UAP Unidentified Alien Podcast - UAP Greatest Hits: "The Punisher" Talks Aliens - An Interview with Thomas Jane

Episode Date: November 23, 2025

You may know him from his staring roles in movies like "Deep Blue Sea" "The Mist" or "The Punisher" but Thomas Jane is much more than that. Listen as he and Stephen Diener discuss some of the biggest existential questions surrounding the UAP issue today. And of course we get some great stories about those movie roles too...See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Everybody talked about it since I first moved to Oregon. The big one, the earthquake that trashed the whole West Coast, total destruction. Officially calling it the largest natural disaster in American history. I just didn't know what would help me next. So I took it all. Even the gun. It was time. Cello?

See why American Afterlife is the number one fiction and drama podcast in America. Presented by pair of thieves. Listen on Apple Podcast. Spotify or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Available now. In a place like Los Angeles, people don't stop being who they are. Writers, thinkers, creators, people with stories still unfolding. That spirit lives on at Kingsley Manor, a community shaped by individuality, creativity, and lives well-lived. So when the conversation turns to what's next, it isn't about stepping away.

It's about continuing the story. explore your options at kingsley manor.org, a nonprofit month-to-month senior community within the Front Forch family. Well, hello there. Welcome into this edition of UAP's greatest hits. Stephen Dean are back with you here as always. And I've actually been meaning to put this one back out for quite a while now. So I'm happy to be able to do it today. One of the more, I guess, memorable and personal favorite interviews that I've done in the history of doing UAP. and that is when I got to speak with Thomas Jane, a famous actor, his role as The Punisher, is really quite legendary these days. And I got the opportunity last year, about a year and a half ago now, to have him on UAP as a guest.

And since then, I've actually been able to speak to him a couple of times in person. Met him over at Contact in the Desert this past summer and actually got to do an interview together there and even just sit down and have conversations outside of any interviews. So since this interview here that we officially took place on UAP, it's been a pleasure to get to know Thomas Jane Moore. And it all started right here with this one interview on UAP. So happy to bring this one back. It was a really, really cool discussion about the kind of how AI and robotics and psychology and all these different aspects fit into the alien UAP topic, you know, conversation, as well as kind of the origins of aliens, right? What are they? And this actually,

funny enough, I didn't think about it until right now, kind of fits into the discussion that we just had with Jordan Crowder on the two-part series that I did with him that just came out this week. So this kind of fits quite nice. The timing of this was unintended, but still fits, which is good. So myself and Thomas Jane right here on UAP's greatest hits, originally aired back in July of 24 and bringing it back now. Enjoy. Welcome back into a new edition of UAP Weekly. I am Stephen Diener back with you here on the Unidentified Alien Podcast Weekly Edition. And man, it's been too long. I am really pumped today to get back on here with you because I miss this. I mean, it's almost been 10 days, I think, since I released the last episode or the most previous

episode of UAP. And that was with Michael Ian Black, who was fantastic, by the way, you know, actor, comedian, writer. If you missed that one, feel free to go back and listen anytime. But he was great because kind of, you know, got into this stage of speaking with some, you know, people out of Hollywood. How does this, how is this subject taken on the, you know, Hollywood side of things? How is it talked about behind the scenes? How much does Hollywood play in, you know, possible slow drip disclosure and all these different things? And Michael Ian Black was kind enough to come on the most previous episode of UAP. And now finally, I can come back with a new edition along the same vein.

And I was able to speak with Thomas Jane. And Thomas Jane is a fantastic guy. I've been a fan of his for a long time, actually, since the Punisher movie came out. Was that over 20 years ago? Man, I'm just thinking off the top of my head. I guess it could be that long. John Travolta was in that. It was just such a great movie if you're into some of the superhero characters and things of that nature with Marvel and D.C.

but The Punisher has always been very relatable in a human aspect because he was just a normal guy, right, who lost his family and took revenge, became a vigilante. So, I mean, when Thomas Jane played the role of The Punisher, that was like, man, this guy is awesome. And I followed some of his different movies and, you know, things throughout his career over the years. So to be able to get him on the show here was just an absolute thrill for me.

And aside from being a brilliant actor and director, he also knows his stuff when it comes to the UAP issue. I mean, this guy is so smart and so well read when it comes to this issue. So it was really cool to get his perspective from, you know, again, his angle behind the scenes in Hollywood and how he kind of takes it all in from that end of things. Really well done. Really fascinating conversation that I think you're going to enjoy here with myself and Thomas Jane. A little bit longer.

It's funny because as we were speaking, before we started, I said, hey, you know, how much time do you have here? And I said, I normally go about 40 or 45 minutes. He's like, yeah, that's great. We ended up talking over an hour. So it just kind of goes to show you how this went. We both really enjoyed it. And I think you will.

Again, what is the conversation like in Hollywood? Thinking about the deeper existential questions, is this the biggest issue of all time? And so we get into a lot of these questions with AI and extraterrestrial biological organisms using biology to create technology, even some telepathy and remote viewing talk that we get into here, and also the movie questions as well. I mean, I had to ask some of those. But so that's some of the things you can expect here. There's a lot in this interview as we get into it now with myself and Thomas Jane on this edition of UAP.

Enjoy. Thomas Jane, thanks for coming on here. Appreciate it. My pleasure. My pleasure. I have a whole list of questions here for you today, but I wanted to start with, I guess, the best place to start is at the beginning, as they say. So how did you kind of get into the discussion kind of down the rabbit hole of the UAP phenomenon? What kind of brought you to all this?

Well, I certainly wouldn't be talking about any of this if it was pre-2017, 2018, you know, it's really 2018 and then to that it became sort of publicly acceptable. you know, actors are, we're all crazy out here in Hollywood anyway, so I wouldn't have expected to get, you know, I would have expected to get short shrift for the, for, you know, for, you know, bringing up aliens. This is not my style. But the events, it's over the past couple of years, have shown that this is a serious subject that needs to be talked about. And even though we've certainly changed the game in the last four years, we have a long way to go. It's the most important subject in the world, in the history of man, the idea, and we're still wrapping our minds around this, that not only are we not alone, but there's very advanced intelligence societies, so civilizations, we don't even know what to call them. We're just calling them that because that's what we are.

You know, we understand conscious, intelligent, social beings to create some sort of civilization. And the output of that is some sort of technology. So we can sort of correlate our own understanding. And that's really all we can do, you know. So as our technology evolves, so does the conversation about what these beings may be. I'm not sure that in the late 1890s there was a giant airship wave

that sort of swept the country and parts of the world, definitely the UK and some other parts. How much reality there was to that is really tough to tell because there was a lot of yellow journalism at the time and certainly sensational stories became viral in their day. But if there was any truth to those airship stories, and there are a few, Lauren Gross,

Lauren E. Gross has an unpublished book. Boy, a prehistory of the phenomenon, something like that. But he wrote a really terrific sort of deeply researched book about that first UFO wave in the, late 1890s. Yeah. And he's got some really interesting news stories. You know, some of them are obviously, you know, completely made up and just catching

the wave, so to speak. But there's some really interesting other stories in there with real witnesses. So who knows, really, you know? We just, it's funny, you know, as we get better recording history, it's still difficult to sort separate the wheat from the chaff as it should be um you know you can't figure this out over a weekend yeah well ain't that the truth we've been asking the question for a long time slowly coming to some sort of conclusions and one of them is that the phenomenon is real right um but my point was that in eight in the late 1890s the way they described the craft were consonant with it late 1890s

1890s technology, right? Pellers and wings and, you know, they even described the giant spotlights as in candle power. So that's what we're doing the same thing today. You know, we're trying to understand the phenomenon using what we know. And right now, AI has become sort of an interesting component to the conversation. It always has been, at least, you know, in some capacity since the 40s, like 40s. But now our understanding of what AI is capable of and what the possibilities are have definitely informed the conversation. And as we evolve, so will the conversation.

That was my point. That's a good point. I wanted to ask you about AI, actually. But before I get to that, there was something that you said at the beginning of your answer where you said, you know, you didn't want to sound like, you know, the crazy alien guy in Hollywood. And so I'm wondering, because that's something that we all say, right? If you work in an office and, you know, you're in a cubicle with your friends. You don't want to sound like the crazy alien guy at work or whatever it might be.

So how much of that stigma does exist? Is it just like any other, like is Hollywood just like any other workplace where you don't want to sound like the crazy person? Or, I mean, how is the conversation looked at, you know, behind the scenes? Hollywood is just like any other workplace. Absolutely. You know, a lot of smart people focused on doing a great job, not a lot of room. for other conversations, unless, you know, you're talking to a writer.

But it's always been a closed conversation, you know. It's a closed loop. I mean, essentially, people who are open to the idea are open to it, and people who aren't, aren't. And we've all sort of created a little UFO basket in our brain. And we've come to, you know, a conclusion, even if that conclusion is, I don't know, maybe. But that's about as far as the conversation goes, you know.

So part of our, part of our job right now is to try to expand the basket, you know, of what people are kind of carrying around when they think of alien visitation and UFOs. You know, so that's part of the challenge and the opportunity of this era that we're living in right now, you know, which just expand people's brains. just a little bit to make a little bit more room for not only, you know, are they here, but what is that? What are the, what are the potential? What are the potential? You know, what are the risks? What are the benefits? What does it mean for us? I think is an important conversation to take it out of the esoteric, you know, kind of like, is there a God basket and put it into what does it mean for us as a society, for us for the future of humanity? You know, And we have trouble thinking about those things.

Everybody's very focused on sort of paying the rent and being up in their career or getting married, you know, the things that we really worry about and strive to accomplish in this life. Those are the number one sort of human, you know, drives that we're all sort of indoctrinated into. But there are other considerations. And certainly alien visitation helps us to expand the band. Yeah, it's interesting because, you know, I've heard that before from just different people who outside of the basket, so to speak, right, that maybe it may not want to get into this discussion. And, you know, some of the things I hear are like, well, you know, when aliens start paying my bills, then I'll worry about it. And, you know, we get it, right?

It's not the everyday thing that's on your mind when you're driving into work and stuck in traffic. But it's such, like you said, when we started, it's such a huge issue. Maybe the most consequential issue out there when you really start to. sit and think about it, you know? Bigger. Yeah. Is there anybody in particular that comes into your mind that you do feel comfortable? Like if you're on the set,

you know, with a particular cast or crew, that you're like, hey, I can talk to this person about it or I can't talk to that person about it because they don't want to hear about it? I don't, I've learned not to bring it up. If it comes up naturally in a conversation, I've also learned that there's not a lot that you can add to people's, you know, preconceived notions, you know, some of them, I mean, that we need to categorize things and then put a label on it so that we can control it, deal with it, and move on, you know?

So most people have one preconception or another, and that's sort of where they're, where they're at. So in a public discussion, you know, or a round table or a dinner, you know, unless you're, you know, really focused on the subject. There's not a lot you can sort of add. I was working on the expanse. We were up in Canada. We were talking with the writers about some episode or another. And the whole thing is about the human expansion into space

and how that might really happen. And so it's a hard science fiction type of thing. And I brought that up with the writers. I was like, you know, other civilizations have, really expanded into the universe. I mean, they're visiting other stars. And they weren't having that at all. They were like, oh, that's nonsense.

You guys are writing the expanse, right? All that's a bunch of crap, you know. It's just nothing to that. It's all a bunch of weird tinfoil hat monkeys running around. You know, and I thought that was really fascinating. It is ironic. Kind of on that note that when you talk, about, you know, expanding, expanding knowledge, expanding technology when it comes to AI,

right? You mentioned AI a little while ago. What role do you think AI is playing now when it comes to the UAP issue or might play in the future? I mean, because it really is the ultimate wild card. Yeah, you're talking about human AI or alien AI? Because I think human AI plays a huge role. In fact, right now, we're starting to come around to the idea that we may have not even met the real organic biological

creatures that are responsible for this phenomenon. In fact, we don't know how interstellar travel works. If nothing can travel faster at the speed of light, a guy named John von Newman, who worked on the atomic bomb and was one of the Most brilliant minds of the 20th century, by far, probably the most brilliant mind is a guy named John von Neum.

And von Neumann came up with a concept of, because the question that Fermi and Rico Fermi asked is, well, okay, well, if the universe is so big and it's so old and biological life appears to, you know, the universe appears to be fine-tuned for biological life to emerge, where the hell is? is everybody. And Von Newman's response was that there's no reason why aliens couldn't build machines that traveled at sub-light speed level, but that they were what we now call Von Newman machines, which are self-replicating robotic machines that would be able to travel thousands of years because they're unmanned and land on a target planet. and then open up and then use the materials that it finds on that planet to build another von Newman machine and then those machines would then take off so you get this exponentially growing

populate wave of technology passing through a galaxy right and then several galaxies you could populate and then he did the calculations about how long that would take to sort of populate the galaxy and it's just a few million years. That might be what we're dealing with. We might be sub-light speed artificially intelligent probes. They land here. And not only are they building other machines just like it. You know, there's a great, I think, very interesting post that came out on Fortune.

A guy said he was a military analyst and that they were studying an underwater base. And that that underwater base was in the business of making probes or spacecraft or what we would call UFOs and sending them out on little missions. And that they were unmanned. They were built to spec for every mission. So if it was out, wanted to go collect some biology, that all the equipment on board would be designed just to do that. It would go do that and it would come back and that ship would then be disassembled and repurposed to make another ship to do another job. But it doesn't stop there.

There's nothing to prevent this same technology from collecting a genetic sample from the target planet, Earth, and then building its own bespoke organisms. You know, biological, synthetic organisms to do work. on the planet, you know, which makes a lot of sense. I was just about to ask you about that, actually, because I think they kind of flow together when it comes to the significance of the idea of, you know, extraterrestrial biological organisms. What would that mean, I guess, what would that,

I guess, look like in the grand scheme of things, the whole picture of, you know, ETs and EBOs for short? Yeah. Susan Schneider, another. really smart lady, she came up with this concept called Bysa. I'm going to not remember what Bysa stands for, but basically biologically intelligent synthetic, you know, AI. And this would be, you know, sort of the apotheosis of the merger between artificial intelligence and biology, right? biology does incredible things that technology can't, you know, just because of atomic sort of tolerances, you know,

you can get a hell of a lot more information into a strand of DNA than you can onto a computer chip. So that the best information storage that we know is in our, ourselves, right? I think some guys did a, I think they, they either did this or they computed that they could take a gram of DNA and that little cube could store every piece of information that we've ever created on the planet so far. Every movie, every book, and you could, you could store all that information into a little tiny gram of, um, a little, um, a little tiny gram of, uh, genetic material. So why not take advantage of that?

You know, it seems from our point of view, inevitable, that we would start using biology to create technology, right? So there is this merger. And then what that does to consciousness is also really interesting. We have a lot to learn from our visitors about consciousness, too. Yeah, on that note too, I mean, that entire idea is completely fascinating because, you know, kind of makes you wonder what are we looking at in some cases? You know, are we looking at androids of some sort, you know, are these just AI type of beings

or is it an actual organic being in some cases? You know, we talk about abduction cases. A lot of abduction cases, people across the world over, over. decades always referred to the same type of, you know, gray alien. They always have the triangle face, the big eyes. You know, people or human beings all look different, right? Like you and I sitting here talking to each other. We look different.

We have different facial features and things like that. But whenever we had these abduction cases, these beings are always described the same. So how could that be? Yeah. That could be the ultimate outcome of, the melting pot, you know. Not only that, but we're obviously going to start genetically engineering babies, right? That's coming. You know, I mean, why not? Why wouldn't we optimize our children? If we have that capacity, I would want a kid with a brain like Einstein and a body like Adonis.

Why wouldn't I? You know, that could live for a couple of hundred years, healthy, you know? I would love to give that to my kids. and so that's that's happening so you're looking at the intersection of technology and biology in a way that people are going to start engineering themselves and then they're also apparently going to be able to engineer drones you know robots like the abduction phenomenon doesn't sound that interesting if you're an alien scientist with an IQ that's twice as big as John von Newman's right like that could get pretty boring pretty quick like once or twice you know it might be interesting to go to another planet and abduct one of the creatures there and study it um but if you're talking about 80 years of doing that in a repetitive manner and you seem to be engaged in some sort of

program with a specific outcome then drones are going to be your best bet you know they've got They need to be smart enough to get the job done and to deal with contingencies. But man, you know, you can think of a lot better ways to spend my time after, you know, I've done that a few hundred times. So I think we're looking at both, you know, and one of the questions is, have we even met, you know, the true sort of originators of this phenomenon? And then you have to look at the 80 years of not only abduction. That's that's very recent, but we've got hundreds, maybe, probably thousands of definitely thousands. What am I talking about? Of contact cases.

Right. These are cases where, you know, a farmer or a mailman or, you know, a housewife, every walk of life has had these seemingly, you know, spontaneous encounters with landed craft and beings. And these beings are described in such a way that there's so many different varieties that it certainly appears that there's a lot of different sort of advanced civilizations who have come down here probably for a whole lot of different reasons. And yeah, it's hard to think of a more exciting sort of occupation.

and an extraterrestrial scientist who studies, you know, exoplanets and the life on them. I mean, what an incredible, you know, a thing to do with your life. So I can 100% see how they're, you know, this would be an experience that's shared by most or not, if not all, advanced civilizations. So, so, you know, how they get here is going to be a part of the answer. you know whether or not we're seeing the actual you know the real dudes or we're or we're seeing their avatars. I think it's a bit of both. Hey guys.

So before we get back into the conversation, I just want to talk about something that affects all of us and it's scary starting something new, right? It's hard and it is kind of terrifying because you think about all the work that goes into it. Are you going to be able to succeed? What new challenges am I going to face? It's that uncertainty. But I know how that is. Because I can think back when I started UAP, I was just hoping for the best.

And it's just like that when you're starting your own business. That's why Shopify is so great and why I'm so happy to be able to talk about them. Because despite all the fears and hesitations when starting something new, it certainly helps to have a partner like Shopify on your side to help. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S. from household names like Death Wish Coffee, Brooke Lennon and Kylie. But what if people haven't heard about your brand?

Well, Shopify helps you find your customers with easy to run email and social media campaigns. But what if you hit that wall and you get stuck somewhere? Well, no problem because Shopify is always around to share advice with their reward-winning 24-7 customer support. Tackle all those important tasks in one place, from inventory to payments to analytics and more. No need to save multiple websites or try to figure out what platform is hoping. posting the tool that you need. Everything is all in one place with Shopify, making your life easier and your business operations so much smoother.

So it's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at Shopify.com slash UAP. Go to Shopify.com slash UAP. That's Shopify.com slash UAP. There's a moment when you start to wonder, What's the right next step? Not about changing who they are, just finding the right kind of support.

At Kingsley Manor, life stays expressive, connected, and full of character, shaped by people who have lived interesting lives and aren't finished yet. So it doesn't feel like a change. It feels like a continuation. Explore your options at canesley manor.org, a non-profit month-to-month senior community

within the Front Porch family. Need skills for the job market, Now, Santa Monica College offers career programs you can complete in as little as one to four semesters. Get job ready with flexible classes and real world training. Enroll for summer at SMC.edu. Hi, you're listening to Meditating with Jan from Toyota. Soften your focus and visualize yourself offroading in a Tacoma. Now engage your senses. What do you hear?

A donkey. Because you're driving the kids to a farm sanctuary in a grand high. Breathe in, breathe out, and go from dreaming it to driving it today. Dealer inventory may vary. See your participating Toyota dealer for details. Event ends March 31st. Toyota, let's go places. I tend to agree with you. I think there's, I don't think there's one absolute answer. I'm kind of with you there. Because one of the reasons why, too, is when you hear some of these cases of close encounters or abductions, we hear about the phenomenon of telepathy. And so one story that pops into my head, and there's been many stories, but most recently, there's been a firsthand witness named Jason Sands.

Okay. We're supposed to be coming out in a new James Fox documentary. I spoke to them personally a couple of times. Great guy, really fascinating story, not familiar, says he came across a tall white extraterrestrial by the Nellas range out there in the desert where he's working. What year? 1994. Okay. About 30 years ago.

Yeah, fascinating story. And one of the things that happened to him with that meeting was he says he had this telepathic connection. Right. To the extraterrestrial. And we hear that a lot with close encounters. So it kind of makes you wonder, what is that telepathic connection, right? What are we tapping into? What are they tapping into?

and is this, if we're having a telepathic connection, right? In those cases, is that the actual organic being, so to speak? Well, you got Elon Musk who says that the eventual outcome of neuralink is going to be that we can communicate without using language, right? Mind-to-mind communication. Language is just a vehicle. It's a symbolic vehicle for our thoughts.

but if you can use technology to tap into the pre-lingual thoughts of someone, then you don't have to use the translative mechanism of language that we're so familiar with in order to get our thoughts across. That'll probably increase the speed and the clarity with which we can communicate, you know. Now I have to choose words that are based on my education and my own use of those words. words, what I'm comfortable with. And there's this whole web of language that our brains need to interface with, to communicate with each other.

If you can bypass that, you're also not worried about learning another language. You're not using worried about using an AI tool to translate another language. You're going to the source itself. So that's coming. And that's coming using technology that we already understand. We understand that that's a possibility, that we can do that. that we've got AI that can read brainwaves now and translate those into images and words and those that's getting better all the time so one way or another telepathy is coming but the part

that interests me the most is the phenomenon that dean radden is studied sci phenomenon and then how put-off's remote viewing program with ingot swan these these point to a real phenomenon of an extended mind, right? That there's more to our consciousness and our conscious experience, then, you know, we've all been led to believe, essentially. There's some really good evidence, and that evidence refuses to go away. That's another fringe topic that, rightly so, most, you know, level-headed scientists will say, well, there's nothing there. That's their job, you know, in one sense, is to sort of protect the borders of science, you know, but But in the other sense, those borders are under constant assault by the extended mind,

as Dean Radin calls it. And if there is something there, you know, then we will figure out how to use technology to enhance it. You know, so remote viewing was, you know, tried, they tried to work that into their spy program where thought, well, this is great. We can just have psychic spies, you know, just figure out where the submarines are that Russia's moving around. But the hit rate wasn't 100%. Right. Some people are better at it than others. Took a lot of training. And then, you know, the results that you got were either spot on or they

were off. So as a spy tool, it hasn't really panned out. But we start really investigating that and using technology to enhance it. And then you're looking at a potential vehicle that alien intelligence uses to not only communicate with each other, but very possibly communicate on an interstellar level, because apparently remote viewing operates in a non-physical manner using something like maybe quantum entanglement. We don't know. But the point is you can access information outside of time, you know, and outside of space. So it's not an electrical. magnetic wave. It's not a link. It's something that we're accessing. That's an inherent part of the concept that all points in space and time are connected, right? The field. And quantum fields are

another sort of subject that we're just starting to kind of crack and look into. But if these things exist, then you've got interstellar communication using technology and a natural sort of outcome of consciousness in the universe that these beings are able to tap into. And also that kind of stuff completely changes human society because human society operates under the guise that knowledge is power. And what that means is secrecy is power. If I know something and you don't, I have power over you. And that's the basis of corporations. It's the basis of government. Really, it's one of of the underlying features of being a human in today's world. Privacy, you know, the protection of privacy, the right to privacy. This goes all the way back to John Locke. So it's fundamental to the

human experience. But all of that goes away if you have a technology where you can access, not someone else's brainwaves, not their thoughts, but the actual events that have happened in reality at any time and any place. Now that's really heavy stuff, and we're a long way from sort of being able to verify whether that this is a real phenomenon, but looking at alien intelligent, it appears that it might be.

I don't know, maybe there's a telepathic connection here because it was something that was going to bring up and you brought it up for me, and that is the remote viewing aspect, you know, Edgar Casey, you mentioned Ingo, someone that comes into my mind is Joseph McMonigle, who is an incredible person. Statistically speaking, the most successful remote viewer in U.S. military history. And that's a guy who you talk about kind of like interstellar communication.

You put it perfectly about being outside of time. That's the way he puts it in different interviews about it. And in one famous instance, this was actually something I covered on a previous episode of UAP because I just found it so incredibly fascinating. He talked about having a connection to an extraterrestrial on Mars from like a million years ago. Right. And it's an unbelievable story.

So when you hear something like that, it really opens up an infinite amount of doors about what this could be, what our existence could be, what our capabilities really are. Yeah, about what the nature of reality is, you know. And these are essentially avenues of pursuit for us right now. And I think that people who study this behind closed doors, you know, obviously these alien technologies and societies are being studied and they're trying to put their best minds on it. You know, the secrecy is really getting in the way of them being able to really open the subject up and make progress. on it. But if these things exist, then you know that we're trying to figure out why they exist and what are the underlying components of reality that make these things possible, right?

And so it kind of gives us a little bit. Alien visitation gives us a window into our own future and also the nature of reality, you know, how reality is really put together. And it gets beyond our sphere, our human sphere of knowledge, you know, which is unbroken. for 50,000 years. We've been putting together this human knowledge sphere, the newest fear. Chardin talked about. That's the unbroken historic line of human knowledge that's accumulating over time and continues up to this very moment.

Well, that knowledge sphere is now being impinged by another knowledge sphere, right? And you can tell, looking at the cases that they're very kind of careful. in how they perturb our knowledge sphere, you know? For example, when there's no cases of alien abductee or someone who finds themselves on an alien craft, there's no art, you know, there's the the outfits that the aliens wear is very plain, very simple. You might see an insignia somewhere. you might see something like a collar. Other than that, there's no cultural communication that these aliens are communicating.

They never tell us anything about their society. They never tell us where they're from. So they're keeping that cultural communication to a minimum. And what we can actually, you know, say we know about these visitors is very slim, you know. Yeah. We kind of describe their technology and that they're here, and that's, you know, that's about it. They appear to be up to some sort of, you know, program that has something to do with biology, and perhaps they're creating hybrid alien humans to live and work here.

You know, those are possibilities, but everything is frustratingly opaque. Yeah, it's a good way to put it, which is why we keep asking the questions, right, and why we have these discussions. And why we're supposed to ask the questions. Yeah. And that's another. They've studied, they obviously probably know more about us than we know about ourselves. So they're able to predict with some accuracy what our response is going to be, right? So we have to factor that in.

So whatever we do know about visiting aliens, they want. us to know. We have to factor that in. What do they want us to know? What do they don't want us to know? And what that might mean for why they're here. What are they doing? What do they want?

You know, all the good questions. That actually leads into another question. I'm hearing down. Thank you for all the segues, by the way. I mean, it's just fantastic. It makes it so easy. Do you think, and this is completely hypothetical. So, I mean, but do you think there is a certain point that E.T.'s,

whatever race of ETES it might be, that they're waiting for the human race to get to, whether it's an awakening, whether it's a telepathic communication, whether it's, you know, some type of clean energy acceptance, I don't know. Do you think there's a point that they're waiting for the human race to get to before they make that, you know, here we are type of connection? Well, you mean before we actually are able to sort of interact with these alien intelligences? Yeah, too input. The gap between us is entirely too large to have any kind of meaningful understanding.

You know, we are still incredibly primitive in our thinking. And we have competing models of reality. And we don't know which are the valid ones and which aren't. We operate humanity under a belief system, right? We have belief systems. We believe in murder. materiality. We believe in the existence of a universal God. But these are belief systems. We don't have enough evidence or experience to be able to understand whether both are true or neither are true.

So when you're dealing with creatures who have a much different understanding of reality, there's nothing for us to talk about. Now, whether or not they're waiting for us to catch up, I doubt it. I think that they've got enough conversations that they've got going on that are interesting. You know, I don't think they're particularly interested, but in us and what we might have, what we might have to contribute to the conversation, which at this point is nothing. So right now, shut up and listen is the best policy. And I think that we are being managed.

I think that our own technological ability is approaching the area that could become dangerous to them. right so whether maybe it's my darwinian thinking you know but i'm under the impression that an alien civilization would um keep the integrity of that civilization paramount in their minds at all time we've been around for a really long time they plan on being around for a really long time and they need to manage situations that could become problems to them later not while they happen the way we do. You know, oh my God, that guy just blew up that building. Let's go bomb those guys, right? They're trying to nip this stuff in the bud early, early enough so that we won't become a problem. And I think that we're not the only ones. You know, if there are several thousand or million

advanced alien civilizations out there, that means there's an exponentially larger number of less advanced or primitive civilization out there, right? So we're not the only monkeys. You know, trying to figure out, you know, how to steal the keys to the Maserati. There's lots of other guys out there, and you wouldn't believe what these other idiots get up to. So we're probably part of a management system that we're just a small part of a much larger management system, you know, which makes perfect sense to me. Really interesting because it also kind of makes you think about where... You know, what do, I guess as far as the connections go with all of this, right? Where we talk about, is there a spiritual connection?

Some people talk about that, that there's some type of spiritual connection to all this, that maybe some people in the know, so to speak, don't want to have it get out. I mean, do you buy into any of that as far as what type of interaction this might have with, you know, the spiritual side of things? I think that the control systems that we have instantiated here on planet Earth have been around for a really long time, and that those control systems need to deal with our evolving technology and any other evolving sort of threats that come along and need to be absorbed into that control system, right? we see this most obviously with the church and how they were able to control human society for so long. And then the baton got passed to science.

Now we use science and technology to sort of make the rules and control human society. And there's always been a control system. And that control system includes all the things that are most basic to humanity, spirituality, being one of them. So that's another component to this whole mystery is how the controllers, the people who operate the control systems that we are all yoked under, how they deal with the phenomenon and what they're trying to protect. So that's another sort of barrier between us and the reality of the phenomenon is the people keeping the secrets, the people manipulating our understanding of these secrets.

So we're doing all that ourselves. And we don't, if we get down to it, we don't have an understanding of what consciousness is. What we really don't, you know, the spiritual component appears to be, and it is to us, very real. But what the nature of that spirituality is, is there's probably another disconnect between us and the alien intelligence. But in my opinion, you know, the concept of love appears to be a really good definition for the universe itself, you know.

The cultivation of information is another way that you can say it. You know, the universe is an information. producing machine. And over time, that information, it's more and more complex, right? We started out, this is Terrence McKenna. We started out as the universe, like nothing happened for billions of years, just flat, empty. And then stars began to form and then all, you know, these, and then complexity began to emerge. And now humanity is one of the sort of premier information crunching machines.

that the universe has produced. And those appear, so that, another way of sort of defining the cultivation and preservation of information is love, right? Because that's what love means. It's deep, it's deep, man. Go deep. Yeah, that's good. On that note, though, do you think people are ready for it, right?

Because that's, like you said, it's deep. If it's a deep conversation, there's a lot to it. There's a lot that maybe, like you said, we don't even understand sometimes of what really goes into all this and the existential questions that surround, you know, extraterrestrial life and life in the universe. Do you think people are ready to hear some type of version of disclosure? Well, you know, you're never really ready, right? I mean, things happen that change civilization and, you know, is anyone never really, you know, sort of ready for it. I mean, and the fallout would be the repercussions would happen in ways that we can't predict, you know. And my example is the pill, which was legalized in 1960, but only for married couples.

because the government and society, you know, we didn't want women running around, you know, being able to have sex with whoever they wanted. But married couples who wanted or didn't want to have a kid, that was okay. It was in 1972 that the pill was finally legalized with a big Supreme Court ruling case that made the pill available to all women. And that's how we got disco and the swinging 70s because women were now liberated. to have sex on a casual basis. Because before that, you know, if you had a kid and the dude, you know, didn't want to marry you, you were completely as a woman. You know, it was hard for a woman to work, a full-time job.

It was a different world. But the pill changed the world and the way we run society, right? It also, you know, the pill, which was designed to prevent babies from, unwanted babies from popping in to our reality, actually created more unwed mothers and more emotions, right? So it had, you know, the opposite effect of what we were, you know, trying to use it for and also changed society in ways that nobody could predict. So the same thing would happen with alien disclosure. It's a process. I don't think that the government is going, you know, look, people study this stuff.

They know what's up, you know. The Brookings report came out in 1960 and said, you know, this is probably not a good idea. You would disrupt society. Well, they weren't talking about you and me. They were talking about the power structures that control human society. So the Brookings report, if you read between the lines, and they're very smart people who wrote the damn thing, so you should be reading between the lines. The message is really clear.

This is a disruptor. It disrupts the power structures that are currently the pillars of human society. Bad idea. And that's still true today. It's a bad idea to the power structures, right? So this kind of disclosure is only going to happen through the conversations that we're having now. And it's going to be a process. It's going to be a slow process.

But that's not going to stop. us from asking the questions and starting to create a body of knowledge, you know, in the, in the marketplace of ideas. Some ideas sound interesting now and in five years, they're going to be totally crazy because this is the marketplace of ideas. This is where good ideas rise to the top and untrue ideas kind of fall apart over time. So like it or not, alien intelligence has inserted itself into the human marketplace of ideas. And that and is already evolving and having an impact on human society. And that will only continue to grow. What do you make is some of the names like David Grush and other whistleblowers out there? You know, people who have worked in the

program, so to speak, as they call it, you know, they testify in front of Congress and they do the 60-minute interviews like Lou Elizondo or, you know, Christopher Mel and all these high-level guys. who worked in the programs or no people worked in the programs. I mean, do you think we're going to see more of that when it comes to more guys coming out and trying to have these conversations out in the open? Well, I certainly hope so. I mean, you go all the way back to Carl Wolf and all the guy, Donahe, Donna Hare, all the people who testified in the mock congressional trials in 2001 and I think 2011.

And so this is also part of the evolution, right? So now we're seeing actual sort of congressional testimony happen the first time in 50 years. So this is all part of the process. And it's an important part of the process. And we will see because these human beings exist who have done the work, who have had direct contact with the materials and with the technology and other things. And they will slowly start to come forward. you know they obviously they saw what happened to grush and that that would give anybody pause you know he was threatened he was he went through a really tough time so he's a heroic figure yeah who actually

stood up and told the truth in an environment that does not want to hear it so that's in my definition of a hero and and a trailblazer and yes we'll continue to see as this becomes easier to talk about and as the protections are put into place by the power structures, you're going to be able, we're going to see more of this. And that's all great. Fantastic. Yeah, I hope so, right? And then we'll continue to have the conversations.

Yeah, it lets us, it allows us to take the subject seriously. We're already seeing more academics come out and start to, you know, enter the conversation. And that's what we really need. We really need scientists, academics, thinkers to have the freedom to be able to come out and sort of say what, because there's a lot of them, they're thinking about this stuff, but they're not, you know, the structure is not in place for them to be able to communicate to the public freely. That can't happen. They can do that privately, but we're starting to see that change. That's probably the biggest deal that we have

and that if we're here to support something or encourage something, the most important, aspect of the phenomenon, and it's a direct result of things like the testimony of David Brush is allowing academics and scientists to begin to enter the conversation. It's the most important aspect of the phenomenon today. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e-commerce in the U.S. from household names like Death Wish Coffee, Brooke Linnon, and Kylie. But what if people haven't heard about your brand? Well, Shopify helps you find your customers with easy to run email and social media campaigns. But what if you hit that wall and you get stuck somewhere?

Well, no problem because Shopify is always around to share advice with their reward-winning 24-7 customer support. Tackle all those important tasks in one place, from inventory to payments to analytics and more. No need to save multiple websites or try to figure out what platform is hosting the tool that you need. Everything is all in one place with Shopify. making your life easier and your business operations so much smoother. So it's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at Shopify.com slash UAP. Go to shopify.com slash UAP.

That's shopify.com slash UAP. When you fly with Hawaiian Airlines, it's hard to tell where your flight ends and vacation begins. Relax with Free Starlink, the fastest Wi-Fi in the sky, thanks to T-Mobile. Go ahead, stream your movie. Book the couple's massage. Make a dinner reservation while we bring you to our island home. Hawaii starts here.

Yeah, that is huge to have, you know, that confidence, right? Because that's somebody that people just inherently trust. You know, it's like, well, you know, like Dr. Michael Masters. They're trained thinker. My master's guy, I just bought his book, Identified Flying Objects, I can't wait to read. But they're trained thinkers, you know, and they're also very versed in sort of the human knowledge sphere that we were talking about, right? They're extremely well versed in one particular aspect of sort of like our knowledge, our history of that knowledge in a particular subject, whether it's microbiology or nanotechnology or evolutionary archaeology. And they have contributions to make within their field, and they should be making those contributions.

That's fantastic. I know I don't want to keep you too, too long. I feel like we could talk probably for a couple more hours, but I don't want to take up your entire day. Thomas Jane, thanks so much for coming on here, UAP. I want to ask you, I guess maybe more along the lines of some of the Hollywood questions, right? Now, this maybe is a silly conspiracy theory, but I'm always willing to throw them out there, so that's fine. When we talk about, you know, having the discussions, asking the questions, disclosure, and those things, do you think Hollywood has played a part intentionally or unintentionally and kind of training people to accept some of these ideas with, you know, some of the more famous movies, like A Contact or Independence Day and things like Close Encounters of the Third Kind?

It has that played a part in kind of training people over the decades to take this conversation more seriously? Do you think it's had the reverse effect? Stories are a reflection of the society that creates the stories. Hollywood is about making a buck. You know, it's expensive to make a movie. So if you're going to spend them all the time and energy and money to create something, you don't want to make something that people want to watch. So that's number one, you know.

The other side is there's a little bit. of CIA meddling in certain aspects, especially the political movies or the movies about war. The CIA's got their stamp all over that. They don't, stories are powerful, they don't want messages out there that don't align with the narrative that they want to promote, right? So that's another part of it. But with the alien subject, I think it's more of the marketplace of ideas that we're seeing.

You know, the stories that are coming out are reflective of the society that is, you know, going to be listening and watching those stories. And that really is the best way to look at the Hollywood stuff. You know, yeah, there's a little bit of conditioning, but it's definitely a, you know, self-reinforcing feedback loop where the stories are being reinforced are the stories that, you know, most people sort of want to hear that they call it. the lowest common denominator. It really, you know, is, and then every now and then you'll get an outlier, you know, like close encounters of the third kind, which is still the best movie made about the UFO subject. But, you know, we could use another one. I hear Spielberg is working on another UFO film, and that'll be the most anticipated movie for me, for sure.

I mean, are you trying to get in that? Are they asking you to be a part of the project? What's going on? Come on. They got my numbers. So far, Spielberg hasn't called me on that. All right. I'm a big fan.

I love watching. Love watching. He's some of the best. He's one of the all-time great filmmakers that we've ever had. He's a treasure. I completely agree. I mean, do they talk, though, guys like James Cameron or Steven Spielberg? Do they talk to some of these agency guys?

to try to get some real information to put, you know, whether it's, you know, again, War of the Worlds, you know, Stephen Spielberg was involved with that, of course, the remake of it. I mean, are they getting some type of inside information to help as far as research and messaging some of these movies? So we've created last year we started this thing called the Hollywood Disclosure Alliance. Yes. We've got it. I forget it's like 100 now, different UFO and alien researchers who have been, you know,

professionals in the field. And the idea is something like the science and entertainment exchange, where if you're working on a script about nanotechnology, you can call the science and entertainment exchange. And they'll hook you up with a nanotechnologist that can walk you through the latest science. And then you have the opportunity to incorporate that into your story. We're doing the same thing with UFOs and aliens, you know, where people want to inject, you know, sense of reality in the subject into their film, we can hook them up with different experts in the particular area of interest.

So we're trying to inject a deeper sense of the reality of the phenomenon into the stories that we tell about the phenomenon because there's few and far between in Hollywood movies that injects a sense of sort of what's really happening. And in my opinion, what's really happening is way more interesting than the Hollywood versions that we've seen so far. It's a good point. Maybe it's even watered down a little bit in some of the Hollywood versions. And shout out to the HDA and Dan Harari, by the way. He invited me to become part of the HDA.

It's a good organization. It's got a good goal in mind and hopefully we can begin to have an impact on the stories that we tell about this subject. I think that's a, I'm all in on that, in that, you know. That's awesome. What do you think has been the most impactful movie? Is it, is it close encounters? Is it, you know, more of the, I guess, sensationalized ones like Independence Day? I think Contact is a great movie, Jody Foster. I mean, so many of these movies have been made.

Do you think there's one that's had more impact on the discussion than others? Well, you mentioned two of my favorites, Contact and Close Encounter. you know, certainly open the mind, you know, in ways that I think that that's part of our job. And, you know, and the rest of them are just, you know, takeoffs

of war of the world. So that's a story that's been told for well over 100 years now. So we definitely have both. I'm hoping that we can start to change the narrative and get into some stories that really make open people's minds and make them think about the subject in new ways. I think there's

nothing more powerful than storytelling in our society. It's one of the things we do best as human beings. I meant to ask you this earlier, so it might be out of place now. I don't know if I'm like I'm jumping around, but have you had any personal encounters yourself, personal stories, dreams, sightings that have given you pause in the past? I have had experiences in the past that kind of let me, led me down the rabbit hole. I think that's happened with a lot of people who take a keen interest in the subject. They've had experiences they can't explain, and that sends them down the rabbit hole. And, you know, in my case, I was completely flabbergasted to find that there was a real phenomenon going on here. I completely bought into the, the military's narrative

that there, you know, that there was nothing to see here. So it was mind-boggling, you know, and it's quite an awakening. So it really is a powerful subject and it can change lives. Our quest right now is to find ways to bridge the gap between people who are on the fence or completely closed down to even the concept, looking at the idea that they've already made up their mind. Like, how do we start turning more heads? Because that's what we need. We need more brains on this problem. And the only way to do that is to get people to look at it. The only way to do that is to offer compelling reasons why this phenomenon might be real. What was that moment for you, right, where you said, well, geez, there's really something to

this. Was it just, you know, New York Times articles, something that you saw in the news and it just hit you or something that's, you just realized, hey, there's a lot going on here? For me, you know, you just got to start reading the books and looking at the history. So I'm a book guy. So my first go-to was to, well, well, who's, what's been written about this subject, you know. And I went back to the beginning. I started looking at Donald Kehoe's, you know, work and Frank Edwards, you know,

and then sort of followed that trajectory. It got into the work of James E. McDonald, who was an atmospheric scientist who worked on this problem for years. and did some really initial scientific work in the subject. And then you get into Jay Allen Heineck and Project Blue Book and studying Blue Book, you know, with a skeptical but open eye. And then you read Richard Dolan's UFOs in the National Security State, which is a fantastic sort of document of the military and the government interaction with the phenomena. you start putting the pieces together.

You know, it's certainly not one book that you can read and go, okay, I figured this out. It's like a puzzle and you start putting the pieces together slowly, following your nose, you know, in my case, trusting my nose. You know, I get a pretty good bullshit meter. And seeing where it takes you, you know, and then you, I've reached a point where it become more about sort of what my own personal interests, where they lie, you know, and sort of the consciousness studies and the interaction of the actual

intelligence, you know, why they're here, what do they want? So I wrote a book. It's called A Human Guide to Visiting Aliens. I'm editing that now. And that's my, you know, my contribution to the conversation, just based on notes that I've been making and things that I've been sort of observing over the years and have something to add that I haven't seen a lot written about. Jim Mars wrote a great book called The Alien Agenda, which is a really terrific book. But, you know, outside of Jim Mars, alien agenda, it's not a whole lot that's been sort of really tried to tackle what this intelligence is, who they are, what do they want, why are they here and what that means for us.

What does it mean for the future of humanity? What does it mean for humanity today? What can we learn? All that stuff really fascinating to me. I think it's great. I think you kind of hit the nail on the head. When the book comes out, I'd love to have you back on.

We can talk about the book and what's in there and everything. You bet. I'd love to do that. Absolutely. What is it? July, we're in July 25th. I've got a new season of my show that I

produced directed start-in. It's called Tropo. Nice. We shoot it in Australia. So season two of Tropo drops on the 25th of July on Amazon. So please check that out. We had a lot of fun doing that. And I directed a couple of the episodes this year.

So I'm proud of that. That's awesome, man. And actually, well, leads me to my final topic, which is I'd be remiss if I didn't ask you about some of, you know, the great work that you've done, on the big screen and on the small screen.

I was a fan of you before we started speaking. Now I'm a fan of you personally because I think you're awesome and you've been great to come on here, super nice and super smart, by the way, in case anybody didn't know, Thomas Jane's a very smart guy. But I was a fan of you back during the Punisher. So I've got to ask you about the Punisher film.

I think, and this is just me inserting my own fanboyism here, so please excuse me. I think it's one of the biggest travesties of all time in Hollywood history that we did not get a sequel to the Punisher. What happened there with the studios? There was so much great story to tell, and you did such a fantastic job bringing that role to life. Right.

You just a little insight of what happened there after the first one came out? Well, you know, obviously we worked on the sequel. We went through a few different writers. I was, you know, privileged enough to be able to work with some of these guys. Stort Beatty at one point was writing a Punisher script. He'd run off and he took another job for some reason. And we had a couple of different directors. So we're working on getting the sequel together.

And then I managed to get a meeting with Walter Hill, I'm a huge fan of, huge Walter Hill. I'm a huge, huge Walter Hill fan. I love the tone. And the tone and the style. that he brings, I felt was perfect for Punisher. And Walter wanted to do it. We had several meetings, talked about what the story might be. Walter was going to write it. Of course, he's got all the help he would ever need in that department. You know, the guy wrote alien for God's sake. And took it into

the Lionsgate and they turned us down, which I still sort of can't, I don't understand. But I basically said, So you're going to turn down Walter Hill. So who do you have in mind? And the director they had in mind hadn't done anything that would tell me that they knew the character of the world or really understood, you know, especially, you know, if you're looking between Walter Hill and another person who didn't, whose body of work didn't tell me that they understood that sort of genre. So I walked away to make a lot of. story short. I just, you know, I think that Lionsgate had some money that they needed to spend by the before the end of that year. So they were kind of pushing something to happen that was not organically ready to happen. And that's why I just like, you know, I'd rather just not do something

that's going to be really bad. Yeah. And that was, I did a little short film called Dirty Laundry. If anyone hasn't seen Dirty Laundry on YouTube, check that out. I was about to bring that up, actually, because that kind of did, in a short film way, fulfill some of the things that the fans were wondering or what would a sequel look like. Right. Yeah.

So I thought that was great. That was a lot of fun. And I really like, what's his name? He was playing the Punisher now. I think he's great. Yeah, John Barrenthal. He does a really good job, and they did a great job at that series. I mean, personally, I think it would be,

pretty cool if they had you as you know kind of a cameo in there you know some type of working you in on that series so I'll say I'll direct something that's sort of similar in that in that vein I was a great job doing that

that'd be awesome it's at right now I had a great time directing Trapo and I directed an episode of the expanse which I'm very proud of so that's kind of heading in that direction now I've got a company called Renegade. We're developing a few films and got another show with MGM that we're putting together.

So I'm having a lot of fun doing that kind of thing today. That's awesome. I was actually, I was wondering because I saw recently a documentary on Gene Wilder, who is one of my favorites of all time. It's on Netflix. If you haven't seen it, it was really well done. Okay. But they talked about kind of that transition of, you know, on the screen to,

behind the scenes when he directed a few different movies. How different is that? I mean, what's the experience like when you kind of go behind the scenes? I'm sure it's just a totally different sense of fulfillment, I would imagine. Well, you're curating a movie from beginning to end, a story. You know, whether it's movies, television, whatever you're doing. You're curating a story. You're developing and then sort of bringing to life a story is really what you're doing.

And if you're good at it and you're able to. communicate what the story should be to enough people because you need so many different technicians and craftsmen and artists to help you put this story together. And it really comes down to your ability to communicate what the story is and what do you want. And that gives everybody an idea of what you don't want. You know, carving away what it's not is almost more important, you know, to sort of and then what what it is will reveal itself. But that, being in the business long enough to understand what's most important about how that process works is why I'm getting a real kick out of producing and directing these days.

You know, because it's a dense, like alien, the study of alien intelligence, it's a dense, complex, multifaceted, multi-layered process. And for my money, it's definitely worth dedicating a life to

and learning about you never stop learning. So there's full of surprises, you know, and like William Goldman says nobody knows anything. Yeah. Very cool, man.

That's awesome. And I would be remissed if I would actually get yelled at. I might be sleeping on the couch if I didn't say that my wife wanted me to tell you that she loved you in deep blue sea. You got to get that out there. She actually had it on the other day.

I'm like, I'm going to be talking to him in just a few days on UAPs. Well, tell her, I said thanks. Absolutely. One of the old-time surprise scenes with Samuel Jackson, too. I mean, every time I see that scene where he's giving the speech, it's just like, whoa, where did that come from? Yeah, we screen that in New York City. And, you know, before the premiere, we had a sneak screening in New York City.

and you couldn't, after Sam Jackson got eaten by the shark, you couldn't hear the movie for about five minutes. You lost their minds. It was so fun to watch. And you could see the studio guys running out of the theater calling, you know, and they were saying, we need to put more money into the advertising here. We've got, we've really got something. But by then, you know, the ball had already been rolling. So what was it, Blair Witch Project beat us at the box. office, which was shot in my backyard. So that was, that was personally offended by the

Blair Witch Project, which they literally shot in the woods of Maryland, where I grew up. Oh, that's wild. And then that came out and did this, it was the first sort of online publicity campaign that produced a number one movie. It was a, it was a phenom, you know, it just came out of know, and it's unwatchable. The damn movie's unwatchable. Deep Blue Sea is still hanging in there. That's awesome. I love that. That's great.

Well, before we go, Thomas, Wells, would you like to throw out there? I mean, where can people find you in social media? How can they follow you? Again, all the projects you were talking about you have coming up. Reuterate some of that before we go. It's card carrying Thomas Jane, I think, on Instagram or something like that. I don't follow any of that stuff.

But I do post things, the things that I'm up to. Or if you send me a link to this, I'll throw it up on. there so people can find out what I'm doing going on there. Otherwise, stay the fuck off of social media people. It's a waste of life. Pick up a damn book. This is a good one. I'm reading this right now.

Weird tails. Very cool. I don't break it now. Goodness. That was the cat. Oh, geez. Well, this has been great. Thomas Jane.

Thanks so much for coming on here at UAP. It is awesome discussion. And I hope we can do it again. Like I said, when your book comes out, there's a lot of grounds still that we can cover. I had this whole note page here of questions and notes, and I think maybe I got to 30% of it. So you do it your homework, pal, and that's what counts right now. So good for you. I appreciate it.

Well, we'll definitely do again, hopefully, some time in the future. And can't wait for when that happens. Thomas Jane, thanks a lot coming on here at UAP. Appreciate it. You're on. America's first pledge was freedom. Jeep still carries that fighting spirit. With the Jeep Declaration of Deals,

we're pledging our allegiance to the American people with great deals on the luxurious Grand Cherokee, with available three-row seating, premium craftsmanship and tech that turns every drive into an adventure. Or Jeep Rangler with legendary 4x4 capability and open-air freedom. Because freedom deserves the vehicle built to carry it. Jeep, there's only one. Hurry into your local dealer for the Jeep Declaration of Deals.

Jeep has won more awards over its lifetime than any other SUV brand Jeep in the Jeep Grill or registered trademarks of XCAUS LLC. What a cool experience that was. Thanks again to Thomas Jane for spending all that time with me here on UAP. And hopefully you enjoyed it as much as, you know, we did talking back and forth together. Really cool conversation. So I'm glad I could bring that to you. I was looking forward to doing that one for a while.

So just some behind the scenes here, things here before we wrap up real quick. There's two things that have been on my plate that I've been trying like the Dickens to make happen, which is why I haven't had a lot of activity here in the past few weeks. I've just been so super focused on making two things happen. One of them was what you just heard, was that interview with Thomas Jane. We had to reschedule a couple of times to nobody's fault. It's just one of those things. And, you know, we were finally able to do it.

So it was great. Very happy to get that out and have that experience. It was a really cool experience to do that interview. The second thing had been super focused. on that has just been taking up so much of my bandwidth and I really haven't been able to think about much of anything else in putting together any other episode because my mind has been on this almost nonstop, which is the Las Vegas alien case. And the reason my mind has been on that so frequently and why it's taking up so much my bandwidth and not allowing me to really focus on

creating other new episodes is because I made a promise to you. I said that I was going to have that episode out in a new interview with Scott Roder, the crime scene reconstruction expert who I first spoke to about the Las Vegas case about two months ago now where he said, you know, this is real. The really were aliens in the backyard there in Las Vegas. And I've had proof. And I put that video out where they talked about it on News Nation as well. And he went over the severe, not the surveillance footage, but the footage from the family's phone, the Kenmore family.

And we promised to do another episode where he was going to talk about the other beings that were found in that backyard where he's got, he's going to break down video and pictures. And gosh, darn it, it just hasn't happened yet. And I sincerely apologize for that. Again, no one's fault. There's been two episodes or two different dates planned. So I wanted to let you know this because I've been getting a lot of questions about this on, on social media. And rightfully so, because I've been saying that it's going to happen and it hasn't happened.

So by all means, I've been getting peppered with where is it? Come on, Stephen, where is it? You said it was going to happen, and it hasn't happened. So I completely take the blame for that. But the reason being, what's going on here is, again, two different dates have been scheduled where he and I were going to do this episode. It was going to happen, which is why I kept saying it's going to happen. It's about to come out. But unfortunately, in both instances, again, to nobody's fault, we've had to reschedule both times.

Both times was it was completely last minute the first time around. I think it was about two hours before the show where on my end I was like, hey, I really hate to do this, but I cannot do it today. And I regret that wholeheartedly, but it was just one of those things. And then the last time we were supposed to do it was just a few days ago, actually. And then Scott had the same thing happened where he, a couple hours before the show, hey, I'm really sorry to do this, but I can't do it today. So unfortunately, it's just been one of those things completely.

out of our hands, not planned. We've been meaning to do it and get this out there. We're both excited. We're both ready to do it and get this information and get these videos and these pictures out to you as promised. But unfortunately, it just has not come together as planned. But that's not to say it's not going to happen. It is going to happen. We both are talking behind the scenes.

We're having conversations behind the scenes, Scott and I, where we have said, yes, we're going to do this. It's just a matter of nailing down that date and time and then being able to stick to it and hopefully nothing comes up at the last minute like it has the past couple of times. So again, I apologize. I just wanted to let you know what was happening there because I have been getting a lot of questions about it. And that is also the reason why the two reasons why I haven't been able to focus on getting

more episodes out was because I was focusing on this one and the investigation with Scott Rotter. So now that we have this one out, hopefully that opens up my bandwidth a little bit more. And I really, really hope to do that episode with Scott as soon as possible. I will keep you updated on it, though. I'm not playing any games or any tricks here. I'm going to keep you updated on it in real time as much as I can on when that is going to happen. So, wanted to get all that off my chest and just say there's much more to come.

Outside of what you heard today and outside of Scott Roder in the Las Vegas Alien case, there is much more to come in the future here on UAP. I look forward so much to doing these episodes and I have a lot more in mind, not even close to being done with some of the things I want to do here on the show so don't you worry plenty more to come in the future but until then continue to subscribe and download to the show thank you all so much for uh doing that um in just incredible numbers lately so ridiculous numbers that i never expected to see so from the bottom of my heart sincerely thank you to everyone who has been joining the show new listeners who were just discovering

the show three years in you got a lot to catch up on so hope you enjoy catching up on all the different episodes over the past three years, which I can't believe it's been three years, but it's been so much fun. So thank you to everybody for listening and for consuming the show like you have. So please continue to do that, download, subscribe, wherever you get your podcast on, you know, Apple and Spotify and Amazon and any of the places that you get your podcast, you can find UAP. Just search that UAP, the Unidentified Alien podcast. And if you'd like to communicate with me, if you like to reach out to me, I always say you can follow me on social media, Twitter, TikTok, it's at UA Podcast 850 is where you can do that at UA Podcast 850 on those platforms.

And then on YouTube, I'm putting more up on there as well. And I see that a lot of you have been taking to that as well. You're excited to see them getting more up on YouTube. So thank you for taking to that. That's awesome. So the more you take to it, the more I'll put up and spend time on YouTube as well. It's UA podcast there on YouTube at UAP Podcast. There's no 850 on the YouTube portion.

And then email, if you like to reach me directly, will write back to you. I write back to everybody as quickly as I can anyway. Sometimes it's not as quickly as I like, but you can reach me at S-D-D-N-R-U-A-P at g-mail.com. It's S-D-I-E-N-E-R-U-A-P at Gmail. If you like to get to me directly with your messages of kindness, criticism, relating stories, whatever you have on your mind, feel free to send it my way. I love getting messages from you. But with all that said, that will do it for today. day on this extended edition of UAP weekly. Thank you so much for tuning in.

And not only to this, but to all the episodes. And I look forward to so much, like I said, coming back with much more in the future. Stuff is so exciting. We're only just getting started. So follow along, social media at UA Podcast 850 for all the latest updates. But until next time, that'll do it for now. Stephen Dean here on UAP, the Unidentified Alien podcast. Can't wait to talk to you again soon.

Thank you so much as always. Be well. Bye for now.