Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 833 | Everyone Phil Baptizes Has One Thing in Common & Jase Is Deeply Moved by a Widower’s Story

Episode Date: February 9, 2024

Phil has realized the one thing that pretty much everyone he baptizes has in common, and Jase’s heart is touched by a widower who drove hundreds of miles to be with fellow believers. Al finds hope in spite of losing a dear friend and missionary in Africa. The guys go over the resurrection of Jesus and his many appearances to his followers in the 40 days following it. Jase is pretty excited that he’ll be able to eat fish in his own resurrected body. In this episode: Luke 24, verses 1-53 -- Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? He began to teach him that the son of man must suffer. Many things would be rejected by the elder, his chief priest, and teasing, that he must be killed, and after three days, rise again. He spoke plainly about it. Peter took him aside and began to rebuke him. I mean, the very thing that he did, he was told I'm going to do this. And every time he opened his mouth in Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John starting about halfway.

All of them. He's saying, I'm going to do this. This is what's going to happen. Well, I just thought, I was just thinking by the time they get there and it's happening, they can't deal with it. They're like, I guess, you know, we never experienced somebody who was alive and he died. and we went down there and he wouldn't believe and maybe he might show up to it. It's a tough, it's a tough call. Well, the other thing we did.

The human race to say, oh, yeah, well, that. We didn't stress it much in the last podcast, but also they were so locked in to this being a political overturn. It was hard for them to Matt. Once he got killed, once the authorities got to. him, the feeling of it's over was so strong. They struggled to believe it. Well, I think... Well, if I'd heard somebody for three years, over and over and over, tell him,

this is what's making to happen. But as you think, and then they were watching what he was doing, the miracles, it would have been enough for me. But as you said, though, Dad, you described it in the middle of the gospel, but that had been quite a bit into their minister. So he didn't really start honing in on the specifics until he got pretty close to the end. That's right. So it was still pretty new.

I mean, it wasn't like. And it's the same way all the way through. That's right. He doesn't start saying, I'm going to die, be very and raised from the dead until about halfway through the about a year and a half before he finally started zeroing in on that. Well, like Jay said in the last podcast, people have been now theorizing what really happened because they can't believe it happened like this is saying it did. That's right.

So that's where you get the swoon theory. He really didn't die. He just, like, passed out. Yeah, they've got one where there's like a hallucination that they all were having mass hallucinations. Yeah. But the thing about that is you don't have, and then one of the points that, I think that guy's name from Biola University, I can't remember his name on top of my head, but he talked about this. Hazen, Greg, Craig or Greg Hazen, I think that's his name. But he talked about, you don't, like, you don't have groups of 500 people.

You know, in First 15th, he says he appeared to me. he appeared to 12, you know, all the people. And then he appeared to 500 people, this is Paul's account, most of whom he says are still alive, which that's the dumbest thing to say if you're making something up. Because if you tell me, hey, if you write an account and you put it in the newspaper, this guy rose from the dead and he appeared to me. He appeared a guy named Bill. He appeared to Andy.

Oh, Andy appeared like 500 other people. Most of them are still living in the same town. they're still alive. The first question I'm going to ask is, well, who are they? I mean, so like, these are, again, these are details in these accounts where if you're making it up, you're going to, you're going to do like, like, something like, hey, I went to a cave and I got revelation from God. And, well, who was there?

No, I'm the only guy in there. Yeah. Because there's no way to prove that wrong, right? I can't prove that wrong. I wasn't in there. I didn't see it. I can't, I wasn't part of it. I either got to take your word for it or I got to say, I'm not going to believe you because that's

seems absurd. But the fact that the testimony of the risen Christ, there were so many witnesses to it. And keep in mind, when Jesus rose from the dead, he didn't just make an appearance and then go. He was on the earth for 40 days. Think about that. I mean, he was walking around. I mean, he was like, he was making multiple appearances. This is not, this type of resurrection was not anything that anybody had a reference point for, which fell to your point. I think the reason why they had a hard time believing it, they just didn't have an imagination. They didn't know what it was.

I mean, you're trying to explain something to somebody that they don't have, in their mind, they don't have any reference for it. And it's one of those things that you just say, well, you can't really see it until you see it. But once you see it, guess what?

You can't unscant it. And that's what happened with these guys. Well, it makes you appreciate Abraham when he reasoned that God could raise the dead when he was asked to sacrifice. Christ's his son. Yeah. Yeah. You, and that's why I brought up this whole deal about where the angels said that they didn't

understand that Jesus had to die. And I think there's more going on with Jesus's death, bound resurrection than we preach on. We generally just keep it to, he died for our sins and he showed us there's a way, you know, to come back. But I heard a really good sermon on this from Tim Keller. I think it was called Jesus is vindicated, and you can look it up. But he basically addresses what we're saying. How come they didn't get it?

He did a really big take on understanding that Jesus had to die. And basically his point was it's the love of God, it's the power of God, disarming the other powers, being shown because we can't save ourselves. We can't, there's nothing we can do that can fix, you know, corruption and transformation or whatever word you want to say. So it makes you feel smaller and it makes him feel bigger. For based on his love, he comes down to do this. But he had kind of four little points that went with it and I'll give them to you. and he basically gave these points that God wanted to show humans that there is a future. I mean, it's not over.

So that's one. That the future is personal. Because when Jesus came back, it was him, but it was an improved body. It was able to do more things. And I do think that that set the tone for us being able to wrap our heads around the verse that says our bodies will be transformed to be like his body. And so it was almost like this body that's resurrected that's able to live in heaven and earth at the same time. Which kind of gets into some of that NT-write stuff that we're talking about that this was the launching pad for a new creation, a new genesis. that all things can be restored.

And I agree with that. So it's futures there. It's personal. It's certain. Because then he passed on the Holy Spirit, and that becomes our guarantee. Think about all the verses that says the Holy Spirit guarantees our inheritance.

Well, it's like a receipt, you know, and he used an illustration of that. If somebody stops you and says, hey, did you pay for that? Where did you get that? Did you steal that? And you're like, oh, I got a receipt here. That's a guarantee that's been bought and paid for.

I'm free. Get out of my way. Well, we're talking about the afterlife here. Yeah. And to your point, not only is it a receipt, Jay's, it's also a deposit, meaning that there's this more to come is going to come. It's like whenever I go speak somewhere, someone sends the people that handle my speaking a deposit.

Well, that's saying we're confirmed. We want him to come here. and I'm saying because you deposited that, I'm coming. And then all we got to do is waiting for the event to happen. Well, that's exactly what the Holy Spirit does. He is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance, meaning it's going to happen. It's going to come. We're going to say something to that?

Yeah, I was thinking how Paul explains this is pretty profound. It's kind of an often overlooked verse in Galatians 3. But when Jesus said, or whenever the, you know, he says that the son of man must be delivered or I forget how it says it in here, but basically these things had to happen. Yeah. And then they're tying that right there, that this had to happen. The crucifixion, the burial, and the resurrection of Jesus had to happen. They're tying that to scripture.

And listen to how Paul says it. He's making a very similar point in Galatians when he's just talking about the necessity of the gospel. and in verse 21 in chapter 3 when he's talking about the law, he says, well, is the law contrary to the promises of God? And the reason why he's asking that is because he's showing how the law does not enable righteousness that can only come through to Christ. And he says, well, certainly not. It's not that it's not that they're contrary because the point is that if the law is the law bad and then Christ is good. They're at odds of one another because it seems like that's what you're saying, Paul. And Paul's like, no, no, no.

He said, not saying that. Certainly not. They're not at odds. They're not contrary. For if a law had been given that could give life, well, then guess what? Well, the righteousness would indeed be by the law. But that's not the case, because you can't be made right by what you do because we're sinful. That's the whole point of Galatians and Romans, for that matter. But the scripture, going back to what Jesus said, they didn't understand the scripture. The scripture imprisoned everything under sin. Well, why would that? Why would the scripture do that? so that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. That's what he's doing here. That is the accomplishment here. So it is partly this accomplishment of us being able to attain righteousness, not by what we've done, but by what Christ did. But it's also about the coming of the kingdom and that we now embody that.

We are the kingdom. and we are the priesthood. We are the outpost of the kingdom of God going out to the world. So I think that the reason why Jesus had to die was twofold. It was one to bring the kingdom, well, two, one, to be forgiven, and then two, to be in the kingdom and to participate in eternal life, which is, by the way, relationship with him, John 17.3. Yeah, I agree. That's good.

Well, that last little future point he had was that the future is the ultimate retriever. He didn't word it that way, but that was his point. And I thought, what does he mean by that? And so he went on this narrative about the reason people don't realize what happened in the resurrection. I mean, one is obviously what we've said. You have a dead man coming back in time. And one of the evidence is that we know this is true that the Jewish followers who are the first to recognize this, and some that were outside of Israel, you know, the centurion, whatever.

For them to acknowledge this went against everything they were taught, they believed. And these are people that wouldn't even spell God out. And you would never look at a man and say, oh, he's the son of God. And so, you know, when you look at the list in 1st Corinthians, 15, it was over 500 of them saw him, the resurrected Lord, and said, yeah. And then their actions proved that their hearts had been transformed. But he made a point that the reason they didn't want to recognize it, because he said humans are humans, no matter what time frame.

We're a group of creatures who look at things of likes and dislikes. And he used Facebook as an example. So there's a reason that it took off. And there's, I don't know how many people. because that's the way we operate. We like this, we don't like this, we like this, we don't like this. So when people read the Bible, what do they do? They like some parts, and they don't like some parts.

And that's the way they try to live. The problem with that is, to his point, when Jesus was resurrected, it's no longer about what you like and dislike. Because if that happened, you need to deal with all the things you don't like in the rest of the Bible. Because he has now trumped. all arguments. So it is a very good point.

And so he had a list of why Jesus had to die. And in this list, you know, I changed the wording on some of it. But it was basically that all humans want to be loved, all human, whether you believe in God or not, everybody wants to be loved and liked. We don't want to lose loved ones. Whether you're a believer or not, we do not want to lose loved ones. All people are upset when that happens, believe it or not. Number three, there are unretrievable aspects of life. And we really struggle with that.

You know, when you think back when you were a kid or when you were played sports and was the greatest. Well, at some point, you're no longer going to be able to do that. And we really struggle with that. The older we get, we're like, we just, we wish we could go back. But, and that's that point about that in our future, some things are unretrievable, but the resurrection is the ultimate retriever. So that's three. Four, death takes away everything.

Now, we try to justify it. We think of memories. We put up flowers where someone died. We make statues. But in reality, it's over. It's over. Everything is gone. And it's just a fact.

So when you put all these things together, we want to be loved, we don't want to lose loved ones, there's unretrievable things, death takes away everything. And then his fifth one was that all people fear death or their line. He said, when people come to me and say, I don't fear death, he says that he tells them, point blank. He said, you're a liar. and it's true. And so the reason he put that in that order is because when you look at what Jesus accomplished and the reason he had to do this, he had to have an answer for those things. This is God's love on display, and he had to do it because he loves us.

It's his nature. He had to show us there's a way to live with your loved ones again. He's having meals. there's things that you didn't think were retrievable that are retrievable. And he went down a long list about people in poor relationships, bad marriages, they never got it right. And he's like, when Jesus comes back and we receive our new bodies, all of that's being made right. All the things you thought were unretrievable, oh, they're retrievable.

Yeah. And even the death takes away everything, his resurrection gives you everything. Everything is better than what you thought. and there'll be no more fear of death because, I mean, how else could he have proven that? And then that exactly what it says in Hebrews. We need to take a break. By the way, welcome to the podcast. Can you tell we're excited?

Oh, we already started? Can you tell we're excited about this? Dad launched us right in. So welcome to Unashamed. Let's take our first break. So, yeah, you're right. It says so powerful. And I was saying that verse in Hebrews that says, was Hebrews two that says he is destroyed.

the one who holds the power over death. And even though we know Satan still around. What it gives you no doubt, your allegiance to God, his death, peril, resurrection. What's what you're left with is, it's good. Yeah. It makes you feel good. Yeah. And it makes you live better, even knowing this.

And isn't that ironic because you would think if someone had come up with a way that makes you invincible because you know you're going to be resurrected, then you would debase to the worst things of humanity, take advantage of people because you were invincible. But it does just the opposite when it comes to Christ. You become a servant. You become one that helps other people. I watch someone would check it, but see how much or how many times the word hope is. If that's all you live, if that's everything you live for, but if hope is there, it's a wonderful thing. I think that's what's interesting about the king. Let's talk about the kingdom too, is that it's, it is a message of hope.

It's a message. Yep. I mean, we talk a lot about that it's also embodied that. That's the kind of this, the concept of that it's already here, but it's not yet. It's kingdom here, kingdom now, kingdom come. I mean, it's, it's, it's, and so for, you know, it, there, there, there is an eternal significance of what's happening now. There's deliverance now here on planet Earth. But, I mean, all of us can say that I've been a Christian for over 20 something years and, and God has changed me and transformed me tremendously in that time period.

But even with that, that transformation, there's still this longing. And so, I mean, so there's still this message for the people that, like, all of us that, Jay's talked about that. all things are retrievable and redeemable in God's time at the second coming in that when we're in glory. I mean, I think that is a huge, that is a hope and that we hang on to. And it should permeate our personalities.

It should permeate our dispositions. And I think that's one of the things we push back on some of the hyper political, the hyper political stuff. It's not that we don't think the kingdom's political in some sense, because God's king of everything, including our politics. But when things are bad, when the earth is supposed to be falling apart, you know, man, we're not the first generation that could say that. I mean, you go back to the second war war and you think about when the Holocaust was happening and I mean, there's the whole

world is at war. I mean, you would think, man, this is the end of all of it. I mean, you would think that. And so we're not the first generation to be in a position to think, man, the world's going to hell in a hand basket. But I think the message of the kingdom is, man, there's hope for rice. Yeah. To answer dad's question, Maddie just looked it up 130 times, Dad. I was looking. In the King James, it was 130 times that it's mentioned, which shows you that is the core.

And I'll give you a perfect example. Think about it. If this is not true, there is no hope, wow. No. And just this last week, a dear friend of mine, Isaac Day, who was a huge inspiration in my life, he came along at a time when I was in ministry and a little bit dry, kind of in that valley of dry bones and needed someone to remind me why I was doing what I was doing. And a lot of times it happens to pastors and preachers. And he was just like a lightning boat that came into my life.

He came here. He was from the Gambia. And he just inspired me because he was working in a country that was 96% Muslim, you know, and yet he's in there talking about Jesus. And I thought, man, I mean, what am I doing complaining about my little cushy setup? And so we became, came friends, and this last week, he crossed over. And the last four years of his life, he suffered greatly. I mean, with something we could not figure out. I mean, he went to more doctors, did more tests. He just, he was stricken by something that nobody could figure out what the answer was. But, I mean, he and I and our conversations over the last four years were, that's why we look forward to being made complete and whole in the resurrection, no matter what happens in this life.

And so I just saw this, you know, dynamo for Christ really just being a shell for four years until now he's awaiting the resurrection. But it inspires me. And I thought this week I thought, I don't grieve like men who have no hope. And you have a dear friend like that. And look, he's only 61 or two. He's just a little bit older than me. But I realize. A good shape.

A great shape. I mean, you wouldn't look at him telling anything was wrong with him. But he was, my personal belief is, is the evil one struck him with something. It was Job-esque. that eventually led to his demise. They did a dedication video yesterday. Yeah, I heard about that. Oh, it was me.

And I saw the video, yeah. And I, you know, I cried when I watched it, but I wasn't here, but I saw it. And he's a tremendous man. And we've talked about him before. If you Google him sometime, you can see some of our videos and stuff we've done on Isaac. Tremendous man and his family is amazing. Dad and I support a school that now is a legacy school for, you know, what he started there in Liberia. But my point is, I didn't like, I didn't spend all week just like depressed because I understand the resurrection.

I know that the totality of a man's life that gives it to God, just like Isaac did, that we're going to be in heaven. Whatever that looks like, you know, heaven and earth together, the new heaven, the new earth, it's going to be exciting. I mean, we're going to have conversations again. So that's the way you have to view life. And I think people say, well, it doesn't seem like we're winning when that happens. we're still in a situation where, you know, the evil one takes him out if it was. Right. Joe Bess.

But other people rise up. And what we do is dangerous. You know, I've done multiple dangerous things. You know, I shared Jesus to a group of people when I ran. And after I finished, you know, our good friend Larry Bowles said, I'm sure you went up on a bulletin board somewhere. You know, and I kind of laughed, but then I thought, ooh. I mean, I'm looking around behind me.

That's right. Okay, what does this mean? But I think you're right. I wanted to make a point about what Zach said about the politics. Because, you know, N.T. Wright had an interesting illustration. Not illustration. He did this. He was teaching a group of 12-year-olds at their Sunday school.

And he asked him, why did Jesus die? And he said he was fascinated that half of the answers, and it didn't matter male or female. He just said it broke into two categories. Half of the answers were, well, and they went a historical view. The Romans via the Jews, they killed him because they thought he was a threat. They thought he was a threat to their politics, which was very, he was surprised at how intelligent an answer it was. And he said, then the other half was basically what they had heard in Sunday school,

which, so we could go to heaven. Die for our sins. Yeah, died for our sins. And so he said he was really intrigued by that. And so what he then discussed with him is that, because the one thing they didn't talk about was from Jesus' perspective or God's perspective. And that's what we've kind of been talking about, this difference in him dying and him having to die. God having a plan for humans that was bigger than, just a rescue, but it was more of a rescue and hope being given, and then to use the same people

for his purpose, to be the mouthpiece and ambassadors and the kingdom on earth, doing these kind of things, going into places after the tragedy happens, and looking for ways to show compassion and the love of God. And meanwhile, sharing Jesus, and you take somebody like Isaac Day, that's a picture of that. I mean, he's in a place that was in desperate. need of hope in Jesus. And he's not getting anything out of it. Oh, no. Very humble surroundings.

Living a rough life for the kingdom. Yeah. And I feel that same way about Larry Bowles, who, you know, spends huge amounts of his time on earth in places that are just, oh, difficult. There's no comforts whatsoever, but he's doing it because he believes that we're representatives of the king. Yeah. That's exactly right.

and that we can make a difference. Let's take another break. I wanted to say this about when you mentioned about there was a power struggle here in this with the Romans and the Jews. But there was an interesting article written by C.S. Lewis was called Equality. And he made this quote. He said, you know, and it was in before I read the quote, he was saying, we all love democracy.

He said, don't get me wrong. And he had a quote that said, democracy, though, is medicine, not food. And he presented a case because we all want to bow to something. And, you know, because when we think about what Jesus is representing here, he is representing a monarchy that he's the king. Correct. And people are like, well, I don't, nobody's going to tell me what to do. I'm free.

And we all love democracy. see. But if you agree with C.S. Lewis, and I do, that you're going to bow to something. You're going to serve something. And in that light, being humans as we are, Jesus is the ultimate king. He's the only time that you want to say, in that, I'm going with a monarchy. Because Jesus was innocent. He was imperishable. He has the best interest of us at heart. Because that's the problem with monarch. If you get the wrong king in there, what happened? Well, America happened. America happened because we had a king who was trying to take all of our money. And so we rebelled.

You're right, because when it comes to earthly kings and earthly kingdoms, we're always going to wind up in that place. And even if you have three or four in a row that are fantastic, trust me, number five is going to come along and he's going to be terrible. And that's what's going to happen. Yeah, I think that's a great point, though, Jayes, because I think what we typically come into this discussion as if we're blank slates in a vacuum, but you have to keep in mind that you will worship something.

I mean, you can't not worship. And that is a, you can't. I mean, we were built that way. It's part of what we are, you know, one of the greatest philosophers of our time, Bob Dylan said, you got to serve somebody, you know. And so, I mean, it's, it's, you're, we're. We're going to serve somebody. You got us.

Well, I brought that up because the last verse, since we've been given an overview for two podcasts about this chapter, when they get to 51, now we're, we've all the, we've gone all the way. He's appeared. I mean, they, they've dealt with their, their doubts. He's come back. He's eating fish. Mary tells Tom, look at my hands and my feet. I mean, he's given all these proofs. And I love how this ends because in 51 it says while he was blessing them, he left them and was taken up to heaven, which is this king of kings being enthroned, where he's still enthroned today.

Then they worshipped him and returned to Jerusalem with great joy and they stayed continually at the temple, oddly enough, praising God. But for these groups of people to do this based on their heritage and their traditions and not liking, to Keller's point, not liking the fact that he had to die. And that's where I was going with that. We're human beings are all about likes and dislikes. And look, I don't like it. When I watched the passion for the first time, I didn't like it. I didn't like that our Savior and Lord was being punished and tortured. and it was just so uncomfortable for me.

You felt horrible because you knew it was happening because of you. Exactly. And because of me. You know, and it's just hard to watch. And we don't like it, which is why I'm giving the disciples. The reason they were having trouble with that, I think they loved Jesus, but they didn't like that this was the plan. And so they just didn't want to go there in their mind.

And they were so stricken and emotional. because they were with him very intimately for three years. They just didn't think about what he said about him coming back. They just didn't like the way it played out. And again, back to what we talked about in the last podcast, the organic nature of this human response of the women, of the disciples, of everybody involved in the story. And if we just went right into the book of Acts,

we'd see it continue to unfold this idea. and you see the results that began to happen. And look, we're all here. We're having this podcast. We're talking about this in 2024 because it still has the same impact on us. I mean, we're 2,000 years removed from this story that we're reading. And yet still. Peace of mind is a rare commodity.

That's exactly right. Peace of mind. Peace of mind. I love this story that comes up next or a kind of continuation of it. they're on the road to Amas. I want to read it. Yeah, read the whole story, Zach. Let me jump in.

Let's take a break. All right, welcome back. Zach, it's going to read the road to Amaya's story, because I'm sure we'll be talking about this, the rest of today as well as their next podcast. Yeah, I'll read the first part. And then if y'all want to continue past it, because there is a part at the end that I think is so powerful of their response in

verse 32 after having all this encounter with Jesus, what they said. but verse 13 of Luke 24. That very day, two of them were going into a village named Amaeus, about seven miles from Jerusalem, and they were talking with each other about all the things that had happened. And while they were talking and discussing together, Jesus himself drew near and went to them,

but their eyes were kept from recognizing him. And he said to them, what is this conversation that you're holding with each other as you walk? and they stood still looking sad. Then one of them said, one of them named Cleopus answered him, are you the one visitor, are you the only visitor in Jerusalem who does not know the things that have happened here in these days? Like, I mean, some big just went down.

Where have you been? Is what he was saying. And he said to them, what things? And they said to him, concerning Jesus of Nazareth, a man who was a prophet, that mighty and deed and word before God and all the people,

and how our chief priest and rulers delivered him up to be condemned to death and crucified him. But we had hoped that he was the one to redeem Israel. Yes, and besides all this, it is now the third day since these things happened. Moreover, some women of our company amazus, they were at the tomb early in the morning, and when they did not find his body, they came back saying that they had, that they had even seen a vision of angels who said that he was alive. Some of those who were with us went to the tomb and found it just as the women had said, but him they did not see.

And he said to them, O foolish ones and slow of heart to believe all the prophets have spoken, was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory? And beginning with Moses and all the prophets he interpreted to them, in all the scriptures, the things concerning himself. I mean, I read that, and I'm like, the first thing, in my Bible I have, verse 21, they accurately diagnosed the problem in verse 21 when they said, we had hoped that he was the one to redeem Israel. Yes, and besides all this, it's the third, basically he's still dead.

Yeah. And you know it's past tense, so they thought it was done in spite of what they heard, because he goes on later and says, you know, man, they're saying maybe he's not gone, but they didn't, they had already, they had already given their true belief about the situation because they said we had hoped. Now, obviously, you know these folks, these two disciples are at least a part of the entourage. They're not the 11. And we'll find that out at the end of this. But they are part of the. the group that's been there for most of his, you know, ministry. And so they've, because he kept our women and some of our companions. And so you see they've had a front row seat to this whole situation. And they're amazed by it and trying to figure it out. But still, to dad's point, this whole time we've been discussing this, they still aren't quite seeing it.

Yep. Which I was, you know, I grew up thinking, I grew up thinking this, I don't know where I got this from, but I hear it in church all the time. It was like you would, anytime you'd mention something out of the Old Testament, they would, oh, that's the Old Testament.

And they would literally say that that doesn't apply. Doesn't apply. You know, and part of that is they get from like Jesus canceled the written code, nailed to the cross. And, and, you know,

part of that is, I understand where they're coming from, but to say it doesn't apply is, it's to kind of fly in the face of what Jesus is saying here. I mean, think about this response that Jesus, Jesus gives when they said, because he was responding to what they're saying, which is basically we thought Jesus was going to be the hope for Israel.

He was going to be the one to redeem Israel, and now he's dead. It's been three days. He's still in the grave. I wouldn't know where he's at. I mean, he's obviously not alive. And Jesus does not say to them, oh, don't worry about the Old Testament, Israel stuff. That doesn't apply. This is what it was really about.

He doesn't say that. In fact, he goes, he doubles down on it when he says, oh, foolish ones and slow in heart to believe, not, you didn't say believe me. He said, believe all that the prophets has spoken. So he's pointing back to the Old Testament prophets and says, you never understood what they were talking about. Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things that enter into his glory? If you had read the prophets, if you understood the prophets is what he's saying, then you

would know that this was what always was the plan. This was what was prophesied about. And when he when he kind of doubles down in kind of his teaching to them in that moment, it says he began with Moses and all the prophets. And he interpreted to them all the scriptures and all the scriptures the things concerning himself. I mean, he is not abolishing and getting rid of the Old Testament. What he's doing here is he's saying, I mean, he's not using the New Testament to prove himself because that doesn't exist. yet. He's actually using Old Testament scriptures to tell them, yeah, what you thought I was

the Redeemer of Israel? You were correct. I am the Redeemer of Israel. Where you were wrong is you didn't understand how it was going to take place. That's what they got wrong. They got the first part right, second part wrong. The same message that's in the last couple of pages of Luke, I've noticed something. One thing is always there when I'm pointing out Jesus' death, his burial, the resurrection,

how it all happened. He loves you. This is what is written. Christ will suffer and rise from the dead on the third day. And repentance and forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations. you're a witness of these things. So the one thing I've noticed about human beings,

and most people don't realize this, what happens every time, every time, whether it be two or three or four or five, the more, the more it happens. You know what I see? When I tell this story, I see tears without fail.

When they hear this message, Rank and Fowl, 2040 years, you say, what do you notice about it? Tears. Tears coming forth from their eyes. Right. 99.9% of the time. And you think about it, Dad, why would... I just tell them the story and show it to them.

If it was just history, would it have that sort of effect? It would have to be more than just history. I mean, I'm watching them cry before me. me every time we start walking toward that baptismal pool and we start wading out in there the tears start over and over and over well think about this phil i mean that that's exactly kind of what happens here uh the language is a little different but you you see it here when they when jesus explains to them through the scriptures what had to happen on some level they they got it on some level because they were in verse 28 says they drew near to the village in which they were going

and he acted as if he was going further, but they urged him strongly to stay with us, for it is towards evening, and the day is now far spent. So I can only imagine that they were here in Jesus, because they didn't know his Jesus yet. So they're talking to him, and he's explaining to them from the Old Testament,

what had to happen. So on some level, I think they may have got, on some level, intellectually, that, oh, okay, wait, there's like a glimmer of hope, So you kind of see their hope glowing. So he went and stayed with them. And when he sat at the table with them,

he took the bread, which is, you know, reminiscent of the last supper, right? And he broke it. He blessed it and he gave it to them. And verse 31,

and their eyes were open. And they recognized him. And he vanished from their sight. And I love this. This is the verse. I think this is so powerful, Phil, what you're saying to.

And they said to each other, did not our hearts burn within us while he talked with us on the road and while he opened to us to scriptures. Yep. That's the thing you're talking about. It is a burning of the heart. It is. That's correct.

When you've had that encounter with the Holy Scriptures concerning Jesus, if you've had that encounter with him, the best way to describe it is a burning of the heart. I've noticed that every time I take a little group down there, tears begin to flow. Because it hits every aspect of who we are. Let's take our last break. Well, yesterday after the worship service, and I didn't get up and shout that I was alive, but I was thinking it. There was a guy who, as soon as I turned around to exit, to your point, Phil, just tears were streaming down his face. Yep.

And, yeah, I hugged him. I didn't know who he was. And he said, I'm from Indiana. And his wife had just died. 38 years, I think, they'd been married. And I was like, what are you doing here? He's like, well, I've been listening to that podcast, and my wife just died. And, you know, tears were just flowing.

And I was just listening because I didn't really know what to say in the moment. But what I put together is, is no matter who you are, to go back to the point I was making about Keller about we all have loved ones and we all want to be loved, where else are you going to go that is historical, that has this much evidence, that is this powerful, that has an answer for his dilemma. And so that was the connection. You know, it's Jesus. I think it's uncomfortable for a lot of people when Jesus gets to the end here,

because the last verse you read that he said, beginning with Moses, the prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the scriptures concerning himself. Then he doubles down on that in verse 44 when it says, this is what I told you while I was with you. Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the law of Moses, the prophets, and the Psalms. So people are like, he's saying, this is all about me. And so I, I think as believers, we have a question that comes, is this about me or is it about him? And obviously, this is about him.

Even the first John passage when it says, this is love, not that we love him, but that he loved us and gave himself up for us. But a lot of people view that in the scholarly world as controversial. Because they're like, well, are you saying the whole Bible was about Jesus? and I'm of the camp that I say, yeah. Absolutely. When you start looking at these prophets from Ezekiel, you know, being the watchman, and then in Ezekiel 33 and kind of setting the stage for your heart, are you going to do what God says or not?

I mean, who do you think that's in mind of? Then he gets to chapter 37, you know, he sees this vision of all these dead bones, and he asks a great question, can these bones live? Well, who is that in picture of? Yep. That one day Jesus would come back to life. So I know why that guy got in his vehicle, because Missy said when we got home, because she sat there for about 30 seconds and kept moving, you know,

because this guy was, I mean, just his whole heart was being poured out. And I said, well, babe, he knows that Jesus is the center of our podcast. He's listened to it for years. That's right. He just lost his wife. He said, I'm getting in my truck, and I'm going to be with people that I know, believe what I believe. Yes, he needed that same moment we talked about earlier. It didn't matter how far it was.

You know, Indiana is a long way from Louisiana. Yeah. I was like, this is why we believe that Jesus was raised. This is it. You're not thinking about, oh, how much gas this is going to cost, what am I going to do for my job? You know, this is, if there's a chance that this man is going to be resurrected with his wife, you do radical things. Yeah. And so in our story, you kind of have to ask yourself a practical question.

Are you on the road to Amas or are you on the road back to Jerusalem, which we haven't got to? But once their hearts burned, it says they got up at once or hurriedly, as some say, to Jerusalem. And when you do the math on what time of day, and it was seven miles, that's where this started. They had already asked Jesus to stay with them because it's dangerous. It's at night. Dangerous. They're now running wide open at night through thickets, thorns. I've been to Israel. It's not a place you want to go running at night. They're tripping, fall, and you say, what happened? They saw the resurrected Lord. They got it. They're like, this whole thing was about him. We can live again. And from this moment on, all the way through the book of Acts, you know what the number

one message was from these people's mouths? The resurrection of Jesus. Go read the book of Acts. They talk about it more even than the cross, which we're not saying the cross is not important. But when it changed their life, they went to doing things that were radically crazy, like running seven miles through a thicket. And they're understanding that I love this because it wasn't like they had a framework inside of, I've already mentioned this several times. They didn't have a framework that was empty that Jesus built. It was like, but Jesus came with a whole new paradigm in this moment.

I mean, what they thought, when they thought the hope for Israel, I mean, think about what that meant to them. That was a very small. They were thinking way too small. the hope of Israel was way bigger than anything that they could have ever comprehended. I think they literally were set on fire. And I was thinking about, like, when you talk about, like, the apologetics of all this, and I love that stuff.

I mean, I've gotten into it pretty deep over the years. And, but I'm going to tell you something. Like, that ministers to me the historical evidences of Jesus and his resurrection and all that. And I love, I'm not diminishing that at all. But I'm telling you that there is something in me that, is more fundamental to who I am than just intellectual curiosity and needing intellectual satisfaction. It's important. I'm not diminishing it, but there's something more real in me that's more prominent of who I am than that.

And it is the inner longing of my heart for true purpose, meaning, and transcendence. Like that, that's what's in me. That's what's in all of us. We're all, like, looking for that thing. And I think what's happening here in this moment is we're looking for presence. And Jesus is actually, he's vindicating all of that. And it's more powerful than anything that you could ever comprehend. It's the thing that, well, it wasn't just an intellectual understanding that made their hearts burn.

It was a spiritual awakening that happened when Jesus opened their eyes up. And they realized that, oh, my goodness, wait, I had no idea. how big this was, that all they could do is just burst forth in excitement and action. I've got to be a part of this. And they weren't even, I mean, it just, it was flowing out of it. And again, back to the, what we've been talking about, the organic nature of it, Jesus does this in Luke's account before he then appears, which we'll talk about on next podcast, to the 11.

But again, that doesn't seem like the way we would think of the story, right? you'd go to the 11 first. But no, he goes to these two who had been sort of the outer, not part of the inner circle, but a little bit further outer circle. And their hearts are burning. And then they come and tell with 11, setting up him up here into them, which is. It's actually the personal side of it. I mean, the fact, look, when I first came to Christ,

one of the most profound verses to me was the fact that he ate fish again. because I would always use that as, well, I better get what I can here because I love eating fried fish. I mean, here, he, you know, one of the first things he does after he's raised is he starts eating fish. It just, it just overwhelm me. I thought, no, I'm telling you, I'm in on this. It was practical. It was retrievable. It was something that I could do with my loved ones.

And I thought, this makes way more sense to me not being the brightest bulb, you know, as far as, intellectual, I just thought if there's a way, you know, to duck hunt and to eat fish and to get my family back and to have these moments. Yeah, this little much that Keller came up with, a moral outsider, that's a thief who believed, a racial outsider, centurion who believed, a social outsider, woman at the tomb, women at the tomb, two insider, Joseph and John, Jewish religious leaders. who became like servant, who were doing the job of a service. That's exactly right. And yet they were leadership.

All right, we're out of time. I got one quote we can end with. All right. I've heard it attributed to John Wesley, but they asked him, everywhere you go, revival breaks out, and movements of renewal break out.

And they said, what's your secret? And he said, I catch on fire, and people come to watch me burn. I thought that's it. I hope he said it because that's awesome. That's fantastic.

All right, so we'll pick this up. We're at the end of Luke, Luke 24 on the next Unashamed podcast. We'll see you there. Thanks for listening to The Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click that little bell to get notified about new episodes. And for even more content that you won't get anywhere else,

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