Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 883 | Jase Is Disturbed by Weird Things People Eat & Phil Disses a New Jersey Delicacy

Episode Date: May 8, 2024

Phil experiences the wondrous culinary journey of Italian and Cajun fusion, but there’s one New Jersey staple that the guys are not so sure about. Jase has had some memorable and queasy moments with guests at the dinner table, and the guys consider how Phil’s life changed from being full of R-rated scenes to being full of grace and devotion. Zach compares today’s society to that of ancient Greece and Rome and finds that even our liberal culture would be embarrassed by what went on then. The guys emphasize the need for a spirit of confession among church leaders and what “heaven” actually means. In this episode: 1 John 2, verse 1; Romans 8, verse 34; Hebrews 1, verse 3; Hebrews 4; Hebrews 9, verses 24-26; Hebrews 10, verses 12-14; Hebrews 12, verse 12 -- Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashame. We are in our throes of a study of the book of Acts, and I'm still in town because we're waiting on our big wedding that I mentioned in the last podcast tonight, which we're excited about. Dad, who's doing the wedding? I'm doing the wedding. Oh, Al, you're, you've turned into a preacher.

I have. I said, I preached two Sundays in a row. I spoke at CR. I'm doing a wedding. So I felt like I told my former staff at our church this week that I felt like I was back. Are you paying yourself to do the wedding? No, this is the thing about it. Everything I've done this week, and it's been pretty grueling, I get only the blessings of the Lord Almighty.

Yeah. No money. I keep your message authentic. It does. That's right. And I love it. It's just like I made the, when I told the mosquito joke in the last podcast, I told you I said, I would have probably never done that had I been on the payroll.

Yeah, because what are they going to do? You offend someone. Now I'm just like, you know, you can't fire me. There's a danger, Al. Oh, yeah, you get a little more frisky, no doubt about it. I was saying that we were your mic up a little bit. I have a great person being married. It is your great granddaughter, but what you have now is the potential after today of having

great, great grandchildren in your lifetime. That's right. It's a very high possibility because Robertsons are fruitful. So it would be if they have a baby before Phil leaves this earth, it'll be a great. Great, great. A great, great. A double great. You don't see that very often.

You don't see six generations. You don't see six generations on the planet. You got to hang in there, Dad. Yeah. So one good thing, Dad, you and I got to experience. So last night we did a little rehearsal, which is not really, we don't, they don't have like people other than them doing the wedding, which is very nice. So we just did a little walkthrough of what we're going to do tonight.

But we did it over at Jersey Joe's house. And Jersey Joe is quite the Italian cook. He's Italian, obviously. And he, so he did. He made his own Italian sausage. Bacon wrapped alligator. Alligator. Duck, chicken, jalapinos, and shrimp.

It was a spread. And one, you're talking about it in. one thing. Yeah. Well, those, those were the appetizers were all the

bacon wrap deals. Then he made homemade sausage that he cased himself. He did meatballs. He did Ziti. I mean,

it was a spread. How was the alligator? It was good. I just, you know, it's a little chewy for me, so I'm just not a big fan.

It's just a little bit tough. I've never, you know, alligator meat is. His roots came from the rome, the power of Rome. His ancestors, that's where they came from.

And you know, we're going on a little trip. It's turned into a honeymoon trip, but we're actually, he's never been to Italy. So we're going to fly over and we're going to do a cruise. Joe and Christine, Lisa and I, the newlyweds, so it'll be their honeymoon in a few weeks. And we're going to go to Italy. He's going to get to touch base with this.

Well, you are breaking ground. I would never think that you would go on your honeymoon. with my grandchildren and with his child. I never knew that the Romans could provide that kind of food. Kind of grub. Oh, I mean, he's into it, I mean, big time. Yeah. Well, we've been throwing them onto the bus for all this, you know, sleeping with snakes and embracing the great gods.

They were missing the good qualities. Now, yeah, they have good food. Dad used to always say that. All we got out of the Romans were good pizzas and shotguns. You used to say that day. Now we could add more to that. But it was interesting. They were talking about this.

You get different things from different regions. So they kept, so Christine's dad, Joe's wife, kept talking about this drink. It's called Boost. Now, as soon as I say that, people up in the Northeast, they're going to, oh, he's talking about Boost. Or maybe it's just a Jersey thing. They kept talking about this drink. And I said, boost. And so he had brought him some, because they brought him like some of their favorite

Jersey things. And they're telling me about it. And I said, well, is it like boost? It's like an energy drink, you know, because everybody's in the energy. No, it's not really energy. It was made by a pharmacist originally to help with your stomach. And it's some kind of syrup. But then they started just adding water to it.

And it's a drink that people in Jersey love. They all loved it. I said, well, what does it taste like? He said, kind of like a flat, Pepsi. I said, Joe, if I had the flat Pepsi, we pour that out. We would start over. Like, that's, that's gone. That's, that can't be saying. So, so they said, don't know. I continue to try it. I said, do you have some? And so Christine pours me a glass of it. I take a sip of it. I was like, you're right. It's flat Pepsi. And I don't know how, in what universe can this be good? But I said, do you, and I'm going around the room. Do you? And I'm going around the room. you like this all these people juries i love this and they had brought him like a big old bottle of it i just shows you the mind the human mind is a dangerous thing i said christine do you like that i mean i just kept being shocked and they were like as joey said joey you like boost love it and i was like who loves

flat pepsi because i google it and it comes up with like an insurer thing like like a like a milk you know like the yeah they pour they add it to milk too they said well i'm looking at the but i'm looking at the I said I re-google it with boost New Jersey and this is what it says this new jersey made drink tastes like flat coke and we can't get enough of it apparently you apparently you got enough i got one sip was enough for al well since i haven't been on google lately i'll google the mind and uh i remember a woman that used to go to phil's house church i'm going back 30 years here and Phil and Kay, what they used to do is they had this big iron skillet. And whenever they would cook like bacon or, well, they'd usually save that.

So it was a bad example. They'd save the bacon grease. But they would put their scraps in one pot. And when it got full. For the dogs. Yeah, they would feed it to the dogs. So we were having house church. They would cook.

Well, there was a woman over there digging. I noticed it. But I thought, hmm. I thought she was getting. the scrap pile to go feed her dogs. Well, then to my surprise, she asked my mom if she could get the recipe on whatever that was. I remember. And that proved to me that day that humans given on the situation, they literally will eat

anything and love it. When you're eating the two-week scrap pile saying, you know, it just, and that y'all, And y'all used to just pour like oil in there, whatever oils you had used and all the scraps for the dogs and said, boy, what is the recipe for this? That's funny. It just happened in my house recently. Alex was over there, and it was a skill. At least it did the exact same thing. At least it was that night's meal.

But she was just putting all the pork chop bones and all that in there to give to the dogs. And Alex is in there. She's gnawn on it. And I walk in. said, what are you eating? She said, well, I'm eating these pork chops. I said, hey, that's, we were giving those to the dolls. Hey, we all, we've already eaten those sports chops.

She's just, she's filed. They were like, pork chop extras, like the part that didn't have meat. Welcome to our world. That makes me kind of want to gag right now. That's kind of nasty. I'm still stuck on this boost. I'm looking at, I mean, this is incredible. I still searching.

You can only get it in a certain area. It started out of... Yeah. Well, actually, someone there, someone that's now going to be in my family, my marriage, their grandfather invented it. He was the pharmacist that invented Boost. And like I said, it had medicinal qualities to begin with. So actually, it must be a much more narrow band than I imagine.

I thought maybe it was a North East. It's just a South Jersey. That's the difference in me and y'all is when I hear somebody say, you want to try something called Boost. I'm thinking that's either medicinal or recreational, as in there's something in here that will make you see strange sights and laugh a lot. You've got to be careful. I would just drinking things you don't really know.

Well, I mean, he said you can't knock it until you try it. I said, all right, well, let me try it. I said, right before I drink it, and I said, now after I drink this, can I knock it if I don't like it? I don't want to finish it. To Jason's point, though, to Jason's point, I'm reading, this is the article I just pulled up, the Philadelphia, the Philadelphia Inquire, a flat, thick, weird tasting soda, you'll only find in Jersey. And then here's the quotation, this is our crack. So they're acknowledging that there's an addictive quality to whatever this thing is. I can tell you one person who is not addicted to it.

That's this guy right here, because flat Pepsi is not doing it for me. Well, we don't need to get into brand endorsements here. Yeah. Well, there's a verse in the Bible that says, do not get, do not drink much boost. Oh, sorry, it says wine. Be filled with the spirit. Speak to one another.

Psalms, hymns, and spirituals. But there's also a verse where Paul tells Timothy, you need a little wine. You need a little boost for your stomach. Tush. That's what it was in the book for. Which is good. So everything.

Are we in the Bible still? What are we doing? Everything in moderation. That's the thing. Everything in moderation. So I'll report to you on the next podcast. Which came from either the Stoics or the Epicureans, which was their motto. Yeah.

Which is just do everything in moderation and you'll be okay. So I'm just saying, you know, I would take that saying in moderation. Which is true. Don't become addictive. That's what you don't want to do. All right. So we're, yes, Zach, we are in the book of Acts. We left off with Lydia's conversion in Philippi,

and Jace was giving us a little historical, a surprisingly in-depth historical view of the city of Philippi. It was a thumbnail, but I think you'll be interested, which I'm trying to get Zach, he's the movie mogul, make a movie about that. Those are two of the biggest subjects ever. I do like the idea. I love the idea.

in between the podcast, just so the audience will know what we were discussing is how, because this is going to be rated R, no matter which way we slice it. I mean, you're talking about some, so we've got to figure that part out. Well, you don't figure it out, Zach. I read the encyclopedia. The encyclopedia is rated R. But it helps you understand the context of what God's power can do because he sent the whole Spirit sent them there.

Right. And you're thinking there wasn't even a synagogue there. You know why? Because they were all into the occult and any kind of sexual perversion. We're talking about Alexander the Great here. Look at the history. But, Zach, I've got full confidence in you as a filmmaker because dad's story was a rated our story.

And you told it well, but you did it with enough subtle tricks to where we got them. implication of things that went on without actually having to see what went on. So it can be done. You pulled it off on our film. James made a good point. I don't think he said this in the last podcast, but you did say something in between the last podcast and the start of this one, which we need. There's some good conversations in between the in-between podcast conversation. But you had mentioned that could be another, the whole podcast of you used to make a note on that.

They make a note. But you has said something to the effect of. You think it's bad now. It would, like, we're talking about wickedness that would make even the worst of what we are experiencing here culturally now. We would, we would blush at what was happening here. And I like that. I like that you pointed that out because a lot of times we get so doom and gloom in our society. So much worse now there.

Yeah, so much worse. It's the end of everything. And then you, you read about, like, Paul going into, like, the worst of the worst place. of just all kind of, you know, pagan revelry and, and just sexual deviancy and witchcraft, all, just all the things. And that was where the gospel was being preached. And that's where the seed of the gospel was being planted. And that's where the gospel was, that the kingdom was growing. And so I think that that's encouraging for me because you think, man, oh, it's so bad, so bad.

Now, look, even in the darkest of darks, God's kingdom is still present, and we could still go in and fold our kingdoms underneath his kingdom in these dark places, and we can see God move because it's happening right here. You know, it's happening in places that you would not expect it to happen. Let's take our first one. Well, that was my point. All of our conversions are from rated R to D. Yeah.

I mean, that's what they are. Yeah. You read 1st. John 1 says, if we confess our sins, then it's right. rated R. It doesn't say that, but it says if we confess our sins, it would be. He is faithful and just and will forgive us. So that's why you see churches that try to act like they've never sinned.

I mean, you don't want to. Right. Because you're like, we don't want to get into that. So when you see churches, you know, like where we were at yesterday, obviously there's a lot of rated R things that have gone on and a lot of new Christians there. and it just doesn't look like a stiff, stuffy place, because these people have just transitioned into, and what I meant by R to G is G is grace.

Yeah. It is for all audiences, but God's grace is what covers us up. Yeah, and which that was really the whole thrust of my sermon yesterday because I was in that fantastic text in Hebrews 2, 14 through 18, where Jesus became us and was, and faced everything we face so that he could be a merciful and grace-oriented high priest and help us through everything and anything.

And so it kind of really cap, mine and yours kind of a three-week run here in Hebrews 1 and 2, that the reason Jesus is so much greater is because he's one of us who then sacrificed himself to make us like him. I mean, that's really, and the angels don't get that. And as we go forward, Hebrews, all the other things. So nothing else compares to that, which is what else we get to.

I mean, you look at what's happening here in Acts, and you think, because I think our temptation is to say, well, we need to package the gospel in a certain way. We need to make it. We were just having this conversation, too, in the in-between podcast, about how, what lengths that we will go to to make the gospel, and I have air quotes here palatable for culture. Yeah. And we've got to do all these things. but then you're looking at what we're reading here,

and you have, these guys are in jail. They're converting the jailer. The Philippian jailer is converted in Acts chapter 16. You have, like, they're in dark places that, they're not in the places where the gospel would be palatable at all, and it's in those places that it's happening. And I think that that, we have to remember that it is the Holy Spirit's reception, responsibility, and it's the Holy Spirit's power that will advance the church and that will

advance the gospel and that will make the kingdom of God known. It's not, it's not our abilities, it's not our strategy, it's not our intelligence, it's not our charisma. It is the Holy Spirit. And so what we're wanting to do is just get underneath what his move is and to live there. And I was thinking about this at House Church of the night, there's a girl that is coming to faith. She, for the first time, I mean, when she first started coming to our church, I mean, she was completely withdrawn, was coming with her dad in college, and over the, she's been watching everybody.

And over the last probably year and a half, I've watched her inch closer and closer and closer to the inside of the circle where we have discussion at House Church. And we had talked about confession that verse that Chase just mentioned and also James 516 about confessing your sins to one another. And you know what she said to me that I thought was. so powerful. She said, in front of the whole group, she said, you know, for most of my life, I looked at pastors, the churches I grew up in, and they had it all together. And I, and I held them on this high pedestal. And she said, I always thought to myself, that was the epitome of what

Christianity is. And she said, and I thought in conjunction with that, I can never live up to that. They're too holy. And she said, then when she got older and she realized that everybody was messed up and everybody had issues, she said that. Then I became very angry and I thought they were lying to me the whole time. And if they're lying about their own sin, what else are they lying to me about? Because she had never seen a spirit of confession. So she was on the verge of rejecting the whole thing of Christianity because she had not seen in church leadership a spirit of confession. And I think that this, I know this seems a little off topic, but it's not. Because what leads us to thinking that we can't confess our sins in leadership and in church is that we think that somehow

God's kingdom is going to be made known to people by our abilities instead of by the will of God and by the power of the spirit. We're relying on our own ability and our own strategy. But if that were the case, man, how in the world would the gospel be unfolding right here in this text in a place where they were in prison in a job? jailer is being converted to Christianity, to the living God, to Christ, it is not in some kind of packaged movement that is appealing. It's in the complete opposite of that. And that's why I think you're right, Zay, and that's why you see so many times, to use our

analogy, the rate at our part, talked about in that this is what God did. And like an artful filmmaker that's not wanting to highlight the bad and the sinfulness and take no glory. that when you share honestly some places you were and now what God has done to make you different and change you because of the Holy Spirit, that has an impact on people. And there's so many people. There was a young man that came to me yesterday and he said, you know, I was in the worst possible way, the worst possible place. And someone told me about you guys in your podcast. I started listening and my life has completely changed. He said, I'm a son of God. I've left those old ways.

He said, and now my whole goal in life is to impact people the way you guys have impacted me. And I mean, it was very humbling to hear that. Yeah, what it is. But I knew I was like, this guy now gets it. He's on the track. And he's willing to say, I was in bad places, but this is what God did. And it wasn't us. The four of us are only a conduit of what Christ is done in us.

So let me say, go ahead. This podcast is a prime example of what we're talking about. like this is the most disorganized ragged like that's the time they what we're doing you know but yeah but yeah people like I think it's in this conversation though that people are coming coming to know jesus because it because it's not about what we're saying it's about what we're saying who we're talking about but even in our broken theology our arguments our discussions our ADD or rabbit chasing scroll chasing and whatever. Like, it is, it is in the power of Jesus, by the power of the Holy Spirit, that lives are changed. And I, I mean, we're seeing that unfold, even in a, of, this even is

even an official ministry, but it kind of is a ministry, you know, like God's doing something. Zach, a wise man told me recently, we are the top five podcasts in the world of unique audiences. So that could, that can only, a unique audience can only come from unique individuals. So I'm this close. I'm like an inch close from launching into something that while you were preaching occurred to me. And because it's like Zach is saying there's, you know, it's disorganized. But I just, something hit me yesterday while you were preaching. And it was, it came from a question because everybody asked, you know, because somebody asked me yesterday.

You know, they can, I watch the podcast. What do you think heaven's going to? be like. And I gave the typical answer, but what it made me think of is we're studying this Hebrews and talking about in the context what we're talking about this morning, confessing our sins because, you know, the next verse in 1 John 2 says, we confess our sins because we have one who speaks on our behalf. He's our advocate. He's our mediator. And what was interesting about that verse out and i think since you're since i'm not going to be back up in hebrews i'll just give you a thumbnail of this of while you i was listening with one here and i was reading with my eyes but that's

what people that's what people that present do because i'm the exact same way i'm listening i'm getting what you're saying but i'm also thinking about things that impact me that i want to tell other people so here's and i and i'm also doing the burying thing where i'm like so let me let me let me run this by you then Zach, and this, because this thought hit me yesterday, and I thought, I think we've missed something here. And it came from this, what is heaven, what do you think heaven's going to be like? The statement that hit me when I sat down after I read 1st John 2, where it says, if anybody does sin, verse 1, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense, Jesus Christ, the righteous

one, he is the atoning sacrifice for our sins. But he made that statement in the context of him being. at the right hand of God. Correct. Correct? Well, all of a sudden, I guess my prep, instead in Hebrews, I thought, wait a minute, because I thought Hebrews 1, 3 says, after he provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the majesty in heaven.

So that's what we think. We're like, okay, Jesus died on a cross, then he went to heaven. And they're like, well, I wonder what heaven's going to be like. And I think the better thing to ask is what is heaven like? And I know one thing from what I've already read. Jesus is there on our account. Well, then I read Hebrews 3-1. Therefore, he says,

We who share in the heavenly calling fix your thoughts on Jesus. Well, that's what I'm doing right now. I'm saying, what is heaven like? Jesus is at the right hand. Well, then I read chapter four, and watch where this goes. This is incredible, I thought. Hebrews 4, 10, and 11 says, anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work,

just as God did from His. Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest. Well, then in verse 14, watch what it says. Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has gone into heaven, Jesus, the son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess, for we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are, yet was without sin. Let us then approach the throne of grace with confidence that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.

So I like the point he made in two, 14, to 18. But watch where this goes. So when you read 924, this is where it got really profound to me. You go to 924 and it says, for Christ did not enter a man-made sanctuary that was only a copy of the true one. He entered heaven itself. Now this is the phrase that got me. Now to appear for us in God's presence. nor did he enter heaven to offer himself again and again,

the way the high priest enters the most holy place every year with blood that is not his own. Then Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But now he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself. And in that moment it hit me that Jesus presented himself as a gift in the third. throne room of heaven for us. You know, when you think about the Levitical sacrifices and all that you read it, and you're, you know, the nature of what that was for. And I thought, man, Jesus, he went to heaven itself for us as a sacrifice.

Yep. For what we did wrong. So then I'll conclude with 10, 12, 12. through 14. So chapter 10 says the same basic gist of what we're saying. Verse 12, chapter 10. But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins and sat down at the right hand of God. Since that time he waits for his enemies to be made at his footstool because by one sacrifice, now here's what I love. He has made perfect forever and watch the tents of the, this phrase, those who are being made holy, is still going on.

Yep. People are still recognizing Jesus on a cross his resurrection and that he's there in heaven for them as an advocate. And he's processing people from rated R to G even today. That's right. And so then when it gets to chapter 12, when he says the famous verse, let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him, endured the cross, scorning it shame.

And look what it says again, and sat down at the right hand of God. I've always had what Jesus did on a cross separate as far as forgiveness, atonement, you know, grace, from him going to heaven itself for me, as the sacrifice for the sins of the world. That's why that first John made more sense to me. I thought, why did he bring up the whole world? Because he's at the right hand of God, and it's still available right now.

So my point is when you say that, well, what's heaven going to be like? It's fun to think about what our new bodies are going to be like. But it's way more powerful right now to realize he's alive and well. He's there as your advocate. This is real time grace that's being offered. And you can go from miserable and ruin and no hope in life to all of a sudden you can be confident going before heaven to the throne room.

And get to experience some of that heavenly lifestyle now. Yeah. Because ultimately, if you ask the question, what's heaven going to be like, another good question maybe to ask is why is heaven heaven and the reason why heaven is heaven is because that is where God lives and so where it's union with him and I love what you said there jays too because I think what we tend to do in the church is we default towards a gospel of sin management even in our best efforts like we we tend to go back to a gospel of sin management and we get into a whole lot of questions about right and wrong.

And then we say, oh, we're all going to be surprised. Who's up there when we get? But even our framework is just so small and so linear that we're not understanding what the whole thing's about. Atonement as part of it, yes. But, I mean, that verse you mentioned in 1st John 2, if you look at all of 1st John 2, it begins with Atonement, but it talks a whole lot more about how we abide in Christ. And so he says, my little children, I'm writing these things to you so that you may not sin. But if anyone does sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ, the righteous.

He is the perpetuation for our sin and not only for ours, but also for the sins of the world. And by this, we know that we have come to know him. How? If we keep his commandments. Whoever says, I know him, but does not keep his commandments as a liar and the truth is not in him. So it's not, the gospel is not, what is the least amount that I can do to get into heaven? And then I'm going to do that. Or what's the, give me like the, what's the, what is the minimum threshold?

What is the, give me the limit. Let me have my own autonomy up to that limit. And then everything past that. Whatever that limit is, it gets me into heaven, I'm going to, I'm going to give that to Christ. That's not, that, that is a gospel of sin management. The gospel of Christ is that we are conformed over a lifetime through, what's called sanctification, we are conformed into the image of the sun. We start to become like him. We begin to smell like him. And we start to love what he loves. And that's why this language

of abiding is all throughout 1st John 2. And another thing that's in here is it talks about desire as well, that desires of the world, they fade away over time. And so the call is here's, it's not, hey, give me the minimum threshold to get in so I can go to heaven. What heaven is, it's living in communion with Christ. And by him, we enter into a relationship with the Father's Son and the Holy Spirit. And so that's the thing. And if heaven is heaven because he is there, then that changes the whole trajectory of how I fight sin. I'm not fighting sin so that I can meet the minimum threshold.

I'm fighting sin because sin prevents me from seeing the beauty and the wonder and the greatness and just the beautiful nature of God. So I'm putting sin away not because I'm trying to earn something with him. I want to see what God has prepared me for. I want to live in this union with him and sin prevents me from doing that. It's a different gospel. What Jay's just described through that walk through Hebrews, I saw it visually when I was in school, the school of preaching, when someone showed me a

drawing of first the tabernacle and later temple, physical tabernacle, physical temple. And I looked at that thing and, you know, the outer courts were, even Gentiles could be in the outer part, but they couldn't go in the inner courts because that was reserved for Jewish people, for Israelites. But then the Israelites couldn't go into the holy place, which is where the priest did all the daily sacrifices and all that. And then the priests couldn't go into the most holy place. Only the high priests going there once a year. And they would tie a rope to him just to make sure they could pull him out in case he died.

And that's a physical picture. And so I looked at that. But like Jay's just described, I imagine when Jesus came here, he went through the outer courts, through the inner courts, because he's a God of all, for all. And it had been predicted all through the Old Testament. He went into the holy place as a priest who could offer sacrifices for all of us, and then he went into the most holy place. And at the cross, his death, the temple was ripped into because now, as Jay's described, he's gone back to the right end of the father. And now we all have access all the way in.

But now instead of just a structure on earth, so I saw that visual, this is like, this is the real deal. this isn't just a place here. And so just that visual idea of a funnel going in to now where Jesus is and the opportunity. The only thing we're waiting left is the final resurrection. I mean, but that's the language. That's why these people argue about Jesus dying, you know, at the Passover instead of the day of atonement. Because they get into this, they're like, well, how can that not be the day of atonement? Yeah.

But when you kind of look at this, it does seem to say something about his atoning work at the right hand of God. I think that's the part they're missing. You're not minimizing the cross. Obviously, we had to have the cross, but guess what? Paul said in 1st, Christmas 15, if he would have stayed dead, if there was no resurrection, well, what now? Yeah, we're now. So that's why I think the Atonement, when it said that verse that says he's able to forever make perfect those who are being made holy. And that's why I think we just tend to look at all of this in the past or the future and not look at the present.

That's why I read that when you enter his wrist. It also makes his ascension so crucial to our thing. Yeah, I'm going to quit saying just the death, bell, and resurrection. Ascension, that's right. We'll read Romans 8. You remember where he said in Romans 8? He says the same thing where we're right before the famous verse, well, look, I'm at Romans 8.

That's a sign. He said, who is it, verse 34, that condemns? And that's in response to saying, he who didn't spare his own son, you know, gave him up for us. There's the, how will he not also give us all things? So he's, the judge, good or bad, you know, based on our performance. But then it says, Christ Jesus in verse, where I'm at, 34. who died more than that, more than that, was raised to life, is at the right hand of God,

and is also interceding for us. I mean, why put that in there? Yeah, crucial. You had the question that if he's still in the grave, then the question is, what now? If he's not in the grave, then the question is the same, what now? But now we have an answer to that. And we do have an answer for what do we do now, which is a big, big question. that we fall short on so often when we talk about life post conversion.

I said this before Schaefer had this great analogy in the book on sanctification called True Spirituality, where he says, you know, he said, if you are, you said, we're too obsessed with our birth in the church. He said, can you imagine if every, I think I've said this on the podcast before, but he said, can you imagine if every time you saw me, I pulled out my baby pictures and I talked about the day I was born, you would eventually think they're just time to move on. Like, yes, it was important. Your birth's important because without it, you wouldn't be here.

That's just weird. It's weird. And I think when you mentioned that thing about rest, I was immediately went back to Hebrews 4. Because what's offered to us through the mediating work of Christ is that we have a promise that we can actually enter God's rest. Which, if you think what does that mean? Well, think about the turmoil and how exhausted we all are. I mean, we all, on this side of heaven. But I love this promise here.

Therefore, Hebrews 4-1, therefore, while the promise of entering his rest stands, so there is a promise that we can enter his rest, that stands. Let us fear, let us fear lest any of you should seem to have failed to reach it. For the good news came to us just as to them. He's obviously connecting the good news of Christ with us entering into a place of rest, but the message they heard did not benefit them because they were not united by faith with those who listen. For we who have believed enter that rest, as he said, as I swore in my wrath, they shall not enter my rest. Although his works were finished from the foundation of the world,

for he has somewhere spoken of the seventh day in this way, and God rested on the seventh day from all his work. And again, in this passage, he said, They shall not enter my rest. Since therefore it remains for some to enter it, and those who formerly received the good news failed to enter it because of disobedience, again, he appoints a certain day today, I'm saying through David so long afterward,

and the words already quoted today if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts. I can go on here, but the point is this, is that we are invited to enter a place of rest with God, and that he's made that available not just through the work that Christ did on the cross, but also through the resurrection of Christ after he was buried, and also through the ascension of Christ, and also through the fact that Christ now sits at the right hand of the Father,

and he mediates for us to enter into that rest right now. This is an active thing that is ongoing. Yes, it's finished in the sense that it's paid for, but God is still working to apply that to us through the Holy Spirit. When is the Day of Atonement? You read it. When is this, when can we get this? Oh, you get it today.

Today? Yeah. Oh, I love that. That was my thing. for saying what is heaven life? You can have this today. Right. It's not some folk tale that people have made up and we're going back and you're like,

now how does this work? You can have it today because Jesus is at the right hand of God. And for us as a sacrifice. Yeah, he appointed a certain day. Today. He made an appointment saying that. that. Today, right now, what is heaven like? Well, there is a sacrifice, God in human form, that has presented on your behalf as a gift to be your priest forever and to be your friend.

You remember the Acts, I mean, the Hebrews 2 that you went over. Yeah. I mean, and it's today. What I've said is when I read that, I was just filled with, you know, emotion and passion because I thought, Man, he's, that's why I wasn't saying the question was trivial, but I just thought, you know, you're missing what we're experiencing today. We can approach the throne room of God with confidence. Why? Because he's there. And that's why he went into all that in Hebrews 4 saying he's not unable to sympathize with our weaknesses.

You know, he came down here and suffered because we suffer. And through his righteousness and love, you know, died, as Zach accurately depicted, our payment for that. I mean, he then ascended where he cannot be touched. He can't lie. He can't die. And so we have this Savior, you know, in heaven. And the one verse I didn't read at the end of that Hebrews 9 was that says, you know, he appeared, he'll appear a second time not to bear sin, but to bring self. salvation to those who are waiting for him. But as many days as you spend acknowledging that,

you look forward to this. You look forward to your new body and to being with it. Because it's real to you in time every day that you're thankful that he was presented in heaven itself for us. And I made the point yesterday that he gives a little bit of that heaven in us anyway when he sends a spirit to us. John 14, 15, 16, he kept telling them, look, I'm going to be leaving here, but it's going to be better for you when I actually leave because I'm going to send this part of me, this idea of this guide and counselor and teacher to live in you. And it's interesting because Paul describes that as a deposit guaranteeing our full inheritance. So you're right, Jay's, as we're living our lives out now led by the Holy Spirit, given us by Christ who's at the right hand of the Father, We're already experiencing just a taste of what it's going to be like in the full resurrection whenever we're raised from the dead.

And the Holy Spirit's going to do that, too, by the way. He's going to bring you from wherever you go to when we go back into that ground, back together in a changed body. Yeah. It will do a lot of really cool stuff. Pretty good feeling. I mean, that's a great thing. That's what I think that Ephesians 2-6 is referring to when it says,

and since you've been raised up with Christ, I mean, God raised. us up, raised us up with Christ and seated us with Him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus. And the Holy Spirit gives us that link. We've got the link. What else could he mean besides giving us the Spirit? That's right. When he says at the end of Hebrews 4, he says that we should strive to enter that rest. He says, let us therefore strive to enter that rest so that no one may fall by the same. sort of disobedience. So when you think about what he's saying there is that it's disobedience

that actually leads to us not experiencing the rest of God. And the reason why is because disobedience leads us away from God. So if you think about the role of the Holy Spirit is to reveal truth to the believer, which is, by the way, it's what's in the Word of God. He says right here, for the Word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword piercing to the division of soul and spirit, of joints and marrow, and discerning the thoughts and the intentions of the heart. So the word penetrates in, and it judges and it tells us what's in the intention of the heart. And that comes by the way through the Holy Spirit. And then when we submit to that revelation from the Holy Spirit, no creature is hidden from his sight, but all are naked and exposed to the Holy Spirit. eyes of him, whom we must give an account. When we stand before that God and the Holy Spirit,

when he reveals that to us, when we submit, when we obey his revelation, it actually leads to life. It actually leads to rest today. Right now, even, yes, we're waiting on the consummation of that and glory, but we actually experience it today through union with him. And when we go away from that, that's disobedience, and that leads us to the misery that we're so desperate. trying to avoid and get out of. And that's the point here. The time of the new order. Which is why, look, that's why I think baptism keeps coming up.

And I realize some people, I have one yesterday is like, how come y'all keep talking about bringing up baptism? I'm like, which my answer was, I said, I'm not continuing to bring it up. The book of Axis is about every other, about every other chapter. A lot. So Lydia was, was, you know, she was a believer. The Lord opened her heart. She responded to the message.

When she and all the members of her household were baptized, she invited us to her home. Next story, you have Philip and, I mean, Paul and Silas in prison. There's a violent earthquake, and it was midnight that they were singing and praying, which I guess we'll talk about this next podcast since I hijacked it with the Hebrews. But look, at that. Another classic unashamed podcast. Let me just read this and get this point.

I said it was disorganized. We never got to the point. Verse 33 says at that hour of the night, they were singing at midnight. Now, what? How long does it take to have an earthquake and the wash of wounds? It's two or three in the morning. He and his whole family were baptized. And so what I was going to say is when you read Romans 6 and you see this reenactment, you know,

I think it's a sacrifice. It does not belong in the debate of the Ephesians 2 where you say, well, we're all saved by grace. There's nothing you can do to be saved, which is true. Therefore, you don't have to be baptized, which is what the argument, that's how it goes. Y'all, y'all have all heard that argument. But it's not a work. It's a sacrifice because later in Romans 12, 1, he says, in view of God's mercy, offer yourselves as living sacrifices.

Well, what did he say in Romans 6? it says for we know that our old self has died you know what you sacrificed him and so i just thought all this picture of the sacrifice and what was going on in leviticus and jesus is at the right hand of god he comes up with a way for you to respond that seemingly makes no sense why in the world would philip and the ethiopian be going down the desert and he told him good news about jesus why would you throw that in he said well look here's water and I really believe if you looked at it that way, it wouldn't be such a hot debate. Because we all agree that Jesus saves you in His grace.

Exclamation point. We just read it in Romans 8. That is it. So for you to respond in faith and repentance, well, baptism is your sacrificial act of saying, I want to enter your risk because I can't do it. And so you died and then you offer yourself as a living sacrifice, which is interesting, because of Jesus is alive sacrificed in the throne room of heaven. And it brings you into a community. Well said.

It brings you into a community of believers. So I'll tie off that last thought that this podcast became about, which was this idea of living heaven now. And that is a quote that I heard when a couple told their story at our marriage. drew fresh and she made an amazing statement she said when my shame wouldn't allow me to approach the throne of grace with confidence that first jays read she said this she said my husband took me there with love and forgiveness because they had you know they had come back together as one out of this and I thought man that was in a marriage but isn't that what the community of believers is all about sometimes when things happen and you can't see it clear to yourself you got somebody there to put

their arm around you and help you get there. So I was like, man, that was the ultimate of what we're talking about. And that's what this whole book of access is talking about is this community of believers. So next time, we're going to attempt to tell the story. And we've told it a little, but there's so many of this good stuff in here. We can't just gloss over it. So we'll try to do better next time on Unashamed.

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