Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 484 | Phil Reacts to the Completion of His Biopic & Jase Scans the Problems with Humanism

Episode Date: May 25, 2022

Phil discusses the completion of a film about the perils of his past life with executive producer and nephew Zach Dasher. Jase examines the problems with earthly wisdom and human philosophy commonly known as humanism, and Al talks about baptism and his dad's salvation. Zach discusses the current culture in America and analyzes how it is unable to stand on its own because of a movable standard. And Jase discusses the tendency for believers to fall into human tradition and mix it up with their faith. Watch the Unashamed overtime show, only on BlazeTV: https://BlazeTV.com/Unashamed - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am Unashamed. What about you? All right, so we got Zach back in the house. Welcome, Zach, back to Unashamed. You've been on your little project there for a while. Tell us what you've been doing. Yeah, I've been in Shreveport, Louisiana. We wrapped our first feature film project

about a week and a half ago. So, yeah, it was quite the journey. But we are, it's in the can. So now we're off to the editing bays and the marketing distribution conversations and all that stuff. So, yeah. Zach, you're a movie mogul now. You're, I mean, like, you're making motion pictures. Yeah, it's kind of a big deal, you know.

We've done one, I have one independent film that has been filmed that has not been released or edited yet. So we don't want to hold off on the movie mogul, I believe. It's a little bit longer. A little for our circle, I guess that's the case. Dad, you saw it. What was your hot take on Bist and the Set? Well, there were so many pieces to the puzzle of making a movie, you know, to recreate what was going on in the 60s and, well, in the 50s. 60s, 70s, up until my conversion, all I'll have to say about the whole thing is if you

redundantly look at the verses in the Bible. And to Jason's point, Jesus is coming from Genesis to Malachi, the Gospels are then written by four different men, Matthew Mark, Luke and John, Jesus is here. But you make sure that if you're going to document that somehow in a movie, that it's crystal clear that the God of heaven has become flesh, died on a cross, been buried and raised from the dead. We say it so much. We sometimes forget that the power is in that. So if you make a movie about it, if that's the thrust of the movie, Jesus came down and flash died, was buried, oh, it will sell.

I mean, so what kind of logic is that? What are you trying to do, get rich and famous? I said, I had nothing to do with whoever dreamed this idea up. I'm just saying if the gospel is put in front of human beings, there is a percentage. always there's a percentage that accept that by faith. Oh, you're saying it'll sell, not monetarily but spiritually. Spiritually, it's a seller. You can't lose.

I mean, if you put one man's conversion, you say, well, what's the, how was he converted? What converted him? Well, if the thrust is pointed at Jesus, him crucified and raise from the dead, oh, it will sell. I see it all the time. You're saying selling from a spiritual standpoint. Most movie moguls, when they hear that, yeah. They're thinking about money. Yeah, we're not thinking about money.

I'm looking at it like, well, you know. I did ask somebody, I said, is there any money in it for the man you're making a movie about? They said, no, not unless it sales. I'm not okay. Just checking. That somebody was me. I'm the guy he asked. I'm good where I am, whether I didn't invest a dime.

in it so whoever did i hope they can make enough to make it not so hurtful but what do you need money for you don't need money that's what i'm saying you need money then it's like this week phil i i've i'll share this since we're just getting the band back together so phil has been catching these opaluzas cat and i wanted one and so you sent dan with the cat in tow. But the more I talk with him, it seemed like we were doing some kind of drug transaction.

The way the talk was. Oh, it's bigger than you actually saw. Look, I'm driving up the hill. I have five Opelousas cat in the boat, and I got my truck backed up down there where we baptize all these people. So fruit is coming forth in the way of fish, people are converted,

but it's all the same spot. We're running over the same ground. But I looked up and I saw my neighbor. He was out on his hands and knees, planting and, you know, hoeing around there with his garden. I said, watch this. So I told Dan, I pulled up there. I said, hey, this is before we got to you and the Opelousus cat.

I got five ops, which is far more than I can eat at two or three settings. Pretty good bit of catfish here. Yeah, I got one. Yeah, they average from about three or four pounds up to about eight or nine, which is the size you want to eat. Anyway, I pulled up and there with my neighbor. I said, hey, I said, look at that tub back in the back of my truck there, Brother Riley.

I said, if you want one of them opollucous, you can have one of them. I'd already cut them on the back where it had bleed them out before I got there where you meat's nice and tender, your blood drains out of them like a hog, you know. But anyway, he looked in the tub. He said, yeah, I'll take one of them. he said wait just a minute he goes back over to his garden and he handed me a

substantial amount of fresh squash cucumbers and fresh onions right out of the ground so that's a good trade that's exactly what I said I said good trade so I got veggies out of another one of the ops

and he went to rally I got up there where we were to clean the fish I said I tell you what Jay said he wanted up I said Dan I'm going to clean this fish up and I'll cut him up ready to fry. I said, I may leave the bellymate, let him strip them, some of them like a little thicker. No, you did, which was fine. Yeah. But what's funny is the way Dan...

Well, I dressed the cat, said, take that to Jace. So one neighbor has helped over here, trade for onions and whatnot. That's a good trade. Send them to you. And Dan said, when you, when you saw that they were dressed, your first thought was, huh, he even cut them up for me, ready to fry. I reached in my pocket. Yeah, he reached. reached in his pocket and got a bill phone. Oh, damn, I was what you know. He said, I tell you what. He said, for that, I'll give you a crisp.

And he said, there was a pile. Whoops. And you come up with a 20. He said, you had thumbed past a $100 bill. No. That's not true. Some is better than nothing. I didn't have my wallet.

I'll give you a crisp. Whoa, whoa. No, no. I said, stock markets down. He said, bad. Why that's that so funny. No, I didn't need the money, but if you were going to give it.

That's the way stories get blown out of proportion. I didn't have it. The Yerick said it was a, it was a come to Jesus, mama, who. No, I didn't have my wallet. I reached in my pocket and the only thing I had in my pocket was a $20 bill. So I gave it. It's like Mrs. Rule, when she gives cash to any church or charity function, she has a rule that she gives the biggest dollar.

amount that she had at least that so if she thumbs through there and there's a hundred she'll give the hundred which i would have done so i thought to myself i'm gonna go her rule whatever's in my pocket i'm given the biggest amount unfortunately for him it was a 20 which is not a bad thing you got 20 bucks yeah just for inflation inflation it's not quite what it was or for being the mule i thought 20 bucks is pretty good but what's the So funny is the way he was acting. It was real. It was shrouded in secrecy.

It was like it we were making an illegal transaction. Oh, and look, it was, this here, it's a great thing that it's so flavorful and good to eat. I mean, this is beyond drug peddling. This is, this is good trade. What's funny is that later on that night, I get a text. Veggies are coming in, a little money coming in off of it. I then met yesterday with the brothers, and there were quite a few visitors, and I started in Matthew when Jesus started over, actually Genesis 315,

kind of brought the story together about who was Jesus, where did he come from? So I gave him the background of Jesus. Then about his death, barrel, and resurrection, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, you can't miss it. But you just gave us, yeah, and what happened? So we all, they're just a, somebody said, well, we want to be baptized in the river, I said, in the river. I said, well, I said, I'll tell you what. How far were you away from the river?

How many of you want to be baptized and be born again of water in the spirit this morning? And quite a few raised their hand. I said, I tell you what, get behind that blue truck when I leave here. Let's go to the river. So I looked back behind me in my rear view mirror when everybody got in a line. And we came out of town, and it was a long line of vehicles, you know, nine, ten vehicles. It's like a funeral procession.

Yeah. And if we come down there and I and I went. It was a funeral process. That's what I mean. The old man spiritually. Speaking of money. It was all free of charge. I don't charge anybody to preach the gospel up there anything,

so there's no money going my way. But I got down there and I was wet from head to toe. I forgot and left my earplugs hanging around my neck and on my shirt. I dunked them. You're leaving out huge chunks of the store. My $7,000 earplugs. It got water in them. It was worth it.

Well, let's, let's, let's, let's read. By the way, I did see on a. table. Somebody out of the crowd, I looked down there and I thought about them avalooza's cat. I said, Jace gave me $20 because I cut them fish out. I gave the mule $20. I said, here, I looked down on the table.

I was taking my wet clothes off and I said, well, what do you know? Somebody in the crowd did put a crisp $100 bill on the table. I don't know why they did it, but just a gift, I guess. And I thought, well, so $20 on the fish, $100 on the new births. We got people going to heaven, and they're paying $100. I've never heard of that. I've never heard of somebody tipping the baptize. They had already left in the baptize.

I'd have said, wait a minute, somebody, you left that hundred. I said, I don't think it fell out of the billfold. I said, but. No, hundreds don't fall out of the belfo. That's what I'm saying. So I was looking at the money factor. don't realize you do the work of God and somehow or another you're blessed. I just accept the blessings.

So let's back up. Tears were shed. To where? What are we backing up to? He said we were all leaving. It's like a record this skipping the law. You left in a funeral procession. So how many, I was wondering how many people were baptized is all I was.

It was about 10. Oh, so 10 of it. So let me get this right. So y'all met. We were from various states, the further states I noticed, a guy, I said, where are you from? And he said, when he said, you know, I'm going to follow you down the river. I said, well, good. I said, you got your woman, will you?

He said, yeah. I said, can she cook? He said, she's an awesome cook. I said, well, I know you're from Maryland, and you're the only person I've ever seen from Maryland. I've never met anybody. So people came from Maryland. They came to y'all's. and Texas, wherever, you know, and we all came together.

And how did they know? There were a lot of tears and a lot of rejoicing during the whole process. Well, I had a guy that was supposed to come, one of my buddies, Murray. We baptized him. Oh, he was there. He was there. Oh, that makes me happy. You know why?

And by the way, I've never seen a person. Well, I've seen a lot of them through the years. but he was as, what's the word, animated as you can get over, I mean, he was. Over going in the water? Oh, he was shaking and trembling. And I was really felt for him because for him, we're standing in the water out there. But, you know, where the ops just came from. Yeah, that is great.

I'm looking at the fruit of presenting the gospel. So whether it be fish, you know, whether it be human beings, their life changes forever, he was one of the most convicted people I've ever run up on. That's awesome. Murray was there. Well, what I was going to say is. Murray followed the troop being. He was, I looked up by so, well, there's a little worry.

I think this guy was working on his air conditioner, and he noticed his treasure finds and metal detectors, and he's like, where you need to go. And so we've got this place lined up. And so Murray called me about it. He said, but he was asking me about Jesus' question. So I think I'm on taking him to Fields. And I was like, well, I like where this is going. Let's get him in.

And then we're brothers, perhaps. And now the treasure hunt may take place. He is less than 24 hours old. He's been born again. And I would say that just based on his reaction to it, It was a very heartfelt decision for them. It's a heartfelt decision for anybody. It reminds me of all the bedrock we study in these texts.

When you actually see them live happening what these words are saying, in Colossians, you looked over our spiritual circumcision, just fixing to take place out here. I'm looking at the Bible verses. Most of them were just listening to the message itself. So we keep it simple. We just point them to Jesus. and we keep moving.

Let's take a break. Yeah, so, I mean, there was a family from South Louisiana to or from dry prong or somewhere a mom was telling me about that. That was last week. Oh, okay. That was last week. But some of these people might have been, I didn't get quite where everybody lived. Some were over there 10 miles south of where I was raised at Dixie, Dixie, Louisiana, little town.

But 10 miles south of there is Bozier City. there was a guy there he's in law enforcement he and his wife walked out into the water I baptized both of them but he was another one that he said this is the greatest thing that's ever happened to me well that's quite a start about being in law enforcement for 25 years

and really he's been in some serious well now he's in grace enforcement that's right there you know I like it you bet you a little cheesy but true A little cheesy, but true. Great guy, great heart. I was moved by the whole thing, you know, and I kind of liked the idea. They came up with the river baptism.

I usually try to make it easier on it. We had a pool of water up there. I think it's good. I mean, driving to the river was a good thing. It's a humbling thing. It's a humbling thing. Very humbling. When you get to witness people that are, you know, they're making the most important decision of their lives to totally submit to Christ.

and to be fully all in. So I've thought about it many, many times. I mean, how many times we've led somebody into a pool somewhere when that ultimate act of submission, it's a humbling thing. And that particular spot, when I walked down there with them, I told them, I said, what would y'all say if I told you that where you're standing, thousands have come here

through the years over the last 30, 40 years. I said they come at this spot. I said, and they walked out in the water just like y'all, you know, and pretty well everybody cried. It was a, it was a, it was a movement by the Almighty. And I tell you what, it did me good just to see them, the fruit, the fruit of the gospel. But you know, Dad, I had the same sort of emotion when we went over and visited the movie set where Zach was set up. whenever I thought about, you know, first of all, how many people in the history of the planet have had a movie made about their life, not many, and they were either really great or really

terrible if they had a movie made about them. And so that was one thing that struck me. And the second thing was, I mean, just so happened, the way this worked out, the movie is being filmed in the place where you and mom dated in Shreveport. That's right. I mean, it's literally just a few miles from where you both were born and grew up. So I don't know. It's just a, it kind of was humbling to me, just that whole idea, too, that like this life we live has been amazing. And even now, getting to basically capture your conversion and what it took to get you there, that's a humbling thing.

If the United States of America had taken the time or could somehow have been transported to see what went down there, from sharing the gospel. Faith comes by hearing. Hearing comes from the Word of God. And you show them what Jesus said, what he did, what he's now doing, what he will do. Your past sins are gone. Most of the time, when people hear, my past sins are all gone right here, washed away by the blood of Jesus. You're dying to sin. You're being buried. They owe you. and the new you spirit field is coming out of this bayou down here, this river down here. I don't know. There's just something about that.

If America could have seen it, I think we'd still be there, baptizing them. If they would just stop and listen to what's happened on their behalf, I think the whole bunch can be converted. So I'm looking at it. I hear in the political angle and all of that crap, but you said when you get right down to it it's a spiritual fix and it winds up on the bank of some river in the middle of nowhere down in here and it that's the that's the apex of it all that's that's what it's all about so i'm uh i was i slept well last night just thinking about some of the guys

you know and the gals you know well you know it's interesting because you did the Zach helped write the movie Torch Bearer that you did, the documentary. And the whole thing was about the... Same spot, by the way. Torchbear. Right. That's what I was thinking. And it wasn't planned.

Was it, Zach, to have the movie end with that way? And yet that's where y'all decided to end the movie was down there at that same spot, baptizing people. Yeah. Yeah. It was kind of cool how that happened. Which, that film was interesting because, of course, you know, I didn't write all of it. I wrote a chunk of it.

And it was interesting that just how difficult even it was with the director for me to be able to show that, like what Phil just said, it's not a political fix. And he kept thinking political because it was, you know, it was he, that's what he was in was politics. And the whole time, you know, we had a lot of discussion, argument about the, what is the foundation for the whole thing? It's not, it's not a political fix. In fact, the movie was called Torchbearer, but I don't know if you guys remember this or not, but I was pushing really, really, really hard for the movie to have another name, and that was called Image Bearer, or actually I think it was Amago Day, which means image bearer that were made in God's image.

And that really is the foundation of the whole thing, is what does it mean to be human? And we would argue as believers that what it means primarily to be human is you're made in God's image you're made to reflect his story and to worship him. And so at the core of your being is, that's what you are. And I think all these people that Phil's dealing with, and even Phil's story, for example, I think we did something with this movie, the one we just filmed in Treeport, that was unique in that we really tried to show how, you know, all behavior is explainable in its context. And for Phil, and even Kay as well, I mean, they had pretty rough childhoods, if you really go back and examine that both of them were raised by mentally ill mothers.

And I love my grandma. We all love Granny. But, I mean, it was tough, you know, that she had some episodes and just being raised in for Phil, the deep poverty in the South and just all of that had that came with it. And so for Phil was kind of this escape. But you know what? Brought him back in the end was when he had that realization and that conversation, it was a lot of things.

But one of the main parts of the movie is he has a. conversation with a pastor named Bill Smith, who we all loved dearly and was a mentor to a lot of us who basically showed him who he was. You know, he said, here's what God's done for you, and here's who God is, and here's where you are and him. And that really is kind of the crux of the film, no pun intended, but I think it's going to be powerful for people to come see it. And I think unashamed audience is going to be, those of you right now that are listening to this podcast, it's going to be you guys that let's get this thing.

in theaters. It's going to take some effort. You know, I do believe the enemy doesn't want this film to be shown. So it's going to take an army of you guys to help us get this out there. By the way, here's a shameless plug. If you want information on the blind, we don't have like a rallying place yet, but you could, we will be releasing information on how you can help out. If you just go to Phil Robertson.com, that's Phil Robertson.substack.com. If you subscribe to Phil's Subsack, which is Zach's email list, we're going to be putting a lot of information out there.

So I would encourage anybody that believes in, like, Phil's ministry and his story, not just Phil, but the whole family, and we're going to need all hands on deck to get this story told. And I think that it's going to be really, really, really moving and profound for a lot of people. Let's take another break. Yeah, Zach, you told me you spent more time probably with the actor that was playing Bill Smith, because that was such a pivotal role in the movie because that was the life changer, you know, for dad to get that right, you know, in terms of how that goes. And so I think that's really interesting.

So, yeah, I want to encourage Unashamed Nation. You guys will be the ones that help us get it out there. Hopefully we'll reach a lot of people like Dad says the gospel, the powers and the message. So it's always going to impact people. And I know just from what Zach's, I hadn't seen any bit of the movie, but I know from what he's told me. I think I think people will come to Christ because of it. Well, let me say this. We, we, uh, we're going to be releasing a lot of promotional stuff and behind the scenes for this kind of thing. Interviews, I've interviewed every, I'm going to,

I will have interviewed everybody in the family, hopefully by the end of June, just about the story. Interviewed all the cast, all the directors, all that. And you know, it's funny, the, the two words that everybody, and you got to keep in mind, this is a story, um, about a man's journey and a woman's journey to find healing through Christ, but it doesn't look like a Christian film. I mean, it is, I mean, it's real, it's raw. You know, if you look at like a biblical arc in terms of how the biblical story is laid out, it's creation.

God made everything very good. Fall, man fell and sin. Redemption that God offers redemption and then restoration. God restores us back progressively back to our original position in the garden. But one of the areas I think we've done a poor job on as Christians is telling the story the fall. So we show, you know, with, we have to use some nuance here, but we do really show Phil in his worst moment. And Phil, if you've been around, Phil and talked about this story at all, you've heard him say the same phrase. I've heard him say it a hundred times.

And he says, I'm embarrassed. And I get that. I mean, this is for you, Phil, this was like, it's risky to put your stuff out there like that. But he's embarrassed because of who he was, but he's proud of who he is in Christ. So we show the fall, but we show the beauty of the gospelness. And here's the two words that every single person that we interviewed said about the three words. Sorry, every person I interviewed, I said, they give us three words that you can describe this movie. Gritty, honest, and hope.

And I thought that was pretty profound, that the film is gritty, it's honest, and there's hope. And I think that that would probably define a lot of people who, you know, watch and listen to the Unashamed podcast. We're in Colossians right now, but just look at this. And I highlighted each time it mentioned it. And I was simply amazed the little book of Philippians right before Colossians, before you get into that one, the Apostle Paul starting saying, because of your partnership in the gospel from the first day until now. being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you, and I went up from a heathen to doing the work of the Lord, you'll carry it to completion until the day of Christ Jesus,

till he returned. So first of all, he mentions partnership in the gospel. Down just a little bit, this is Philippine chapter one, about verse 7 or 8 in there. I'm in chains. Whether I'm in chains or defending and confirming the gospel, all of you sharing God's grace with me. So they got him locked up, and he's been chained to some post, and he's talking about what a wonderful thing that the Philippians are partners with him. They're defending the gospel. They're confirming the gospel.

You drop down a little further, Philippine 112 by the time you get just 12 verses in. I want you to know, brothers, what's happened to me is really served to advance the gospel. They got me in jail down here, but, boy we got this gospel going now so partnership defending the gospel confirming the gospel advancing the gospel as a result it's become clear throughout the whole palace guard i'm in this prison down here and i've got the message because they locked me up now i'm trying to convert them but it's going well talks a little bit you know there's a certain bunch there their motives are off so of the gospel so he mentions that

Way down there in verse 127, whatever happens, conduct yourselves in a manner worthy of the gospel of Christ. Then whether I come and see you or only hear about you, I'll know you stand firm in one spirit. Now it's contending as one man for the faith of the gospel. But I've been frightened in any way by those who oppose you. Well, just fast forward to modern day America. And we're trying to get them to see, hey, politics. can help or hurt. But really, in the grand scheme of things, the gospel is the centerpiece of why people love God and love their neighbor, which is solely needed. I shall say again,

politics alone, Al, it's not going to do it. You've got to have power to get past the evil one and all of what he throws at you. So, and it comes in a simple message, faith in the gospel of Jesus, Christ, repentance, baptism, new birth, and they move on. Colossan by the Gets 2, being one in spirit and purpose. Then the spiritual circumcision. Don't let all these people get to lead you astray, the hollow and deceptive philosophy. Don't get tangled up and all that. So if you just look at it over and over and over and over, the same story is highlighted and is the bedrock of eternity, the gospel of Jesus Christ, what he's done for us, his death for us, removing our sin, delivering us from Satan, removing our guilt, redeeming us and getting us out from law and putting

us under grace, and then finally immortality guaranteed by the resurrection. So it's the most powerful story ever told. But to Zach's point, it really has to begin with authenticity. A person has to look at their own lives and realize they can't do it. it. And so it always starts there. I mean, I'm not a, from rags to riches out. That's exactly right. And that doesn't necessarily mean, you know, physical riches. That's right. It's the whole thing. I thought about that. When you read that about the partnership yesterday at WFR, we had a man from Ghana who is the head of a Bible college over there, which has produced a lot of African missionaries. And he was preaching at WFR main yesterday. And I just,

you know, he's one of the best men I've ever met, an amazing man of God. And in a country that, you know, God has pretty good shape for Africa. But I mean, you know, they just don't have much in terms of physical stuff. And yet this man is one of the most spiritually rich people that I know. And I just thought about, you know, we got guys like that who we partner with around the world to get the gospel out. It's incredible. It's what an opportunity for all of us, you know, for these people, which is really powerful. So let's take another break. Politics comes and goes, Al, but the word of God lives on forever.

It does. And we're at the place in Colossians 2, as you mentioned, Dad, that what I kind of call now the core message, we kind of set this thing up with his intro and basically that prayer early on. And then he kind of set up what he was going to talk about and his concern for the churches. And as Jason has talked about, it wasn't just the church at Colossay, but it was also Laodicea in Hieropolis as well, because there's three different cities that are nearby. But he's kind of going to get into the core message. And I have to say, in terms of sermons, this is one of the best in the entire Bible. Would you agree, Jay, this next?

You're talking about Colossians? Yeah, Colossians, too, the rest of it. No doubt. Well, he kind of gets to the point, and he's being positive. Because we bring up these ideas of where was this all coming from, like chapter 2 and verse 4. He says, I tell you this so that no one may deceive you by fine sounding arguments. Then he's going to reiterate in verse 8, see to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human traditions and the basic principles of the world.

rather than on Christ. Then he says the same thing in verse 22 of chapter 2. He's like, these are all destined to perish with use because they're based on human commands and teachings. Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom with self-imposed worship, false humility, and harsh treatment of the body, but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence.

So some people had come in the church, Remember we did, I think, last podcast to get Zach caught up. When you read the letter in Revelation to La Eadesea, and that's the famous one that says, I wish you were either hot or cold, and we talked about the different uses of water in that region in the three cities. And here you had lukewarm in La Eadacia, and he was like that made him sick.

And then there's this famous altar called, verse that was Jesus knocking on the door saying, let me in, and we made a point that he was actually knocking on the door of the church. Never one would be in that situation, which feels the same way at Colise here. Because he's talking about talking to believers, and some people had infiltrated the camp, and they were trying to promote, and this phrase that says basic principles of the world, I mean, it's translated different ways. And I looked at that last night.

Elements of the world. Can't even read my writing here. Worldly sanctuary. And basically what I came up with in all from the Greek and the translations is that you're putting your faith and trust in earthly rituals instead of Jesus. Yep. So when you think about what is an earthly ritual? It's rampant across the political, I mean the spiritual apparatus.

It's rampant. Yeah. Well, you don't want to have, you don't want to have your religion look like an earthly ritual that's based on earthly physical treasure. Yeah. I mean, that's why when he said this, this about Jesus. is hidden the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. Well, that kind of flies in the face of what we think of as far as pleasure and profit on the earth. You know, we think if you have a lot of money, well, the Lord has blessed you.

You must be doing something right. But if your total goal is to amass some kind of earthly gain, that's why when you were talking about that movie, talking about it'll sell, I knew what you were talking about, you were talking about make a bunch of money. But most people, when they hear that, oh, that money was successful, that may, I mean, the movie was successful, that means it made a bunch of money. Yeah. Not hardly.

Well, I think, I think in the Colossians, too, the way he sets up this argument, which, by the way, I think this is one of the biggest chunks in the whole New Testament, in my opinion, of just like theological richness. And so I've camped out, and this passage a lot over the last 20 years. But the way I've always kind of interpreted it is that you have this juxtaposition that's going on in Colossians 2, 8 through 15, that he then kind of clarifies and gets more clarity to in verse 16 through the rest of the chapter. But the juxtaposition is this. It's that on one side, you have the traditions or the, you know, or the captive and hollow philosophy,

which I think Yaw's translation says, which depend on, what was it, the empty and hollow philosophies, which did. Human traditions, yeah, human traditions and basic principles of the world. Yeah,

it says deceptive and hollow philosophy. Yeah, so I think about it from like a philosophical standpoint, it's not just the traditions, it's the philosophies that undergird those traditions. And, you know, hindsight is 2020. So we can look back at different cultures from, you know, 500 years ago or even in this period of time, you know, 2,000 years ago and say, man, how stupid did these people be to literally worship, you know, little statues that they made? Well, we're going to look, someone's going to look back on our culture at the philosophies that are prevailing today.

And they're going to be like, wait, wait, y'all believed what? that culture they actually believe that that's how they do the world and they're going to look back at that and think how ridiculous

we are that we believe that so that's like one side of it is the human constructive philosophies which I think the way you look at it is this any philosophy that begins

with us is a flawed philosophy it's called humanism and humanism will not stand on its own and then when he switches in verse 9

or actually at the end of verse 8 he says that this is what people are latching on to rather than that according to Christ. Listen to all the in hymns. For in him, all the fullness of deity dwells in bodily form. In other words, in Christ, all the fullness of the God of the cosmos who spoke the universe into existence dwells in bodily form. He's in a body, which that right there, just that. one verse we could spend six months on and never really scratch the surface of the brevity of the fact that the God of the cosmos dwelt in a body that's ridiculous right but it's in him in Jesus in him the fullness of need to dwells in

bodily form and then him you've been made complete it is he that is the head over all rule and authority it is in him that you were also circumcised with the circumcised with the circumcision made without hands and the removal of the body, but the flesh by the circumcision of Christ, having been buried with Him in baptism, which you were also raised up with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. When you were dead in your transgressions, and in the uncircumcumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven all of us, our transgressions,

having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us, and he has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross, when he had disarmed the rulers and authorities. He made a public display of them having triumphed over them through him. The operative word there is him. It's like on one side, it's us, the other side, it's him. It's crazy. Hang on, Jess.

Let's take our last book. I had the same thought, and that's where I was going. but I'm just going from a different perspective. But if you back up in Colossians 115, which we said is this timeout, here's the fix to any group of people, especially in the name of religion. And he goes through these 12 things that Jesus represents.

He is the image of the invisible God for by him all things were created. And we went through that. But he gets to the end and he says, and he is the head of the body, the church. Well, that's where we came. And I was going to go down the same path because when you think about what the church is, you know, the Greek word is ecclesia, which means what? Do you all know off the top of your head?

It's the called, the called out. The called out. Yep. So, exactly is what it means. So he calls us. And if I just read a couple verses about that, for our listeners. You got 2th Thessalonians 2. It says he chose us before the beginning of time to be saved. So he knew, going back to Zach's earlier point, that we're all made in the image of God for a

purpose, for a forever purpose. But verse 14 of 2, Thessalonians 2.14 says, he called you to this through our gospel that you might share in the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. Another one is Ephesians four. He says, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling. As a person of Lord, to live a life worthy of the calling you have received. So he calls us through the gospel. And he goes on to say in chapter four, four, there's one body and one spirit, just as you were called to the one hope when you were called one Lord one faith one baptism and she you say what's your point my point is it's like I remember when I was called it it didn't seem that way I thought you know I think I'm going to look into this religion I'm going to do some studying I'm going to see if there's any truth to this

but at some point in there I realize oh wait this is not about me trying to figure it out, God's calling me. And I think that's the adventure of this whole thing, of the experience, is making that transition is really the key moment. Because you talked about this movie being honest and being gritty. Well, that's all what we're called from by God. But he also calls us to something. So that's why when you read and when we get to chapter three, he's going to say, you know, put off the old self and put on the new. Because he called us out of something, into something, which goes to the end.

So that's why when you start interjecting yourself into human commands and traditions or this is what we're going to do or this program. And you missed the whole point here. That's why I centered it around the adventure. when you realize that God is pursuing you and he did it through coming to earth and living a perfect life and dying on a cross, that's why in John 12 where it says he would draw them into himself, meaning the manner of death that he chose to die, that calls us. And the empty grave calls us. We're like, oh, wait a minute.

He has a plan and a purpose for us. And then so what do we do after that? he makes the call through us, which is why he said, the mystery of godliness is that Christ is in you. So when you tell the story about people being baptized and us doing the spiritual funeral possession, you know, y'all had everything but the flash and lights. But really, that's what it was. Yep. It was a spiritual journey that they're driving down.

And people that misunderstand baptism, that's what they miss. You're basically giving up and realizing that God is calling you. you. That's what being a part of the church is. You've been called out from your decision-making process, and now you're surrendering in the physical act, but the spiritual regeneration, you know, Christ cutting off your sinful self, now puts you up in a position. So I said all that to read this one verse. I love the way this is said in Colossians, too, and I'm skipping ahead, but I just want to highlight this passage. In verse 13, right after, you reenact the death, barrel, and resurrection, and Jesus cuts off your sinful self through faith

and the power of God, when you were dead, 213, in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, I like this phrase, God made you alive with Christ. Now, there's a moment. You die, and God made you alive on the earth. in this that's why there was so many tears that's why this is an adventure that's why this is exciting

and I agree Jason and I love the way that he uses circumcision which was a physical sign that was implemented in Genesis 17 but now he says in a spiritual way this is what happens it's the cutting away the idea about

this is what makes you new but this is eternal it's not just a physical sign anymore. This is an eternal sign. But I was thinking about how, to Zach's point, that everything was based in Christ, but you think about it how fragile anything else is. Like, you look at our country. It was founded as a constitutional republic. I mean, nobody's ever had an idea that was had to have a country like we have. And, you know, for a while it seemed great. But look in just a couple hundred years at how fragile it is. I was saying about this thing. we talked about statues, men go, you know, statues were representative of people that had great

accomplishments. And so someone erected that and said, you know, we want to remember this person. All it takes is the philosophy change. And then people will go out. They'll put ropes around it. And they'll yank every one of them down because now it's like we don't believe in that anymore, whatever the idea was. But if you're thinking about from an earthly standpoint, look at how fragile the idea is that's why you have to have something way bigger than your idea of government or whatever it is about an earthly human tradition because we've seen that happen in a pretty short period of time right here in good old USA right there's a there's a mighty throng and they don't even know and they teach they teach others that you can never even tell at all whether you're a man or a woman

you just don't know. Simple question. What's a woman? I'm gender neutral meaning I don't know whether I'm a man or a woman, but I've got it all together and you need to listen to me. I mean, it's amazing. Which is one of those philosophies that we're going to look back on, our people after us will look back on this moment,

this cultural moment, and they're going to say, wait, what? You denied biological reality and pretended like that was real? and that was actually a thing that people bought into. And, you know, that's how it's going to go down in history. Although they claim to be wise, Paul told the Romans, they became fools. They exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man, birds, animals, and reptiles. Surely they won't get and go down the road on that.

Hollow and deceptive philosophy. You don't need to know whether you're a man. or woman. Just get out there and have at it. Sexual immorality always is at the top of the list, and America is drowning in it. I think one of the areas, when I was thinking about this passage here, I had this idea, I was talking to a guy that wanted me to do some animation projects with him that were like these little short apologetic clips of explaining concepts and animation form. And I thought about this passage, because I was thinking about like this cartoon, character and he's got a shovel in his hand.

And he's trying to make meaning of the world. And every time he does, he takes a scoop out of himself to begin with himself into how to interpret the world. And eventually what happens is he looks like Swiss cheese because he's having to dig out of himself whatever the basis is for how he comes to the knowledge of the world. And the point is that if you begin with yourself, we're all finite creatures. So if we begin with a finite creature to make meaning of the vast universe, we're going to run out of a basis, if that makes any sense. That's why I think this passage here in Colossius 2 is so key, because he says that you're not going to find it through philosophies that basically are just empty deceptions according to the traditions of, I'm adding this in here, finite men, according to the elementary principles of this war by the dawn of Christ.

then he flips it, this first nine is key. The reason why we begin with God is because, in Jesus particularly, is because in Jesus, the fullness of deity dwells in bodily form. In other words, God is infinitely big and glorious. There is no, there's no, you're not going to get to the end of that. So we're never, if we begin with God to make meaning of the world and of our own lives, he's never going to look like Swiss cheese because you're never getting to the end of it. You never get to the end of him.

And I think that's what's happening here, because when you see when they move into verse 16 and moving forward, he gives, he kind of defines what those philosophies were. He gets examples of them. And they look very similar to today. They're little different, but it's like legalism with a bunch of rules and regulations in regard to food or drink or in respect to festivals or New Moon or Sabbath days or things that are basically what he says are shadow of what's to come. They were worship in the shadow of instead of the one who was casting the shadow. Yeah, versus the reality. Yeah. Hang on, Zay. We're out of time. But I want to continue that thought in our overtime segment. So because that's a really good one that you brought up.

So we'll pick it up on the other side in overtime. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube. And be sure to click that little bell to get next. notified about new episodes. And for even more content that you won't get anywhere else, subscribe to Blaze TV at blazedtv.com slash unashamed.