Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 1380 | Jase Robertson Puts His Own Life on the Line for His Children’s Faith

Episode Date: July 20, 2026

Jase, Al, and Zach confront the fear-driven control that keeps parents hovering long after their children need room to grow. Jase recounts the radical prayer he prayed when his own kids rebelled and explains why parents must ultimately trust God with the people they love most. The guys connect Abraham’s obedience, living faith, and the hope of resurrection to the difficult work of letting go without giving up. They also challenge Christians to move beyond merely believing in God and begin living as though they truly believe him. In this episode: Genesis 1:28; Genesis 2:15; Genesis 3:15; Genesis 9:1; Genesis 11:4; Genesis 12:1–3; Genesis 26:4; Matthew 1:1–16; Luke 20:27–38; John 12:23–32; James 2:14–26 “Unashamed” Episode 1380 is sponsored by: https://myphdweightloss.com — Find out how Al lost 80+ pounds. Visit the website or call 864-644-1900 and mention "Al Robertson" to get 2 weeks free in the program! https://chministries.org/unashamed — Get a better solution at half the cost of traditional healthcare! http://unashamedforhillsdale.com/ — Sign up now for free, and join the Unashamed hosts every Friday for Unashamed Academy Powered by Hillsdale College Listen to Not Yet Now with Zach Dasher on Apple, Spotify, iHeart, or anywhere you get podcasts. Check out At Home with Phil Robertson, nearly 800 episodes of Phil's unfiltered wisdom, humor, and biblical truth, available for free for the first time! Get it on Apple, Spotify, Amazon, and anywhere you listen to podcasts! https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/at-home-with-phil-robertson/id1835224621 Chapters 00:00 Faith Without Action Is Dead 04:18 Why Abraham Was Called God’s Friend 08:28 Bruising the Heel & Crushing the Head 13:42 Humanity’s Original God-Given Purpose 16:49 Rahab’s Surprising Place in Jesus’ Family Line 21:58 Faith Means Believing God, Not Just Believing in God 26:16 Jase’s Hardest Prayer for His Children 32:35 The Single Seed That Produced Eternal Life 38:42 Death Is Not a Problem for God 44:45 Authentic Faith Requires Bold Action 49:18 Baptism as an Abraham & Isaac Moment — Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? So welcome back to Unashame. For you, it may have been, I guess, a day or two. For us, it's been five minutes since we just had our massive reveal that Jace has been talking about from James Chapter 2. And we started out in the last podcast talking about jellyfish, which I was thinking of jellyfish a whole different way. But that led us. us into what I think is the apex of James' letter in James 2, 14 through 26, with this symbiotic relationship of faith and action. Or as Jase was just saying, what you call it just listening and doing?

Well, he brings up listening and doing in chapter one and when you have trials of many kinds, which is where he started. And he even used as an example later when he says it's like a person who looks in the mirror and doesn't remember what they look like. In other words, you forget. That's the big debate, right? I mean, faith versus works. And so we're trying to, James is trying to answer that question.

And Jace asked the question in the last podcast, why does he, a couple questions. One was, there's two questions. One was, why does he use Abraham and Rahab as like the prototypes for us? And then why does he use the add-in this whole concept of life and death at the end of it? And then the apex of what Jace was talking about was in Genesis 22. We went through the whole story of Abraham and he's sacrificing Isaac on the mountain. This is a recap.

Go back and listen to that episode if you didn't because this is just want to make a lot more sense. And then Jace went through really verse by verse of most of Genesis chapter 22 to the point where he says, and maybe you should start there, Jace, of that verse 18 again. Well, I want to say, yeah, I want to say this. When, when, what we're referring to from James is when he gets to, let's just read the James passage first because we never did in the last podcast. But just to throw in a few of the, of the context in verse 17 of James 2, he says in the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead. and what was that in response to? In verse 16, he says,

if one of you says to your neighbor or somebody that comes in, I wish you well, keep warm and well fed, but does nothing about his physical needs. What good is it? So in the same way, faith by itself if not accompanied by action is dead. So he's using this illustration,

and he says it twice, that if you claim to love Jesus, he says that twice. if you love him, we're going to see that in the way you treat people. And what kind of people you're treating, whether the widows, orphans, or poor people coming in and shabby clothes. So that's kind of his point. So he gets to verse 20, and he says, you foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? Now, this is right after he says, because I'm reading what he says,

then I'm going back and saying, why did he say that? In verse 18, it says, but someone will say, you have faith, faith, I have deeds. Show me your faith without deeds, and I'll show you my faith by what I do. You believe that there's one God. Good. Even the demons believe that and shudder. He's like, doesn't mean anything. That means nothing.

Just that you acknowledge that there is a God. Even the demons believe that. So then he says, you fool. man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? So he's going to give evidence, and then this is where he picks Abraham, was not our ancestor, Abraham, considered righteous. Now, I should have pointed this out earlier. The reason I made such a big deal earlier about righteousness, meaning are you right in your relationships with God and other people. That's what the word means in Hebrew and Greek used here, not a keeping of a moral

standard. The reason we made such a big deal about that is because it makes sense here when he says considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son, Isaac, on the altar. You see that his faith and his actions were working together and his faith was made complete mature by what he did. And the scripture was fulfilled that says Abraham believed God and it was credit to him. Now here's this word again. That's righteousness. But look at what proves my point about in your relationships.

Because what does it then say? And he was called God's friend. Why is he bringing that up? Yeah. Now, you just think about that's the greatest compliment you're ever going to get. God considers you his friend. I looked at up where that is. Isaiah 41. Isaiah 41 and Second Chronicles 3. Some king, I guess, got the memo on that and said, you know, Abraham, he's God's friend.

So that was a common thing going around. So then it says, you see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone. in the same way, and we'll get to Rahab, the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies, sent them off to a different direction. We'll read that story. As the body without the spirit is dead,

so faith without deeds is dead. So then he makes that transition into a dead faith or a living faith. And both these stories are about death and life. Abraham is asked, tested by God, to give his son. So the review on that was, you think, well, that put Abraham in a tough spot. However, based on how he got the son, based on the first promise, him being 100 years old and his wife 90, it did give him the context of, well, I wouldn't have this boy unless God had provided him.

And so now he wants me to do this. So I zeroed in on Genesis 22 and 18 because this seems to be the reason James is bringing this up. And I just said it had an unusual usage of the word heal. Now, we should have explained that a little better because that's how we ended the last podcast, but we were out of time. So the first time that's used is in Genesis 315, and I'm going to read that, because I probably should have said this. After the sin and the evil ones' involvement with Adam and Eve, there was a curse put on the evil one, and it says,

I will put enmity, which is a word for hatred, or is there another word you can think of? Like passion. vision like a yeah yeah it's a conflict word between you and the woman so the human woman between your offspring or seed and hers he will crush your head and you will strike his now that's very confusing i remember when i first became uh when i surrendered to jesus and somebody read this and said this is the first time Jesus coming in flesh is mentioned. And I was like, what? Where are you getting that from?

So maybe do you all have a simple way of explaining that to people who are needed faith? The way I would say it is, I don't know if it's simple, but you have in Genesis 3, right, it's the curse, but it's also kind of the blessing as well, that his, her offspring, the offspring of Eve is going to crush, talking about Jesus, is going to crush the head of Satan. He'll bruises Heel, which was the crucifixion, right? He's going to get hurt. There's going to be a bruise, but I think if you back up a little bit, too, particularly in light of Genesis 22, what was it,

18? Was it 18? When he said, well, I was just going to say in 2218 is the next time the exact word for hill is used, but it's used as a, kind of like what Al you said in between the break. If you tell your dog, heel, which our dad, you say that all the time, heel, he, they, yeah, you train them to, to then get behind your heels so you won't trip over them, you know, when you're going out to the, to the field. The idea is they obey and they get behind you and let you lead. That's the whole concept, yeah.

So, Jayce, I think you got a little more of dad's metabolism. I got a little more of moms. Me and Willie did. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but I'm thankful. Yeah, you are, because you hadn't had to really struggle. But Willie and I got in our 40s, all of a sudden, the metabolism started slowing down. But we kept eating what we always ate, and that led to some serious problems. And so our good friends at Ph.D. weight loss really reshaped my thinking, my mind.

they have a great program. And so it took me about a year. But here's me at the beginning. Here's where I'm at now, a year and a half later, 80 pounds lighter, feeling better, off all my meds, off my CPAP machine, much more energy, doing much more with my grandkids. So life has changed for Al, and it can change for you, especially if you're at that point, you know, where you realize you need to do something. So here's what I want you to do.

Right now, when you call and mention me, Al Robertson, you'll get two free weeks in the program and they'll pay for the cost of your food. That's a $1,500 value right off the bat. You call $864-644-1900. That's 864-644-1900 or go to my Ph.D. Weightloss.com because the goal isn't to lose weight once, but to not have to start over again. Give them a call, 864-644-1900 or go to my PhD weightloss.com. The word because in Genesis 2218, it's trashed.

Translated because if you look up in the Hebrew lexicon, it's the word heel. But what is heel in that light? It is listening to the voice and doing it. And doing it. So now the heel in Genesis 315 was an image and a vision that there's going to be a human with a heel that's going to come out of this woman. of course we've already figured it out that's going to be of heavenly origin it's going to be Jesus the son of God that's why his mom was a virgin so that's the image there it's a he has a heel which is I'm holding my foot up on the table right now that's the heel I'm talking about

here so you so that's why when you when I went down that rabbit hole of what that word I was like well wait a minute how can it be an ankle in Genesis 3. And that's why the translators of this Hebrew lexicon said, this is a very unusual way to use that word, but it's here. And I just thought, this can't be a coincidence. Because we're literally talking about three days a journey at mirroring the death, barrel, and resurrection of Jesus,

this promise in Genesis 315. about the evil one being crushed through a human coming forth at a woman one day, and then Abraham's faith and actions listening to his voice in order to do this. All right, that was the review. Go ahead, Zach. Yeah, and I think where it gets kind of hairy, and what I think this whole passage explains to us is that connection between, I'm going to do, I got to do something, but yet I'm saved by faith.

Well, which one is it? I mean, am I saved by works? Am I saved by faith? And what the writer's doing here is he's actually changing the whole conversation. And I think the way he does it is what he does connect it into this grander story of Abraham is more than just Abraham and Rahab. If you think about, go back to Genesis 128, I always go back there because that was the first vocation that was given to man.

And what does it mean when you say vocation? If I say, what's your vocation? I mean, what do you do for work? What's your work? What's your deed? What are you doing? And we were given a job to do. And so listen to the job we were given to do in Genesis 128 is to be,

God blesses humanity. So whatever is coming next out of this is a blessing. He blesses humanity with a vocation. Here it is. And he commands them be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth. So the original human vocation, the original human work, the original human deed was a blessing, not a curse, and it was an outward expression of God's presence. So then you move into Genesis chapter 2. I'm so rapidly fired through these, verse 15. Adam is placed in Eden.

This is pre-fall, and what does he told to do? To work it. To work it and keep it. So Eden wasn't meant to remain this static thing. It was meant to expand out the temple garden. Then you go to Genesis chapter 9. After the flood, God repeats the mandate that he gave in Genesis 128, be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth. So you see the commission of Eden is, it continues after judgment. Then you move to Genesis 114, which you have the Tower of Babel,

and what did they do? They did the opposite. So they shrink back and they say, let us not. let us not be dispersed. Let's not go and be dispersed over the face of the earth. It's an anti-Eden. It's an anti-mandate. It's anti-kingdom. Then you get to Genesis 12 and God calls Abraham out of the nations. And what does he tell him in Genesis 12, 3, 1 through 3? He says, all the families, all the families of the earth are going to be blessed through Abraham. And so you see that this is coming through families now. Genesis 22, what does it say that we just read? all the nations of the earth shall be blessed.

And then Genesis 26, same thing. All the nations of the earth shall be blessed. Exodus 19, Psalm 67. There's this idea that all of these nations are somehow going to be blessed, particularly through Isaac. Think about this. He tells Abraham, all the nations are going to be blessed for you, Abraham. Then Abraham has a son.

He tells Isaac, all the nations are going to be blessed for you, Isaac. then Isaac has a son named Jacob. What does he say? All the nations are going to be blessed or you. So when you get to the introduction of Christ, which was the one prophesied about in Genesis chapter 3, the descendant of Eve, you say, well, how did Christ arrive on the scene?

And if you go to the very first gospel and you get that genealogy, is it not interesting who it starts with? the very introduction of Christ starts with Abraham, the very person that we're talking about here. And here's what's interesting about that genealogy, because I used to read that genealogy for years

and thought, oh, this is the part you skip over because it just doesn't really matter. But listen, he starts with Abraham. Verse 2. Abraham was the father of who? Isaac. He told Abraham, all the nations are going to be blessed because of you.

Then the next week says, Isaac. And then Jacob. So he has all three of those guys, and you skip down a little bit. Hang on, Jack, before you make the next point, because it's really good where you're going. Let me just throw a caveat in here. Jacob reached out and grabbed the heel, Jase, of Esau, the older brother. You see that same Hebrew word come up again in that instance. And the idea was, is that Esau should have been the one through which this legacy carry because he was the oldest son,

but it was always going to be through Jacob. of a good point. It is interesting that he reached out and grabbed the heel, which is another just little biblical clue about how the lineage goes. All right, goes that. So you got, that's Israel. That all makes sense because that's all DNA.

These guys are grandsons. I mean, these are direct lineage of Abraham. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. They're all in the line. But then all of a sudden you have this character name, uh-oh, rehab. In verse 5, how does Rahab a Gentile end up in the lineage of the Christ?

Well, she made. There is a guy named Boaz. Then they have, oh, and then Ruth was not Jewish either. I don't believe. No. So then you have, now you have these other nations being integrated into the seed of Abraham. And you just keep reading down. And when you get to the end of the genealogies, guess who the last one is?

The one born of Mary, called Jesus, who is called the Christ. I mean, this is like. Well, that's why I want to bring this up before we get to Rahab. So you see this. idea about the seed what Paul discusses this in Galatians 3 and he brings up Abraham I think this is interesting because Genesis 315 you see this seed that's going to come forth from a human woman that's going to curse Satan but he's going to have his heel bruised you see Abraham being considered God's friend because he trusted to listen to the voice and did this crazy radical moment of

faith in trusting God by acting like he was fixed to kill his son. You know, God said, wait a minute. So it uses that word, but I think it leads me to, I just feel like I need to read this Galatians 3. I mean, I don't want to read the whole thing, but I'll skim through it a little bit. Verse 8 of chapter 2 says, the scripture foresaw that God would justify the Gentiles by faith and announce the gospel. That's the phrase I want to get.

advance to Abraham, all nations will be blessed through you. So when you think about what happened in Genesis 12, where God calls Abraham and they have this conversation, you say, how's that announcing the gospel? I thought the gospel was Jesus. Well, in 22, you see a preview of the gospel because he was going to kill his one and only son that he loved. and then Hebrews 11 explains that Abraham reasoned that God is going to raise him from the dead

but remember that in Hebrews 11 it doesn't stop there it's like and in reality he actually did get him back from the dead that's right yeah he said figuratively speaking he was willing yeah he was that was a fiction that happened that's a faith that I can only dream of here so I try to make sense I think this is the thing So what the text is not saying is, this is what the text is not saying, that you go out and you have this thing called faith and then go do a bunch of works to prove that you had it. Because then you're just back into a works page.

If we hadn't made that point in the last two hours, I mean, I'm just saying, most people, we've said this over and over, they go to this text and they're having an argument over things that this is not about. No, because the point is you're being invited into participating in the unfolding of the kingdom. And so if I believe the king about his kingdom, and guess what I'm going to do? I'm going to do stuff to be a part of it. And then there's all this like, he said, do you not see how these people were just to be? God produced all the results, obviously. I mean, when Christ came through Mary, what did Joseph do to make that baby? What did what did Mary do to make that baby?

They did absolutely goose egg zero, but everybody played a part in the submit. So God uses our obedience to bring forth his will. And so all of a sudden, now you're saying, if that's why that demon passage is so important, demons believe God. That's not, he's not talking about that kind of belief. He's not talking. Faith is not belief in God. Faith is believing God.

And those are two separate things. I can believe that there's something exists. but then I can believe what that what, then I can believe what you're telling me is true. And if I believe what you're telling me is true and that it's for my good, then I'm going to do it. And that was that was Abraham. So since they changed our health care laws, I have noticed, I know everybody else has to you that the price has skyrocketed to where it's virtually unaffordable for a lot of people, particularly if you're unemployed or even if you're self-employed. Al, you guys have had a difficult time over the years finding affordable health care as well. Yeah, no doubt about it. And of course, the older you get, the higher it tends to go on top of that.

So it's just a nightmare. So if you're an American, you may be one of the millions buried under medical debt or trying to afford health insurance that just keeps getting price here. On average, we're talking about $805 for a single person. It's just ridiculous. And that's why Christian Healthcare Ministries offers a more biblical and affordable solution. I'm a member because of this. CHM is not health insurance. It's the original health cost sharing ministry where Christians actually share the burden of eligible medical bills together. Since 1981, CHM has satisfied 100% of every eligible bill received.

Program started as low as $150 per person per month with added protection for catastrophic medical events. What stands out most to me about this whole ministry is it looks like the book of a hacks where Christians actually share the burden together. You guys can be a part of this along with myself. See why believers like me across the entire nation are better off with CHM. Get started today by visiting CH Ministries.org slash unashamed. That's CHministries. That's ch.ministries.org slash unashamed. Look, why bring up friendship if it's all about some legal code?

Why does he bring up friendship? That's right, because it's about relationship. And you mentioned that early. Let me give a practical illustration of this and what it can do to someone. So our good friend Paul Stevens, who's been on the podcast a couple of times, he found out his son, young son, young guest son, but young son, had really bad diabetes. He was just a boy.

I mean, he was life-threatening. And he and Kim were so scared. You know, it's your baby boy, and you're so worried about it. So he just was tossing back and forth with God about what to do. And he said this passage in Genesis 22 that we've been referring to as this listening and doing, in his prayers and in his agony and in this trial, he realized he had to give his son to the Almighty. And so he said he went in there and they were sleeping.

He has two boys. And so the older boy, Zach, was there too. And he got down on his knees. And as he was crying and they were asleep, they didn't even know he did this. He said, they are yours. They are not mine. They are in your hands.

And I will trust you with everything. Then he went back in and knelt beside the bed and did the same thing with his wife. But he said from that night on, He never had another moment where he felt like that somehow God wasn't going to do what he said he was going to do. And look, those young boys grew up. They're men of God. They have their own kids and family now. But I've always thought about that.

He believed that this text and what we're talking about so much today that he literally did it. Yeah. Well, I was going to share earlier, but I mean, I hate getting into my junk. But I guess I will since you've broken the Band-Aid off of that. You know, I've said this, it's a different prayer. but I did it with all my kids because at some point when they became teenagers, they lost their way.

And look, I think it's normal and it's natural. There's a natural abeyer that is to occur from kids and their parents. Now, we have a bunch of hover parents out there who don't realize this is part of the process that's supposed to happen. And then they hover to they're in their mid-40s or whatever.

You know, they're still pulling all the strings. But that doesn't work, by the way. If you were curious how that will turn out for you, that don't be a hover parent. That won't work out well. Yeah. I'm just going to. Well, my scriptural foundation is leave and cleave on both parties.

Leave the father and mother and be united to your wife. So we both have responsibility. But I was just saying when each of my kids, when I got to where I felt like there's nothing else I can do, I've had multiple come to Jesus, try to get them help. Yeah, they're just, because I'm more concerned about their relationship with God. In each of my kids' lives, I made the statement at some point, and it was usually like right before the end of their old life and the beginning of their new. I was like, you know what I prayed last night?

If God has to take my life for you to wake up, I'm praying. that prayer. I'm putting skin in the game for your life. I mean, I'm not ready to go and die. I mean, I'd just soon hang around, but I just want you to know that's what I'm praying right now. I did notice that did have a profound effect on them. And I said it in such a passion-filled way, because in the heat of the moment, that's where I was at this. Yeah. You were just saying that you believe, you were offering. Oh, I was like, this could happen. So if you look up and I'm dead within a week, you know what to do. There you go.

There's my sermon for the day. But it's a hard prayer to pray, and it's a very difficult thing to tell your kids that, because they're looking at you like, what have you gone crazy? Because I think from the outside looking in, if you're just barely familiar with this story, you're like, what are we doing? We're going up a mountain to kill your son. It just seems too crazy. But if you really believe that we came from God and we're returning to him,

it kind of takes the weirdness out of it. Well, you kind of see it in like when you get into more controversial topics that maybe, because if you read the Bible and you're going to follow Christ, there are topics that are, it may shock people, but there are certain things that God commands that the culture around you may think that is bizarre. I don't know if everybody knew that or not. Like there's things that aren't culturally acceptable about the Christian faith. If you're going to live it out in the public square,

the public square is going to say, we don't, no, that's not, that's, that's, that's, that's a bridge

too far. And like I, like I said, once we got into the details, this doesn't seem that big a deal. Look, I never finished Galatians 3.

Can I please read that? You can't? The seed and the heel and all that. So when he gets to verse 16 of Galatians 3, it says the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed.

Now, this is interesting. The scripture does not say and to seeds. meaning many people, and to your seed. He makes a big deal about this. And you're like, why is he making a big deal about this? Because the first promise in Genesis 12 is that you're going to have a lot of seeds.

All nations will be blessed. In this case, and the reason I think it is interesting about the heel in Genesis 2218, because he's listening to the voice. Because in this marrying Jesus, I think that's his point was into one seed, meaning one person, this is Galatians 316, who is Christ. So what did that one seed do?

Which now makes John 12, where's that at 48? Remember when Jesus said, read the John 12, 48, because there's a connection here that's really, this is part of, of the rabbit hole on this, but John, I think it's 48. Let me look. Oh, yeah, 24.

So let me just read this. John 12, 23. Jesus replied, the hour has come for the son of man to be glorified. I'll tell you the truth, unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies,

now listen to this, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds. Ooh. So that's where this goes in. Well, that's the Genesis 128 again. I mean, that's the whole thing, right?

So my translation says, I don't have in front of me, but I think it says, if it falls, it dies, it remains, or if it stays on it, it remains alone. And God's prerogative was never that we would be alone, God's prerogative, that all the families, all the nations of the earth shall be blessed. And so that's the idea there. Like, right, when you think about that, that seed falling and sprouting up, and it's, it's, it's, It's expansion. It's garden language. Expanding garden language. All right.

And I just wanted to make this connection for you from Genesis 315. Because some people probably read that thing. Well, why do you think there's talking about Jesus and the seed and the bruising the heel of the woman? So he starts talking about seeds right here. Then you have the Abraham that is read in Galatians 3. Well, then he says in verse 25 of John 12, the man who loves his life will lose it. That's why I prayed that with my kids. I'm like, my life, if I can't show my kids Jesus, what am I doing?

They're my number one targets for, because I want to live with them forever. God gave them to me, gave me responsibility, and I need to do whatever it takes. So I literally am praying this statement. If it takes me losing my literal life, a la Abraham and Isaac here, as a test, because it is a test to raise teenagers, then that's what I'm willing to do. While the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life.

I realize he has another point. I was just saying I was using that to try to motivate my kids. I wasn't kidding. It wasn't like I was praying not being serious because I thought, well, I know I'm going to be raised again anyway. If this is the catalyst, since they have more years and more energy,

this works for me, you know? Yeah. If this is what it takes. Whoever serves me must follow me, where I am, my servant also will be. My father will honor the one who serves me. And then now he gets into this conversation about trusting the father. And after he talked about seeds and seed, and then he says in verse 31, now is the time

for judgment on this world. Now the prince of this world will be driven out. Well, this is an echo in Genesis 315, from the seeds, seed to the seeds. to him crushing the evil one. When I am lifted up from the earth, and we talked about that, that has a double meaning, not just the cross being lifted up physically,

but his exaltation through the resurrection and ascension into heaven itself to make the presence of God available for all humans. I will draw all men to myself. He said this to show the kind of death he was going to die. So that, when you go back to Galatians 3, you say, well, where did the seeds come in? And you can read the whole Galatians 3 all the way to the end, but when he gets to verse 19 of

chapter 3, it says, what then was the purpose of the law? Because we're talking in James about the royal law, this new law that's outside the box. You're getting the discernment of the law. You're listening to the voice of God in a personal, intimate, friendship way that's inside your body, which is why we're going to get to his last illustration. just like a corpse that has no spirit, it's coming back to the spirit that God has given you. And that's why the seed would die and multiply and produce many other seeds. So he gets down to verse 26, you're all sons of God, do faith in Christ Jesus.

This is still Galatians 3. For all of you are baptized in Christ, have closed yourself with Christ. There's no Jew, nor Greek, no slave, nor free, or female, you're all one in that seed, Christ Jesus. If you belong to Christ, look at this. Now he's going back, you're Abraham's seed. The one seed that listening and doing faith and actions, life and death, you have become heirs according to promise.

And then chapter four launches into the spirit. And so now verse 4 of Galatians 4 goes back to Genesis 315. When the time had fully come, God sent his son, here it is, born of a woman. Here's the offspring that unleashed Jesus crushing Satan, but he had his heel bruised because he had to go through the same process that Abraham sent Isaac down. He's got to have a three-day death march that's going to result in drawing all people, exaltation and eternal life, destroying death itself and the power of the evil one. But how is it done?

Verse 6. Because you are sons, God sent the spirit of his son into our hearts, the spirit who calls out Father. So you're no longer a slave but a son. Since your son, God has made you an heir. Point is, it's a dead faith. If you claim some mental acknowledgement that God is there and there's no action, there's no trust. There's no doing to the listening. It's a dead faith. And he chose these two things,

which were life and death, literally, kind of like my prayer with my kids. I'm willing to, I'm willing for death to occur to get the point that God raises the dead. He wants us to live forever. He wants to be our friends. He wants to have a relationship. He wants to partner with us. And I think that's his whole point for bringing this up. You know what he used then, Jay's, and the rest of that chapter later as illustration was another story out of the Genesis narrative of Abraham with Hagar and Sarah and Ishmael and Isaac is to one was a slave and one was a son. And he explained that why, and that was the sinful union that happened to try to fix it to show you that man cannot fix his own problems. And so to your point, Paul uses that story, which we didn't even

deal with back much when we're talking about the general narrative of Abraham, again, explain this process. It's a fantastic point. All throughout, it's just over and over. Because then you're getting into the freedom. That's where the law that brings freedom, you're no longer a slave. You've been freed. You're like, well, how can I be free if I'm under the law?

Well, it's the royal law. It's looking at it and discerning the heart of God and the relationship aspect that God is desiring to see the freedom. Go ahead, Zach. Yeah, I think the Romans 4 passages helpful again. I mean, when you talk about Abraham as kind of the prototype of this, because he does use language in here about justification by works. A person is just, you see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone. This is in James 224.

And everybody, I mean, I've had a hard time with that, right? I mean, I believe that we're justified by faith, that faith alone, how do you make sense of a passage like that? And I think that the point that the writer's making is not that your works earn you favor with God. It's just that works doing something is the natural byproduct of believing God when he's telling you. And so if you think about his revelation is always a revelation of life. And so my obedience now comes into play. I'm actually just believing that what God's command of me is a blessing. back to Genesis 128.

The command to work was actually a blessing. And so that is like where the freedom of Christ, the freedom in Christ comes in. For too long we've thought freedom in Christ meant I'm free to do what I want. And I'm not held accountable because, hey, grace, I'm free in Christ. That's not what freedom in Christ means. Freedom in Christ means that you're free to do what you want,

which is the things that God wants. And that's where the freedom aligns, is that as I believe in his revelation, that it's actually good and pleasing and good for me, you know, for the joy set before him, he endured the cross. There's a joy that's set before us. And if I believe there's a joy set before me, because God's revealed that to me,

then I'm going to be obedient, and I'm going to do that. And that goes all the way back to the very first sin in the Garden of Eden. The very first sin was they did not believe that God's commandment was good for them. They thought, oh, he doesn't want us to eat this fruit because if we do, we'll be like God's holding out. That's what they thought. That's what sin is. And so faith, if sin is calling God a liar, which I think that's a good definition of it, then faith would be saying, God, I believe that you're being truthful here. And so Abraham's faith was credited to him as righteousness, not because it was, it's not a work.

To believe God isn't a work. It's just I believe that you're telling me the truth. And so guess what? I'm going to do what you say. It's acting right in the relationship. But it's just like you said. If you claim you don't have sin, you make God out to be a liar, or if you don't acknowledge Jesus.

Well, here you bring up Rahab who lied. I mean, both of these stories, he picked the two most controversial story. You got one guy is going to murder his. son. And you have Rehab, who this whole great act that is recorded in Hebrews 11, she's there too. Oh, yeah. Saying faith without deeds, here's Rehab. Well, you know what she did to please God and become a person in the hall of faith?

She lied. And you can spend it any way you want to. Did she not lie? Yeah. I mean, I want to read the story. And not only did she lie, Jay, she was a prostitute for that. But look, let me read this for you, read the story, Jay's because we didn't make a strong point about this, but I want to read it again.

When you got to the end of Genesis 22, I want to reiterate this right before you tell the story. This is the angel of the Lord after he is, you know, the whole ordeal with Isaac is over. He says, I will surely bless you, make your descendants as numerous as the stars of the sky, the sand on the seashore. And then catch this. Your descendants will take possession of the cities of their enemies. Well, guess what? When this happens with Joshua, the very first city is a city named Jericho.

And the very person that is saved out of this city, the only person family is guess who? Rehab. And then he says, and through your offspring, all the nations on earth will be blessed because you have obeyed me. Well, guess who, as Zach pointed out of Lurter, became an ancestor in the lineage from Abraham to Jesus, Rehab. So even back in that promise way back then, he just gives you this little glimpse and connection to the story now we're fixing to have with Rehab. It's just so the flow of the Bible into the redemption story just continues to amaze when you find them. Look, I'm making a determination that if I launch into this Rehab story, we're not going to have enough time to finish it. So let me just stop and make a practical application.

And we'll get to Rehab on the next bike, yeah. Because I think you've hit on something really good here. I think the bigger points of why people are uncomfortable with this story, in the end, God didn't let him kill his son. Yep. God did the right thing. Now, Abraham was willing to do it because he had stumbled up on the main fact of this whole chapter in James 2,

which is if you surrender to Jesus and you start walking with him in a relational way, you realize that death is not a problem. This is not a problem to God. It's not that you just believe that. You're literally acting, I'm going back to that prayer I said to my kids. And by contrast to Zach's point about

making out God to be a liar. People go to these stories like this to try to deny the existence of God or say the Bible's ridiculous. It's like, hey, I mean, here's the guy who's going to kill his son. But number one, God didn't allow that to happen because he's a God of love. He's going to do the right thing. He just wanted to make sure he's all in that I'm the author of life and I'm the extender of life. That just come off the top of my head, but it sounds really good. But if that's true, if that's true, look, death is not a problem. So when I've, many times I've seen children die, and here I am in a situation where I'm trying to provide encouragement to someone that's lost their kid, well, it's very difficult to say, well, death's not a problem.

This is not a problem. I am convinced 100%, you're going to see this kid again. This gives you incentive to put your face. and trust in the Lord, which is really right. But in that moment, people are like, what are you saying? Why would God do this? Well, he didn't do it. But he's going to make it right, just like he made this situation right.

And there's a famous passage, what is that in Luke 20, when it says, to God, all are alive. Remember the story about the woman who had been married seven times, who will be her husband in heaven? He's like, to God, all are alive. Death is not a problem. So when people blame God for the deaths of the innocent on the earth, he gave his son to die. And what happened? Well, he didn't die.

You're like, well, yeah, he did. Well, not really. I mean, he took a three-day, what would you call that? Dirt map? This is not like the jellyfish, you know, where they eventually get eaten by something else. No, no. He's alive and well two thousand years later. It is not a problem.

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That it's not a problem. Because when people get the news that you've got two weeks to live, what do they do? They panic. Why? That's on you. We all know that you have a short period of time to be on the earth upright. We're all going down, which is why I think he uses that illustration at the end. He's making that a spiritual thing.

but it's really a belief in that death is not a problem. So he's like, if you're just a corpse, well, what good can't, what are you going to do? There's no spirit. You see what I mean? He's tying that in the way you live out these spiritual truths that death is not a problem. If you really believe that, how much bolder would you be? Oh, man, it's so good. And here's the way I wrote it down, Jay.

you're not physically alive unless you have both body and spirit. We know that. You have to have both to be alive. If you see a body without the spirit, you're dead. But you're not spiritually alive unless the root is bearing fruit. And that's back to that James, I mean, John 15 concept that Jesus is the root of us. And he bears fruit through us by His Holy Spirit that he gave us. And that's why you see it as fruit, both fruit of us.

spirit, the fruit of other people, the fruit of a lifestyle that blesses people and lives like you have life and not death. I mean, all those things here. That's why this thing is going, but James is going to get to this later when he says, look, you brag about, I'm going to go here, I'm going to go there, I'm going to do this, and you're not even thinking that life is a vapor, a whisper. I mean, like, it is here and then it is gone. But we know already, we are in the eternal process. And the only reason we can know that is if we have the Spirit of God. I think you see this lived out with new Christians.

There's a new brother. I won't get into details yet because I'll wait for him to reveal that story. But it's like when you're asked to speak, because you have an incredible story, you're just a hellion out there. And, you know, some stories, I mean, look, everybody to them is a work of God and it's incredible. But it's just some stories are like, think the worst of the worst. I'll use our dad as an example. I mean, it's like, wow. I mean, they make movies about this kind of transformation. We've heard that before. But here's my point. They even made lifetime movies.

Here's my point, because I just saw this happen. And this guy was asked to speak and just share what God, but he's new. And he's like, there's no. There's no. scenario by which I'm getting up in front of an audience and doing this. It's like when it first was asked, I got involved and saw some of this. It's like that can't. I am incapable of doing that. And but it makes me think about where we're at now. I'm like, oh no, you're capable. You have no idea what you're capable. You literally can't die now. even though you die. I mean, you just think about all the big picture things here.

And now you're thinking that it's a big deal just to get up and declare that there is a God who's rescued you from just hell itself. Now you're going to live forever. It's giving you the resources to repair all the damage that, you know, you've caused in the past. It's just such an immature way to look because they're new. It's normal. I'm not saying it's a bad thing.

This is all. I went through the same process. I mean, it took me two years to get it through my thick skull. I'm not going to be able to do this quietly. I can't, there's just, there's too much evil. I have too much influence around me with my friends, the places I'm going, people I'm talking to, I'm like, I'm going to have to draw the line. And you're going to have to appeal to that, I mean, I have the Holy Spirit in me.

Yeah. And long story short, the guy did get up and was so nervous to the point of distraction. But it all helped. And I was having a conversation after. I was like, you don't realize that. You being that nervous. You getting the words wrong. You're not remembering where the verses are.

All of that actually was a positive. People knew it was real. That's right. But you're like, you should be nervous about this. This is how important it is. I was like, people just go in. They're craving for any kind of authentic faith and action that seems crazy. this person be getting up talking about Jesus now, you know, after he's been, just lived a life

of ruin and misery for decades. And I think that's what people fail to realize when you wrap your head around all these potential stories that seem so crazy at us. Really, it's not that crazy at all if the true reality is that there's an eternal God and you're going to live forever. What is death? It's nothing. It's like a mosquito, but it's not. It's not like a mosquito, bite. Yeah. They, oh, what was that? Oh, you died.

Oh, did I? Oh, well, I'm back now. Yeah. Well, let's, now what are we going to do? You know, it's, Jason, it's funny because I'll go somewhere and speak and you'll be sitting at a table and, you know, I'm just getting ready to get up there and just waiting for whatever's going on here to have the time for me to get up because I'm excited to be there. And somebody will always say, or almost always said, do you still get nervous? And I was like, oh, always, you should be nervous when you're speaking on behalf of the Almighty. this, you know, yes, but here's what the Holy Spirit and wisdom do for you.

Over the years, you take nervousness and nerves and let the Holy Spirit turn that into energy. Energy that then becomes dynamic because of who you're talking about, not because of you, but because of who and what you're talking about. And that's the difference in what happens. But that has to start someplace and that has to grow someplace. And then that has to be revealed someplace. And then it has to be done over and over and over. again. So that's what you just described. It's not just public speaking. I'm talking about sharing Jesus,

because that may be at work. That may be, you know, in your own family. It's an awkward thing a lot of times to get started. But once you start, you can't stop. It's going to flow because you're connected to the root. And he's the one bearing the fruit. And it's a beautiful thing. You talked about righteousness in the last podcast. The only time we see righteousness in a bad light in the New Testament is when you hear the word. self-righteous. And that's the kind of thing we're talking about the difference between the righteousness of God.

Well, I wanted to say this for the close, because that keeps bringing up the denominational world, faith and worship, there's nothing you can do. And there's something here about the reason I read that Galatians 3 is because when he gets to baptism, I think this is the same thing. This is your Abraham Isaac moment. It's not like you're trying to do something to earn your salvation. You're going to die. You're taking your death march and saying it's more in that light.

Even Jesus who did that in his baptism and what was spoken. This is my son, whom I love. And I still think that goes on today. We're just, we're looking at it from a rule-oriented standpoint instead of you giving your life up to the Lord God and having that moment. And then he says, you know what? You're not really dying. You're living. I'm going to resurrect you. And that's why Roman 6 depicts that. I think this clears up all these arguments that we have that have missed the boat as far as the relational aspect of it.

Yeah, it's called Live and Large. All right, we're going to have to pick it up. Next time we will tell the story of Rahab. Jason's going to do that and we'll pick it up and go. We know we've got a lot of good stuff here. But remember, this is the most crucial part of the book, in my opinion. So that's why we're hanging out. So we'll see it next time on Unashame. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch every episode.