Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 425 | Jase Prepares to Defend His Chickens & Phil Highlights the Leaders of Culture

Episode Date: February 11, 2022

Al teaches how the Holy Spirit is the authority within us that allows us to Identify our own convictions without relying on the guidance of others. Phil discusses the problem dictators and prime ministers have when attempting to change a culture. Jase warns against exercising freedoms that could place stumbling blocks for our fellow believers, and Al urges believers to seek Jesus rather than focusing on theological debates. And Jase prepares to defend his chickens from coyotes. Watch the Unashamed overtime show, only on BlazeTV: https://BlazeTV.com/Unashamed Get Uncanceled by Phil Robertson, available now: https://www.amazon.com/Uncanceled-Finding-Meaning-Accusations-Condemnation/dp/1400230179 Blaze has great Uncanceled T-shirts and mugs you can get at https://PhilMerch.com - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? So it was a joy on the last podcast to have Larry Bowles. He's just the kind of guy. I mean, we really, you made a great point about like he's, you know, firemen. You wouldn't think. Well, he self-taughty just studied. But he, you know, he did a radical thing. We're in the name of Jesus.

He said, I'm going to go out here to a mission field. a place that you would think a guy from Oklahoma would never want to be stuck in because it's just a big city. But he has all the history, and he's a lot smarter than he looked. He's like an old Airdale dog, yeah, exactly. But over there, he would do four-hour classes. And you sat in on some of them. I've seen you in four-hour classes. It didn't go well. I had ADD before. That was a thing. I mean, I'm not as bad as Willie. Willie, I watch him, you know, sometimes we're in church. watch Willie. He starts squirming after five minutes. I'm like 20, 20 minutes I start squirming because it's just hard for me to sit anywhere and do. Usually he's up and out of the room. He's got to move

around. I'll see him. I was like, yep, he's gone. He just couldn't. He's a bit high strong. He's like, oh, I sit there and listen to a guy for four hours. You can bet that that he's got something to say. So I'm really impressed with him. Because it's got a pure heart. He's doing it for the Lord. And I mean, I'm not making light of Greece. Look, I enjoyed it or whatever, but the fact that I would, if I had to go there for 10 years, I'm just not a big city guy. And he's not either, but he's doing it because he believes that's what the Lord wants him. Well, and we didn't get into the salon the last podcast because we've talked about the last time he was on the podcast before yesterday. But he, the thing about it is he, the impact he's having in the Middle East. I think that's what I'm excited about because you know, we've been, we've been fighting over there for 20-something year. We've been trying to change it by political will or war, and it ain't working. I mean, I believe that with all sincerity, I'm involved in the war on terror. Yeah.

Because through Jesus, that can change the heart. It's not about the weapons they're using. You're never going to be able to take away all that. You're not going to attack it politically. You say, how do you change a country? You do it with a small group of people, men and women, and families who fall in love with Jesus, and that love can resonate and take off like a wildfire because these people are driven.

You've just given the reason for the latest book coming out with. Uncanceled. You're welcome. Yep. I didn't even realize I was doing that. You were. And it's right. And the thing about it is, Jay, the people that you met are willing to risk their life to then, you know, mostly via the Internet, but to go back.

into the culture and say, look, here's what we learn. And so, you know, just like you see in communist China, you're seeing a groundswell of underground believers, which, by the way, is exactly how the first entry church started. I mean, it was pushed underground because of persecution because you had the Romans and the Jews. You won't change the world by dictators, prime ministers, presidents. Wars. They're just flawed individuals. You try to get the best one to represent the people that you can but at the end of the day only God through Jesus can remove sin

and raise you from the dead the government's can't it's just like what we're in we're in 1st Corinthians 9 it's the same thing he doesn't have to go over there and do that he's not compelled by some kind of forcibly

oh it's my duty and you can say he's doing his duty to the Lord but of all the things you would choose you just wouldn't choose that I went over there. It's like, you're talking about miserable. Because I kept thinking, why are you here?

I kept saying that. He's like, I'm here for the Lord. There's nothing comfortable about that area for a guy where he's from. But it finally hit me. I thought, you know what? He's just decided this is what he's doing. Him and his wife, they're just on the front edge of making the world literally a better place through. Jesus and the love he brings.

Well, I always enjoy having him on with our group. So we'll try to do that a little bit more. So you were off from filming last week. So you got a little R&R. Tell us what you did. I mean, look, I was this. I don't know why our listeners taught me into doing the show because I underestimated. So did you hear that undershamed nation?

It's your fault now that Jason has been. I mean, I feel good. If you had just said no, then he wouldn't. I feel good. about it but I didn't think about I mean I feel good we're like four or five episodes in now and I'm and I think it's going to be something we can all be happy about because the true treasure in life comes from these godly spiritual qualities and relationships however I mean it's daylight to dark and then when I get home you know it's phone calls about what we're doing next I mean it just never stopped so I had to go decompress Missy was like let's go see the grandbaby she It's not like she needed an excuse for that. Oh, yeah. But it did hit me.

And, you know, I'm going to give you a physical illustration for about, you know, Ephesians 6 here. We're in a spiritual war, and we have the armor of God that God is supplied. But I'm going to give you a good illustration of how this happens and sometimes how we don't understand what's going on. So here's Missy. Look, she has Yuppie tendencies. That's a nice way of saying. She's the total opposite from me and everything outside of Jesus and our kids. That's well documented.

But she wanted to be closer to the grandkids, and so we had a fortunate blessing happen at the sale of our house in Austin, so we just exchanged it for a little farm that's on the top of a mountain in the middle of Tennessee. Well, here's what I've noticed. If you put a bunch of chickens and goats, At the top of a hill in a very wooded area, the predators are coming. They're coming. It's the circle of life, Jay.

Everybody loves chickens. Every animal loves chickens. I mean, once they get on it, they're not getting off of it. So when we acquired the property, they left the chickens and the goats. We had 30 chickens at one time. Now we have six. So I thought Missy wanted me to come up there and see the grandbabies. baby but when I got up there real quick I figured out no there's there's a different reason she wants me

to figure out what's killing these chickens and attacking the goats and the third part of this this kind of coup was that in the winter up there when you're on the top of a hill in a nice heated environment mice from miles around go to the top of that mountain and they enter your house well I don't have any chickens but there's currently a not mice

infestation it's a rat wolf rats they're about a foot long from one end to the other they're about a foot long and they have descended on my little

house it's about 30 year 40, well was that thing 76 but it was another 10 years before that's about 50 year old house and they have found ways inside my house and we started first hearing them now you walk over there you see a rat take off so the rats have moved in among us I am I'm retaliating with the glue that they run over and they just stick you know one one I notice I all I had when I look check my trap was his tail he got stuck in the glue that's where it works

Then you'd knock them in the head and throw them in the trash, take them outside and throw them in the trash. But, you know, this one just his tail was there. He ate his tail off because his tail evidently was the only thing holding. This is getting rated all real quick. Well, I showed cable to your mama. I showed her one last night. I'm currently on the offense.

I'm trapping them. I'm poisoning them. And they're dying. And I had one, a big one last night. she said I heard one while ago I said where'd you hear him she told me on the front porch out there on the porch yeah I heard right in there

I took a step and I saw him flash get behind the refrigerator that's out there two freezers and a refrigerator I saw where he went I set my traps out quick the glue ones and within five minutes she said I heard something out there I go out there and I see him

and all four wheels are stuck in the mud he can't go anywhere So, I mean, look, you knock me in the head. I go in the head, kind of like I want to platter, and I showed it to your mother, and she just, she screamed. I didn't know. You wash your hands real well after doing this, you know, you're knocking rats in the head. Well, your butler had sent me a picture where he had moved the gun cabinet,

and it was a pile of dog food like I've never seen in acres and everything. 10 to 15 pounds of dog food had been taken from the little trays where we feed the dogs on the port set. The rats were taking them to the high place. And one at a time. And it was a mountain of that underneath the gun cabinet. Did you see the potatoes they were growing in the dog food? So they liked potatoes too. It was like a little farm inside of that.

So whatever diseases warf rats have. You got them. We love to get them. It probably made you immune to the current diseases. This is make the kill, wash the hands. Make the kill, wash the hands. That's what we're doing right now. Mama said, she said, I'm not sleeping with us.

It wasn't matter. So she started telling me about this. She said, yeah, Mia came out and spent the night with us. But she said, she was in, she heard the story about us talking about all the rats. And I guess she's like her mama. She ain't much on all that. So she was sleeping in the guest room. So she goes in and wakes mom up at 12, 30 and said,

I'm okay, there's a rat in my room. I hear some scratching. So they spent the night on the two couches in the living. Now there's traps inside that area where they were sleeping, trying to meet me trying. You said, well, why don't you get some professionals to go out there, you know? That's what I would do. It's just rat killing.

I know what trapping's all about. Well, let me tell you this. But I've got coming to professionals with whatever it takes. Well, when I got called, I go up there and I assess the situation. So I went out and I'm looking at the landscape. What's killing the chickens? Yeah, what's killing the chickens. So I looked around and thought, yeah, the two southern chicks, probably are the bobcats and the coyotes.

So I went metal detecting on my property the first afternoon because it was the best weather. Well, I'm coming back to the house. Well, I got a shovel and a metal detector. And I get, I'm climbing the mountain. I'm almost to the house. I hear a big racket. I look up. I thought it was two dogs.

And here comes two coyotes, literally 20 feet from him. And they looked at me like, what are you? Yeah, what are you here? It just kept on going, like, no biggie. So I took off running up the mountain, dropped the metal detector, grabbed my 22 rifle, which I probably should have grabbed a bigger caliber gun, but it just, in the heat of the moment, I was thinking a properly placed 22 bullet is not to be underestimated.

And so I grabbed it. I went on the other side of the mountain. Well, when I got down there and look, of course, there you go, I thought it was a long shot. And so I look around and I see a glimpse, well, here comes another one. Now, I know it's a different coyote just because he just looked different. So I'm like, well, look at here. So I pull up, well, he stopped behind a bush and looked at me.

But I wasn't, I was underestimating the amount of ground. brush that's there. It's not like here where everything's flat and anything just grass you can shoot through. But I thought to myself, well, he thinks he's hiding behind this bush. That's a mistake. Because I could barely see the outline of him behind the bush. So I pop. And I'm thinking, that's a heart shot. But he took off like I didn't hit him. But when I got down there and look, well, that bush was way more hardy than I realized. I thought there's no way that bullet would have gone through there. And in fact, I looked at it to the point to where I saw where my bullet went through about

five of the prickly little branches. And I thought, nope. So I come up there. I tell Missy the story. She's like, you just shot at a coyote? I said, yeah. She's like, and you didn't kill him? What's wrong with you?

I was like, hey, wait a minute here. She's like, we need to call some professionals. I was like, hey, this is a war that will never end. And she said, what do you mean? I said, you can't get a house on top of a hill, put a bunch of chickens up there, and think that some war is going to end in five minutes. You know, I said, but I let them know from now on, things have changed. When you see me, there will be no casual look. She was thinking the war could in with one shot fire.

It escalated into argument because she was attacking my dignity as a hunter. I said, hey, this is not going to stop. You can't move to the woods. And all of a sudden, think, oh, we have mice in the house. There's cows getting our chickens. I was like, this will never end. I would simply say get more firepower. Exactly.

But that'll help. Let's take another break. So then she said, well, I call a professional. You know, he came up and put some mousetraps out. I was like, when did that happen? Ten days ago? I said, well, did that stop? And she said, I've actually seen more since.

I said, I am the professional. I was like, but you can't get instant access. It's a war. I was making this illustration to go back to my spiritual thing. They're never going to stop coming. I said, they're coming. You battle them. You get the first ones right off the back because she said, well, what's your plan?

I said, this is the plan. When I see them, I shoot at them. I said, but I keep going and they keep coming. And at some point, the tide will turn. and this place will become a coyote burial ground. I was like, but it's a long-term process. And she said, well, I'm out of here until something gives until the tide turns. I'm like, well, fine.

So that's how we left it. Yeah. Hang on. Let's take a break. Well, so that's exactly, Jay's the, what's funny to me is that anybody that's living that lives in a farm somewhere in the middle of a field. Or in the woods, either one, they know exactly what y'all are describing because it's life every day. You know, you get in the wintertime, the barmets are coming.

Precisely. So it's no, this is no surprise, but about the third day I was there, I went scouting. I thought maybe we could do, you know, an episode up there. Some people had written in to the podcast and said they had some historical places. Well, the first one I went was a yuppie guy, you know, him and his wife. They have nine kids. and they're living out in the middle of the country. But I could tell real quick, just in a conversation,

this guy has yuppie tendencies. And so I was telling him just about what we do and what the show's about. And he's like, hey, I got a question, well, you're a hunter. He's like, we had a bunch of chickens, but they're all dead. And I'm trying to figure out. I was like, oh, here we go. So I said, I can't wait until I get back to tell Missy.

Guess what? This is going on statewide. They're our chickens and they're under attack. We got too many coats. And there'll always be an ongoing battle with them. You're not going to clean them out. Which was my point. And it's just like from a spiritual perspective,

this is an ongoing battle of good and evil. God has given us the ability to choose, but he's also given us his son as the answer to whatever the problem is on a launching pad for a new beginning. And then you just pick aside. And Jesus's side is going to win. So is the only other than man is the only natural predator of the cow like a bobcat or some kind of big cat?

What kills him? Humans. Is humans only? Or will a big cat eat a kill a cow? Well, but I mean. Mountain lion, maybe they're probably not in a big mountain line country. No, we're not. Cows would be, they're in cities walking around in the road street.

You know, so if you don't do something about them, they will overcome. There will be no chickens being raised. Well, look, the third day, we had a bobcat coming. Because now I'm hunting. I'm just hunting them. Forget treasure hunting. You're hunting. I missed more this week than I've missed in my life.

I missed a bobcat. I mean, it was a quick shot, and it just, you know, I took it, and I missed him. But, and she's like, why do you keep missing? I mean, I was like, hey, I'm not going to. going to come up here and defend. With questions like that, that's a threat to your man. I'm like, I'm in a country that I'm not familiar with with the lay of the land. And I had a quick shot and I took it. And it was a bobcat. And she was like, I mean, I just can't believe this is happening. So here we go again. I thought we're going to be arguing about this week.

Early pioneers, if you could just reel back quickly and get all the records of, evidently you're in a mountain range. What mountain range is it? I have no idea, but I'll do some research. It's probably the smoky mountains. It's hill country up there. I mean, what I'm calling a mountain is a hill. Those old Tennessee people that live there, you talk to the old ones, and they'll give you a little insight into that.

Now, you start with traps and all that, but then you've got people's dogs, your dog. Well, that's what I told her. I said, I can't go by the, because we're on the top. of this hill but it's actually a neighborhood but it's real scattered out while in the valley there's i'm surrounded by houses and i'm like number one i'm not shooting towards somebody's house even though i'm far enough away yeah but it's just as a general rule you don't do that i was like you can't use any kind of steel traps or poison or all that because it's you've got other people's we have a dog the goat herder dog i don't want him to go i was like so that i'm limited if i was

just out in the middle of nowhere, like over at your land. Well, the rules of engagement change there. That's true. Because you're just firing at will using all kind of traps because there's nothing out there except predators and the prey. I mean, that's it. Of course, one of the things she's missing is that just by you taking them on, you're building a fear into them that they didn't have from before.

I said the problem, I've only been here three times. I said, and these people at the lower bottom, they're not, they have open pastures. in their yard. All this is going on up here. And I said, we have the bait, which is our chickens. That's it. They're coming for the chickens. And the mice are coming to get warm.

And it's the best place to hide is up there. I was like, it's like any kind of battle or war. We're at the top of the hill. It's a fortress. And we have something that they want. They're coming. So I don't know why you wanted to buy this place. I mean, it just escalated into a typical marriage argument.

I'm like, it was like, why are we even here? That's where it got. Why are we even here? I was like, you're going to have to be patient. You know, where yuppie women meet predators, as such as Bobcats, and probably wolves in some part of the country. They reinstated. Don't tell her that. They put the wolf.

They brought wolves in. They thought they was going to run out of wolves. So now they're all over Montana, Wyoming, all up through their. The wolves are preying on the ranchers. cattle. It's a bone to be cheated. The mountain men thing, it's showing how they do and how they try to get them to slow them down. But most people don't understand that.

They're just too ignorant to understand that you just can't live in harmony with wild animals. It's, they're after whatever you're chickens. Not if you want eggs every morning. I can tell you that. That's exactly right. So I said, hey, let's go in there and make some omelets and just what few eggs we have left here. and I'll take care of it, but just you've got to give me a little time. There's patience in this game.

And I guess at the end of the line, if they get all the chickens, you'll just have to go back to buy an eggs like everybody else to. No, I just said, we'll get some more chickens. Or you get some more chickens. You got to remember they eat. We see the signs of it all the time. You walk up, you're driving along on a four-wheat, and you look in the middle of the road,

and there's a fresh kill, and all that's left is maybe one hind-quarter and part of the rib cage, baby deer, fawn. Well, you say, hmm, it's either coyote probably, maybe a big bobcat. We see bobcats. We see coyote. They have to eat. So they come after the deer over here,

and it's a thinning process, you know. So you just kind of got to remember. Backwater runs them out, so this is not, it could be worse. We were up on a hill like he's talking about. The backwater's not going to run them out of there. That's right. They're there. When you don't have God as the center.

They're ingrained in the terrain. When you don't have God as the center, though, you come up. I saw an article today. No joke. Now, you can't make this stuff up. They're like, now the scientists have said, well, the deer herds have now obtained the coronavirus. So they're trying to figure out what we're going to do. And I'm like, if these people, and I'm assuming these are yuppie people, I'd love them.

If we start lining up deer herds and try to vaccinate them, I'm out. Oh, yeah. You know? Or if, you know, we're going to try to mask the deer herd. I don't think masks and vaccines are going to work. Y'all think I'm making this up. But this is, they're actually, there are people in rooms having meetings. It doesn't surprise me.

What are we going to do about the deer herds now having coronavirus? Because everything we're working for is not going to work if they're not. wearing mask and they don't have vaccine. It's a way for them to do away with deer hunting. A lot of people deer hunt in the United States, millions. Well, it might excel it. I don't know. Well, right.

Yeah, exactly right. I don't know which part of that spectrum it goes. Well, I'm glad to see, Jay's, you're on the case, and so you're going to get to the resolution. So, I'll get it done. I mean, it's personal now. But it takes time. But I did think it was a good analogy for what we're talking.

talking about. I mean, it never ends. You wake up every day, and it's a process. And that's just like living a Christian life, you know? I mean, that's, that's what's about. You're right. And there's always, there are always enemies. There are always the insidious things that are always working against you, which is true. I mean, there's a verse in Second Corinthians that says, what is the one that says of the weapons we fight with? Yeah, this is Second Corinthians 10.3. For though we live in the world, we do not wage wars the world does. The weapons we fight. fight with are not of the weapon or not the weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds.

We demolish arguments in every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God. And we take captive every thought and make it obedient to Christ. Which goes into what we're studying. Paul was trying to get the Corinthians to realize that Jesus is the filter for the decision-making process. Even the stuff that's hard to wrap your head around, even the things you're free to do, he was saying in some cases, I'm not going to exercise my freedom because if I can use that to promote Jesus by neglecting myself, I'll do it. Isn't that what First Corinthians 9 is about? It is.

Let's take another break. It is, Jace. And back to just to set the stage for it, in chapter 8, a couple of podcasts ago, we talked about the food sacrifice to idols. And just like we said in chapter 7, we were talking with Larry, we're only getting the answers to questions that he was asked because we don't have privy to the letter they sent to him. And I think that's by God didn't, he didn't do that by accident.

Right. I mean, because the bottom line, the theme here is if you get Jesus figured out, the rest will take care of itself. Don't worry about the small stuff. I mean, if he felt like we needed to have the gory details of all this situation in their culture, we'd have the first two letters. But we don't have them. And I think it goes to the point of what we were talking about that most of the questions weren't the right questions anyway.

I mean, part of the whole idea of the book is the reason they're asking so many questions is they're to understand that if Jesus were first, we wouldn't have these problems. At the very first of the book, we talked about these people were following men instead of cry. Let me give you an illustration, and I want to read this, say, grand this, because I thought about doing this last podcast, but I just, I did. But you know, when you have in a court of law and you're trying to get to the truth, and these lawyers that get up there and they'll ask these questions, you know, and then these,

or even in the, you know, when you see these politicians, when they have these Congress boards and they're all like, and especially someone they don't agree with, they're like, yes or no. They'll try to get it down to a yes or no question. Because they don't want you to opine on whatever. No pontification. Just give me the yes or the no. Yes or no, because then they're trying to lay a trap.

Right. Once they have you in the trap, then they'll give the explanation for why if you said yes to this, you know, and this goes on in our society and our culture. And so when you're trying to figure out these difficult issues or here we, 2,000 years later, seeing how this applies to us and the problems at Corinth, when 2 Corinthians 1, which this is one of my favorite passages in the Bible. He gets to verse 18, and we'll get to this in a deeper form later, but it says, but as surely as God is faithful,

our message to you is not yes and no. And just to use my illustration, if you're looking at a chapter in the Bible and you're trying to dial in the exact meaning of every situation and circumstance in a yes or no form, where all the boxes are checked in your mind that you have it, quotation marks, figure it out in every detail,

you're going to live a frustrated Christian life. Because it's not about that. But he says, for the son of God, Jesus Christ, verse 19, who was preached among you by me, Silas,

Timothy, was not yes and no. But in him, it's always been yes. For no matter how many promises God has made, they are yes in Christ and so through him the amen is spoken

by us to the glory of God so that's what I wanted to say is that I mean these are difficult things we're reading we don't have food sacrifice to idols now wondering whether we can eat it or not is that oh that was given to a demon I can't eat it because that's sacrilegious

or what about that answer the question yes or no can I eat food sacrifice to an idol and so I think eventually when you read something like that, he was trying to say, it's about Jesus. That's what it's about. Right. That's the filtering system. That's the different war we use. We have all these thoughts and confusion and questions and we make them obedient to Christ and remember that the proclamation of him through people is really what we should be doing, not worrying about, oh, what can I get away with

or what can I can and can't do in all the little decision-making process involved around the? They'll ask you the questions. The question to elaborate on what you said, do you think it's right to get ready because there's no telling what you're fixing to here? Do you think it's right to, that's what they would say. Right. Or even to go back what Larry said, they'll say, well, now do you think it's right, if, woman if she speaks at the front of the church building or you know in a group of people now could she speak out in the parking lot and it because they read first Corinthians 14 which we address that and

larry did awesome about that we'll talk more than we get there but i'm saying in all these issues there's a lot of religious groups who are systematically in a lawyer type fashion trying to get yes and no answers to every specific situation that's ever been in the history of the history of the history of of humanity in all cultures and make it all fit. And guess what? If you don't agree, if you say no and we think, yes, move. Even the Lord's Supper that we remember all the time. But there's always been these factions in different places on how the blood is dispensed,

the wine that to us is the blood of Christ and the bread that we eat is his body. How that's dispensed has been an age-old. argument and who does the dispensit, I mean, is it males, they're females who actually, you see what I'm saying? Well, and that's the thing about it. Over 2,000 years. Did the women get this wine and pour it in there? Was it men and buy it the women?

Well, we've got people in our world today in 2022 who say, you know what, I'm pretty sure that back here they used one cup instead of little cups. So we got to have one cup. Because it says cup, not ass on it. And if you said, well, you know, I don't think it really matters. It's about what it represents. And they're like, you may go. That's true.

We're laughing just to keep from crying. But I'm saying in all these issues, that's why when he's saying 2 Corinthians 8, 9, which I think is the lead in to what he's, the illustration he's using in chapter 9, he says, be careful, however, that the exercise of your freedom does not become a stumbling block to the week. Because this is what throws Christianity, and especially people who are rule-oriented, just into chaos. Because he's saying, yeah, actually his answer was, yeah, I'm free to do that. You can eat this meat that was sacrificed. Don't waste the meat because they're sacrificing it to gods that don't exist.

They're not real. They made them up so they could participate in all kind of pleasurable activities in the name of whatever their religion. But he's saying, you know what? but I'm not going to do it, even though I could. The answer is yes, but I'm going to say no, because in this certain situation, I don't want my brother to stumble. But don't you notice, too, that let's take another break, that whenever, like a woman came up to me yesterday,

and after Larry's sermon, which I found odd, but she'd been wanting to ask this question, so, I mean, Larry had just done this thing, and I'm still just like, you know, I'm still just, my mind is still running on that. She said, I got a question for you. She's a sweet little sister It comes to up here for her. And she said,

It's about whether something's a sin. And so immediately I thought, just what we were talking about, I thought she, so sometimes when I've been asked that question, and y'all too, it's something obvious. Like, it's like, well, you know,

here, and you may refer them to something. It's like, that's probably not a good idea. But she had one of these things I've never heard of for, I can't even remember the whole scenario, but she's telling it to me. I'm listening.

I said, well, I don't know anything about. what you're talking about. But why do you think you're asking me about this? And she just stopped. And I said, why are you even asking me about this? And she said, well, because you're a preacher. And I thought you said, no, you're asking me because something inside of your own mind

has, because you're participating in this, you don't feel good about it. I said, is that, is it safe to say you feel like you're kind of getting up close to a line that you're not comfortable with? She said, oh, that's how I felt. That's why I came and talked to you. I'd say, well, the Holy Spirit lives in you. And everything that was written was written by him. But if you're feeling like you're coming up to a line,

I would just be aware of that and maybe take a step back. Because you're probably being convicted that this behavior you're talking about is probably not right. Now, I didn't even know what she was talking about. But I do trust and know that the Holy Spirit will convict us. And so I think that's as big a point as anything. So it could be something like this that we're not even familiar with about food sacrifice to our eyes.

But in that culture, there's no doubt from Paul's writing that there were people that were literally struggling, should I eat this meat or should I not. I mean, I think a better answer maybe is just to say, if you ask God about it, I mean, he knows you better than I do. Right. I mean, what are they going to say? I mean, do you believe he's living inactive? He knows what's deep down and the motivations of your heart. I mean, he knows why you're wanting to do this, when, where, how. he knows all this.

To me, most stuff could be answered if you ask yourself if you really believe God is present and is all-knowing down deep in your soul. He knows why you're wanting to do this. Well, that's what I'm saying. Some things, you remember when Paul said, the act of the sinful nature is obvious. Then he lists some of the things that are. Some things are pretty obvious. This is against God.

This is against yourself. This is against other people. It's against relationship. But then other things are debated. of them. You know, for one person, it's not a big deal. For another person, it's, and that's where we're into that. That's what, I mean, he says in chapter nine, he starts off. And so yes.

Which, by the way, before you go there, so chapter nine, I think is Paul illustrating with himself about the idea about giving up rights. So I think that's kind of the backdrop of this. And I think you're right, because 15, before I read one, 915 says, I have not used any of these rights. So we'll see what they are in a second. Right. And then he was in verse 18.

He says, what then is my reward just this, that in preaching the gospel, I may offer it free of charge, and so not make use of my rights in preaching it. So he's giving up his rights. That's why we said, you know, we have one of the things that we love about our country is the Declaration of Independence, and we support that. It makes our country great. But in Christ, it's a declaration of dependence. on his power, Holy Spirit, his Lordship, Jesus, and who he is,

and him being our father, that's where we get the idea of family that he built. But we give that up to be a part of this. And so when he says, 9-1, am I not free? Well, yes. We're free in Christ. We're the free people, which is the opposite of what we thought when we left Christ, because we thought, oh, I don't want to follow a bunch of rules and regulations. I want to be free.

But actually, by saying that and declaring your independence outside of God, you become locked up under a system that will not produce freedom. You become a slave to sin, which we all do. So then he says, am I not an apostle. And then I like this. This is a subtle point, but it says, have I not seen? Jesus our Lord and a lot of people have made a lot of scholars have made the argument that to be an apostle you had to be an eyewitness to the resurrected Lord and I I believe that I believe that's

what gave them the special rights to disperse the miraculous powers and gifts right you can talk about that later because we'll get to that I guess in 11 and 12 right but then he says are you not the result of my work in the Lord even though I may not be an apostle to others, surely I am to you, for you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord. This is my defense to those who sit judgment on me. Don't we have the right to food and drink? So here's a yes or no question.

So he's using the same illustration. Now, when he gets to Saccharacians, I mean, I kind of went ahead just to show you what his point was in that he's trying to get them back focused on the relationship aspect. of who God is and the Lordship of Jesus and the communion with the Holy Spirit. That's what he's trying to get on the focus on, and not on the yes or no rule-oriented basis for existence.

So then he says, don't we have the right to take a believing wife along with us? So much for him not believing in that, which he gets from a lot of scholars and religious people. wasn't about that, which I think Larry did a good job on that, and the Lord's brothers and Sevis, or is it only I and Barnabas who must work for a living? And then he comes up with this gentleman. Which tells you something else, which I didn't realize until this context hadn't thought about that

Barnabas was single too. Exactly. Yeah, which I had not thought about before. But he mentions all the ones back in Jerusalem, all Jesus' brothers and those that were part of the early church there, James, all those guys and Peter, were all married and had family. So then he gets in the... Let's take a break. So then he gets in the illustration about whether it's okay to take money for doing the Lord's work. So he says, who serves as a soldier, verse 7, at his own expense, who plants a vineyard, does not eat the grapes, who tends a flock, does not drink of the milk? Do I say this merely from a human point of view?

Does it the law say the same thing? What is written in the law of Moses, don't muslin ox while it's treading out the grain? It is about oxen that God is concerned? Surely he says this. And that was something they were doing, by the way, they were so stingy. They would muzzle an ox where he couldn't eat some of the grains that were falling along. And so the point was, are you so greedy that even the animal working for you can't eat some of the produce?

And he gets into the reaping and so on. But verse 12, he says, if others have this right of support from you, shouldn't we have it all the more? So that's about the money, whether it's okay to be supported. So evidently that was a big issue there. But look, even today it is. I mean, one of the reasons I didn't want to do ministry for money is because people would say when I tried to help them. You're doing your ministry for money. That's what it is.

I couldn't deal with that. So the first person who said that, I went up there and I was like, okay, I quit. Because I'm going to do this for free. Now, I could have received money. It's nothing wrong with it. I mean, just like what Paul is saying. But for me, I just didn't want somebody to say that. So I just said, not doing it for money.

Yep. But so then he goes to. verse but he said well we did not use this right on the contrary we put up with anything rather than hinder the gospel of christ which was my whole point which i think was his point is that the gospel of jesus being put out there is what this is all about and you're having a relationship and a communion with that's what he was trying to get them to make their decision process on. And he even uses, Jason.

That's why I went across the river to a little church. It had gotten down so low that, you know, they said, well, we're going to throw in the town. I said, oh, we were kicking it around the elders. I said, I'll go over there, free of charge. I don't mind going. So I just went on over there. Now it's a vibrant little church there.

Right. But no money is changing hands. Right. And it's worked really well, which we're going to talk about. more about that a little bit. But he says in verse 13, don't you know that those who work in the temple get their food from the temple, those who serve at the altar, share what his offer on the altar? Now, he's going back under Jewish law, you know, the things that were sacrificed, then the people, the Levites, they got to protect in that. That's how they ate, was what was

sacrificed and what was brought there. He says, in the same way, the Lord has command that those who preach the gospel should receive their leaving from the gospel. So it's not a question about whether you can. Right. And then comes back to him, it's because it about whether you want to. And then he repeats again, what you said, Jess, but I have not used any of these rights. But then he takes it a step further. He said, I am not writing this in the hope that you would do so.

So it's kind of funny. It's almost like, if you think I'm bringing this up because I want some money, you're misinterpreting. Because most preachers do. They're like, that's not about the money. And they'll preach a good sermon and then say, all right, let's do a love all this. That's right. Because I mean, my kids need a new pair of shoes.

I'm just saying. But this is the way Paul puts it. I would rather die than have anyone deprive me of this boast. Now, that's a pretty strong statement. I would rather you kill me than pay me. That's what he said. Because he liked the fact of being able to say, which is what you talked about earlier, that I'm not, this is not how I'm gaining my living.

You're not going to nail me on. this one. No. I'm the same way. I sympathize with him. Right. But he took it way further than I did. I mean, and he articulated it way better, but I guess, you know, it was under the spirit's hand. But when he said an 18, what then is my reward? Just this. I love this phrase. That's really good. And in preaching Jesus and the gospel, preaching the gospel, I may offer free of charge and so not make use of my rights in preaching it. Which he's giving up his rights. Yeah. For the further of the kingdom and people eternal destiny is going to be changed

I mean you just think about that we're going to be in heaven together and even though this is all about God's power and in his plan when you look over across heaven and see somebody that you shared with I mean that's going to have to make you feel good about this how God used you to change the eternal destiny of another person. That's for all those gospel preachers out there

like our man over in the Middle East there, I mean, in Corinth now, well, what are they expecting to starve to death while he's trying? Well, Jason has already said what he's doing as a personal sacrifice. Should we not get him over there to help his work? Should we not make sure he's making, you know, able to feed his family why he's in the process? Because he's already giving up, you know,

what kind of logic is that? Yeah, it makes no sense. But, I mean, look, I'm going to be transparent here. The first time I heard Larry, the first time I met him, he was, he, y'all had invited. He invited him, White's Ferry Road. And when he got up, I thought, oh, here we go, missionary. It's hard to be good.

I had a terrible attitude. But when he started talking, I was, oh, this country boy. He's from Oklahoma. This might be good. Well, he just shared Jesus. He didn't talk about his mission. It was just a... The deity of Jesus.

A 30-minute presentation on the deity of Jesus. I leaned over to Missy, and I said, you got your checkbook? And she said, yeah, why? I said, I'm fixing to write him a check. And she said, well, you don't even know what he does. I was like, I don't care. I'm for that.

The guy's a missionary, and he got up and shared Jesus in a real clever, creative, powerful way. And they said he was a missionary. I said, I'm supporting to him. She's like, well, we can do this and get something about taxes. I was like, I ain't worried about all that. I said, I want to check now. And she said, how much? And I, 3,000 popped into my head because I thought, the last time I heard a sermon like this is when I was reading an Acts 2.

It was a guy named Peter. I said, and 3,000 responded. So I said, that's a good number. Write it for 3,000. And to her credit, she said, I'm in. Because she thought it was great too. And that's how I met him. But even the presentation that he gave Sunday, this Sunday, because he was coming through.

And so we wanted him to preach. But he didn't talk about his work. No. I know his work since I now recently went there, which I was even more impressed once I got there, that a human, you're talking about becoming, you know, sacrificial, like Paul's going to eventually get to where he says, I make myself in verse 19 a slave to everyone to win as many as possible. Because I'm telling you, there's nothing about the culture there and the city there that's appealing to a guy from Oklahoma. It's just not appealing. It's not comfortable. The food's not that great.

It's dirty. It's smelly. They've got plumbing problems. The crime rate's ridiculous. I mean, there's just one thing after another. It's rule-oriented. The government is just intrusive on your life. I'm like, get out of here.

But he's like, no, I'm doing this sacrifice because God is protecting these refugees that are coming out in there in search for Jesus. By the way, all these people in America that want to go towards socialism, go to Greece. you need to go to Greece and hang out there for about a month. And you tell me how well socialism is working out. Great, great point. So anyway, I walked. When he sat down by his wife after that sermon,

I just got up. And he immediately went up there and sat beside him. I said, I'm Jay Robertson. I want to help support your ministry. And I hand in that check. And he's like, wow, we, you know, we're not here for money. I mean, he started talking out of it. He went Paul here saying,

I was like, well, I figure you can do something with that to get that message to wherever. I said, where are you going? And he's like, well, we have this ministry in Greece. I was like, well, there's you a plane ticket or however you're getting over. I don't know, but I want to support this. But it was, I was supporting it because I didn't, it wasn't that I didn't know him. I didn't know where he was headed. But that message of Jesus resonated with the same thing Paul was saying.

And I'm like, I'm behind this. I'm behind getting that message to other people. And I don't think that was his plan, but it sure worked with me. Right. You know? And then he didn't want to take it, which made me really feel good about it then. Well, and I think it's back to the overall point, which is, and I think what he's culminating here from eight to now, because he was talking about really what is a minor,

should have been a minor matter about eating this food, but it became a major thing. and he's trying to tell them, compared to the gospel, it really is minor. And when we get to chapter 10 in the next podcast, you'll see that he says, there is a danger from idolatio because the next chapter he's going to show you it is bad when you don't have Jesus right. But what we're talking about here is not that bad. I do want to mention the last paragraph because I do think for the culture around there, I mean, it's where we even now have, you know,

our Olympics or whatever. And I think he used that illustration. Yeah, we're out of time. Let's save that for the overtime because I want to talk about that too. Just as a reminder, if you go to blazTV.com slash Unashamed, we have our overtime segments that are there along with everything else that Blaze is offering. So we're going to continue a little bit of this discussion we didn't quite get to there. So if you want to come join us or if you're already there, we'll finish it up there.

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