Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 508 | Jase Finds a Scripture That Really Makes People Uncomfortable & Phil Calls Jase a Raggedy Priest

Episode Date: July 8, 2022

Jase explains how a high priest used to be a bridge between man and God for attempted atonement, but now we have the ultimate high priest in Jesus Christ. Phil calls Jase a raggedy-looking priest — and flawed too! Jase shares a Bible verse about Jesus that really makes a lot of people uncomfortable, and Zach makes the point that we often mistakenly — and dangerously — view God as our own cosmic bellhop. Watch the Unashamed overtime show, only on BlazeTV: https://blazetv.com/unashamed - Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? So we got Zach here with us today for the pie. Because Zach, I feel like we're finally kind of back to normal. I'm back here. I'm back in the U.S. You're doing your thing. You're being you in North Carolina. Jason and Dad are being them.

I'm finally back in. There's a trap that you can fall into. I want to say this. If you keep telling yourself in a couple weeks, I'm going to be in a position where I can catch my breath. You think, well, Missy, I said that the other day, and she said, you've been saying that for 10 years. That reminds me of Phil's advice to my mom about losing weight.

He said, if you would quit planning for your diet, you might actually lose weight because she would, one more little sliver here, I'm going to start my diet tomorrow. Phil said, if you quit planning for your diet, then you would actually be skin. The problem is you're planning for it. That's exactly right. No, but it was kind of like, and it's, it's funny, as you said that, because it's like me,

somebody said, well, do you know, because I'm here, there, I'm everywhere. I was like, I'm either my life is a vacation, but then I'm always working on my vacation or I really never take off. So that's kind of the way it works. Well, look, it's like me. Here's what happened. So I stay here for the weekend because Missy, she wanted to be. get Karina moved in because she got a job and we're really proud she graduated college i mean one of the

greatest i think just life moments and sign of courage of orphan girl from a third world country educates herself has a little mentorship from spiritual people a spiritual family down there that helped her and she comes all this way and so and we we took her own in our family but uh and we we're not saying credit for anything. I mean, she's just been awesome. But she moved her in. So I had the weekend of myself, and I've been. I mean, God brought her, no doubt, into your lives and then, ergo our lives, yeah.

So, and it was real touching. They were giving me the play-by-play. So I tried to cram as much fun in the weekend as humanly possible, which I had to speak at the sportsman thing at Willie's on Friday. We talked about that. Friday night. So I planned a little card game at my house, a little. So that lasted till four in the morning.

So me and Willie and one of our buddies, we're in a golf tournament. It was like a 4th of July golf tournament, which we're not. The guy, our buddy, he's good. But Willie and I are not. Not exactly consistent. No, we're not consistent. You're right. So we go out there and so I stayed up to 4 o'clock in the morning,

and then get up, go play in the golf tournament. So here's what's funny. We wind up winning what they call. the first flight, which means this. There's 36 teams, and they said there'll be four flights. Well, after day one, I looked down, well, we're tied for 10th. So I was like, perfect. You know, we didn't.

Because all you got to get to is number 9. I tell Missy, like, we won, you know, we won the tournament, our flight. What does that mean? That means we got so lucky that you hit on number 9. The fifth best team. So the second day, we shot eight under, which is pretty good, three-man scramble. Well, the second day, we shoot 63, which was nine under. And it comes out, well, there's a three-way tie.

Well, we played the tournament. Our buddy said, I'll hang around and see if we won anything. So me and Willie, we left. We're in separate vehicles, but I'm in the grocery store because I'm a bachelor. I'm looking for something to eat. Well, I look up in the grocery store. Well, there's Willie. Because he's hungry.

He's hungry. Because he's Willie. Yeah. And so we get a call from the golf course saying you're in a three-way tie. And so we're doing a tie breaker. We're going to have a chip off on the 18th green. But you're in the grocery store. We're both in the grocery.

Willie's looking to me. I'm looking at him. I was like, we got to call our buddy. Because he's way better. I was like, does one of us have to go or three? And they're like, just one. So we call him. Well, he's at a red light fish to get on Interstate.

We're like, turn around. Drive back. He's a much better chipper than both of y'all anyway. Long story short, he drives back. Chips sit within three feet. We win. And somehow I feel like, you know, oh, I've done something. I've won.

You know, we won. Oh, I'm so lucky. I'm all that me out that you were the 10th, 11th, and 12th team, and he had a better chipper than the other guy. We were sitting. We were seated in our living room, Willie Robertson's mother, and she has a couple of dogs. Would that be Ms. Kay? She has a couple of dogs.

That's your wife. That's your wife. Your wife. And I'm sitting there in my chair, and I hear a little racket, and we've been sitting there all day, just taking care of the dogs and, you know, no company. And I look up, and I hear this racket. I see this man standing down at the end of the counter in the kitchen. And I said, I literally reached for my AR. Oh, boy.

I said, who in the world is that? Well, he starts coming toward us, and I'm looking at him. I said, good night, that's Willie. But the reason I said that is his top notch, everything where these are, all the top is brilliantly blonde. Yeah, he dyed his hair blonde. His whiskers, he was coming out of his fetes had been cut short. So he has a little black beard and this blonde hair.

And I said, good night. Will, is that you? And he walks up there, you know. He said, you got any gas? And I said, do what? He said, do you have any gas? I said, well, not on me. I said, will you?

You run out of gas? You vehicle broke? He said, no, I need something for the boat down there. So I said, give me about 20 minutes. So I fill him up with gas. Get some gas at the back of his truck, and he drives. He's having another mid-life. He's heading down the river there.

You might make you feel better? There's a guy that comes up to me at church Sunday and starts asking me questions, and I never made eye contact because when I'm in a large crowd of people, especially our show just got released, so there's a lot of people coming out there. I saw you downtown New York, you know. Oh, yeah. You and Jeff. I'm big shot in this guy, you know, whatever.

and Willie finally said, Jace, I was like, oh, he was having a conversation, and I did not know it was him. I could not identify my third son. I'm looking at him.

I'm neither the prophet nor son of the prophet, but I did at Willie's 50th birthday party, we were roasting him, and I did a roast about all of his hairdos through the years, because this isn't the first time. Jack, I had some interesting pictures, right? So now he's done it yet again.

He's back on the blonde, blonde hair. Is it a good look? Is it look great? No. Not really. It's bizarre. He looks like, I mean, I asked him. I said, is this a cry for help?

Yeah, it's like an M&M slash Kanye West love child. I mean, it's bizarre. But I think he did it, to be fair, to be fair, I think the reason why he did it was for Sadie's birthday party. And so they had like a karaoke night. And so everybody kind of came in character. And his character, him and Corey, were some kind of rappers or something. And yeah, it was, it looks bizarre, though.

It certainly does. Yeah, he did a rap. Dan showed it to me on the computer. He walked by. He said, that's what Will's been doing. I looked down there. And he and Corey are singing some kind of rap deal. I said, what in the world's talking?

to my family. Well, I'll say this. When your father reaches for his weapon, when you walk into a room, you may have gone a little far in whatever you were trying to pull off. My dogs didn't bark. The dogs didn't bark. And, you know, and then I'm standing. And he's standing down there.

I said, who in the world's at? I really didn't know who he was. I'm glad. I'm glad. I tell you what is. His hair looks like, you remember the time that me and Jeff when we were in college and we dyed our hair and it turned out white. I remember that.

One of them pink and orange. The rebel years were both bleached. Well, yeah, we were bleat. Jep's hair is darker than mine, so his came out orange. Mine came out like white. And I'll never forget. We were laying in bed that morning on Sunday. And Phil walked in there and he said, good night, Kate.

Billy Idol is in our house. That was his opening. But that's what it looks like. It calls such a stir. So I guess, because y'all were still kind of in your. your prodigal phase. And they came into, they came into Wysfay Road.

I happened to be preaching then. And, but it caused such a stir the way they looked that I felt like I had needed to respond. So the next Sunday, I came up with my, at the time was my patented top 10 list on the top 10 things overheard when Jeff and Zat walked into the church last week. I mean, it was such a stir that I had to address it. I mean, couldn't let it go. First thing I thought of when I saw the new,

new look. I thought sin has creeped into our family. We've got some measures to go through here. We brought them back on board. Thank goodness, Zach. Because Zach, in the last podcast, we were addressing a little bit of the movie and, you know, dad's trepidation about just the whole idea. But I thought about this.

I didn't say this in the last podcast, but since you're on here, because I know you preached yesterday as well, I want to hear what you preached about, is that if any of us, I think, had the worst parts of our life and decision. And for Uzac, it was a teenager. College age, for me, it was a teenager. If someone came and said, we're going to do a movie about it, it would be very nervous. I mean, I would be very nervous,

but I would be willing to do it if I felt like it would help people, which is kind of the whole purpose about this with dad. But we talked about that before, but I thought about this era of your lives, same with mine. I would be embarrassed to show that on a big screen. some of the things I did and thought and, you know, were part of my life. But if it shows the power of God, obviously that's kind of the whole point.

But tell us about what you preached about. By the way, I want everyone to know that I did not dream this movie thing up. It didn't come from you. You're off the hook, Phil. Yep. Yep. Phil didn't dream it up. Yeah, I preached on Matthew 13.

We're in the book of Matthew. Parable of So we got into the, uh, no, to the whole kingdom. What is the king? I thought that was a parable of the soul were in Matthew 13. No? Oh, there's a lot of stuff in there. Yeah. The kingdom is like.

The kingdom is like. The kingdom is like. So I didn't get into the, I mean, I started there because we're kind of transitioning into this whole concept of what is the kingdom. Who was your audience? Who are you speaking to? This is our church. Oh, yeah.

Here in North Carolina. But we, um. Zach's like all of us. He's a volunteer priest of these days. Yeah. Yeah. Well, we actually rotate. So we have three, four elders, pastors, same thing, that rotate teaching.

And we're just going through books of the Bible. But, yeah, I camped out most of the time in Daniel chapter two, which is one of my favorite passages that fill you. And all you guys used to teach whenever I was cutting my teeth on the word. And so we got into that. Yeah, the prediction. Yeah, the coming kingdom. Yeah. And the stat, yeah, went through the statues, the statue that. King Nebuchadnezzar saw and went through kind of the history of what those kingdoms were.

The first one was the Babylonian Empire. The second one was the Medo-Persians, then the Greeks, Rome. And then the one that I was honed in on is the one that was established in the days of the Roman Empire when the prophecy says, in these days, God will establish a kingdom that can't be shaken nor destroyed. I mean, it was very relevant for where we're at today because, you know, we have a whole lot of anxiety about our earthly kingdom here in the U.S. But for believers, man, we got to hone in on the ultimate kingdom we're a part of. Well, Zach, it's interesting because I didn't know that you did that, but I just got back from a trip that started in Italy and then wound up in Greece. And obviously a lot of what we did was seeing historical ruins and sort of like we did with the movie we did on Torchberry years ago.

But it just listening to all these historians and people we were doing all these walking tours. And it really brought that to light back to me because I was looking at, I was literally walking around listening to history of two of those four kingdoms that you mentioned. Because we're on ancient Olympia, you know, which is where the birthplace of the Olympic Games, which is so long ago, but I'm hearing all this stuff, and I'm seeing and realizing that all of these great powers were doing it without God. We're doing it with these, you know, pantheon of gods, you know, that were represented in all the Greeks, they established it, but the Romans came in. It was basically the same gods. They just renamed them. But it was still this idea that we could find something more than the creator and the kingdom. But it was, you're really, you're a

right right out of Daniel 2, which was written hundreds of years before this ever... Chapter 9, he then began to teach him. He must suffer many things, be rejected by the elders, chief priests, and teaches other law. He must be killed. And after that, these three days will rise again. And he ends it up. When he gets into Mark chapter 9, I tell you the truth, some who are standing here, he's talking to his apostles there, will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God come with power, which tells you, oh, it came. Yeah. And it came quickly.

Well, he said it was near. John the Baptist said it was near. Yep. And to Zach's point, it is bigger than just what we're a part of. I mean, where God the Father is and the heavenly realm and the kingdom, when you think about what God has and is, oh, it's big. Everyone but this one has risen. and collapsed, including Nebuchadnezzar, and the collapse and collapse and collapse.

Now you've had this. You go back before Daniel and the Babylonian way back. All of them kingdoms of various degrees, rose and they fall, rose and they fall. But this one. Still rocking. Hang on, let's take our first break. Well, even when you said that, Zach, I mean, Hebrews 12, we're in Hebrews. Hebrews, 12, 28 came to mind.

Since we are receiving, are receiving a. kingdom that cannot be shaken. Let us be thankful and so worship God, accept, acceptably with reverence and all. Yeah, I can't wait until we get to that text because right before he says that, he describes what that is, what that looks like. And by the way, which takes us to where we talking about today, picking up in 414, but it takes us all the way back to the idea that the kingdom of God and the mind of God has been there from the very beginning. I mean, it was revealed to us later in time, but from God's perspective, he's outside of time. He's always known what the kingdom of God was going to be and what it was going to look like.

So I think that's why, Zach, we left off the last podcast, kind of where you guys did before when I wasn't here, is he kind of closes out this segment of talking about Moses and the law by saying the Word of God is living and active, meaning it's not just an old document. Or an old covenant or an old idea, but this is always going. Well, you remember the illustration I gave in the last podcast. I was on why people. I did a top 10 on why people go to church outside of a personal relationship with a guy. And some of the things that we went through was just they want their kids, you know, to have a foundation or they're older because they realize they're not going to be here very long or they're trying to get a date or they work.

there. We had we had different things. But the reason I brought that up is because a lot of churches when you look at them, they're the opposite of living and active. Yeah. It looks dead and idle. And so that was the point I was trying to get to, but I never did because we we chase some rabbits on the left. Which we are prone to do. We are prone to chase a few rabbits. Al brought up something about paying taxes. The next thing you know, I got over in more than 12. Well, some guy said in the comments, he said, they're going to the book of Hebrews, but man, they're taking a long way to get to it. I'll say, well, but in fairness to us, the book of Hebrews is written to expand the entire history

of the Hebrew nation into the current kingdom. There's a lot of room for rabbit chases. The kingdom of God in the midst of it. I will tell you why that happened, Al, because to finish my weekend story, I'll be a lot of I was so tired after the night of playing cards and the golf tournament. And the chip off that you commissioned. And the chip off that I sat down on the couch. It was 6 o'clock p.m.

And I remember looking down at the dogs and, well, the next thing I know, my eyes popped open because I had fallen asleep. And I looked at the clock and it was 2.30 in the morning. I hadn't even laid down on the couch. I just sat back. Well, now I'm up. Yeah. It's a, I'm up. So I said, well, I'll do some Bible study.

Well, these are the kind of thoughts that come to your mind from 2.30 to 630. So I jotted down. I was like, yeah, I got a few notes on our podcast. Well, it's funny that you said that. I had no idea because I've been doing the same thing. So I'm, I think today finally I'm over, but I've been in a three-day process of jet lagging because I've been eight hours ahead of y'all. my body clock for almost three weeks. And so I get back home, well, guess what happens?

You know, first night you get in and sleep, you lay down and go to sleep. Well, you wake up at four in the morning. Well, it feels like it's noon to your body. And so this has happened to me every night. So like the last two nights, the first night it was 9 o'clock. I couldn't hold my eyes open, which I know, Dad, that's about when you go to bed. But for me, that's early. And then the next last night, it's 10.30.

Now I'm finally back on my regular time. I've been waking up early in the morning doing the same kind of studies. But the point I was getting at is, you know, to your point about the kingdom, Jesus is our king, and he's the king of kings, and we howls him. I keep going to that chapter 3, you know, verse 6, Christ is faithful as a son over God's house. I mean, that's a 24-7 reflective thing. And I mean, we did the whole study of the book of John. And when you think about how God chose to reveal himself to all.

us the word because here it says you know the word of god is living and active well it immediately takes me back to john one you know the logic of god is a person yeah his name is jesus and you remember the one through three i mean everything that has been created was created by him for him nothing that has been created was created without him so when you start thinking about what that means he's an he's an uncreated divine being everything that's ever had a beginning got a beginning from him yep that's why jays to to your point hebrews 4 14 therefore since we have a great high priest what's he has past tense who has gone not is going to go he's already gone through the heavens jesus the son of god let us

hold firmly to the faith we profess, for we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are, yet was without sin. Let us then approach the throne of grace with confidence so that we may be, we receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need. This thing wasn't speaking of the future. This has happened and he has gone back to the right hand of the father for us to bow to him. It's a kingdom and the king is invisible. But that's why I feel. It is powerful. Churches today, one of the reasons I didn't mention that people go to churches is they have people represent them. And very, depending on what religion you're a part of, they have priests today

who say, I'm going to be the go-between. But we're like, well, Jesus is the ultimate go between. Because he represents heaven and earth. The people that are representing us here now, they have been to heaven. And to your point, even the Protestants, we indulge in the same thing. We'd like to throw that on the Catholics, but we lift up pastors to a degree that probably isn't healthy. And then we outsource the priesthood to professional clergy, which is not biblical.

and it's not what we're called to do. But if you look at like this thread here at Hebrews, that's interesting moving into the passage Phil just read, we were just talking about, or the Hebrew writer was just writing about that Jesus is superior to Moses, right? Then he moves, that's in chapter three. Then in chapter four, right before this, he says Jesus is also superior to Joshua.

So you got all these guys that everyone looked up to particularly, because of what happened in Egypt and the exodus of God's people out of Egypt and all the things that happened. And they revered these men. And the Hebrew writer is like, Jesus is better than Moses. He's better than Joshua. And now he's going to the priesthood. He's better than Aaron. And so you see this thing because Aaron was, Aaron was the head of the priesthood and the tribe of Levi, which we're about to get into.

You can't, here's a little history that you couldn't be a priest. unless you could trace your lineage to the tribe of Levi. And they had all these records and where they could, I mean, you could, you would be an illegitimate priest if you could not trace your lineage to, to the Levite tribe. And so here we are, like this is written before. When was Steveers written? Do we know, it was written before 8070, right? Yeah, somewhere around that era.

I mean, most of them have guessed anywhere from 60 to 90. I mean, broad sense. Yeah, I'm more of a 60 to 70. to. But it was definitely, there had been enough happen that you had people that were wandering away. I don't think the destruction of Jerusalem had taken place up to this point. Probably not, because he would have probably mentioned it. Let's take a break. Now, Zach, you got up a great point. I was going to do the same thing. You have to look at this in context, because he's making a shift. The passages that dad just read, is him now going to bring on this idea about priesthood?

Because he's already established that the mediators better, angels, Moses, all prophecy, better because he's the fulfillment of prophecy. Now he's talking about being better than their own history. Joshua, the law, all the things are there. But the next step would naturally be the priesthood because think about it from a Jewish mindset, the priesthood was your way to make atonement for not being able to fulfill and uphold the law. It was the process by which God set forward.

So if you're a Jew and you're sitting there thinking, okay, Jesus is better than all these saints, but what about the one thing that made me right? Plus all these human priests, through Levi, all of them had one problem. They're sinners, too, to deal gently with those who are ignorant and are going astray, since he himself, the high priest, is subject to weakness. This is why he has to offer the sacrifices for his own sins, as well as for the sins of the people. That's the downside.

It's when he brings up the first flaw in the system is that Jesus had that conquered. You say, good. No, he didn't have any scenes. In our specific passage, he subtly mentions that 14, 414, since we have a great high priest, number one, he's gone through the heavens. Yeah. That's different. Yeah. That's why I'm saying.

It'd be a good question. By the way, the alternate to that verse has gone into heaven. but they're the same because you know how he got into heaven by going through the heavens. He left here physically, went through the atmosphere, and they watched him as he disappeared. My point is, if you're going to represent us in heaven, which I believe he does. He does. I mean, we talk about 1st John 2.1. That's the point of why he's there.

He speaks on our defense and all that. That's why I always said that Matthew passage about the kids who have their angels before the face of God, because I always thought they were safe. I don't know a lot of people disagree with that, but I thought they have representation. Why is that there? And by the way, he started off in Hebrews 1 saying Jesus is superior to the angels, even in that world.

So then the second thing, he says, we don't have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who's been tempted in every way. Here's the next big difference, yet was without sin. That's the key. Right. So it's not, so people want to quickly jump and say, well, the, the good thing about having an earthly priest down here is because they know what we're going through, because they're sinful. But Jesus knows what we're going through.

Because he was tempted the same way. But he didn't have any sin. I think you just, you went up on the list as more qualified to help us. Well, here's the way, Jace, here's the way Paul would put it in 1 Timothy 2, 5. And notice his wording, very important. for there is one God, one mediator between God and men, the man, Christ Jesus. Now, we also know he is the God Christ Jesus, but what's the mediating work? That's the first.

It's the first. And then it said, who gave himself as a ransom for all men. So the idea is that the man, the humanity of Jesus is our representative. Well, think about it. What did a priest do? What was his goal? I mean, what was he doing? offering sacrifices for what gifts and sacrifices for sin to try to make it right so just look at it

logically because a lot of people said now what about when y'all talking about levites and priests and what does it mean you get it's a little bit hard but look you see you like okay there's a god and there's men slash women there's humanity well what's the problem with god and humans he has no sin and we do that's it so what happened god became a man it sounds like to me we're building a bridge here not we but god is building a bridge and you have someone representing god and man so in essence a high priest that's what they're like a go-between they're like a bridge there uh but we have the ultimate one in jesus because he was sinless he conquered the grave which he'll get to in chapter where is that six or seven you know he he was qualified because based on the fact of an

indestructible life that's the other thing so when you put your faith and trust in earthly priests and look i believe that since we have the spirit of god we're acting as priests in a way because god is using us as ambassadors you're just a raggedy looking at you're just a raggedy looking at priest. Yeah, and a flawed man. But we have that treasure in jars of clay to show that the power's coming from God and not us, which is what's happening. So when, you know, you could go around and technically say, yeah, I'm a priest because you're meeting people and you're introducing them to the high priest, which is Jesus, and they're putting their faith and trust in him. And so in a way, you acted as a go-between because Christ is in you, which is real church.

Almost like Dr. Apostle Paul said, we become his ambassadors as though he was making his appeal through us. Thank you. That's a better way to. Lowly human beings. You're like, how could that be? I think that's the basis for verse 16 when he says, therefore, let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in our time of need. the reason why you can have confidence, going back to Acts 17, listen to how Jesus is described in Acts 17 in verse 30. It says, therefore, having overlooked the times of ignorance, God is now declaring to men

that all people everywhere should repent because he has fixed a day when he will judge the world in righteousness, and he's going to judge the world and righteousness, this is how he's going to do it, through a man whom he appointed having furnished proof to all men by raising him from the dead. In other words, you want to know how God's going to judge the world? He's going to do it through Jesus. So when you read a verse like this in Hebrews, you're like, wait a second. The one who is going behind the curtain and satisfying the wrath of God, like he goes behind the curtain, that's Jesus.

Well, who's the one that's going to be distributing justice? Jesus. So it's almost like, I've heard of description. out like this. You got Jesus on the seat of the judge. And then he says to the defendant, which will be us, how does your client plead? And then Jesus gets off of his podium. And he goes around and he sits down by us, the client, my client's not guilty. Then he gets back up. So he's in both spots. That's why we can be confident because the one who is making the sacrifice on our behalf, the one who is going and pleading our case is also the same guy that's going to

judge us. So we're in a good spot. That's comforting for me today. It's the only spot. Yeah, because you've got out of here alive. You've got both the prosecutor and the defense on your team. Let's take a break. So I want to bring up a historical point here because one of the brilliant things that the Hebrew writer does over and over is he's talking about large concepts like law, priesthood, these type of things. But, Zach, you made the point earlier. He uses the names of people that have been revered for thousands of years. He uses the name Moses, and he uses the name Joshua.

Here in chapter 5 and verse 4, he uses the name Aaron, as you mentioned. Now, I wanted to say something about Aaron. So the first time he shows up on the seam is when Moses is before the burning bush in Exodus, early Exodus, and God calls him to lead his people out. You remember what Moses's thing was? You know, I can't, I've been out here herding sheep for the last 40 years. I can't even speak. I mean, I can't do this.

I can't do what you ask me to do? And he says, what about my brother Aaron? He speaks really well. If he can go with me, I'll do it. So the first time we ever see the brother of Moses, he's kind of like a representative for Moses, right? He's going to articulate everything Moses can't. So now fast forward, the people.

People are freed. They're at Mount Sinai. The law's coming down. Moses disappears on the mountain for 40 days. People start getting antsy at the bottom. And look who it is that has no confidence. To your point, Zach, about Jesus and confidence. Here's Aaron and all the people look to him. They say, we don't know about this Moses guy. We don't know where he is, but tell us what to do. And what does he do in his first moment as a recognized leader? He blew it. I mean, he says, okay. here's what we're going to do. Everybody, all the gold and stuff that God gave us when we went out of Egypt, take it and put it in a big pile. We're going to smelt this down and we're going to create a calf to represent what we left, and we're going to bow down and worship that. So my point is, if a guy was that far off, he was the father of the priesthood to show you how difficult it is to have confidence when you're a sinner if you don't have something bigger than yourself. I mean, so just the historical part jumps out at B. It just gets obvious. In our history, go ahead. Well, I was just going to say in our history, though, you just don't seem,

Jesus doesn't seem powerful to the world. You know, when they talk about people following Jesus, they're not, I mean, we're reading this verse, and I think subtly, you know, we were talking about the kingdom earlier. We're part of the greatest kingdom that's ever been. and that ever will be and that ever will be and that's eternal well you notice what he did there in verse 12 though he said the word of god is living and active it's sharper than a double-edged sword well how do people rise to great kingdoms they they did it with swords yeah and he suddenly is like this is this is sharper than that it's more powerful than a sword which or any weapon that's why you think that's why you think

think about that the weapons we fight with are not the weapons of the world go ahead yeah yeah i was going to say well listen to this listen to this that you think about this idea of that the that it's sharper than a double-edged sword there's another reference to a sword like that in revelation one uh when um john has a vision of the son of man and he said which is by the way is is also in the book of Daniel when we talk about the idea of the coming of the kingdom. Here's where I think we get off is we forget that it's not primarily about the kingdom. It's primarily about the king. And you can't have the kingdom without the king.

And what we're always trying to do is how can we have the kingdom without the king and it never works? Because you have to have the king to have the kingdom. And so we talked about the son. I was fixing to say the same thing. Because I think that, look, Zach, I think that's what their problem. was they had the ritualistic. What's the hardest thing to do in life?

It's to go from ritual to a relationship-oriented aspect of life. Well, it's the hardest thing doing marriage, too. You get in the habit. Whatever your new normal is, it's hard. You know, people look up and they're like, what happened? We just lost our way. Well, you got so caught up in the everyday occurrences of marriage and family that you lost the key pieces, which is the actual people.

like and sharing your hearts and thoughts and because that's why he said nothing is hidden it judges the attitudes of the heart i mean that's what god's interested in not not what you you can fake a ritual but you can't fake god in what you really believe and what you're really passionate about which is should be the king is what i was yeah because it all comes into it all comes into like this this focal point I view the whole thing. I was almost like a target that all these writers that wrote these scriptures here and they're just throwing darts at a dartboard. And they just, I mean, they're all coming from different angles and different places,

but they keep hitting the same spot right in the dead center of the board. And that center is the person of Jesus. And so you think a double-edged sword, listen to this and what John saw. He said, well, he heard the noise behind him. He said, I turned to see the voice that was speaking to me. And having turned, I saw seven golden lampstands. And in the middle of the lampstands, I saw one like a son of man clothed in a robe, reaching down to his feet, girded across his chest with a golden sash.

His head and his hair were white like wool like snow. And his eyes were like a flame of fire. His feet were like burnished bronze when it has been made to glow in the furnace. And his voice was the sound of many waters. And in his right hand, he held out seven stars. And listen to this. And just think about what you would do if you saw this person. Out of his mouth came a sharp two-edged sword.

And his face was like the sun shining in its strength. So you had mentioned, John, one, one, that in the beginning was the word, the logos, the word was with God. The word was God. Then you have coming out of the mouth of Jesus, this double-edged, sword did you have here in Hebrews 4 that the word is sharper than any double-edged sword. And you start to get the idea that how often when we approach the reality in a way where we're at the center of it, it's not going to work. And I think that we even do this in religion because we take Jesus and we reduce Jesus

to what I've heard called the cosmic bellhop in the sky where he's there to help us and give us therapy, and it's like this therapeutic age that we live in. He's there to help our self-esteem and help our brokenness. But we need to remember that this is the Jesus, according to Acts 17, that's going to judge the world. According to Revelation chapter 1, he's not to be trifled with. And I think that's what the case that we're seeing here being played out in Hebrews, is whatever your view of Jesus is, we need to elevate it. Whatever it is, we need to elevate our view of Jesus.

Which is becomes the whole point. Let's take our last break. Yeah, because he did say, I mean, he goes on to say he helps us in our weakness. You know, he's, but he's also with that aspect, he's more powerful. And you're not going to, you know, this, why would he put that in there about he judges the thoughts, you know, nothing that in all creation is covered up. I mean, he sees everything. Well, why is he saying that? Because we know why he's saying it.

Because what are humans? What are they the best at? Covering up, lying, faking. You know, it's just how our world revolves around them. If you do something, you try to get away with it. And if you get caught, you lie about it. And that's just the way human nature is. And, you know, he does a very interesting thing here

because he compares the calling of Aaron to the calling of Christ. He says in verse 4, no one takes this honest. in other words, to become a high priest upon himself. He must be called by God, just as Aaron was. So this idea, and I described to you how Aaron's calling happened. I mean, it wasn't like he planned it. He just happened to be the brother of the guy who was talked to directly by God. So what's interesting is when you look at this history of that.

Think about the Jewish mindset in the first century because that's who we're talking to. They're looking back at 2,000 years of history of the Levitical priesthood. And by the way, that all happened before Aaron. because Joseph went into Egypt and it was just him and his family. There were 70 of them. It happened to be his brothers that would become the 12 tribes that would later become the leadership of Israel. One of those tribes was his brother Levi. Now, Levi was dead.

By the time they get into the promised land, Aaron is dead. But God says, here's the way I want you to do it. I want you to set aside one tribe that's going to be nothing but the priesthood. And it's going to be the tribe of Aaron and Moses, Levi. So now you look 2,000 years down the road, that's all. they've ever known is the priesthood. Now he goes back and says, look, it wasn't up to Aaron. It was up to me. I called him to do what he did. And we know he failed spectacularly in the moment, but the idea of God helping and having a relationship with man was the key. So then he shifts it to

Jesus. Look what he says in verse 5, Hebrews 5, 5. So Christ also did not take it upon himself the glory of becoming a high priest, but God said to him, the father, you are my son. to dad become your father. And he said in another place, and he's going to introduce a name we're going to talk about later. You are a priest forever in the order of Malkisadec.

And his throne is called throne of grace. That's it. Not works. Exactly. Well, give the click review on Malkisadec. Yeah, let me give you this. Let me read the rest of this.

Then I'll talk about it because we'll probably got to go into overtime. I'll read down to verse 10 because he's going to describe this. idea of why Jesus is like Melchese. Then I'll tell you a little bit about it. During the days of Jesus' life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death. And he was heard because of his reverent submission. Now, this is a picture of Jesus that makes us uncomfortable.

Jason is how you talking about the chosen? We don't like the idea that Jesus at the moment of this sacrifice was saying, are we sure this is it? because this is going to be painful. Although he was the son, verse 8, he learned obedience from what he suffered. And once made perfect, meaning complete, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him. It was designated by God to be high priest again in the order of Melchese. So first of all, we see that Jesus' ultimate sacrifice came because he was willing to become one of us and do it.

But it wasn't easy. It was very difficult for that to happen. I want to say this, because to Zach's point, he quotes Hebrews five, where is it at five, where he said, you're my son today, I've become your father. Well, that doesn't seem like a real scary verse. That's like, well, that's a relationship aspect. Well, when you read Psalms too, listen to this. Why do the nations conspire and the people's plot in vain?

The kings of the earth take their stand and the rulers. gather together against the Lord and against his anointed one. Let us break their change, they say. Verse four of Psalm 2. The one enthroned in heaven laughs. The Lord scoffs. Then he rebukes them in his anger and terrifies them. Verse 6.

I have installed my king on Zion, my holy hill. Who do you think you're talking about? Verse 7. He said, you are my son. Today I become your father. Ask of me and I will. make the nations your inheritance the ends of the earth your possession you will rule them with an iron sceptre verse 10 therefore you kings be wise be worn verse 11 serve the lord with fear and rejoice with trembling

kiss the sun lest he be angry and i think that's what we're trying to describe here is that god is forced not against us and he became a man and so then you read something that seems to fly in the face of it. Like in Hebrew's 570s, like, he was crying and he had tears. He was crying out and he had tears. He learned obedience. So people are like, and that's why I think you have all this controversy about how to show Jesus.

Retraying. But it comes back to that, him being the ultimate high priest because he is God. And he did become a man. I mean, John, one, is all that powerful verbiage about all his creation and his power, and he's the source of life, and in him there's light and there's no darkness. And then it gets to the end, he's like, and he became flesh. Yeah. He became human.

And then it says he explained God in human form. So I think the most powerful thing you can realize is he is a human. He did have emotions. I mean, there's no doubt about that when you read this. Oh, yeah. And that makes people uncomfortable. And I've read this verse thousands of times to people who think that you have to go into a building and be dead and inactive in order to be reverent. Right.

And this is the exact opposite of reverence here. He was crying out. I like being in places when we're together and worshiping and there's people crying out. I like that. Yeah. Because I'm like, I know somebody else who did that. Yeah. And the point is, Jay, he's showing the similarities.

We always point out quickly the differences between the high priest. The Hebrew writer is showing the similarities. He's saying, look, he suffered. He learned what it's like to be a human being. He went to the point of knowing he was going to have a terrible, torturous execution, just like we all would. I mean, I don't know about y'all, but one thing is, I know I'm going to die. But when I'm going to die in a terrible way and people are going to torture me up to the point of my death,

you've got to get your mind wrapped around that way. I read it and I end up by saying, I don't think I could handle that. Most of us. You see the line, though, he's going down that line of like that Psalm passage. He's like, you kiss him because you don't make you mad. But I think that it's nothing wrong with being motivated by that, the power of God. I mean, because he, how was he trying to motivate you saying he knows the thoughts and attitudes of heart? The fear of God is the beginning of wisdom.

Well, yeah. Yeah, I mean, he's going to get to that. since you're receiving this kingdom that can't be shaking, you know, shaking, that you might should do a little trembling and be confident. I mean, you're walking all those lines, and I think those are helpful lines. And another uncomfortable phrase that people have in this same text we're talking about is that idea about once he was made perfect. But the only idea, because we said, well, I thought he was perfect the whole time.

He was, and he is. But what he's talking about is his death is what then completed. the process. That's why I said it is finished. I mean, now all things have been brought. That's what he said. That's what Jesus said before he was crucified. He said, Father, the time is come glorify your son and the glory I have with you before the world began. So it's a restoration of kind of Jesus's position at the resurrection. But, you know, as Jace was talking about this, I was, I'm just reminded of, do you see the gospel all in this? Because there is this, like, identity connection that the Hebrew writer is giving us here,

like the world of Christ is like us. But there's also this other thing that's like this great exaltation of Christ. And he said, man, well, it's kind of a weird tension that we're trying to hold. He's so much better than anything, but yet he's also can identify with you. That's exactly. But if we get off on the greatness of God, I think the point that he's making here, is that if he's just like Aaron, I mean, it's just not that great. You know what I mean? Yeah, Aaron can identify with us, but man, he's just not big enough to do anything. That's right. And that's

why we have to see this elevation of who God is. He's got to be greater. So look, we're out of time. But in the overtime, I want to go to Psalm 110, TNJ's like you did. And this idea about McKesedek and set up a little bit because we're going to spend a little bit more time we get to chapter seven. But this whole section is about this idea of priesthood. So I want to want to talk a little bit more about that. Remember, it's blazedtiv.com slash unashamed to pick up our overtime. So we'd like for it to come over and join us. We'll kind of set up that concept. We'll see you there. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click that little bell to get

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