Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 1024 | Willie Embraced His Diva Tendencies During ‘Duck Dynasty’ & Jase Has a ‘Joe Rogan Experience’

Episode Date: January 16, 2025

Al spills the beans on Willie’s behind-the-scenes diva behavior from the “Duck Dynasty” set, and Jase’s eccentric behavior makes him seem more like his namesake Uncle Si everyday. Zach opens up about his faith crisis as a young adult and the study that helped him overcome his doubts. Jase listens to a podcast for the first time, but it wasn’t his own! Al’s trip down memory lane shows the real reason Jase didn’t last long in professional ministry.  — Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? So welcome to unashamed. We've already started arguing. Zach, welcome into the unashamed duck car room. Yeah. Is this your first time in the duck car run? It's my first time recording in the duck car. Oh, you were here. We were in here when we did Shane and Shane that time. Yeah, but it was a different setup. Yeah, it was kind of like a six-year-oldly different. It had a round table. This is like, no, I, I, I, I, I,

I sat here at that table when the power went out. That's the first time I did an ad read and that you and Phil. Oh, I wasn't here. And that's when Jay's told me that Zach all of a sudden turned into a car sales. Yeah, that was the where that was one of the funniest memories of my life. When we get to the afterlife, because I think there's going to be a replaying session. Just everybody gathered thousands of people. Do we have edit control on the play?

saying back and say, we'll leave that to the Lord God. I got better at it there. I've got a good editor, buddy. Because I've got about 10 arguments going that basically have resulted in. We will not know until the afterlife. And we have some kind of replay, heavenly replay system. And so I'm looking forward to it because my wife and I have about five of those. Because we just can't, she remembers something differently than I do.

And we're 100%. 100% adamant that the recollection that we each have is correct. Well, here's the thing, Jay's, when I was younger, I was the same way. Oh, I was still the same way, but when I was younger, I was right a lot more. As I've gotten older, I'm still locked in that I'm right, but I found out later, no, you're wrong. Well, that's why these politicians will say something and they'll go back and figure out that they, whatever they said never really happened. but I'm not real hard on them because I'm like if you,

the story gets tweaked a little bit and a little bit and you keep repeating it. Especially in our family. Oh my gosh. I mean, we start embellished and off the top. Who knows what's true anymore? We're serial embellishers. Yeah, we've been that way. I'm like pilot at this point.

I mean, what is truth? I mean, I can't. I don't, I said the line is so blurry with the, at least with the stories that we've told and retold, primarily coming from two people. I think there's two people in our family that struggle with embellishment more than the rest of us. Yeah.

They're both named Silas. Yeah. Two people in our family. I'm, I got nothing on that. By the way, it's three, because you just hadn't spent enough time around the third Silas, but he's the exact same way. Really? Yeah.

Especially when he was a kid. Are y'all talking about me? Yeah. What's on here, Maddie? Is your name Salas? Wow. Well, then I wasn't sure I was going to feel, but you being this close to me. And me trying to make fun of you.

Just for fun. And it's his birthday. And it's your birthday. But I am really glad that whoever got you that hat for your birthday was looking out for you because I just thought to myself when I saw you today, I thought, you know, if I was from North Carolina and I was coming to Louisiana for quite a while, a few days. A few days, yeah. I probably need an orange hat so that no one will shoot me. You say that, but I'm looking at a picture right back there of somebody with an orange hat on. There's a right orange hat.

I'm not the only orange hat in here. Are you hunting in the city limits here? You thought I was making fun of you. I'm not. That was a very good thing. If I were you and I showed up in Louisiana during all hunting seasons are open right now. You're all open. Could never be too safe, Chase.

I would think I need to wear an orange hat. But I just figured someone gave that to you for your birthday. So well, well, it was a present. Well, not for my birthday, but somebody did give it to me.

Well, yeah, they're not. Well, I gave him two hats this morning for his birthday that actually came to me through our, our buddy makes hats, but,

and he left them. So, I knew that was a re-gifting. It was like, it was one of the things. I got room for this. Happy, and he literally just handed him to me.

I said, here you go, happy birthday. They're still there. Now, I do want to say, if you go duck hunting while you're here, don't wear that hat because although no one would probably shoot you,

the ducks would see that. Okay, noted. I'll make sure I don't put this on. I do want to go, by the way. So you can wear orange hats while deer hunting because deer are colorblind, which I think was a bit of humor from the Almighty because they can see really good. Yeah.

But their smell is fantastic, but they don't see colors. I'll tell you what, I drove in last night from North Carolina, because me and I talked about this. If it's under eight, mine's ten hours. If it's under ten hours, I'm not flying. Mine's eight now. But mine used to be five. If it had to be five or I'd fly. But now air travel is so bad.

Oh, you're just missing out. So now it's eight hours. Some of the greatest memories I've ever had were 24-hour road trips. Yeah. Yeah. I love the drive. Well, some of the worst memories I have were 24-hour road trips. too. As long as I'm in control of my own destiny, when you're at the mercy of the airlines,

I mean, I'd rather be, if I'm going to be stuck, I mean, at least I'm in control. I'm driving. It's my truck. I feel like we've had a breakthrough here. That's it. But anyways, I saw a herd of deer from all the way from, I would say, all the way from you get over the Mississippi River. And it's about, what, 67 miles. Is it 67 miles? Yeah, from Mississippi River to hear. Yeah. And I mean, Delta. I mean, I've done, I've never seen. I mean, it was late at night, but I mean, you want to talk about the deer. That's when they all run around. I am. Yeah. Hundreds and hundreds and hundreds. So, Zach rolled in. I was trying to wait up for you, Zach. Your son-in-law beat you here.

Mm-hmm. And Dawson, who's a really good guy. The Lord blessed you with favor. He did. With that one. Very great. And they just celebrated their one-year anniversary. So we were talking about marriage and life and things such as that. And so I was going to wait up for Zach. He was supposed to be in about 1030. So I gave him until 1040, you know, the Robert somewhere I gave him 10 minutes I looked over at Dawson and said you know when your paul-in-law's getting here he said what he said about 1030 or so I said well I'm going to bed I'm sleepy and so I don't know when did you get in I got in about 11 45 yeah I may be a notorious embellisher but Zach is notorious for being late that may be true he learned that from

he learned that from my brother Willie who's also he's also that way so yeah it's kind of their way Willie's early if he's two minutes late. He told me that one time. He said, no, I read it online. If you're two minutes late, that's the perfect time to be there. Well, back when we were doing the little duck show, Willie was, he showed up pretty close on time at first to call times. And then he figured out pretty quick. All they did was make him wait.

So he thought, no, you're not getting me on that one. They just want you around, you know. I was saying, well, I used to always be punctual. because I mean Phil was real adamant about and he still did it on the show he and sigh would come and sit around but the TV show made it just could not be on time no because you'd have to wait an hour you know before you actually did something sometimes so yeah it's a lot of waiting it's a little bit I've never understood the the waiting game when we did the movie I was I remember just like we were over overtime every day which cost you time and a half and it blows the budget but I was like is there we need a higher guy, because I didn't know all the language, we need to hire a guy whose job, this is just clap and, hey, come on, let's move it and snap their fingers and move it along.

And then I know there's a guy who does that. He's called the AD. That's the way he needs to get on. Is that anno domini? Assistant director. Oh, okay. You have too many chiefs. Yeah, in a TP.

So last night, our cousin Lulu, who is just one of the best people in the world. She's so awesome. and she listens to the podcast. I know she's going to hear this. She called me and said my son Casey, who's in college playing college football up in Arkansas, she said he's decided he wants to get baptized.

I said, well, great, because we had talked a little bit back at Thanksgiving. Some of my other cousins got baptized. And so I think he's been thinking about it. And so this morning, before I came here, I met him down at the church building. It was really interesting conversation because, you know, I always pray on

to explain this to someone young because I think people kind of know I need to do it, but sometimes understand the why of it, you know. And so you don't go into a full-blown thing, but you kind of wanted to understand what this moment's about. And I kept having this thought about family, you know, because obviously he's our cousin and just a good young man that believer loves the Lord. And he's just ready to make that all in commitment. And so, and today he did that.

But he said something really intriguing to me because I was telling the story about how we were doing this and you know places don't matter the water doesn't matter no of that stuff matters but sometimes it matters because it has an attachment to it so today it happened to be a place where i spent most of my life at wfr at the building and i was telling the story about because he was real close to harold his grandpa my our uncle and i always had an interesting relationship with harold because i was the oldest i don't know jace if you remember this but we were living in farmable well he would have us come over. And I was probably about 10 at the nine or 10. And he would just work me the whole time. He had two daughters. And so there were certain things they couldn't do very well, I guess,

hauling firewood. Did he pay you? No. And that was the thing. I was like, I wanted to tell him, you know, how they freed the slaves in the Hebrew days back in Exodus, you know. And yet that's what he kind of had me. But it was because I was a little boy. And so I always kind of thought, man, this guy, but at the same time I knew he like he really liked me and that was kind of his way of showing it and so all these years it was that kind of relationship he helped jays and i we fell in love with the osu probably because of him and judy my aunt but he stopped by one day after jace and i were interns at the church and he came up the back stairs and back then we were all sharing the office i don't know if he talked to you or not but he talked to me and he had tears in his eyes and he said i just want you

you and Jason know, I am so proud of y'all because I've always wanted to do ministry and I wanted to go to school and I wanted to preach and, you know, life just didn't take me that direction, but I've always had that desire. And now to see my nephews, you know, getting trained and, you know, he didn't know what was going to happen with. But he had tears in his eyes and I'd never seen him tear up before my whole life. And so I was telling Casey that story this morning because I'd never told him that. And I said, here, 30 years later, we're, you know, 30 feet away from where that same conversation happened. And so, so now here you are making life decision. And he said what you want young people to say.

So, well, you know, I've got 120 people connected to our football team. And I realize that a lot of them really need to know about Jesus. You know, he said, after being with them now for four years, he said, and I'm kind of a leader on the team. he said but you know I can't lead people in what I don't know and so he said I got to go all in myself you can't take people where you haven't been exactly and that's what he said and I thought man that's that's what you want to hear you know he's gonna he's excited he's going back and he's gonna get ready to share Jesus it was awesome it was a great way to start the day for me and it's family so I told him it's like it's forever family we talk on podcasts about being

unashamed of the gospel but it's that Hebrews 2-11 You know, the one that makes us holy is unashamed to call us brothers and sisters. Both ways. Yeah. It's a beauty. No, I didn't want to interrupt that beautiful story, but I have vivid memories of being a kid and working. I thought you were part of that, but I wasn't sure. Well, it wasn't that.

I guess I didn't really mind it, I thought, you know, because in our family, it didn't have to be your parents. Right. And one of the worst weapons I ever got was from Uncle. Harold. Oh, really? I didn't know that. Brutal. He was scary. Well, let me tell you, this was a... He scared me. I don't remember any way. I'll just leave it

there. I mean, I think if like... There's a statute of limitations. If I would have called 911, he probably would have gone to jail for a short period of time. It was brutal. And... He's crossed over now. What did you do? To receive the... You're so nosy. You want me to share

my skeletons. Here's what I did. I'll have to do this so we don't offend the listeners. So there we are. Me and his two daughters, and someone else was part of the game. Willie seemed like he'd have been a little young, but maybe it was. Maybe he was part of the game. I'm not sure who the fourth person was.

Well, I think we were a little older than that. So this may have been later. It was at his house. Okay. But we used to do like some. Some Thanksgiving and Christmas up there. I want to think it was Willie because this was the beginnings of his Scrabble prowess. We were playing Scrabble.

So we had to have been older than that. I would have been like early teens, yeah. Yeah, I mean, it didn't seem like we were that old, but somewhere in there, somewhere between, you know, six and 13. Well, I made a word on the Scrabble board. That was a triple word, you know, score. They said, that's inappropriate. They didn't say inappropriate, but that's a bad word. I did not think it was a bad word.

And I said, look it up. And then I gave a Phil Robertson description of the word that I had used. It was a slang word for part of the anatomy. So they went and got their dad, Uncle Harold, and he just saw that word on the scrabble board. And the next thing I know, it was just, I was twirling around his one arm. And every time I would stop,

leather was being applied. And I just thought, that's a word. That is a word. Was it the syllabic beating that we talked about on the previous podcast? Was he giving you the commentary while he was running you in the server? me the commentary.

Mm-hmm. You, we don't talk like this. We don't. We don't scrabble like this, Jason. I was playing the game. I was using the word. I was using the letters that were given to me.

And I will say with true confession, I did not think that that was, it wasn't deserving a belt weapon. And I didn't even think it was wrong. I was like, this is. I don't think it deserved a belt weapon. Yeah, this is the game. Right.

He was the, he was the most intense. of the seven. No, he was. Well, and his siblings, because dad and side both said it many times through the years, would say he was the meanest of the crew. Well, that was pretty brutal. He was the second oldest brother, so. You know what?

It was weird. For years, I'd play Scrabble. And I'd always think, well, you can't use that word. It's just, so it did have an impact on it. It was pretty traumatized. I'm sure if I wound up at a counselor's office one day, You should have had Dr. Eamman about it. I mean, I got whipped.

Your brain under a brain scan, it looks different because of that moment right there. Yeah, it was pretty traumatic. But you know, back then. Back then, you know, part of it. The whole family, I mean, I got whipped by my grandparents, by most of my uncles, which is pretty crazy. Yeah, you'd never see that much anymore. No.

But at the same time, boy, you had a lot of accountability. Oh, my gosh. roaming around. Too much accountability. Paul would tell us, he'd say, no, boy, don't make me come over there and thump that gourd. Yeah.

And he'd thump you in the back of the head. Well, I guess we turned out all right. I don't, I'm not endorsing that, but it was pretty brutal, you know? It was a rough memory. I never heard that story before. Oh, yeah. That's a beautiful thing about a podcast is you start telling stories.

I was like, I've never heard that one before. Yeah. I think that's the first I've heard of it as well. He was prophetic because the last thing he said to me is like, you'll never forget this. And I haven't. Well, I mean, again, he was very intimidating. You're feeling sorry for me now.

I do feel sorry for me. I was scared to him, for sure. I was scared to him. At Granny's funeral, he showed up. I mean, he showed up. It was his mom's funeral. But he was so mad. that he said that one of y'all showed up with that big beard he was it was dad inside well it's actually

what I was going to say is how he did come down to my office and say the same thing but since we had had a different journey yeah on our relationship you wanted to bring up that's no I just was very blunt and I said I appreciate it but I'm not going to be here long and he he went from teary eye to said well what's what's the problem i need to break out my bell yeah and i actually said i said you see this office here i said you know what the problem with it is i said there's two things and he was looking around i said there's no people in here but you i was like i believe god has called me to be with people i can't do offices i said and the second thing is there's no window And that was why I resigned.

I was an intern for a couple years. There was some kind of period days back there, and I'm not sure why they did it. But we had to wear ties for a while. Do you remember that? That was probably the third thing. You had to wear a tie to peers. We had to wear a tie.

I liked when we came up to the building, and they finally suspended it, thank goodness. But for a while, for a period, when we were interned and we had to wear ties. I just No, I did it. Yeah, I did it. But when I, it's funny,

because they wanted me to write down, because I said I was resigning, and they were like, they handed me a form. And I was like, it's going to an exit interview. I'm not going to fill out this form. And I was like,

one of the reasons that I'm resigning is that you have a form for me to say. And I gave them the same speech. I said, and I just had a Bible study where a guy said, the only reason you're doing this is because it's your job. And, you know, I was immature, but I just, in that moment,

I do think through the immaturity, God just led me down a different path. I said, I'm just going to be a regular guy. I'm going to build duck holes, you know, fish the river. I kind of went to what my dad had done. And I'm just going to preach Jesus for free. I mean, that was the statement I made. I was like, because what was happening is, and how you remember this i was studying with so many people back then because i had i'd made a list

from high school kind of like our our young new brother here and our family and uh i was going down the list well that list didn't have a clock i mean i was most of the studies i was doing was at night well then i had to come to the office and sit there all day and i'll tell you what i did most of the time there slept i slept there's no window right there's nobody in there i mean i sat down what about what i'm going to fill out some paperwork i would walk in and because we'd have a meeting or something to go to and i knew i'd go to because i was always looking at per jay and so i'd go down there and i'd go in there and he'd look up and just big you know like on his face where he'd been laying down on his hand with just these streaks and i was like go wash your face

we got a meeting in 50s i finally set up my chair i have one of these chairs that fall back and i would make it into a bed but i had to do it where when someone knocked on my door you could pop In three seconds, I would pop up. Hey, that's the worst. Because, you know, you were doing your ministry at O'Banian's Pool Hall. Oh, yeah. And I was, they were wanting me to fill out forms on all that. And I was like, you don't want to know where I was last night because I wouldn't be here anymore.

It's going to make you uncomfortable. But it just didn't work for me. But you know, Jayce, you help change our culture of leadership there. I mean, and I guess I did too, over the course of time that we began to start focusing on what was most important. Because those guys that trained us, they came from a background. You wore a tie every day. Yeah. That was just part of it.

Yeah, that's what it was back. Yeah. I mean, you had dressed your best. You had looked bad. Sunday, don't even think about showing up without, you know, full suit, suit, tie, the whole bit. And so you had the mindset to change. That's not where most people are. Yeah.

So over the course of time, that changed. Now, look, having said that. this. I do think I was right in principle, but I don't want to make it seem like I was young and very outspoken. And so some of the things I did in meetings, I regret, although I think my principal and my heart was right. Because I remember I gave this big speech one time in a meeting about, it's not about this building. Because I was still bitter that they're making me punch a clock when I just, technically,

I was doing the Lord's work all night. I'm tired. I'm sleepy. I don't want to come to the building. So one of the elders was like, well, I mean, what is your,

he was kind of asking, like, where are you at on the use of a building? Because you seem to be attacking everything about the building. And I said, burn it. Were you a shock jock?

I don't know where you got that from. I mean, that just didn't go over well. That was then a meeting after the meeting of that is just crazy talk. You know, what are you talking about? So you were going to get fired if you didn't. I was never going to make it in that. You were right. Yeah, that was.

Your time there was limited. Yeah, just lacked the diplomacy necessary. No diplomacy. But you were great at that. Oh, I was good at it. That's why you're. It actually helped me. Jace helped me to be even more.

when I needed to be. But I was in the same place, Chase, was in fact, when I out, later became the main pastor, I guess, I hate to even call it that. But whenever I preached and was leading the whole church, I told all our employees, I was like, if this

building catches on fire, and you call the fire department, you're fired. So along with the firing of the building, if they come and put it out, you're fired. Because this thing is a, I mean, you're talking about a money pit. Oh, yeah.

A building like ours is 60 years old. We put so much money into it that, I mean, the only really way to solve it is burn it down. But, I mean, I know you can't do that. That's a crime. No one burned the building down. Don't burn the building down. This slamer, don't burn the building.

I'm just kidding. But I tell our employees, don't do it. If it happens naturally, just. But, I mean, honestly, you think about the emphasis of the last two years of this podcast has been really from the scripture that the guy's not in the building. Yeah. I mean, he is in the building because we're in the building. but he doesn't live in the temple's built by man's hand.

Now the hard part, Zach, is for people to embrace that. Let's take another break. The hard part for people to embrace the idea about the building there. Well, wait a minute. God spent a whole chapter telling Solomon how to build the temple. But his point always was to show, by the building of it, and by telling Solomon exactly how to build it, the whole idea was to show one day that it's not necessary.

Well, you know, it's funny about that in First Kings 8, when he dedicates the temple that God had given the instructions to build. At the end of it, he asked this question at the end of all that, Solomon says, surely, and I'm paraphrasing here, because I don't have it in front of me,

but something to say, surely God does not live in a house made by me. And it wasn't a, like, he's like pointing out the obvious, like even in the dedication of the temple after Solomon built it, he recognized the ridiculous,

nature, the God who made everything is going to dwell in a house made by man? I don't think so. Exactly. And surely this house won't contain you. And it was, that, that nugget right there was the same message that Jesus gave when he, before his crucifixion, he said, if you destroy this temple, I'll rebuild it in three days talking about his body. And it's the same, and I got him killed, by the way. It's the same message that Stephen gave whenever he, right before he was martyred when Stephen said, God does not live in temples built by man's hands, and he was killed for it. Acts chapter 7. John 2 was the first one.

Which you're about to be in in a few weeks. But I think that it's... And then Paul. Paul said in an Acts 17. Acts 17. We're seeing a common thread. That's why I was getting my take on the building. But I would even go back to John 114, which I think if you're going to put greatest profound

statements of the Bible. the word became flesh, the logic of God, the wisdom of God, the word became human and made his dwelling, which in the Greek, that doesn't seem like that big a thing, but when you look at the Greek word that was used and tabernacled among us, the building became a man, housing God in human, form or pitch to tent is what these scholars will use that phrase to define it because it goes back to the system of Judaism where they had the temple they had the tabernacle and it was the thought and true that this is where God and humans meet that's why this says this in John 1 14 and they did meet there. But that's also why in the last verse of chapter one, when he told Nathaniel, he said,

you'll see heaven open in the angels of God ascending and descending on the son of man. Well, that goes back to you remember Jacob's Ladder, where they called that place Bethel. I'm doing this off the top of my head, but I believe that means house of God. So here and in the tabernacle or temple, these angels would be on each side, which is why I think there were two angels on each side at the tomb. All of these things are pointing to. You remember, Jay's the picture that's described in what you're talking about was a ladder coming down out of heaven.

And the angels were descending and ascending along this ladder. The idea was, I'm coming to be with you. I mean, he was giving him that vision way back. Yeah, it's so funny, I was thinking about this as we were singing some songs at church on Sunday. And I thought, man, how many songs have I sung over the years that actually cultivate an imagination for the complete opposite of what we're talking about? I was thinking that one song that it talks about like heaven, this world is not my home. I'm just a passing through. My treasures are laid up somewhere way out there beyond the blue.

We've sang these songs all these years, and we've been catechized in this idea that somehow that God's going to only come in that building, and one day we get to go be with him. We're missing the point of what Jason mentioned, of heaven and earth coming together. That is the point of the temple. I mean, it is the point that God's presence, God comes to be. It's where man and God meet in the temple. And so it's pretty profound when you think about God coming from and where he's coming to, and he puts himself in a human body.

I mean, you can't, like, you can't overestimate or over-emphasize the importance of that because God's ultimately going to make his home in human bodies, which is the ultimate connection of bringing heaven and earth together. It's in us. So our treasures aren't laid up somewhere beyond the blue. our treasures are actually laid up in him and he's in us it's just like that remember the song mansion over the hilltop so there was a mansion over the hilltop but we are the mansion yeah the mansion's right here i mean it's it's housing the holy you know what makes a mansion the holy spirit living inside

yeah well i think it comes from john 14 which we'll get to yeah where when he said in my father's house are many reams but the older i get the more i look at that i don't think that i don't think think he was talking about what people think it was talking about. Exactly. Because he was talking about him ascending to the right hand of God and pouring out his Holy Spirit. Right. And we know from first period too, the house is being built right here.

Well, exactly. I mean, it's being built up with the Holy Spirit. Yeah, Ephesians too. We rise and become the temple of God by his Holy Spirit. But all of that, all of that eschatology is right here in John 1. It's Holland. We've already gone there. It's in John 1.

We've embraced that one. We've embraced that one. Yeah, that's a term that's thoroughly vetted in this podcast. The audience is testified to it. Just shouldn't be surprised. You're using words that I'm having to look up and it's distracting. Because a while ago you said catacizing. Catechizing.

I wondered if you were going to say. Well, that's that repetitive, like, learning and being, like, shaped by the teachings of the church. Not categorize, but categorize. Catechise. In fact, like a catechism. Because I tried to spell it, and according to the internet, I could not find that. So I must have a spelling issue.

It's got a surprise why in there, I think. It goes back to my Scrabble issues. You could use it in Scrabble. There was a word used in Scrabble. I will say this about the Robertsons. Y'all were great Scrabble players. But. Well, we hijacked the system.

because I memorized every two and three letter word, especially using the letter Q and X. Yeah, but y'all would know the words, but you wouldn't know what they meant. That was the problem. They said, Dad, then Dad was an English. He got his degree in English, and so then he learned, expanded his vocabulary.

Do you guys remember the famous ergo? He used the word ergo. Yeah. And somebody challenged you. I think it was Willie. So that's not a word. And, of course. So Catechize is C-A-T-E.

E-E-C-H-I-Z-E. I said Y, but it says Z. Okay. So good word. It instructs in the principles of Christian religion by means of question and answer typically by using a catechism, which is the word. We should do this every time because I don't use these words. Yeah.

I got it. I knew where he was going. Because if I... If our Catholic listeners. Well, I'm dealing with the real people and I'm having conversations about Jesus, mainly in the duck blind because right now it's duck season. Well, you, you, but you, you put it in a context of people, they may not, they kind of understand what you're saying. Well, but I'm just saying if I'm men a duck line and we're talking about somebody's life.

You're not going to use the word catacized. Because he'd say, what did you call me? No, I'm not sure I can do that. Well, you got a first to find who is he. But now we know all this time. Yeah. This thing about the words and everything, Jace has finally revealed on the podcast today, what's happened. That memory all the way back.

to Big H, giving in the beltwhip and over the word. That's what happened. So now he's got this whole thing about if it's a little bit off, he reacts so strongly. You have PTSD. Yeah, that's what this is. No, I think what it is is when the word became flesh, I thought, oh, good. I don't have to learn all the words. The word is a person.

That's good. I like that. The word is a person. So therefore, if I come up and talk to another person about God, I can introduce a person. And I don't have to use words based on human wisdom. I love that. What's the Paul quote? So it was the hypostatic union that brought you to understand it.

But when you push back so much, I read the book of Acts and I wanted to make sure there were no apologetic arguments during that whole discourse of the birth of the church. And you realized that there were apologetic. No, it was pretty much a declaration that Jesus is the son of God. He died and was buried and raised. The X-17 is quite the apologetic. There was a few moments where they had a discourse,

but the words translated were pretty simple. So you'll want to refer back two days to the Not Yet Now podcast. I interviewed Dr. William Lane Craig. I actually asked him this question, who I would argue is one of the world's greatest Christian apologists. I asked him the question on the podcast. How do you respond? And I'm not levied out the charge that has been brought.

And he had a brilliant response. I'm not going to tell you what it is. You can go listen to it. But anyways. So, well, let me jump in here. Shameless plug for the... Shameless plug. Since we have a new set for a limited time,

then we're going to have a newer set, right? Yeah, we got a newer set coming. We're in a transition mode, boys. But can I just say this? I do need to repent that I was wrong. It is way more than six feet. This is like, this is almost to a point where it's awkward. I told you I didn't want to set up.

But not for me. Because I spent probably 10 years here building duck calls. This is like home for you. Well, you got to think who I like a much time. I mean, this has got to be every bit of 12 feet. You got to think about who I was sitting with. You want a distance is what you're saying. Distance was preferred.

Okay. If you ever watched the Duck Car Room podcast, they're yelling so much, especially, that the spittle, I'm thinking they had to do this just to get you out of range of all the yelling and, you know. Well, I sat here and built duck calls with Cy Martin, Godwin, Jay Stone, Mountain Man was here for about two years. Oh, you had a, you had a group of characters. So I actually, in a weird duck commander meeting one time, said, because they were all talking about how we can improve things, I said, you know what, I would really improve the duck hall room?

And they were like, well, I mean, it was like, Jason has an idea. I said, I think whoever's clean in this place should clean that room every day after we leave. I was not kidding. It's not a bad. Nobody said a word. because that was the height of all, you know, it was mountain man, I mean,

Mountain Man inside, bathing is optional. Musty. It was musty. And I don't know. It was a lot of men. So we're working on a new studio for us. Yeah,

that'll happen. We're in the process of moving now. We may upgrade some furniture. I know y'all have complained about chairs. I have a new prop that I want to introduce. Are you got it with you? Yeah. Oh, come on, somebody.

I actually took it from this room. Oh, wow. So now we may get in trouble. When we have a drum roll opportunity, I have a set of drums. Oh, the cahone or what do they call it? And I actually are, I was waiting for you to say something that I wanted to. So, which I think sometimes when Zach gets into one of his long, like he's really on a run and, you know, because he gets on one of those there once in a while, you should lightly play the bongos behind what he's saying. Yeah, because that's not a typical drum.

drum roll there. That was like a island drum roll. That's what I'm saying. It's like a behind that, you know, you could do that. I think you'd probably get going and just never stop if you started good. Now I'll reveal why I did the drum roll, because we always have this relationship of

I try to keep it simple. Zach tries to keep it complex. Oh no, that sounded wrong. Zach uses big words. But I have a drum roll moment. I actually listened to my first podcast over the weekend. Oh, wow. I had never listened to another podcast.

You mean like our podcast? You wouldn't, you know, this is our podcast. Not our podcast. But I listened because I got three different messages. I had a really weird weekend. I got three different messages on two totally different issues. And I'll share both, I guess, if we have time. But this one was, you need to check this out. And it was, the problem is, everybody sent it to me in a form of social media. So you got this from multiple people.

Three different people sent me a clip. One of them was like Facebook, one on was like Instagram. Well, the problem is, I can't go to any of those places because I don't know my password. I don't frequent them. And so now I have people in my family

real close to me that represent me kind of like you know they know how to get there they do the heavy lift they do the actual representation so I thought

well I guess I just need to go find the source I mean you can make some spiritual analogies here so it was actually a Joe Rogan podcast because that's what you listen to that's the first one I've

anybody's podcast the first one I've wrong with about 10 million because because there was a guest on there who was, he's from Zach's camp. He's a Christian apologist. Yeah, he's a Christian apologist, but he's more into the reliability of the Bible,

and 66 books. And this guy is like, one of his hobbies is taking original manuscripts that were written on PAPRA and, or papris and copper and he can like replicate them he can write this guy knows all the languages for fun three-fourths of the words that came out of his mouth i had never heard because it was over my head was did rogan seem to be well that's what i was going to say i watched the whole thing there's three hours and 15 minutes every time you complain about our podcast liege's just think about

Joe Rogan if you were doing that five days a week yeah so I watched that because you know and how they met I thought was interesting because this guy his name was huff was his last name and uh you know him's that I don't know him personally but I started I saw I saw the same interview and started followed in his work on Instagram yeah and uh so I what I thought was funny is this huff guy has a debate with a guy who like picks and chooses what he believes in the Bible because Everything in the Old Testament, anything that he deemed negative, he's like, well, that, you know, this is not legitimate. Well, they had a debate. I'll watch that.

Well, this Huff guy, he didn't just win that this was like, imagine Muhammad Ali, you know, fighting's act. I mean, it was a complete. Intellectually or physically? Physically. Okay. It was a complete, just like, so, well, this, uh, this, uh, Rogan had had this other guy on this podcast and like entertain something. How do we know the Bible's reliable?

And you know, I've always looked at it. Like I've never gone down that road because when I read the book of John, I just thought this is based on faith. But it was so thrilling and made so much sense even about Jesus. I just said nobody could have made this up. So I didn't feel like I ever had to go down that road. this guy went down the road and after I listened to this I mean it was such a powerful argument on how we got the Bible and it would take somebody doing this for years

and have this kind of mind yeah well it was just fun to see Joe Rogan he just didn't he just didn't have an answer for I mean he was like fascinating this is fantastic yeah is rogan an atheist Well, he kind of, that came up in the interview. I don't know. Well, I don't either. He also had a line about Jordan Peterson, who is obviously on there too.

Look, I'm not promoting the podcast because what I was shocked at, a couple times this Huff would have such a compelling argument that Rogan's response would be, man, that's some crazy and he would have a Scrabble board moment. And I thought, I think he meant that as a compliment. Oh, I think he did. And he uses four little words. I mean, like the F word, you know. Every time I see him quoted on TV, there. But to your point and to your ministry that you talked about earlier, there's a correlation here because I think so we've backed up and said, we're going to do ministry in the church. And we have lost the culture.

And I love that Huff is going into other places. I love like you went to the bar. Like, we need to be taking the gospel into the world. We don't have anything to fear. my introduction to apologetics, which is what that guy's doing, by the way, was I was struggling. I talked about this on the podcast, not yet now, which again, shameless plug. But you need to go hear it because Dr. Craig was the first person that I had ever come in contact with. And I would argue this guy, Craig is like a savant when it comes to just biblical knowledge,

defending the truths of the scripture, the historicity of the resurrection, you name it. I mean, he's got about six or seven arguments that he is just owned. And I was really at a crisis of faith. I tell my story on the podcast, but there was a moment when I was at the end of my rope, because I did not believe, I hoped that it was true, but I had a lot of doubts. And I get into this, make the story short, to a Google Vortex, I wound up looking at watching a debate between Dr. Craig. And I don't even remember the atheist who it was now. and I didn't know what he was talking about.

I could probably understand about 10% of what this guy was saying, but I knew he was winning the debate, and so I ordered his book called Reasonable Faith, which is the name of his ministry. I should not have ordered that book. It was way too deep for me. It took me three and a half months to read it because I just didn't understand everything in it.

But that, for me, that was the awakening. Oh, are you? I was 26. I'm 47 now, so it was 21 years ago. And that, and I never even read books really. I mean, honestly, I'm ashamed to say this. I think the only, the last book I had read, before I read that book, was a book called James and the Giant Peach that I read when I was in elementary school.

I just didn't read. I mean, I read the Bible, but then that's what started me, and I was so intellectual. That was Chuck, that was your choice. That was it. I went from James and the Giant Peach to reasonable faith. Before that, it was C-Spot-Rud. It was Beverly Cleary books and Hardy Boys. Yeah.

Yeah, but I mean, I love that. that branch of Christian theology, the apologetics, and there's a lot of different branches even inside of that that for me have been super, super transformational. But to your point, you know what, the most transformational thing after I've gone through and studied as much as I've studied as I come back and I read the gospel John, and I'm like, you can't make this up. Well, I've always said. So what was your takeaway, Jay's from the whole? Well, I obviously thought it was a positive, just because. Because Rogan's got a huge audience.

Oh, yeah. Huge. And, well, I thought it was a positive, just because then a few days later, I didn't watch this episode. I'm still at one podcast. But I just noticed a lot of people commented then. He had Mel Gibson on, and he kind of asked the same questions, you know. And I was like, I think this guy is reconsidering, because he was kind of in bed with the other guy that had this debate, you know, Huff, which he thought, okay, I was, because I mean, he was, he was no nonsense on that. He's like,

you clearly knew what you were talking about and back this up and have made me, you know, rethink this whole thing. And I love that. The guy you debated, he doesn't know what he's talking about and his career's over. I mean, it was like, because then the guy who lost the debate, he's like threatening to sue if it was released. He was trying to get out of, he just got in over his head. I mean, this guy's, started, you know, saying, well, let's just get into whatever language you want to get in. And some of the things he said, I'll just give you a nugget. One thing he said is the book of Isaiah for hundreds of years, the oldest original that we had was what's in the New Testament now.

Well, then, I don't know how many years ago, I can't remember, but maybe 100 years ago, they find another manuscript, I think it was the Dead Sea Scrolls. Didn't they find that in the 30s or 40s? 40s. So when they find it, well, they find the book of Isaiah. So then everybody was like, oh, no, because what it, you know. We're fixed to see all these differences, you know.

And so this huff's talking. I'm just giving you the high points here. And did you know that it was written a thousand years before the one we had? And it was Word. Word. And so when Rogan heard that, he was like, you've got to be, I'm going to paraphrase what he said, you've got to be kidding me.

Word for word. It's like, word for word. How is it even possible? Exactly. How could the, you know, passing it down orally be memorized to that point? It made me think of that movie Denzel Washington did that time about the book of Eli. Eli, and I mean, if you haven't, I don't want to ruin the movie for you, he had memorized it. Yeah.

And so, and he was, he was blind, but he could see. It was fascinating. It's hard for us to understand that because our culture is, I mean, we have been so changed by Google that we don't have to memorize anything. In fact, I was thinking about this other day. You know how many phone numbers did I actually know? That's like five. Well, guess how many I know? Probably nine.

Do you know your own phone number? No. So they say, what's your phone number? And I'm like, I don't know. I don't know. And they're looking at me, horrified. And I'm like, you people did this to us. Numbers, you have made numbers obsolete.

So I want to button this up because I know I said there was two interesting thing happened. I just want to make this announcement. I am not, I'm not undercover. I did not do a show called American Primeval. because three different people sent a picture to me and said, is that you? Oh, this thing is blown up on Netflix. Yeah.

It's supposed to be the most violent show ever. Yeah, well, I checked out, you know, the first few minutes of it, which I thought it wasn't boring. I haven't watched it. And, but I thought, I don't even think. There's a character that looks like you? I don't think that I evidently, because three different people, and then I showed it to my wife, and she said,

that does look like you. So I just wanted y'all to know. This is an episode. It's not me. As we're talking here, Maddie, I'm thinking of all the different title descriptions that we could go with on this episode. There's a lot.

Well, look, I will show you what I got this morning from, look, a person who's not even in my phone. So I don't know who this is. And look, they sent this picture. Does that look like me? Oh, gosh, it kind of does. I'll send this to Maddie. I'll add about 10 pounds.

It actually does. Hold on. I want to say one thing before we leave. I know we've got just a few minutes. But that oral tradition is so important because we have a hard time understanding what that is. But in Jewish culture, they could pass down large amounts of information, generation to generation to generation to generation. And one of the most powerful oral traditions in the scriptures in 1st Corinthians 15, which is one of the anchor text of the church that we all grew up in, which is this is an oral tradition that Paul received. I want to read it as we close.

because it is the actual gospel. Now, I would remind you, brothers, of the gospel I preach to you, which you have received and which you stand, and by which you are being saved if you hold fast to the word I preach to you, otherwise you believed in vain. For what I delivered to you as a first importance, what I also received, and here's the old tradition, that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the scriptures,

that he was buried, and he was raised on the third day in accordance with the scriptures. That's an oral tradition that Paul received. It's one of the evidences, the earliest accounts of the scriptures. the gospel, they say that this was given within 15 months of the actual event, which if you look at the history of how we access history, this is so reliable because we don't have events recorded this close to, or we don't have records to this close to the event in history. So it's one of just something I thought about when you were talking about that. But anyways, shows you the power, and we're not ashamed of it.

I don't think we ever got started with this podcast. Well, and yet it has to end. All right. We'll see you next time. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube. And be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch every episode.