Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 318 | Phil Robertson Spells Out Why Killing the Enemy While Serving Our Country Is Biblical

Episode Date: July 28, 2021

Phil, Jase, Al, and Zach explain what "thou shalt not kill" really means and why it's biblical for our military to wage righteous war against the enemy. Jase and Missy argue about the one person he loves to text. Phil discovers a new reason to hunt ducks. Jase is REALLY into the Olympics, and Phil is fascinated by figuring out why someone would watch. And Phil explains why doing the right thing will always win you God's favor. - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? So see, I'm checking my phone here, and you said, what are you doing? I had this pretty good discussion with my lovely wife because I was texting myself. And she thought I was being egotistical. You don't do that, Al? No, no. I don't text myself. It's like I don't talk to myself either. She said, why don't you put it in?

notes and I said, well, why would you text yourself if you already had the information? I didn't want to forget the information. Oh. So I texted myself. So it's a, it's a briefing,

a memory, memory. So, Dad, you and I write stuff. We're old enough. We still write stuff down. That's the way we remember stuff.

Jason is just doing it new, new age. I got it. I text myself. Well, yeah. Do you? Yeah, Zach's with you.

So do you sing a little song when I think of you? I text me. Jayce, have you ever text yourself and been offended by the text? Because you said something too harshly? That's why I didn't mean that egotistically. I just like texting myself because I'm unoffendable. Sometimes you give yourself an update, whether just in your mind or if you text yourself.

But three weeks later, you come to. a moment and you say that's the craziest thing I've ever thought about. Sometimes, you know, it works against you. You say, I don't know what I was thinking when I wrote that down, when I sent that text. Well, this is the funny part. So I'm into the Olympics. And I was texting myself to check on the date because every time the Olympics came on, I kept thinking, how did I miss this? Because they had 2020. Everything I see is 2020. And I saw, I asked Missy. I was like, is it not 2021?

And she said, it's 2021. I said, well, why do they keep saying this is the 2020 Olympics? She said, well, they moved it because of the coronavirus. So I was like, well, why don't they say it's the 2021 Olympics? Coronavirus or no? So I sent myself a text to research that and I figured out they had spent almost $2 billion. on marketing. So they decided they were marketing for the last five years

that the Olympics was going to be in 2020. Because it was in 2016. So I'm just asking what motivates you to be, I'm into the Olympics. I'm into them. What do you mean? Oh, I'll watch it. I watch the games.

I'm a competitor. I love our country. We're representing. We're seeing who's the best in the world. That's probably my competitive street. I take it, Dad, you haven't seen any of the Olympics so far? That's a good conclusion, a good deduction there. And you know what I like is I've watched a few hours of it at the wee hours?

And there's not been, you know, no political banner. They're just, we're playing a game. I'm trying to beat you. I represent America. You're, you're. So nobody's kneeling to false gods. Not that I've seen. It's just been competition.

Now, they have some new events, which were kind of interesting. I thought the three-on-three women's basketball was the most exciting women's basketball I've ever watched. It's three-on-three. There's no, there's one half of a court. You hit it just like we played out in the yard for years. Oh, yeah, half-core basketball. You make it. You miss it.

You take it behind the line, then you can shoot it. The whole game lasts about. seemed like it lasts maybe 20, 30 minutes. It was awesome. And we won. We won that little game on watch. I don't know how much time I would set aside to delve into that particular. You're missing out.

Last night they had the big showdown. I may be. I missed out a lot more than that. This swimmer Ledecki, who won like four gold medals in 2016, she has a rival. and some Australian woman, and they, like, showed the backstory, and this Australian woman's coach was, like, the most emotional person. I mean, he's hollering, and he, because he's like, we must beat this, this girl, you know,

I mean, he was like musing it. And you're on the edge of your chair, wasn't it? Well, by the time they talked about it and got me all swept up in the emotions of it all, when the actual race happened, like halfway through the race, it's those two and then everybody else's, They're not even in the race. I will give you this. If you're going to watch anything that has no lewdness or filthiness or carnal, who can run the fash or throw stuff, the feathers, jump high.

You know, you got a point. I would call that good clean watching. Yeah. You know, in the history of the Olympics, one time I looked up, like, events that we had, because some events I don't get, you know, they get the curly. now you basically throw a big stone down and you try to it's kind of like shuffleboard it's like icy shuffleboard is what I compared it to me we used to play shuffleboard Jason I kind of like that

by the way I mean I do it but they're like sweeping the place you know sweep you got sweepers and pushers by the way Al philosophically at least what what is what what drives human beings work worldwide to compete with each other to see who's the best. What is that about mankind? Because, you know, back in the games, they call it. You know, the Bible speaks of the games. You know what I'm saying?

So the Greeks and the Romans were real big into what Jason is talking about. It was a little more brutal, let's face it, back 2,000 years ago. What drives human beings to do those, to be involved? in that. So what's, what's the deal there? You know, I don't, you're right, it's very ancient. And I'd read somewhere that the original Greek Olympic Games were nude, they were nude, when they competed. So that would add another element to the whole proceedings. Oh, they got America, if they find that out, they, you got that coming next. Ratings are going up. Strip naked and see who's the fascists.

Of course, this is all pre, this is way before TV cameras. I don't know how that would work now. But you understand the question I'm asking because, you know, Jay's said he likes to watch it. I mean, what is it about? No, I don't like it. I love it. I'm hollering. I'm up, hollering, waking the house up in the middle of the heart. Are human beings there, are they born with competition?

I mean, competing. Well, it almost has to be, don't you think? It's that because it's been around so long that, like you said, and even Paul used this illustration. Where is it, Jay's First Corinthians, 9 or somewhere there. Run the race. Yeah, we talked about running the race. and you train for the race. And so he even used the idea of the games as a...

It's a safer competition in the battlefield. And I don't think he was speaking of it as a negative thing. Do y'all? No. No. I mean, not at all. He said you go into strict training for a reason. But he did say, you don't want to live your life just going for a temporary crown,

which in our case, we would say it was a gold medal. He said, you need to go for the big crown, which is the bigger one. But I do think it's in there, but I think it's a... Yeah, we do it once ever four years, so it's about right. Yep. So every four years, I get up front of the TV, and I just enjoy the experience. I mean, that kind of answered my credit. I was wondering why you, but...

Because I'm a competitor. Well, the human race is. Think about it. I like it. And it's good sports. How much did you say they spent two what? Two billion on promoting it. But now I didn't like that.

Don't now. I mean, now just put it on my TV. There's 2021, because I'm confused half the time what day. it is already. And now you're telling me, oh, yeah, it's 2021, but let's act like it's 2020 because we spent a couple billion on marketing. I didn't like that. Just so you'll know, you'll reach an age. And I'm speaking to myself when you don't even know what year it is. So what I'm saying? I do ask people that. That's why I send myself text. I try to stay up on current events. Well, no, but Chase, you're missing it. The Olympics are so big that they can go back in

time i mean they've just taken us back to 20 we're we're living last summer and through these athletes that's what's happening right you're you've missed what i was going to say they when you go back in the history they one event i wish they'd bring back because in the early days now i'm saying i think this was like in the early 1900s they had tug of war and to me i would watch that i mean get us get about our 20 strongest americans in a mud hole unless you're you're not you just have a tug of war. Why not? I mean, we're sending rocks down and sweeping where

I watched the fencing. I was another one I was hollering at some young girl, American. I mean, it was a tight, you know, they got the whole suits on and they got little swords. Oh yeah. But they won't really hurt you. They won't penetrate you. Well, now, when

you, when like the American poked the, because it was a Russian and American in the finals, hurt the the person whose helmet lights up means you got there first because now they got so much technology because you know they just take off they're stabbing each other in a non-graphic way but it's exciting you know what I mean yeah young girls got some weapons and some suits on see in the old days old days that was a life or death event so I'm into that and so I was I was trying to research what why the year i i actually thought they had run it last year and saved it i thought

they did this a year ago and we're just now showing it and i was like well how could that have not come out who won this stuff so missy saw me she's like what are you texting i was like well i'm texting myself to research that and she's like babe that this is real this is happening now so we had this Well, we actually had two arguments. Why do you text yourself? Because Missy doesn't do it. Yeah. And I said, in that way, it helps me remember because as soon as I text myself, I forget that I'm texting myself, my phone will go off and I'll be like, who's texting me?

I'm like, oh, that was me. So you texting yourself was not to elevate yourself. It was just to give yourself some information you might want to get back to. Yeah, I have hundreds of tests. hundreds. Your mother needs one of those. She needs to text herself every five minutes. So look, here's like I texted myself a week ago and I put, Missy said, are you seriously asking me something about ducks? And because I was going to tell you this story, I traded this property that I had in Austin. I just traded that to

Nashville. It was a, it was a trade. trade. Yeah. And this property in Nashville. Only a stock market man that's got a truckload of money would speak like that. I just traded, you know, a couple three hundred, four hundred thousand dollar house. I'm like, do what? Well, if you sell it. I got a little house down there, J.S. It's paid for and I'm not trading it to anybody. Well, if you sell it, you got to pay taxes on it. But if you trade it for a property weren't the same thing, life goes on. The government says you can do that. So you need to work for the government to give them a little insight.

I would love to get involved if I could have any kind of authority and make things right. Dad, what would you trade your house for? What's of equal value for your place down there? You know, we had to jack it up here last year because it had the front part of it was sucks going down into the mud and the doors wouldn't shut we'd scrape wood off the doors it keeps sinking and finally we're working on in doors where they'd shut you know so finally we called a uh that good carpenter that willie recommended uh Gary we called him in and he jacked up the front portion and put another little foundation there we live too close to the river you know floods coming

in and out which you actually welcome I welcome did I enjoy it everything you know It says that to me, I don't think Dad's going to get much for his trade. Hey, let's take a break. Well, in the real estate market, my son, he'll buy properties like yours. And the first thing he would do is rent a bulldozer. And he's then going to bulldoze that, build a nicer house, and then sell it. So I hate to tell you that your house is going to fall into the bulldoze line. All I wanted to do, my goal, Jace, unlike yours, was to get a house.

and at the time it was six acres of land as crazy as it sound and two houses were there for $29,000. That's what I got invested over there. Yeah. Well, but Phil, that was 40, 50 years ago. That's right. So I'm still there. So I'm like, well, but the good news is I don't owe anybody a dime. True.

Yep. So you've gone. Well, I don't. Not my training of you. I don't. I don't either. So we just have a bigger number. I didn't think one of my sons would be trading houses.

How many houses do you have, by the way? I'm not sure. Let's see. You have the one you live in. You had one down there in Austin, Texas. Let me check. Now you're talking Tennessee. Are there any more?

Check your text to find out how many houses you. I'm checking. You know. Texas, see. I don't know. But. I'm trying to tell you that this last place I acquired has a little farm on it. Well, that's a good, good.

Yeah, and they're moving and they got, you know, transferred or whatever their job. Is it a farm inside a subdivision or is it? So you're on out in the middle of this is in the woods. This is the one in Tennessee? Yeah. You have deer in the yard. Deer in the yard. Oh, yeah.

And so they have a, they got a bunch of goats and they have chickens. and they have ducks. And so what was amazing is they said the ducks lay more eggs than the chickens. Well, that's when I looked at Missy and I said, can you eat duck eggs? And she said, are you seriously asking me a question about ducks? I said, yes. Well, what you can do with this, I'm just giving you a few ideas.

Is it upstairs to the house? Or is it? Is there two stories? Two stories? Yeah, there's two stories. Well, there you go. So Burley told me, Paula Go was coming back from cutting beaver dams.

He showed up for about a week, and I'm using him for heavy lifting. But he shows up, and he said that he killed three deer out his bedroom. He's got a bedroom on the top. He's on the second story, got him a shooting lane out there in his yard, and it goes into some thick woods,

and he's got a little feeder up there, the deer walk up, he shoots them and has fresh deer meat around the clock. That will be the plan here because the woman who... Your upstairs bedroom will be your deer stand. I'm saying, you know, be... Exactly. I'm following it. The woman said that she had to put a rule on her husband and sons

that they could only shoot bigger deer because they were shooting them off the porch for food. Yeah. So I said, yeah, I like... Well, that's the strongest thing I've heard. heard about housing. That's a good deal, that, Jace. Yeah, I think it is. So anyway. Jay's back to your duck egg question. I don't know if you're going to answer this, but there's a farm, a duck farm where they raise eggs that's about 45 minutes east of us there in Westman

Road. And they raise duck eggs and they sell them to restaurants around town because apparently they're bigger and the yoke is bigger. So they do better, especially in baking. So stuff rises better. I mean, I've heard really good things about duck eggs. I don't know about just eating them straight up. Well, Missy didn't know. I learned something today. I didn't know the ducks, because I've always said,

as I now understand, after I got to Al's speech, I've always said a duck is really good for nothing other than getting his feathers and having a feather pillar. Because the old women used to pick, when they'd pick the duck, women all picked all the ducks back in back in the day in the 40s. Or eating. 40s and 50s.

So I'd watch the old women get together, and we all slept on mattresses that were made from duck feathers, pillars that were made from duck feathers. But I thought, in eating, that's the only thing they're good for it. But we've got number three now. Duck eggs, he said, are bigger. Baking, you're baking? They said there actually have a richer flavor,

because then I went and Googled it. And they were, I was like, what have I been missing? A duck has just gained worth in my mind in the last two minutes. So I'll give you one more, Dad. So a very... That's another good reason for shooting ducks, I guess. A very popular item in restaurants now, all across America, are duck fat fries. So they take the fat because, and you know this from your dressing and stuff,

the fat is much more dense. And so it makes it fries better. Like they do these truffle fries and stuff like that. It's definitely makes the best dressing. when you make duck and dressing, it's way better than chicken and dressing or turkey in dressing. Ducks have a better flavor to their fat. Their fat's got a better flavor. Yeah, speaking of duck fat fries, the first time I was introduced to that was your other son.

Willie had used that little concoction, and I was over at his house. But they also used goose feathers to make the birdie in my favorite Olympic game, which is badminton, to watch. Huh. Because Willie and I was on the badminton circuit for a while. Remember those days, Al? Oh, yeah, I was too. And it's one of the most fun games you can ever play.

So they have that in the Olympics, too? Oh, yeah. It's awesome. They're playing at a little higher level than Willie and I. But same concept. I got you. I mean, it's a, you know, slam and wham. And James is right.

So the reason, I love it too, and I saw one the other day, because I hadn't had a chance to watch a lot. But they had two Asian countries playing against each other. And, you know, you're used to seeing Jay, she looks somebody, you know, you're making the burgers in the backyard, and they got the badminton net set up, and they're running around. And it's, you know, you're watching that and thinking, oh, man. But then when you see real badminton, like we used to play in like what they're doing, where it's just moving all over the court. and they hardly ever move, and that's the whole deal.

I mean, you try to control the game from the middle of the court, but it was like watching us on steroids, you know, watching them play. Well, I'm going to order some duck eggs. Well, don't order them. I got a bunch of ducks I've just acquired. Are they laying? Yeah. They said they lay more than the chicken, so I got the duck eggs.

So I'd like to have some duck eggs and let Ms. Kaymaker pound cakes and everything from duck eggs. Consider chicken eggs. consider it done. Okay. Have you guys had the duck liver? They force feed the duck and he gets obese and he has fatty liver disease. Then they take the liver and they mush it up into a paste. A patte.

It's like a patte. It's a what's it called, Puegua? Yeah. Yeah. That's a delicacy. That's a delicacy right there. Well, I've ate a lot of duck livers and the hearts. And the hearts, the what?

What is it? The hearts. This is making me nauseous. No, I don't. What? The gizard, the hearts, the gizzard. But I've never tried the liver, but that's a thought. It's the liver mush. It's like a pattee foie gras.

Yeah, you put it like you spread it on a cracker. Yeah, I had it when we went to Normandy. Yeah. I didn't know. I thought it was strawberry butter. And I was like, oh, yeah, let's try this out. If you think you're going in for strawberry butter and you get fat. It's a little different flame with the strawberry butter.

I didn't care for it too much. The Cajins call it Gizier, the gizzard, but they always use them. You got to boil them to tender them, you know. But I always put usually that I have gizzards and hearts chopped small inside my gumbo. See, I've always, you know, you brought up the Cajins and calling it Gizier.

There's a lot of things, I think, that people eat that came right after huge consumptions of alcohol. And they said, hey, let's try that. Ain't bad. Where are you going to cause? Jesus. Hey. No.

They were stoned sober when they cooked these because of it. Wow. I don't know about that. I mean, gizards and hearts of a ducker. Why do you want to eat something where everything that goes in there is supposed to, I mean, that's an organ trying to siphon out all the bad stuff? You know what most people don't know if you know what you're doing when you're cleaning a duck gizzard, you can take off one side and the other side because if you just cut it right half in two and open it up, a duck's gizzard is full of little rocks and sand.

That's my point. But you have to clean that off, of course. But I just take and shave off barely missing that and on the other side barely missing it and throw that away. But a lot of them are used to. I say take the gizzard, throw it on a gravel road, and eat the rest of the duck. No, a good duck gizzard is cooked right is good. I mean, I've made many a duck dressing with gizards, you ate it as a boy. That's what gave you that energy and that insight.

Yep, I ate it as a boy that y'all forced me to eat. And now, as I'm older, when they say, here's some duck gizzards, I say, I think I'll pass. Somebody said, well, why would you eat a bunch of ducks all the time? I said, because that's all we had. I agree. If I was starving, I would eat a duck game. There you go. But guess what?

I'm not. Hey, let's take another break. So you're saying, Jess, your palate now just says no to the old stuff. Some of the stuff you're forced to eat. I get it. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. All right, Romans 13.

I brought up the Olympics because I think it's the most friendly that you can find when it comes to nations doing something and competing. But everybody, they're showing this common, their common sportsmanship. And you got to remember the whole point of the book of Romans was that everybody, God's grace is for everybody. Yeah. And so I like when the world comes together and we show character in how we're competing. That's what excites me.

I mean, that's part of it also. By the way, this is mentioned in 2 Timothy chapter 2, when he's saying, train people to know what they're doing, to train other, endure hardship with us like a good soldier of Christ Jesus. No one serving as a soldier gets involved in civilian affairs. He wants to please his commanding officer. Similarly, if anyone competes as an athlete, which is what you're referred to with the Olympics,

he does not receive the victor's crown unless he competes according to the rules, which is pretty cool. So he said the hard work in farmer should be first to receive a share of the crops. But he just makes a point there that, and far as athletes and soldiers, which is pretty cool. I agree.

There would be more discipline in their life, soldiers. They want to please their commanding officer, athletes, they compete with the rules. No fudging. I mean, we want to see who's got what. So the Apostle Paul spoke of that,

kind of like you're doing today. You know, he liked it. I think it's good, clean fun. Well, I think part of the idea of the Olympics was kind of what you're talking about, Jay's, because obviously in the old days, the ancient stuff was all just done within one culture, one country. And, you know, of course, the Greeks and the Romans had taken over a lot of other countries by warfare.

But the games or the idea, at least the modern games, are that we can, even people that we may not have a great relationship with, we can still compete against. So the idea was try to make athletics, you know, have that blitz. you know, have that bleed over and how people, you know, treat each other's countries, but, you know, it doesn't always work out that way. It's interesting because you look back at the Olympics in my lifetime, and the countries you wanted to beat the most

were the ones you kind of had a bad relationship. The Russians. The Russians in the U.S., you know, for 20 years during the Cold War, the Olympics were, everybody was like, we want to beat the Russians, you know. And I guess now it's kind of like that with the Chinese, you know, a little bit. Some of these Sunday, you know, instead of watching the

NFL, they went to the Coliseum and watched two men fight to the death with gladiators. You know, they got a little brutal with it, IJ. So you agree? Well, I know, but we've pulled back from that. We try to. Now you can't hit the quarterback high and you can't hit him low, which they're almost saying you can't hit him. Well, right.

But I'm saying I would never watch these events in anything else in life. If I drove by and I saw five boats, you know, kayaks and people were rowing, and I'm not even going to, I'm not going to stop and watch. But you put USA on it and you put another country. I mean, now let's see the best in the world is. Well, I'm watching this, and I'm cheering from my country. Yeah, the New Zealanders strapped the United States here a few years back with his sailboating, you know, they had the, but the New Zealanders beat them.

America. They never did get over that. Jace, a lot of people were surprised that for four years, all these sports you see in the Olympics, they're playing them in the off years, too. And they're even televising them, you know, but to your point, nobody's really tuning in to me. Nobody turns in until you put the country on the planet. Well, right. Maybe the Olympics, maybe the Olympics insert some type of, uh, conventional getting along, let's just compete in sports with no wars and killing each other. I mean, you know, it would be a healthy thing for countries if they could get together and do that,

I guess. What do you think, Zach? Well, I think it values humans, you know, we live here. We're, this let no debt remain outstanding, which we're going to get to in Romans 1380, except the one to love one another. I mean, you love your neighbor. Don't do all these. I know some of the listeners are going to send this in, so I'll just go ahead and bring it up for us to talk about.

Because a lot of people have kind of been turned off by the Olympics because there's been a few athletes that have, you know, lighten out during the anthem or turn their back, you know, on the flag and, you know, wore some stuff that was put on a T-shirt. And so a little of that has happened. I think it's not widespread. although, you know, to be honest, I hadn't seen it. I haven't seen except what's being reported.

So I know a lot of people just want to. Right. A lot of people want to throw it out because that kind of took the other take. I mean, I don't like that, obviously. But I thought most of those Americans that are over there love their country, love competing. So I hate to throw out the whole games because there's a few, in my opinion, a few bad actors and bad apples. So it's just another way to look at that. But I know there's going to be strong opinions about it in our, you know, our listeners.

Well, there is something to be said about camaraderie. You know, they ought to consider that, I guess, among nations. Comerottery here. We can get together and behave. I agree. Well, and we'd rather not go to war, but sometimes there is war, which kind of is the lead-in. We had a question from a guy named Jared that's a, I don't know if he's still in the military or just was, but he'd been deployed several times.

And he had been involved in several firefights. and in one of the cases took someone's life, you know, one of the, one of the combatants that they were, that we've been fighting against, I guess, in Afghanistan or somewhere in the Middle East. And, you know, it obviously has bothered him. And so he asked us about it. In lieu of the Ten Commandments, he said, you know, it says thou shalt not kill, which it actually says, thou should not murder. But I want us to talk a little bit about that as we lead into Romans 13, 13, because, you know, Paul lays out.

out, I guess a case for following the authorities. And in there, he mentions even the idea about bearing the sword. So what would be your take? Let me just read. I mean, it says everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities for there's no authority except that which God is established, which he was basically giving the almighty credit for the idea of establishment that we have on the earth. Yeah, call law and order. The authority. The authority, that exists have been established by God. Consequently, he who rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God is instituted and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.

For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from the fear of the one in authority? Then do what's right, and he will commend you. For he is God's servant to do you good, but if you do wrong, be afraid. and you got to remember, I think he's speaking in generalities here. I mean, there are corrupt governments, and there always is this presence of good and evil. So he goes on to say, is God's servant an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoing? Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities not only because of possible punishment,

but also because of conscience. And then he even says, this is also why you pay taxes for the authorities are God's servants who give their full time of governing, give everyone what you owe him, if it's taxes, taxes, revenue, revenue. And then he comes down and says, let no debt remain outstanding, except the debt to love one another.

And then by the end of 13, he gives you a picture of what the greater motivation for us to be, which is to be like Jesus. Yeah, what Jared needs to understand is... Hang on, Dad. Let's take a break. I would say to Jared, I said when the Japanese, for no reason, they had no reason when they attacked Pearl Harbor and they were trying to expand their empire, they were a powerful, powerful nation at the time.

So they attacked China, all their neighbors, they started conquering islands. They said, we need to get the United States out of the way. So let's take care of their fleet at Pearl Harbor. So about 3,000, I think, a little less than 3,000 died on that day. And that day will live in infamy, according to the president, old Roosevelt at the time. This day will live in infamy because we're coming back. So we declared war on Japan because they attacked us. Jared needs to understand that millions stepped forth and went to the Marine Corps,

the Air Force, the Army, everybody. So everybody under one said, we're not going to let you do that, attack us for no reason. So when they all joined up, we lost hundreds of thousands during that process, four, five, six years. So World War II came and left. But all those guys, I went to Omaha Beach and I stood on that sand and looked how far it was to the edge of the bluff. and on top of the bluffs, all the Germans were dug in. That phase of the war, I was just hoping that they had a love for God and believed in Jesus Christ before they started out across that sand, that beach.

So that's that. So the twin towers, Jared, we were attacked, two of our tallest buildings in the New York City, for crying out loud, and they ran jet loads of human beings into the, these buildings and they did it with no reason. They just did it because they could, they were trying to make a point, I guess. So they murdered all these citizens of theirs. Three thousand died there. So Jared, the conflict you were into, you were there because the president of the United States, George Bush said the people who brought these towers down, they're going to be hearing from us. So, Jared, you were the one of the ones that joined up.

But when you killed our enemy, just remember, they're the ones that started it. And in my humble opinion, it was a righteous undertaking when you signed up, joined up, and you went into war against the enemy. And by my count, I think we won it. We're basically out of there now, and it's all ended, Iraq, Afghanistan, and all that. but I think it was worthy of note that they're the ones that started running airplanes in the buildings, not us. As Al mentioned at the beginning, you kind of briefly said it, but the verse doesn't say

thou shalt not kill. It's thou shalt not murder. The Hebrew word is murder. And so a killing is not necessarily sinful unless it's murder. If someone breaks into your house and they're going to raise. raping pillage, you know, your family and your belongings. So obviously you defend your family and you kill them in response. That's not, that's an honorable thing to do, not to protect your family.

So I would tell Jared first and foremost, because the email said, Now Shall not Kill. I know it's actually, now shall not murder. And when I ran for U.S. Congress in 2014, I'll never forget in one of the debates, one of my opponents, who was mayor of Monroe at the time, Jamie Mayo, he asked me, what would I do about ISIS? And I was like, well, I think there has to be a force and whatnot. And he brought that point up.

He said, well, I thought you were a big Christian. Your Christian values on one side. Then he said, kill them on the other side. He said, doesn't the Bible say, thou shalt not kill? And I was like, no, the Bible says thou shalt not murder. And so there is a time for killing. Now, I think that there's pacidists out there that, might argue with us, and I would certainly respect their opinion.

But I can see how they get there scripturally. But I don't see it. I think the scripture says that it's very clear in the Old Testament, at least 10 commandments. And you see that Abraham was an example of somebody. You preached on Genesis 16 yesterday. What was it, Genesis 13, whenever Lott was it 14, 13 or 14, when Lott was kidnapped.

Abraham went in there who was a man of faith, the patriarch of our faith, and he killed a few people to get a lot back. He left to provide him back. Why are you there, Zach? You can tell Jared, Joshua, Joshua, start there. Gideon, Samson, Jonathan, David, Elisha, Jehoshaphat, and all through the book of Deuteronomy. And Joshua, you say, God was leading the charge against these murderous nations that had popped up.

and we're trying to kill the is lights off he protected them i think in romans 13 hang on jason let's take last break the verse before romans 13 for we read says do not be overcome by evil but overcome evil with good i mean he had made the same reference in 12 9 where it said love must be sincere hate what is evil cling to what is good and then in chapter 13 when he made this point about rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. You keep seeing this come up, and even at the end of 13, it says, let us, this is verse 12, let us put aside the deeds of darkness and put on the armor of light.

Let us behave decently. And then he lists things that are evil. In verse 14, it says, rather clothe yourselves with Jesus. And he also makes reference in the end of verse 12 about let us put on the armor of light. And we have this spiritual application that he uses. Paul uses in Ephesion 6 about put on the armor of God. I read all that to say our primary focus is to point people to Jesus. Where's the passage in Corinthians says we don't fight?

We don't wage war like the rest of the world. But there is an instance when it comes to the government. and distinguishing between good and evil, where we have to rise up and be a part of that. I.e. David, who said there is a time for war. And you remember Jesus when he was given the illustrations of counting the costs in Luke 14? Remember when he said, you know, suppose a king is fixed to go war with another king. Will he not first sit down? And, I mean, Jesus himself was set there.

there's a time where we're moving, this is evil what you're doing and for the greater good of our neighbor that you're oppressing or persecuting. By far, loving each other where it doesn't come down to warring with each other is a far better idea and it's a lot safer for a lot more people.

If you've learned to love one another, love God, love our neighbor, it's a lot better than war, that's for sure. And war should be a last resort, and it should be rare, but it's when the atrocity has reached a certain level where things are happening to fellow human beings that other people have to move in and say, no, we're not. Well, that's a good point. You think about Dietrich Bonhofer. I mean, that's really the place he got to, Jace, with Adolf Hitler. Bonhofer is a orthodox, you know, preacher, minister in the Lutheran church in Germany.

and he was very patient with trying to be faithful to the cause, faithful to the ministry at some point in the history of Germany and that whole in the unfolding of the Holocaust, he thought it was worthwhile to try to attempt to assassinate Hitler. And I think he was justified, do you? Yeah, I do. And not only that, you mentioned, Dad, you mentioned David, I mean, David is the perfect example, King David, because when he was young, I mean,

he was just starting out. Yeah. I mean, you see how God cares about soldiers when he basically gave him the wherewithal to take Goliath down. And look, that was a brutal situation. He killed him with that rock. And then he took that big old sword and cut his head off. And he said he dragged, he took his head around and carried it around with him for about a month.

You know, so I mean, all that, you read stuff like that in the Old Testament. Of course, a lot of people say, well, that's the Old Testament. But remember Jesus is the same yesterday, today, and forever. And we've already established that he was around the whole time, along with Yahweh, the father, and along with the spirit. So you look at the book of judges, same thing. I mean, Samson was a killer. I mean, Samson killed a lot of people. Yep.

You know, and he did it by the power of the Spirit of the Lord, according to the scripture. So I think the tender of that, like Jason is right. We don't want to, we don't want to kill people. We don't want to have to defend ourselves. there, nobody ever attacked me. But the reason I carry a weapon around is in case somebody does. And if they're after me or my family, I'd rather share Christ with them. But if they got menace in mind, then, you know, we're going to have to throw down. That's just the way it is. And that's not anti-Script. Would you agree with, as far as Jared is concerned, that his participation in the war

against our enemies was justified. In my mind, he was justified. Absolutely. I think so too. And I think he'll be in heaven for eternity because he believes in Christ and has agreed to follow him. So whether he kills someone in war or not. But I do think, I do think it's a testament to his character. I mean, that's a serious thing that takes somebody's life. I can see how that would be a traumatic thing that he would probably continue to wrestle with. He might for the rest of his life, you know. And that's why we talk about the sacrifice these guys make.

It's not, I mean, some of them sacrificed their lives, but even taking somebody's life, it has to be quite the sacrifice. you got to carry that with you now. But I appreciate your service, Jared, if you're listening. Absolutely. To Jason's point, Jason, I'd lot rather have a Bible study with my neighbors, no matter where they're from, what country they're from. I'd rather sit down, have a Bible study.

We talk about God, talk about Jesus, introduce him. I would lot rather that than some guy who breaks in your home or two or three of them, and they're there to rob, steal, and kill. Well, you think about it. It's too late for a Bible study. What causes war is evil behavior. Yep. And where people are looking at humans, not from a godly perspective.

I mean, you think about, we mentioned Hitler and other wars. A lot of people just, they hate another race of people, and they just want to do them harm. Yep. And they start doing all these things that are so atrocious that other people have to rise up and say, no. But the greatest weapon we have to fight that, is to change the heart, which is the message of Jesus through the grace of God, and start looking at people from a godly perspective, which is what Romans is all about, is that Jew and Gentile can be saved.

Yep. And Jew and Gentile includes everyone, every nation. Which Paul made your point, Jason, in verse 3, he said, rulers hold no terror for those who do right. But for those who do wrong, you know, that's where you get into the problem. So it's kind of like we talked about this, you know, last summer when we had all this stuff with the police and the Black Lives Matter. And of course, most of us just look at those situations and thought, man, if you'll just do the right thing, you really don't have to be fearful. Oh, it's just because you're white, whatever.

But it really is true. I mean, the Bible is true about that. You know, people may be falsely accused. That's going to happen because they're evil. To your point, Jay is about sometimes having corrupt, you know, officials and government or police officers. There's going to be some of that. But then that's on them. that's their bad.

You know, so even Jesus. Even Jesus was crucified and he didn't do anything wrong. So, you know, you'd think, well, this, what, there's a contrast here. There's always going to be exceptions to the rule. But the overall rule is our, our main warfare should be spiritual, not physical. Yeah, I agree. I agree. I think that's why Romans 13 is honestly sitting in the middle of this book.

it's almost like a, oh, by the way, kind of thing. I don't think it's the axis of the Christian faith for us to go out there, wage war. I think that's a function of government. I think God, the scripture gives governments that right, even whenever Jesus himself was crucified. Do you remember when Pilate said, do you not realize that I have the authority to kill you? And Jesus is like, yeah, I realize that because it came from my father. So even Jesus in that exchange is recognizing the right of government to impose these things. But I don't think that's the church should certainly not be.

I don't think we should be going out there as the church in the name of Jesus. Let's go take down people and start wars. I think the church's role is to be kingdom people. And I think this whole passage is like, you be kingdom people and let the government do their stuff and you guys submit to them because you've got something else going on over here. This is your kingdom people. But submit to the government. They're there for your good in general.

I mean, there's obviously, this is even written in the time when the Roman government, I mean, you think about what was about to happen with Nero and, I mean, the government was not going to be for their good. But I think it was more, this is a contextual thing here to bring people back into a kingdom mindset. Well, that's why his, that's why he said the greatest weapon in verses 8 through 14 is love. you don't bring people together you don't prevent wars i mean you sow the seed of love that's why he said clothe yourselves in verse 14 with the lord jesus and don't think about how to gratify the desires under sinful nature he's giving you an image of i mean it's like you're literally putting on jesus as clothes which reminded me of that galatians 3 27 you know all of us who were baptized into christ

have closed themselves one of a little interesting points here. Jesus and Luke chapter 11 about verse 21 when a strong man fully armed guards his own house, his possessions

are safe. But when someone stronger attacks and overpowers him he takes away the armor in which the man trusted and divides up the spalls. So there there is something to be

said with that particular text, do you see what I'm saying now? Yep, that's exactly right. So, and you see that quite a bit. And to Zach's point, as we wrap up here, I think that's why we wouldn't be supportive of the Crusades, you know, that went on. Because that was the idea, if you don't, if you can't convert them, then you kill them. But, I mean, God didn't treat us that way. No. So I don't think that's the way the church, we should do respond either. But anyway, we'll, we'll talk a little bit more when we get back to Romans 13 into 14. next time. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click that little bell

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