because people were still under late 40s. Yeah, right.

Right. So, yeah. Just unreal stuff. And, you know, we talk about it because we know that case very well. And it's just this is kind of, you know, to illustrate. again for someone who doesn't know like if you were in a you know a Starbucks or a Panera bread

something where you know you sit down you're having a cup of coffee and a sandwich and someone just like hey you know what do you do what and you start to tell them about what you do and what you've been up to what would you say to the person who like my wife is a

good example who knows nothing about this and I don't even mention any of the stuff to her because I just I want to leave her in her world so she doesn't have to be consumed by this like I've been. What would you say to somebody like that about this case that you feel would just take them to that level of like, wait, what? This is going on?

Yeah, it's hard because it's so big of a case is so complicated, right? And there's so many witnesses. Yeah. But yeah, I tell them, you know, basically what I say is in 1996, something happened. in Varginia that ignited the curiosity of the entire country of Brazil. It was on the news every day for months. And, you know, take it or leave at whatever you think happened, but hundreds of people claim to have seen UFOs, UFOs crash, and aliens running around.

You know, and the government's response was, this is a national security incident. there's nothing to see here shut up and quit asking questions right and then you leave it at that like then what happened yeah exactly like if the if it wasn't what we're saying happened

what did happen because something definitely happened in Varshi right some I mean these people saw something like you said this isn't these aren't people who are you know trying to gain followers on social media to tell the story they don't even want to tell the story and they tell every time we would

talk to somebody, more leads open. And we would talk to somebody to are like, oh, yeah, I know about it, but you need to go talk to my cousin in this other town. Wow. He saw it or his wife saw it. And by the time you leave Brazil, you've got 30 other witnesses to track down. Jeez. And people just walk up to you on a street.

And they're like, oh, yeah, you know, my cousin told me about it when I was a kid, you know. And some people are like, I saw bull-ha. I talked to a lot of people. And you're like, well, what happened? They're like, I don't know. But they're just up the mindset. It was nothing because that's what they were telling. Well, something happened.

Yeah. It's incredible stuff. I could talk to you just about that for the next hour. But before we're done on this, on this edition here, Jeff, and maybe we can, you know, come back and do this again soon because it's just fantastic, you know, getting this, having these conversations with you. and I think it's super important and super helpful for, you know, movements forward for this entire discussion, for this entire disclosure movement.

I really value, you know, what you and the other guys are doing. I think it's incredibly important. But yeah, absolutely. Before we're done, I was curious about this because sitting there at the hearing, just to go back to that real quick, a couple rows behind you guys. It was fortunate enough to be in that room. and I can only imagine one of the things I was thinking to myself was number one how nervous you guys must be

but number two and we spoke about that number two you must have so much that you want to say but you can't say at all because of time constraints and other witnesses who are being addressed and to get their turns so looking back on that what sticks in your mind are the things that you really wanted to get out there

to the public in front of the cameras, but you just weren't able to do it because of, you know, you didn't have enough time to say it. I got the information out, but I don't think it landed. I wanted the public to know that when these incidents at Bannerberg were happening, it wasn't just like one or two people. There were like a hundred of us on duty when these things happened.

Wow. And, you know, not everybody saw it. you might only have five people that saw the craft in one incident, but everyone heard it playing out over the radio, right? And everybody knew what was happening. And every one of these cases was documented, meaning a police report was typed up with all the witnesses, all the information, a description of the object, where it came from, where everything, right? Not only that, our entire chain of the information. of command was notified every single time. And there are records of that.

Like by name, like 10 people that were notified in the command post, my commander, my superintendent, right? On and on. And that's what I really wanted to land. Like it's not just me. This is not my story. I'm speaking for all those military members that lived through those incursions at Vannever. right whether they believe it was an alien or not or a UFO or not right the events happened and they

were documented and they were you know investigated in upcham and everything that happened there was really no stigma or or anything like that at van derbyr until the craft landed on our flight line It did land. Really? I don't know if I knew that and forgot, but I feel like I would remember that. So it did land? Yeah. We had a landing with witnesses, right?

So this is what's kind of driving me like to madness. You know, the community they're talking about is the Holloman landing real. Is this landing real? We've got a modern case with credible military witnesses that are still alive and willing to talk about it. It was 2004, right? That one was 2003. We know the date, the landing occurred between October 14, 2003 and the end of the month because the witness deployed to Iraq on Halloween night. So we know the time frame, right?

And that's when the tone changed. After one of these craft came in, landed on our base. And there was nothing we could do about it. Wow. Then the tone changed. And then OSI came in and all the spooks came in. And they were like, you people need to shut up and quit calling in the UFOs. And I think that didn't land.

Like I've told that story. I've had Grant on my podcast. He's talked about it. But it just goes right over the head of people. Yeah, it's massive. You know. And that's why I'm excited. there's more Vanneberg.

The good thing about the hearing, that case landed with the military community, maybe not the public. And because everybody gets in, the video stole the show, right? The hellfire missile. Sure, yes. And then everything else, like, whatever,

we got a hellfire missile and UFOs, right? But when I, when we talked about this stuff in the hearing, the military community started to reach out. And they're like, I was at Vanderberg. I've got more information. So I'm hoping to bring more witnesses out.

These are incredibly credible people with incredible stories. And I'm hoping more and more people are encouraged by that. And we're going to get more data coming from, you know, Army personnel and Navy personnel and Coast Guard personnel. And then we just get this flood of information and witnesses. Right. Keep those dominoes falling. Exactly.

Just real quick on the landing because, again, shame on me. I don't know if I forgot that detail. I feel like I would remember maybe for whatever reason I wasn't aware of that because that's a really, really big deal. When we talk about a landing of a craft on a military base, especially one like Vandenberg, which is one of the main bases in the country. Was that the red cube that landed or is it a different craft? It was another very large, I could show you an image that my friend put together with AI. Okay. But it was another large, very large, multi-level craft with like windows around the top.

It was big. Wow. And it was called in as an unannounced aircraft landing. This thing was coming on approach to land. And my friend, you know, they observed it for a while, him and his partner. They called it in. we went on alert. He said we've got an unannounced aircraft arrival, something unknown coming in.

We have a whole protocol to deal with that, contain it. And the craft came in, landed on the flight line. And before anybody could get there, just it was gone. Instantaneous acceleration off the base. And I mean, this thing sounds like it was huge. Am I right? It was another like, you know, there was a tree line between the witnesses and the flight line. And the light was very bright.

But, you know, they couldn't make out all the details, but they've got a decent description. And it was a large, multi-level craft. Are we talking about like a cube shape, like the red, like the red cube? Was this another cube? Or is this a saucer or a cigar, Tick-Tac? I think it was more squareish, but multi-level, like kind of tiered. I'll have to find the picture. Yeah.

Clip it in. For sure. Yeah, I was going to say, if you don't mind, you know, obviously when we're done, you can send that to me and I'll, I'll put it out on social media if you're okay with that. Yeah, absolutely. We can get that. And I can introduce you to Grant. You can talk to him. You know, he's out public.

Yeah. No, that would be great. And we, you know, get more talk about this, this event even more for sure, because that that feels like it should be like a bigger deal. And I don't, I don't mean offense by saying that. Like, you know, I can't believe, you know, this is, this is no big deal. Although this should be, right? I mean, this should be a really big deal. Like this, people should be talking about this,

that you had a landing of a multi-layered craft on Van derbyr. Air Force is still called Air. It was Air Force Base then. Is it Space Force then now? Yeah. And so, I mean, you had this landing at Vandenberg, 2003, October, and then you have instantaneous acceleration. Why don't we hear about this more?

Exactly. It's unbelievable. Um, wow. And that was just one of the craft scene. I know, again, we had the Red Cube incident there as well. Um, we talked, we, we've spoken about the other triangle craft that was seen by one of your friends that came over while he was, I believe in his, uh, in his vehicle. Yep. Was. Yeah. That craft was larger than a C. 130. Oh, my gosh. Do you talk to like 300 foot wingspan or something like that? And that and that was a triangle, right? That was the triangle. Yeah. unreal did they any any sense of propulsion on any on any of these craft no it matches all the other descriptions right these are completely silent wow propulsion yeah well wow jeff this has been unreal honestly this is uh just an incredible conversation i truly appreciate you doing this here on uap today um we'll have to come back and and keep going on a couple of things but if if If you don't mind, we can, you know, continue another time.

Oh, absolutely, man. Anytime. Yeah, it's just great stuff. And I appreciate it. It's just incredibly important information that I think for people to hear to put into perspective that, you know, you were there when that happened. And then all the other things that you've experienced with the hearings and what's going on right now behind the scenes. So hugely important. And I appreciate it.

Before we're done, I guess on a lighter note, we got. something pretty cool coming up for contact in the desert. You're going to be there and you're going to be a speaker. Hopefully we can link up. I'll be there on the weekend of it on Saturday and Sunday. Oh, great. Right on, man. So that would be awesome.

But tell me about what to expect from your appearance as I contact in the desert this year. For anybody who doesn't know, it's the biggest UFO conference there is. It happens in Palm Springs, May 28th, I believe it begins and goes through June 1st. it's a huge five-day event. So yeah, what can we expect? So, yeah, I'm going to be giving a number of talks.

I'm still working it out because things are changing so rapidly. Maybe now I'll be talking about what's coming, right? Yeah. But, yeah, I will be there really looking forward to it, looking forward to meeting people in person and just hanging out. That's the best part of these events for me, man. It's just getting to know people. And so, yeah,

I'll be talking about a variety. different things, including the Vanderberg incidents, you know, what's going on behind the scenes in Congress as much as I can talk about and in the government in general, and primarily about what's coming next, like what our plan is to walk all this information out, our plan to take this to court, and on and on. So hopefully, you know, I'll have a pretty good presentation. I'd also like to talk about if I have a chance and opportunity, just wildly speculate, like about, you know, what we're dealing with and the ontology we're dealing with and the phenomenon in general. I'd like to just give kind of a talk about just wild speculation and in theories

about what we're dealing with. I think that'd be fun to kind of get away from the hard evidence and everything I'm always, you know, dealing with. So yeah, I'm looking forward to it, man. And it's going to be a lot of fun. And my good friend and executive producer for my podcast, Tom Vernon, is going to be there. Oh, cool. Okay, good. I'm not sure if he's going to be speaking, but he'll be with me. And my other friend, Scott Garing, will be there.

I spoke to Scott. Yeah, he was on here. I think you interviewed Scott. So I'm super excited about that. He has, Scott is a legendary Air Force Special operator. experienceer and he has some of the best video and images of a UAP I've ever seen in my life. Yeah. So I'm really excited he'll be there too. So looking forward to it, man. That's great stuff. No, that's also. I'm looking forward to it too. Like I said, hopefully,

you know, I know there's a lot of moving parts that contact in the desert, but hopefully we can meet up while we're there. That'd be great. Right on. Oh, Jeff, this has been fantastic. Before we go, for anybody who's not following, you anywhere for your show, what you're doing on social media. How do people find you and keep up with everything that you're doing? Yeah. So my podcast is the Jeff Nusitelli podcast. You can find that on YouTube. It's only on YouTube at the moment. We haven't put a lot of content out in the last few months because I've been traveling almost nonstop. Yeah. So there, I'm on Twitter and Instagram. Now I'm a little bit more active on Instagram, but my handle is Ice Alchemist.

one one and yeah you can find me there and uh i just want to say thank you to you and all your listeners man uh like i i always say you guys are the front line troops in this fight you get the information out you ask the questions um so thank you so much for having me on and anytime anything you need man i'm here absolutely no my pleasure and this is again i think has been a really really important conversation today and i'm i'm happy that we were able to do it So thanks so much. Jeff Newsatelli right here on UAP. We'll talk again soon, buddy.

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Thank you again to Jeff Nusatelli for doing that. I mean, to me, that was my immediate reaction, and I don't know how you feel after that, but my immediate reaction, I can just tell you as someone who was, you know, hosting that conversation with Jeff, I felt like that was a tour to force when I was done with him. It was just start to finish.

we're going to start at 100 and we're staying at 100 this entire interview, which I don't mean this in a bad way, but I didn't expect because it's just not natural. Like that's not normally what happens with an interview. It's normally, you know, a little bit of a ramp up and then, you know, you get towards 100 and then you kind of stay there. You come down a little bit towards the end, you know, make it a little bit lighter maybe towards the end. And you kind of have kind of had that natural progression, that little roller coaster.

this was a straight up shot and we just stayed there. That's how I felt as we were talking and having that conversation. Just unreal stuff from Jeff. Again, I also felt my immediate reaction was when I was done and I actually told this to him, I felt like that was one of the most important interviews I had ever done. And I actually thought that about halfway through just as we were talking and I was reflecting on what he was saying. about halfway through I thought to myself, this is one of the most important interviews

I've ever done, and I feel that way now still, to hear the gravity of what he and the others have been going through. You heard him mention, you know, Chief Wiggins, you heard him mention Dylan Borland and Matthew Brown and even unnamed, you know,

witnesses or would be witnesses or would be whistleblowers who have gone through, and we're still going through in Tim and behind the scenes having people within the Department of National Intelligence where Tulsi Gabbard is the director or you know for the director of national intelligence for that department to have people working there working against Tulsi Gabbard working against the witnesses and the whistleblowers like Jeff Newsatelli or Matthew Brown or Dylan Borland it's you know as you heard me say during the conversation it's disheartedly it's disheartedly

to hear that that stuff is still going on. Not surprising at all, but disheartening because you're hoping that you're getting to a certain point. And maybe that's just me being naive and idealistic, where I actually think to myself, maybe we're actually getting past, you know, the shadowy figures behind the scenes trying to squash this stuff as we're working towards disclosure. But apparently we haven't gotten past that at all. And you heard Matthew Brown in his interview with Corbell and Knapp where he spoke about, you know, people working against them, you know, using the Immaculate Constellation Program to hide secrets, to hide videos, to hide evidence.

And now we hear Jeff Nusitelli echo that and even stronger talk about how these people are going after them. And we're going after them. You know, to hear that his house was broken into that. he was being threatened, his family is being threatened. That stuff shocked me and it actually shook me because, like I said, I know Jeff and I hadn't heard that until we were talking on the interview. And I was legit shook as we were talking. I mean, you probably heard me kind of like trying to figure out, oh my gosh, where do I go

from here? Because I was trying to process all that as we were discussing it. It was a complete and total blindside, quite frankly. And I don't mean that in a bad way. it's just I was not expecting to hear any of that of what they had gone through leading up to the hearing. And it's disturbing. Again, because this probably just comes down to me being idealistic, but you hope that stuff wasn't going on anymore. But it absolutely is these 1950s tactics from these, you know, shadowy figures in the deep recesses of the shadow government working behind the scenes to stifle and quiet down people like Jeff, like Matthew, like Dylan, and people before them,

Lou Elizondo, Ryan Graves. I don't know what they've gone through, so I don't want to throw their names in the mix if they haven't gone through the same type of stuff. But just to use examples of people who have come out and try to talk about these things in the public sector and, you know, have these congressional hearings talk in front of Congress, talk under oath, and try to spread what's going on. And to hear that, they're still being treated this way. They're still trying to be, you know, they're still intimidating them and threatening them.

it's tough. It's tough to hear that, but it's important to spread that truth that is happening still behind the scenes. And I can't even put into words how much I appreciate Jeff and what he's doing and everybody else that I've named and mentioned here

in the past five minutes for not only doing what they're doing, but continuing to push through and then coming out and talking about it. But there's obviously a lot of things that play here, and you heard Jeff mention a lot of it and really comes down to power and most likely money.

you know hiding these secrets all these skeletons in the closet of the legacy programs and so again super important I know I've said that a bunch of times here today and I said that was going to be the word of the day but that was that was really really heavy stuff and yeah really important stuff

and I'm sure we're going to be talking about it more as the future goes on because this is this is what we're dealing with and as they say sometimes the best disinfected is light shining the light on it. And hopefully that's what we were able to do here today, or at least help to shine the light on what's going on.

Thank you again to Jeff for doing that. Outside of that, I guess maybe on a lighter note, I don't know, to hear the stories about his adventures in Virginia with James Fox, again, such a landmark case that continues or should continue to be, you know, addressed and noticed because of all the witnesses, because of all the reasons Jeff spoke about. I mean, that continues to me, as you heard us say, to be one of the most really top three, I guess, important cases,

not to keep harpy on the word, but one of the most important cases when all of ufology, just because of the sheer witnesses and what's at stake with that one. And then when you hear about the landing on Vandenberg, again, you heard my surprise while we were talking, I don't know why I wasn't familiar with that story,

especially considering all the times I've spoken with Jeff. I don't know. Maybe it just went over my head at some point. I forgot it. Maybe my memory was wiped by somebody. Like, I honestly don't know. But to hear about those details about this craft, multi-layered craft landing 23 years ago almost,

October of 2003. And to have multiple witnesses. And people just aren't paying attention to that story. because it wasn't really spoken about. It's been hidden for many years. But Jeff is trying to get that word out there. So, I mean, and that was, that was like the kicker story. That was, you know, the part of the interview where we could start to come down a little bit.

And that, I mean, we could have led with that. That could have been an hour just on that case. So this was unbelievable. And I hope this has the ripple effects that I think it should have as far as this episode of UAP to get this message out there for everything. that we spoke about here today during this conversation. It's massive, massive stuff. Honestly and truly, I'm not trying to exaggerate or use hyperbole.

I really feel like this was one of the most important episodes I've ever done in the almost five years of doing this show. So hopefully a lot of this word gets to be spread to everyone to hear this. It's just incredible stuff, to say the least. You heard me mention to Jeff that I would put the picture out there. He mentioned one of his buddies who was. on base that night and saw the craft come down before it took off with instantaneous acceleration. Again, we were talking about a landing at Vandenberg, one of the most important bases in the

entire world, let alone the country. And you're talking about a landing of this giant craft, multi-level craft with windows, and then take off with instantaneous acceleration. And then just have it be quiet for almost 23 years. So he sent me that picture. Of course, it's not a real picture. It's an AI rendering from the witness who saw it. One of the witnesses who saw it who saw it who was in touch with Jeff on Vanderberg that night and he sent it to Jeff and Jeff has sent it to me so I am putting that picture out if you're hearing this already then the picture should be out already on social media so make sure you're following at UA Podcast 850 on social media I'll have this out on Twitter specifically so make sure

you're following there to see this picture out there and and Instagram too you know what I haven't been able to post very much I've been meaning to pick up the UAP Instagram so this is a perfect opportunity to do that. So at UA Podcast 850 on Instagram as well and I'll put this picture of the AI rendering of what was seen that night at Vanderberg in October

of 2003. Wild, wild stuff. Just a remarkable conversation and remarkable episode. And I hope you got something from this because again, this, if I could pick one episode to have ripple effects,

I hope it's this one. And I hope it had the same effect on you as it did. for me. Truly unbelievable stuff here today. And very, very last, but certainly not least. And something, I guess, maybe more lighthearted is contact in the desert. You did hear us in there where Jeff is going to be at contact in the desert for that big conference starting late May, going through that last weekend of May into June 1st. It's a five-day event. So I just wanted to mention this again because I think I've only mentioned it once. And then I've just gotten so

distracted with all these other stories. But to be fair, I do want to throw this out there again because there's only, I think, a few weeks left to use my discount code. If you're going to contact in the desert, if you're planning on it, if you haven't bought tickets yet, and you're trying to figure out the travel, I highly suggest doing the five days because you get the most out of it, you get to see all the different speakers and you get to experience, you know, really the whole gammon of the entire conference. I went last year for the first time, as you know. I can't wait to go back this time. Like you heard, Jeff say, the camaraderie,

just really getting to have that freedom to sit down and talk with everybody. Everyone's super accessible. You know, that's a cool thing. It's not like you're behind, you're hitting behind closed doors. You're walking around and you see this person and that person.

It's a who's who of the UFO world just kind of hanging out. So if you're planning on going, you can use my code Radio 5, the word radio and the number 5 together to get a discount on your five-day event tickets for contact in the desert.

So I highly suggest that. And hopefully I see you there. I'll be there. I won't be there all five days, but I will be there for the weekend for contact in the desert. May, what is that going to be? May 30th and 31st, I think. I believe so.

If I remember correctly that Saturday and Sunday. So if you're going, I highly suggest that. Use Radio 5, my discount code for the five day pass. But with all that said, we will end this tour to force here today, this episode of UAP. And I can't wait to come back again.

Next week. the Case for Alien series with part three on the others and then some really great stuff as well coming up here on the show. So make sure you stick around, you stay tuned and you continue to follow along wherever you get your podcast and all the major platforms. Just search UAP and you will find it, including YouTube as well. So until next time, it is Stephen Deaneer here saying thank you again so much for everything, for all the support, for all the kind messages. it really, really does mean everything to me, so thank you for that. Until next time, it's Stephen Deiner saying, be well, and thanks so much. We'll talk again soon right here on UAP, the Unidentified Alien Podcast.