Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 273 | Phil's Warning About Music, Worship Wars, and the Smokin' Shaman Shakedown

Episode Date: May 9, 2021

Phil talks about the kind of music people need to avoid. Jase reminisces about his very short-lived career as a guitarist. Al remembers a shaman in Gambia who demanded money for NOT putting curses on people. And the guys are joined by Ryan Lee, director of One Kingdom, to discuss all things worship, including battles over worship style, why Job's worship of God is the standard we should all shoot for, and how and when we should worship. Learn more about One Kingdom at https://www.onekingdom.org. -- Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? So today we are welcoming into the lair for the first time, Mr. Ryan Lee. Welcome, Ron. Thank you. It's good to be in the lair. A good buddy, a good friend of ours. And also works for One Kingdom, which we're going to talk about a little bit later, a great ministry that we've all been a part of for, I guess our whole lot of pretty much since we've been adults.

But also, Ryan is a worship leader. And so I was excited about having them on because Jay's, Ryan, talks about worship a lot on our podcast. So he's, yeah, we've synced up on that for sure. That's how Ryan and I got to be really good friends. Because we were part of a team for a couple years to, which I, what's funny about it, because I tell Messi, when I grow up,

I'm going to be able to sing like Ryan Lee. I don't know. No, you need to have higher goals than that. Yes. No. I like. Sitting the bar alone. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I like, though, the fact that what comes across is your, you know, heart for God in worship. And you just tag along. Ryan was at our house. And Phil actually came, which was surprising. We had a surprise birthday party. For the prime rib, though. I mean, there was, let's make sure we know why he was there. He has own record is saying the food is the drop.

I actually think that's why he came, but that's okay. You are correct. I said, wait a minute, bonnie and ribby. We're having a birthday party. We're having a cake. Listen, we're going to worship together. And we're having prime rill. It feels like, I think I'll be there.

Last night we had blackened. No, we didn't. It was mustard-fried. Cropy. Hmm. So. Was that come from stone? Was that one of his offerings?

So you know we train them right that when the next generation under me now Still brings the first fruits to the Patriarch right? We had we had some little rolls That's some little rolls and the little rows we had a little Fresh made Mayhall jelly nestled in between there so it was it was Mayhall season Was coffee and Mayhall jelly Yeah So not being from Louisiana

Mayha jelly has been one of the the highlights of being here and I mean the Mayha trees and all that stuff that's also slow what's the is there slow spelled s l o e yeah and you have to say it's slow yeah i told the story about our our nicaraguan daughter carina every time i would when i introduced it i would say the slow jelly so when she went back to college in minnesota she was telling all her american friends about the slow jelly And she kept telling me the story. And I said, were you doing that every time? She went doing what?

Like, slow. And she's like, yes, that's how you say it. I said, no, that's me. She said, well, I were wondering why they were snickering. I was like. Just a lot of O's in it. Slow. She just thought, oh, that's this.

The original idea was they call it slows because it's the latest plum that you see. anywhere. There was all the plums come and go in June, going into July or gone. But these all the way to October. Yeah. And they're a late. And I'm thinking that the spelling is because this came from Scotland and England.

And over there, they don't know if they make jelly out of it, but they make gin out of it. Slow gin is very famous in Europe. So it's that same, but it made its way over, I guess with some of the early folks from there. brought it with them.

And then it wound up being for here, you know. But to go back to Ryan and I think it was our first meeting. And it was Trent. And we had our wives there. And I was, because it's a tough situation for them. And everybody who does church work, you know, you're kind of working within an organization. And you're wanting to, you know, celebrate on Sunday mornings, you know, Jesus is Lord and he's alive.

But you have some of the more mature members. who get uncomfortable when you change anything. Right. And so Missy and I were bringing some new ideas through creativity. And I remember Ryan saying, I mean, now how far are you wanting to go? But he asked me like, I was trying to think of a way to describe it. And I said something that I shouldn't have. But he got my point.

I said, as in burn the building. I remember looking at the look on his face. Because I was making the point that we're the church. We're the body of Christ. We're going to celebrate. So anything that's a problem within this building, I want to tear that down. And so Ryan's like, I'm in. Yeah.

But it was a great, it was a great venture. And we formed a bond. And I really appreciate you leading that night for Missy's birthday. I mean, she cried. I was shocked. Yes, she was. Yeah. She missed everybody because we're going back from her.

to Austin. And there's just something about getting out under the stars with people you have relationship with and celebrating who God is. And it wasn't even a Sunday morning. I think it was a Friday night. Yeah, it wasn't Friday night. It was awesome. So, Ryan, one of the things I've always wondered about, when do you, when, like, were you,

have you always loved worship, you know, playing music? I mean, when did that like, because I was wondering with worship, is your whole life? Is at some point, like everybody else you had like this awareness or when it did it It kind of, when did you realize you had, you loved it and this is something you wanted to do? My story is, you know, a little bit unique because I grew up in an Acapella church. Right. As we all did. And, you know, I wasn't, I was, we weren't really taught, you know, that instrumental music was bad.

It was just that we were always acapella tradition. So I never thought of worship as, you know, instrumental. And then, you know, I listen to, I'm a kid of the 80s and our 90s. Okay. So I'm listening to Nirvana and Pearl. jam and I'm listening to my alternative rock radio station. And then all of a sudden, jars of clay comes on. I was like, wait a man, what is this?

This is my style of music, but it's pointed at Jesus. And then not long after that or maybe right before, I can't remember who came out with what, but DC Talk, you remember? Jesus freak came out. And now all of a sudden, I'm like, wait a minute, we can do this? The thought had never occurred to me. It wasn't that it was wrong. It was just that it never even occurred to me.

we could worship in that way. And really, you know, I was in a band in college and did that whole deal, but it was really about 10 years ago that I started listening to worship music. And I went on a men's retreat and they had a worship team. They had a praise band there. And I just, my heart was just pricked that I could just be free in my worship. Yeah. And just to not worry about what this guy on my right is doing what this guy on my left is doing,

but just be free with an intimate one-on-one moment with Jesus. And that's when it turned for me. And then, like, I couldn't tell you what a whole lot of relevant music is going on today. I just don't listen to it because all I listen to is worship. And that has really transformed my life because now, you know, I'm in the truck and I got two boys and they're in the back of the truck, singing worship songs and requesting specific songs. So that really, that moment, I think, you know, understanding that there's free. freedom in our worship, that there's not a specific way that you're supposed to do it.

Right. Really, really change. And that it's not just reserved. We talk a lot about this on this podcast for Sundays. Yeah. I mean, that like what you're describing is really a whole lifestyle of worship, that it's all the time. Yeah. And that it goes to the next generation.

That's right. Well, I have a habit now. Every time I pull up in a parking lot where mischievous events are happening, like a golf tournament or it. And you just, you know, it has a certain smell to it. Yeah. It's kind of like pre-vomit, you know. Well, it's like Burbank Street.

You know, when you, as soon as you. That's post-pourn. Yeah, yeah, Burbin Street's post for sure. But this is pre. You smell all the right ingredients and you're fast-forward in your mind four or five hours. And you're like, yeah. So I always turn that worship music wide open while I'm getting my stuff out. Because people are looking around.

But I'm like, and I mean, I always have my Bible in my truck. but I'm just setting the tone. And I need that for what I'm fixing to encounter. And so, I mean, Al, you're right. And what you were saying about free to worship. You know, the two places in the New Testament that talk about, I guess, how we worship, because the whole point is who. Yeah, yeah.

The how, it gives lists. So when I view that just as an average intelligence person, I'm like seeing spiritual songs and hymns and what's the other one? Does it say hymns, spiritual songs. I'm having a brain cramp. But I'm like that. To one another, right? Yeah, but he lists categories which there's a lot of things that are involved with that.

You know, when you see Psalms, the definition is with a stringed instrument. my Bible's falling apart even more. I'm noticing that, yeah. Yeah, well, and I have a new one, but I've lost it. I don't have Ephesians 5. Instead of, instead of highlights, Jace has coffee stains. Ephesians 5 is no longer in my Bible. So I was thinking, are you talking about this one?

Colossians 3 says, let the word of 16, let the word of Christ dwell in you richly as you teach and amish one another with all wisdom. and as you sing psalms, hymns, and spiritual songs, with gratitude in your hearts together. Okay, I found Ephesians 5. Speak to one another. It says the same thing. With Psalms, which is singing with a stringed instrument.

Hems, we got that down, and spiritual songs. Well, that's a lot of different categories that are a lot of different ways to express yourself, is the way you always read it. You know what strikes me is when John the Revelator, is telling the story of what he was seeing when the Roman Empire decided they were going to crush the people of God. In the middle all of it, he said, I saw heaven open and another great and marvelous sign.

Seven angels with the seven plagues last because with them God's wrath is completed. So he devastates the Roman Empire on our behalf. We won at the end of the day. I saw what looked like a sea of glass mixed with fire standing beside the sea. He's got a picture in heaven. Those who have been victorious over the beast, the saints, and his image and over the number of his name. They held harps given them by God, so God furnished a harp for all these people. And they sang the song of Moses, the servant of God, and the song of the Lamb.

Then it has the song right there. But you say, if God outfitted him with some harps, I'm saying, I would love to see you and play a harp. I'm saying, take no to that. Whatever that means? By the way, that's the proper harp technique that he's showing right here. I was impressed. I was impressed. The next time you form a praise team, we need to feel over on the side with a heart.

Oh, yeah. Or a cowbell, more cowbells. I'm just saying they held harp. given them by God. So I'm thinking, what is the hullabaloo about all this? I mean, you know, I mean, loosen up a little bit here. If it's a picture and they're in heaven and God has furnished the harps, I'm like, that's where we get.

It doesn't bother him. That's where the illustration came through the middle centuries of the little baby-looking angel. Yeah, with the harp. You know, that comes from that. Tiny heart. But the point was they were all singing worthy is the lamb. That's right. I mean, we get, we, we get so sidetracked on how we're going to do something.

And that's what I was making the point about. Actually, we condemn people and get angry with others. Yeah. I'm like, just make sure that you're worshiping the Lord. Yeah. And we'll give you some slack on how exactly you want to do that. Well, if you notice that in every, the verses that you just quoted in Ephesians, Colossians, every verse about worship talks about a grateful heart.

Yeah. You know, it's a response. If you're not grateful, then you're really not doing it right. You're talking about want to do it right? Yeah. Start with a grateful heart. Yeah, that's right. Then you have Genesis chapter 4.

Uh-oh. When God made mankind, he had somebody named Zillith, but he, and here comes old Jubil. Jubil. Jubil. I was wondering how, look, we had a timer. Jubo was the father of all who played the harp and the flute. What was the over under? 10 minutes.

So catch yes. He made individuals who were Jubile, Jubilee. You said he made people that were very good. Ryan, yes. But he. That's Ryan's ancestors. And then we got the folks who were saying, but he never wanted to hear it while we were on planet Earth.

I'm like, well, he made them. And some people just have a knack for a musical instrument. You say, I wonder where they got that. Yeah. This is a good point. Descendants of old jubal. Let's take a quick break. So, Ryan, every time somebody's own here this musical, we always go to Genesis for it.

Son of Juble. I just always stole a couple in saying, I don't know, boys. What about this one? I mean, you know, calm down. I guess that's where they get the word jubilee. Yeah. That's the root. I added that.

I would think. Jubilations. Jubilee. But you know, I mean, one of my favorite chapters in the Bible is Leap 15, and people go there talking about the prodigal son and the lost sheep, if you lose 99. and, you know, why is Jesus eating with tax collectors and sinners? That was the accusation. But really, it's about joy on earth and in heaven about God establishing the relationship back with people, the bridge, which is Jesus.

I mean, he's like, not only is they rejoicing when something lost is found, there's rejoicing in heaven. And he says it over and over and over. So you get a picture of, we're not just, you know, celebrating here. and what would seem crazy is if they're celebrating in heaven over someone coming to God and there's no celebration here. What? That doesn't make sense.

He was drinking wine with some people in a place and when the Pharisees saw him, they said, look at that. He's a drunkard. They went from he's having a glass of wine to a drunkard. Jesus chastised him. He said, you know, you say John the Baptist has a demon. which is a lie.

And he said, and you call me a drunk and a wine bribber or whatever. A glutton. He said, a glutton and a wine biver. But he said, wisdom will be proved right by its actions. Then he just went right on.

So that's what I'm saying. They look at something. They just overreact. I mean, good night. He's got a glass of wine. Well, and that's been one of the sad things to me travel around the American church.

I figured out, no matter what group you're with, I talked to pastors, and leaders, and it's always, they call them worship wars, and it's always over the style and the how in these places. And so just as we've said today, that's so sad to me, because if you were arguing over the how, you totally miss the who. I mean, there's no way you can be coming in there that right before we went on air. You were talking about vulnerability in leading worship, which I think is the same even in participating, right?

Think about it out. 98% of our worship is from Monday through Saturday. Yeah. A small percentage. A small percentage is with the brothers themselves, but the structure became more important than the worship. So you're looking on how you're going to go about worship, and you're like, y'all need to loosen up a little bit. So Dad gave us one from Revelation.

I wanted you guys to chime in, too, maybe someplace in scripture that you love about worship. For me, it's always been, because I'm just, I marvel at it, was in Job 1. after Job got the bad news of he lost his children, he lost his wealth, he lost everything, and one fell swoop. And look, it was just messes, messes, messes. So it was like a triple whammy.

And so at this, the last one in verse 20, Job got up, tore his robe, which was an ancient way of saying, I'm in misery, shaved his head, which meant I'm worth nothing. Then he fell to the ground in worship and said, and then here was his worship. naked I came from my mother's womb and naked I will depart. The Lord gave and the Lord has taken away. May the name of the Lord be praised. And I just thought, you know, we think about times when you worship. In this case, it was the worst crushing thing that we couldn't even imagine.

And Joe's response was to worship God, which I mean, that's a standard for me. I'm just not a lot of what you want to say. Your body is a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God, don't conform in it, which is your spiritual. act of worship and don't don't get with the world but stay away from men you don't do worldly things you know right you know don't let them get you in there take you in that but it's a it's a full-time thing 24-7 that's where you got to start for me you know Phil just quoted at Romans 12 1 yeah you know your true and proper worship is your living sacrifice that's it you know where we're

I think we get caught up with the word worship is is only songs yeah well your worship is the way you live. It's in your work. It's in your relationships. It's everything you do. It's not just this you know, one hour on Sunday morning. It's how you live. So then when we get together and sing songs, it's just a celebration. You know, and you can use, you know, a lot of these songs nowadays are, they're talking about worship as a weapon. You think about Second Chronicles with Jehazaphat. You know, they go and sing over the victory over Amman and Moab. And then, and then Joshua, of course, you know with the walls of Jericho there's they're playing trumpets you know even i think miriam after the red sea right yeah what i was thinking yeah i was going to say yeah well i love david you know he's

he's in a cave hiding for his life you know yeah they're after him and what does he do he writes a song you know and sings praises to god and says you know no matter what happens here i'm going to praise you and the evil one uses the music too there's there's some brands of music that especially young people need to stay away from. That's a great point. It's a musical filth. So you say it always cuts the same way. We're pointing people to Jesus.

Well, there's other musicians out there. They're pointing people to the evil ones. Well, it's a reflection of their heart. You recognize them by their fruit. Some of these like rap songs and all people are angry. And they're, they feel guilty. And they've, you know, bad things have happened. You're just seeing a reflection of their heart.

which is, you know, when you look at the other side of it. Plus, so many of the lyrics are degrading to people, to women. It's just, it's a terrible cultural thing as well. And, I mean, when you hear it sometimes, we were at the beach a few weeks ago, and this kid walks by and he's got a little skinny little white dude, but he's listening to these rap lyrics. But, I mean, it was just filthy. And he's walking, snaking his way down through all these people at the beach.

And everybody's just looking around. I mean, most people got their little rock music or little, you know, classics out. And it was loud. And everybody's just looking at this kid, like, what do you do? I mean, you're doing the same thing I'm doing. He's making a statement. Yeah, that's exactly right. You know, I used to listen to some of that when I was younger, you know, just thinking,

we would justify it when I said, oh, we just like the beat. You know, we're not, I'm not listening to the lyrics, you know. But what's funny is now with these, all these music services, you can listen to whatever you want, and CDs are thing of the past now. So every now then I'll go back and I'll listen to something. This is what I was listening to when I was 16. And I can't even get through the first 30 seconds of the song. And I think that's part of the sanctification process.

That would really cut you if you were really listened to. If you were really living holy, some of these lyrics would really, really make you cringe. Do you remember, are you too young for those old shows? The way they used to roll out music, they would have these shows. You used on Friday night or Saturday, American bandstand. Three or four of a soul train. So it was their way to get new music out because you didn't have all the avenues today. It was funny that had all these kids out there in their dance and they're playing

the new music. And then they would interview a couple of them. You know, it's like, what do you like about this song? Well, it's got a good beat. Yeah. It was always that to start with it. It was like, well, it has a good beat. And that was about it. You know, no substance to it. No substance at all. But I just remember about thinking culturally, that's how it started. It was not nearly as bad as it is today, but it's just kind of progressively gotten worse. You know, I always like that old country style music that was in that old brother of where out there you know yeah some of the songs it came out of that i said you know our family uh sang one of those songs oh was that right marv's wife was in a group that sang one of those songs that's on that's right i remember yeah one of our cousins

she uh sang at that's right jan's funeral that's exactly right she did some of that music i'll fly away she did yeah yeah it was beautiful some of that music really was good it was a lot of it was I mean, it was hymns. Yeah, it was a big, big chunk of it was. You know, you brought up Jan's funeral. I mean, that, you know, your emotions are raw, but we sang that, I remember just thinking, this is what heaven is like. I mean, that was, it was, it just seemed supernatural.

You know, it's a good point. And that's what, when I'm at a funeral like that, and there's worship that happens. And I've been to many. And it's usually because of the person we're celebrating who they were in Christ. But it's really a lot like this. passage, you know, because you think about it. It doesn't make a lot of sense that we're like celebrating and worship and touched and moved, but people live lives that affect us that. Plus, I don't think our mindset needs to be. Let's get rid of, we were in a kind of a rut

saying this is the only way. But I think everyone needs to remember, you know, acapella, when done with some great voices, is a powerful thing. You know what I'm saying? I'm said, I'm one who said, and you shouldn't get rid of archipelic music, you should have that. I think, I said, because there are times when it fits the situation. Well, when you brought that up, my favorite passage, hang on, Joseph, let's take it back. My favorite passage is Mark 1426. It's an obscure, subtle passage.

But right before he goes to start the process to the cross, you know, Peter denying him all the trials. And he just said, I'm fixed to pour out my blood. for you. Yeah. It says in 1426, when they had sung a hymn, they went out to the Mount of Olives. And I thought about them singing that song. These were probably all males, would you think? Just the, or you think some of the women with them?

Probably, you know, I think there was a little cadre of them. One of the things on the Chosen is they kind of have a little. That's a good point. Good point. But I tell you this, and here's the point I want to make. probably some of them because they're humans and they, you know, I've had this same problem. They probably sang the song,

but they don't know what's fixed to happen. But I guarantee you the next time they sang this song, wherever they were, after all this happens, Jesus dies and buried and resurrected, I will guarantee you there was an emotional response, there was a celebration response, there were tears flowing. and that's kind of, I think, how we do.

We get into a routine, and we're not looking at the big picture and not coupling our problems with his solution, and then all of a sudden something happens, like at Jan's funeral, and you start reflecting and thinking of who God is and what he's done in your life, and all of a sudden, it just pours out. There's a lot of singing going on for the 5,000, by my count, the 5,000 years when they were saying the prophets, Jesus is coming. There was a lot of singing going on throughout the Bible.

There was a lot of singing going on, period. So there's a place for it. It starts with the Israelites. You know, they, in Exodus, they're free. The first worship song recorded in the Bible is they're in Exodus as they're marching out. Yeah. Yep. And they sing a song of praise of freedom.

It's a freedom song. Yep. And I think that goes back to that grateful heart. If you're singing about the things that God has done in your life, then shouldn't there be an emotion? Shouldn't there be a passion about what you're doing there? Some events just call for song. It's in our DNA, I guess.

And like Jay says, some songs will evoke a memory, a person. There's a song we sing sometimes called Complete. And every time we sing it, I think of Gary Myers, a guy who's gone on to be with the Lord, who died of cancer, but it was just a very passionate worship leader for many years at our church. And that song just, I think of him every single time. It always brings a tear to my eye because I just, the passion of him. And of course, it's all about Christ, but that's who he loved, you know.

So it is, it is amazing. You're right, just that songs can evoke that, you know. And the other side of that now is, you know, one of my favorite verses is Psalm 98, sing to the Lord, a new song for he has done marvellous thing. So I love all the old songs, and I think there's something about the old songs that evoked that emotion. You know, I can tell you, if I hear a Dave Matthews band song, I can picture myself driving an old car with my little disc man with the anti-shock, you know, and plugged into the cigarette lighter. You know, you can just, you bring you back to a time. Well, you're listening to the Eagles on the way over here. There you go.

there you go and hotel california and i said who in the world would not like that at any time right right that's just a borderline say taill it is but it's got a good beat it's got a good it is and by the way dad it's in the top five of all-time rock songs really yeah i just heard the well i heard a while ago it was funny it was funny yesterday i was texting mac powell who is i guess he's been doing contemporary music for the longest and was the first kind of band I listened to because Missy was trying to get me involved for years. I mean, and I had the same moment you had probably three years ago. I mean, once I got into it, oh, I'm in.

Yeah. But she's like, I think you like this guy because he has a style, kind of a rock style that you listen to, because I love Leonard Skinnerd and Credence Clearwater Revival. And that's what Phil used to play in the duck call shop to keep us, you know, working when we were kids. but so later on I get to meet Mac Powell and he's like he was coming to Monroe that's why I was talking to him about yesterday because he's coming again in like a week

and so he's like why don't you get up on stage with us and play with us I was like I can't I was like you need to get my wife up there we could get a harp I said now I could do a duck call something funny and he's like no no he's like they'll never know and so

he said we'll just get you a guitar and we'll just get you a guitar and we just won't plug it in. You plug it in. So I was like, okay, let's do it. So we get up there and he says, well, you want to play. So I just throw out some Leonard Skinnerd. And, you know, people thought this was playing.

They crank up. They call me the breeze. Which is one of their all-time best. Yeah. And, of course, I'm playing the guitar. And look, I've had, through the years, I would say at least 100 people come up and say, boy, you could really, I just was shocked, you could play a guitar.

Didn't know you had it in you. I was like, you know, just the gifts, you know, that God has bestowed on me are hard to explain, you know. It's a funny moment. So there's pictures floating around out there about me in concert playing the breeze. I never heard that story, Jay. That's a pretty good story. Yeah, it happened. Willie got on stage just recently, I guess the year before the pandemic, I guess it was 19, with a foreigner.

because he has they're a big part of his story jukebox hero you know it's how he used to make money on the school bus and uh because he was the human jukebox and you put a quarter under his arm and he'd drop it in his hand and then he did all of his sing the song so so he's always we and they got it from me because i liked foreigner so you know your brother's here with your older's birthplace so he got an opportunity i guess they knew that but they pulled him up on stage i will say that some people take it in a negative light because i was baptister this girl down in the river, and there was a pretty good little crowd had gathered up on the riverbank, and a couple of bass fishermen were coming up to Bayou. They were bass fishing, so they just kind of ran into what, they just come around the curve,

and all of a sudden it broke out in song when I baptized this girl, and I turned around a look, and I saw them. They was like standing up in their boat with their rides and wheels, you know. I said, hey, y'all won't in on this action? I've never seen two people leave so fast.

Shoo! Mo, woo, whoa, whoa, dink. They left the premises. I guess they weren't. It was kind of like a singing out of old brother where Arthur, you know, down in the baptism, you know, and the guy they thought, I said, y'all won't in on some of this action? Boy, do they get out of there.

A lot scarier is an ex-drunk with a Bible in his hand than if he had a real weapon. Oh, yeah, that's scary. It's scarier if an ex-drunk got a Bible, how old about Jesus. That's scary it a lot. So let's take another break. So Ryan, I want to shift gears a little bit and talk about, because you're the director

of our One Kingdom ministry, which, how long have you been doing that? Because you used to be like a stock guy. Yeah. I wouldn't even get into that because you, you know, you're a stock guy? Yeah. He worked for Merrill. I worked from Merrill Lynch for eight years. Oh, I'm sorry to hear that.

No, I'm sorry. We don't want to start that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We'll go down a rabbit hole there. But, no, 2016. And I've felt the call, and a lot of you guys know my story, but I fought it for many years. You know, I was asked to be the youth minister for, you know, symbolically, I turned it down three times, Jace. And but there was a seed just planted in me that, you know, everything I was doing, it was already, it was already ministry.

And you and your wife, Miranda, works with our college kids with some other volunteers. In a weird set of circumstances that we talked about in the party. Do you want to tell, like, you know, or share with, I'm part of the process that led you to your wife? So, Jace baptized my wife when she was in youth group. Yeah. So she was, it was at camp. You know, I have trouble going back over a two week period. Right, right, right.

Yeah, let me. Don't ask you. As soon as I said it, I knew, and I was like, no, he doesn't know. He doesn't know. But I met her because I used to teach the junior high because I had a burrow in my saddle because nobody wanted to do that. And then I went and taught it for the first time and realized why nobody wanted to do this because it's such an awkward age. And then I took it as a challenge. I thought, I'm going to try to reach these people.

And she was one of the first classes that I did. But I told you, and I wasn't kidding when we were talking about the other night. There was always a couple in each class that I would think. to myself. Now, this person is going places, even at a, you know, junior high age. Yeah. And she was one of those people. I mean, I loved everything about her. I said she's got a heart of gold. Yeah, I can't blame you. That's why when I heard, I don't know if you know this, but when I heard y'all were getting married, I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, because I had never met you. Right, right, right. And I said, babe, get her parents on the phone because

we need to have a talk. And I had a conversation with them. With my in-laws? Yeah, about you. I don't know the story. Yeah. Oh, boy. And they were, they assured me. You were being vetted without, without your knowledge, right? It's like I hadn't even seen her in years, but I was like, no, wait a minute, get married.

I don't even know this guy. Which is kind of ironic because we've said on this podcast for every Roberts of Mail was rejected by their in-laws on the initial run to get married. So it's kind of ironic that Jason didn't even know you. And he's having to say. So I had the same deal on the opposite side. that jace because i i come to visit whites fair road as miranda's boyfriend or fiance i don't remember the timeline yeah and you know we take responses at the end we have our family time and and here comes phil walking down and i was like oh man this poor guy you know like he's coming down to you know lay his heart

out and then he's just standing there he's probably drunk yeah yeah yeah and i said i look at marina's like what's this guy's story she's like that's phil he's one of our elders i was like oh oh okay and then she points at jace and she's like yeah that's his son he baptized me. I was like, huh? You know what? What's going on? Some kind of cult. Right, right.

I'm looking around. I'm hitting on a swivel. Yeah, where the rednecks and the stock market meet? That's it. There's the title of this podcast right here. I was checking you out and you were like, oh my goodness, we're going to have to go through some skeletons in the closet. No doubt. Like the girl asked me a couple of weeks ago, is there, where's the preacher around?

here. They've never been there before. They said, we think we got the wrong church. Where's the preacher? They asked me, and I said, oh, he's around here somewhere. They said, who are you? I said, Jim Smith? They said, Jim. The story. We're talking about here. I'm like, it struck me because both of them. I'm Phil. I'm Phil. I'm the Prym Smith. It just struck me. I was having a little fun with them, but you say, what happened? They both were converted to Christ when they, when they unfolded. Even though their first thing that happened, they had a lie. You got lied to. Yeah, I'm the first interaction.

I didn't lie to him. They said, where's the preacher? I said, he's around there somewhere. Jim Smith is a lie. Oh, Jim Smithy. I just threw that in because, you know, then they were surprised. Oh, Jim gets up for good life. There's the preacher.

They told me about it later. They said, why did you tell us that? I said, well, I just spun it around with you girls. They said, well, thank you for that message because we get eternal life here today. So they both obeyed the gospel. This is one of feels. stories that's like, you know, Si, you know, Sa has about 12 stories. But no matter when you hear them, they're always good. It's always good. It's always good. So, so you are the director

of One Kingdom. I'm to keep us back, hurt us back. Well, tell us about the name because a lot of people think, what does that mean? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, because the ministry has been around almost as long as our church has been. That's right. Yeah. You guys are kind of rebranded. So it's it's been around for 2,000 years, huh? Well, that's true. That's true. That's true. plan before that. You got it. So the ministry was actually started over 60 years ago, and it was called World Radio, and it's still World Radio is still one of our main projects.

But the goal was to get the gospel out to every nation, every language. And what they found was they started off, you know, with, I think we bought a radio station in South America somewhere. Of course, that was taken over by the government. So I said, okay, well, let's try to do it a different way. But then we started buying airtime for, you. leaders that God had raised up in their respective countries. And that has evolved into so many things.

Now it's one kingdom, and our goal is to empower and equip local leaders to share the gospel in every nation and every language. How many nations are you in? Almost 70. Whoa. Wow. Almost 70. We're about 60.

Which is basically a third of the world. I thought you were going to say seven. Yeah. 70. Yeah. We give to y'all, Ms. Kay and I, you know, we've been the supporters of it for a long time. It's really morphed out.

I remember when they first started. Yep. Oh, yeah. We have a particular love, mom and dad and Lisa and I, for a project in Liberia. Yes. That, to me, kind of encapsulates everything you got. It tells the story really well. Yeah.

So in Monrovia, Liberia, of course, we have our friend there, Isaac Day, which I want to just stop here for a second and ask all of the listeners of unashamed to pray for Isaac. Isaac's a partner of ours, but he's been dealing with some health issues. He's my second favorite, Isaac, I always say, because my firstborn son's name, Isaac. but he's a man after God's heart. No doubt. I think we all know him. And I've been we're in both in Gambia and also Liberia, probably four or five times.

I've traveled over there and to do things with him. He's a tremendous, you know, son of God. He's the one that finds other reliable men who can teach others. I remember the first time I heard him preach and Missy wasn't with me when I got home, I said, you know what, I didn't understand everything he said, but I loved it. Yes. Because of the accent. He has a strong accent.

Yeah, he does have a strong accent. Yeah. And then when I talked to him, he could understand nothing, I said, because he was like, because you too have a strong accent. He said, what kind of English is this? I took that as a bad sign. He said, bad. What kind of English is this?

Yeah, Al tells a story about being with him when they looked up and some guy with smoke coming out of it. Al said he never figured out. where the smoke was coming from, but some guy with all dressed up hair like this, and I mean, and he was basically tell that story out. Was it Maco?

He was a shaman. Yeah. And what Isaac said about him. Let's take another break. Yeah, we were, it was in the Gambia, and apparently he was some kind of shaman. Yeah. He had what looked like a gilly suit.

What's a shaman? Like some kind of tribal, juju man, menace man. Oh, oh, like a boo-doo. Yeah, yeah. So he comes down the street. I hear all this banging around. And it was like, I walk outside, you know, and I'm just looking around.

And so I could hear him coming down the street. And the church is there. Well, we were at Isaac's house. Yeah. But he's walking down the street. And so I see people going out and they're giving him money. And so I'm watching this, you know, and I'm intrigued, you know, because you're in another country. But it was kind of scary because he had this smoke.

It's coming out from somewhere. And he's got this suit on. And you can't see just his eyes. Right, right. And it's kind of spooky looking. So Fetu runs out, Isaac's wife. She's, oh, you're back in the house, Pastor Allen. You don't want to be out here with this guy.

I said, well, what are they doing? She said, well, they give him money so he won't put curses on you. She said, but you don't want to. What a job. Yeah, she was like, but you don't want to look him in the eyes. It's like, okay. Like, what do you do for 11? Don't put curses on people.

That's right. Who do I make that check out? Basically, this was demonic. It was demonic. But it was, I guess, they were, you know, the people believed in it, the people that were out there giving money to. Isaac basically said,

what did he say? Don't worry about it. He said, don't, don't even, yeah, don't even mess up. You don't want to get cursed

by those guys either because they have to have that come true. Right. So if they're like, hey, I'm putting a curse for you to die, well, they're going to figure out a way to kill you.

Because they got to be right, you know, for the legend to go on. It's all making sense. Yeah. Yeah. And I've seen that in other places. We've been to Haiti before.

Haiti's big on the, and you can feel, it's a papal, evil. When you go around these voodoo houses and places, it's a, it's a real deal. And, you know, we've talked about it before on the podcast, but I've seen a lot with Isaac especially that, you know, you'll see a lot more crazy things if people are willing to believe it.

Yeah. My theory has always been, you don't see as much in the U.S. in terms of demonic stuff because they don't tend to believe it. You know, they just, you know, everybody's got a script for it. It's a middle illness, this, this, this, that. But you go to the third world, you say some, and hear about some crazy things. It's like a different way to have a mafia. Right.

Because they're basically offering you protection. Right. And in Liberia, they call it the secret society. Right. That's very much like that. I mean, there's a name for it. Man. So tell me a little bit about the school, the Gurree and all that in our last few minutes.

One of our philosophies at One Kingdom is that we believe that God has raised up leaders all over the world. You know, the old way, I say the old way, it's still effective, but we don't necessarily send American missionaries to go live anywhere or spend long. long-term missions because we believe God is working already in those locations. And so we try to come in support of the visions that God has laid on these men's heart. So Isaac is one of those. And he had a vision years back to start a preaching school that also taught men and women agriculture. Because at the end of the day, you can teach a man to preach, but in those countries, it's hard for them to support themselves.

So then they're calling back to the United States, hey, I need support, I need support. Well, Isaac had the idea to say, let's teach them the Bible. well, let's teach them how to spread the gospel, but let's also teach them how to farm so they can support their ministry themselves and they're not dependent on U.S. support. Seems simplistic, but it's, it works. Yes. And it's also a great idea. And it's also helping rebuild a war-torn country.

That's right. Because now you're getting some, you know, entrepreneurship, you know, and you're stilling it through spiritual people, which is amazing. That's right. So they have the Restoration Bible and Agriculture Institute, which they've graduated now. They're working on their third class. So you and I've been to both of the graduations of the first two. which is, you know, hopefully we'll get down there for the third.

Yeah. We hadn't talked about that yet, but I'm going to put you in a spot here. But, so they're teaching men to preach. They're teaching men to farm. They've also started this Garry facility. So to tell you a little bit of Garry, Garry is, it's like a starch. It comes from like a potato-like substance. Like a root.

Casava. So if you know cassava, it looks like a potato, but they mash it up into what they call Garri, and it's using every meal. It's just behind, you know, rice. It's the second most popular food in Liberia. Well, they don't produce any garri in Liberia. They import it all from Nigeria. So Isaac said, well, we got to start that now.

We're going to start our own producing our own garri. We'll have our preachers that are learning. They'll farm cassava, feed the garry facility. That money will go back into support. So it's a self-sustaining environment. And, you know, one of our goals, it sounds counterintuitive. is for us to not be supporting this mission anymore. Right.

Because they, you know, God has given you everything that you need around you to not only survive, but to flourish. That's right. You know, and I think prosperity is a word that we confuse sometimes with riches. Yeah. Prosperity is just living full in the gospel and knowing that God's giving you everything you need to survive. Yeah. And that's what Isaac's trying to teach these young men and women. They've also started a skills training center for women.

Yeah. Yeah. You know, a lot of these women, you know, just like, you know, here the man, the husband is not involved or they've taken off or they've, they're alcoholics or what, you know, and some of them have turned to prostitution or just really tough, tough lives. And Isaac has given them, Isaac has given them an avenue to learn tailoring and sewing and to start their own business so they can support their families. It's really a work that we're really highly invested into. And Isaac's wife and daughter have been a big part of that. And also his wife

started. We call it the Daymart. I think I... It says Daymart on there. I know. I think I jokingly said it and coined it. And then now it's on their sign. Daymart, like Walmart. But she runs the whole business. And so when I look at Fatu, who's a wonderful person, I think about Proverbs 31. You know, that's her. She's a P-31 woman. She's that woman. And so these are wonderful people. And we don't have much time left, but I was thinking about, as you mentioned Karina earlier, that came about because of One Kingdom. Because one of our ambassadors who's in Nicaragua, needed someplace for her to be for a period of time,

and that connection was made for you guys. And now we have a daughter. I mean, I have a new niece out of that situation. But that came about because of one kid. Because of a statement. That's right. And he had kind of offered to mentor her because she was basically an orphan.

She had one sister. And just led her in a way of, you know, you learn, educate yourself, internet keep yourself out of trouble you know but overall you put your faith and trust in in jesus christ because he has a plan for you and uh boy i'm telling you one of the most impressive people that's ever that i've ever been around i love carina oh she's she's amazing so so matthew 28 18 through 20 was always the guiding force for radio and now for the entire mystery because you guys do relief work too yep we had a couple of guys on that are doing these

series, a video series about work being done in Lake Charles. And then right along that time, one of the week, yeah, the One Kingdom Sunday, a couple of weeks back. Yeah. And you guys did a tremendous video about a family that we helped and you guys rebuilt it. I mean, I just wept through the whole thing. Yeah, that's where we got the idea to have you on. I was watching that too.

I thought, oh boy. I was a mess now because I came up and spoke. And I'd seen that video probably a dozen times and I walk up to the stage and I was just overwhelmed because she's sitting there in the audience. It's, you know, and for those that don't know the story, we, we partnered with an online boutique that they do a giveback weekends. Carly Jean, Los Angeles, I'll give them a plug here. They do great, you know, it's a women's boutique. They're based out of Los Angeles.

They do a give back weekend where they raise money for a charitable cause, and they wanted to partner with us with One Kingdom for relief work. And we were able to rebuild this woman's house, I mean, and not just the roof, not just the walls. the floors. That's what she thought was being done. But we, they raised enough money that we were able to completely remodel their home, new furniture, appliances. It was a beautiful home. Yeah. And, you know, and she was just so mood. And then she was there that day and we had lunch afterwards. It was a very, it was a wonderful day, which, by the way, the audience, if you go to WFRchurch.org, look in our archives, it was about three weeks ago, but you'll see One Kingdom. So tell folks in our last bit here how they can, if they want to help out, One Kingdom, how they do.

Go to One Kingdom.com.org. And there's a, ways to help bar on their upper right hand corner. And, uh, you know, the best way that you can help is a monthly donation, even if it's $5, $10, $25, whatever that is, that continual support goes a long way to giving us, uh, helping us map out where we're going to send support. And for all those guys that we're partnering with, it gives them that confidence to know that they've, they've got a long term, you know, support. So go to one kingdom.org. You can also, I've got, I'm wearing some gear today. I brought you guys some gear later. Uh, you can, you can, you can, you can, you can, you can rep us wherever you're going, but also that goes to support our ministry as well.

I saw one of your right-hand man yesterday in the grocery store. I turned around, I saw a shirt, and I thought, well, I need one of those shirts. And I read it, it said, rub some dirt on it. And I looked up, and it was Robert. Robert, yeah, yeah, yeah. And I said, where did you get that shirt? And he said, Ryan Lee made it for me. I was like, he's going to be on our show tomorrow. He was like, you know, if you don't know Robert, he He just turned 70. So what is it? I'm making it of what you're talking about.

What does it mean? Rub some dirt on it. I didn't know, but I loved it. I think it meant like when you, if you're griping or complained and the whole officer of the shirt. Well, so Robert, he just turned 70 years old. He's still bench presses 250. You know, he's just a man's man.

And, you know, if anybody's griping or complaining or, you know, I'm not feeling well, his phrase, he always says, hey, just rub some dirt on it, you know. In other words, get over. Get over it. You know, there's work to be. done you know and I like that about them because I was telling him about our ailments I said me and Finn he's like yeah I'll remember that but rub a little dirt on it man he'll be all right yeah it's good to have you Ryan thank you for having me appreciate it we'll do it again

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