Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 1196 | Jase Battles Duck-Struck Airplane Chaos, Reed Pops In & Who Is the Antichrist?

Episode Date: October 28, 2025

Jase recounts a travel gauntlet worthy of its own sitcom, including an in-air collision with his favorite waterfowl, before walking into a rough crowd where his jokes flop. But a heartfelt tribute to Missy leaves her beaming and Al and Zach taking notes for their own playbooks. The surprise arrival of Jase’s son Reed turns the conversation serious as the guys continue through John 18, contrasting Christ’s unshakable kingdom with the seductive traits of the antichrist and the deceivers who twist truth for power. In this episode: Exodus 33; John 18, verses 28–40; 1 Corinthians 10, verse 4; Daniel 2, verses 34–35, 44–45; Ephesians 2; Mark 1, verse 15; Matthew 6, verse 13 (doxology note); John 17; 1 John 2; 1 John 4; 2 John, verse 7 Chapters: 00:00-03:49 What annoys Jase about Zach 03:50-14:51 Jase scores an “I was right” over Missy 14:52-22:35 If the cornerstone isn’t right, nothing will be 22:36-26:45 What makes the anti-Christ? 26:46-32:00 How to make your wife beam happily 32:01-39:40 Rome finds Jesus innocent 39:41-47:57 Modern signs that Jesus conquered Rome 47:58-56:22 Jesus mic drops on Pilate — Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? I mean, Dash, what's wrong with just doing good? Doing good. Love one another for crying out loud. Doing good. Doing good. What's the downside? What's the downside?

Is there a downside to doing good? I think it's the motivation. That's what I'm zeroing in on tonight. Well, they wanted me to do a speech on morality. and it's morphed into fire. Fire. Yeah. It'll be good.

Are we recorded? Are we already going? We started with our film impersonation today. I didn't realize we were recording, but that's okay. Sometimes Maddie gets it going a little early. She likes some of our banter. Well, you missed, she missed recording the part. What we had just said when you walked in, I'm doing air quotes.

I need to stop doing it. You're talking about me walking in? Yeah. Yeah, ten minutes. 12 minutes late, Zach. Let's start this podcast off with an intervention. Zach's, he's developed a habit. And here are the two things,

because my dad used to do rants on this. He's showing up late and leaving early. That's a bad combo, Dasher. You got any thoughts? Who do I see over there? Wait a minute. And he's also breaking surprise guest onto the podcast. Reed, is that you?

It is, Jeanne. It is I. They had the box so small, I couldn't see who that was. What's up, Rich? That's your oldest son. I had no idea you were coming. We were just making jokes about how you talk too much. And they said, okay, the headphones are on.

I put the headphones on, and it was just blaring my dad's voice. He's already rolling voice. Reed, welcome to the Unashamed by all. you're what is Zach to you your cousin-in-law we literally just had this entire conversation on the last podcast what is that relation he that's like a second cousin or nice first cousin first cousin once removed oh okay once removed whatever that is he he's making me angry by he's leaving early he's like hey hey guys last time we're together he said hey guys i got a call that call better be about somebody to the hospital or the morgue or the white house that's right well i mean i'm like you get a call

i get a call every five minutes that doesn't mean i'm going to stop what i'm doing and go answer you do you do you do text right in the middle of the podcast you've seen him do that read right he texted the middle of the podcast yeah because i'm always texting him and he's responded to me and he's just text me and says in podcast so i will i've got your back on that one dad read defend me the other night you sent me a text and then you found out later what I was fixing to do but did I not text you back with a Bible? You got a Bible question. I did think that was really funny. I was preparing to teach Bible study on Tuesday night and I didn't tell my dad I was but I just texted him and I said is God talking about Jesus in Exodus 33? And so then he responds and gives me his rundown and I never read. responded. I just went and taught. It was over. So then I'm laying in bed at 1045 later,

and he just texted me again, and he says, how'd it go? And I was like, well, okay, so then I called him and we talked for an hour. But he was preparing to go on stage and do an event, and he took the time graciously to explain to me what Exodus 33 was about. So I appreciate it. Well, you actually helped me. I didn't tell you this part. So your mom, we did an event together. And look, you got to remember. This is what I've been waiting to hear about since Monday. It had been 10 years.

Because in the past, it's not been good. Well, first she said 13 years, and I started pressing her on that while we were in the green room that wasn't green. And she finally got it down to 10 years where I had offended her by saying she was wrong in front of 2,000 people. And that I wouldn't let her talk. So we've waited a decade. No, no. And so this is how this starts off. We're literally fixed to get, they called us and said, we're ready for you.

And I'm texting my son, but she doesn't know that. And she's like, when she calls me by my full name, she's, she's angry. She's like, Jason, they just called us. You're on your phone? Put your phone away. I said, I'm texting my son over a Bible question. There are some things in life. You just stop and answer.

Think about the privilege that we have. We have a 30-year-old son who's asking me a random Bible question on a Tuesday night. He's unaware where we're at. And she said, I'm so sorry. I shouldn't have said that. So I saw you all ace card right there. You won, you're welcome. So I feel like we should have, I wish we'd have had an imaginary like ringing the bell, like competition on making this right where it all went wrong 10 years ago.

Because that was a ding. Yeah. And so. But you can tell Jay's is loving it too much because the 14 other times she fussed at him, he was just blowing her off. but the one time he had an excuse, then he got her. That's the one you're right. That's the one you're out. I get it, Jason.

I'm not really sure how that helps your point that you were trying to make. So tell us how the event way, because I'm curious, did you do better than you did 10 years ago? That's the question. Well, we had a moment, Al. Because you got to remember, it was a, we had a lot of trouble getting there. So we had already, like, galvanized our relationship because it was a rough. It was just a rough trip. We, the plane, we get to, you know, drive to Monroe, get up 4 o'clock in the morning.

We get there. And they call everybody, you know, like whatever, 5.30, you may board. So everybody but Missy and I had boarded because we were at the back of the line. And then all of a sudden everybody starts coming back out. We're like, uh-oh. And then they put up that little word, Delayed. Delayed.

Guess why the plane from Monroe was delayed. Weather. No. The night before, when the plane come over, they hit a duck. You cannot make this up. The plane hit a duck. The plane hit a duck the night before, which there's a lot of questions there. Are we just now getting around to noticing this?

Because evidently you've deemed this something that has to be cleaned up before we can move on. Because I was like, how could a duck do that much damage, you know? And plus, I'm a duck man. This is your wheelhouse. It took almost three hours for somebody to clean that duck off the plane, which I just thought that was ironic. But then we went to Atlanta. Well, you know what happened?

We miss our connection. Connection, of course. So then a series of events happened where we're in Atlanta and we realize we're not going to make it to Notre Dame. I was going outside the campus of the Irish. So our assistant, Bonnie's with us. She's like, we're not going to make it. And five minutes later they said, we have had someone emerge and they're going to send you a private plane to get you here. Yeah.

I was stunned. I was like, well, we're back in. So the plane came, but it came from there, and the weather was rough, real windy. So then at some point, probably 10 minutes before landing, I thought, we're risking our lives for this. I mean, Missy and I were fine because we've been on a lot of choppy.

One pilot or two pilots? Two pilots, a man and his son. They could not have been any more nicer. I've got a rule, Chase. What's that? I only fly private. But when somebody else pays for it. I was fixing to say.

Yeah, I'm glad you put that caveat in there. I was fixed to say, when's the last time you've flown two decades ago? But I'll see where you went with that. So anyway, so I felt like we had already had a lot. It was emotional. And we weren't upset. But, I mean, it was a pretty rough, rough ride. I mean, our assistant Bonnie, she was distraught.

It was pretty rough, right. Just the last 10 minutes. But anyway, so we had all this, then I had the phone drama. So we get out there, and I'm like, it was a Q&A, they asked a question. I'm like, babe, would you like to go first? I was being very courteous, like offering her the first shot. I was doing all this. But I could tell she was kind of looking at me, like, just be yourself.

She had that annoyed look. And now about question three. No win. No win situation. Question three. And the theme was like, you drop a rock. and it creates a ripple effect. Of course, I had already gone off with,

let me just explain this to everyone. The rock is Jesus, and the ripple effect are, you know, the repercussions of him coming to Earth. What are the odds that I texted you right before that, asking if God was talking about Jesus as the rock in X-Dix 33? That literally happened. That was my whole point.

I know. And I told Missy that on the way down. I was like, your son is somehow in with the working of the Lord here because he asked me a question about the rock. I told that. I was like, and the theme is dropping the rock and the ripples. That's true statement. So your response, they're like, this guy is always prepared to give an answer.

They have no clue that you had just walked through. Kind of a pretty weighty theological point in the book of Exodus. I mean, it is a... Oh, it was weighty, yeah. That's why I texted him because I'm like, I think. that this is where it's going here and I'm going to make a pretty big claim in this Bible

study I ought to make sure you know and it's either chat GPT or Jace Robertson and I went with the living, breathing human Yeah, good job really You know because we are also were in First John about the antichrist here so I want to stay away from chat GPT

Well you got to be careful with chat GPT because it'll, you get in an echo chamber and it learns what you want it to say And it can make I mean I Like everybody knows I love to talk about the temple. And so I did a little thing I would like put a random verse in there. And I would say, give me the temple motif in and then fill in the blank. And just about every time it like comes up with something like, that's pretty good. That's kind of scary. Because it knows what you want

to hear. But but on that Exodus 33 passage, though, that's, I mean, I preached on that a few weeks ago. And I think that's one of the most powerful, I mean, it is one of the most powerful scriptures in the Old Testament. And particularly, if you can understand that in the revelation of Jesus Christ. Yeah, that's pretty cool. Speaking of rocks, we need solid foundation in America and our good friends at FRC, which is Family Research Council with Tony Perkins, have been a huge friend of the podcast and also us for many, many years.

They've stood by us when they tried to cancel Dad. They're right there with us. So we're asking you to join the fight with them. Give today at FRC.org slash Unashamed. So here's my text to read. I'd say technically yes, because he said his guy talking about Jesus. And I actually read, I shared that story to the audience about the rock. I was like, no coincidence, my son's asking me about rocks before I walked out here.

And he didn't know I was going to be here with the ripple effect. And so I put First Corinthians 10-4 is interesting. You remember that? Yep. I was going to mention that. I read that. Go ahead and mention it because I can't remember exactly how it was word. Well, basically he says that.

I mean, he says that Christ, Jesus is that rock. That accompanied them in the desert when the water came out whether or not. Right. Yeah, that's the verse I used when I priest. He made the same reference that the idea of water was there when they were covered in the Red Sea. It was like a baptism, them coming out of slavery into newness as well. So it's the same concept. He says, and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they drank from the spiritual rock that followed them.

And the rock was Christ. I just love that verse. I love that verse that Paul is using an Old Testament imagery of Israel. And all of a sudden, he throws that nugget out there. I mean, he mentions Moses. I mean, it's almost like he's talking about, it's almost like he's referencing the verse we're talking about in Exodus. Because he says, for I do not want you to be unaware, brothers,

that our fathers were all under the cloud and all passed through the sea and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. And all ate the same spiritual food and all drank the same spiritual drink. And he says, and the rock was Christ. And then he backs it up, which is his point.

Nevertheless, with most of them, God was not pleased, for they were overthrown in the wilderness. Now, these things took place as examples for us that we might not desire the evil as they did. Oh, yeah. Oh, it's fantastic. So the rest of the text went, if you read the whole chapter of Exodus 33, because I skimmed it real quickly, and I was like, the presence of God, and it has a capital P when it's had presence of God there, is referenced several times.

You got to remember, God is three and one, and there's a lot of references about Christ being the cornerstone. So my final answer would be this shadows what Jesus would ultimately fulfill. he is the rock that brings the presence of God. And then I put this, which really didn't catch on at the time, but we had another talk about this later. And then would allow us to see his face. Well, you remember in Exodus 33 that was a big deal, but you can't look upon my face and live?

Yeah, we just talked about that in the Not Yet Now podcast because me and you were both saying, we may have stumbled upon something interesting here because when he says, and while my glory passes by, I will put you in the cleft of the rock, Jesus, which is the point we're making, and I will cover you with my hand until I pass away. Then I will take my hand away, and you shall see my back,

but my face shall not be seen. But when Zach made a great point about Jesus being flesh, and we were talking about how it doesn't just, it affirms the Old Testament, all these prophecies, and I mean, it makes the entire Bible one story, as Jesus came. And now God has a face.

It creates this interesting point of, well, now they did get to see his face. Oh, absolutely. And I think it's a great, it would be a great sermon. What it also sheds light, a great illustration is at the Mount of Transfiguration, when you see sort of this glorified nature

of this little preview of Jesus and you're seeing him, but you're also seeing the old there with him where you're seeing Moses and you're seeing Elijah's, which represents the law and the priesthood, all now formulated into this glorified Lord who's here. I mean, it brings passages like that, what y'all are discussing, brings that to light in even a more exciting way. But also another one, too, is Daniel, too, when Daniel has the vision of the kingdom coming, and it's the member of the statue, and it had the different layers, the four layers, and iron.

Yeah. And the bottom, that bottom was iron. And in Daniel, too, it says a stone that was cut out of the mountain, it rolls down. And the stone that struck the image and became a great mountain and filled the whole earth. Well, that's temple language there, by the way. But the stone is Christ. Like, he's cut out. Literally, I mean, Christ came and destroyed the Roman Empire, if you really think about it.

then you get to like Matthew's interaction which we did talk about this and not yet now with reading Brighton when Matthew in Matthews account in Jesus asked Peter who do you say I am well he said who do you who do people say I am he said though some people say you're a prophet some say you know you're Elijah yeah but who do you say I am he said well I say you're the Christ and Jesus is like yep and upon this rock the confession that Christ he's the rock I'm going to build my church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it. So the kingdom that came in the coming of the rock, it's just going to storm the gates of hell. It'll crush the Roman empire.

It'll crush any empire. And it's going to crush the gates of hell and overcome in the end. And then when you get to Ephesians 2, when you start to see the nature of the kingdom, the Bible says that we're also little rocks that are living. We're living rocks that are built upon the. corner rock or the corner stone, which is Jesus Christ himself. So the idea of Christ being that rock is so the tentacles of that truth, we could spend the whole year talking just about that one truth. The tentacles reach far and wide. Well, look, Reed's a builder, so he knows

if you have to have something to start things at the right angles to make everything work and be in sink when you build a house and you build a building and that's who jesus is he literally everything lines off of him that's why he's called the cornerstove and then every foundation is built on him which is powerful yeah if you think a foundation doesn't matter you just spend a day with a concrete contractor and see i mean they're going over that thing with a fine tooth come arguing with the truck it's too wet it's too hard you know i mean it's weather's not right it's got to be the perfect degree with the perfect amount of moisture in the air and they get the concrete that they ordered.

I mean, because if it's not right, it will create problems, a ripple effect, if you will, that will linger and just compound on each other over and over and over again. I mean, I see it in my house. I built my house. You look up one day and there's a crack going from the top of the doorframe all the way up to the ceiling. You're like, what in the world is that? It's because the house is settling because there's something wrong with the foundation all the way

at the very bottom. But to your point, I mean, when you think of it, about the context of when this was written. And I'm going through First John in our study in Nashville with our church. And it's talking about false teachers and the Antichrist. And it makes you realize that this was such a profound thing, especially at the time, because you had a whole group of people that he's adjacent to that they accept the father, they affirm the father, but they don't accept the son as as living, breathing God in the flesh. And so to Zach's point in 1st John, it says, no one who denies the son has the father. He's, he's, all he's saying is he's like,

hey, this is one God here, you know, he became flesh. Yes, he is the rock. Remember in Exodus 33 when Moses said, I'll put you in the cleft of the rock? He is the rock, you know? I mean, it's, it's an amazing thing really when you when you which is why he defines the antichrist in john and john two or second john one one chapter in second john right uh verse seven i think he says that the antichrist is anyone who has said or is saying chapter four what is it chapter four well he no that's first john for he uh second john about second john which it only has yeah it's not it's not it's only yeah but he basically says that anyone who says Jesus didn't come in the flesh is the Antichrist. And I think the reason why they're the Antichrist is because they're actually saying,

oh, no, there's no rock that came out of heaven that crushed the kingdoms of the world. Verse 7 of 2nd, John, many deceivers who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver. deceiver in the Antichrist. And first John, 1 John 2, he's describing how to how to figure out

if someone is a deceiver or not. When he says, children, it is the last hour. And as he heard that Antichrist is coming, so now many Antichrist have come. Therefore, we know that it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they were not of us. For if they had been of us,

they would have continued with us. And then in chapter 4, he says, Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the spirit of God. Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God. And every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God.

And I made the point with you the other night where, and actually I stole this from one of the practitioners in our Bible study, he made a great point where he's when Jesus looked at Peter and he said get behind me Satan he wasn't saying that Peter was Satan he was saying that you have the spirit of the Antichrist in you you know it's like you're get behind me get behind me evil spirit you know It's it's it's a very interesting and deep thing to dive into but kind of it's one of those things where we've said it over and over again on and I've heard you say it over and over again on this podcast is once you see it you just can't get around it

I mean, it's just, it's everywhere. And we're going to, that's one of my hopes, and we're going to see Jesus. Can you imagine? I mean, you're, yeah, you're going to take a good look at him. And that's 1st John 3. That's in between the two.

When he appears, you know, we will be like him. I never finished my story. You all want me to finish it or do we want to finish it? So look, third question, me and my wife, they asked who has been the most influential on your journey of the ripples of Jesus and they brought up my dad because they said well you mentioned your dad because I said I saw the transformation that happened in his life but I thought a little deeper and I said well of all the people that have been in my life I would have to say the biggest influence in my

growth and me finding my purpose in Christ is this woman sitting right next to me. Oh, boy. Pro move. And it was true because it hit me. You know, I've been with her, you know, almost two-thirds of my life at this point.

And the complementary completion aspect of God's design in marriage, it works, even though it's bumpy. and the struggles and all that process. And so, Al, when I did that, I could tell she was beaming and it never stopped. So for you young guys listening out there, get your notebooks out, get your pen, take notes on what's happening right now. That's a pro-moor, Jace. But look, but to Jay's defense, it's not like you make it up to say it.

You got to live at first. You got to. You got to live. It's got to make sense. And then, but when you can do that in a moment in public, I mean, that's the best. Jay's is right on to our... It was almost like a movie because the audience, I don't think they could understand my accent because we were way up north, you know.

I don't know, maybe it was an Irish thing. Or maybe they're not actually Irish. They're just called the Irish. Yeah. They're just northern America. They're not Irish. Well, a few of my jokes just absolutely bombed. and I did a duck call contest where this Q&A thing went,

and it was just a lot of bewilderment and looking like, I don't know if they didn't duck on or what. But Al, when I said that it was like cue the audience, and you heard a faint gas, like, oh. Hell yeah. Oh, yeah. And I thought, now this doesn't work. Right.

So it. There's a, I read a book a few years ago from a pastor out of Dallas, named Matt Chandler, and the book was called Mingling of Souls. And I was reading it because we were in college ministry at the time. And Reed, you came to the old college ministry. And they were all dating people. And I was trying to like, hey, this is how you need to date. So I was reading that book.

And he said something in there that stuck with me all these years later. He said, when you get married, he said, it's like driving a Mack truck through your life. But he said, it is God's greatest tool. for sanctification on planet Earth. And so I think that I would say the same thing, Jay's, because it is like, you get married, it's like, man, this, I don't know any other thing that God has given me

that has sanctified me. Having kids too, right mentioned that on the podcast too, but starting a family, it is the greatest vehicle of sanctification that God can give us. It really, I mean, it's...

And my dad says that about me all the time. He says, that's why he loves my wife so much. It's because when I married her, she made me a much better person. I mean, it just, I was sanctified. Because I started looking around like, what am I doing with her? You know, I mean, she's way, I mean, I, it was like this insecurity of like, hey, I need to step up my game here. Because this woman here is way on another level.

And we all agree. We all agree. But Reed, but Reid, your wife on the podcast, on our podcast, when we were in Nashville, the vulnerability. and transparency that she shared because like we've all viewed her like you just described, but then her sharing her own shortcomings and how she found Christ in a deeper way through you guys in your marriage and relationship through the process was, I mean, it shows you what the ultimate strength is. And Jay's mentioned earlier.

It's the bumps and the difficulties along the way. And that's where these growth periods, that's where they come in our life, is usually through going through something difficult and a realization that without Christ being at the center fully, we're missing something. And it starts as an individual, but then it quickly spreads as a couple. So you know, you guys, you know, figure some things out much earlier than a lot of other people do and are still working through the process and still will deal with things. But that's the beauty of what marriage can be. I mean, it really is, I mean, the idea of two, together, one plus one equals one with Jesus is really a powerful concept.

Well, Reed, I got news for you. She's made me a better person. Your wife has become one of my good friends, oddly enough. And, oh, boy, she's such a treat. She said something funny the other day. I was talking to you on the phone, Dad. And you said, ask her if she's still been listening to the podcast. She chimed in from the other room.

Oh, he's insecure because I hadn't texted it in a while. The podcast. Well, there's a few people I'll come up there and I was like, how are we doing? You know, because I know she listens all the time. It's because of the many rabbit holes. Well, look, so let me steer us back into John 18 because actually what we've been talking about, kind of this extended cold open with a surprise read. Audience, we didn't, Jason and I had no idea where he was going to be on the podcast today.

So that's, and Zach was going to get us because we were griping and complaining about him being late. but now I see it was so he could set up for read. So that's a pretty good move there, Zach. Apology accepted. That was my version. Well, we were trying to kick you out, and now you worked your way back in. So all good. He brought in one of our favorite people.

So we're at the crux read in our study in John 1828, where just what we've been talking about is, is what it is what is at hand in these sort of series of trials against Jesus. And just for me to reset for the audience, then I don't want to read this next section because we're about to go into the pilot section, which to me, John covers it the most extensively because it's probably the most interesting part of all these trials. Because we kind of expect the first one, Ms. Anas, which is kind of the godfather of the,

I don't know what you call it, the Jewish crime family. They were very corrupt. The high priesthood was corrupt. His son-in-law, Kaifas, he went to his house. Again, more illegal way of trying Jesus. Then they moved into the Sanhedron, which had an error now because it's daybreak. And it has an error that it's something legit. But we read that, J.

said that last time from Matthew. It's not legit. They don't have witnesses. It's not exactly as it's supposed to be. And then during that process, Peter denies him three times, which Jesus has predicted is going to happen. And so now in verse 28, they're turning him over to Pilate. And so we explain part of the reason why. It's because they want him dead, but they don't want to take responsibility of it.

So they're trying to turn it over and make it the Romans business to kill him. Because, you know, they kill John the Baptist. Later on, they're going to kill Stephen. So they have some rights, even though they tell Pilate later they lie. say they can't execute anybody. They rescue people all the time. They just don't want to take responsibility because the people are with Jesus. So that's what this is.

It's just another ruse, which we've been talking about the entire time. So we get to verse 28 and John says this, then the Jews led Jesus from Caiaphas, he'd been at the Sanhedron, to the palace of the Roman governor. So now they're going to turn him over to the big ruling government. by now was early morning, and to avoid ceremonial uncleannliness or uncleanness, the Jews did not enter the palace. They wanted to be able to eat the Passover. And someone in my studies made mention there that John puts this in there probably, because here they are participating in an evil cover-up murder scheme, but they're so aware of their little pious sanctity that they can't go in the house of a Gentile.

why they're doing it, which shows you how corrupt they are. Verse 29. So Pilate came out to them and asked, what charges are you bringing against this man? Which, of course, is what you would ask. But listen to their answer. If he were not a criminal, they replied, we would not have handed him over to you.

So this is one of those things where you give somebody what they ask you back with no real answer. That's not an answer. So Pilate says, we'll take him yourselves, judging by your own law. See, he's telling him. you have the right to do this under your own system. But we have no right to execute anyone the Jews objected,

which is not true. That's just a ball-faced lie. This happened so that the words Jesus had spoken indicating the kind of death he was going to die would be fulfilled. So again, this is all part of the greater narrative and plan. Verse 33. Pilate then went back inside the palace, summoned Jesus, and asked him, are you the king of the Jews? And we talked about that phrase quite a bit.

And then Jesus says, is that your own idea? Or did others talk to you about me? And then Pilate kind of comes back incredulous. Am I a Jew? Piler replied, it was your people and your chief priest who handed you over to me. What is it you have done? Jesus says, my kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jews.

but now my kingdom is from another place. We've already talked about that some as well. Then he says, you are a king then, said Pilate. Jesus answered, you are right in saying, I'm a king. In fact, for this reason I was born and for this reason I came into the world to testify to the truth. Everyone on the side of truth listens to me. And then Pilate asked the question that kind of hangs through time, what is truth?

Piladas. With this, he went out again to the Jews and said, I find no basis for a charge against him. And I want to stop here because there's a little bit of an interlude that's going to happen here in the narrative of the story because it's at this point when he's going to get turned over to Herod, which we're going to read about in another one of the Gospels, and then he's going to come back to this point, and then we're going to get the second half of this. But I love this narrative that now he's before Pallet. And Pallet basically says at the end of his, this first part of the trial for him, I find no basis of a charge against this man. What he's saying is, as far as I'm concerned, and the state of Rome is concerned, he's innocent. And of course, he was innocent. This is the,

this is the thing that kind of hangs over the whole proceeding is that this is an innocent man brought now before four different ruling councils, and there's still another one to go, and he's still innocent, which is amazing. Well, the interesting thing about this passage and how it is coming together with a lot of what we just talked about, you've got to keep in mind, Jesus is at this moment. He has been handed over, he's been handed over to the chief priest, the corrupt Jewish rulers of the time. they in turn get the world's greatest superpower involved, the Roman Empire.

So now Jesus is standing before the Roman Empire in Pilate, and if you think of it this way, that you have two competing kingdoms going on here. You have the kingdom of God is in Jesus, and it's coming against the kingdom of Israel and the kingdom of the Roman Empire, which at that particular time was, incredibly powerful. How you and I went to Rome, we actually filmed a lot of scenes there.

And just looking at the ruins of the Roman Empire, if you were to go to Rome and see just the ruins, you would be like, this place was absolutely incredible. Like to think about how powerful the Roman Empire would have been in comparison to the rest of the world at this particular point in history, I don't think we can fully understand it because they were so advanced in their engineering compared to the rest of the world. it would have been, one of the guys that was with us was like, you can imagine some guy from a mud hut showing up on the scene from Africa. And he's in the Roman Empire. He's looking around, and they're telling you Caesar's God. And you can really kind of understand why he may have been like, okay, I can buy that because they were so far advanced. And now Jesus is coming up against this kingdom,

and he says, my kingdom is not of this world. And I think this goes right back to this passage in Daniel chapter two that I mentioned earlier because what's happening in Daniel two is you see that statue of different empires and the last empire is represented in the feet of the statue which were made of two types of material one was iron and the other was clay and the reason why that's indicative of the Roman Empire is because the Roman Empire was mixed it wasn't it wasn't homogenous it was a lot of different other kingdoms and territories that they had conquered that had been mixed in with the iron of Rome. So it's an iron and a clay. And so when you read in Daniel chapter 2, and it has everything to do with the kingdom, by the way,

because in Daniel 234, it says, as you look, a stone, a stone was cut out by no human hand. and it struck the image on the feet of iron and clay and broke them in the pieces. Then the iron and the clay and the bronze and the silver and all the gold all together were broken into pieces and became like the chaff of the summer thresholding floors. And the wind carried them away so that not a trace of them could be found. But the stone that struck the image became a great mountain and filled the whole earth. And then if you skip down a little bit in verse 44, it says, and in those days, what days, the days when all this is going to happen,

of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that shall never be destroyed, nor shall that kingdom be left to another people. It shall break into pieces all the kingdoms and bring them to an end, and it shall stand forever, just as you saw that the stone that was cut from the mountain by no human hand, and it brought into pieces, the iron, the bronze, the clay, the silver, the gold. A great God is made known to the king's, what shall be after this? This dream is certain, and its interpretation is sure. So what you're seeing here in John chapter 18, as Jesus stands before the might of the Roman Empire, what you're seeing is that the king has finally arrived.

When he says, are you a king? I don't think Pilate understands that question, but Jesus is answering that in a very profound way. Or he doesn't care. I mean, that's what's so interesting. I mean, just a very interesting thing when you read this is that Pilot almost has this aura of just this, he's just this pompous like, what do I care? You know, and he kind of, he says, what is truth? You know, it's like, it doesn't matter to him. You know, I mean, whether you want to dive into what that means to be a career politician

in the world's empire. And, I mean, that guy, he has no morality or truth. or, I mean, he's just like, whatever gets me to the top kind of. It just kind of paints this picture in my head. But he's like, I don't care. What is truth? Well, he goes back and he says, look, I mean, I don't find any basis to kill this guy. I mean, he's just, he's got his opinion.

What do I care about it? And it's just so interesting to see that the same people that are pleading the case of kill this man are the same people that could recite you, Daniel, and tell you every single one of those things and what they mean in great detail. And now here he is fulfilling it. And they're like terrified of the Roman Empire. They're terrified of that statue and what it represents that it's just going to squash them in a minute. You make it such a good point because, you know, when Peter stood up and preached that first sermon, he didn't say, and Pilate killed, you know, Jesus. He said, and you, talking about the people. Right. With, you know,

with the help of wicked men, with the help of Midlight Pilate. You're the one. You're the ones that put him to death on the cross. And so he, he went right back to what you're saying, Reed. They knew better. Pyle is just this curious guy who happens to be trying to keep the peace in this one place. Do you know what's in the, do you know what's in the Coliseum in Rome, which was the epicenter of Roman Empire and particularly later became oppression against Christianity? Do you know it's in, I think that it's in the dead center of the Coliseum? It's a cross. I know. It's a cross. It's the cross of Jesus now. Like, like the, the, emblem is in the Coliseum, you think, well, well, did that Daniel II prophecy ever come true?

Did Jesus really crush the Roman Empire? Well, go to the Coliseum, look at the ruins, and look at what the whole thing is centered around now. The cross of Jesus. You tell me he didn't conquer Rome. The prophecy came true, and his kingdom now reigns. Pretty powerful. And whatever happened to Pilate? Nobody knows.

He disappeared two years later. What about that pilot guy? I think the most misunderstood, one of the most misunderstood verses is what Jesus actually said there. You know, it's like, oh, he brings up this kingdom. It's from another place. And I think for years, a lot of religious people have detached that as it has nothing to do with here. So, you know, what I did was I went back to the beginning. I mean, this, because you think, well, how long has Jesus technically been king?

What would be your answer? How long has Jesus been king of the earth? Since he formed it. Yeah. All things are created for him and by him. It's all right. Right answer. And how long will he be king, which is a more difficult thing to answer?

Because you're like, well, to the end. But technically, there is no way. How he validated him being king by coming back from the dead, yeah, there's no end. But now if he would have said that, like some form of John 1 in the beginning was the Word, you know, and the Word was with God. That's me, Paul. I've been with God from before the beginning. Before the foundations of the world.

And then some. In fact, not only that, he was also crucified. It says, before the foundations. the world. Think about that. What does that mean? So I think that it's just confusing for people because, I mean, the first words that Mark recorded that Jesus said in his letter, the first time Jesus speaks, this is Mark 1.15,

the time has come, the kingdom of God is at hand. repent and believe the good news. Well, what's he talking about? I mean, you know, we're fast forwarding here to John 18, and all of a sudden he's like, my kingdom is not of this world, which I think Pilate wasn't reading a whole lot into that other than he was like, well, if you have a kingdom,

that means you must be claiming to be a king, which actually would be some kind of grounds for legalities being approached upon, you know? So what I wanted to do, I mean, I went all the way back just to see how we got here. But you remember in his prayer, if I just go to Matthew's version, where he says this prayer. And he's like in Matthew 6, verse 9, when he's teaching him out of praise, like our Father in heaven, how it be your name, your kingdom come, your will be done on earth as it is in heaven. And when you get to verse 13 at the final words of the prayer in some of the later manuscripts,

there's an additional phrase where it says, and lead us not into temptation but deliver us from the evil one. Well, some of the later manuscripts of the Bible, and you should have a little letter right after evil one. and it says for yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever and you're like well why was he introducing this concept in the prayer well it goes deeper than that when you when you go back to what john the baptist was saying remember in chapter three of matthew in verse two he's going around this is before jesus and he's saying repent for the kingdom of heaven

is near. Then when Jesus comes along the scene, he says the same thing. Where is that at? In 417, from that time on, Jesus began to preach, repent for the kingdom of heaven is near. Of course, then in this prayer, what does he mean that your kingdom come on earth as it is in heaven? What does he mean that yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory of forever? Why is he bringing this up to Pilate when he's fixed to die, saying, my kingdom is not from this place? I mean, what are y'all's answer to them? Well, the first thing I would say is, let's identify what Jesus did not say,

which is how I think we often interpret it. He did not say my kingdom is not in this world. What he said is my kingdom is not of this world, or my kingdom is not from this world. which the very nature of that statement is that his kingdom is in the world because he's saying it's here, but it's not from here. And that's a key distinction of what he's not saying. So it's such a good point because what's happening here is there's about to be a crucifixion of a body. So the God incarnate is in a body now. He's on planet Earth. He's actually in the world now.

The word actually became flesh. And now that flesh is going to get crucified on a cross, but there's going to be a vindication in the resurrection. So I think that actually what he's testifying to here is not that this world doesn't matter. It's not that he's actually saying that the kingdom of God has now invaded the planet. And it's going to actually expand across the entire cosmos in Jesus. That's so good, Zach. And Jace, I love that you brought up the prayer because I was thinking when I read it the same thing, but I was at the prayer in John 17. Because look what he says.

He says, for this reason, I was born and came into the world to testify to the truth. Remember when he started that prayer and he started out with I and the Father one? And then the next thing he prayed for was the disciples. Everyone on the side of truth, he said, listens to me. So that's more testimony that comes from those who are with him. And they remember the last segment of the prayer. It was to the world. He said, the world has to believe.

And so look at the last part of this. Pilate says, what is truth? And so here's someone from the world saying, I don't even know what you're talking about. And like Reed said, this is from his mindset, it doesn't even matter. But it does matter because in 300 years, all of Rome is going to understand and convert to Christianity from this moment. So you're seeing that prayer live itself out from John 17, Jays, as well as you are the one about, you know, for that kingdom. come. Yeah, it just wouldn't have mattered. It wouldn't have mattered to him because what Jesus could have said is, well, I am truth. You know, like in chapter, the end of chapter 15 in John when he says,

but when the helper comes whom I will send to you from the father, the spirit of what truth who proceeds from, who proceeds from the father, he will bear witness about me and to your point, dad, and you will also bear witness because you have been with me from the beginning. And in, in chapter 17, I glorified you on earth, having accomplished the work that you gave me to do. And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed. It was pretty powerful. It shows the whole picture.

All right, look, we're out of time. Well, this is to be continued anyway, because I just got started. All right. Well, then us to be continued. All right. To be continued. Reed, can you hang around and go through another podcast? We'll have to do another because you can't get all your points with three Robertsons and the Dasher in one podcast.

That's true. I love it. We're glad to have read along with the journey today. We'll pick this up next time, which for us will be in five minutes on the Unashamed podcast. Thanks for listening to The Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcast. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click the little bell and choose all-nashamed. notifications to watch every episode.