Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 202 | Phil and Jase's Relationship Breakup Advice, Male vs. Female, and Trump's Inauguration

Episode Date: January 4, 2021

Jase and Phil offer advice for anyone going through a relationship breakup. Jase explores the difference between male and female — ahem — ducks. Al and Jase remember attending President Trump's 2016 inauguration, and with Al's birthday coming up, they recall his short-lived birthday tradition. The guys discuss how to respond to churches that preach hate and why there's no place for racism in Christianity. And Phil points out a big flaw in the belief that we each have our own truth. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? To use some of Jesus' terminology, you know, when Jesus arrived via the virgin birth, which had been prophesied about. Yep. So here comes God in the last. 700 years earlier. Yeah. So Jesus is here, and the weight had been about roughly 5,000. years by my count from the original prediction somebody the seed of a woman will crush Satan

Genesis 315s yeah right you and you look at these events as they begin to unfold from four different writers the four different writers but I notice one thing is throughout the whole thing because we live in a culture now where they say well that's you that's your truth I have my truth Well, what we're seeing here is one individual who ever lived on any issue, he keeps saying, like in John 21, over about 18, I tell you the truth. I tell you the truth. I tell you the truth. So I think the argument to the truth crowd, we have our truth, you have yours, we say one difference. our truth is thousands of years in the making, Jesus Christ.

How far back does yours date? You see what I'm saying? To 100 years ago. To Marxism or whatever to it is. That's right. I mean, they run it back to their college professors year before last. He said, we have our truth. You see what I'm saying?

I always go back to that pilot when he said, what is truth? I think their side's always what. and to quote Shaquille and Neil, went to LSU, remember they said, well, what do you think about this guy who's up and coming? He went, who? And they said his name again, he went, who? Yeah, yeah. He was acting like he never heard of him.

Yeah, but the better, I don't know why I came over that, but go Google that one. But you think about it, he said a lot. Yeah. And you catch what he said from four different writers. But at the end of all of it, you. add it up and you say, this is quite the individual as far as if you just want to put a resume. Right. I mean, creator, reconciler, redeemer, savior.

Phil, that's what I mean. All these people in these college professors, I'm like, who, who are you? Yeah, yeah. I got a guy who was a prediction over hundreds of years. You know, you're talking about long-term prognostications. Thousands of years. Well, yeah. thousands if you tie in the Genesis 3.

Yeah. And all of a sudden, but these specific ones that I was talking about that come to fruition. And we're dealing with a star from the, every prediction that you, I mean, how many is it? Prophecies about Jesus. Oh, there's hundreds. Yeah. It's a lot of, I had a list of them. Which was even interesting, though, does even what people would think of other ancient

religions are not really that ancient. I mean, Islam was 600 years, Muhammad was 600 years after Christ. I mean, it's a fairly old religion. Some of their arguments. It's still not going all the way back. Some of their arguments, the atheist argument is, well, some guy just rolled in, read the Old Testament, and then he said, I'm the one that we're talking about. So, but when it gets down to, you know, so how do you explain his virgin birth?

Right. I mean, his arrival, you know, what? What do you have to do about that? How could he have said, yeah, that's me right there? Well, what's interesting is, though, and we share Christians, we share our history with Judaism, but then we forked off at Jesus for those that didn't come along with us because they're still practicing Judaism.

So it's really interesting. I mean, we do go back. I mean, we're ancient. But I think as Christians, we've got to do two things. You've heard me comment on this. And, I mean, I'm saying this in love. one is sometimes Christians quote that salvation is found in no one else Jesus but they almost say it in a way that's like yeah and I'm glad you that they're proud

they're not in well and like being sectarian to a point to where you're alienating the people who don't look at Jesus and I'm like no our job is the opposite yes salvation is found in Jesus and it's our job to make him presentable to other people. And the way Jesus did that, he went and ran around with the riffraow. He wasn't going around saying, you know, you're lost without me.

Which was his greatest criticism from the sectarian crowd. Because remember, they didn't want these people in. They're just like, you know, I mean, every time they dealt with them was like, oh, these people, who wants them around? And Jesus was like, I want everybody in, you know? It's done through love and grace. And in Jesus, look, is the place where presentation does matter.

That's right. It matters how you present him. Because you can go to, I told the story earlier, but when I was in Austin, you know, there was a street, I was going to say preacher, but he was just a street hater. Just everybody that walked by was just hollering, ferociously, hail, fire, and brimstone using four letter words, but in the name of Jesus, I thought, how many people do you think he's going to convert? I'll tell you. Zero. Maybe one other crazy dude. What I'm zeroing in on is in today's culture,

in lieu of all of what's said about this Jesus and all the things they say about him and the ones who follow him. The message of the cross, 1 Corinthians 118, is foolishness to those who are perishing. It's true. They're like, what? Yeah. He did what?

He got here, how, virgin. You actually believe that junk? but to us who are being saved, it's the power of God. It's written, I'll destroy the wisdom of the wise. The intelligence of the intelligent. I'll frustrate. Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar?

Because we have a world full of them. So where are they? Where is the philosopher of this age? Who's going to go up against this Jesus? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? He goes on down and said, brothers think of what you were when you called. Here's what makes them mad our today's culture, the college professors, the news media, and all of them. Not many of you were wise by human standards.

You see the C-minus crowd, I'm a C-plus, whoa, whoopee. Then you have the D crowd, Al, and the F crowd. You say, the Apostle Paul seems to be saying, this is who this is, who this is far. You get so smart, Jesus hides in plain sight right in front of, and you can't see him. You're like, who? Not many of you were wise by man's standards. Not many were influential. Not many were of noble birth. Well, if you start down that road, you say, all these people are being saved because they believe in Jesus. Look at that stupid bunch. We're looking at it like, we're looking at it like the wisest men of all say fear God and do what he says. We're just trying to make it simple and say, look, these degrees, how's that going to help you with your sins and that physical death coming up?

You're going to die. And all your brains with you. Even super smart people still have the same problems everybody else has. Same sin problems, same family problems. So really, that makes it common because Christianity and Jesus was born out of a need for something. I mean, need to redemption, need for all those different things. So essentially, as you were talking about the sort of the chaos of the street preaching, it took me back to, we went to Trump's inauguration in 16.

You and Willie had a little better, you know, they're more known than me. So they had a little more secure situation. You know, they had a bus that took them out. I was out with a commoner. in the throngs. I wouldn't have gone if I had to go out. Well, you come dragging up in the rear. I was in the rear, right.

It's a lot of offer. It's a very chaotic situation. So after as soon as Trump is sworn in, they had a 21 cannon salute. The problem is I wasn't ready. I didn't know about the 21 cannon. So I thought somebody said Obama. I mean, like my insights, when that first one, boom, you remember how loud it was? Oh, yeah.

And so, you know, so it just. just kind of created. And then you had a bunch of protesters there, a bunch of anti-Trumpers. You had a lot of confrontations. Most of them were just, I would only think they were anti-Trump. A lot of them are anti-American. Everything, right. So there's a lot of skirmishes going on.

There's people yelling at each other. So when we're going out of there, I'm in the mode of, I got to get out of here. Because it's a huge throng of people. So it took me back to what Jay said. So this situation is chaos. The roads are blocked. You can't just go any way you want to go. You have to go with the masses.

And they've got these guys with these microphones, and they're kind of these big, tall signs. The end is coming, the end of the world. And they're just yelling into these microphones they have. And all it was doing, I mean, me as a believer, I looked at them, I thought you were just adding to this super chaotic, terrible situation. I was like, shut out. You know what, Al? I looked at them as there's no difference in what you're doing.

That's what I thought. And what you're doing. Because all it did was make me want to get out. I mean, I'm just, now I'm almost at a gallows. because I'm thinking this I have wound up I have sunk into hell it's what it's what it's manifest itself in different ways and you got to remember whenever this this makes people uncomfortable when you talk about it but I'm not sure the exact verse it's in first or second Corinthians but it says the evil one himself masquerades as an

angel of light and so do his servants it's not like we think where we think he's the evil ones running around with a pitchfork and all you know some of the people that we think, well, that's just evil. But he also works in churches where people come across as good, and they may even have the facts right. But, boy, it's just they're hateful. And we, look, I think every one of us has been to, and this is rare, but we've been to churches that are filled with hate.

Right. You know, and we preached on love. It didn't go well. That's right. Because we just weren't, I told you, I've said many times about, the time when I was coming to an event and they said don't bring anybody black with you. I said, I'm not coming unless I have somebody black with me. That's right.

Now that you put that out there. And I mean, that's been 20 years ago, but still, that's not that far. So look, there is racism alive and well. I was a part of that. But I said, not only I'm bringing my closest African-American friends and I'm preaching. and I'm preaching on racism and love. They said, don't come. I said, okay.

I mean, I just wasn't going to do it. Yeah. Our mentors that Smith, Bill Smith, all the guys we talk about on the podcast, they told us stories in the 60s, you know, before we didn't get to White Street Road until 75, because they had always been open to black people at White's Faye Road. And in the 60s, there were multiple times when crosses were burned

on our church's property as a warning. You keep having these black people in your church. We're going to torch the whole place. And that happened at the place we're all at now. And that was just, you know, a decade before we got there. So you're right. I've seen that. There's pockets of people everywhere.

I think I said before I brought a guy to the Lord. And during his transition, when he was thinking about it, we came to where we meet. And he leaned over. Now, he hadn't responded yet, but he said, hey there's a lot of black people in here and i said i hadn't noticed i mean it made me mad but i realize this guy hadn't come to christ we're you know you just don't treat him with hate well right because he doesn't mean it did make me mad yeah but i i thought that was the best

response and look it led him to tears because look he was a victim of how he was raised and and making bad decisions and carrying that on but at some point you got to stop the cycle and I've said this hundreds of times. Jesus is the only one that I know of that actually has a plan to bring all races of people together. It's well documented in here. You do not notice people's color, what they have. We all come together as sinners at the foot of the cross, and he throws out the gender as well, which is another thing.

I noticed one of the quotes that I made on the podcast that made the rounds on social media was that, I guess it was some conversation we had that racism has no place in Christianity and it does it. And I preach that my whole preaching career, you know, because we're in the South and, you know, I know some people who think like that. But I've always preached it strong because it makes no sense. I mean, we've talked about it before.

You've read the verse in Galatians, you know. There's none of that. It's gender, male or female, race of people. It goes both ways. Some of our closest friends who are African-American. They took a lot of heat for having, like, me and Willie used to hang out in that neighborhood all the time, and they took heat for having us there.

Because they'd tell us. They'd say, well, they calling us all these names, and them people don't care for you. But, you know, after a few years, I feel right now I could go anywhere in that neighborhood. People know who I am there. Right. And they know I love them. So I do not feel threatened.

I do, you know, I'm colorblind in that situation because we have built a legacy of love with our family to this one family, but everybody knows who we are when we come there. Would you agree with that? Oh, yeah, no doubt about it. It's a small neighborhood, but still. Yeah. Let's take a break.

You're right, Jason. And really the critical race theory, this new thing, supposedly, is really just reverse racism. Now it's like because you're white, you're instantly privileged. And then they list all the stuff. But, I mean, is that not racism? You don't know me. I want to reach a place where you don't notice.

That's right. It's just, I'm like, why are we having to say? stop and notice every group of people. It should all be where you're color. But hadn't you been hearing this day with all the talk about Biden's cabinet? It's always it's always about gender, race. This is the first whatever to whatever to what. I mean, it's just like, why would you just get town to people, whether they're black, Hispanic, white? What difference does it might? Because I think only Jesus really produces, because they're like, well, you're not going to do it. You're only saying that because you're white. But I'm like, well, let's give them Jesus, because I

know this. By the way, who wasn't white. Right. Jesus was a person of color. I mean, you know, go to the Middle East. When I'm participating in worship with every possible ethnicity on the planet, nobody in earshot of me is thinking about, oh, I'm standing next to a black person. It's not happening because we have that oneness in Jesus. I mean, to me, you want to do it? That'll work. You agree?

Yeah. Even the actors who play Jesus and all the pictures that portray, they got him, you know, kind of like blonde hair and blue eyes. All those pictures you see and people's having. That's not him. You had me? Then you lost me. So today is January the 4th, which means tomorrow is a momentous, very important day. Do either of you know the importance?

I actually do. Oh, you asked that. And I'm going to try to shoot a green wing till Drake in your honor. That would be good. There's a backstory on that. That's right. I used to, for years when I hunted a lot, because I don't hunt much anymore. I had about a 10-year run where I killed a greenwing till on my birthday.

Now, one of the ways that happened, that didn't happen a lot down here. We were building, W.E. and I were hunting across the river in a lot of fields. And so it was a lot more till available. It was like 10 years in a row. I killed a green-wing till. And we treasure the green-wing till more than that. They're so good to eat. I don't know that story.

Yeah. And so that was kind of the yearly tradition. And then I started hunting exclusively down here. And then I went about a 10-year drought where we never kill one. So I don't know. Maybe you could find one before we just what you. I haven't. It's my birthday, by the way, is the momentous occasion.

I haven't seen a green wing till. Well, I saw one in the last two weeks. So out it's going to be. And a green wing tail, Drake is still one of the, to me, one of the prettiest ducks. When he's in full of plumage, he's a beauty. You know, ducks are. the male in the species is typically the one that you know which most birds are like that they're the they're the most plume the brightest color because they're competing right well and the hen

she's built for hiding when she's nesting right so just think what as phil says what category of seaweed determine this seawater and look the drake i do this a little bit in my speeches i get up because most people that hear me do the duck call thing they don't they don't know what i'm doing they're He has some sort of dangling things around his neck. A devices hanging around his neck that sound like birds. And I'm trying to share Jesus. They don't know the birds you're sounding like. Right.

I'm trying to get to Jesus. But these people have seen, you know, when we were on TV and they're like, what you make duck whistles? That's what they usually say. We have a couple of whistling ducks, but most of them quack. They quackers. Or make some sort of sound. all saying,

look, I know this is going to be really hard for y'all to grasp, but in the duck world, the hen will, she does a lot of talking. She does a feed,

if you think about it, it's true, she does a feed call, she does a lot of quacking. She does a hail call. They call it hail call. Just, I said,

but the Drake, he does one thing. He just goes, and he wants everyone to stop and take notice of how he looks. while he's doing it.

And I'm like, I know this is a stretch, us being humans. But in the duck world, the hens do a lot of talking and seemingly won't stop talking. And the Drake will do one thing and just want everybody to stop what they're doing and acknowledge their presence. Do you all get the... Human beings, men, women use on average about 25,000 words a day, men about seven.

You know, this has been standing out. Now you're helping my argument. So it is kind of the same, you know, the idea of the... The older your mother gets, the faster and more talk is coming out of it. I have noticed that.

I don't know what that's about. I think the wood duck is the most hilarious because he's the most colorful duck. I believe there is. There's more colors on him than any other. And all that Drake does is this. It's a real silent... The hen sounds like imminent danger call 911.

She's screaming. There may be a connection there. Jace is drawing a slight connection between boisterous duct. For humorous purposes only. So, Dad, I'll be 56. Did you ever think you would live to see the day where your oldest son is turning 56 years old? I mean, I'll be 60 and, you know, former world birthdays. One, at least you remember the math.

I'm glad that we got started early because I've been running with y'all for 50 years. We've been able to live together. Which if I waited like the millennials, you're 40 before you marry. You'd be long gone. Long gone. I don't think they say 40. Well, we talked about this before on the podcast, and you baptized, you know, my now 15-year-old granddaughter. Yeah.

Who's your great-granddaughter. Oh, I know. So there's a pretty good chance if you stay as healthy as you are now that you may actually see her, your granddaughter, get married. Which is amazing. This is incredible. I mean, that's another whole other potential generation. They can say what they want to about the patriarchal structure of families. Yeah.

But when we all come together and look at it now, I can see clearly from the top to the bottom and all in between, you know, your children, your grandchildren, your great-grandchildren. where I'm at the great grand and now the next one is great great grand children or not too many people see that because they don't start early with their with their births is what I'm saying well right and in American the trend has been the last few years maybe some argument on what's the best way to roll but it looks like to me the patriarchal system I know everybody yeah yeah well in our case and I give the tribute to Christianity I mean we're all still married to our original wives yeah and and now my kids are married.

Your kids are married. Only your kids. And I noticed if there's any children, little, little mischief makers in there, it's with us. It's a complete total from top to bottom, a family response to it. It is.

It's not like, you know, well, you know. Well, it's not if, it's when. I mean, the bigger family, the more issues. I mean, look, in the teenage years. The teenage years are trouble for everybody. I don't remember your team. teenage years. Exactly right.

But I think that's how you should respond. I mean, I wish families, more families out there. Because look, the world is after your teenagers. There's no doubt about that. Because it's their first awareness of spiritual things, of their own inabilities. I mean, that's when everything comes alive. And in the spirit of the internet.

She would be my granddaughter, great-granddaughter. One of my great-granddaughters is now a teenager. Right. And she hugged me the other night when she left. She said, I love you, Papa. And I said, be good. She was like in her eyes, you know. I said, be good.

She was like. And that's what I wanted to hear. She hesitated for about a second there like, be good. Yeah. Because, you know, there's the first exposure to sin, to worldly stuff. The Internet, of course, and social media, as we've talked about, and this stuff now that's being basically. developed to help people sin more.

I mean, you know, it's, the evil one is behind so much of it, so there's no doubt. It's just more, it's easier. And it doesn't mean it's any more pervasive or more difficult. It's just easier, and the access gets early and earlier. Let's take another break. I guess that's the perfect segue into, back into John 21, because last time, Jay's, you talked about the need for community. And really, that's what you see in a family unit.

If you're doing it the right way. Look at these disciples, it's kind of a structured, family structure, and it's certainly patriarchal structure, because there's Jesus, the one who brought it all together. We didn't say this last time, but I thought about this setting. Jesus is about to have this conversation with Peter, but you remember when they're all sitting there around the fire, Jesus already had some fish and some bread. He had already started the meal. It was a family setting.

Yeah, and that's what brings people together. That's why I brought up the isolation thing. Plus all the women that was following them, it doesn't mention them here, but they were there. Oh, no. Well, in Acts 1, you're going to see that a little clear. That's what I thought. This was the first kind of scene of what the New Testament church was going to look like.

I love the Acts 1. It says when they were all up in the upper room, along with the women, and they prayed, you know. I mean, because our churches get so legalistic. They're like, oh, we're going to do this in decent and in order, and the men are doing this, and the women. You had a group of people who put their faith in Jesus. the Holy Spirit was fixed to fall out. Acts 114. And guess what?

You got 120 people here, which is sad, based on what Jesus had just done, that the number was that small. That shows you how many people just scattered to the four weeks. Well, a lot of people say, oh, well, you can't read anything into that. It said all the believers were there, and it was 120 of them. Yeah, when Jesus died, when he came over in Luke, which is where we're headed next, when all the people had gathered to witness the size, saw what took place and that was that was when Jesus died they beat their breasts and went away but all those who knew him including the women who had followed him from goutily stood at a distance watching

these things yeah well let me read this phil you know what i'm saying that goes in with what i'm saying it says in those days in acts 115 peter stood up among the believers and then in parentheses it says a group numbering about 120. Well, right before that, in verse 14, it said all the apostles were there, and it lists them. And it says they had all joined together constantly in prayer along with the women

and marry the mother of Jesus and with his brothers. So you got the crew here. And my point about this isolation is when somebody gets mad or things happen or somebody makes a mistake, we're talking about our teenagers. What we tend to do is say, you know, I'm quitting and moving to, you know, Antarctica and I'm doing my own thing. That's just not how we're supposed to respond.

You've got to roll up your sleeves, swallow your pride, and work it out, especially for the common cause of Jesus. I mean, that train has to move on. Because I believe in the same way as what those apostles did and those 120, I don't think anything. things change when what we're doing we go out we share Jesus there's ups and downs within our family but no matter what happens we're going to work it out you know I was given a young youth some some guidance his girlfriend broke up with him he asked me what I thought I mean he was I bet he's probably 20 I don't know and he's like well you know I was asking him about it that's how it come up and he's he he he's I said well now what happened he said well she just

he had been going with her a couple of years and he said she just said she needed some time and some space I said to do what he said I don't know that's what she told me I said there's no sign when your woman says I need some space because she means you need to disappear

what she means is I don't need you in my space I said so let me get this right for your relationship she wants to isolate from you and do what? And he said, well, she said she needed to work on her. And then she would let me know when that's worked out. I said, you have to move on.

That's over her. But he's like, what do you mean? No, she's time, space, working. I said, no, there's no scenario where this is good. I said, because when you get married, guess what? Let's say she does come back, you get married. Well, what happens when she says, oh, it's time for me to have space again. and time work.

You can't take timeouts in marriage. You need to tell her, whatever we do, whatever you're going through, we're going to get through it together. You can't isolate and say, oh, I'll get back to it. I said, no, she might have just been being nice saying bye. Adios, amigo. But there's no scenario based on what I read from a spiritual view where this is a positive. Yeah, and to your point, this is all negative.

To your point about marriage, when two become one, you don't become two again. It's not the way it works. Well, and you build a foundation. I had one yesterday. They asked me that question. It's a family group. And they had, they obeyed the letter when the Bible says, be fruitful and multiply because they had 12 children.

And they were in a line. And the oldest one's about 19. He had woman problems. And they said, do you have any words for whatever his name was? He's having. He's having. Phil forgets everybody. Yeah, he's having one problem.

Well, there was a lot of them, 12 of them. I can't remember which one he would. But they basically said, could you help here? And I told him, I said, look, just listen to today's lesson. Keep your relationship with God intact. Things come and things go. I said, if you're going to have a severe problem here, it's best. This is pre-marriage.

All are just dating. They were planning to marry or whatever. But she pretty well put the, I need a little space here. and he was devastated. I tried to cheer him up and said, look, eternity is riding on highway operator on planet Earth. Taking stride, put it in the Lord's

hands and it'll work out. But, you know, I'm not, it sounds like we're being coy about it, but I remember being that age and, you know, you get in love and you know, and somebody says that and you just say, oh, you know, well, maybe it'll work out. But when you apply these spiritual principles,

you just think what all these disciples has been through and everybody had been through, and they made a great decision. We're going to stick together, despite all the difficulties. And now we have a reinstatement, which I think says a lot about how we are to be in the church. No matter what anybody does or anyone says, God in His grace and mercy always provides a path. Your mother told me Burley and Stone, they were there like. night they'd been out on a hunt you know and i'd whipped up a little uh shrimp ar grottin and i reminded about it and they showed up and they were having that ar grottin and listening but miss kays said at

14 and i was like 16 she said that is the man i want to marry like this guy right here i want to marry him she said i made my decision right there at 14 and i've never wavered since so she's well well what's interesting she said she wanted a pioneer man which you have certainly become, but you weren't there at 14, or 16, or whatever was that time. Be careful what you wish for. It can be bumpy. She said,

it will be bumpy. One of the parameters was, she said, she mentioned a lot. She said, he told me that when hunting season come along, that the dating process was pretty well over until all that's over. She said, he reminded me that, and he stuck to it.

He went, I didn't see much when I just waited. Yeah, all the way through. Hey, to her, look, she, she did. did it, I wouldn't have. She hung in there. Jayce, that's the reason you're here, so. That's exactly right. Me too.

It's close to a modern, I had to revisit. Thank your mama. Thank you mama for being faithful. I had to revisit my thoughts on modern day miracles after this happened because they ain't no way in heck. I would have hung around. Well, a lot of people told her that. Let's take another break.

So, so to our, back to our John 21. One of the things that we haven't mentioned yet, which I thought was interesting because I just preached a sermon on this text. And once I was kind of diving back into it, I realized that you go back to Luke 24, remember the two guys, the road to a mass, which we've talked about during this story. And so afterwards, the two disciples that Jesus appeared,

he walked down the road with them, and then they sat around a meal. It's kind of similar to this. And then all of a sudden they recognized who he was, then he just vanished. He disappeared. They go back to the other disciples, and here's what they said.

This is Luke 2434. The Lord has risen and appeared to Simon. And then right after that, he appears to all of them. And then also in Paul in 1st, Corinthians 15, 5, and he's laying out Jesus' appearances going back. He says, and that he appeared to Peter and then to the 12th. Do you think this happened first? Well, either that, or it could be, the other possibility could be, is that he appeared privately, at some point during these appearances to Peter,

we just don't have a record of it. I always look at the timing of the different gospels as... Well, you never know, because they're recording it by their own way. Yeah, I don't try to figure out the details, and I've been to churches that do, and it becomes boring. Because one thing is, it's hard to make everything fit. Right. But meanwhile, you're missing the point of what happened here,

which is the greater heart need for us. I mean, the point is you would think Peter denied Jesus publicly three times after saying he would all die for you and all these things. And now you have this confrontation. So that's what I'm saying. The two possibilities are is that he had appeared to him privately and had a conversation, and this is the more public conversation because the other disciples are there, or this is that instance that they're talking about. Either way it doesn't matter.

You have an appearance after someone saw you die. That would help. It helps a lot. In fact, you mentioned, Jayce, you mentioned in that act. You know, you saw him die and then. Well, think about this. Maybe I was wrong on that one. The Acts one setting that you described.

Remember it said, and his brothers were there? Well, you remember when his brothers were around all through the Gospels, they didn't believe in. John 7.5 clearly states it. They didn't believe in it. His brothers did not believe in him. No. And then in Acts 1, they're sitting there in the room.

praying. You say, I don't understand. What happened? When your brother dies and you go to his funeral and then a few days later, you're like, hey, I'm back. Guess what? You are now a believer. I'm listening to this guy, whatever it takes. So the only reason I brought it up is because, like you said, Jesus' first question to sign him, he's going to ask him three times, do you love me? But the first one, he says, do you love me more than these? And so in my sermon, I mentioned it, so who or what are the these, because that's a hanging pronoun. We know that from our old English days, right? It's a hanging pronoun.

We don't know who these are or what these are. And so it was really interesting. So I talked about in my sermon that I'd always taken this to mean that the these were the other disciples. Because they said the male. They says this is the third time that Jesus appeared to his disciples. Right. After he was raised from the day.

Remember the first time when he just. shows up. First time I didn't know who it was exactly. Then they had the doors locked in the room. Then the second time was when Thomas, who missed the first time, so he comes back again, a week later, it says, and then there's this one. Yeah. So you had the door, when they had doors locked, they had the Thomas reveal. Yep. And then, yeah, this one. And I think that's right. That's right. So, so, and that's the three that John

records. So what's interesting is when Jesus says this, I've always assumed it meant, do you love me more than these? Either, more than these do, or do you love these guys more than you love me? We could go either way. But then Jay's talked about on the podcast. I think we talked about the podcast. We did. I shared the story.

You shared the story. I guess I can say it's name. Yeah. Jeff Smith. I didn't say it in my sermon, but... Hey, one of the best people I know. He basically deal with the trout lure, what we did with Duck Calls. He is a trout, I would say...

Commander. Yeah, he is a trout commander. And I have fished with him a couple of times. And I, you know, I fished a time or two in my life, and he beat me 10 to 1 catching wise. Right. He's just like a human trout. I think the name of his lure's trout magnet. Right.

He's just a trout magnet. They just, they come at him because he's figured out every way to catch a trout there he is. So I told him. So I told us. I think he's saying these guys love me, but they didn't do what you did. Which is what I've always thought. Do you love me more than these? Right.

That's what I've always thought to. But in the story. I was fishing with Jeff. And he said, we're sitting there fishing. And he is a very Jesus-loving spiritual man. When he asked me to do something, I do it because he is a Jesus man.

I like having people like him in my group. Yeah, I just, because his lifestyle proves it. So we're sitting there fishing, and he said, do you love me more than these? He just kind of said that. And I was like, what's he talking about? I didn't recognize the passage right off the bat. He said,

what do you think that meant? And so then I started going through the chapter in my mind as we were fishing. And I said, well, there's two choices. It's either the disciples or what's those 153 fish he caught? Well, when I said it like that, he said, you're the first person I've ever known who had that number off the top of their head. I said, well, I'm a commercial fisherman. When he said he caught 153 without breaking a mesh, I'm never going to forget that fishing story.

And so then, do you want to finish the story? Let's take one last break. So I'm telling the story because I had never thought about that until Jayce brought it up on the podcast. Because what happened is with Jeff is he heard that in a sermon. He asked himself that question, if it were the fish. He thought he was sitting in a sermon, and he thought, do I love Jesus more than I love catching trout? And unfortunately, when he asked himself,

I hope he does that mind me sharing this story. No, he said the answer was no. Wow. He loved fishing. So what he did was, he said, I need to do something about that. So he parked his boat for three years. He parked his boat for three, I think it was three years, two or three years. It was a long time.

To make sure he had it right. And he asked himself that question over and over, and there came a day where he said, I love Jesus. And he poured himself into John, Jesus. And when the day came that he loved Jesus more than fish, he said, I started fishing again. Which I love that story, because we get asked a lot about that. We've talked about the past about hunting and how do you make it not an idol. And so in my sermon, I just went down that road.

And I used that story as a launching pad about how powerful idolatry can be. And I told the story about Lisa and I, which we talked about on here before, Lisa was on the podcast, that she had made me her idol. She was living off of my faith, and she didn't have any. She was void. So 15 years under our marriage, because she didn't have Jesus as her Lord, she had me as her Lord. I was her idol. Well, the whole thing falls apart, and our marriage did. And I was making the point, because a lot of men are like, oh, man, I wish I had a woman that worship me. No, you don't. No, you don't. You know why? Because you're not worthy of worship. It's not going to work. It's not going to work. And so that was my point. Jesus says you can't serve two

masters is really brilliant. You'll love one and you'll hate the other. Think about how that works. If you love Jesus more than anything else, then you hate sinful stuff. You don't want to be a part of that. But if you love the other stuff, more you love Jesus, you'll eventually hate God. And you see it happen every single day. That's why Jesus is the most brilliant one there. You know, I wanted to bring up about Jeff. He, and now he uses that fishing talent. I mean, not only I think God bless his business. I mean, he's become the biggest trout lure salesman in the world.

But he also uses it like every year he'll take, there's a local Christian university there where he's from. And he'll take these young youths who are going to give their life to sharing Jesus or preaching or whatever. He takes them on like a weekend of fishing and, but he's trying to make them fishers of men, which I love it. Because the very thing that he had to look at himself,

he didn't do it for a story or he don't even know I'm sharing this. He just looked inward and said, you know what, I'll go to church because he was basically going to church as an insurance policy. But what he loved was fishing. And so now he goes fishing and uses that to the glory of the Lord. But what he loves is Jesus. And that was the transition.

So he uses that now, kind of like a platform, like we do. Even though he's not a famous guy, he's famous in that world because of his skill set and his lures. And I love that. That's what the conclusion that he made. And he doesn't go around and speak. He's not much of a speaker, but he'll call me and I'll go speak to them boys that he's taking fishing. And it's just a perfect situation because I'm like, these are, you know, the last time I went up there was 50 of them. 50 guys, teenagers, early 20s, saying, we're going to be preachers.

Well, who in the world do you want to give a good taste of Jesus and share stories like this? So the point is, whether it's the fish or the lifestyle of commercial fishing or whether it was the disciples, the point is the same. Nothing can be above Jesus. That's correct. So any of those scenarios are all. the same thing. But it's got to come from your heart. You've got to look at yourself and say, because it's not where I take issue with some religious people is they'll get up in rail

about somebody going and fishing on Sunday, you know. If a guy's heart is right and he's had that conversation, there's not some legalistic set of boxes that you have to check. Because a lot of people go to church every Sunday and are meaner than a rattlesnake. We've met these people. Well, it was just like You, on the last podcast, you talked about taking a couple of guys hunting on a Sunday morning. Yeah. And with the purpose of sharing Jesus with them, which you did. And I share Jesus. I mean, I plan to meet at church later.

But, you know, when you go, you realize when you go out in the hunting world, things happen. That's right. And so I wound up being late, missed the whole thing. But in my mind, I'm like, I'm not going to feel bad about that. God knows my heart, and I'm sharing Jesus. And I had the right. Well, you're on mission, your own task. But it burns me up when people, I hate it when preachers get up and rail a bit against people who are not there.

I'm like, we're here. They're like, there's people out there shooting deer this morning instead of being with the Lord and grinding this out like everyone. What did you say was the country song where the guy says, I'd rather be on the lake thinking about Jesus than in church thinking about fishing. One of the greatest songs ever. And you two guys who sent me the email saying, I was wrong about that. You need to repent in a loving way. So Jesus asked him three times, which I think is the direct correlation to Peter denied him three times.

In other words, it's the one thing. No doubt. I think that's obvious. I mean, it has to be that. So Peter says, first time he says, you know, I love you, Lord, the same time I know you love you, Lord. The third time it says he was hurt because Jesus asked. him a third time, which is kind of funny because you'd think Peter would understand what

Jesus was doing. I denied you once. I denied you twice. Oh, yeah. I remember. There was a third. But it didn't. It said he was hurt, and his answer was different the third time.

He said, you know all things, and you know that I love you. And that's just a little phrase, but I thought, you know, he's really making a statement because he's saying, you know everything. You know that I love you. Because he did. He knew his heart. He did. But I think you should give him a quick tutorial. He used a different Greek word there. They had four words for love. Correct. And so there's two different words that are present. And so the words are filial, which means brotherly love. With Philadelphia, the city of brotherly love. Another Greek word is the word Agape, which you see primarily in the New Testament, which is basically a sacrificial Christian love. So if we were using the Greek words, it would be like this. Jesus said,

Do you filetal me? And Peter said, yes, I filetal you. In other words, yes, I love you. You're my brother. Then Jesus said, do you agape me? But it's interesting, Peter says, yes, I filet you. Now, these are, this is how John recorded. Third question, do you agape me?

Yes, I filetal you. So he never says, he never tells Jesus back, yes, I agape you. And so I said in my sermon, I don't know the implications of that. I think you're right, because then, Because that love being sacrificial, this is a deep point in a short period of time. But then Jesus tells him about how he's going to die, how he's going to be sacrificed. Which makes you think, look, there's a deeper love. And that's why you've got to look into yourself, which is why we told the trout fisherman story.

It's not a story. The guy's a real guy. I mean, because he had to ask himself that question. And I think as a fisherman, because a lot of people think, we are just, you know, what if it is the disciples? If he died on his behalf, their capela was there. Oh, it was. Well, you know it was because of what you did.

And he says what you said. They said, I'll tell you the truth. When you were young, you dressed yourself, but there's going to be a day where you'd stretch your arms out that someone else is going to dress you. And then John said, he meant to say that's how he was going to die. So that was the ultimate. Later on in his letters that he wrote, you know, he said, that was my, I knew that was kind of death was coming. He said, and that's my departure. But I like the way he looked at it. He didn't say

that was my death. That was the end of me. He said, it's when I depart. That's right. Yeah, but it's a good question. He said, as the Lord is reminding me of what kind of death, I'm going to die. In all relationships, you know, you're like, you're dating a girl. You're like, okay, do I love her? Yeah, yeah. Would I give my life for? Now, now keep in mind, Peter had said that earlier, which is what makes all this, I think, to your point, mean something. Because remember, He said, oh, I'll give my life for you. Jesus said, yeah, you're fixed to deny it three times. Then he hit the road, and then he did give his life for.

So then he's like, do you agop in me? What happened to the? And I think Jesus took that comment. That's why you shouldn't make stupid comments that are embellishments when it comes to making a vow to the Lord. Leave the, no vows. Yeah, don't say, I'll give my life for you when Jesus knows that you're fixed to deny me three times. But I wanted to say this, I think the reason we can relate to this as fishermen, I think he was so caught up in the excitement of seeing the 153 fish being caught.

As you think about all our memories, Phil, because we love the outdoors and hunting and fishing. I can go through a top 10 list of greatest excitements where 100 pentails come in at the Cypress Lake. I mean, you remember it, you were there, which caused a 10-year argument between men's eye, but that's beside the point. It was such an awesome. It was such an awesome event. You remember when we caught the hundred bass at a beaver dam, and then on the way back, we ran a net,

and there was a seven-foot alligator gar in the net. I mean, it was like, we caught a hundred bass, then we catch a seven-foot alligator gar. I mean, so we remember the excitement of these things that happened over the last 40 years. We're here this happened, I think, to get their attention. which is ultimately. So for our In the Woods watchers, I got one more bonus point I want to make. So for Unashamed, we'll see you next time. Thanks for listening to The Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click that little bell to get notified about new episodes. And for even more content that you won't get anywhere else, subscribe to Blaze TV at BlazTV.com slash Unishol.

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