Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 895 | Phil Needs a Helping Hand in the Baptistry & Drinking Chuck Norris’ Sweat Is Good for You!?

Episode Date: May 29, 2024

Phil required a hand in the baptistry recently, but Jase thinks it’s a cool approach to the task. Al feels a little “frisky” after drinking Chuck Norris’ brand of water, and the guys can’t resist some classic Chuck Norris jokes. The guys ponder the difference between the indwelling of the Holy Spirit and the pouring out of the Holy Spirit, and a scriptural reference to a miraculous handkerchief gets Jase giggling over the idea. Zach encourages people to examine their lives for evidence of Jesus living in their hearts. In this episode: Acts 18-20; Hebrews 9, verses 27-28; Hebrews 12, verse 1; Matthew 3, verses 7-12; Acts 2, verse 33; Acts 10, verse 44; 1 Corinthians 1, verses 13-17; 1 Corinthians 12, verses 12-29 -- Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashamed. I'm feeling especially frisky today, Jase, because I'm drinking my Chuck Norris Sea Force water. Did you know Chuck Norris had water? No, I did not. Is this an ad? Well, it is now. Chuck Norris has lived such a life. He deserves a free ad. And he's the guy that everybody puts the statements on, you know, that are like borderline supernatural? Yeah, that's exactly. Well, in fact, when I met Chuck Norris, I've mentioned this for on the podcast a few years ago, and he was 75, it was on his birthday.

And they were having a little party for him. And I just happened to be in the right place, the right time. We got to meet him. He's one of my childhood heroes because we loved Chuck Norris movies because we like to fight, you know. and of course we were doing it for real. We didn't realize that wrestling and all that they had, you know, there was some choreographed move, but we did it for real, which explained a lot of broken bones that Jace mainly got.

And so, but Chuck Norris was one of our heroes. And so I got to meet him and he looks great. And of course, at the time he's 75. Now he's like in his 80s and he's still amazing. And I saw a video recently where he was on the porch with his 104-year-old mother who looked amazing as well. And I was like, what is about these people? So when I met him, all he could talk to me about,

I wanted to talk about his movies and all the cool stuff he's done. And all he wanted to talk to me about was this aquifer he had found on his property over in Texas where he had this water. And he said, I'm going to produce this water. So I was telling Stone about it. Stone said, well, you know what happened? The sweat from Chuck Norris's dojo, which is above that aquifer, it went down through the dirt and went into that aquifer.

and it created a super water. And so that's why it's so successful. I said, oh, I didn't realize that. So that's what Stone says. So I'm going to go with it. But made from the sweat of Chuck Norris's. Well, just to, so for people who don't know this, when Chuck Norris sweats, he sweats justice.

Go ahead. I got one too. One more year for Chuck Norris means that he has decided to let you keep breathing. One of my favorites I heard was Chuck Norris went to a feminist convention and came back with folded laundry and a sandwich. So when Chuck Norris was exposed to the coronavirus, the coronavirus quarantined itself for two weeks. That's awesome. I have not heard this. Chuck Norris actually killed two stones with one bird. earth.

There you go, Al. I won't look that up, Jay. You have now inspired me even more. Oh, you could sit there all day. However, when Chuck Norris returns in whatever manner, it is not as good as when Jesus returns. From the dead and what does Hebrews 9 say for those who are waiting for him? It's exactly right.

I think that's Hebrews 9, 27, and 28. As great as Chuck is, he's just a man. So we got to remember that. So we're in Acts 18 to 19. And we're finally going to get to this text, Jay. So you've been rabbit-hulling us for several podcasts now. Well, we needed sometimes you've got to realize the podcast is for our listeners. And sometimes the podcast is for Zach.

I'm not the one taking us off of the rails. The last podcast, we were, so Jay, Jason, dad and I were Priscilla and Akila teaching Zach the ways more adequately. No, we had a good, healthy. It's a healthy, we have healthy disagreements on here. I will say this, though, someone came up to me at my church who listens to the podcast and said, are you guys in Hebrews or Acts? So I will say that we have-

It depends on whether Jason and I are preaching. Yes, I thought you were in Acts. Well, they're preaching on Hebrews. That's the problem. We probably should have lined up the podcast. Well, we already did, We're behind it, church. Well, that's more our guilty conscience.

We studied the book of Hebrews for the podcast, and then we see all these things about the kingdom and about our purpose now that we seem to have missed. Then we all felt guilty that we missed the whole book of Hebrews. So now we're trying to make up for all that. Which, by the way, is the power of Bible study. And look, this is episode number 8909. And every time we cycle back through, I mean, we've already done acts once already on the podcast, but I'm learning a lot of new stuff, you know, this time through. Especially because we've been linking in the letters that Paul wrote more of this go around.

And it just opens up your thought processes a lot. Well, I helped a brother yesterday where I was at church, I saw Phil baptizing people just when I walked in, it was just like, they had. It was right out of the book of Acts. It was kind of in the spirit of Chuck Norse, the two rocks with one bird. There was fill on one side. It was a double baptizer. Yeah.

It was like a double barrel with the baptizee in the middle. Yeah. And y'all would just go home. Well, when you get people that are crowding 300 pounds, yeah. You'll have another man with you, one on one side, one on the other. Yeah.

the guy I saw it looks smaller than that but it's fine I forgot what I was going to say oh now that because we because we don't have like a time frame around like people don't know what yeah they're not sure what Sunday that they're like is he talking about me if you're a big man don't think we're talking about you yeah wasn't you it's about 15 minutes of instruction if you ask people who gather from all places in these United States of America that that would include Canada Canada and all that.

I'm not assuming you knew that, Phil. That was good. I remember what I was going to say. So I used your line yesterday because I had a brother come up and say, he said, I've been trying to listen to y'all's podcast for years. And I was like, yeah, it has been years now. And he said, you know, I go through these periods where I have to stop listening because I don't agree with everything y'all are saying.

which I thought that's an interesting way to expand your mind. I can only listen to things that exactly agree with everything I think. Because we said we could be wrong. I used Al's line. I said, well, keep listening because we don't agree with ourselves all the time. I can prize you, if we go back to like podcast number 112 or one of those, I'll probably not agree with something I said on the podcast now.

So it would be funny for someone to go through and find something that we once believed. And then four years later, wait a minute. The total opposite. So it happens. It's part of a growth. And even my, I didn't finish my thought last podcast talking about the focus is who we're going with and for how long and finding others along the way to live forever with us in Jesus. but that second Peter three, the last verse says 318, but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Savior Jesus Christ,

to Him be glory now and forever. So I get it. He's talking about when he comes back and he's patient with everyone. And you're like, well, what should I be doing? You should be growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus on an hourly, if not minute basis. And the beautiful thing about the journey is, especially that I love what you read earlier in that text that Peter said about being patient is because, you know, every day that goes

by and you're living this life and you're on this journey and you've got a kingdom lifestyle going, you never know. And the best person that you never knew is just right around the corner waiting to hear Jesus from you. And that's going to be the person that's one of the best friends of your life. And so, I mean, it happens all the time. It's like we're chapters being written. And that's why when you go through stuff and you're like, man, why is this happening to me?

Why are tough things? You're in the middle of your journey. I mean, it's just, it's the idea that you can do that with other people and that they can do it. Everybody can argue about it or just go down there and go go to the river and do it. And, uh, but the bottom line is, you know, it's, uh, it makes people nervous. but the thing that stands out about the ones we're baptizing stands out for me one thing stands out tears tears yep they walk down in that poo and i see tears coming out of their eyes 99% of which is always a good sign i say the same thing about when a young couple is standing before me

and I'm, you know, giving them their vows and they're connecting their life together for their whole life. When I see tears in them, and it's not all, it doesn't mean you have to cry, but I'm saying when I see that, that typically tells me that they're taking this very seriously, and this is something they want to do for the rest of their lives. I see it over and over and over and over. You don't take many vows in your life, and that's one of them. You're vowed to your spouse, but first and foremost, you're vowed to the Lord. Yep. And that's why, Jay's, you talked about it earlier, that he compares it to a marriage.

And you know, you know whether you are or whether you aren't. Well, I think one thing is it's kind of a misunderstanding of how many times you read that phrase in the Bible about running the race. I mean, if I just said that, what is, how do most Christians view running the race? I mean, I'll give you, you know, one the most famous. I think it's impossible. Others think, well. Well, but what is it? So, Hebrews 12-1 says,

since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses, let us throw off everything that hinders and the sin that so easily entangles and let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us. So what does that phrase mean? Well, they're thinking just run around the track and, you know, there's a start and point to finish. Start and you finish, and you finish, and you make it. And you make it.

But when you read Acts 20, which is where we're fixed to get to, Paul says something real interesting in verse. I mean, y'all made me think of this. I had to look up these verses real quick. But so what is Paul doing? He is literally going from town to town, and he is declaring Jesus as the son of God. He died for the sins of the world.

He's resurrected in verse 22 of 20 says, and now compelled by the spirit, I'm going to Jerusalem, not knowing what will happen to me there. But assuming, by the way, he said that, it won't be good. Well, right, but he's going there to declare Jesus publicly. That's right.

Publicly. And just look back in verse 20, when he says, you know that I have not hesitated to preach anything that would be helpful to you, but have taught you publicly and from house to house, I have declared to both Jews and Greeks, they must turn to God in repentance

and have faith in our Lord Jesus Christ. That's what he's doing, right? Yep. So then he says this, I'm going to Jerusalem, and then verse 23 says, I only know that in every city, the Holy Spirit warns me that prison and hardships are facing me.

However, I consider my life worth nothing to me. If only I may finish the race, and complete the task the Lord Jesus has given me the task of testifying to the gospel of God's grace. This is a different kind of race. This is not ready, set go, and everybody go try to go to the finish line. It's ready set go, and then everybody is trying to get the crowd to get on the track of Jesus. And say, hey, here, we're giving water. We're not receiving.

we're giving the water, say, look, Jesus has got some living water. Come on, let's go, let's go, let's go. So I think that's the problem when you have that kind of theology where it's just about you finishing as clean as possible, you've missed the point of this. And when you're trying to program everything and produce a product as opposed to personalize every individual life. I think that's an interesting thought.

No, that's very interesting. It's a weird race. Yeah. And it's one everybody has to run and everybody has to make a decision to run. And look, and to stay running. Some people are walking. Some people are crawling. Some people are handing out stuff.

Grabbing other people. But it's that type of purpose. I've looked over my life and there have been times when the race was just a sprint. I mean, where it was just getting after it. Then other times, you know, a slower pace. And so, but over the course of the race. That's it. You got people throwing stuff at you?

Yep. I mean, you're ducking. But you're telling that guy who just threw something, look, come on and join us. Come on in. The water's fine. So Jay's read that text, which is interesting, it was him talking to the Ephesian elders, which is kind of the back end of where we're going to begin today. And this was, remember when he was in Corinth, Priscilla and Akila wound up sitting down.

with Apollos and they teach him the way and more, he didn't know about, he only knew about John's baptism. Yeah, and look at his credentials, Al. He was a learned man. That's verse 24 of 18. So he wasn't like he didn't, just some dumbbo. Right. He had a thorough knowledge of the scriptures, obviously the Old Testament.

Right. He had been instructed in the way of the Lord. So someone had come in there and mentored him that these scriptures, scriptures that he knew about was about the Lord Jesus coming and he spoke with great fervor so not only did he have the knowledge he had been trained he knew the scriptures he was a he was a speaker and he did it very passionately yeah and taught about Jesus accurately which i think that is the key thing though he knew only the baptism of John.

So it seems to indicate a problem. Right. Not a problem that he caused or he went awry because John the Baptist was baptizing people before Jesus, because remember when John's baptism, he was saying, you are to believe in the one coming. The king is coming. It's at hand. It's near.

Jesus is coming. So this guy had been baptized by John, and even though he's speaking about Jesus accurately, he knows the Old Testament scriptures and he's speaking, there's an issue here. So Priscilla and Aquila, they began, he began to speak boldly in the synagogue, and Priscilla and Aquila heard him. They invited him to their home and explained to him the way of God more adequately. So evidently, something he was saying was talking about John's baptism, even though he was teaching about Jesus accurately, he's the one.

You get the impression that he hasn't realized that Jesus has actually here, died, buried, raised, and is now at the right hand of God. And the Holy Spirit has been poured out. I don't know of any other explanation. For them to invite him to their house and, discuss it that had to be what it was. Zach, do you have any other? No, I'm just reading ahead here.

No, I don't have any. So when Apollos wanted to go to Akea, now it kind of leaves the story as a cliffhanger. Yeah, because it doesn't really tell you. So he's like, what did he do about it? But I think Luke, when he wrote this, actually inserted that here because you're going to run upon some people with the same issue in the next chapter. Right. But I'll go ahead and read the rest of it.

on arriving, this is a 27 of 18, he was a great help to those who by grace had believed, for he vigorously refuted the Jews in public debate, proving from the scripture that Jesus was the Christ. So then in chapter 19, Apollus was at Corinth. Paul took the road to Ephesus. There he found some disciples and asked them, did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believe? Now, we actually had this debate last podcast, and because of Acts 10, the miraculous aspect of the Holy Spirit fell on Gentiles who were standing around. And Peter said at the end of Acts 10, well, why shouldn't these people be baptized in water? So water baptism used in Acts 2 when the same scenario happened was a response. Remember they were cut to the heart and they said, what should we do?

If Peter said repent and be baptized. So you have the holy, you have people being baptized by the miraculous Holy Spirit speaking in tongue. Then you have people being baptized in water and receiving the Holy Spirit, the undwelling of the Holy Spirit. So in this case, when he said, did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed or after you believed, they answered, this is a strange answer. We've not even heard there is a Holy Spirit. So Paul asked, then what baptism did you receive? Which is obviously saying that there's more than one. Well, there's two that we read about.

It's in either or. Well, John's baptism, they replied. Paul said John's baptism was a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him. That is in Jesus. Now, here's, this is quite the occasion, what happens next. On hearing this, they were baptized into the name of the Lord Jesus. So you would assume this is kind of like the action.

to kind of like the response to in Acts 10 when he said, why shouldn't they be baptized in water? Right. So then when Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them and they spoke in tongues and prophesied and there were about 12 men and all. So I think the reason this is a confusing passage, and we've spent two weeks and four podcasts leading up to it, is because in Acts 10, they received the miracle of the Holy Spirit. before they were baptized. But here, it's after they were baptized in water.

So you say, well, why is it the exact opposite? I don't know, you'll have to ask God when he gets there. But I do know that it was to show that these people were approved by God because miracles were signs to confirm the message that they were saying about Jesus, Hebrews teeth, three and four says that. And let's read, let's read,

I think it's important to read this in, um, kind of John's words in Matthew three. Um, this is John the Baptist because he, he kind of talks about the different baptisms. He doesn't get super deep into it, but, um,

but he does make the, the, a distinction. Um, you've got John coming out of the wilderness when he saw many of the Pharisees as a sagacee's coming to his baptism. He said to them, you breed of vipers,

who warned you, to flee from the wrath to come bear fruit in keeping with repentance and do you not presume to say to yourselves we have Abraham as our father for I tell you God is able from these stones to raise up children for Abraham even now the axe is laid to the root of the trees every tree therefore that does good or does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire I'm baptize you with water for repentance. But he,

who is coming after me and is mighter than I, whose sandals I'm not worthy to carry, he will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and with fire. And his winnowing fork in his hand, he will clear the threshold, it will clear his threshing floor and gather his wheat into the barn, but the shaft will be burned with unquenchable fire. So I do think that there's a whole lot here that is also about more kind of the full scale of what God's going to do in the kingdom, including some in time stuff.

But, yeah, I think what they didn't understand at this point, they didn't have any clue of God living with man or God living inside of us, the 1st Corinthians 6 passage. That's not what they were a part of. They were a part of some form of repentance, and they knew something about, you know, Jesus, but it wasn't the same thing as God living in us and taking up residence in our hearts. When you think of the Holy Spirit for a certain, you know, part of our Christian family, you know, the over our family, they only really see the miraculous side of it, the ability to do miracles, whether it's speaking in tongues or whether it's miraculous ability to heal. And so, but when you read in the New Testament here, the spirit's role was quite different.

I mean, that was one of the things that was there, but it was always meant to point people to who Jesus is. And so I agree with Jace, this idea that, but the spirit living in you is a personal thing that connects you to the Godhead. I mean, as we told the disciples in John 14, he's going to now live in you. And so that's a different way he works in us. But that's made available for all. And the difference between the two baptisms was that. People that had been baptized by John to point them towards Christ, it did not include being in dwell by the Holy Spirit.

That's very evident by what we see and what we're reading here. So this is now something new going forward in Acts 2. The confusing part is when all of a sudden it just falls out on people and they can do these miracles and have these abilities. But look, in this case, it didn't even happen that way, as Jay said. I mean, Paul laid his hands on him, which we see that happened. Remember in Acts 8 that happened whenever, you know, remember the Simon, the Sorcerer was there.

And so Peter and John went there. And, of course, they were surprised, but this was another group of people. These were kind of half Jewish people. And he said, man, he made the same statement, I guess now these people are in. And then they laid hands on them and they were able to do these miraculous things. So I think it's a little bit confusing to people. Oh, it's confusing. And so that's what makes it hard when we're trying to just...

If you go look it up, you're going to find everything under the sun. And look, we could be wrong. But I'm just not sure how to make sense of it any other way. I mean, we're trying to be fair to the context. It's unlike our culture because we're way past John the Baptist now, so we don't have this issue. And you made a point that we're in this transition from Jesus' death. until, you know, one thing that was going to happen was the destruction of the temple in 80s 70. And so there's people just like finding out about stuff.

During this period of time when the church has been established, they just hadn't heard about it yet. I mean, it's not like they had the Internet to look it up. You know, you had to hear, you know. You had to hear. I do think, again, I was connected to the kingdom because John, when John came, he said, repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. I mean, that's what he said. That was like his opener, and even his doing his baptism or repentance was repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

This is he who spoke about the prophet Isaiah when he said the voice of the one crying in the wilderness, prepare the way of the Lord, make his past straight. So John the Baptist is fulfilling that. He is preparing for the inauguration. I like the term the inauguration of the kingdom, because it's, it's at hand. It's it's it's it's it's it's it's here. And um, when he when the Pharisees came, I think his point is is that you know, they're coming to this baptism of repentance. And he's like, you, you don't understand what, what's going on here. Like you don't like this is not about some

adherence to some way like some law that that you can like serve with with your D but not with your heart. Like this is this is a much more of a relational thing that's being inaugurated And that's why I think that when you look at the language of baptism of the Holy Spirit, like all throughout the book of Acts, but even like in Paul's letter to the Corinthian Church, you know, when he talks about, you know, we didn't come with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit's power so that your faith might not rest on man, but on the power of God. And then the Spirit will make what's known of God to us. I mean, the Holy Spirit is central to everything moving forward. And they had no concept of this. And so going back to our conversation in the last podcast,

I think this also sets up the way that we can talk about response in faith and it not being a work. Because we don't respond in faith. We're not like Christopher Columbus exploring the wilderness and then we discover God. Like, that's not how this works. The Holy Spirit has to speak before we can hear. The Holy Spirit has to reveal before we can see. The Holy Spirit has to sin before someone will come. And so everything, I think we should mention this, everything is initiated by God, all of it.

All thoughts, everything is initiated first by God through the Holy Spirit to the belief or to humans. Now, then we can take that revelation and we can reject it and we can say, God, you're actually telling me lie, and the word for that is called sin, and it leads to death because what God is ultimately revealing through the spirit is life, or we can say, God, I believe your revelation, and I'm going to submit to that because you are revealing life to me, and the word for that's called faith, and that's why faith always leads to life. I think that's the progression, but what they had, whatever they were involved in here was not, it wasn't on that level. It was simply on the level of whatever John the Baptist was doing pre- Holy Spirit company.

Well, and remember, this was a strictly Jewish issue. You never see these conversations with Gentiles because they never even knew about the baptism with John the Baptist. I mean, that was something totally. So, you know, it is like if you raise in the church like we are, you'll run up on somebody and they've had issues because of something that were taught for 40 years. And then you have a brand-new Christian come in. They're like, yeah, sure, tell me whatever.

Yeah, I'm in. I mean, they don't have the baggage. that goes with it. I mean, this was a uniquely Jewish problem because God was preparing the Jews for him coming here as a Jew and leading them out of everything that they were known. So all this stuff with John's baptism, this was all linked to them.

The Gentiles didn't even know about any of this stuff, which in a way was refreshing because they didn't have to worry about it. Like John who? Yeah. Yeah, I think the way... The what? The way to explain it is... because I know there's a lot of thoughts out there.

Here's the way I wrap my head around this. There's a difference, same spirit, but there's a difference in the outpouring of the Holy Spirit when you read that phrase in the Bible and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. The Spirit came on them. I mean, you hear the word on. So you think, well, no, no, there's no difference.

No, if someone threw a gallon of milk on me, there's a difference in that. and me drinking a gallon of milk. Big difference. I'm way happier, even though I'm a little bloated after drinking. But if someone throws a... Well, that's a different circumstance. So I'll read the passages.

So just, I got the thought in your head. So in Acts 2, what happens? The Holy Spirit is poured out. There's a violent wind. There's tongues of fire. And when Peter gets up and preaches, and they began to speak in other languages that they hadn't studied, which would be a miracle, right?

Yep. Well, in Acts 2, in verse, after all that happened, where does it say, he poured out what you now see in here. Where is it? Two, two time delay. Yeah. Acts 2.33, he's speaking of Jesus after he raised Jesus to life in 32. and 33, exalted to the right hand of God,

he has received from the Father, the Promised Holy Spirit, and has poured out what you now see and hear. What have they been seeing and hearing? The wind, the fire, the miracles. All right, well, in Acts 10, you have the Gentiles come up and you're going to see the same phraseology. In Acts 10, verse 44, I read this last time, but I just want to focus on poured.

While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out, had been poured out even on the Gentiles, for they heard them speaking in languages or tongues and praising God. Then Peter said, can anyone keep these people from being baptized in water?

they have received the Holy Spirit. Well, what is the difference? In Acts 2, remember after Peter preaches that, when the people were baptized, what did he say? He said, repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus for the forgiveness of your sins and what's the next verse?

And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Well, I thought it was already, I thought it had already been poured out. Well, there's a difference in the indwelling and the outpoint. So if I just ask you, before I read 1st Corinthians, 12. What are the results of the outpouring of the Holy Spirit? Signs, wonders.

Signs, wonders, and miracles. What are the results or the fruits of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit? Love, joy. Glacians 522. So I found a verse that I believe has both. So if you go to 1st Corinthians, which where we're at in Acts 19, he just left Corinth and went to Ephesus. So we know that they were baptizing people because of 1 Corinthians 1. Remember where it says in verse 13, is Christ divided?

Was Paul crucified for you? Were you baptized in the name of Paul? I'm thankful that I didn't baptize any of you. Remember all that? And then he has this profound statement in verse 17. Christ didn't send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel. Because if you don't have the gospel, you don't have Jesus, which is God's grace, which saves you alone.

You would never want to be baptized. Why would you just be getting wet? Right. Okay. So then when he fast forward to 1st Corinthians 12, and you got to remember what we just read in Acts 19, the Holy Spirit came on them after they were baptized. Well, you assume they received the undwelling,

and now they got the outpouring after he placed his hands on them. Exact same thing, Jay. The same Corinthians had the same hands laid on them, and they were speaking in tongues and doing all that. Same thing in Acts 8 in Samaria. Because it said the Holy Spirit had not yet come upon any of them. They had simply been baptized into the name of Jesus Christ. Peter placed his hands on them and they received the Holy Spirit.

So exact same scenario. So I believe this passage I'm fixed to read has both out and in. So it's 1 Corinthians 12 in verse 12. The body is a unit. Now he's talking about the body of Christ. and he's kind of chastising them. I think we'll all agree. And he's already said that he's an eyewitness to the resurrected Lord,

which made him an apostle. He's imparted these gifts to them, which is back in 1st Corinthians 1, verse 5. It says, for in him you have been enriched in every way in all your speaking and in all your knowledge. So he had imparted these gifts outpouring of the Holy Spirit on it. So then it says, so it is the Christ. Now watch what this is.

this is really cool. But we were all baptized by one spirit into one body, which I believe that's what Zach was referring to, baptized by the Holy Spirit, the gifts. But watch what then it says, whether Jews or Greek, slave or free. Now, watch this next statement. And we were all given the one spirit to drink.

Well, where does that happen? We're back to the end, which I think he's trying to give the analogy that I'm trying to give. And so then he gets talking about the body as a unit. But then what does he say? He gets down to verse 29, and he starts talking about the roles that people play in the church. And are all apostles, verse 29? Well, no.

What's the understood answer? No. There was 12 of them. and I guess if you want to take one away and then you can make a case for 13 or whatever with Paul being later right and the one replacement so you can make a case for 14 are all prophets you know what's the understood answer no are all teachers know do all work miracles no do all have gifts to feel and know do all speak in tongues but but then he says but eagerly inside desire the greater gifts well where do they come from they come from

the endwelling, because what does he start talking about? Love. So you have the gifts that come from the outpouring of the spirit and the laying on of the apostles' hands. Then you have the gifts of the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. So that's my take on it. No, I think it's a good one. And it shows you that even back in the first century, and it continues to this day, 2,000 years later, there seems to be a bit of a battle among believers over the indwelling Holy Spirit versus the outward manifestation and gifts of the Holy Spirit. I mean, that conflict still goes on today. It was happening big time in the Corinthian Church, or he wouldn't have written this letter about it. But the reason they're talking about it so much is because, like, in Acts 19, you have people who were baptized before they even

heard the Holy Spirit. They were baptized by John. These are good-hearted people. They want to do the right thing. It's not like, ooh, you got it wrong. They're like, oh, you're not going to believe this. The guy you were baptized for saying to look and you change your life over, he actually has come and died and was buried and raised. He was like, well, why didn't you see my text message? Well, they didn't have a cell phone. So then they're like, well, how do we know this is true? Well, how about a miracle? Well, then he starts speaking. Just pick a language. Spanish, and he's never been to Spain or Mexico. Yeah.

And all of a sudden, they're like, oh, this must be. True. But at the end of the day, they were just as focused on confirming the message as they were sharing Jesus, having people respond in humility, not any kind of meritous work on their behavior, but an opportunity to respond. And they receive the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, which is how we make Jesus' presence known today. Which is why that we're not miracle deniers, you know, in the current climate in 24. Maybe people have this ability. God does something because these signs mean something to point people to Jesus.

As long as you don't miss out on the idea that the Holy Spirit that indwells you is a result of, Jesus in you. And that's available for all people. Whether you have any outward ability to do any of the miracles or not, this should never take away from that. So. Yeah. And the test, you know, when we were talking last podcast about Jason read that verse in

2nd Corinthians 13 of examining yourself to see if Christ lives in you, if somebody says, you read that verse, you think, well, how do I do that? How do I examine myself to see if Christ lives in me? you don't look for the evidences of miracles as the evidence of the crisis in you. What you look for is what's in Galatians 5. We kind of said this earlier. I just want to reiterate it. You look for the fruit of the spirit because if the spirit is in you, then that would bear fruit,

which goes back again to the whole thing that John the Baptist said in Matthew chapter 3 about, he talked about, I believe he talked about fruit here. Well, one thing he did talk about while you're looking that up is when you said, I really think this is about the kingdom. I'll give you a clue that it is about the kingdom because the next verse in Acts 198 after this,

the miracles confirmed that they have received the spirit. It says Paul entered the synagogue and spoke boldly there for three months, arguing persuasively about the kingdom of God. Yeah, listen, here it is right here. Yeah, that's it. This idea of,

fruit and this is in Matthew 3 when they saw the Pharisees coming this way he says to him the axe is laid to the root of the trees every tree therefore that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire i baptize you with water for repentance but he who is coming after me is my there than i who sandals i'm not worthy to carry he will baptize you with the holy spirit and fire so he's clearly connecting the baptism of the holy spirit with fruit. And I think that's why you cannot leave out Galatians chapter 5 when it talks about the fruit of the spirit. So the baptism of the Holy Spirit when you've received that, it will manifest itself in fruit in your life, love, joy, peace, patience. And by the way, you don't produce these

things. I mean, I just had this conversation last night with someone who's a very new Christian, gone through something very difficult in her life that I was very scared for her that this is going This could shipwreck her faith because she's so new in her faith. And last night, she was at this event that my kids, they did their first concert last night in town. And so how are you? And I went up to our sorters. How are you and your husband dealing with, you know, with everything? She said, surprisingly, she said, I'm very hurt.

I'm very just sad about everything. But I have a piece that I cannot explain. And I thought, you can't explain it because it's not the piece that you do. that you conjured up. And I told her, I said, you have the Holy Spirit now. And so even in the midst of suffering, you are experiencing a fruit of the spirit. That's a way to test yourself and examine yourself to say, is God in me? Am I seeing peace in my life?

Am I seeing love, joy? Am I being patient? Because I know I'm not going to conjure up these things in my own effort. But God does produce them in us as we submit. to him. And it's not a, it's not a workspace thing. It's not God saying, man, you guys are doing so good. I'm going to give you a measure of patience. It's not that. It's simply that when we believe in the revelation of the Holy Spirit, it naturally, or rather supernaturally, leads to the fruit of the Holy Spirit. God's like, if you want these things in measure, trust me, do what I'm

telling you to do, because what I'm telling you to do leads to this. This is who I am. And so, I just again, I can't overestimate the connection between fruit, between the Holy Spirit, between this baptism, between the kingdom. It's all, it's all connected. It's not separated. And I end with this little thing. That's why we find it difficult to examine these passages, because we want to isolate them in only the context of one of those things. And that's not what it's talking. It's talking about all of it.

Well, that's why it gets into debates on, well, are there miracles today? and what we do mainly in the church is we call things miracles or we redefine miracles in that, you know, if I pray, which I've seen it happen hundreds of times, we pray together and what doctors have said was a diagnosis, the exact opposite happens. And you say, well, was that a miracle? Well, it depends on how you define miracle. Was it a supernatural providential act of God? Absolutely. If you want to call it a miracle, I'm fine with that. But I believe the miracles that were happened to confirm the message were things that weren't just the supernatural works of God.

They were done in a way that defied the laws of gravity or science or whatever else thermodynamics. A guy cannot speak a language that he's never. ever studied. That's a miracle. If you knew, have you ever studied this language? No. And you start speaking. Well, you know, if you drink deadly poison that will kill every human being and then

you don't die, that's a miracle. So there's a little difference in a miracle and a supernatural act of God, which, like I said, I don't mind somebody calling it a miracle. Yeah. But that's where we get into the debate, which I think waters down the point here. Because really the point was, I mean, the next paragraph we're going to get into, it says Paul went around, verse 11, and did extraordinary miracles through Paul. And so did those 12, which was why he wanted to get them lined out,

because he's just starting in the city of Ephesus, which is another place like Corinth that has a lot of similar issues that all these first century cities had. and he needed a troop there with him. Well, right. You know? He goes on to say, look, even so this verse 12 of Acts 19, even handkerchiefs and aprons that had touched him were taken to the sick and their illnesses were cured.

Now, that's a miracle. Yeah. He blows his nose, throws it down, somebody grabs it, touches somebody, and they had leprosy, and now it's gone. Now, that's a miracle. That's some powerful. And even the fact that they brought this up just shows you that this is not something made up. Who's going to come up with this?

Why throw that in there? They took a hanky and touched somebody. But then it makes this statement that I was trying to get to. And it says, and the evil spirits left them. So you got to remember, we're talking about the Holy Spirit in Acts 19 and the two different ways the Holy Spirit works with the miraculous. outpouring and the indwelling, and you see that love, joy, peace, patience, which is what he was chastised in the Corinthians over. They were so excited that they could speak in languages that they had never studied that they were forgetting the lifestyle, the love, the, he was like, wait a minute,

now, they even forgot the gospel. Yeah. He had to remind them of the gospel. So they had gotten so caught up in the outpouring. They left those things, which Paul said are way more important than what's confirm the message. And then some of these, in the next story, some of these Jews who got so caught up in the idea about casting out spirits, they went and tried to do it in the name of Jesus. In the name of Jesus, who this guy, Paul, preaches, we command you to come out and the evil spirit said, Jesus I've heard of, Paul I've heard of, I don't know who you are, and then they beat the tar out of these guys. One of the funniest stories in the Bible. But it shows you the real context is all these cities had all these gods. Remember in Acts 7?

and they thought the chapter before they were calling them Zeus and Hermes, and they were bowing down. So they have all these gods, which are made up because that's what gods are, anything other than the one eternal God, which Jesus said repeatedly, remember when he was like, there's only one God.

Because they would say, what is the greatest commandment? Love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, soul, minus truth. They were gods with little G's, not big, not a big G. And Artemis, of course, was the largest temple, but there were over 50 temples in Ephesus with 50 different gods. And also a bunch of other ones, which were Roman emperor, they worshipped them as well.

So this place was rife with idolatry. Before we quit, I want to squeeze this in because you say, well, what are these evil spirits? Well, it's evil happens when you deny the true living God. All of a sudden you have evil. There's evil spirits causing chaos. everywhere. So Paul addresses that before the text I read about you're baptized by one spirit, giving the spirit to drink. In 1 Corinthians 8, now this is fascinating. In verse 4, he says, so then, about eating food sacrifice to idols, because remember, there are idols and gods everywhere in this time. We know that an idol is nothing at all in the world, and that there is no God but one,

which is what I just got through saying. For even if there are so-called gods, little G, this is 8-5, whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords. Yet for us, there is but one God, the Father from whom all things came and for whom we live. And there is but one Lord. Jesus Christ through whom all things came and through whom we live.

That's the setting. That's why they had to have the miracles and I say had. I mean, God can do what he wants to but that's why he was doing it. He's like, oh yeah, you're following this little fake God? Well, what's this? Right.

And so then he called people to Jesus. They then could receive something way more intimate and personal than just a, miracle, you're housing the eternal God and making his presence known. In your body. In your body. All right.

We're out of time. We come back on Unashame. We'll wrap up this little trip to Ephesians and we're going to do some study in Ephesians, which we're super excited about. So we'll tell you more about that next time on Unashamed. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube.

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