Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 1167 | Jase Goes Toe-to-Toe with a Pro Chef & Trusting Jesus When the World Hates You

Episode Date: September 17, 2025

Jase relives a wild week filled with Godly encounters, from offending a Dutch chef who still served him the best breakfast of his life to sitting beside a flight attendant who broke down in tears over faith and loss. Al meets “Almost” NFL coach Andy Reid, and the guys explore how the Spirit exposes sin, reveals righteousness, and declares judgment over the enemy. Plus, a crazy coincidental 9/11 connection shows how the Spirit turns grief into joy and equips believers to shine light in a hostile world. In this episode: John 16, verses 1–16; John 3, verses 19–21; Romans 1, verse 16; Acts 17, verse 31; Romans 14, verse 10; 2 Corinthians 5, verse 10; Genesis 1, verses 1–3; 1 John 2, verse 1; 2 Peter 1, verse 4 Chapters: 00:00–12:45 Jase Intimidates a Dutch Chef 12:46–27:00 An “Unprofessional” Flight Attendant 27:01–37:03 The Courtroom of Heaven 37:04–44:28 Jesus Advocates for Both Jew & Gentile 44:29–56:39 Love Embodied in Acts of Service — Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashamed. We just finished recording the kind of our thoughts on Charlie Kirk and everything that went on this past week. And so, you know, we're still kind of in that thought processing mode, I think, of talking about that. But it was also a travel week, a big travel week for us. We were all over the country. And Jason mentioned a little bit. of that in the last podcast. I was headed to Missouri to speak this past week. And it was really interesting because so we were traveling on 9-11, which is the day after Charlie was assassinated.

And, you know, that would have been a heavy enough thing anyway. In fact, we were at the airport and I ran into, I don't know if you guys, do you guys know Josh and Allie Taylor? Yeah. Yeah. Great young family, amazing story. And they were on their way to do an event. They speak and tell about what God has done in their lives and their marriage.

Allie has had cancer since she was very young. And so it's impacted them in so many ways. But they've just been so God-honored through the process. And there were times when they were told they couldn't have children and these type of things. All four of their girls, they were with them on this trip. And when they were coming in, you know, we saw them because we speak at a lot of the same events. So they do a lot of pro-life stuff too. So it was really great to actually run into them in the airport, kind of like you and Willie Jays.

But they're just like it looked like Zach, your crew, I would guess maybe a few years ago. It's just like a circus moving through because you got the car seats, the strollers, the bags, the, you know, trying to keep everybody in line. The littleest one runs through the radar or not radar, but the X-ray machine too quick. So it was just, you know, we were kind of helping them, kind of grandparenting there with them. and it was really great just to see them. And they were on their way to an event. And they were going to go to D.C. first and spend some time just with their kids and their family. And so Josh sends me a text when we get on the plane and they're sitting way way in the back, which is probably good with all the kiddos.

But he sent me a text and said, I just realized we're flying on 9-11. And I was like, yeah, no. I mean, like that would have been a much, you know, more scary situation even just a decade ago, just a thought of that. But I think it also reminded me of just what the week. It was so impactful because this was 9-11, which was 24 years ago, you know, had this 3,000 plus people killed with this idea of hate and the two worlds colliding, Jase, as we've been talking about. And the day before, we kind of experienced it again with one life, but the same tragedy,

the same shock, the same, like, realizing this was something that could be a difference maker. So, but Josh sent me a text this morning and said, you know, at the event we spoke at last night, he said the audience was so inspired and it inspired me. And he said, I was probably bolder than I've ever been in front of an audience. So I was just texting them back. I was like, I think we're all kind of feeling that, you know, in the moment that it's just kind of an extra bit of inspiration in people and in people like us that go out and try to point them to Jesus. Oh, there's no doubt. We didn't really get into the stories of it all, but I did the same event.

I think they asked me to do it because my dad had done this event in Lancaster, South Carolina, 13 years ago. Of course, he died this year, and so they reached out to me, which there was one interesting thing about this. They actually had Si, who doesn't really do events. the next year. And so when I got up, I said, okay, you have my dad. Then you had Sae. Then there was a 12-year break from whatever happened when Sai got up. Before somebody else got a shot.

Yeah, I was like, so I get it. He's crazy. But Al, you brought up 9-11. So, you know, we travel. It was pretty much all-day traveling. And so we get to, they had a stay in me and my assistant, which is Mrs. Zant, at an inn, which I thought was weird because they kept, I was like hotel and they're like, no, it's an end. So we pull up and there's no one at the end. And doors were locked.

I thought you were going to say there's no room at the end. No, there was just no one there and the doors were locked. And so the people that gave us a ride who were working with the event, they were like, well, do y'all want to come hang out at the church building? And I was like, well, there's some chairs on this porch. I think we should just hang out on the porch and y'all go do whatever y'all got to do. So that's what we did for a couple of hours because it was real nice. This home, which I found out later, was built in the year 1800.

And it was moved to this spot. And it kind of reminded me of our place that we use at Logtown Estate for wedding venues and those kind of things, which at the same time that I'm doing this event, Missy was doing. She has a mentor event where she invites, I think, I don't know what the exact number is. You know, 13 or 14 young women and just has a weekend Bible study. They're ages like 22 to 29 or something like that. So at our old place. So finally, this guy shows up after a couple hours. And he was from the Netherlands, I believe.

He was Dutch. Yeah. And his name was Johannes. Oh. He got the frequent flyer award for your event. The reason I'm telling you this story is he's a chef. and he said, I'm from New York. Well, he worked at that time was the, in the Twin Towers,

he worked at the restaurant on top of one of the towers. Wow. And look, the only reason he's alive today is he was interested in buying this house. And so he was covering that, you know, trying to buy this house. and he said a line that was just profound. He said, I mean, this house saved my life. And so this is what I do now. He turned it into a bad breakfast.

He said, I'm saving its life. And it was just, I was like, well, you can't make this up. And this time of year. But I will say this, of all the places I've ever traveled, of all the food I've ever eaten, when we went down there for breakfast, I had no idea. that was the number one breakfast I've ever eaten. Because I tried to make my way into the kitchen, but Johannes,

I guess it's just the life of a chef. He's like, oh no, you're not allowed in the kitchen. I was like, well, I was trying to make me some coffee here. He was like,

I'll make you the coffee. He had kind of a thick accent. And I think I made him nervous, but just because I was like, well, I want to see you work. And he's like, no, that's not allowed.

you sit, I will bring. And so he ordered. Oh, no, he had it already prepared. That's what I said. I said, well, where's a menu? And he said, oh, no, I will provide the food for you. You will like it. They call that chef's choice, Jay's.

And they're usually the best. Well, I pushed back because I was like, you realize I'm from Louisiana. And he said, well, I knew you were from somewhere south. I guess he was noticing my accent. So he brought out this kind of lemon-flavored muffins, and I said, I'm really not a muffin guy. And he said, oh, you will love this. He was right. You love the lemon muffins.

Oh, fantastic. I ate it, and I said, do you have another one back there? And some fresh strawberries. So I thought that was the breakfast, which would have been good enough for me. and no he then he brought out the main course which he had eggs that were cooked in a way he said the word it started with an ass i'd never heard it before no not started with an s yes yes p you know for such a smart man i missed a similar you know what it happened there i was anticipating what it was and then you but i soon i was like as soon as you said it he didn't say scramble

I thought you were going to say that. It wasn't that is. It wasn't fried. It wasn't coached. It wasn't, no, it wasn't Scottish. He said a word that I've never heard, so it must be a Dutch thing. But whatever that was, was fantastic. I mean, he had a little seasoning.

It had three different kinds of cheeses melted in there somehow and another. And they were kind of big eggs and bacon that was cooked to perfection. but it was enough for like two men, two grown men. Was it shired? May have been. That's, that's, that, or soft-boiled or steamed. Wasn't soft-south-south or scoffelade or scotch? Maybe he said sufil-Aid.

That could have been it. They were kind of, they looked kind of like a giant muffin with all, they were like compact, but look, you know, Hugh, Of course, you had cheeses in there. I was trying to get... Somebody who cooks is listening to our podcast is screaming the answer out there. I'm going to go with soufflade because... Maybe so.

Maybe so. Because that's eggs separated and whipped so that the whites create a fluffy structure baked until puffed. That was it. That was a soufflead eggs. Fantastic. With the cheeses and then he had some kind of seasoning that was different. But he had enough black pepper in there to keep me in. You know, I mean, as I hate this, I thought, man, I mean, it was absolutely fantastic.

So that, I forgave him for making us sit on the porch two hours, which actually was nice. The weather was cool. It was, it was awesome. And you got to remember, you know, we were processing this with the Charlie Kirk and because I was just physically nausea. I didn't really eat that day very much. And until that next day, you know, I whipped up quite the hunger. Well, we flew days into Columbia, Missouri, which is the home of the Missouri Tigers from the SEC. And they actually had a game that weekend, so it was kind of made everything crowded.

But we were actually speaking about maybe 30 miles away, a little town called Fulton, Missouri, and wonderful people there at this little Christian church who took such great care of us. And so we spoke on Friday night and did our testimony. which is kind of how we do our marriage stuff. And the next day we'd do some teaching. And so we were standing before we got up the first time back at our book table, just selling a few books and meeting some folks that we didn't get to meet the night before. And this couple came up and we're talking to us.

And I kept looking at this guy. So I had Maddie send you a picture. So him in the black shirt is when I saw him first. And so he was dressed normal. But we're talking. Well, I was sending a. text saying should we talk about this because I got a picture. I was not on my phone. I was like, oh, this is for now. Yeah, this is for me. So, and we'll show it to the audience. But this,

so he's in this black, you know, shirt and pants. He's a big guy. But I, whereas we're talking, he didn't say anything. And finally I said, dude, has anybody ever said, you look exactly like Andy Reed? And, uh, and of course, I'm not realizing we're only two hours away from Kansas City. And he laughed. And when he laughed, he sounded like Andy Reid. And then I said, are you Andy Reid? And he said, no. And his name, it was so surprised.

Oh, it's not Andy Reed? Oh, I thought that was him. It's not him. This man's name is Matt Black. Oh, wow. But here, catch this. So then they start telling his story. He is Andy Reed stand in on all those state foreign commercials.

Are you kidding me? I am not kidding you. Should you be revealing this, Al? Oh, yeah, he talks about it openly. Oh, yeah. And he's friends with Andy Reed. So, so anyway, we go in and we do it. So I said, I can't believe this.

So I take this picture with him. He takes a picture with me. And we go in and I start speaking and I said, I just want to say, man, thank you, Andy Reed for being here today because I know you got a big game tomorrow. We're all pulling for you, coach. And I'd ever say anything else where the crowd all thinks is him. So like after we finished Tito, they all rushed back there to take their picture with him because I just I just kind of said it tongue and cheek.

Well, he goes out after we wrap the whole event and puts on the garb because that's what he does. He does like videos and stuff like this. And his thing is called almost Andy Reed. And that's how he signs his cards, which is really cool. But he is the nicest man. They came for our marriage refresh because they love our podcast and they love our family. And so it was really a cool thing because it almost felt like you met somebody famous.

Although he really really. really was it, but he comes in. So both pitchers are him, the ones with the chief. Yes. You had convinced me in a short period of time. I thought we were fixing to hear some kind of I am second Andy Reed promotional. So there was. Yeah, the truth is the headset should have gave it away.

He's wearing a headset. Right. Why would he be doing that? But let me tell you this, Zach, good eye there. That is actually Andy Reid's headset that he gave. to Matt. And because they're friends. Like now he, he stands in for him and does all these things. Isn't it amazing? Here's what's funny. So they're really interested Matt and his wife about PhD because now Andy Reed is losing weight. And so now he's got a problem. He's got a problem.

You got to go with it. He's got to go. So they were like, tell us about PhD. I was like, well, here we go. So it was so funny. But they were, these people were wonderful. And I just love this guy. because he took it in stride. Like he knows he looks like him. And obviously he has a whole other job. Like he sells food and he's a vice president for this company. But he just does this on the side. But they were driving back to Kansas City to go to the game.

So he goes into the game dressed like that picture with the headset and everything and then takes pictures with people in the stands. And some of them are like, are you really him? And he's like, no, he's down there on the sideline. I look down there. That's funny. I don't care of you. It was awesome. It's just such a blessing.

I have one other story before we get to the Bible. You know, it was heavy. We all said that our intensity was ratcheted up. Even my first speech I wasn't real happy with because I think I was so intense that I don't use notes. And I just had no idea. It was like I was so bottled up and I just went out there and exploded. and I never even looked at the time, and so obviously I went over, but I made some adjustments the second night.

But there was just so many people in tears, and it just seemed more than usual. But even on the plane when I was coming back, so me and Bonnie, you know, we sit down, and the male steward flight attendant, he leaned in, and I mean, Look, I hate to just kind of tell you how he looked, but I feel like you need to know because I just, when I looked at him, I wasn't thinking, oh, he's a fan of the podcast, or he just didn't look like, it's kind of like, kind of the way I felt the night my wife went on the first date with me.

I just thought, I'm not too sure this is going to work out, you know. I just felt, well, she just seemed more sophisticated. I kind of took a look at myself and thought, this is not going to work. I'm too country. I look too rough. But anyway, he had two earrings on, and I'd say he's a 60-year-old man, but he just seemed neat and everything was in order. He just didn't seem like someone who would be, who would know who I am, I guess, is a better way to say it. But he leaned in to him, and he said, at some point in this flight,

can I be unprofessional? Well, I looked at Bonnie because I thought... What does that mean? I didn't know what that meant. Do y'all know what that means? Yeah, I know. He said, he's going to take a picture. So I said, she looked at me like kind of her eyes got big because he couldn't see her eyes.

He's looking at me. And I thought, okay, she's got nothing. So I said, I'm not sure I understood you. And he said, at some point in this flight, can I? I'd be unprofessional. He spoke slower. And I just apologize. I said, look, I apologize.

I have no idea what you're talking about. And he looked at Bonnie and he said, do you know what I'm talking about? And she said, no, I really don't. And he's like, well, I would like to do something with you because I know who you are. And she then said, oh, well, I'll schedule it. She's my sister. I thought, that was the funniest line of the whole conversation. Get back to me when we take up.

Yeah, I'll get back to you. So he said, okay. So he went back and started, you know, getting people drinks or, you know, what they do. And I said, I'll schedule it? She's like, I'm thinking. And so then a minute. She was buying time. A minute later, she said, okay, I got it.

I'll cue you. And I was like, I feel like I'm, I've stepped off into bizarre. I was like, but I'll take the queue. Okay, I was a little frustrated. And so then once we got up to the high. Cruising altitude. Yeah, cruising altitude. Oh, yeah.

She said, okay, here's the plant. I'm going to go to the bathroom. And that way he can sit here and take a selfie. And I thought, oh, that's the schedule. And she's like, yeah. I was like, well, great. So she did. So here's where the reason I'm telling you this story,

when he sat down, he just burst into tears. And I mean broken. As in, it was because I was in first class just for reasons that I can get to my destination and not miss, you know, that's, I'm not apologizing for it. That's just how it works. And everyone was noticing it. And I was like, what's wrong?

And so he started talking about my dad. He started talking about Charlie Kirk. He started talking about his life. Wow. And we had a really good Jesus conversation for five minutes. Then we took the selfie. And I just thought that captured kind of the way people felt in this moment. I mean, he's obviously a believer in God and had this conversation.

But, you know, we just needed it. So then when Bonnie came back, she's like, well, I live. looked at him to say, how'd it go? And she said, he was a mess. I said, oh, you have no idea. But I said, you know, I think it was a God thing. And I think even the people who saw that thought it was a beautiful thing. And I wanted to share that because I think this is why the kingdom of God is the greatest

kingdom on earth. And this is something catastrophic happened. but to us look death is not only not a problem it's actually promised by Jesus in the very verses we're reading and will continue people give their lives and no matter what you want to say or how you want to spin it this guy was unashamed of sharing Jesus and went into hostile environments and was very clear his number one priority was that Jesus Christ is Lord of heaven and earth and that moves people That's evidence that there is a God and we're a part of something that is the greatest thing on earth. You know, it's funny, Jay, when you tell that story, which is a beautiful story. I spend so much time on airplanes and airports. And even in one of my and Lisa's teaching moments that we have, we talk about respecting other people and the importance of that. And of course, we're in a marriage context, but, you know, Job is making the point in Job 31 that he treats people respectfully, no matter where he's at.

And I always use air travel as my example of how disrespectful people treat one another. Yeah. And I mean, it's inside. It's the gate agent. It's passengers. It's on the plane. It's with flight attendants. It's one passenger to another.

And you're bump in the back of my seat. It's whatever. And, you know, just all the videos you see, of course, are, you know, mostly they go viral, are terrible things and people treating each other terribly in these settings. And I always explain the reason why is because it's a high pressure situation. People don't really want to fly, but you have to to get to places. People don't really want to work there and deal with it because now it's just this almost like moving people like cattle in and out of this plane.

It's all built on frustration. Everybody is frustrated. But I talk about how I try to make it my ambition every time I go to an airport to be a light because I'm in a place that's going to naturally not go that direction. I try to be kind. I try to be, even if I, even if something happens and I miss out on something, I don't try to respond ugly and, you know, ugly and be great people. In that story, I mean, I'm confessing my fault.

You know, I felt convicted because I thought, you know, I looked at this guy and formed an opinion that was wrong. And that's anti-Jesus, you know. And so I really thought, why do we do that? it this guy he looks different and next thing you know i mean i was convicted just because i formed an opinion not really consciously subconsciously because he did ask me a weird question that was weird and i was like what in the world is this guy what does he want but jays it also spoke that question also spoke to the pressure he's under too because like for him to do something based on his faith and something that's impacted his life and to approach you

this probably would be frowned upon. Exactly. I didn't understand the context and he didn't know how to get there and it was awkward and we were both, you know, we were emotional about it. And that's kind of, Missy and I was talking about that from Charlie Kirk's wife when she gave her speech. I was like, because she was like, it was good, but I just felt like she was just, and she couldn't think of the word. And I was like, well, babe, even when my dad died,

And he just died and he was old. And, you know, no one took his life. And I was like, the first couple of days, you know, I just couldn't really put two sentences together. Yeah. Just because of different reasons. And I thought, you know, here's a woman getting up where the worst thing imaginable could happen. And her to speak, I mean, through her devastation and the pain,

I was like, I just think that's what it looks like. I mean, yeah. It was just very tough to watch. It's hard to watch, and yet when you did, you were inspired, you know, by her effort to do it. That's kind of happening to me. It's like one of those things where the fact that she just agreed to do this with two small children who have been, you know, what do you do here? I mean, she'll be dealing with that the rest of her life. I mean, trying to explain this and it's just, boy, it grabs your heart, you know.

I mean. So this Matt, you know, the Andy Reid, almost Andy Reid guy, his wife told me, so we sat at their table when we had lunch that day. And she was telling me, she said, I just want to tell you guys your family, thank you so much for sharing with all of us the funeral. And she said, you know, when your kids were leading worship and all of it, she said, I just cried. And she said, because your dad meant so much to us, you know, out here. And she was like, I know that probably had. to be a hard decision. I said, well, it was. We spent quite a bit time talking about how we were going to do that. I said, but we felt like the world needed to know how we felt about our dad and also in appreciation to, you know, everybody's been led to the Lord by his, you know, what God did in him. And she said, well, look, it made a huge impact on me, on us, on me and Matt. And she said, you know, I know that's not easy. And so it's kind of what you were just saying about, you know, Charlie's wife as well, is it wasn't easy, but she felt like that the world needed to hear from her that she was going to be okay. And, you know, so if I had been advising her, I probably would have said wait a little longer, but you know what?

I mean, she did what she did, and I was inspired. No, I think it's a sign of her faith, you know. And look, to get back to our text, I mean, Jesus is basically looking ahead because he started this whole section in John 14 saying, don't be troubled. You know, trust in me. trust in God as well. And then even here in 16, he's saying, I'm telling you these things in verse 3. I'm warning you.

I've told you this. So when the time comes, you'll remember this. I don't want anybody to lead you straight. It's fixed to be traumatizing what's fixed to happen is basically what he's saying. I'm going to die and they're not prepared for it. I wanted to sort of reset because last podcast, as you read 16-1 through 4. which is exactly where we're at in our study.

And it was so poignant to the discussion about Charlie and kind of where everything's at. But I want to do a little bit of a callback, go back two verses earlier, which is where we left off a couple of podcasts ago, because both the guys that I read and study while we're doing this Bible study of NT Wright and Chuck Swindall, both kind of see this as an almost like a courtroom setting, which is why the word counselor, advocate, is because there's different You know, the Holy Spirit is translated in different words. And back in verse 26, it says when the counselor comes, and this is the Holy Spirit,

and that word is also advocate. And J.S., you showed us that also is the same name for Jesus in 1, John 2. Yeah. Sort of in this setting that the one on our behalf, which shows you that the Jesus and the Holy Spirit are one, whom I will send you from the Father, the Spirit of Truth, who goes out from the Father, he will testify about me, which, and that kind of puts it in this context of almost like a courtroom setting with this testifying about. And you also must testify, for you have been with me from the beginning. And so what he does and setting that up is saying, this is why I'm here. I'm sitting

in the Holy Spirit, the counsel, the advocate to live in you, because now you're going to be going out and testifying about me. Then you get the verses one through four, which is him warning them. Now, look, this is going to not be easy. And then when he gets back to verse 5, which I want to read down through verse 16, he sort of describes what this looks like. And this is really interesting about these two worlds, Jay's that you brought up. I like that contract, the war of the worlds that we talked about, because you're going to see the Holy Spirit does convict the world. But he does it by showing the contrast of who Jesus is. So let me read these verses.

He says, now I'm going to him who sent me. yet none of you ask me where are you going because I have said these things you are filled with grief so he's back to you know the idea of their they're grappling with this truth he's given them but I tell you the truth it is for your good that I'm going away unless I go away the counselor there's the advocate again will not come to you but if I go I will send him to you And they're really having a hard time wrapping their mind around this concept. And why wouldn't it? I mean, this is the Holy Spirit in a way that's never been poured out on humanity.

So, you know, it's really something you can't grasp until it happens. And here's what he says, interesting. Look at this in the kind of courtroom lens. When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt. Or also that word is he will expose the guilt of the world. So that's that idea. But just by him coming. In regard to sin and righteousness and judgment.

So three different things that will, then because you see the Holy Spirit living in Christians, you'll see this conviction or the guilt exposed. In regard to sin because men do not believe in me. So if you don't believe in Jesus, how could he do anything about your sin is the point? In regard to righteousness, because I'm going to the Father where you can see me near longer.

That's what we talk about the power of the ascension. That's the righteousness being revealed. How is it revealed through the gospel? Romans 116. And in regard to judgment, it's the third one, because the prince of this world now stands condemned. And that has to be the resurrection because that's what ultimately defeats Satan, right? This fear of death.

I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. But when he, the spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you. into all truth. Now he's shifted gears. This is more of a transformation. Now he's speaking to the disciples and not just about the world. He will not speak on his own. He will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. So that's going to be his role in the early disciples, and even for us. He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said, the spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you. In a little while, you will see me no more.

And then after a little while, you will see me, which again, talking about the resurrection. So I just love the picture here. Both the guys that I studied talk about this idea that while one is this idea of truth brings condemnation, if you don't believe, you know, and if you don't succumb and surrender. But the other one, if you do, brings transformation. It's the same spirit. Spirit, but it's all depending on whether you receive him or not as to where you stand before the Almighty. So that was just my take on it, but it was just such a powerful picture. And now he's kind of getting down into the deep weeds of exactly what the Holy Spirit is coming

to do. One of the things you see in that text, too, is I'm trying to think of a way to frame this up, but like a Trinitarian accomplishment of our own salvation. Oh, yeah. And what I mean by that is you think about verses like John 522, for the father judges no one, but has given all judgment to the son. So you see in this framework, you say, well, the son's going to be the judge and not the father. And he condemned us, this is Acts 10, to preach to the people and to testify that he is the one appointed by God. This is talking about Jesus.

To do what? to be judge of the living and the dead, or Acts 17, because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he appointed. And this is how we know who this man is. And of this, he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead. So Jesus is going to actually be the judge of all of us. For we all, this is Romans 1410, for we all stand before the judgment seat of God, which is going to be some manuscript should say the judgment seat of Christ,

then 2 Corinthians 5 says, for we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil. So when you mentioned that courtroom scenario, then the way the salvation is being accomplished through this trying nature of God

is that Christ actually is going to be the judge. So he says, you want me to leave because I need to send your attorney. Right? Christ is, but here's the deal. attorney and the father and the judge. They're all like the one who planned it, the one who accomplished and the one who's applying it. They're all one being. So we're leaning in through our salvation. We're actually leaning into the very nature of who God is. So Christ is going to be

the one who judges us, but he's also one who covers us. And then so the spirit is going to actually be our counselor in that. This whole thing is incredible because you see that playing out right here in the giving of the spirit. And I think you see that in the very nature of God when he said, it's not good for man to be alone in Genesis because God's not alone. God is a relationship. He is a holy communion. That's who he is.

And so that's even being seen here in the accomplishment of our actual salvation. I was going down the same rabbit hole as that went because I had to a question from a viewer about John 1426, which I realized were past that. But, you know, what I told him was, and before I read that, I said, well, when we get to chapter 16 and what Al just read specifically in 13 and following what Zach was saying about how the Godhead is working in creation, I was like, I think it helps explain John 1426. Because his question was, based on John 1426, and I actually told him, I didn't give him all this, I just said, I'm going to do this on a podcast and tell you which one.

So his question was 1426, because it's the same, the first time it uses that Greek word paraclitus in 25. He says, all this I have spoken while still with you, but the counselor, the Holy Spirit, him the Father, will send him my name. name and here was this question because it says we'll teach you all things and remind you of everything i have said to you now he zeroed in on the all things he said what are these things so when you but he actually said two things he said he's going to teach you all things and he's going to remind you of what i said to you which is what he's doing here in 16 well that's why i read the verse that said, I have told you all this in 16, 4, so that when the time comes, you will remember that I warned you.

Well, then he gets in, I'm giving you the Holy Spirit. So the Holy Spirit's going to remind you of who Jesus is, what he did, the questions he asked, all these things, which is how the Holy Spirit works. So before I get into the 16, and I'm going to read my response I gave him, how would you respond to that when he says he's going to teach you all things. I mean, I think that's a good question. Well, I mean, I was thinking, I mean, I think it's a good question. I think that you have to distinguish something profound about John 16 and John 17, though, that the will, that Christ has a divine will that is inseparable from the will of his father and the spirit as well. And so when he's

talking about that they have a shared purpose, they have a shared, um, will, for lack of a better term, and I think that's what Jesus is getting at when he says, when the spirit of truth comes, he'll guide you into all truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears, he will speak. He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine. This is Jesus saying, and he'll declare it to you. Well, then who's running the show here? Well, then Jesus pivots, and he said, well, all that the father has is mine. So, so you, you, You see this mutual sharing. Therefore, I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you.

So everything that the father has belongs to Christ. And then the spirit only speaks what he hears from the father and the son. And I think this is super important because when you get into John 17, he's going to say, since you have given him authority over all flesh to give eternal life to all whom you have given him. So the expression here, it's like this, I'm trying to think of the way that you would say, maybe like a delegated authority from father to son,

but their agenda, their will is the same thing. So in the courtroom, when the judge is like, how do you plead? It's almost as if the judge is like seeing us in the courtroom, how do you plead, then the judge gets off the standing. He goes down next to us as our counsel says, my client pleads not guilty. And then he goes back because they had that shared will. And I think that's super.

super comforting to know that's where we stand before this holy God. That's why we're saying there's no condemnation for those in Christ Jesus. And I would say, Jay, specifically when that one that says for you to know all things, that you remember the disciples, the 11, and then later would pick up another in the 12th, once the Holy Spirit now actually comes. Remember, they're coming off, but they're only, you know, less than two months from Jesus dying, resurrection, leaving, and giving them instructions. And now the Holy Spirit is going to pour literally upon them and end them to now begin the

movement that we're still a part of 2,000 years later. So why all of these apply to us as further down the road disciples, they really did have to have all things put into them to understand how to get this thing going. And so that's why Peter was prompted to go speak to Cornelis. He didn't want to do it on the own. on his own, we know he kind of had a thing about not wanting to associate with Gentiles. And yet the Holy Spirit prompted him. So I see it as the first century. It was, it's all crucial to have the Holy Spirit live in you, but it was for them to begin the movement. They had to

literally have God instructing them on where to go, what to do, and how to do it. Well, here's my take. And I kind of went, I agree with everything you are saying, but I went in a little different direction. I actually went into the now. Now, not yet direction. Because I think most people, when they see the word judgment, they think, oh, that's yet to come. Yeah, final. But if you read that, what you just read again. And because you were doing, I think most people are like, when you talk about the ascension,

when righteousness is being revealed. Now the first point I think everybody gets because it's like in regard to sin because they don't believe. in Jesus. But if you go back to your courtroom analogy in John 3 in verse 19 when he says, this is the verdict, which is the NIV translates it that way, which is another courtroom word, but it's actually judgment. Yeah. And it says light has come into the world, but men love darkness. Let me read it exactly. We've read it many times. Men love. darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. Everyone who does evil, it's kind of a present tense phrase that he's using, hates the

light and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed. But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God. This setting here is talking about people before he comes back. And my point is that when you brought up the resurrection, him ascending, his death and death and resurrection, well, think about what happens when he was ascended. Well, Jesus, 1st John 2, you made reference to that, he becomes our advocate in the presence of God. And meanwhile, we get the Holy Spirit. and become his advocates to the world.

Now, it's through him. That's why it uses the verses, I mean, the phrases like, we're the salt and light of the world. Think about salt and light. They change the environment that they're thrust into. Oh, it changes. It doesn't conformity. It changes good and bad.

And that's why I read that, John 3, it's an exposure. It's actually a judgment in time whenever you're doing Jesus things and having conversations because that light is revealing your heart. And bad things happen and good things happen, which is, you know, Charlie Kirk got shot. He was doing this on a constant basis in hostile environments. That's why he was getting so much persecution. But Al, you think of our family and our life. We've been shot at, our family, we've been shot at, just random guy, empty a nine millimeter clips, you know, through our houses that actually awaking me, you know, awaking me. I was taking a nap and I hear this gunfire. We've been persecuted. I've been beaten,

you know, a guy attack me just simply because I shared the gospel. And I did not retaliate in that moment. But all these things happen, you're like, why is this happening? Because this judgment that's being revealed through Jesus, the truth in that, it is being revealed through flawed people today because we have the Holy Spirit. So my answer to the guy who sent me that question, because the part I left out in it, he says what his thought was, and not that I was against his thought, he just said, is that going back to Genesis, which I did agree with,

and about the word. And like, was he saying, like, you'll now understand the word, teach you all things? He was, he had that word, teach, you know, and thinking the words, Jesus is the word, become flesh. And so what I did was in my response, and I'll read what I said, I said, as for your specific thoughts about the word, I would think more of the creation being the Godhead working together, which is exactly what Zach said. Yeah. And I went to Genesis 1, 1, 2, and I said, now look,

if you read Genesis 1, 1, 1, 2, you have this setting of creation itself. In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. The earth was formless and empty. You know, I think the Greek word can be translated, It made no sense. There was chaos. And then the Holy Spirit is hovering over the waters.

And then God said, let there be light. So you see these three entities as one working together for creation. Well, what is Jesus now fast forward promoting now? He's introducing a new creation where judgment is being revealed against the main party who, through an accusation and a lie, led humanity to not trust God and commit sin. And now you still have, now have the Holy Spirit entering the humans itself. Because of the word becoming flesh, you hear about Jesus, who the father sent, just like Zach was talking about, that train of sacrifice where all of them,

they're choosing to show love to each other. because Jesus said, look, I'm not doing this on my own. I'm doing this. Everything I say is from the Father. Then the Holy Spirit's like, he's going to point things, he's going to point all things towards me. You know, we get that verse here coming up. So he's like taking a, he's not promoting himself.

He's like pointing you to Jesus. It's like these, well, how would you say that, Zach? Love being manifested, I guess, in the Godhead. that they share through acts of service in pointing people to each other. Yeah, I don't know if it's, I think it's deeper than like a manifestation. It's, I think the first John. Yeah, it's probably not a good word. I think about what, I mean, God is love.

So I think it's indistinguishable to say that love is a characteristic of God. It is, he, God is love. And so it's, I think that's the reference. point through which we understand his nature. One way that I see it is that it's ontologically impossible, just meaning that it's not even possible, like in the very nature of the thing, or not even a thing, but it's not possible for the son to ever manipulate or abuse the father. It's not in their nature to be able for the father to abuse or manipulate the son. And it just can't happen. Like, it's not in the realm of.

of possibility because the very essence of their being is one of sacrificial love. And so what you see in the cross is whenever God, whenever Christ incarnates, you actually see even in the cross when Christ lays down his life for us. That's actually a display of his nature. Now, it takes on a little different form. It takes on a different manifestation when sin enters the world. Because now there's got to be sacrifice. There's got to be these other things that, how that, how that,

that manifests itself. But that's the life that we are being called into to participate in. So when Peter says that we are partakers of the divine nature, I think that's what he's talking about. Yeah. So you, which looks like the fruit of the spirit. I would use the word restoration because obviously from the garden just described, what you see here now and what the Holy Spirit is going to accomplish after Jesus' ascension and resurrection and ascension. is the three things you saw in the garden, the people's guilt, the people's helplessness, and then the people's destiny.

Because remember, it was death. They were cut off. And so from that point until now, Jesus, that needed to be reconciled and that needed to be redeemed. And that's exactly what he does with the new kingdom, which is. Which is my point was when he uses that terminology, he will bring glory to me. That was the verse. That was just like Jesus brought glory to the father. But the point is, is that he was preparing them that they're now,

God is going to dwell in them, and they're going to be doing these things, and it's not going to be well received. You're going to be hated. You're going to be killed. I want you to hang in there. You're going to have me with you. I mean, it's a beautiful story about how God uses us despite our past and our failures to not only clean us up, but move inside of us and use us.

for the earth, despite extreme opposition, which is all about the light and darkness that we live in. The world's colliding. All right. We're out of time, but we're going to pick it up right here next time because the little title in the Bible, which is not the Bible, but someone says the disciples' grief will turn to joy. And that's ultimately where we're going to head in our next couple of podcasts. So it gets better and better. I'll see you next time on Unashamed.

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