Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 1180 | Willie Robertson Saves a Man’s Life with One Word & How to Write Your Gospel Playbook

Episode Date: October 6, 2025

Willie Robertson recounts an unforgettable meeting with a fan who was planning to take his own life until a brief exchange changed everything, launching a debate with Jase about how “church speak” can confuse people who simply need the hope of Jesus. Willie shares what opened his eyes about how to talk about the gospel and his faith with anyone he meets. The guys explore how the Gospel travels best through ordinary words and willing hearts rather than grandiose speeches. Zach’s just glad Willie’s on the receiving end of Jase’s teasing this time, and Al’s happy to referee. In this episode: Acts 1; Acts 18, verses 24–26; Acts 19; Romans 6; 1 Corinthians 15; Galatians 5; Philippians 1; Philippians 2; 1 Peter 3, verse 15; 1 Peter 3, verse 21; Revelation 12 Chapters: 00:00–05:25 Jase & Zach Are Two Dogs on a Bone 05:26–15:15 What Inspired Willie’s Pivot to Practical Evangelism 15:16–23:52 A Great Opening Line for Sharing the Gospel 23:53–30:27 Does Your Life Reflect Your Baptism?  30:28–39:04 Prepare Your Answer Like You Prepare Dinner 39:05–46:15 A Good Question Opens the Door 46:16–56:26 Crazy Coincidences in the Making of “The Blind” — Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? I mean, look, in the middle of me saying that we don't have mansions over the hilltop. Think bigger, Zach. He said, this is the real reason why I didn't say much in the last episode. Willie, here's what he tells me. Look, look, here's his argument. I was like, what is exactly is your argument? Zach, you're trying to keep your head back. And he said, you're right on the line of being a Gnostic. I didn't even know what that was. I thought I needed to blow my nose or something. I thought,

Gnostic. I didn't even know what that was. And I didn't want to say, what is that? No, we talked a lot about sharing the gospel last time, and I forgot Zach was there. I didn't hear from him for about 45 minutes. By the way, you don't have to explain Gnosticism to me, because after our study, I bumped into Jeffrey Kent.

You know, he's a Bible. He's a Bible study guy. And I said, so I said, We just had an argument. I was like, let me see, because maybe I'm wrong here, so I went through the argument. And he explained. So you went to that I could be wrong.

Well, I just thought, I couldn't get over why he was pushing. It was a passive aggression. I could be wrong. I couldn't figure out why he was pushing back on that. Because he agreed with us on John 14. That was, I was like, why didn't you bring this up in John 14? Because he agreed with us. They're just talking about, it's not talking about, I got a mansion over here.

It's just talking about we have the Holy Spirit in us. That is the room. That is the mansion. We are the building. Well, you capitulated and said if it's we have a mansion, maybe that's you. I was trying to give an olive branch after that. He was trying to be kind. Change I to we.

That was my act of kindness. And he's like, okay, so we agree. I was like, no, if we had a change in the song, I was wanting to do away with the song. Yeah. Let's not, that's not, you're going to cancel guys. It's only been around 150 years. Well, let's not sing it.

I mean, we come, we drove up here, we got kids, we all, everybody. Well, so back to that, so we're rolling here for a while. We are rolling? Yeah, we've been rolling. Of course we're rolling, son. Wow, okay. Time is money, buddy. We can't get off that.

I wanted to mention one of the things that the first one I read in here, well, because I was just flipping through, you mentioned going to Lee Strobel was someplace, and he was speaking, and about evangelism or about sharing your faith, because he had written a book called The Case for Christ. You know it's wild? It was in Colorado Springs. Really? This is where I just came from.

Yeah. It's wild. I just think that's wild. Like, as you read the book of accents, like these places, and I mean, all through the Bible, but it's like there's a place here and a place, you know, where you didn't, where, you know, like when Jesus said, hey, you guys are going to, you're going to preach it. Samaria, you're going to go.

And I'm sure at the time they were like, I ain't going there. Like, ooh. And then ultimately, that's what happened. Stephen gets killed. Here goes. Where did they go? It's exactly back to Acts 1. It's where they ended up.

But the interesting thing about Lee is that he was an agnostic, really an atheist. And so he set out to disprove the bio. That's what got him kind of into it because he was an investigative journalist. Yeah. And he was an ex-cop too. And I didn't know who he was. So if you don't know who he is, that's fine because I didn't either. Yeah.

Because I was there. Actually, Zach, Zach wrote me into speaking at this thing. And I, let me just say you right now. I had a bad attitude at the time anyway. And so, you know, I'm like, what is it? You know, and so Zach really wanted me to be at this thing. And I did need to be there. So I felt like God, God was trying to get me to be somewhere.

I didn't want to go. I was like, I'm busy. I'm tired. that. He's like a jacket. But Zach had some other insights into how God was using him. And so, and so he really needed me to be in this particular place. Like, Zach needed me. And I feel like, ultimately, God, now that, I mean, now I can look back at it after 10 years. But because the book, I mean, it was part of the inspiration of it. And so I got to this thing. I really, he was walking in, I looked at, I said, what is this again? And I didn't even know what it wasn't. He says,

So it's this. And so we talked about TV and positive television or something. And for me, it was just another guy. I was like, it's just another thing that I'm going to do. And I didn't have the spiritual vision at the time. So then they offered me to stay. And one of the classes was it just said evangelism, Lee Strobel. I didn't know who Lee Strobel was, but I knew what evangelism was.

And I said, oh, this is a religious thing. And I really didn't even know it was religious, you know? That's funny. And so I said, I'm going to go hear this cat talk about evangelism. And so now later, Lee tells me when I'm sitting in. This is where I wanted to get. So I was, the whole time, I'm just writing notes. I mean, it's just like I was back in college.

Which is what I would do if I was really, something inspired me. I'm going to be, my heads down, I'm taking. I'm eating this. And Lee thought I wasn't paying attention. He thought I was like, Jason, church or whatever. You get one song. off that and then he's writing his own deal. So Lee thinks

that I'm like, Jay, like I'm not paying attention. I'm on my phone or so. I literally am just writing, I mean, I'm just writing everything this cat's saying. And I did know his story. I didn't know who he was. I didn't know any of that. And he would mention his book or his movie and I was like, I don't

know who this guy is, but that was some good stuff. So, and then when I took, I didn't even I didn't go talk to it. I just took that straight back home. And then went to a group of people and asked some of the questions that he had said you should go ask these questions, which led me to doing a Bible study for... Because you started that right after this.

Right, what we called First Step. And so, and Lee was talking at the time, like, we don't, there's no ministry for evangelism or ministry, if you don't like that word or know that word. There's no... Well, it's funny. That's a funny word because when I came home and said it, a guy, a man came up to me who lives in this town, and he said,

Willie, you keep saying this word, evangelism. And the guys said, I don't like that word. That word scares me. And I went, really. And I didn't realize for him and had a negative connotation.

And so what we did was... I was in that count. It was a first... Oh, yeah. So... You can have that argument if you're No, we can't, yeah, just don't get me, don't get me on that quite yet. Well, then they say it's not in the Bible, but it actually is.

The Greek word is in the Bible, but it's not translated to English. Well, the main thing was about sharing the gospel. So we started a thing where it was called first step. And I think a lot of churches have things called next steps. And so that's getting into that kind of what we talked about last time. So, but what is that first step? So, and the problem I had was that there was right at the end of the sermon. And this is pretty much everywhere I go.

it's the same. It's funny. Churches are also different. This one, a lot of them do the same thing. So right at the end of it, hey, if there's anybody here, you know, 30 seconds, you know, if you want to make Jesus Lord of your life, you know, pop a hand up, boom, boom, see. Everybody's got their heads, eyes closed, except for the, you know, so you don't know. It's that, thank you, thank you. So something's going on here. And then it's over. And everybody walks out. And I told the pastor, I just said, I don't know that, I don't know everybody knows exactly what they're doing. I don't know what, you know, like it's a, it's a big thing, but I don't know that they know.

I said, there's any way that I could... Now, what I said, what I'd like to do is get up after every one of them and then go about another 30 minutes on what that exactly means. What did you just do? And I said, and I'm assuming you're going to say, no, we can't do that every Sunday 30 minutes after. I said, okay, so can I have a room? Is there some place I could go to where we could explain that more

to those people or anybody who didn't raise their hand or whatever? And so we created this little room. It was called First Step. And it was a funnest room in the house. And all this came from hearing Lee. Yeah. Because when Lee said there's no specific, you know, category for evangelism or sharing the gospel. And he said, we have tons of ministries.

We have ministries for widows. We have ministries for teens. We have ministries for singles. College kids, yeah. Where's the actual ministry for what I feel like Jesus was saying the most important thing? the Greek commission, you know, this is why I came to seek and save the loss where most people... It should at least be on equal par with all the other. It's nowhere. And so he said, go ask when you go back to your place, go ask who's in charge of that. And they're going to

say the pastor, along with the other 600 things that he has to do. So I asked the question. They said exact same. I guess the pastor. And, but then the cat, they, they were smart. They called me about a month later and said, we don't have that minister. Do you want to start it? Yeah. And now I'm in the position. That was my move. to where I'm leading the, I was like, well, open my mouth. I guess I got to go now. And so so much of that came from Lee. And then later on, I called Lee and we have become friends.

And he said, it's funny that first encounter. But it really started this idea of what that means. And so a lot of what I wrote in the book, Gospeller, was some of it, what I actually learned in the class because there were so much misinformation where people didn't know. They thought evangelism or shabler. sharing the gospel, they had it connected to missionary. Yeah. I mean, for real, like most of them thought that's what missionaries do in other countries

they do. They didn't see it as something that happened here. Which is kind of the catch thing about that word, because it sounds like it's not just what we do every day, but it sounds like something that's done somewhere else. Right. Or it has to be official or whatever. To your point. Well, because my point is, okay, I just looked it up.

The word evangelist is mentioned three times in the New Testament. Right. But one of the times is in Ephesians 4. Remember where he says it was in the church. He gave some to be prophets, teachers, some to be evangelist. The word evangelism is just a word that we said. That means preaching the gospel. But I was looking at the word like, well, that would be something that only an evangelist could do technically.

Which is kind of what it's happened. You're going to love this story. You know where I first got into this argument? You remember at White's Ferry Road, Mike Kellett was a youth director, and every year they had a teen seminar, and the name of it was yes, youth evangelism seminar. So I pulled O'Kellet off to the side. I've been studying, and I said, I think we need another word for E there. And he's like, what, evangelism?

trying to get people to preach the gospel. And I said, well, we don't want to give the impression that you have to be an evangelist to perform evangelism because everyone should be representing Jesus. Should be sharing Jesus, have conversations. I had that as more of a Jesus style. As I, as the Father sent me, I'm sending you. But that prayer is then all the believers. We represent. We're light and salt, which when you think about those metaphors, by us having the spirit and proclaiming Jesus, we're changing the environments, which is what salt and light does. In whatever environment we in, we have conversations. That's what we do. So that's where that kind of argument came from.

It's like, well, we're not talking about just what missionaries do. We're talking about sharing Jesus, because there is a difference. Because even the second time that you used to Timothy, remember when Paul told Timothy, he said, do the work of an evangelist, second Timothy four in verse five. He had just said, remember, preach the word. So that's a preacher is what I'm getting at. What your book is about is more, and I like that word, gospeler, you're having conversations. You're asking questions.

I mean, I've said many times. times I start most conversations in an airplane or whatever revolving around. How did we get on the planet? Or do you believe in God? What are we doing here? What is the purpose of life? You know, what happens next? What happens when we die? All these things that are coming from like Acts 17 in Paul's famous little sermon there. He's addressing those same things. Remember when he's like, God gives all men life and breath, everything else? He determined the exact times for us to be here. God did this, so we would seek him. It's kind of given the answers to just basic human questions.

Right. And also, Willie, we've noticed in John, Jesus asked over 300 questions in the Gospels. He was only asked by other people a little over 100, which I think is ironic. I mean, Jesus was perfectly comfortable with asking questions and then seeing where that would lead. And a lot of times when he was asked a question, he would ask a question in response to their question, which is really the epitome of conversations, because I know you have a section in there about listening also. But I think that's how we share Jesus in basic conversation, which normally the basic human questions are, where are you from? And then we say a state or whatever.

And so every time when somebody asked me where you're from, I said, well, I believe I was created by God Almighty. I say that, which is awkward and uncomfortable for somebody to say that in a seat, in an airplane. But you would be amazed at how that one answer then say, oh, are you a preacher? That's usually because I usually have my Bible out too. And I'm like, no, I'm actually just a believer, but I do share Jesus to the world. I think that's why I'm here. Well, I've already answered two basic human questions, and they're not offended.

They're like, they're like, huh, well, how did that happen? Well, that's the greatest question in the world. Right. It's like, well, you know, this Bible's actually about a person. I mean, it's about the one who created it. That, it's a, where they're, that just debunk most of what people believe, which is the Bible's a rule book or a fairy tales or, you know, it's quite the incredible book.

And next thing you know, you're having a conversation about Jesus and their life, and they usually just start confessing their problems, their faults, without really knowing it. Like, well, at one time I believed in God, then this happened. And to me, if you want to call that evangelism, I view it as it was a conversation about Jesus from a spirit-filled person. Right. The evangelist is just that that's somebody who brings good news. And I had a Bible study this past week with a couple, and it's kind of rare that you get into the kind of conversations

where somebody comes in and they're just like, like, I'm done. Like, I'm empty. They know. They know the situation there in. And they were telling me, I always kind of start with, tell me your story.

And if they started telling their story, but they came in for the express purpose, they wanted to know. And the more they got to talk and sharing their background and the pain and the drama and the trauma and their own sins, I mean, the abuse. I mean, just the whole thing. The more they talk, the more, I just kept thinking, I'm getting so excited because I have such good news for you. I could not wait to tell them that all their shame and guilt could be washed away. But sometimes it's a little more difficult because it's hard to get people to see.

their need for the Savior. That's why Willie, you said in the last podcast, I love that approach of going to Galatians chapter 5, because that is a real, like, that's a real contrast, right? Stark, yeah. You show that acts of the simple nature, and people are like, yeah, that kind of sounds like me.

And then you can say, well, here's the fruit of the spirit. How are you doing? Are you experiencing love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, gentleness. Those are the things I think that when you can show that, like that, that really is like a shocking thing to bring people to the conclusion of way to say, I don't have peace in my life right now.

Yeah, I am searching. You know what? My family's in turmoil. I'm not loving each. We're not loving each other. We're not, there's no joy in my life. To me, that's like a really good, like, pre-evangelism to set the stage of what are we actually calling people into?

Well, right? And ultimately, it's the fruit of the spirit, right? Well, because what you're doing is, I think, it's coming from John. And in his prayers, you know, 17 times he mentioned. mentions world and we're not from the world. We're not of the world, but we're in the world. I'm going to send you in the world. Jesus was constantly saying that.

But by doing that, he was saying there's two camps. There's two worlds. You have the spirit-filled people who are my world in the world. And even the Galatians 5, the same thing. You're seeing two camps. And so a human being who's not familiar with the Bible, they're indirectly thinking, well, which camp are you in? Because it's pretty easy to figure that out once you read the two lists.

Is your life characterized by the acts of the sinful nature? Which are obvious. Well, most people are reading that thing and, yeah, me, me, me. But the Father of Spirit, Spirit, love, joy, peace. And most of those words, if you're in the wrong count, you're not using those words like God is using those words. You're thinking, oh, I love so-and-so, or, you know, I love the New Orleans Saints. You know, we're using love in a way that's from the wrong camp is my point.

I mean, true love, sacrifice, being unselfish, those kind of thing. And what's the difference in being happy in this world and then being joyous in Christ? Big difference. Right. They don't really know that. you're still, I think, drawing the line of there's two camps, which one are you in? Yeah. Look at what this has to offer.

Look at what this. Look at the rewards. And to your point, Earl, you said, talking about how just being in church or in a church, you can still miss what's the whole picture. And I think it's when you see that in John 13, when Jesus washes the disciples' feet, they're all 12 there, including Judas. and then that's the dividing point for him. Remember it says right after that he leaves

because Jesus said one of is going to betray me and it said Satan entered him and then he just walks out of the room. So he missed the whole part about the Holy Spirit which was the next discussion and the prayer in John 17. So he was so near the whole situation

but then he wasn't because he had made his... Think about practically. How many people... There's four men here who have shared the gospel with a lot of people. how many times have you seen someone give a religious experience then throughout the study they read stuff like Galatians 5 and they're like even though I had this religious experience

my life has looked like cap number one which is of the evil one yeah and then they're saying well maybe I didn't understand I mean I would say half of all the studies I've had yeah a lot of them people had had a religious experience and a lot of times the a bad one that then turned them south even more. But never manifested the fruit of the spirit. Exactly. So then they're like, well, we have a problem.

Of course, I'm like putting it on them. I'm like, well, you're the one you've got to figure out where that went off the rails. But all of a sudden it's disarmed whatever theology they claim to have. It's like, well, my life does not look like this. So why is that? Right. and I think that's a conversation that's awkward, but... And you can't just be missing something as well.

Maybe, you know, maybe they're somebody that's... You can be a believer. It's interesting. Like, I think about Apollus. Think about the list that was read about him. Knew the word, spoke for it. I mean, this guy was like a... But he didn't understand...

He didn't understand... Ax 18. Acts 18. Yeah. didn't understand that. Well, then who sets him straight on it? Wasn't even Paul. Versal and Aquila.

Now, these are two that he had just bumped into, because I love the other names, because you start seeing how other people work, you know? That's worth a read, though. It's 1824. Look, it said he was a learned man. He had a thorough knowledge of the scriptures in verse 25. He had been instructed in the way of the Lord,

and he spoke with great fervor and taught about Jesus accurately. So right there, this is a upper level. This is the guy probably leading your church. Yeah, yeah. Think about it. To speak like that and do all that. But he was still, well, it was still missing.

Because then it says, though he only knew the baptism of John, which you have to kind of stop there and say, so he didn't even realize the spirit had been poured out, people, the spirit could indwell you, but he had all this other, he was believing in John's baptism, which is there's a Messiah coming. Yeah. And so they're like, what did they do? So he began to speak boldly in the synagogue, and here's Priscilla and Aquila. They heard him, and they invited him to their home. Conversation. And explained to him the way of God more adequately. Yeah, that's big. Which is like, wait, what? And the fact that he lived.

listened, which showed that he had a good heart. Yeah. Because most of the time, if this guy had those five credentials, and he's speaking boldly, courageously. So that's a perfect illustration that it's not always that stark contrast to Galatians Five about lifestyle. This guy had a good lifestyle. But he didn't know about the Holy Spirit, which, of course, would have been a huge

game changer for him. And probably he didn't know that Jesus had done all these things. Even though it says he taught about Jesus. accurately, but it was still tied to John's baptism, like there's a king coming. You know what he probably was, Judge. He was probably what Paul describes about himself in Roman 7. He was probably that guy. In other words, he could see it and he understood that something was happening, but he's still fighting that inner battle of just release that you really don't get until the Holy Spirit resides in you, which is exactly what happened. But then,

as you said, Will, it's not just 2,000 years of history. How many people are like that out there right now every day, you know, waiting to be unleashed? Well, and I think we've got to be open to that. There's maybe something missing that's something in our lives. We're like, ah, and then, so you've got to be open to that. Yeah. So you can't be like, got it figured out. Got it all.

I don't know. You know. Yeah, exactly. We laugh, but we really think we do. I know. Like, give me the issue, and I'll tell you what that is. And like I was one of my travel companions. He was saying something about a guy.

And he was like, I don't think. He said something about what's going to happen in heaven or hell. And then the guy's looking at me like, I mean, can you believe he believes that? And I said, well, do you know what's going to happen? Yeah. He's like, well, I mean, I know what you'd think you know, but you don't really know. But he was so worried about what he, you know, does he have it right? We were talking about match over the hill.

But it's like. you may think one thing, you may get there, be like, well, I missed that one, you know. You know, I missed that old thing. Actually, I went to I went to First Peter and read about Jesus, whatever he was doing to those souls back in the, and I mean, blew his mind. He's like, I've never read that in the Bible.

I said, well, I'm done. When you get into it, you know, there's some things that we probably just don't know. And I think a pause was the one. That was the one who, I mean, this cat, is a flame thower, you know, but he had this thing wrong. Then we'll see in Acts 19, same way, Holy Spirit. And they were baptized again. That was this re-baptism, which I love that it's in there.

Because when we're talking about people's experiences, when I'm talking to somebody and they're like, well, I was in, you know, I was six years old and I got baptized. And generally what I do, you know, I was out at some camp. And usually what I just say is, well, how's it been since then? Yeah, yeah. How's life been since that happened? and then you can, most of the time, it's terrible.

It's like, well, then I got on drugs, and then I did this. I had to say, and it's this whole thing where you're tying that to, you know, a lot of people are tying that, to something that happened. You entitled it in the devotional day, you don't need a bath. Yeah. Yeah, that was the title, which was good. Which actually, yeah. That's what Peter says, right?

That's what he says. Not the removal of dirt from the flesh, but an appeal to God for a good conscience, which I think that's the, to me, that's the biggest. thing, especially when it comes to coming to faith or getting baptized, like baptism is a death and it's a new birth. And I think a lot of times, Phil would always ask that question, when did you die? And that's a big question, because if you can't think back, when I was six years old, that's when I killed that old sinful man.

But then like, well, how's it been since then? Well, it's been pretty rough. Yeah, that's, that is a big objection that I get a lot in sharing the gospel of people. is they had they did the thing they said the prayer whatever it is but like they didn't really die to themselves and they weren't buried with christ and raised to live a new life and that's what really this whole thing is about is our own work we're actually being connected with christ and his own death burial resurrection so we're we're participating in the gospel and we kind of have a mini gospel of ourselves right i'm buried with christ through baptism into death

in order that just as christ is raised in the dead i too may be raised to live a new life that that that really was Paul's method when he would, you know, propose that. Well, that was one in them, but I love that Peter says, this pledge of a clear conscience is such a different, it's, it's never said like, you don't read that like that. Yeah. And I'm so glad it's in there because I think it does help with someone who may be struggling with that, you know, because, and I talk about how, yeah, if you're unsure of something, you know, right now, if I'm unsure of my marital status with Corey. If I'm like, I don't know if this thing, I promise I'm not going to talk about it if I'm unsure about it. Are we really? Are we really married? I'm just not sure.

If I'm not sure, I'm not. So I think there's so many people out there who are not sure. If you're not sure, that's the last thing you're going to bring up in a conversation to try to be that light to someone else. You're not going to talk about it because you don't know. Or you don't know what the Bible says about it. And so therefore, you're kind of, you're like, I don't know what it says, you know. And so if we're, if we're called to be always prepared to give an answer for the hope that we have, my question is then how are we preparing? You know, like I like to cook food. My wife likes to eat food. My wife does not think about the preparation it takes to have a meal sitting on the table and everything is done at the same exact time. Because you don't just think. It's not thought

about when you get hungry. When you're starving to death, you have, I tell her, you missed it. Now you are going to have to drive through a window that someone else has prepared

and they say here, and give me $20. And we thought about the preparation of food. I think about it. Like, I'll ask you, I'm like,

you know, what do you want to eat tomorrow night? She's, I don't know. It's not even tomorrow. I'm like, I'm thinking about that right now. Because things have to be thought out.

They have to be marinated. The store, the whole situation. It's a good, great illustration. So if you're saying we've got to always be prepared to give an answer for the hope that we have, if we, and then you simply ask them like, how are you preparing? What is it, what is the preparation that you do? When you're unprepared, it's obvious, you know. When the, you know, I think about the quarterback, the quarterbacks that come out are like, when they're looking at the, they're looking down here and they're, they're, they're, they're, Well, you're just trying to remember the play.

You're not even looking at the defense. Look at the guys who come out there like an Aaron Rod. He knows the playbook. He knows that he's looking at the defense and he goes, ah, right there. So when you're sharing your faith with someone, the more you do it and the more experience you get, you're like, oh, yeah. I know what the word says. Sometimes that may be impressive. Sometimes it may not be.

Sometimes the idea of church, hey, there's a group of people that could love you and all that. Sometimes that appeals to people. Sometimes it's not appealing. Sometimes they're like, I grew up in a place. I hate, I hate the people. I was hurt. I was abused. So when you start talking about what seems like a good thing, they're like, not a good thing for me.

You're like, oh, oh. So you can't, that's why it changes. That's why Jesus was asking a lot of questions because you don't know where it is, even physical death. Some people you may be like, you're going to die. That may scare some people. It may not scare other people. Well, Aaron, Aaron Rogers, he didn't arrive at that destination overnight either. He started somewhere. Probably started in Little League football looking like an idiot. But he just practiced and repetition over and over again. I think about when I first started sharing the gospel, I was in college. And I sat underneath, I actually sat underneath you guys.

Willie was my college minister. And I'd say, I'd listen to y'all and Bill do it. And then I would try to imitate it, and it was probably pretty horrible at first. But over time, like, I remember in my Bible, I would have, like, I would start, I had a whole, like, progression of scripture. I would start with, what is the gospel? First Corinthians 15. I would write in the margins of my Bible, what are, where I was going to go to next. Romans 323. We taught that. That was kind of a method we used. Yeah, it was a method. And then Romans 623, you know, the wages of sin is death, all the, and I would just go through the whole thing. And I had every, in my Bible, It was just like a progression.

But after doing that, I don't know, thousands of times. Like I could share all of that with you now off the top of my head. I know the very, I know it because I've sat in it for 25 years and doing it. And over time, what's happened is, and I can't wait to see what it's going to be like in another 20 years. But being able to pivot and like you said, Willie, and being able to sense that. And also knowing that there may not be an action in that. moment, and that's not really for me to determine when someone's going to respond to the call of Christ. I mean, when my mom took Bill Smith into that bar, that night did not end in success.

Actually, the night, if you would have witnessed it, which you could see in the movie, it looked like failure. I mean, Phil wanted to fight Bill Smith. I mean, it was like, that's not like, oh, this was a successful evangelistic moment. But in the, in God's economy, we look back now, 50 years later, and we're doing a podcast. podcast, to your point, Willie, that we would not be doing had that encounter not happened. So what it looked like failure in the moment, now we're seeing, oh, it was very successful. But you wouldn't know it in the moment. And this is one piece of what we're doing right now is one small piece.

Think of all the other pieces. I mean, people that, you know, and I mean, there's so much that has come out of that, of that, of what happened right there. And if not, we may all be lost. We may all be worldly. we may all hate each other. You know, kind of back to that acts of the sinful nature. Our lives may look completely different. Because we'd have come from a broken home, you know.

And who knows what? Who knows what? But the way God does things, and he's like, ah. And so you do take that and it builds, you know, and the stuff that, like when we were together, when you were in college and we were, and it may not look like a lot of stuff, but there were stuff getting poured into people.

And some of the stuff, obviously is that you'll never know. I just, I did a podcast. a couple of days ago with Ed Millett, and he shared their stories. And he was like, I talked to this guy, and he was bawling crying in, I don't know what state he was in. And he said, I just want you,

can you please tell Willie Robertson. He took a picture with me at this event. I was going to take my life that day. But something he said in this connection we had, I didn't. And he still allowed. I never would have known that. Yeah.

I'd have thought, somebody took a picture, me, that happens a lot. But man, so you don't know what God, you know, even when you were saying, like,

you may have been off at it, because it's not for you. It's for, it's what you're doing to share, you know, and speaking of Aaron Rogers, he sat under Brett Farve

and didn't even play as he learned. Yeah. And then when he gets his spot, and now he's such to the point where he really can't even run, but he's so valuable. Like,

you can't even be, you can't even be, you can't even be, even run. He's like, we need him so badly, you know, because of the experience he has or whatever. And so that's the way I think about it in the church. And I think we can all be prepared. I do think there's different roles. I go back and forth with this, you know, because I want everybody to be out there sharing it. But there's, it's a big church. It's a big body. And there are, I think there's giftedness of evangelist, you know, of now teaching, you know,

people and travel around and being able to do that. And not everybody. it would be that skill. I think that's part of Paul's point, Ephesians 4. Some people are better at this than other people, just because of the nature. Some people are conversational. I think everybody, here's what you put in the book. Well, this is day three, about all of us being ambassadors. I think that's a great way to look at it, St.

Corinthians 520. And that's all of us, right? The Ministry of Reconciliation, we're all a part of that. But there's no doubt that some people are going to be a little more gifted to do something kingdom-wise and somebody else. I think about Strobel, because he had that impact on you. But Strobel is a great apologist, too. I mean, because of the way his mind works,

he wrote several books. I mean, he's right there in Zach's vein of being able to talk about these things in a whole different way, but he's never lost this simplicity of being led to Christ. And that's where we all have to be. I'm not aware of y'all keep bringing him up,

because when I looked up that 1. Peter 3.15, the word for when it says to give an answer. Zach, you'll like this. Let's see if I can pronounce it. Apollo Gia. Apologia. Or Gia ha. Gia ha.

No, it said pronouncing. It has a ah. Apollo Gia. To defend. To defend. To defend. But what's fascinating, so that's in First Peter 315. which then he goes to 1 Peter 3 about where you brought up Jesus going back in his burial

and preaching to the spirits from the... Die of the days of Noah. Noah, because the celestial world had contributed to the earth having to be flooded. So, you know, that was Genesis 6. We did a podcast on this somewhere. Speaking of Aaron Rogers, his brother was one of the fuzzy creatures. Exactly. on the Genesis 6th.

But Willie, here's... I know, I'm fuzzy creature. They're blurry creatures. I'm a fuzzy. I'm going to start my own podcast called Fuzzy creatures. Here's the point. Then all of a sudden he brings up baptism, which you think,

well, what did Jesus say in his burial to the spirit world, the fallen celestial beings or whatever? He's basically saying, you lost. In that, because then he came back from the dead. But then in that funny, how he ties it to our baptism,

and it says it saves you by the resurrection, which is what you're declaring a while ago when Zach was going through that Roman 6th that we die with Christ, but also a good question in that is who did we bury? Because I asked one of my family members one time when their life was looking a lot like Galatians 519 instead of 22, and we were trying to have trouble, we were having trouble figuring this out.

And I asked that question, which was the first time brought tears. because I asked, who did we bury? Because you're not looking like the new self. But that question was really a moment because it was a good question. Who did we bury? Where's the new person at? Which led to, you know, maybe I'm fooling myself. But I brought that up just to say, when I looked up that word,

Apollo, say it again, Zach, Apology. Apollagia. So it's also used in Philippians 1 in 2nd Timothy 416 about this in defense, but it's not kind of what you're thinking. It's more practical when Paul said, I have a point to this, but I feel like you'll keep bringing up Lee Strobel, so I have to read this. So I want to read these two times that Paul uses it in Philippians. In verse 7, it says it is right for me.

is Philippians 1-7, to fill this way about all of you since I have you in my heart for whether I'm in chains or defending and confirming the gospel, all of you sharing God's grace with me.

And the reason I'm reading this, and he says, uses the same word in verse 16, which it says, the latter, well, let me read 15. It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry.

This is kind of what got my attention. But others out of goodwill. The latter do so in love, which is telling you how we should be sharing the gospel. Love should be the motivation. And then he says, the latter do so in love, knowing that I am put here for the defense, there's that apology of the gospel. He goes through, you know, famously in Philippians too, talking about we should be united in spirit. do nothing out of selfish ambition.

And then we should have the attitude of Christ. Remember that famous verse? And then when he gets to verse 19, he gives two illustrations of people who are gospling and gets back to this, as the Father sent me, I'm sending you. This is what led me to this verse. He first brings up Timothy,

and look at 219. It says, I hope in the Lord Jesus to send Timothy to you, that I also may be cheered when I received. see news about you. I have no one else like him who takes a genuine interest in your welfare, which goes back to this love. He's like, I'm going to send this guy. For everyone looks out for his own interests, not those of Jesus Christ, which is what causes us not to share Jesus. Because we're looking after our own interest. But you know that Timothy has proved himself because as a son with his father, he has served me in the work of the gospel. There's another

key ingredient. You've got to be willing to serve. And so then he brings up... Apaphroditis. Apaphroditis. But watch. He said, I think it's necessary to send back to you apaphroditis. I mean, Paul's like, I'm defending the gospel, I'm trying to do it in love, and I'm just sending you people. And look how he's described. He's our fellow worker and soldier. And the reason I'm bringing all this up, I think all these ingredients on how they're being described are the qualities that we need and the view of how we should be viewing this on getting Jesus out. But it's work. He's now said a fellow soldier who is also your messenger,

which is another way to describe it, whom you sent to take care of my needs. For he longs for all of you in his distress because you heard he was ill. Indeed he was ill and almost died. But God had mercy on him and not on him but also on me to say, spare me sorrow upon sorrow. I want to just finish this because I think it's great. Therefore, I am all the more eager to send him so that when you see him again,

you may be glad, and I may have less anxiety. Welcome him in the Lord with great joy and honor men like him, because he almost died for the work of Christ, risking his life to make up for the help you could not give me. And the question I was going to ask is, you've got to think. think, why do more Christians not share Jesus and are not living lives like this? And I think it's a worthy question, because I think part of it is fear. Part of it's ignorant, as Willis said.

You don't know. You don't know. You're kind of looking at it from scriptures instead of a person, you know, which really helped me overcome my fears of sharing. Because it's like, what if they ask me a question? I don't know where the scriptures are. I'm like, well, you wouldn't have a problem introducing your wife. I mean, you don't need a book.

Yeah. You could describe the relationship. It's like, we'll describe your relationship, you know, with Jesus. You don't have to show the marriage certificate. Yeah. I'm married. Let's tell me about your wife. Tell them about Jesus.

So I've had so many conversations like that because people come to him and said, I want to share Jesus. I mean, I had a guy Sunday morning. He's like, well, how do I share Jesus? I was like, and you know what my answer was? I said, with your mouth. And he looked at me. I was like, just tell what he's done in your life. Don't overcomplicate this.

And then he said, well, I don't know the verses. I'm like, well, that's on you. You need to do some study because this whole book is about Jesus. So just pick a spot. But you can start with the word of your testimony because that's the Revelation 12 says that we overcome him by the power of the blood and the word of our testimony. So that is probably the best place to start.

Even if you don't know the scriptures yet, which is not saying you shouldn't learn him. You should learn them. We need to know the Bible. But just sharing the word of your own story is powerful for people. And maybe the most powerful thing is just what did Christ do for you? What is your life like now that you're with him? And I love the idea.

The blind, you know, and Lee talks about that as well. Who did this? I don't know. His name is Jesus. I was blind. Now I can see. That's all the dude knew. That's it.

That's it. He didn't know the whole theology. That's where he started. They were like, we're going to kick out the synagogue. Okay.

It's like, I could care left. This guy just, he just did it. Back to my conversation of this fellow. And I might have been being too aggressive.

I don't know. Because he said, well, I'm not following you. And I said, okay, just picture yourself. Let's say

Jesus comes back in five minutes. And we all, let's say literally stand before God. And you will, walk up in front of God and he says, why are you here? Whatever you say is what you need to say to this person. He's like, why are you here? And I think you would tell the story of Jesus saying, well, you sent Jesus and he died for me and he was raised and I gave my life to him. He's like, oh, okay. I was like, well, that's all I'm saying. You're thinking, I guess there's got to be some

kind of Bible school or memorization of scriptures. I'm like, it's a conversation with a person that's in the wrong camp, and you're like, here's how I got out of that camp in Jesus. I just think everyone can have that conversation if you're in Jesus. Yeah. And look, we started out the first podcast talking about dad's influence. That's exactly what dad, and we all witnessed it. We were kids and watched it.

And he would say, I was one of the biggest reprobates I ran, you know, I was out of horror, you know, hey, I had his little lines. But he was relating to them that he gets it. Because they're thinking, me, me. Exactly. And he said, but here's what, here's boys, here's what I found. And then what he did was when he searched the scriptures diligently, it was to how to express what Jesus had done for it.

And that's really what we're talking about. And I just want to reiterate, too, you don't really know where it's going to head. I mean, even as we're having this conversation and Willie was talking about, that meeting in Colorado where he first walked into his encounter with Lee Strobel, which led to him writing the book. What also happened at that meeting, which I didn't know when I got there, was I was standing in line at that same exact meeting. I was standing in line for dinner, and I heard this Cajun guy behind me,

I mean, thick, like South Louisiana accent. That's funny. Yeah, this is right. Yeah. And I turn around and this guy named Troy. And he's, I said, are you from Louisiana? Yeah, I'm from New Orleans. And he said, come sit down and talk to me.

And we sat down at a table together, and he started asking me questions and said, what's your big dream? What do you want to do? What do you want to do? And I was like, I don't know. You got something. What do you want to do?

I was like, I'd love to do a movie about my uncle's life. And that conversation. That actually started there, too. Was the beginning of the whole thing. And that he literally, I mean, without Troy, we would have done it. And like all that started right there at that same meeting. You know what's crazy is that? So that same guy.

So Lisa finds out she has breast cancer. We go in and meet with a plastic surgeon. And within two minutes of the conversation, he said, do you have anything to do with that movie, The Blind? I said, well, yeah, it's a family project. We're all involved. He said, I invested in that movie because my best friend is Troy. And I was like, I was blown away.

I was like, Doc, I like you already because you make good investments. I said, you got some money too, didn't he? He said, yeah, I got it. And he said, and you know. know who Jesus is. I mean, this was the guy who's going to be operating on your wife. But that thread, you're talking about threads, which we've talked about this whole time, about how powerful they have.

Well, I spoke in Lynchburg the other day, and not at Liberty, actually, at a different thing. And I told the guys, I said it was a company. And he hired, he got me to come in just to talk to a couple of other guys, just to talk to his company, like five or six hundred guys. And I said, what would your book of acts look like? Yeah. What would it look like?

Yeah. What are the stories that you would tell? If you're not, if you're just watching, if you're watching something and you're constantly watching, we talked about cell phones and all that, it's hard to have good stories when you're just watching other people who just stuff, you know? And here's what happens.

I'm like, oh, have you seen that thing? This has me every day. Have you seen that thing? And I got, no. And they'll be like, oh, you got to see it. I'm like, I don't have to see it. You can just tell me. Like, no, no, I want to say, no, because you're going to show me that.

Then you're going to say, if you don't get the reaction, you're going to scroll to another one. you're going to show me now. I said, I don't, I don't even want to see that. It's 20 minutes of cat videos. That's it. Because as a society, we're just watching other people do stuff. And so when we get in the game, which is what I told that group, when we get out there and think about what your week looks like, what your days look like, what your months looks like, you know, think about, read the book of act, just read it. And go like, these cats were all in, you know, I mean,

all in 100%. And so I think about that. every week. Like, what would it, you know, and it's just a push for myself. Which keeps you just rolling along. It keeps moving for the kingdom of God. So I'm not caught up in just a bunch of stupid stuff that's gone here today and gone tomorrow. And, I mean, we just buried field this summer. And so we know, like, we all reflected on what it was.

What's really important? What's not important? I think it put the urgency there. So just so the audience will know, if you haven't gotten it, because we have talked about the first book, the Gospelor, which is, excellent and then this is a sort of a companion to it and this is a 40-day devotion. It's called Gospel Courage. But I know a lot of you have asked, how can we share Jesus better? I'm telling this is a great guidepost and you did a really good job with it, Will. Thank you. So we'll see you

next time on Unashamed. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcast. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications. to watch every episode.