UAP Unidentified Alien Podcast - UAP EP 202 Real Time UFO Tracking Made Possible?

Episode Date: April 24, 2026

Stephen Diener welcomes in experiencers/researchers, EJ and John, to find out about the technology they are using to help build a community of real time UFO trackers. We also find out about John's childhood abduction as well as a very unexpected connection to the current day missing scientist mystery....See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Yes, welcome back into UAP. Stephen Dner back with you here, as always, on the Unidentified Alien Podcast for episode number 202 this time. And still kind of thinking about everything we spoke about with Anthony Williams in episode 200 and 201, especially that one a few days back with all the different videos and what he has seen on those. And we just, you know, we spoke about so much when it came to the disappearance of the scientists. And that was one thing, actually, before we get into today that I do want to mention real quick, just to kind of, I suppose, bring it all together since then, was, you know, I had mentioned when I put out those episodes that when we did it, the list was at 10 scientists who had either, you know, disappeared or been found dead or, you know, military officials as well.

But since then, it did go up to 12, almost unbelievably. Now, that said, the 11th one, I think that was kind of more the media, if I'm being honest, the media has really attached themselves. to this story now, which is interesting to see. It's not a bad thing, but they have really, you know, kind of hyped it up a lot. And, again, I'm kind of speaking on both sides of my mouth here when it comes to this. But the media is doing media things, I guess is what I'm trying to say. They tried to sensationalize it all. That said, and they know it's a story that they can't sensationalize.

That said, it is important that they're talking about it and that it is being brought up to people and that people are the stories of catching the populace's attention. it is highly unusual and highly suspicious and disturbing to hear about all these different scientists and military officials who have either got missing or have been found dead. Now, I say that because when I say that they upped it to 11, before moving into 12, actually, is the number they're at now. The 11th one that they included was Amy Eskridge. Now, if you know the Amy Eskridge story, you know that that is something that happened

four years ago where Amy, and I've talked about it here on the show, I did an episode about her. She was found dead in 2022 what the coroners ruled as a suicide. But she was working on anti-gravidic technology in Huntsville, Alabama at the propulsion center there. And she was very vocal about some of the threats that she was undergoing, about some of the attacks that she was enduring, saying that she was being attacked with Havana syndrome weapons. She was very vocal about the different things that she was going through while she was alive and even went so far as to say to one of her friends shortly before she was found dead

that she would never commit suicide. That if something happens, she didn't do it to herself, but lo and behold, they still ruled her death a suicide. So you can call, I guess, Amy Eskridge maybe number one in the modern day list here that were seen, but they counted her as number 11 because it's like the media just found out about that story four years later. So just to put some context on that if you're hearing those numbers adding up. But they did find also a 12th scientist having to do with his work with NASA was also in Alabama, believe it or not, kind of the same as Amy Escarriage was also found dead. So including Amy and her case from 2022, the list did go up to 12 from just last week when I did those episodes with Anthony Williams, which is very scary to think

about. And also the untimely passing of David Wilcox, of course, the famous UAP researcher. He's done a lot on, you know, TV with ancient aliens and different shows and his own shows. And unfortunately, his death being, you know, ruled a suicide as well. And so just a lot of things going on these days. And some misinformation, too, that I want to point out. I know there's a long preamble hill before getting to the episode, but I did want this. This was important to say before we started. There's some misinformation going on around about with Nick Pope. I've seen some different videos in social media. People trying to lump in Nick Pope's death along with all the other things that we're seeing.

And that is just not true. So either the people making these videos in social media are just uninformed, innocently uninformed, or they're trying to use Nick Pope's death and connection with this to get clicks. And if that's the case, that's beyond shameful. So if you're seeing some of those or if you know anybody who's seen some of those, Nick Pope, of course, did not die from any of these mysterious circumstances that were seen with everybody else that we've been discussing. Of course, we know what happened with Nick Pope that he passed away from cancer,

and he was very public about that battle that he was having. So I just wanted to address that, some of the misinformation I had seen out there when it came to Nick Pope that was, you know, leading people in the wrong direction to think that his death had something to do with what we're seeing, and that obviously just is not true. But with all that said, let me go ahead and get into today's episode for number 202. And this involves actually, believe it or not, it actually does connect to everything we were just speaking about with the scientists and officials gone missing or being killed. And unintentionally, by the way, and that was the thing that kind of freaked me out with this.

So I brought on a couple here named E.J. and John. And they originally came on just to talk about their own life experience. right, you know, as far as quote-unquote normal people who've gone through different abduction or citing experiences. John, the husband, you'll hear him talk about his abduction experiences that he found out about through hypnotherapy regression and also a siding that he had using Morse code, which is fascinating to hear about that. And you'll also hear about them talking about their own technology that they're using to

try. That was the main portion of the interview. those the main idea behind the interview was to discuss with them the data that they're collecting behind sightings and the tracker that they're using, this technology that they came up with, using frequencies and everything to connect people around the world who are seeing sightings and then kind of have this, you know, community to connect with everybody to say, okay, it's over here, it's over there, now you go look there and to kind of pinpoint it to try to figure out what, you know, everyone is seen.

not just singular sightings anymore. Now you're building this community. So I thought what they're trying to do is really, really cool and interesting to talk about. So I wanted to bring them on to talk about that. And they do talk about what they're doing there with their mission behind what they call UFOTracker.com. But also, it's UFO-hyphen tracker.com, just to put the hyphen in there. Because if you don't, then the website doesn't work. But then we do get into their experiences.

And what kind of freaked me out here was we recorded this interview last month. month, in all honesty. It's been a month that I have been waiting to try to put out this interview, but so much has come up since then that I kept having to push this one back. But in the past month, obviously a lot is happening with the missing scientists and government officials and military officials. And what I completely forgot about was how this episode, this conversation, actually connected to that. Totally forgot that this came up before it was even really highly in the news the way it is now anyway. And you'll see what I'm talking about. And so listen to here to all of this, what you're about to hear. And you'll know what I'm talking

about once you get there. And then I'll come back with some afterthoughts from this one because it really did kind of freak me out how the timing of this worked out. And I totally forgot some of the things that were in here over the past month. And it was, I'm telling you, it was eerie. I guess it's probably the best way to put it. So I'll let you get to it now. myself with EJ and John talking about, well, everything I just mentioned right here on UAP. Enjoy. EJ, John, thank you so much for coming on here to UAP. I'm looking forward to this conversation.

Thank you, Stephen. We are too. I'm glad to be here. Thanks for having us. Yeah, absolutely. First off, I want to start with the data points that you guys are working on because I'm a huge data guy myself as well. Now, don't get me wrong.

I love the stories, the lore behind the UAP topic throughout history. right there's some incredible citing stories encounters abduction stories and i love all of that because that's where my curiosity comes from and i think all of our curiosity is born out of those stories but i think it's always so important when we can look at real data whether that's medical records or actual you know data pertaining back to math or scientific data and that's where you guys kind of land so let me start there what exactly are you guys working on when it comes to data-driven studies behind UFO sightings? Well, we started having interesting experiences with the Angelic Realm,

or John's late wife and my late brother, kind of felt like they got us together from the other side. It was very interesting. Then he started talking about UFOs and asked me if I'd ever had a UFO experience, and he kind of dug something up out of my subconscious, and I realized that I had, but I hadn't really been chasing them. But both of us were scientists and mathematicians and were like, this is such a frustrating topic because how do we actually prove that something is out there?

And we started just troubleshooting and problem solving and our backgrounds in programming, which both of us have serious backgrounds in programming and data analysis and things like that. and we just started saying, you know, the one thing we need is multiple witnesses. We need multiple camera angles. We need redundant data so that people can't just dismiss one and, you know, dismiss them all. You can't dismiss them all. So if we actually had repeated data from the same sit-in and from two different locations or who knows what, but, you know, we can use that data.

We can actually compare that data. We can use that data to tell things. that other people can't tell, like size, shape, distance, speed, directions, etc. We started looking at what that potential was, and we're like, well, then how do we actually notify other people that something's going on in the moment? And that's how UFO track was born. So UFO Track is a, it's a website you guys created? Is there an app with it as well, or you have the website ready to go? It's all, it's all web driven. There are several parts to UFO Track. One is called sitings.uifo track that anybody can look at our real-time sightings in the world.

We have members worldwide. And we want more members. That's the whole thing. That's the denser the member, the denser the membership, the more likely we can actually get a repeating signal. We have these members that see things and report in with report.uFOTrack.com. And then that will notify out everybody within 50 miles of them. So hopefully those people will go out and look up. And if they see something, they'll also put in a report. And then everybody within 50 miles of them will go out. And then they'll put in a report if they see something. And we can prove the exoticness or the mundaneness. I mean, sometimes it disproves things when we get real data. But we can actually prove that something

is exotic or something has been debunked. It's solid. It's really fun, solid data to do, to study and to analyze. Right, right. I mean, it's such a cool idea. I mean, you're talking about, you know, essentially kind of using a community to triangulate positioning of UFOs and get real-time data about how they're moving, where they're going. And if it is truly something anomalous, right? Like you said, it's also about, it's not just about, oh, let me see UFOs and see where they're going. It's also about, well, maybe we might think this looks weird, but it could be a SpaceX rocket. It could be a satellite. It could be Starlink. It could be, you know, a bunch of different things.

So it's also about kind of creating that awareness to, I guess you could say, you know, look at the other options and use that process of elimination so that we know that we are actually dealing with something that is anomalous. And, you know, where are you guys now with this? What have you seen? How has this gone? So I guess, E.J., I'll let you take it from there. What happened? Somebody that was just working late in the middle of the night, saw something strange in the sky. They took out their phone and they recorded. And so I'll have some video up on our website as well.

That's the other fun thing is that a report at UFOTrack.com or a sensor detect will trigger an email to the person who reported or detected and ask them what they saw so that we can go deeper in just an immediate. interview, what did you see? So people can start responding back in real time or very near real time with what's going on so that we can get that out to the membership and tell them which direction to look and what to look for. And that's the fun of that. And then some of these people will actually respond back to that email with the attachment of the photo or the video they took. I post that on sitings.uftrack.com, which is the map. And people can double click on that. icon, that map icon, real time as you can get, I can have that up there in a day. I don't know anybody else that can react to this kind of stuff that quickly. I go back to

say Phoenix Lights where we knew we had a mass sighting. And we know that people saw it from Tucson to Phoenix. If we had had Phoenix like this during Phoenix Lights, we could have had the first blip show up in Tucson

and then people in 50 miles would have come outside with cameras in hand, prepared to look up. And then the next person that saw it would have put in the report, hey, I see it here, or hey, I see it here. And we could have actually just mapped and tracked and determined speed.

And then we'd have multiple pictures. And we could have gotten size. And we could have gotten better pictures. And we could have gotten something so undeniably that disclosure would have happened by default. Nobody could have covered it up. because there's just too many and there's too much. I mean, you would have seen a real life, real time disclosure event happened.

And that's truly, that's what I hope we see happen here, something that we can track. I don't care if it's across the city or if it's across the country, but something that we can track in real time, that we get enough data on that it just is undeniable. Make 2026 your year with Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses. around the world and 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S.

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at Shopify.com slash UAP. Go to Shopify.com slash UAP. That's Shopify.com slash UAP. Hey guys, so I'm going to get back into the show in just a minute, but if you'll allow me, Mars Men is a natural supplement and it's designed to support healthy testosterone levels. And I want to really highlight natural because I want to try to stay as natural as I can. I'm not looking to take any weird hormones or, you know, weird stimulants or anything like

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sighting into a mass sighting because you're taking something that, you know, somebody might see. They're out in the middle of the night in, say, Texas or Oklahoma or California, Florida, Arkansas. And they see something. And you think to yourself, and this has been the majority of UFO sightings over the years is where you have that singular event. And you're like, oh, my gosh, no one's going to believe me. Let me try to take a picture. Let me try to take a video.

And it comes out blurry. You can't really tell. And you're like, how am I going to explain this to somebody? And some people don't even try. But it sounds like with something like this, it would be a really cool opportunity where you can now make that singular sighting, that singular event into, let me see if somebody else can see this. So we can work on it together. I think it's, and I don't want anybody to think I'm like here to promote anything. I just think it's a really cool idea.

And I'm glad we get to talk about it. And the technology behind it, too, is such a cool idea as well. And I was actually going to ask you guys what type of information you do gather. from these sensors, but I think you answered it, which was you can tell the size of the object that is being seen. You can tell the speed or the velocity and the height at which this is flying, right? Did I pretty much cover it all there? If we get two perspectives, then we can triangulate and get size, speed, distance, velocity, et cetera. With a singular sighting, no, we can't tell that. The device actually just picks up the magnetic field disturbance, the longitude and

attitude, date and time. I'm excited for this, guys. I really hope it takes off, no pun intended. I really hope that it continues to gain traction and attention. And I'm glad that we can talk about it here today because hopefully it does bring it more attention. I think this will be something that's really, really useful to the UFO community as we try to continue to investigate these things and investigate claims and hopefully give us some

really useful information. So kudos for taking this undertaking. I know it's probably a lot to do. On that note, though, I did want to ask you guys, too, about your own personal experiences, right? It's not like you guys have just heard stories and you think it's cool and it's fun to look at. You've actually had experiences yourselves. And John, I know you've had a couple of experiences, right? Yes, but I had an experience way back in, I think it was 1974, with my first wife and we had a baby daughter.

We're living in a mobile home out at the west edge of Lincoln, Nebraska. it. And UFOs have been seen for several nights in a row. And so I had this idea of crazy idea. I was working for the railroad on some electronics. I had a PDPA computer in my mobile home, which first personal computer probably anybody had. Yeah, right. And I found that if I toggled the lights, the front panel switches and got a row of lights showing, it would actually put out an RF signal that you could hear in your AM radio headset. So I thought, okay, well, I could send a message by just putting a pattern to these lights. And I thought, oh, this is crazy.

Nobody could ever figure this message out. Unless, you know, there's somebody up there monitoring because they've been around for several days in a row. The message was UFO meet me top of hill about 9 p.m. tonight. And I sent that out. And then I thought, oh, this is crazy. And I just kind of forgot about it. And I actually didn't tell anybody about the experiment for years. Later that same day, a friend of mine and I decided we wanted to just drive around out in the country.

and watch for UFOs since everybody had been seeing them as reported on the local radio stations. So we did that. We drove around and didn't see a thing, dropped him off about 10 o'clock at night. When I got back to the mobile home, my wife was freaking out. She said about 9 o'clock, the cows had gone crazy, the dogs have been barking. Our daughter was crying uncontrollably, and the TV had turned to snow. So she was all freaking out. So I felt guilty about looking for UFOs.

Well, you know, she was all freaked out. out. It's anecdotal. I don't know for sure, but it's too much of a coincidence. Yeah, that's wild. Did you ever try sending any other messages after that using the same, like, you know, techniques? No, I just, it was so weird of an experiment, I just kind of forgot about it. And that was silly kind of a thing. But looking back on it, I realized, oh, maybe there was something very serious to that. I don't know why I just sort of brushed it off, but I did for years and years. Wow. That's really interesting. EJ, what have you experienced in the past? The one event that he reminded me of was one time I was in the rural Idaho and I was just out in the yard.

The only thing around was like farm lights just not very, it was pretty dim. And I see this thing and it just flies over very low and slow and silent. And I mean low as in low enough that I could. see the fuselage very clearly. I could see the vents, if you will, the vents and the nuts and bolts on this thing. I could see it. I could draw it for you if you needed to, but I could see the shape and I could see, you know, basically the equipment on the bottom of the thing and it flew over low and slow and silent. And it had the same shape as like the shuttle. So I always described it as like The shuttle and the shuttle was flying that day.

So I kind of dismissed it that, you know, maybe it was the shuttle coming in for a landing, but that didn't make any sense. But it is, you know, what your mind does, dismiss things, et cetera, et cetera. Anyway, many years later, we were in the Space Museum in Hutchinson, Kansas. And I looked up at this SR 71 that was hanging from the ceiling. And it was the same site. It was in what I saw flying over low and slow and silent was the same exact shape and size of this as this SR 71 and it was probably only about twice as far away as that thing that was hanging from the ceiling because I could see the same vents and the same nuts and bolts and the only difference was that the vents on the fuselage of the thing I saw were parallel to the fuselage and on this one they were perpendicular. Otherwise, it was exact same thing. And I said, that's what I saw.

And he said, and it was low and slow and silent. The SR 71 is not known for any of those. Yeah, not one, right. Yeah, it's the opposite of all three. So what did I see? I don't know. I could tell you the date because I know that the shuttle was flying. We did some research back into the one time that it should have landed in Florida and ended up having to land at Edwards.

And I could tell you, I think it was 1987. And I could get back to the date if I needed. do. But what did I see? And that made me believe in the secret space program that whatever it was, I had dismissed it as obviously manmade. I mean, who needs, UFOs don't need vents and nuts and bolts and stuff like that. So I had just dismissed it in my head as the shuttle or something manmade. And I didn't give it a second thought until John asked me about it. And then he just started questioning the low and slow and silent and yeah that made me realize that I had seen something extraordinary

so that was my biggest that was my biggest event very interesting have you either of you guys had any like you know close encounters with other beings where you've actually seen other beings before I know I've heard a lot been told a lot of different stories about you know being showing up in a room or you know in dreams abductors anything like that for you guys? Or we're talking mainly just craft related experiences.

Back in when I was in high school, 68, my brother and a friend, we drove to where we lived in a little town in Nebraska, down to Norfolk, Nebraska, it's about a half an hour drive. And we watched a movie in the evening. So we got out of the theater, maybe 11, 1130, somewhere on that time. We were walking down the alley to get back to the car. and suddenly saw what looked like a bolide, a meteor going across the sky, and it suddenly made a U-turn.

So, you know, wow, what was that? And then it made another 90-degree turn and faded up. We drove on home, and when I was all excited. When I got home, I woke my dad up, and all he could say was, what are you doing home so late? Why? Where you been? And it was like two in the morning. I didn't think anything of it at that time.

But later in life, I had a hypnotic session with a hypnotherapist, Colorado State Certified Hypnotherapist, and I had a weird story, I mean, being abducted, and I can still see all the things that I came up within the hypnosis. I still don't know if it was true or not. But the weird thing was, I got home to the little audio cassette tape of the session. She and I were the only people there, the hypnototherapist and I. I got home and I tried to play it for my wife and it was all white noise.

Nothing. Very frustrating. And then a week or two later it came to the next Mufon meeting and this gal was not there. They said, well, we have sad news this week. Evelyn Roberts was her name. She passed away in a small airplane crash in Wyoming. Wow. So I was just left with such an empty feeling.

It was hard for me to go back to move on for a while after that. And she was the therapist, the hypnotherapist who did the session with you. Yeah, right. Yeah, she was gone. And I didn't feel paranoid about it, but it was just left me with such a weird feeling. You know, that cassette tape was blank. And all I had was my memory of this session. It's just frustrating.

Very frustrating. Someday I should probably go get another session and see if I can recall all the details better. So as far as you know then, John, that you may have actually had an abduction experience based off of this session back when you were younger. What I consciously remember from the hypnotic session was this object came down close to our car. I sort of skid it off the side of the road. I remember a long, bony, dark brown hand coming in through the side window and being floated into the ship, laying on a table and felt like medical tests going on. I saw two or three different types of beings in my memories, which I still don't know if it's real or not, but I saw tall people.

And then I saw some really long-headed smaller creatures, entities in the side room, that kind of thing. Some metalwork and equipment that ain't just bizarre looking. And the other people that came with me that were there in the car when it happened, they don't remember anything. My brother, well, I shouldn't probably go into that, but he doesn't want to talk about it. So someday if he wants to, we'll find out if he has a similar experience. Yeah, understandable. Did the beings, as far as you remember, look like your classic, you know, tall grazed? Did they look human?

What was some of the descriptions on those? They were vague. The ones that were kind of all on my left side working on me were vague looking. It's like I didn't quite get a good look at them. The ones in the other room are the ones I looked at off to the side with the really long hats, strange looking. That's my conscious memory of the details in there. Very, very interesting to say the least. But I definitely wanted to get to the, well, the angelic side of things because you have experience, E.J.

with the angelic side of things. So that kind of plays into what I've been investigating. And I think I've actually even written a book on this. So tell me about what you've experienced on the angelic side and how it may have actually connected to the UIP phenomenon. Well, I have a brother who is named John as well. So it's a little confusing with the John name. And he died when he was 31. He died suddenly in a mountain climbing accident.

And it was devastating. But he was a scientist as well. He studied Nikola Tesla and he was ready to change the world, give it free energy and pick up the banner of Nikola Tesla. And this was, he died in 1987. So this is way before it was a fashionable thing to even evoke the Tesla name. So I've known about Tesla since I was a child. Basically, we had a Tesla coil basement. I can still smell the ozone anytime I'm.

even close to it. But anyways, he was an absolute scientist. And after he died, I was freaked out because ghosts scared me since I was a child, etc. But John was somebody who would probably try to attempt to communicate again and leave proof. He was into proof and scientific theory and everything like that. And I have two books. One is a fiction book, and it's called Angel on Board. And it is about the story of my pregnancy and who I think my son's guardian angel is. And who takes care of us? And my brother played into that as well.

But I also have a, I always say this was based on a true story. So people go, well, what was the true story? And so I wrote a spin-off book called Angel On Board Real Life Stories, where I have a story in there called Proof. And it is my brother, John's, coming to one of my family members in a dream and said, I'm going to prove to you that I'm with you. And you're going to find something that's special to me that you just wouldn't have found otherwise. But I need you to appreciate that you found it at this point in time and on and on.

And yeah, he came through. He predicted in his dream that we would all get together. and that he would prove that he was also there with us. And so he would prove that he was there because somebody would find an old hat of his. And he would use that as proof that he was there. He would give somebody one of his old hats. And so what happened is that my grandma got sick, but then it was also like her 90th birthday.

And all of us kids, there was five of us, four living in John, said let's all go to Denver, stay at my parents' house, and celebrate my grandma's 90th birthday, because we'd rather go to a birthday party than a funeral, you know, on and on. We said all these things. And we all said the same thing. We all had the same weird rationale as like we were being coached. But anyways, we were all there together. So the first part of the prophecy was there.

And the one person who had the dream hadn't told anybody else about the dream save her mother. So none of us knew that this was like happening. Hey guys. So before we get back into the conversation, I just want to talk about something that affects all of us. And it's scary. Starting something new, right? It's hard and it is kind of terrifying because you think about all the work that goes into it.

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Everything is all in one place with Shopify. making your life easier and your business operations so much smoother. So it's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at Shopify.com slash UAP. Go to shopify.com slash UAP. That's shopify.com slash UAP. Anyway, so ultimately the person who had the dream shared it with my father and he shared it with my sister.

But again, most of us weren't privy to it. My son, who was like two years old and not verbal yet, and everybody had gone outside to do a snowball fight. This was March in Colorado, and you know how snow has happened in March in Colorado. Everybody wanted to go out for a snowball fight, but it was also rough that my little two-year-old wasn't allowed to go outside. And so we were all watching what was going on, find out. out that he totle to the back room. And he came out of the back room with my brother's Yankees hat that he had gotten when my brother was like eight years old and had gone to the game seven of the world series.

And so talk about a special hat. And even in the thing, my son's name was just Sean Blake. And even in the hat, it said Jay Blake. So the person who found the hat had the same exact initials as the person who gave the hat to him. Anyway, so we don't know where that hat came from. But suddenly, he comes tootling out of the back room, and my father has this reaction that none of us understood. Right. Okay. And he's just like, ugh.

And then he tells everybody what had happened, and we realized how special that was. Wow. And that John had given us proof. that we were all going to be together and he was going to be there and somebody was going to find a hat. And none of us knew about it. And it's not like we were looking for hats. So. And that one person who he gave it to was the one who couldn't tell us where it came from because he wasn't verbal again.

Right. How about that? Wow, that's a really cool story. Thanks for sharing that because I do love those stories as well. Even though, you know, it may not have to do with, you know, aliens or UFOs. that part of the spiritual realm or supernatural, you know, conversation, I think has a place in all this. So I think that's really cool. Have you found, DJ?

I mean, have you found over time that there might be a connection with these two things? Or do you think they're separate? What I consider angels and protective spirits and things like that are inner, I consider them like interdimensional beings. whether they used to be people Angel just means messenger so I think that they're just interdimensional beings that can when they choose to interact with us. They can speak to us

they can do things. I've had audible experiences well just a couple but I have heard them talk to me and I think that aliens might be coming from out there they might be coming from like inter-Earths.

So they might be up there, they might be down there, and they might be right here, interdimensional. I don't know that there's really solid labels we can put on one over the other. The orbs that show up are light beings. Is that a UFO? Is that an extraterrestrial or is that just an interdimensional being? I think our labels are very, very limiting. So I do think that there is, yeah, I think that in the paranormal world, there's a lot of crossover. Real quick, E.J., there was just this bugging question in my head, and I hate to be conspiratorial when it comes to what you were talking about.

But I can't help but to wonder. And if you don't want to answer, that's fine. But you mentioned how your brother was looking into free energy when he passed away, you know, a tragic, untimely demise at the age of 31 in a mountain climbing accident. Did you ever suspect that that might be nefarious, given to what he was looking into? Or do you think it was just straight up an accident? I have had that thought all the time. just about on a big breakthrough he had just contacted some big bunny to help and they were going to come through he was studying at a university and yeah it really could have been but we have no proof

we have no way to try to explore that path except it would probably endanger myself and my family so yeah do i think that yeah i have had those thoughts many, many times. Boy, that is tough. And I know we hate to think that way. And, you know, I do appreciate you being so candid about it. And I appreciate you both for coming in here and for doing this, for telling us about your lives, your stories, and also for the mission that you're, you know, undertaking with

UFOTrack.com. So before we go, E.J., can you tell us just a little bit more how everybody can find what you guys are doing, the websites and everything about your mission? UFOTrack.com put the hyphen in their UFO I can't do this UFO hyphen track.com it's a hub for everything it's a hub for the membership it's a hub for the products and it's a hub for the books so if you go there you can find everything if you go to books to believe in.com you can see my angel book there I don't have my angel book on UFOTrack.com but john's UFO books are there So if you go there, you can find everything that you need.

But there's places for sightings. There's places to report. We have a YouTube channel there, which again, it's a hub for that. You can find it there. So everything that you want to find out about us, just start there and see where it takes you. Fantastic. John Craig, E.J. Thornton, thanks so much for doing this for coming on to UAP. Again, really enjoyed this.

And hopefully we can keep up on some of the things you've got going on and talk again soon. Hey, guys. So I'm going to get back into the show and just a minute. minute, but if you'll allow me, I wanted to get something a little bit more personal here, and that is my age. Yes, I have just turned 40, and with that in mind, being a now officially middle age, I have realized that it is harder for me to stay in shape. I work out, I exercise, I try to eat right whenever I can, but with all that in mind, I've noticed it's a lot harder to get in shape and stay in shape than it was when, let's face it, when I was younger, in my

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They can help your body burn fat. more efficiently and build lean muscle. That's all we can ask for these days is to try to stay healthy by burning fat and building lean muscle naturally. And with Mars men, your hormones can work the way they're supposed to. A lot of things can get easier on Mars men, workouts, your energy, staying lean. Mars men can help you do that. So do what I did.

Go check out Mars Men today. They can help your body get back to running like it did years ago. How nice is that? And with all the natural ingredients that we look for. And what's great is you get a nice. 90-day money-back guarantees. So there's no risk. So how do you get it?

Well, here's what you do. For a limited time, my listeners get 50% off for life, plus free shipping and three free gifts at men go to mars.com. That's men go to mars.com for 50% off and three free gifts when you check out. And after you purchase, they will ask you where you heard about them. So please support my show and tell them my show sent you. So thank you again to E.J. and John for doing that for coming on here. and for, again, you know, discussing their lives and for being so candid.

You know, and there was, I know you maybe did hear. There was a little bit of an echo when John was speaking. So I do apologize for that. We did have some audio difficulty during that interview. So, but I was able to salvage what I could during that interview. So hopefully it wasn't too bothersome. But there was some really interesting things that, you know, John was saying that I wanted to try to keep in there, even, you know, despite some of the audio issues that we were having.

So I apologize if that bothered you at all. I may be the only neurotic one that that bothered. I don't know, but I am very neurotic when it comes to sound and how things come across. But again, just really interesting stuff there from E. Jane John, especially talking about what they're trying to do with their UFO tracker. I thought there was one thing I want to take from that, that I had never heard before that John actually mentioned at one point, where he said that, you know, as far as human technology goes,

we don't have anything that can fly, you know, above 20 miles as far as, you know, unless you're going out to space or anything that we have that goes below 100 miles, you know, from Earth's surface. So that's kind of like the sweet spot that they're looking for. If they find something that is between that 120 miles, 100 miles above and 20 miles above. And if it's in that sweet spot, that's where you kind of start to, you know, one or something. under, okay, what could this be? Of course, aside from the things outside of Earth's atmosphere, that goes without saying. But in that sweet spot there, that's where you can really kind of narrow it down. I never thought about that before. So I thought that was pretty cool when John mentioned that and something to just keep in mind when we, you know, kind of investigate these claims and these

stories for ourselves. Of course, not everything is very high up. We hear about how the craft come down very low. And you heard John talking about that in his own case, when he sent out that Morse code and also when it came to his abduction in many, many other cases that we've heard just in our own time or that we've spoken about here on UAP before. So there's no doubt that not everything goes into that grouping. But it is interesting to consider kind of those bearings when we look at some different cases and think about what is it that we might be seeing. But of course, the one thing that got to me that I mentioned at the beginning that I want

to finish off with here today is how E.J. and John both mentioned people, close to them dying under mysterious circumstances. It freaked me out. I am not going to lie again because that wasn't even something that was on my mind at that point when we recorded this over a month ago. When John mentioned that his hypnotherapist who did his regression session died in a plane crash, now that could be very innocent thing, just a very tragic, unfortunate event, you know, that she died in a plane crash, but she was the only one.

to know about his session aside from him. And the other people you heard him mention don't want to talk about, including his brother. So is there something mysterious and suspicious there? We can only speculate, but it was weird. But the thing that really got to me, and I'm sure you noticed it, was when E.J. spoke about, again, this didn't even register to me until I was going back through this episode yesterday as it was getting this episode ready for today. when she mentioned her brother, who is a scientist, who is working on free energy of all things.

When it comes to Tesla's experiments, and how many times have we spoken about free energy here on the show over the past, you know, close to five years in Tesla specifically? And when it comes to, you know, these technologies that have been squashed and buried over time, especially Tesla, when he was just, you know, ridiculed and left to, you know, with nothing. After all the incredible breakthroughs he had in his life, the genius that he was, the visionary that he was

and he was left penniless and broken alone, only to have his research stolen after he died by the U.S. government. So now here you have, in 1987, E.J.'s brother, a scientist, working on free energy, working off

of Tesla's technology, and he dies in a climbing, a mountain climbing, accident. How eerie is that? Going back to 1987. And now, of course, we know that this phenomenon of missing scientists or government officials or ones that who have been killed is not something new. Of course, we know this has been going on allegedly for decades. It's one of the things that is very, very shady when it comes to the legacy programs over the decades. Accusations of silencing people through intimidation.

or murder, unfortunately. Just go back to Jeff Nusatelli when we had him on here a few weeks back. He spoke about the intimidation that he and the other witnesses suffer through before the congressional hearing in September of 25, the break-ins into his house that he mentioned, people coming up to him face-to-face, making it known that they could get to him whenever they want. It's that type of stuff. And so we're seeing that now, right, supposedly with these, you know, the missing 12, the missing or killed 12 now that's up from 10 when we include Amy Eskridge and the new case.

And now we look back at something like this with E.J.'s brother here in this episode, dying in a mountain climbing accident in 1987. And you heard me say at the end right there, do you suspect foul play? And she said yes, because of what he was working on. And she, you could hear, at least I noticed that when I was talking to her, you could hear the fear in her, in her voice and how unsettled she was talking about it because she knows, or at least she feels, that there is danger there in bringing up that subject. And she doesn't want to investigate it further in her own life because of the danger that

she feels that surrounds it. So here we have the modern day discussion that is, you know, taking the media by storm. And then we hear about that with E.J.'s brother from 1987, another mysterious death where he was working on free energy technology. of all things. So you can't tell me that's not mysterious with a mountain climbing accident or even with John's hypnotherapist

in a plane crash. I don't know. Listen, this is all speculation. All I'm saying is that that when I heard that, when I listened back making this episode, I could not help but to be absolutely shook when I realized the gravity of what she was saying

and I didn't catch it the first time around and now to connect it to what we're hearing today. scary. Scary stuff to think about how long this might be going on from decade to go to now today and we're still hearing about the same things. And I didn't even get to mention David Wilcox as well. Rest in peace to him. We saw what happened there. It is unsettling to say the least. No doubt about that. And I'm not going to lie, it does make me kind of look over my shoulders sometimes with things that are going on here. You know, not to say that anybody has a reason to come after me, but there is, you know, there's no doubt about it that there are people out there

who know who I am and what I do with this show and who I've spoken to and the things that I bring up and the things that I investigate. So, you know, yeah, it's a little freaky these days, not going to lie, but I'm not going to stop doing this. I'm not going to stop here on UAP. And in fact, you know, I'm not going to stop investigating. It's too important. And I just hope that nothing happens.

That would be nice to have nothing happened. but with that said, I am going to come back again next week. That is the plan with Roney Vernet. You heard me speak about that last week. Rony is a genius researcher in his own right. He does so much work in Brazil, in South America. And there is a case that he was working on over the past couple of weeks from 2008 in Brazil that no one is talking about.

And it could be one of the most incredible cases I've ever heard. and no one's talking about it. So Roney Vernet is doing work on that case, and I am very much looking forward to bringing him on here next week to UAP to discuss that, to bring that news to you, because you talk about, like, you know, we think about Virginia or we think about Brazil and UFO cases and we think about Virginia. This is, I mean, right up there in that echelon

with what we know about Virginia from 1996 and what we're hearing now, the story that Roney, Vernet is uncovering in Brazil. It's nothing short of incredible. So I can't wait to talk about that with him. I can't wait to present it to you here next week on UAP. And of course, much more in the future.

So be sure you are sticking around on the show. Continue to download it. Subscribe to it wherever you get your podcast and all the major platforms. Just search for it. UAP, Unidentified Alien podcast. Just putting UAP podcast really on Google and you'll find it. It should pop right up. And then, of course, through social.

media at UA Podcast 850 on social media just search that um you ap podcast on youtube you can search that out for all the videos follow along make sure you're getting all the latest updates of what's going on and what i have in store or just different things that i have to put out so and you can send me messages through any of those uh social media channels as well or through email s dineruap at gmail dot com s d i e n-er uap at gmail dot com if you'd like to get in touch with me um through any of those means. But on that note, it's been very, very interesting

couple weeks, that is for sure. And I'm glad I can bring this episode out to you here today. And I can wait to come back again next time here on UAP. So with that said, thank you all again for everything, for all the support. You know it always means the world to have you have my back.

So until next time, it's Stephen Deiner right here saying be well. And thanks so much. We'll talk again soon right here on UAP, the Unidentified Alien Podcast.