Unashamed with the Robertson Family - Ep 984 | Jase Offers Simple Advice for Sharing the Gospel & How to Get Your Prayers Answered

Episode Date: October 31, 2024

Jase once ran off his best friend when he showed up drunk at Jase’s house, but Jase continued to pray for him. The next time they spoke, two years later, Jase asked him to be the best man at his wedding! Jase has a simple piece of advice for those wanting to share the gospel with their loved ones. The guys explore what Jesus has to say about the heart and the role it plays in our passions, decisions, and feelings. In this episode: Colossians 2, verse 2; Colossians 3, verses 15-23; John 6, verse 26; Mark 6, verse 52; Jeremiah 20, verse 9 -- Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

I am unashamed. What about you? Welcome back to Unashame. For us doing the podcast, it feels like it was just a few seconds ago. Well, I wanted to repent. I really, I felt, I'm glad in that two minutes, Zach, that your heart has been finally penetrated. I mean, I really felt convicted on the burger thing because your clothes, Jace, was, I mean, it was. I guess I was like preaching there when you just Well it really was the perfect analogy Of what the devil does

He lies to us with cheap imitations Exactly And I'm like I did that With the chin but it does taste good I didn't say that I just threw it out there So you could form Which that's it

You just showed how it's done You just got to be clever It's the power of suggestion Because really we were talking about Adam and Eve in the garden Look they had the whole world They were in charge of the whole world And the relationship was literally perfect because sin was not around.

You had a relationship with the creator of the universe and with each other. And he put you in charge. And one little statement, are you sure that you're not missing out on something? Right. Did God really say? Did God really say? And that's what happens. Because people say that all the time.

You can have the strongest marriage imaginable and have somebody come in and say, Are you sure your wife's being faithful to you? Even if this was made up. You're so right. And they're like, what do you mean? She's like, well, I saw it at the store the other day, and she seemed to be talking to a guy. And the next thing you know, this guy's off the rails. You know, he's, it was just the power of a suggestion.

And what you do about that really has consequences. Yeah. Especially when it's to your heart, you know. Yeah, I mean, you read verse 21 of where we're at, Colossians chapter one. he makes a statement that you were once alienated and hostile in mind doing evil deeds. So you think, why, why was the, what, what's the, what's the basis of the alienation from God? Like, I mean, because that's what we're talking about here. Like, what, like, why, why alienated?

Why can I just do these things that I want to do and still not be alienated? And, I mean, why does sin have to lead to alienation as, is the, question I was thinking about. And you described it right there. It's because if you think about the core of what sin is, we mistakenly think it's a violation of an arbitrary command that God gave. That's how we typically define sin. Oh, sin's a missing of the mark. And it is a missing in the mark. But it's not an arbitrary missing of the mark. It's not that I'm trying to accomplish something. Oh, I missed it. I didn't, oh, man, that's a sin. No, sin is a mistrust in the of God. So sin is to say, God, I don't trust you, either one, that you're powerful enough to do

what you say you're going to do, or two, that you're not good enough, that you don't have my best interest at heart, that you're trying to manipulate me, use me, you know, would do something. And that's what it is. So the reason why sin leads to alienation, and I think that's what the devil did in the original sin, is he sowed a seed of distrust. Did God really say? And it's always about choice. I mean, God gives us a choice. The beauty of free will is that we have a choice. We can believe in or we don't have to.

We can follow our own way. I was going to share this on the last podcast. I want to get it in this time because I had made a point in a sermon I preached recently from John 6 about when Jesus fed the 5,000. And you remember the whole setup was he was going to show the disciples and, of course, these thousands of people, some true God power. I mean, he knew it. It said he did it to test him. So he asked the disciples, Jay, this is right up here out of one of the questions, is where are going to, we're going to get some bread to feed these people? And you can imagine the disciples are

looking out here. There's 5,000 men plus everybody else. So we've said before we did this text, there were thousands of people there. And Jesus said it as a joke, really. Or, you know, he said he said it to test them. Because he knew what he was going to. to do. And so then they were like, we couldn't. We'd have to work for a year's wages wouldn't feed these people one meal. And so then he says, anybody got some food. And they said, well, here's five loaves, two fishes, and we know what happens. What was interesting was he feeds them. A day goes by. They're still out there wandering around. Jesus goes off, has some prayer time, comes back. And then the people showed back up. They found it. This is John 626.

Jesus said, I tell you the truth, you are looking for me, not because you saw miraculous signs, but because you ate the loaves and had your fill. He was saying, the only reason you're coming back is you're ready for another baconator, right? Do not work for food that spoils, but for food that endures to eternal life, which the son of man will give you. On him, God the Father has placed his seal of approval. Now catch their response back to that statement. What must we do to do the good works God requires?

So he told him, I'm the way. Trust me. And their answer was, well, what do we need to do? Tell us some deeds we need to do. Then he said this, this is amazing. And this is right in line with what you've been talking about. Verse 29, the work of God is this, to believe in the one he has sent. Yeah.

And, I mean, it's that simple. it's that straightforward and yet when you're when you're only led by human desire my belly's full you know and my look right is my Facebook page look like it's when you're driven by things of the world you just miss it and it's right in front of exactly those are john 6 and john 6 that you just mention the if you say what is just bowl the whole thing what is john 6 about like just boil it down to one thing it's exactly what jace has been saying what we've all been saying what pa what paul says and Colossians. He says, what about this bread?

He said, yeah, your forefathers ate the manna from the that came down on to heaven. He said, I am the bread of life. I mean, Jesus claimed, you're looking for the bread that came from heaven. I came from heaven. I am the bread of life, and I give my flesh for the life of the world. And I think that's the thing that they kept missing. And so you get the, like a Mark's account of these stories, which I love, because he has like there's two separate feedings where Jesus does the miraculous and with just

limited loaves of bread feeds you know 5,000 and then 4,000 people and then there's this weird thing that happens in mark eight after both of those happened by the way to which the disciples saw and witnessed this about the bread and then there's this scene where they're where they have one loaf of bread and they get worried that they're not going to be able to feed themselves and jesus is like did you know like witness just what happened and he says his phrase he says that they didn't understand the loaves they didn't understand the loaves and i think that's where we miss it so many times we don't understand the loaves that the loaves are him that he is the center of all of it and it's him

that's why that's why he asked the question which is then my point out along which i'm trying to make over and over again because like i said i speak at i speak about jesus and then people come up and they're like, well, how do I, how do I do that? And, I mean, my default answer is open your mouth and say what you think about Jesus to another person, but you can't really say that. But this is the deeper part, because you know what's the deep underlying knowledge that he's revealing here? Just think about the context. He's chosen these men to literally change the world.

and to show that people can live forever. They can be resurrected from the dead. All these big things that's going to accomplish. The kingdom of God is being established. And you're in the inner circle here. You're part of this. And then he just asked one question. I mean, that's what they're doing.

And it's actually working. There's thousands of people here. And he's like, well, what are we going to feed these people? And what happens? Chaos. Oh, no. We don't have. enough food, where are we going to get the food? All of a sudden, all the big picture stuff

was forgotten just in an instant. And I think the deep theological truth is, because you don't think that happens every day in our lives. Look, I have planned multiple get-togethers at my house in the name of Jesus with my lovely wife. And all of a sudden, something always happens. Oh, no. We forgot to get the plates. Oh, no. What are we? And then people start, you know, biting at each other. Well, it was your fault. I told you, well, they're lazy. And all of a sudden, you're like, well, aren't we supposed to be doing this for Jesus and helping people?

And so I think the truth that he was unveiling is that if you trust in God and he is in control, it's going to be all right, no matter what happens. You run out of bread or you don't have a way to figure. I'm going to work through this situation, and even if it's difficult, or even if you're hungry, it's going to be all right. If you're trusting in me, that's the underlying principle that you're not going to have these moments of panic where the world, the sky is falling because you can't figure out. Now, in that case, he did a supernatural miracle, but the underlying principle is true. If you trust in me, it's going to be okay.

There's no reason to panic. No. And it doesn't matter what's a situation. is because I was, when you said that, I thought of another scripture in Mark 6 where there was a panic. What they, and it was when they were in the boat with Jesus, the storm or, the storm gets stirred up and what do they do? They panic.

But what does Jesus do? He, he doesn't panic. And you know what he says to him in the boat? I've just mentioned Mark 8. This is Mark 6. He says, take heart. It is I, don't be afraid. And he got into the boat.

with them and the wind ceased and they were utterly astounded verse 52 for they did not understand about the loaves but their hearts are hardened and see that this idea here what does it mean about the loaves is that god god is he's sovereign and he's he's going to he's going to see this through to the end it doesn't mean you won't suffer doesn't mean you won't go through bad times that mean that does mean that god has a plan that he is the central point of the whole thing and I think that is really why it's so repetitive in Colossians one and two about establishing Christ as the center points very similar to kind of by the way Hebrews yeah no doubt I'm gonna take that verse as a sign because I studied I'm constantly always going

ahead because I don't want to miss something in this letter that happens later and then all of a sudden not bring it out is kind of his point and you know when he just read that about happening in the boat, two times he mentioned a certain word, which was heart. He said, take heart, and then their hearts were hardened. Yeah. And this is something he's going to get into in Colossians, because when you think about heart and what does that mean in the Bible,

and I look this up, over 800 times that word is used. And you know how many times it's used as your physical pump, the way we use. Right. We describe a vital organ. our heart. It's used zero times as the physical heart. So when you take a little rabbit hole dive and what that means, you'll come up with things like it's where the desire center, where you make decisions based on desires. And it's something he's going to bring up in

Colossians. He mentions it in chapter two and verse two when he says, my purpose is that they've may be encouraged in heart, this place where your decisions are made based on your desires and that they may be encouraged. Because they're getting persecuted from every conceivable angle, kind of like the deal with the loaves and all of a sudden, oh, no, what if there's something we don't know, which goes back to that setting in the garden, which Adam and Eve, in their heart, they thought, oh, we're missing out on something here according to this friendly snake. And in Colossians 315, he says, let the peace of Christ rule, which goes back to this,

he's the king. And that's what I feel like there's a detachment in churches today. They'll say, well, Jesus is the king of kings. But the real question is, is he the king of your heart, your desire, decision-making pump for what you do in your life. I mean, that's quite a statement. I think it's one of the themes of the book of Coloss. I think that is so good, Jay.

So no, we can't say that anymore, but I'm going to keep saying it. No, that's good because it's the piece of Christ. Something. You know, it's not like, because look, people will say, we have a version of that. We'll say a little prayer. And I made that illustration a few podcasts ago, which really convicted me. about the guy who had come out of a real charismatic group, you know, and he was like all about the altar call.

And look, we're all about the altar call. When people come to Jesus, you know, but we'll have a little prayer and we'll say, you know, in the illustration I gave, he was tapping people on the head. He was like, you're never the same again, you know. And it's all under this idea of Christ coming into your heart. I'm all for Christ coming into your heart. But what I'm more about is that he's ruling in your heart from that day forward. There's a big difference in just a little moment of thinking, oh, this sounds great.

And then when you get out there where the pressures are strong and you're getting all these other questions from the demonic world, because contrary to popular belief, the demonic world, the things taught by demons, are not this, these, you know, Satan worship and, you know, orgies and cults. And it's these little questions of, oh, you may be missing out on something. there's something bigger than this Jewish carpenter from Nazar. I mean, are you kidding me? The guy was homeless. He was penniless. There's something better.

And you read a verse like this. It's like, let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts. That is quite the statement. He's the king of my heart, where I'm, every desire I have, I think, okay, where is Jesus ruling in this desire? If you just ask yourself that question, well, you would obviously not be looking at pornography for seven hours straight. You know, is the peace of Christ ruling in your heart? Absolutely not.

You're just distracted like a hamster on a wheel. But then he says, since as members of one body, you were called to peace. And I just want to read this other one. So he gets down to verse 23 and listen to this. It says, whatever you do, whatever you do. work at it with all your heart as working for the Lord. It's kind of like he doubles down, double down on letting the peace of Christ rule in your heart.

And it's like whatever you're doing, it's like you're working for the Lord from the heart where your desire and decision making process is happening. He also brings it up again in chapter four. Go ahead, Zay. Yeah, there's a, there's been some work done on this that by the way what you're saying right here is for for me this has been this discussion has been the most transformational thing in my walk with

jesus is understanding what you just said and i mean it really is i don't i want to emphasize this because i want people that are listening that the because this has been transformational for me because i grew up thinking that i had to get the right belief system of about God to be right. And I'm not diminishing that at all, or diminishing that at all. But that's not the core of what it means to be human. James K. A. Smith wrote a book that I highly recommend called You Are What You Love that was helpful for me.

But he talks about this word that we use for heart is this word cardia. And it's better translated in the scripture as almost like the gut. Like what does your gut tell you? what is your, you know, living from the gut. And we wrongly think that the heart is like the center point of our emotional life. And that's not really what we mean in scripture, or what's meant in scripture. It is the center point of the human experience in our whole life. It's the center point of our desires, our longings, our affections.

And so the real thing that happens with a life in Christ is that your desires, can be reformed and reshaped to align with what God desires. And when those align, when your desire, when your heart, when you're, when you, what you want lines up with what God wants, you experience this thing that Jace just mentioned in the scripture, this thing that's called peace. That's where peace comes from. Peace comes from harmony, right? When my desires are in harmony with God's desires.

And I'm reminded of this quote, another quote by Augustine, where he says that we were made for you and you alone. And our hearts are restless until they rest in you. And the book that I just told you about, Smith talks about this beach ball that you try to submerge in the water. And if you try to submerge a beach ball in the water, it violently tries to emerge to the top. And it's a violent pursuit. but what happens is if you let it go, it shoots through the water, and then it comes to rest in the position on top of the water. Why does it do that?

Because that's what it was made for. And so in the same way, your heart was made for God and God alone. What you were created for, what I was created for was to desire God. And so if I want to rest, if I want to have peace, then my desire has to end and terminate on who God is. And so that's the power of what's going on in the book of Colossians, is he is establishing the center point and the end point of our desire. And he said, it is in Christ that we have our reality.

And if you try to go anywhere outside of that, then that's where you're going to be met with non-peace. That's where you're going to be met with hostility. That's where you're going to find the alienation in your mind. That's where you're going to find the anxiety, the misery, the depression, the emptiness, just the, just the, it's death. an isolation. But in Christ, oh, it's quite the opposite. You find life and life abundantly.

And that's why I think, Zach, it's broader. I love this discussion because it's broader. It's the human experience. Remember in Genesis 126 were made in the image of God? He's got to let us make man in our image. So we're made up of three components. Paul tells us, body, soul, and spirit. So you've got a body that has that pumping heart and a brain.

It fires on these synaps, You know, it's these electrical char. Everybody's got that body. Everybody has a spirit, which is the animating force of who you are. Because when a body dies, you're like, where did the spirit go? Went somewhere. You're not there anymore. You can cut a person up.

You can go in and cut the brain and the heart and do all this stuff. And you can't find that animating force. But then that third component, which is what we're talking about, the soul is the description. But it's the biblical heart. It's the idea of the life force of who we are. And we're made in that life force to be like our father and son and Holy Spirit. I mean, the idea of God in us, us in him, that's what he made us for. And so what we talk about is people then having that conflict in that part of their life.

And the only way you sink it back up is to submit to that relationship again. And you're right, Zach, when that happens, it's a miraculous. thing that happens because yeah well supernatural at worst exactly but you know i i think it's interesting there was a lot of things that went through my mind during that conversation because that was right when he he quoted that uh greek word that cardio which is where we get that from that's the greek thing we get from cardio like well cardiac you know look people's biggest fear and i think it's the biggest uh thing that causes death is you know heart disease or cardiac arrest is what we call it.

And when you look at it... Jay, you know the liver has a lot to do with that. Yeah. When you look at it from a physical versus a spiritual thing, what's worse than cardiac arrest to your physical heart is cardiac arrest from your spiritual heart, which would be any condition where Jesus is not ruling that heart. Exactly.

And it's amazing the contrast when you compare the physical and the spiritual because, you know, you think about even what popped into my mind was when people have heart problems, they try not to get excited or to do anything that they feel like they're vulnerable

to any kind of trauma that causes you know, something that escalates their heart. You remember when they came out with the magic pill you know, for old people to get back into the sex game. And then what happened? They all started dying they all started dying of heart attacks.

Too much excitement. It's like, oh no. We sent them off the ledge. And that's what I think the contrast is so crazy, is that the Holy Spirit being in you and the piece of that Christ offers ruling your heart, being the king of your heart, it produces the opposite. All these things that cause us anxiety,

depression, overexcitement, where you're panicking over something that happens outside of your control. And here, just like in the boat, just like the feeding the 5,000, all of a sudden,

despite the chaos going on around you, there's a peace that you have in your heart, which is where really you're, I mean, we're getting way down deep inside of you where you have these desires and you have these dreams and these hearts. and these hopes. And when life happens in a negative way,

it just seems to dash it all when Jesus is not the sinner. And that's really what Jesus was introducing by that verse. I read the first words where he's baptized. And we're all thinking, oh, we've got to get baptized because we're terrible people. But he was baptized to show us a picture of something so much greater in that God could literally get down into your. Your heart.

What was the word? He used the phrase, fulfill. All righteousness. Which is powerful. Look, this is what, this goes back to in the beginning God. He created humans not to just live with them and so they could live for him, but to be in them. I mean, to so intimate that to say that you're going to grasp this in a one hour study

about Jesus is ridiculous. You're going to spend the rest of your life. figuring out the intimacy that God is offering. Which, and you've described it before, is like a marriage. I thought about that, Judge, you were talking about this idea about having conversation. I was looking at, because you were in Colossus 3, because I used this verse in my sermon, again, about salt. Let your conversation be always full of grace. Season with salt so that you may know how to answer everyone.

Which you were talking about just being able to have conversations that matter, and these are soullish, heart, Jesus heart conversations. But you know, it's interesting. The three verses that lead up to that, starting in verse two, actually four, is about prayer. And so a lot of times the question you guys ask about, you know, how do I start this out? I can't tell you how many times I've been in settings. We're in my living room. We're outside.

It's a worker who's there to fix something. And we're having the conversation. We're just talking. And then he says, yeah, well, you know, my wife's got cancer. You know, we've been trying to take care of my dad. And I just stopped and I said, can we pray about that? And I've never heard it. Not one time somebody said, no, no, I don't do prayer.

Every time it's like, yeah, that'd be great. What's their name? What has happened now is we're just having a conversation about whatever, about football, you know, LSU, Alabama. And then all of a sudden, we just had a spiritual moment where we're going to engage the father, son, the spirit. And so that's a huge weapon for us to break things down. And because everybody's got somebody that they're concerned about.

Exactly. Have you guys ever heard the story of D.L. Moody, who prayed, he had a hundred friends. This is, I think this is one of the most powerful things I've ever heard. He had a hundred friends that he prayed for, that they would come to know Christ. And he would pray for them every day. I think it was every day. It was a rhythmic prayer for many years, many years over his life that he prayed for these. He had 100 people that he knew that were not in Christ that he prayed for.

And at his funeral, would you believe that 96 of those friends by the time he died had given their life to Christ? And then the final four, it's been reported, the final four of the hundred at his funeral gave their life. So I think that we diminished the power of prayer in so many ways. but man, how amazing is, not just the fact how God supernaturally intervenes in the hearts of others, but even think about the posture that if you get on your knees and you pray to the living God for the souls of the people that you love, to know him, think about what that does to your posture and your heart. You think you're going to be able to go into a conversation with sincerity with those people that you're praying for? I don't know how you couldn't.

And I think that it does more for us, even that it does for the people that we're praying for it, it puts us in the posture. So that's encouraging to think about that story about D.L. Moody, you know, he has such an incredible legacy, but even just thinking about his prayer life and the effect of that prayer life on the relationships of those hundred people that he had prayed for. And you know, in Colossius IV, that Paul is asking for prayers that he can make declare, you know, fearlessly the gospel. I want to get it out there.

He's asking, pray for me that I'll be able to do that. He asks this church, who he doesn't know. Well, and to even take that further, you know, I had a, I had something in my personal life, you know, called, I guess, Jesus's list. And it was Jace's list. Yeah. You know, when I. Of all your friends. Yeah, I had this moment when I was 16 years old, and I've shared this story many times.

So I just give you the cliff notes. But, you know, the first person I actually shared Jesus. with, I didn't know who it was, nor did I ever find out, because it was a prank caller, because I was such a, you know, a coward at that stage of my Christian development and growth because I was shy. I just, but, you know, I had tried for two years to kind of do what Zach described earlier. That was my process. I just thought, oh, being a Christian means don't do bad things.

and so when you go to a public high school that that can be a lonely life because everybody was just going off the deep end and I did a pretty good job of not doing bad things but I realized that even as hard as I was trying this wasn't this wasn't going to work and at the same time I was studying mainly about Jesus and I realized this is not what I'm called to be

I mean, it's good that my behavior has improved. But this is about walking with Jesus and declaring Jesus. And, you know, in that moment, Jeremiah became a real inspiration because he seemingly preached, I'll give you the cliff notes of that, for 40 years without any response. All he was getting was heartache and persecution. But one of the reasons that we went to that Bible school is, because that was their theme verse that,

and this came up last night after my sermon. And I didn't bring it up, but we were, I was talking to a young woman who was saying, I need to be more vocal with the people around me about Jesus because I'm not saying anything. And she said, but you know,

every time I read Jeremiah, I'm just encouraged to keep, not that she was sharing, but I keep wanting the desire to share. And I said, look, I've been there. And I quoted Jeremiah 20 in verse 9. Which was our theme verse for our class. But I want you to notice a key word in here that we've already discussed today.

And it says, but if I say I will not mention him or speak any more in his name, his word is in my heart, which is that, look, 800 times. I can't stress, 800's a lot. Yeah. talking about this center of human beings that make all the decisions and where your desires are flourishing that you don't think anybody knows about. And you're right, Jay's it's a real place. It's a real place.

But he says, his word is in my heart like a fire, a fire shut up in my bones. I'm weary of holding it in. Indeed, I cannot. And with that same theme, I made a list one night after this conversation with. the person who was a prank caller where I shared Jesus and I was convicted in that this person listened for hours even though they didn't say a word and uh and I hope they came to the Lord but I tell what you said one of the conversations you thought you heard them sniffling let them know they do the last the only audible sound which sounded like a demon came out because six hours of silence

over two nights when they made an audible sound it terrified I was literally talking to myself for six hours. So if you came to know Jesus by prank phone calling somebody, please let us know. Send us. Sin Zank a know. Yeah, I would love to know who that was. Because that may be a listener. But it convicted me in that the story of Jesus and being presented to a person would

listen for that long. I mean, they might have known me and they're embarrassed to say, hey, Jay's, that was me. I just was embarrassed that I never said anything. But, you know, I made that list. and it really can it it uh it kind of got to me when you shared that about the guy praying but i actively pursued that list for the next three or four years and it wasn't a list based on anything other than i like these people yeah or they were around me and i thought

i want them to live forever and i'm going to try to find a way to get jesus in their ears i actually thought about it sunday jace because when i was up in front of our church I looked in the very back right there on the almost the back row and there was the first guy on your list. First guy on my list. And that's been now, what, 35 plus years ago? Well, as long as I've been married, he was baptized about a week before I got married. And he was kind of the first domino to fall.

And that was the point I was going to make about Jeremiah. So I did start sharing Jesus at 16 at my high school and no one responded. None, none of them. they all just heat, abuse, persecution, and ran. You were a modern Jeremiah. And I was kept going down that list, you know. I kept going down that list, even when that movie, Schindler's list came out, you had that list where he was saving physically,

you know, Jews from being annihilated. But, you know, I just kept going down the list and plodding along. And even when I would see somebody later, I wouldn't say this, but I would think it, I would get in a Jesus conversation. and I was thinking, you're on the list. But, you know, Zach, to your point, it was more than prayer, it was action. And I would say now with confidence that most of those people on the list came to Christ.

Yeah. And, you know, I haven't researched everyone, but I have noticed that through the years as I've gone and looking for some lesson that I had given one time or I know it somewhere, and every once in a while, I'll see that list. And it actually makes me emotional because I think these people came to Christ, but in the short term, it seemed terrible. And you say short term, it's four or five years that I was going down that list, and nobody was responding.

It was all met with just a lot of reservation and anguish given towards me. But you're right, now every time I see my best buddy Blake, I think. Man, I had him at the top. And when he came to Christ, look, he went through the same process we all do. But the fact that we're, you know, 35, 40 years later, he's still there. I mean, he's real dedicated to Christ. And I know the background he came out of. And I just think, man, what a supernatural occurrence that this guy had every reason in the world not to come to Christ.

But he did. And he's been a, you know, a soldier for the Lord. And so that's what we're really saying. It's not, it wasn't based because I went to Bible school. And I shared with all these people before I ever did all that. I was literally, it was probably the worst presentation of Jesus. The world has ever known, but it wasn't about me. It was them looking at themselves in their heart and seeing who Jesus was.

It was just an introduction. And the action that you talk about, like he says, it's action and prayer. I don't know if you can sincerely pray in the spirit repeatedly and not have action. I think that's what it does. I think that's what the prayer, one of the power, one of the things that brings power to prayer is that it enables us for action because it changes us. And I was thinking about, I tell my kids this all the time, you know, you cannot fake a movement of the Holy Spirit. Now, you can try and in your own kind of talents and power, you can cover up some stuff. But at the end of the day, like, if someone is sincerely communing with God on a daily basis,

like they're meeting with God, they love God, their desires are shaped by God. And like that part, like, you just can smell it. Like you mentioned that we keep going back to that second Corinthians passage. They just smell like Jesus. And they may not even be the best. speaker. Like, how many times have you sat in a church or a venue or you've been somewhere and some guy gets up that you never expect it, but you're just like, but he just, he or she speaks with just the greatest sincerity. And you're like, and everyone in the, in the place is moved because

it's sincere and it's real. And it may not even be the best. They may not be the best orator. They may not have all the great language and analogies, but just some kind of sincerity on them. there's like, I mean, some people call it an anointing, but I think what that is is that is someone who is walking with God. And if you think about that road to Emmaus, whenever Jesus left them, they said, we're not our hearts burning while he was with us.

And I think that's what it is. When we're with him in prayer, then our hearts get set ablaze. And so it's a burning. It's a, well, if you think about it's the three of components I mentioned earlier. coming together with the three components who are our deity, our God.

And in that moment, in Romans 8, the description is the Holy Spirit, who Jesus sent to us to have that conversation internally in this place we're talking about. When you pray, all those things come together. Yeah, exactly. Which is, and the confluence of that, the idea that we're all doing this together is what's powerful. Before we take our last break, Zach, I want to mention someone that sent an X message to me about wanting to be able to send some money and some help.

And they asked me to ask you. So we talked about Onekingdom.org, it's Samaritanspurst.org. Tell them again the place they can actually send it to you guys. What's the address? Yeah, our church is, you can send it online at swan. Dot Church. That's actually the website. Swan.

Dot church. Yeah, with one end, swan. church, and you can donate it there. And what we're doing, by the way, with the money that we're getting is we're helping rebuild some houses. It kind of entered a new phase. And that's why I wanted to mention it because we hadn't talked about in a while. But he asked me that specifically to ask you to do that.

So I wanted to make that available to those. So, yeah. So we talk about that concept of prayer. But it is a real conversation with a real place. And that's, and it's about connection. I think that's what this, in Colossians, because Colossians is a lot like Ephesians. They're very similar, and there's this whole stuff there that we're going to get into the next paragraph about, about the Gentiles, you know, being coming in, the whole mystery that Paul talked about in Ephesians, the mystery hidden for the ages and generations, but is now revealed to the saints. To them, God chose to make known how great among the Gentiles are the riches of the glory of this mystery, which is Christ in you.

So, I mean, that's the point of it. And like, like the eschatological flow of the kingdom. Sorry, I had to say it. There is all that in here. There's all the, there's the new temple language. There's the Jew and Gentile coming together. But, but like, that's all, that's even not the point. That, that, that's the point of all of it is that Christ now is going to take up his

residence in people. that is the mystery that was hidden for all the ages is now Christ is in people and not just Israel. He's in all kind of people. He's in slaves, free people, males, females, Jews, Gentile. He is in all kind of people. And it's offered to everyone. And it's interesting because we've been talking about this invisible. You know, when he starts out in verse 15, he's the creator of visible and invisible.

Because we're talking about this life force thing in us. this idea of our soulish part of who we are, it's not something you can easily see in terms of if you just went through it through a scientific method, but that you know it's there because you're just watch people. And you see, you know, you see it.

Do you see it? Think of this, you also see it when it's not there. And so if you think about someone, you ever met someone, and we all have many people, and they have a look in their eye. They used to say,

they got a look in their eye about that guy. Guys got a look about him. Those guys got to look. I got to look, but it's like this look in their eyes. And you look and you just can see. It's like something is off, man. It could be pain, anguish, conflicted. You're right.

It shows up, the eyes, the window to the soul kind of thing. And then you see somebody or how many people that you've seen that and you've known them that way and then you've known them in Christ. And you're like, you're not the same person. Your face is. You're counting. It's different. I mean, that's what it does. That's what I was going to say.

And just to piggyback on what you said, you know, about Christ and you revealing the mystery that we literally have this spirit of Christ, which is why we should become Jesus stalkers. I actually used that line last night. I mean, we're investigating Jesus in almost a weird way. Every day we're reading through the Gospels over and over and over. but his goal, his prayer, he goes on to say at the end of the chapter in chapter one, that his goal was to present everyone mature in Christ, because it is a process.

You know, I went through my own personal process in that first two years, okay, I'm one again trying to hang on, and then all of a sudden, you know, I'll make a list. I have this weird phone conversation because I was growing in Christ. I realized I'm going to share this. And so to get back to the point of how do you do that, how you have these conversations, I always started off.

I mean, my opening line was even to my best friend. I was like, look, I'm an idiot. I don't, I'm not smart. I'm not a preacher. I've had no training. It was all because a humility had developed in me learning about Christ that I realized I literally have nothing to offer here. other than this guy I met 2,000 years ago,

you know, his name was Jesus. And so I do think that that tends to make the conversation better because even people would say, because they would try to attack it. Because people deep down realize that if they follow Jesus, well, their life's going to change. And they push back from that. And it's like having the idea of following Jesus,

it's like, well, that means I'm going to have to give up. you know, drunkenness or living with this girl and having sex, it's not my wife, or this adultery has to stop, or pornography, all these things start flooding their mind. And so they'll attack the messenger. They're like, well, are you perfect or, I mean, you know, you're a hypocrite or whatever. And I'd always just answer like, well, yep, you figured it out. I am a hip, I'm just a flawed person, but that's not. changing the good news of Jesus and what he's offering here.

I mean, you're getting forgiveness. You're getting a purpose. You're getting a community. You're getting a family. You're getting eternal life. You're going to get your dead body raised from the ground. That was my, that was the way I shared Jesus. It really wasn't just this scripture and that.

Yeah. It was like, attack me personally. I'm like, oh yeah, you're right. I'm an idiot. However, Jesus has made me really smart because I'm going to live for What if I'm right and you're wrong? I mean, just these little simple equations. And they were like, well, that is true.

I mean, what do you have to offer? And which is always nothing. Nothing. It's nothing. So I found out, yeah, I found out what I was intimidated by was, you know, being attacked or being fun. It was really nothing. It was just a temporary blip. And then it's like, well, let's get back to what Jesus actually offered.

And if they rejected what you were saying, they really weren't rejecting you. Yeah, which has really helped me later on in life. Even about you anyways. That's exactly right. If it's about you, then you take all the blame when it fails, but then if it succeeds, you take all the pride. You're kind of like in a conundering either way. But for me, what was intimidating about sharing my faith early on in my Christian wall was that I thought,

I think I had misdirected or a misunderstanding of salvation. And so my goal was to get them baptized or maybe your version of that if you grew up in the Baptist church was get them to say the sinner's prayer or whatever your, you know, whatever your entry point was. Yeah. Response was. But really if you think about the Great Commission, like baptism was an afterthought. What he says is what? Go make disciples. And so that's a different kind of thing now.

If I'm sharing Jesus to make disciples, then it's not a one-time conversation that I got everything rise on this one conversation. And for me, it was all about that. Oh, I have to present it the right way. Everything rise in this one conversation. And that's not what God's called us to. God's called us to make disciples, which is a process. And it takes a long time. And to your point, Jase, as you pointed out correctly in Colossians, to bring people to maturity.

When you read what that means, I already read Hebrews chapter 5, when it talks about maturity being, it's being able to distinguish the good from the evil, the lie. It's a holy discernment of where we can actually discern, where does real life come from. And it's the same language, by the way, that Paul uses in Romans chapter 12 when he says that you're offering your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God. this is your spiritual act of worship. And he uses very similar language to Hebrews 5.

Don't be conformed to this world. He uses the language of transformation, though, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect. That's the maturity. And that's just something that we have to walk through together by being open and sharing. And that's pretty much what Jesus did. But he had 12 guys and he went through a three-year process with him.

one out of the 12 didn't have a heart for it. I mean, you know. Exactly. Well, it wasn't unlike when we mentioned the first guy on the top of my list. Look, the first time I shared with him, I was, my hands were shaking and he had a little wry smile. Like, his actual response was, he says, well, this would be great.

He said, but I got, there's a redhead. And he, I knew who she was. He's like, I mean, she just said yes to going out on a date. And I was like, that's your response to the message of Jesus. Well, look, trade it for me. Redhead. Two years later, he drove down at our house one night on the riverbank, and he was drunk. He drove drunk down there and was like, he was crying and talking about his life. And I was like, you're drunk. I was, I'm going to go call 911 and tell him you're driving and drinking. I was like, come back when you're sober. I mean, it was, did not go well. I mean, I basically ran him off. So he left. And so then two years after that, two years. This is four-year process. I hadn't seen him since. I asked him to be the best man in my wedding.

And he's like, well, there's nothing. Why would you do that? And I said, because I see your potential, you know, in Christ. I mean, I got back on Christ, I was like, you've, we've been friends for years. But somehow another, that act of love convicted him. And he called me and said, you want to go fishing. he called me back, which I knew with that man. And he stayed at our house five days.

I mean, he dried out. We had multiple Jesus conversations, and he came to the Lord and never looked back. And he traded in the redhead for a great blonde. Who was this? It's Blake. And now, and look at Blake's life now. Like, you think about a guy who you walk with Blake for how many years. Now Blake's, I mean, he's a mature Christian.

Oh, he's a great guy. Blake, I mean, he's one of my favorite people. He is a mature believer in Jesus. All right, Black, I know you're listening, so you know we love you, bro. All right, we're out of time. We'll see you next time. Thanks for listening to The Unashamed Podcast. Help us out by rating us on iTunes.

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