Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 1234 | Jase’s Road-Trip Breakdown Begins With Just One Innocent Question

Episode Date: December 22, 2025

Jase hijacks an eight-hour road trip with a nonstop deep dive sparked by one simple question, and Al reveals the surprising and touching secret hidden in the walls of his home for decades. The guys unpack how ordinary people become the place where heaven and earth meet, why forgiveness is spiritual warfare, and why anointing still carries real power. The guys close with a prayer for Zach and for listeners facing illness. In this episode: 2 Peter 1, verses 3–4; James 5, verses 13–16; First John 2, verses 18–29; John 13, verse 35; John 14, verses 26–27; John 15, verses 26–27; John 16, verses 7–15; John 17, verses 20–26; John 20, verses 19–23; Genesis 28, verses 10–22; Exodus 30, verses 22–33; Isaiah 11, verses 1–10; Isaiah 42, verses 1–9; Isaiah 53, verses 1–12; Matthew 1, verse 18; Matthew 16, verses 13–20; Mark 1, verses 9–15; Ephesians 2, verses 19–22; Psalm 2, verses 1–12; Psalm 3, verses 1–8; Psalm 20, verses 1–9; Psalm 21, verses 1–13; Psalm 22, verses 1–31; Psalm 51, verses 1–19 Chapters: 00:00-07:31 Jase holds an 8 hour Bible study 07:32-17:15 How to “participate in the divine nature” 17:16-26:31 What does it mean to be anointed?  26:32-35:30 Believers are a portal between worlds 35:31-48:45 Arming ourselves for a spiritual battle 48:46-56:38 A prayer of anointing for the sick — Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashamed. I'm down here at the Southern Lair. Jase is there in the studio, and Zach is still sick. We're not sure what's going on with him. He is. But I have a get well thought for Zach. And it's actually a Bible study that goes in. with where we're at in John 20. And it was kind of due to events outside my control. I've had two Bible studies this week,

but they were kind of on the same theme line. And it applies to Zach's condition because at this point, since Zach is down for multiple podcasts due to illness, there's an obscure verse in the book of James. I don't know where that is off the top of my hand. head. I know it's in the last chapter where, and look, it's, it's kind of a, it's kind of a lightning rod for a

particular face, but Zach may be, he may need to read this. So this is James 5, and it says, you know, if any of you is in trouble, this is 13. 13, yeah. Yeah. He should pray. Is anyone happy? Let him sing songs of praise.

Is any of you sick? This is verse 14. He should call the elders of the church to pray over him and anoint him with all in the name of the Lord. And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well. The Lord will raise him up. If he has sinned, he will be forgiven. Boy, there's a lot of goodies. Maybe there's some sin going on.

that oh, Zachary needs to come clean on it. I hadn't even thought about that. No, we're kidding on that. But it is an obscure verse that this custom of anointing oil, so I got asked about this in the Bible study a couple of them I had. The first one was about participation in the divine nature. So one of the guys I went to Kansas with, he was teaching a class, and he said, I've got a question for you.

Because interesting enough, the last time I went to Kansas, I took the same fellow. It was the first time he'd ever gone. We called him the nurseman. But Al, we went to Kansas, and it was the first time that I had an eight-hour Bible study with a human being. Yeah. The whole... Because you're on the road, right? So what else are you going to do?

We got in the vehicle. He asked me a biblical question, and eight hours later... The only pauses, the only intermissions is when we had to stop and get gas or whatever. Then we got back in the truck, and it was right back to the Bible study. I was like, I don't know if I've ever had an eight-hour Bible study on the road, but it actually made the time pass by. And he's a, he, a nurseman is, he's a real sharp guy and a leader in his church. Oh, he is. Yeah, yeah.

So he asked me this time, because I think he was going off the last time we got in a vehicle together, it was eight hours. So he's like, well, I'm ready to crank it up again. I have a question. And he brought up 2. Peter 1, where it says his divine power has given us everything we need for life and godliness through our knowledge of him who called us by his own glory and goodness. Through these he has given us these his very great and precious promises. So here's where the question came up, this next phrase. so that through them, the promises that God has given us, so that through them, you may participate in the divine nature.

And so what happened was he was teaching a class at his church. And somebody, you know, they, as I do when I sometimes teach classes, I'll say, does anybody have any questions? Which is a dangerous thing to do. Because what if someone asks you a question, that you're like, huh. So someone basically asked, what does it mean the word may?

You may participate in the divine nature. And so he said, I gave an answer, but he was like, look, I'm a medical professional. I have a job. You know,

I'm teaching this. I studied the Bible, but I wasn't ready for a theological question about what does that mean? So he's like, I would like for you to share what that means. And then I can, then I won't tell you what I said, but I just want to compare what you're fixing to say off the top of your head to what I said.

Off the top of his head. Yeah. So look, now here's the difference. He has answered a question in a minute. And my answer took three hours. I'm not shocked. I'm not shocked. Oh, Jay Stone was driving.

He was like, well, never seen a question ask that took three hours to explain. You realize your answer, Jays, took as long as Gilligan's Island's whole show set up, a three hour or two. So after I got finished, I said, well, what about your answer? And he said, I missed it. and I'm going to teach this Sunday and clarify and amend my answer. He's like, he may have the longest Bible class in the history of Sunday schools this week. And look, I want for clarification, who am I?

I'm not a scholar. But before you continue, Jay, let me give a quick shout out to our good friends at FRC. They're people of truth like we are, our family research council. They're based up in Washington, D.C. And we know there's a lot of division going on. And this actually discussion shows a lot of what it's about.

People who have the Spirit of God understand truth and how that shapes your life. But people that don't, they don't get it. And yet we're still trying to create a country that we can live in that's not so divided and so violent. So our good friends at Family Research Council stand firm, they defend faith, family, and freedom on the front lines right there in D.C., but they can't do it alone. they need us to go shoulder to shoulder to be able to set this up for generations to come. So we want you to check them out. Give today at FRC.org slash Unashamed.

He was just saying I should have dug a little deeper into that. But I think it is a good question. And it kind of ties in, believe it or not. Tell me the verse again because I missed it when you said. Second Peter 1 in verse 4. What does it mean to participate? in the divine nature. And so I think that's a good question.

And I'll tell you where I went, because I'm studying in the book of John, obviously for the past few months. We've been doing this. And I went to John 17, but I want to tie this into another Bible study. So when I get back from Kansas, that was on the way to Kansas,

the guy who I was with in Kansas duck hunting, when we got there, We basically, he said, how was the trip? And I said, well, we spent three hours talking about participating in the divine nature. And so, well, then that triggered questions from him. Well, what exactly, what is the answer to that? That's a good question. And so we had a cameraman there who then got caught up in the discussion, and he started asking questions.

And this is what happens, I think, when you talk about things. in the Bible in a public way because, let's face it, human beings are searching for the answers to these questions. And Jays, it also highlights something you noticed that I had never noticed until we did the John study this time is how many questions Jesus asked. So it shows you that questions are the way to go to dig deep. I mean, and Jesus was the master of it, right? So this fellow that we're hunting with in Kansas, one of my best friends, he asked me a question when we got back.

He just sent a text. It was at like 5.30 in the morning. He was like, are you rolling? Which means because he thought it was duck season down here, but we're during the split. But I happened to be up, and believe it or not, I would study in my Bible. And I was like, oh, yeah, I'm rolling. What you got? So he called me, and he's like, look, I'm studying 1st John 2 today.

I have a question. What is this anointing about? And so I, now, I had not studied that, but since we're going to the book of 1st John. That's where we're headed. And I was familiar with the text, but I haven't done a deep dive. And so basically we did it together, which was a couple of hours we spent having long Bible studies about it. this and that is in 1 John 2 when it it brings up this the idea of the Antichrist and then it says in verse 30 and look just to give you the background

here there were some some false teachers that were infiltrating people who are following Jesus and he's kind of given an argument for how you can identify these false teachers or Antichrist. And he actually brings that up again in 1st John 4. And look, I know I'm going through this fast, but we're fixing to study in the new year, the book of 1st John. So this will be a good teaser for you.

And Jace is right. We'll get into this. But the whole backdrop of what John was dealing with in these three letters was this idea that had risen up now because a lot of time has passed since he was here that he really wasn't a human being. Like he had no earthly qualities. That was this false teaching that kept coming.

It's called narcissism, which we'll get into it. Yeah, well, I'm glad you said that. I'll go ahead and read the first John 4-3 since you brought that up, and you kind of clarified it. But 1-John 4-2 before I read the 1-John 2, and you'll see how all this is going to come together. First John 4-2 says, this is how you can recognize the spirit of God.

Now, just think about he spent three chapters, which is what I told my friend from Kansas. I was like, before we get into whatever this anointing is, you've got to realize this is the same John that we have 21 chapters of about the life of Jesus. And within those 21 chapters, he spent, he devoted three chapters to, promising the Holy Spirit that would be in you forever, the Spirit of truth.

That's John 14 in a verse, what is that, about 6 through 10, somewhere in there. And so now fast forward to 1 John with that as the backdrop. So I said, whatever this anointing means, and we know that it has something to do with the Holy Spirit at this stage, I said, I recommend that before we have this discussion, you need to read John 14, 15, and 16. the whole chapters, because that's what it's about. He's promising this counselor, this comforter, the Spirit of Truth. So when 1 John 4-2, it says, this is how you can recognize the Spirit of God.

Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God. but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard is coming, and even now is already in the world. And so they were having a problem with this. People were saying, oh, no, Jesus, a human can't be God. And John rightfully ties it in with having the spirit, which John 1426 is a very good,

verse to connect all these dots before I read 1st John 2 because I'll read it first. And this is something me and my buddy actually came up with as we were studying. John 1426 says, I'll read 25 and 26. All this I have spoken while still with you, but the counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all. things and remind you of everything I have said to you. And by the way, the next verse says, peace I leave with you, my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid. And the reason I'm reading that, because now we're in

John 20. And twice, Jesus as a resurrected human, brings up people. peace. He's like, Pete, when he enters the room, though the doors were a lot, what does he say? You know, peace. Peace. And then Thomas. Yeah, yeah. And then Thomas comes up.

So to get back to the 1st John 2 and the question that was asked and what this has to do with the an anointing of oil for Zach, all this is going to come together here. First John 2, verse 20 says, but you have an anointing from the Holy One. and all of you know the truth. I do not write to you because you do not know the truth, but because you do know it, and because no lie comes from the truth. Who is the liar? It is the man who denies that Jesus is the Christ.

Such a man is the antichrist. He denies the father and the son. No one who denies the son has the father who have acknowledged the son. has the father. So that's kind of what we were talking about. But then he goes on to say, where does he bring up the anointing? Yeah, in verse 26. I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray. As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you. And you do not need anyone to teach you. That's why I read the John 1426. But as his anointing teaches you

about all things, and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit, just as it has taught you, remain in him. And then he gets into us being the children of God and being unashamed, which is the name of our podcast. That's in verse 28. It says, Dear Children, continue in him so that when he appears we may be confident and unashamed before him at his coming. And he also repeats the themes that he had strong in the book of John.

I'm thinking John 13 and some other texts about how you know each other by your love for each other. And those are the things you see the fruit of the spirit come out. And Jesus talked a lot about it. And then John's going to revisit that as well. So there's this idea of family being introduced. And you say, well, what does that have to do with the anointing, you know, putting oil on someone when you pray? And the reason I wanted to discuss these three passages as one is because when you look at that English word, anointing in 1st John 2 and look it up, well, it means the same idea of this anointing, smearing someone with all.

And it's called the anointing one. So, but what you got to realize is when you see Jesus Christ, that's not his name as far as the Christ part. That means the Anointed One. That's a title. Now, in the Hebrew scriptures, the Old Testament, that word is Messiah, which means the anointed one. So here you have this title with Jesus and his promise.

of anointing us with His Spirit in John 14, John 15, John 16. You said, what does that got to do with participating in the divine nature? So what I told my friend, I was like, and in answer of the question of participating in the divine nature, when you read Jesus' prayer, which we did when we went through John earlier, and he brings up this idea of, I'm going to have my glory, the glory that I have, had in your presence before the world began? That's John 17, 4. And then he gets to the back end of this prayer and talks about our anointing,

after he's talked about the Holy Spirit being poured out and being in you in John 14, 15, and 16. He then says, verse 24 of John 17 in his prayer, and I know we've gone. through this, but just to remind you, I want those you have given me to be with me where I am, and to see my glory. The glory you have given me because you love me before the creation of the world. Righteous Father, though the world does not know you, I know you, and they know that you have sent me. I have made you known to them, and you will continue to make you known, and will continue to make you known, and will continue to make you known.

in order that the love you have for me may be in them and that I myself may be in them. So there's your short answer for what does it mean to participate in the divine nature. God through Jesus and the point out of the Holy Spirit has invited us in to participate in the divine nature and experience this love that they had before the beginning of time. which is why my buddy said, I think I missed that. Because whatever the answer was, he never did tell me. He was like, I didn't go that deep and that personal in what we're a part of here. But what it made me do is do a deep dive on this anointing and look at the history of that.

And I found a good resource for this. And I'm going to apologize right off the bat. this thing I listened to was done by the Bible project, Tim Mackey and those guys, and it was a six-part series on the anointing, what we're talking about here. And it basically went through the Hebrew history of what that meant.

And the people that were anointed, the places that were anointed, and how this transitioned into Jesus being called the Anointed One, And then fast forward to us, people who surrender to Jesus, being anointed through the spirit. And so I didn't listen to every detail of it, but I kind of skimmed through the six hours of it and then just launched into my own Bible study on it. So I kind of wanted to bring that up in light of what I read.

Because when you think, well, there's one obscure passage here talking about taking oil, which is what they did. There was actually a recipe for it in Exodus for when you anoint all. But when you look at the people who were anointed with all and why this was so, it was specially commissioned people

like one person for the good of the many, which is basically what Jesus did as the anointed Christ, the son of God in human form. And so you can go through all those rabbit holes, but what you'll find is it was either a priest, a king, or a prophet, which Jesus would represent all three. Yeah, all three. So when you look at the anointing with all, it would be one of those three. And you say, well, what, and I wrote this down on kind of what the reason

those three were anointed for their special project from God. So when you think priest, it's they were all about representing the presence of God, kings, the power of God, and the prophets being the purpose of God, which is to declare, you know, his word. The point I want to make, though, is when I said the places were anointed, and I found this really interesting, and I wanted to bring this all the way around to prayer. In Genesis 28, you remember in John, Where was that with Nathaniel? Chapter 1 at the end? Or was that Chapter 2? It was Chapter 1 at the end of Chapter 1.

It's funny because I was doing a dive back in because Nathaniel's going to pop up again in John 21. So I thought, oh, there's a little Nathaniel. I hadn't seen him since John 1. It's in 43. Yeah, so here's the fascinating thing about this, Al. I didn't really, I guess I read over this when I read the Jacob's Ladder story in Genesis 28. And remember, he had this dream and there's this stairway to heaven. And, well, he takes this rock, calls it House of God, and anoints the rocks with all.

Yeah. And you're like, why is he doing that? Well, what I found fascinating through all this and the other place that's anointed is the tabernacle. and so now we're having the presence of God. Well, what are those two stories? The only two that I could find where an actual place was anointed with all. Well, you see what they represent. It's where heaven and earth come together.

And when you tie that in to the prophets, priests, and there's only one prophet that was anointed. There's multiple of the kings. think Saul and David, and actually in the Bible project, they made a point that at the same time you had these two kings, Saul and David, being anointed and all the conflict there. And he kind of made a picture of this anti-annointing versus the true anointing because Saul didn't do so well.

And then David obviously did better. Well, Saul wasn't God's choice. David was. and even the way he was anointed. I mean, they didn't even call him in out of the fields. And like Samuel goes through the whole line. It's like, was there anybody else? And they're like, well, we got the little shepherd out there.

And so we're bringing him in. And so that's what happened. Yeah, well, and the Bible project made a pretty good point about that. Because when you fast forward that here comes Jesus in the line of David. And they're like, well, Jesus was never anointed with all. well you think well how was he anointed to declare for this one to now represent heaven and for the good of the many well he went to his baptism which was kind of a private thing because because in all these cases of this anointing with all with the prophet priests and kings you you then have the holy spirit all of a sudden coming in being poured out on them in these instances, like this is from God.

And so when Jesus was baptized, and now you have this anointing kind of like in a verb form, because God, the Father, declares who he is, this is my son, whom I love, I'm well pleased. And now the Spirit comes on him and in him to do this kind of ministry, which is a preview, I think, of what's going to happen. to us going through kind of this water spirit idea, which I didn't realize, I think they did a good job in the recipe of the oil that's being poured out in Exodus. It all traces its roots back to the garden of Eden, where you have water, you know, giving life to the land. Remember, it came from the deep and it's water and all the crops.

and then you have the Spirit of God, enabling, and all these oils from these plants are representative of life. And I just thought it was absolutely fascinating as I went through this, as it was tied to the spirit, which is why I wanted to talk about it. That was kind of the gist of it, but when you fast forward to 1 John 2, and you said, what's this annoying about in God giving us his spirit, we become this same kind of portal, this bridge to heaven and earth, as a reality now. And so even in the James 5, where you're literally using the earthly symbolic of the oil, which is what it was, even in the Old Testament, it was symbolic of something greater that heaven's going to work through these earthly men in ways.

of God. And, but you're still looking at it, uh, in prayer as that portal being open. And so I told the story on, uh, when we had Missy on, when we kind of did a little Christmas episode of, you know, here's this guy, he bumps into Uncle Si of all people. And he's like, well, you pray for me because, you know, he has, he has cancer. And all of a sudden, he's healed. And he's attributed to that, that prayer, but for a believer in the, and the, that Si has the Holy Spirit of God, and he's praying on behalf, and this is the kind of things that

happen. I mean, the portal is open to heaven to believers who are in Jesus. Which, by the way, Jay, is we still at our church at WFR, and we've been doing this as long as I've worked there, which is now over 30 years as a leader, we have, we practiced this passage, and the main reason we did it, I remember, because I was back then, I was just preaching. I wasn't an elder, but someone asked us, they were like, do you guys do this? Do you know, though? And everybody kind of looked at each other and nobody had. And we're like, why wouldn't we?

Because we're spirit-filled men who pray for people. Why wouldn't we annoy it? And so if someone requests to be anointed with oil and to have prayer of our leadership, of our church, we do it, whether it's publicly, privately, whatever. We just did it like a week ago with a woman who's having some real severe back pain. And she was like, I want to be anointed with oil because I'm asking for healing. and I believe this verse. So just as a practical measure,

we've been doing our church for many, many years and seeing amazing things happen as a result. Well, I just thought it was an interesting study about participating in the divine nature. And when you think about prayer and this access that we have to God and representing heaven on earth and with the history of what the anointing of all was,

and I recommend going through that study, it'll really make you think. But I feel like, man, I'd kind of miss that. It's a rabbit hole I'd never gone down. And I'd never really combined it with the first creation and this liquid becoming life through the spirit. And now we have the new creation. Jesus being raised from the dead.

He pours out his spirit. It just changed the way I read John 20. After, you know, when you think John 14 through 16, the Holy Spirit he's promising. And then in 17, he has this prayer about this participating in the divine nature and heaven and earth coming together. And then in John 20, there's this purpose aspect of he's choosing each individual and these profound things are being said that's different than what they,

that he was referring to him. And we talked about this before. He was just calling his followers, disciples, and how else would he do? Friends. Servants, friends. And now all of a sudden he tells Mary Magdalene, who just crops up here in the book of John after she hadn't been mentioned in the whole book. And he's like, go tell my brothers that I've been raised.

I'm returning to my father and your father, to my God and your God. All of a sudden, yeah, it's the children of God that he's speaking of in 1st John 3. And look, and the other thing that's different, because this all resonates when you go back to John 1, in the beginning was a word, word was with God, he's going back to that beginning. John 17, he's recording that prayer. I'm passing this love on to you, the very love that we had before the beginning of creation. And so then when he gets to First John, what's interesting is that first little paragraph in First John, he goes from him to that.

He's called him an it because we're at the place in John 20 here where it's like you're going through this story. I mean, think of like if you're watching a movie and you're seeing Jesus and he's an interesting fellow and he's making all these claims and all of a sudden, he dies and you're like well you know that's that's that and then he comes back i mean if you were watching this and you had never heard anything about the story of the bible you're like oh wait a minute now the guy was dead and now he's coming back to life this is just unbelievable which is why thomas was like i'm going to have to see this and now you realize that oh going back to my movie illustration, the person who wrote this movie has now entered the movie and turned it upside down.

It's like, not only are we going a different direction, I'm going to die and come back to life. And it's like, I'm the person who created all this and I became a human. They kill me. And now I'm back to life. It's just all of a sudden, you're like, well, this is not realistic. This is crazy. Well, and think about it, Jay's, the biggest problem, it appears to me, and we'll talk about this when we get to 1st, 2nd, 3rd John, is that now that some years have passed and the resurrected

king left here, and so he's not present on earth, but we know he's raining and we know the kingdom is here. But now all of a sudden, with him not being on site, there are all this doctrinal, you know, false teaching comes up. Well, he really wasn't a human anyway then. I mean, obviously, you know, if he were the true Messiah, if he were the true anointing, well, he would be here, you know, and he would be a king here. We still wouldn't be under Roman oppression, and we blah, blah, blah. So you can understand why this even probably cropped up. It's because they never understood the nature of what Jesus came to do.

And they certainly didn't understand the Holy Spirit. And now when you look at the transformation that they have in that little verse in John 20, where he breathed on them the Holy Spirit. Yeah. And it's kind of like this little private ceremony that Jesus had when he was baptized and the Holy Spirit came on him. All of a sudden, it had this public consequence of changing the world. And these guys go through that same kind of process.

And the Bible calls that an an anointing. it's heaven and earth coming together and you become as human beings who have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit portals for making this happen. So it's like the next time you see someone being anointed with all, there's way more going on here. Don't get hung up on the symbolic language, but that's why James put it in there. That's right. This is a, think the Jacobs ladder. Why did he anoint that place, those rocks with all?

Because, I mean, they're rocks. Because he was making a symbolic gesture that God was there. This is the house of God. And so I think when you fast forward that to us being turned, the household of God, and we're the living stones and all these things because the Spirit, think those last two verses in Ephesians 2. I mean, it kind of gets on you. like in a powerful way.

You know, we, it's funny, Jay's because I don't know if I've ever told the story on the podcast, but when we were, I was working for the church and we were living in West Monroe. And we had built our first house, this is a little bitty house and very tiny. But we had our big house church in there and just, it was man, rocking and ministry was awesome. And then we got an opportunity to build a bigger house out in Calhoun because Mack owned some land out there. And so several of us from the church, there's several of them that still are out there on,

on this street across from Gobwin and Paula. And when we were building this house, you know, I was reading these passages, the ones you're describing, especially this idea that a place could be anointed. And so I got Bill Smith to come out and Carl, who are our mentors, they were elders. And we had our house church. And we met in the house as it's being built, one of our meeting times. And so it's just, imagine, it's just all the naked studs and the concretes in the house. And so I had everybody in our house church write scriptures on the studs of the walls.

And then I had Carl and Bill pour oil and do an anointing of our house. Because I was like, I want this to be a house that God lives in, lives in us, thrives in and all this. And so, you know, we anointed our house. And look, it was an amazing place of ministry. And I'll say this, years later, when Lisa and I just came to a disaster, just point in our marriage relationship. I mean, obviously we told her story before on the podcast. It was in that same house and right out in the backyard where she finally came to Christ

and changed our destiny, you know, in terms of ministry and what we do. So, I mean, I'm telling you it's there. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, this is a really, I mean, I'm just giving you a thumbnail of it. Because there's so many other passages that have these hints in the same idea. even in like the book of Isaiah looking forward to Jesus coming as the anointed one there's three chapters that i'll mention that mention him as the anointed one coming Isaiah 11 Isaiah 42 Isaiah 53 and so when you when you read those and then think of something like Matthew 16 when he's saying well who do you say

that I am. And they're like, well, some say you're a prophet and some say, you know, you're Elijah. And you remember that discourse. But all these categories and people that they're mentioning had this special anointing

and on behalf of God were used. And then he's like, but he do you say, I am? And Peter makes that famous saying, you are the Christ. Well, there's that, the anointed one. the son of God. And on this rock, you know, he tells Peter, I'll build my church. And then he connects that to the kingdom, which is what I wanted to bring up.

Because in Mark chapter one, when you read that, you see this anointing. You see him talking about the kingdom coming in. And you see the good news of what he's bringing. But also I wanted to mention that in the Psalms, you see this too about the Anointed One coming. You read Psalm 2, Psalm 3, Psalm 20, Psalm 21, Psalm 22. Look, there's way more than this. But as you read these things, connecting all the dots that we said this originally, this is symbolic of, you know, in the Garden of Eden, this water and spirit coming together, the plants flourishing, and then the oils of these plants, symbolically representing liquid life.

and that's the same thing that was used in the book of Exodus, even down to the recipe of this and these different kind of things they were using from cinnamon to, and the basis of this was olive oil, which what is that representing, you know, life and fruit. Yeah. And you fast forward to...

Well, and even healing days, I mean, a lot of those things represented, and still due to this day, a lot of those oils are healing oils as well, like for wounds. And I mean, it's just, there's so many qualities of that, which speaks exactly to what the Holy Spirit does, you know, in terms of physical. And what I found fascinating about this whole study about anointing was in all these things with the kings and the priests and all the, even the recipe for all this, these plants that were used for the oil. If you just take them and try to eat them by themselves, you know, they're either bitter or these were like extractions. from them once they were crushed. And in all these anointings, it took a lot of time.

There was always suffering as a part of it. You had to wait. And nothing happened fast. And so all these images that are being represented there, when you get to Jesus being the anointed one, well, he basically lives out that whole process, which ended in him being crushed, suffering. It was years that went by before it culminated to the resurrection. And I found that

fascinating, because now as us being anointed with the Holy Spirit and having the indwelling, we still go through that same process. There's suffering. There's persecution. And when you tie all that together, you're kind of figuring out the theme of the Bible and redemption and the process that goes along with it, even though you have the Holy Spirit and you're representing heaven, there's something in this struggling in the wilderness and growth process and the pain that's happening that God is there with you during the process that makes his power known. It makes his presence known. It gives you your purpose.

It comes back to that, us representing heaven and God himself, despite all this. The thought that kept popping up in my mind was the, two instances. One was in Luke 7, and then one is in John 12, where you have two different women, the sinful woman from a town, comes in when Jesus is having dinner at the house of Simon, a Pharisee. And remember she was crying and on his feet and washing his feet with her tears. And then she anointed him with this very expensive perfume. And, you know, and then Simon is like, oh, he's looking over at it. He's like, this guy, you know, if he were a problem, but he didn't know what kind of woman this is that's anointing him.

And so in that picture, you see just what John was describing later. You see a person whose heart is just pouring out because she's desperately seeking forgiveness of her life. And she knows she can get that from Jesus. And you got this other guy who's Antichrist, who is just all he sees is judgment in the moment. And then you get over to John 12. And, of course, it's Mary, the Lazarus sister, that anoints him again with an expensive perfume. And who do you have right there, the Antichrist, Judas, complaining and griping and saying, this money should have been, you know, this perfume should have been sold and money given to the poor.

And both times you see a heart that looks to Jesus and trust him, because that was a preparation for his burial, is what Jesus said in the case of Mary. Well, and he said that'll be told forever. Now you see why he made such a big deal about that. Because when you look at the theme of this from the beginning of creation until now, he is the anointed one. He's the chosen one, which is, you know, another word for anointed one, the chosen one. And he, where everyone else was lacking in that process, I mean, even David, it's a very interesting study. He got it more right than everyone else that had been anointed,

but then look what happens. Yeah. He falls off a cliff. And so you see the culmination and the process that Jesus would ultimately provide in being the human of all humans and reflecting God's character perfectly and then introducing what real love is, even forgiving his enemies in the end. And that's why when you see that verse that's hard to wrap your head around, when he breathed on them the Holy Spirit, and of all things he brings up this idea of approaching sin, when he says receive the Holy Spirit, and that's in John 20 and verse 22.

And then he gets into, if you forgive anyone his sins, they're forgiven. If you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven. And which now you see why that makes sense, because you are representing God himself. And you're qualified. You have the Holy Spirit. And look, Al, we spend, how much time do we spend with people on our couch? is when people are stuck in a sinful situation, and we're like, hey, what do we got to do to stop this?

This is not godly. You're claiming that Jesus is Christ, and yet your lifestyle and your sinful relationship or habit or whatever you're into is declaring anti-Jesus. No, it's so good. And you're exactly right. And it's the only pathway to true healing in restoration is to find that. And I love that you brought up David in that because we've been doing a life of David on our Hillsdale podcast. And, I mean, you want to see a comparison of where a guy can be in two different places.

Read Psalm 23, which Jace also mentions anointing. You know, you anoint my head with oil. Yeah. And see the confidence. And when David is, you know, following God and doing the right thing. And then go read Psalm 51, which is what happens after he. goes through this terrible scandal and murder and adultery and basically sets his house on fire. And his family will never be the same again because of some terrible decisions.

And read that song. Now, both of them show you a heart for God, but one of them is a wrecked place that's desperately asking for him not to take his spirit away from him and to renew him and to rebuild him into something different, which he does over the course of his life. But you're right. It's such a beautiful picture to see. And that could be any of us, and is all of us in a sense. Well, that's why, you know, I brought this up.

I hate it, took, Zach, getting sick for me to make it. Well, he jettisoned us on the podcast, Jay. So it's only fitting that we would have a great study about anointing. Well, because the, you know, the James 5, it's like you're praying for a guy that's sick. But then all of a sudden he brings up sin. And I think it comes back to this power of sin and death that the evil one contributed to making it happen on the earth and this battle of heaven and earth. And then what God did through Jesus' life, his death, his burial, his resurrection, to end sin and death, and also to defeat the powers. But that connection is there.

and you think of all the miracles that Jesus did where you'd heal someone, then he would say, well, which is easier for me to tell him his sins are forgiven or to heal him? And it's the same concept as God's anointed one to end this sin and death. And I think it's good news. And I wanted to bring this up because once you see this, you will never unsee it. I mean, I mentioned those few Psalms, but you're right, Al. It's filled all over the place, even in Isaiah. And when you look back on God raising up these people and they're going through this little ceremony with the oil, which seems so crazy.

I mean, it literally means smearing oil on someone's face. But even when you look up the definition of the word, Al, of the anointing, it has a – the word, when I looked up in the Greek lexicon, like one of the ways that described this process was vicious. And it's a power word that you're unleashing a power that is not earthly. It's coming from God. And it's representing back to Jesus's baptism when he got that Holy Spirit. Like I said, there's a reason that there's no miracles that Jesus performed before that act happened. And then he has this battle with the evil one about the kingdoms that you brought up in your sermon. You know, and so you're seeing the powers collide, which is really a theme in the Bible.

And then Jesus starts his ministry, and he starts healing not only the earthly problems that are the sign of death, all these sicknesses and ailments and all this, but he's also forgiving people's sins because he's representing the heavenly on earth. And it's so good because ultimately when he destroys death itself, then does disease really control us anymore? Because at the end of the day, we're going to be restored fully with resurrected bodies that are going to be like his, that what we see, which is very,

very powerful. So it's a, what a rabbit hole. I'm glad we had a chance to discuss it. I want to close with a prayer for Zach in seriousness because we've been joking about it. But also I want to pray for a couple, Al and Kim, who are great listeners up in Memphis area.

And I know they're going through some cancer battles and some stuff in their lives, too. And you guys have been on my heart. I know there's others. So since we are spirit-filled men, I want to pray that prayer of anointing of healing for you guys as well. Father, we are blessed to be together. We get the opportunity to just talk about your word and the power of it. And I'm so glad Jay said this rabbit hole because it's a very inspirational to think that your spirit lives in us, which then allows us to participate in your nature.

And that's such a gift. And we thank you for that. We do pray for Zach. Father, just give him strength, heal his body, rest his mind. So he'll be ready to go next time we get together to talk more about your word. I want to pray for Kim and Al. I know Al just had surgery. And, you know, it's been a big battle for them.

They love you. They love our podcast. And so I pray for healing for them. And no matter what, with anybody that's sick out there in Unashamed Nation to understand and realize we will be resurrected, we're going to lead this life at some point, just like Dad did, unless you come back. first. And so we just pray that we will be strong and faithful to the end and unashamed. We love you. In Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a

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