Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 1449 | The Robertsons Fire Back at What James Talarico Calls the Abortion ‘Solution’

Episode Date: October 26, 2026

Texas pastor and U.S. Senate candidate James Talarico’s abortion answer sparks a challenge to the idea that planning determines a child’s worth. Jase, Al, and Zach connect the debate to God’s purpose for the family throughout Scripture, with Zach reflecting on his own five children’s unplanned beginnings. Jase also recounts a weekend with Willie, a thrill-seeking invitation from two Navy SEALs, and a 101-year-old veteran who refused to budge. The guys dig deeper into Jude, the Nephilim, and spiritual rebellion before disagreeing about whether fallen angels fully understood their choice. In this episode: Genesis 1:28; Genesis 4:7; Numbers 13:27–33; Matthew 5:5; Matthew 16:15–18; 1 Corinthians 6:3; Philippians 2:10–11; 2 Timothy 3:1–9; Jude 1:5–7, 14–15 Want to watch Unashamed ad-free? Only on EKKL! Get 20% off with code UNASHAMED, and watch faith- and family-friendly movies, podcasts, and more: https://ekkl.com/ “Unashamed” Episode 1449 is sponsored by: Go to curehydration.com/unashamed and get 20% off your first order with promo code UNASHAMED https://homechef.com/unashamed - Get 50% off and free shipping on your first box plus free dessert for life! http://unashamedforhillsdale.com/ - Sign up now for free, and join the Unashamed hosts every Friday for Unashamed Academy Powered by Hillsdale College Check out At Home with Phil Robertson, nearly 800 episodes of Phil's unfiltered wisdom, humor, and biblical truth, available for free for the first time! Get it on Apple, Spotify, Amazon, and anywhere you listen to podcasts! https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/at-home-with-phil-robertson/id1835224621 Chapters 00:00 Al’s Hostage Video 02:27 Jase & Willie Reunite 04:50 Navy SEALs Challenge Jase’s Faith 12:10 A 101-Year-Old Veteran Won’t Budge 15:11 Missy’s Retreat & Madi’s Secret Identity 17:25 Jude’s Warning About Church Imposters 22:52 Mount Hermon & the Gates of Hades 26:43 Challenging the Term “Unplanned” Pregnancy  37:04 Can Fallen Angels Repent? 44:14 Godliness Without God’s Power 47:12 Giants, Nephilim & the Promised Land 52:43 Facing Spiritual Battles With Confidence - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to the Unashamed podcast. Al's in a new location, so he's kind of had technical difficulty, so I'm taking on the lead today. And Jason, you can see Al, right? Yeah, Al, where are you? What state are you in? Well, I'm in Alabama, and I has had some internet problems, so I had to move to a new location. Can they hear us? If they can. hear us if they can't hear us if you can text us where you're at we'll come save you because it looks like you're you're being held hostage man what do you what's going on with your sets right

there too well i'm not exactly as set designer uh zach i don't have any uh production value and so i basically just took what i had and put it on a blank wall i'm in literally a cave no here was the vibe i was getting i realized that whatever his backdrop is must not be very good so he went with the gospel diagram, but he's in the middle of it. There's no grave. So now we just have a couple of arrows coming off of each shoulder. There's a thin line between preaching the gospel and realizing I'm not sure you're even in this country. Now, what's behind the flag you got there?

Well, behind this, see if you're watching here, this is worse. We got wires. We got, it's a, I'm in a, I'm in a, I'm. I'm basically a cave. I'm just doing the best I can. Yeah, it looks like you're in an abandoned building, but you haven't been taken hostage. I'm not being held hostage. I'm free. I'm a free man. I'm free in Christ. I've got the gospel symbols. Lisa's in the shot as well. Yeah, that's where we're at today.

Well, I get emails all the time, people asking about, like, what kind of setup do I need to do a podcast? So if you're watching, apparently not much. So you don't need a lot. He just, that's whatever you got going on. That's something called low rent. I'm surprised you didn't blame it on me for being cheap because that's been a thread. Well, I mean, I'm a man on an island. I have no help here.

I'm just doing it myself. That was actually my first thought. I thought, Al's traveling. Everything I'm doing, I'm doing solo. I'm hot solo. Zach's got budget issues. I got budget issues, boys. Well, I had a good weekend.

if you want to hear about it. I did a rare event with Willie, my brother. So when we get together, it's always fun and interesting. I get to break out all my jokes that I used in Duck Dynasty because people have forgotten them at this point. Because back then, I basically got paid to have a beard and make fun of my brother Willie. What a dream job.

Where were you at? We, look, we had something happen. It was a local phenomenon, which is we had ULM, the university that's our sister town in Monroe, playing Louisiana Tech, which is in Rustin, which is where I was born. And my dad... Where dad played college football. Yeah, and I'm sure Phil's pictures on a plaque somewhere at Louisiana Tech. On the Hall of Fame.

They played a football game against each other for the first time in 26 years. Wow. So the crowd gathered, and we were asked, we have a mutual friend, Shelly Giss, who works for the ULM Sports PR. I probably should have asked what her specific job title is. But she creates buzz, you know, for the athletic department. And her sister, which I've shared this story before, actually wrote about her in the book I wrote was basically my best friend in high school.

Her nickname was Goose. She died in a car wreck. You can read about it in the book. Because when I came to Christ, she was the first person that I met in the high school arena, even though we didn't go to the same school, who loved Jesus. And that was the connection. And what was so awkward about the relationship, it wasn't a lot. romantic relationship. I was like, I was a late bloomer. So imagine me in high school, I was maybe

5-2, and she was 6-2, and her nickname was Goose, and of course my nickname was Duck Boy since I was 5-2. And it was just an interesting odd couple, but Jesus was the glue. And so this is her sister, who loves Jesus, and that's why I went. So she asked me and Willie to come, because she's trying to create, you know, they were creating a vibe, which the vibe was created. And I'm telling you, the pre-game, they had two, there was three Navy SEALs,

and two of them parachuted from the heavens onto that football field, doing tricks down. And I thought, no matter what happens in this game, this was worth coming and watching this. I mean, I was in the back of my mind. I was thinking, America. And they landed, because I thought, you know, halfway down, I thought, we're fixing to witness, you know, a couple of fellas die. Because the trick. That actually happened this week.

It happened this week. Did that really? Yeah. That happened at one of the games. Look, the wind was blowing. It looks so dangerous to me. And so as soon as they landed, I looked around, I looked at Shelley. I was like, I need to meet those guys if you can make that happen.

And so I did. I walked up there, and they're getting off their parachutes. I guess one of them was there because there was just two of them riding the parachutes down. And I guess he was there to be the lone survivor in case it didn't go well. Or I don't know if they jumped out of a plane. I'm not sure how they, when I looked up, they were. dots in the, just specks as far as you could see. And I said, man, as much as I believe in the resurrection of Jesus, I could not do that. And of course, they busted out laughing. They thought

that was funny. I said, no, I'm serious. I believe the, because I was wanting to let them know, you know, about the resurrection. I was kind of subliminally setting the tone for the conversation. You would need, if you do that for a living days, you need to have a healthy belief in the resurrection. Well, they were like, well, we want to take you. You're just the perfect guy to do this if you believe in the resurrection. I was like, no, wait a minute. And they were like, no, look, have you ever been in an old beat up truck and, you know, trying to get from point A to point B and just hanging on? I said, all my life.

I mean, the one I got now is pretty beat up. And they said, that's what it feels like. You're just hanging on an old beat-up truck coming down. He's like, it's not like you think. And I said, there's something about heights. We talked about this. I said, I just don't feel right. It's not that I'm scared to die.

And one of them looked at me right now, and he's like, no, no, you're scared to die. You'd get here and do it. It's like, I'm really not. I just don't want to do that. But so that was spectacular. And, of course, you know, I'm around, I'm on the ULM side, and there's media everywhere, and I'm with Willie, and they're asking us all these questions.

I'm like, I'm here because they wanted me to pick a side. I'm obviously, this is my hometown, but I was born in Rustin. My dad played for Louisiana Tech. Let's just celebrate football in North Louisiana. That was kind of my take. So I went to political route. But I think, you know, deep down, you know,

She was like, because you have, was 0 and 5 going into this game. And the first half was zero to zero. And it had been such a crazy day in college football. Like Georgia lost at home to Auburn. Alabama got strapped by Tennessee. What, BYU beat Notre Dame? Notre Dame.

Florida beat Texas. Florida beat Texas. How could we forget that, Zach? I mean, that was shocked. I was shocked. I predicted it. At Texas being down two touchdowns at halftime. You know, to all you Texas fans out there,

here's what I want to tell you. Welcome to the SEC. This is what it's like. It's saying like the old days, you know what I mean? So I was trying to be realistic the whole time because I'm watching the two teams, and I'm just like Louisiana Tech's better, but Louisiana Tech missed two field goals in the first half.

ULM blocked one. We got an interception. But it was all what Willie kept saying, hey it's something in the air you know and there was a really good crowd and uh but i kept saying i think louisiana tech is going to strap them and you know shelly's like what do you say i mean i was like it comes down the way this the nil thing is now and and all that i mean i hate to say this but whoever you know if the more money you spend the better player the better athlete that's just the way college football is set up

And that, Shelly's like, why do you think y'all are here? We're trying to get y'all to in on this. I was like, look, I don't know what you think. So one of the things I've realized recently is that even though you drink water, Al, you may not have the electrolytes that you need. I know you've been, since you've got your health in shape, you've been drinking some electrolytes. Yeah, I had to. And I didn't realize that, especially if you are on a, you know, pretty severe dialy, like I was on with the high protein and low carbs,

that you lose a lot of electrolytes in that process. And so you've got to replace them or you really begin feeling bad. It's a big deal. You know, Jay's has the, I think the watermelon in front of you right there. I have the lemonade beside the watermelon. They are excellent. I'm telling you, Jill's favorite electrolyte drink is cure. It's my favorite as well.

They also have, I've got the energy drinks as well. If you like to amp up with a little bit of a caffeine, they've got these are really good. It's all natural sugars. there's no added sugar to it. Yeah, one of the things I like most about it is how simple the ingredients are. Very simple. Coconut water, pink Himalayan salt and real fruit.

They've got peach, mango, watermelon, lemonade, blood orange, tropical punch, just to name a few. And if you don't know which one you would like the best, then you can grab their variety pack. My favorite right now is the blood orange. That's my go-to, but I kind of switch back and forth. Cures the electrolyte mix that I've started reaching for every day with clean ingredients and nothing artificial. It's become easy to stay hydrated. Find it on Amazon or save 20% at curehydration.com with code Unashamed. That's curehydration.com code unashamed.

I don't have millions of dollars to be funneling in to the local football team. It's like around here, NIL means I'm going Neil in a game of spades, which means I don't have a very good hand. Neil would be as bad. that was funny, but nobody laughed. I was like, you know, I think we're, let's just enjoy. We're playing together again. So it was a good experience.

There was a lot of Jesus things because I thought, look, ULM, that's a minute, they put on a really good show. I mean, I, and had a lot of really what I would call Jesus stuff going on. They had the boys club, girls and boys clubs there, and we took pictures with them and a lot of military guys. I met a World War II veteran 101 years old who was at the game on the sidelines with us. And it was so funny because we were on the sidelines, and every time someone would get down to that end of the field,

the referees would have to, you know, they'd back us up. They got to him, because he was in a wheelchair. But look, perfect. He was very articulate and his memory was fine, and he's making jokes. You just couldn't help but love this guy. And there was a representative for the VA in Louisiana, and we talked to them and took pictures with a lot of people. It was just really, really good, good stuff, helping the community.

A lot of kids with special needs and different things like that. So I was really glad I was there, and I thought, man, what an event. This was awesome. But that referee tried to move the World War II veteran back, and he's like, no. And I said, when you get to be 101, you can do whatever you want to. And you survive World War II. Exactly. That Ralph kind of looked at that situation, and I thought, what is he going to do?

And he said, you're fine. Exactly. And I thought, man, this is awesome. But anyway, Tech turned the corner in the second half, turned out to be a strapping in the second half. But what's funny is, Jay's, that Willie must have been the day of football because he sent me a picture of him at the LSU game from the morning. Oh, he did. He did. He was walking out, walking down, what do they call it, the Tiger Wall. Victory Hill, Tiger Lane. And at LSU, he was side by side with Lane Kiffin. They met somewhere weirdly as soon as

Lane Kiffin was hired. It was so funny, I was like, well, how did you get that gig? And he's like, he sent me a text. I was like, you know, you want to, you want to walk us in? And, you're you know well he's like sure he's like then he was trying to explain kind of what the what I was explaining about ULM he's like we like you know creating a vibe and we get these celebrities and what he's like yeah I get I get the concept of doing the same thing tonight at ULM a day but uh so yeah he said it was it was real exciting and so yeah he put in a long day he basically left at half time and said I got to give me some sleep but But it was a really fun moment.

And then meanwhile, my wife was doing, she hates it when I could just call her my wife. Missy was doing an event with a mentorship thing. I think she does it three or four times a year. And that next year she's doing like a huge event. She does it twice a year. Maddie knows more than I do. Shocker. She does it twice a year.

And it's ages, I think, 22 to 32. I got that right. So she has a little small group of women. They do a whole weekend. She speaks. And she's like in a trance for three or four days because she, you know, she has all this presentation. But she sent me a text right when I was leaving the game.

And she's like, well, we just buried three women in our pool. And I was like, oh, my God. And it's pretty chilly. So I thought whoever was in charge of that, they had a shock to the system. And what was fascinating is Maddie was a part of the group, which I found fascinating. Oh, Maddie was in the mentor group? She was. And something weird happened because when they were introducing themselves, you know, getting to know each other for the weekend,

somebody said, well, are you Maddie from the podcast? I mean, how they figured that out was shocking. Maybe your name. It could be. I mean, that's your first go-to. You know, I'm Maddie. Because she said you were from Arkansas, but you live in West Monroe, and it's like, are you the Maddie? The Maddie.

So now these women have actually seen the real Maddie. I'm just hoping Maddie's not prepared like a tell-all book called Surviving the Robertsons or something like that. Yeah. Well, you need to do a movie. Here's your silly movie. You could do a skit. Not don't think big production, because I know how cheap you are. Because you have Maddie.

She's the brains of the operation, but she's unseen. There's a mystique about it. Then you have Zach, the money man, because we all know how Al tighty is. And I guess Al's the glue, although his glue is not too sticky today based on his setup. It's kind of like a mask and tape today more than glue. You've got to have high stakes, so the stakes could be that Al's being held hostage, and we have to somehow get him out of his hostage situation. And y'all can depict me however you want to.

I figured I'm kind of a loose cannon, but whatever y'all come up with. So it would be a pretty good Saturday Night Live skit. Well, I had a rabbit hole this weekend. Oh, a rabbit hole. What? Zach Rabbit hole. That's breaking news. It didn't start with Jude, but it,

kind of ended there. And so I'm at the very beginning of it, so I don't know if we should dive into it or not yet, but we could. Well, let's dive into it. Look, I've been on a rabbit hole for two or three weeks in this book of Jude, and it has been fascinating. I've been more excited, not just about anything, you know, that's that profound, but just a lot of connective tissue in the Bible that I had never. realized until we started reading Jude and going backwards and seeing why he wrote what he wrote. But maybe we should do just an overall review. I mean, at the end of the day, I think you've got to keep this thing simple. And you had impostors come into this church who are part of it, who

secretly came in, but their life was not mirroring their belief system. I mean, it's a little, it's somewhat similar to James, you know, with the faith without actions. And second Peter and first, second, third, John. There's no doubt as we're like getting into, you know, 30, 40 years post-Jesus resurrection leaving, now you're starting to see some things creep into the. the church because all these later writers, you know, from 60 forward, that's what you're starting to see. They're all dealing with this kind of similar issue. So, but Jude is the most

poignant, I guess. I mean, he just goes right to it because it's such a short letter. But, man, it's power pack because he, and we talked about this before, he brings in the celestial, like heavenly realm component here really more than anybody else. And I think that's what makes it so intriguing. The deeper we dive into it, that's what keeps getting me is sort of this peel back of the curtain

to look and see this effect that the other realm has had on humanity. And you sent some stuff, Jason, it was really good. I hadn't quite put it all together, but like that. We'll go over that. Yeah, we'll go over that

at some point. that was a rabbit hole that I didn't want to forget. So I made it into a, what would you call that? Y'all are the ones that do that, like an outline. Yeah. And so I actually put a rabbit hole to paper and got AI to help me organize it. But before you give yours, I did another thing because you think, well, what does this have to do with modern day? Because we're going to really take some rabbit holes, especially when it comes to the book of Enid, which I'm way more versed in, since.

we last met and kind of figured out why that's such a big deal and kind of how that connects and it's it which i didn't really know this but where it comes in where jude uh didn't quote but this quote that that he used in i always forget where that is in jude uh you're talking about Michael? Well, when he quotes basically a lot of the Hebrew scriptures where he says there's a time when Jesus is coming with thousands of angels. Where is that it? In Jude? Yeah, it's in June. Oh, it's from, yeah, that's from Enid. 14. Yeah, that's what I'm getting at. Enoch, the Seventh of the Mount prophesied, see the Lord is coming with thousands upon thousands of his holy ones, which, and there's the quote from the book of Enic, which is a quote

from several passages in Hebrew scriptures. So people who kind of say, hey, don't make such a big deal about the book of Enic. But the Bible makes a big deal about Enick, especially when you get to, and I'm kind of going down a rabbit hole, I'm not ready to go down. But when we get down here to when it says the way of King. Some have followed the way of Cain. Well, when you kind of look at the way of Cain and when we get to that verse, we can do it. But he had a son, and guess what his name was,

also named Enick. Yeah. And he built a city and named it Enoch. And then in Cessline, seven generations down, he has Enoch, the Enoch that walked with God and God took him to heaven. And so you kind of start seeing these two camps emerge. one which started with a murder and you know the evil one

remember crouching at the door sin crouching at the door and it leads to that line and we can go we'll go down that rabbit hole at some point but the point I was going to make is what the connective tissue is with inek in the book of Enick is when you get to that story in Genesis 6 about these angels taking on flesh to get with human women, well, what the book of Enix says is that happened at Mount Herman. Well, that's what's interesting

because Mount Herman is going to become really famous in the rest of the Bible when it comes to spiritual forces of evil, celestial beings. Think when, when, when, Peter, when Jesus asked his disciples, who did the son of man say I am? And they went through the list, you know. And well, they were, that's where they were, Mount Herman. And he's like, but who do you say that I am? Peter said, you're the Christ, the Son of the Living God. And he said, you know, on this

Rockabama church, and the gates of Hades, which the place they were at, was described at Mount Herman as the gates of Hades, the underworld, the realm of the dead. And then when you get to the transfiguration and here's Moses and Elijah, well, guess where they were? We're back to Mount Hermon. So when you put all those things together, all of a sudden you said, this is fascinating. Yeah. And so I think you, it doesn't make you think we are just coming up.

with stuff, it just seems to fit together. And you've got to realize there's a reason Jude is quoting from that, because this was, they viewed that as important, this literature that they were reading that contributed to this cosmic battle. And the note that I sent you and Zach, the rabbit hole, that was more the cosmic battle over the land itself. So it's easy for dinner to become an afterthought during the holiday season, which is coming up right around the corner. But Home Chef is offering an easy way to make busy weeks less hectic. You can get fresh ingredients delivered right to your door and recipes that are super easy and meals that actually taste good.

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HomeCheft.com slash Unashame must be an active subscriber to receive free dessert. I won't have all the details of this, but this is what hit me this week. So I was watching this all started. I was doom scrolling on Instagram, which I would not recommend, but I was. And I saw a clip that someone I knew had posted of James Tellerica, who's the guy running for Senate in Texas. And he's a pastor. And they were asking the question of him at a town hall meeting.

Like, the person was like, I'm a pro-life Christian. Like, what are you going to do to essentially convince me that you're not going to eradicate the right for people to live. And his response was so concerning to me. Not, I mean, we get in this debate on abortion and stuff all the time. Now, you're kind of in that whole world. And I thought, I was thinking, what is it about his response that was just so unnerving to me? And one of the things he kept saying that the solution was to stop unplanned pregnancies.

It was all about planning pregnancy. The whole thing is like, the only life that's, the only life worth protecting is the one that was planned. And that was kind of the premise of his argument. And he was like, everybody wants to reduce the number of abortions. I want to reduce the number of abortions. But the way we do that is we have to stop unplanned pregnancies. And I got to thinking about it. I said, you know what's funny?

I have five kids. And not one of my five children, none of their pregnancies were planned. Me and Jill didn't plan. I mean, they were planned. They just weren't planned by us. Me and Jill didn't plan on any of those. And I thought, man, and I look at my daughter, you know, Ruth, and I'm like, hers was certainly not planned.

And I thought, you know, her life is not valuable because her, the pregnancy or her conception was planned by her biological parents. None of my other four biological children, their life wasn't, it wasn't worthwhile because me and Jill planned it. We didn't plan it. And I was just thinking about this debate on abortion and the right to lie. and how so often it gets into like the political. And I think we've missed the bigger picture here.

So here's what I thought about. I went back and I was reading all throughout from Genesis 128 that the blessing, God blesses them. And he says, be fruitful and multiply. And go subdue the earth, talking about your land acquisition. I mean, that is literally what he's saying. Be fruitful. Go have children and then now go occupy the land

and have more children. and occupy more land and have more children and occupy more land. That seems to be the prerogative of God from the very beginning when he gives this initiative to humanity. Then you have the Genesis 6 account, which you mentioned. I'm glad you brought that up because it ties into Jude. The world gets very corrupt, murder. I mean, everything, in fact, the first murder was post-fall, where the blessing was to be fruitful

and multiplied. Now the family is killing itself at Canaan Abel. Genesis 6, it gets so bad that God's like, I'm going to watch. wipe everything out. Genesis 9, he comes back after he rescues humanity. They come out of the arc and he says, be fruitful and multiply. And I've mentioned this many times in this podcast. That narrative goes throughout all of scripture as the blessing of God. God's blessing was two things. Have a family and go work. And then the curse comes that now when you have a family, it's going to be painful. And when you work, it's going to produce thorns and thistles, Genesis 3. And so the evil one has always

wanted to thwart the will of God. So in Jude, listen to what it says here. This is kind of a weird verse in Jude 1-6. It says, and the angels who did not stay within their own position of authority, but left their proper dwelling, he has kept in eternal chains under glooming darkness until the judgment of the great day, just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desires, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire. What was the sin of Sodomagamara? It was the same sin as whatever these angels that Jews talking about,

they were in some kind of realm. They were in a boundary of their existence. They had a particular occupation. They had authority in a certain way, and they left that authority. We know what happened in Genesis 6. They leave that realm, and then they go in, and what they do, they have sex with the women

and create Nephilim and all the men of renown. And so the fall of these angels are a big part of this is that they just left what God had designed them to do. They went outside of that. And sensuality always follows this. So one of the things that Michael Heiser writes about in his book, The Unseen Realm, is he connects these dots. I'd never seen this until I read this book a couple years ago, that when he gets to Genesis 11, and you have a phrase where it says that they wanted to make a name for themselves, for themselves and that's why they built the tower.

He makes the argument that it's the same Hebrew language. And that phrase is the same Hebrew language as men of renown in Genesis 6. And he makes the argument that he thinks that these angels came back and did this again. And what's interesting about this is that I believe that what is happening in Genesis 6 and Genesis 11 is there is a participation, a coordinated participation, with the celestial realm with earth, with human beings in the orchestration of evil, primarily seen in the worship of angels, in the worship of animals, and the sacrifice of children. Bail, Mulek, all these, that was the way of the Canaanites.

And so when we get all the way now, when I was, and I did the, I went on a deep dive, on the history of abortion in America and the eugenics movement. And I'm like, just at the beginning of this, but I'm going to be, I'm going to be, to educate myself in the history of this. Because I looked up Margaret Sanger, who was the founder of Planned Parenthood. There's that term, plan, right? We're going to plan parenthood.

And I didn't realize how deeply she was tied to the third right and the Nazi party to Adolf Hitler to the Ku Klux Klan. One of her founding board members was a member of the Ku Klux clan. How much of even what they were doing

initially was to get rid of the unfits And you think, what is happening here is that there has been an orchestration of people having a partnership with demonic celestial beings. And I think it's, I actually think that what we're seeing today in the modern Planned Parenthood movement, the eugenics movement, infanticide, post-birth abortions, which is what some of these guys are advocating for, personhood theory. All of these things, they're just new iterations of what we see in the old text. Testament with Mollick and with bail and the worship of these idols. And it kind of raises the bar to the point where you think about Pastor Philip Anthony Mitchell, who wrote the book Contend, which is on the podcast out of Jude. I'm starting to see now that the book of Jude is

actually very relevant for today because this demonic realm didn't go away. It hasn't gone away. It hasn't been fully defeated yet. It'll only be defeated when Christ comes back in the second coming. But we are the church. And the and the, and the, and the, gates of hell will not will not prevail against us. And so we have an active role in this fight. So that's a lot. But that's, that's what I was on this weekend. Well, and I 100% agree. I've seen the same things as you. I mean, you compiled it well, but I think you're exactly right. And, you know, I've said this before in turn to this planned pregnancy stuff. you know, from from Mary and Joseph's perspective,

they didn't plan for the Holy Spirit to show up one day and say the son of God is going to be, you're going to be impregnated with the son of God. That wasn't planned from their perspective. I mean, it's been planned from God's perspective from the beginning. And look what happened. I mean, God decided to become flesh by being a baby and being born and being protected.

from evil and being whisked away to another country so that he wouldn't be killed by another, you know, infanticide person, you know, Herod, in the beginning, that it just kills children randomly to get it, you know, to keep his own power. So you're right. There's a consistency that's been there all along about innocence and about blood. And even now, I mean, this thing with the pills going out, you know, certain states have said no abortion, but now they just, they come in the mail. But the premise is the problem is the premise.

Jase, what do you, what, Jace always says that the Bible is a story about how God gets his family back. And to me, that makes a lot of sense. And I agree with him. That is the center. That is, that is the story. So if that's God's agenda, then Satan's agenda is going to be to destroy the family. That's right. In all capacity.

And we, and so the book of Jude, it paints this picture, like most of the, the Bible of how the evil ones, one of his primary tools is can I separate sexuality from procreation? Can I separate it out? Because once you can divorce that, then your sexuality becomes more just sensuality and it has nothing to do with procreation. It has nothing to do with making love anymore. And it terminates on itself. And in the end, the only end of that is death. It's a death culture, it's a death work. And I think that's what we got to back the conversation up. Yes, we can debate on whether a fetus is a life and all that human being and are they 100%. But this goes, that's downstream of the conversation. The conversations should begin with what is God's prerogative for the world?

What is he doing? What is he, what is he trying to accomplish? And he's trying to get his family back. He will accomplish it. So Al, I've told you about what we're doing at Echle. Ackle is partnering with the Jimmy movie coming out in theaters on November 6th. Jimmy is the untold true story of America's most beloved actor, Jimmy Stewart, and it's the iconic role that saved him. So this is going to be really interesting. And so for a limited time, we've got something really special for our audience. We're giving away two free tickets to see Jimmy with an annual Echle membership.

All you have to do is go to Ackle.com, and here's the code you want to use to get the two free tickets. Go Unashamed. That's ECHL.com. Use the code. Go Unashamed. And you'll get all of Eccles' faith and family content for a full year. Plus, you guys are going to get two free tickets to Jimmy. Go to ECHL.com. Use the code. Go unashamed and get your two free tickets to Jimmy. That's going to go into what I sent you, which I don't think we have time to go through that at the moment. But I'll say this. I think it's made me think outside the box on a lot of these things because you think, well, why don't the evil one just realize, okay, I'm not going to win and repent and turn to God? And you're like, well, why doesn't that happen?

And the more I thought about it and looked at this and studied it, you know, he's not a human being. You know, humans were born and we have flesh. which weakness happens because of that. But the evil one and all of the evil angels are the watchers. You know, the book of Enoch says there was 200 of them. So take that for what it is.

But we know more than one has fallen. And we brought up Azizel in a previous podcast. But you got to realize they left God with full knowledge of who he was. and who's that the angels the evil yeah yeah the rebellious angels and uh well didn't it revelation 12 jays says that uh Satan took a third of the heavenly host with him yeah but but i think that's i think that's talking about the because the context of that was the uh the virgin birth yeah and so if you read that book that uh zach referenced uh the unseen realm yeah he doesn't put that like before the beginning.

Let me say this, though. Let me say this about what you just said. This is kind of a more recent thought I've had, but Philippians 2 says that when Christ returns, it says that every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord, above the earth, below the earth and on the earth. And so when we fast forward to the

consummation of the kingdom at the second coming of Christ, what's going to happen is Satan himself. Think about this. We'll bow down before Christ and say, you are Lord. Now, he's going to be cast in the hell, but you're not going to have an option at that point. So I don't know if, I say that to say that I've been thinking about this. Did they really fully know? At some level, God has hidden himself even from the angels. He's hidden his glory from the angels.

and from everyone because if God were just like open up, first of all, we couldn't, we couldn't consume the full, like it would, it would evaporate. But there's a threshold to God's glory of his revealed glory that no being will be able to resist the truth of who he is. And so it's for whatever reason, I think this kind of gets in the whole free will debate, but like he's hitting himself to a degree as to not override your free will. Even the angels have a choice at this point.

If they want to believe in a lie, God allows that to be possible. But there will be a point at the second coming where it will be impossible. It will be impossible to believe in a lie because you'll be looking at God and you're like, in Christ, you'll see. Whoa, you'll be just like John the revelator on your face. You may be right. I respectfully disagree. But I disagree mainly because humans were made in the image of God. the evil one, I mean the angelic world had a specific purpose, which was different than ours,

to, you know, serve and be messengers and help the kingdom, you know, the kingdom people, just human beings in general. So I just think they had a job to do once they crossed that boundary. They were bound to the earth, and there's no repentance. available. So I think that's why they were bound up and will be forever punished. Yeah, I mean, I'm getting that from a lot of different other verses, but yeah, I really wasn't prepared to get into that. I just assumed we all agreed on that, but I'll, I can concoct that for a future debate. But I think that, I mean, I think I'm right on it, but I just don't have all the verses

at the ready and it take too long. What I wanted to point out was the first verse that I think that goes in with what we're talking about, about this cosmic battle. When you read Jude, and he says, I think this is really fascinating. I feel like if we set up this foundation, this is going to be really interesting. In Jude, where he says, if you go back to where we're at, he's like, you have these, which I think is a, template for this cosmic battle that's being played out today. Because really when you think about it, if Jude and 2nd Peter says that these watchers or these demonic angels are bound up, well, what is happening today?

I think you get in a practical way a hard time explaining this. So I looked at what scholars say about this, and they're like, well, they introduced a template, basically. And so maybe that's true. You know, I mean, you remember the story about the pigs and here's these demonic forces. Now, let's say these are the spirits of this nephalum that are roaming around looking for somewhere to inhabit, that maybe the flood killed the bodies, you know. So if they're bound, how come we still see demonic? Because you mentioned that earlier, you know, the demonic activity.

So people are like, well, it set up a template for, which is kind of what Jude is saying, you see this same spirit of rebellion. Because when you think about the answer from Jude's perspective, this is what I was trying to get to 30 minutes ago, where we are to surrender. And these people are saying they surrender. They come in there and they're talking about, you know, all these great things about God, which I'll use a parallel passage to illustrate this.

There's an obscure verse in 2nd Timothy 3, 1 through 9, that basically says the same thing Jude is saying. In the last days, let me just read that, and I'll illustrate the point. This is crazy what I'm fixed to read. Second Timothy three, what? One through nine. I mean, the point I make is going to be pretty crazy.

But let's just read it. And look, people read this all the time, and they're like, the last times are here. It says, you must understand this. In the last days, distressing times will come. People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boasters, arrogant I'm getting my glasses on

you'll be read it for you I got it now abusive disobedient to the parents ungrateful and holy inhuman implacable slanders pro what's that next word I can't read that you read it Zach

what verse you in now I'm in uh two three three three heartless unappeasable slanderous without self control brutal, not loving good, treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power, avoid such

people. For among them are those who creep into households and capture weak women, burdened with sin, and led astray by various passions, always learning and never, always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth. Well, that's good. Just as Janus and Jabris opposed Moses. So these men also opposed the truth. Men corrupted in mind and disqualified regarding the faith. But they will not get very far, for their folly will be plain to all, as was that of those two men.

Okay. So listen to this. So you see the connection, obviously. You have a sexual immorality component here going in weak with women. have having a form of godliness holding to the outward form of godliness but denying its power. What I want to bring up is when Paul brought up these two names here, as in the days of Moses, Janus and Jambrius, they're not in the Hebrew scriptures. So when you look at what their names mean, it has a double meaning.

you know, it's a form of gracious to God, and I can't remember what the other one was. It was something that sounded good, but at the end of the day, and a lot of scholars think these were pseudonyms because one meant seducer, and the other meant rebel. And so what's fascinating, you say,

well, what's that got to do? Well, you go back from where we're reading in Jude 5, and this is the point I wanted to make. This is a rabbit hole, but it's a good one. So in Jude 5, when it says, though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord at one time delivered his people out of Egypt,

but later destroyed those who do not believe. So when you go to Numbers 14, you see this scenario play out. And just to, I'm not going to read, it's a long chapter, read it on your own. But basically, in Numbers 13, the Lord sent some spies. Caleb, see, who was the guys he sent?

Well, he sent 12 at Joshua and Caleb. Joshua and Caleb were heading this up. Here's what's fascinating. They go in and he sent some in the land of Canaan. Well, when you get to the end of 13, this is fascinating. And no scholar or link made this connection. I just happened to see it because I read Numbers 14 about basically a direct quote from Jude saying, hey, he killed people because of their adultery

in the wilderness who he had liberated. And it's pretty, it's graphic. Christ, specifically Christ. Yeah. But when I went back and looked, I said, well, I need to get the context of this. So I went back and read number 13. That's what you do. I was going backwards. So they go, Caleb on this scout and run, I want to read, Read this. This is Numbers 13. It says, verse 27, Moses gave this account. We went into the land to which you sent us, and it does flow with milk and honey. Here is its fruit, but the people who live there are powerful and the cities are fortified. So they have big walls, which, by the way, going back to the way of Cain, I want to throw this in, when you read the book of Jubilee, which I realize is a Jewish

literature, kind of like the book of Enid that supports this. It kind of goes into what happened to Kane in this city and he was the first one to build these walls. He made all these weapons and they pillaged their neighbors and it just became

just a cesspool of selfish ambition, sexual immorality and hurting anyone around. And that's how they operated. And he builds a stone house in this book of Jubilee. and basically how he dies,

which you've got to remember, he killed his brother with a stone, and now he's living in a fortified city that he created, named after his son, and then the house falls on itself. That's how he dies. Could I make one little caveat to numbers 13? My translation in verse 28 says this.

So the spot on the land, because they're supposed to take the land. That's key, to your point on taking the land. My translation says, However, the people who dwell in the land are strong, and the cities are fortified and very large. And besides, we saw the descendants of AAC there, very large. That's where I'm going. Because look, but then he explains that.

You say, who are these descendants of Anac? Well, when you skip down to, well, I'll just keep reading, verse 30, then Caleb's silence to be before Moses and said, we should go up there and take possession of the land. We can do it. I mean, God said to do it. Verse 31. But the men who had gone up with him said, we can't attack those people. They're stronger than we are.

And they spread among the Israelites, a bad report about the land they had explored. They said the land we explored devours those living in it. And all the people there are of great size. Verse 33, key verse, we saw the Nephilim there. The descendants of Anak came from the Nephilim. Well, now we go back to Genesis 6.

Now we're going back to this Mount, what was the Mount Hermon, from the Book of Enix. And it says, we seem like grasshoppers are in their eyes. Now look, a lot of people, a lot of scholars, they'll say, well, they're just using this as like, kind of like what Paul did with these two characters, you know, Janice and Jamper. These are pseudonyms, and they're saying this is the prototype of demonic activity. I think everyone agrees that's there, but is this literal?

But Genesis 6 also says the Nephlam were here on the earth and would be afterward, after the flood. So it seems to me. Well, okay. Let me say, I'm getting short on time. But so 40 years later, 40 years later, Joshua goes back in, and he does conquer this land. He does exterminate the Nephilim. You know where he didn't go? You know where he didn't go?

where he didn't go he didn't go to the philistines fast forward now you got king david and he's standing before goliath and who's a giant and and i would argue was was a remnant or an ancestry of the nephalum i think what this where this why this matters we're going to have to get into this in detail the next episode for sure but i think why this matters is we don't want to admit that there is a demonic round because that is scary to think about. But I think we have to raise the stakes of what's happening here. I think the Bible does it. I think that's what Jew does.

He's raising the stakes here. This is not humans just operating autonomously in the physical realm without any connection to the supernatural. There is a connection. Well, here's what I want to say. Here's what I want to say in closing. The reason we're doing this is because when you read Jude 5 and you see, you can read numbers 14 and you'll see

God sent a plague. He killed them and he passed it on for generations to root out the people who wouldn't go into the land even though he said I'm going to be with you and we're going to rip them. They wouldn't go in there because of walls and giants.

And it was at the base of that was this celestial fallen world that's in cahoots with evil humans. And that's still going on today when you surrender to the Lord and you go public for Jesus, this is going to be a problem. There's still walls and there's still giants and there's still demonic forces out there and the

spiritual forces that we can't see. And even though you don't see it, there's a reality coming. This whole bunch will stand before God. You will look up in the ones that did maintain the boundary and are working in cahoots with the family of God for God. They're coming. coming and there's a there's a judgment coming and you need to pick a side because because if you're on the right side guess what you'll do you'll judge the angels and so that exactly which is what led me to this to being in disagreement with those that are fallen they're done they're they're done and they will be eternally done and it'll be official when it comes back because i just think they have a different role and since they fell from the glory of god they fell from the

the light. So that's a debate for another time. I think I think the closes this. Don't be like Moses. So God's called us. He's called us to conquer the land. You say, how many people is it going to take to do it? However I mean, God says, if it's one, if it's 10, who cares? If God says do it, then he's going to see it through. Be like Joshua and Joshua 15. Go in and do it. So I think that's our call is to actually participate. That's why it is scary, but to the level of fear that should rise in you and you understand this truth about the Bible

and you understand the truth about the world we live in, there is a divine orchestration from a celestial world. You should exponentially be more secure in knowing that we house the Holy Spirit, and that he is the ultimate power. So let's do this. I think we could sum this up. This was the heavenly perspective of the spiritual war going on.

Why don't we come on the next podcast and do that outline that I sent you Al and Zay, and do it from the land. Because heaven and earth coming together is a theme of the Bible. So we did the spiritual realm, the heavenly perspective and the war, and now we'll do the cosmic war of the land, which is why this whole thing was a shadow, what I think to us as followers of Jesus,

not only judging angels from the heavenly perspective, but inheriting the land. And you say, how much of it? all of it. Thanks, Sermon on the Mount. What is that? The meek will inherit the earth. All right, we're out of time.

We'll see you next time on Unashame. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcast. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube. And be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch every episode.