Uncover - S31 E2: Time capsule | The Banned Teacher

Episode Date: December 16, 2024

Robinson stored her painful, high-school memories deep in her mind. But it all came flooding back in midlife after she saw the music teacher. She decided to confront him. That meeting led Robinson on a journey to discover what really happened and report it to police.

In 2017, it felt like drugs were everywhere in the news, so I started a podcast called On Drugs. We covered a lot of ground over two seasons, but there are still so many more stories to tell. I'm Jeff Turner, and I'm back with Season 3 of On Drugs. And this time, it's going to get personal. I don't know who Sober Jeff is. I don't even know if I like that guy.

On Drugs is available now wherever you get your podcasts. This is a CBC Podcast. For years, Anne-Marie Robinson had tried to forget her former music teacher. She stored those memories away, like a time capsule in her mind, not to be opened in this century. Then she saw the ghost. In 2014, she joined a community band in Ottawa, not the place where she went to high school long ago, but where she lived happily with her husband and their teenage daughter. Mr. Walker joined that same community band the same night she did.

What were the odds? I kind of went, oh, Doug Walker trombone. And I thought, that's my high school teacher. After practice, Anne-Marie asked him if they could meet for coffee the following week. If I wanted to move forward in my life, this might be the only time in my life that I could say something to him. And so I basically spent the whole week deciding what I was going to say to him.

What she really wanted was an apology so she could move on and heal. Just wanting him to know that he had abused me, that he had affected my life. I wanted him to realize what he had done was a terribly bad thing, and it was really wrong. The Band Teacher I'm Julie Ireton. This is season two of The Band Played On. Anne-Marie Robinson is a survivor, and she's trying to regain control. She wants to know how many other girls went through the same thing she went through in high school. That's really what I remember most is the music room, because that's where my trauma took place and I... He and Ann Marie are in the music room, the music office.

And I found that very strange. I thought there was something real off there. I want to be in the building. I want to walk through those hallways and not feel powerless. Ann Marie wants to return to what she remembers as the scene of the crime. She's seeking out others who might help our investigation. But first, she must confront the man she calls her abuser. Episode 2, Time Capsule.

So the next week we both showed up at rehearsal and after we walked up the street to the coffee shop. There's little banter as Anne-Marie and the former teacher walk over. The cafe is just down the street from the old church where the band practices. But it's cramped. Not the perfect spot for a private conversation. And so we sat down. I had this whole long list of things I wanted to say. But then he spoke first.

He started in the place where he left off when I was 16. Like the first thing that came out of his mouth was, I'm sorry for what it was and for what it wasn't. You were the love of my life. And I remember thinking, like I was so, I can't tell you how shocked I was when he said that because it was just so immature. And then he started talking about how his wife was going out of town and did I want to

have a drink sometime. So I realized very quickly in, he was, I guess, hitting on me. I don't like that expression, but that's how it felt. And I was just like, so shut down. I mean, I couldn't say a thing. I couldn't get one single thing out. I was just like in shock and like, I think I was like a block of ice. And then he switched right away. It was like switching on a dime. He started talking about how poor he was. He couldn't afford to buy lunch. He'd lost all of his teacher's pension in the stock market.

We were there for all of 15 minutes. We just walked out and I said goodbye and he left. We went one way, I went the other way and I never saw him again. And then he never came back to the band, no. But that time capsule in her mind, all those high school memories, was opened. It was like having a box that you put in the basement and you don't look in that box for years and years and years and then suddenly you go down and you open the box and it explodes in your face.

At that point in time, 2014, Anne-Marie was at the peak of her career in a deputy minister level job in the Canadian government. I just had just done a parliamentary committee, which for many of us in the public service, those are tough, hard challenges. And it had gone well. And I thought, okay, I'm feeling good about myself. I'm going to sort of tackle this. She would rise above it. I wanted him to acknowledge that he caused me pain and that he hurt me as a child. Like I wanted him to, and to say what he did was wrong, that it was unbalanced and, you know, that I quit high school. Like I... It changed the trajectory of your life.

It did. And there was no follow-up from either the school board or him or anything. I just kind of floated away from school one day. But after that meeting, it changed the trajectory again. A few months later, I had a complete emotional collapse and I walked out of my job at the Public Service Commission. That was the hardest thing in the world for me, honestly, because I loved my job. She just left work. No explanation. She says she couldn't be that deputy minister and that teen girl. They couldn't coexist.

So then I started having panic attacks and anxiety. I was diagnosed with delayed-onset PTSD. So then I went on a attacks and anxiety. I was diagnosed with delayed onset PTSD. And so then I went on a long struggle to try to recover. Anne-Marie never went back to work, and she was still in recovery mode when she got in touch with me years later, but ready for an investigation. There we go. So how are you this morning? Yeah, good. I feel fine this morning. We catch up frequently by video call. Yeah, it's this unsettling feeling when there's big pieces that are missing. You just feel like you need to know, you need to understand why this happened, what happened, what other people who were around at the time thought about.

And, you know, in terms of trying to find his other victim, I know he has at least one. She knows because of that report she found several years ago. It was when she Googled the former teacher's name. The Ontario College of Teachers had found him guilty of professional misconduct, and that report revealed he had sex with another teen student at least 56 times. But the victim's name was blacked out. I feel she's the only person in the world who can understand what I went through, and she happened after me. And so I really want to, to apologize to her. I know what happened was not my fault,

but I just feel that's something I want to do to have closure. But when we're talking about the seventies and eighties, it's, it's obviously more difficult because we just don't have that digital record of, of everything. But I will, you know, I'll start digging. Yeah.

He, and he also told me himself that he was punched in the face by the father of another victim, but reflecting back on it, I wonder if it really did happen. And I believed it at the time, which seems ridiculous but you know well it could have happened you don't know yeah I think it may have happened I mean it makes sense now to me that it was a problem that it did happen and that's why he was he changed

schools any other big questions that you want answered? I mean, in terms of my personal experience, yes, that's kind of encapsulates it. I want to know. But in terms of systemic issues, she has additional priorities. In fact, she started doing research. Anne-Marie has found inadequate protections for children and loopholes that still allow teachers to get away with abuse. I've done a lot of reading. I think I read all the legislation in every province. Plus, I've spoken to experts. The former policy wonk can't help herself.

Besides, it's keeping her mind busy. I want to know what other people knew at the time. But going forward now to the president, it's really important to me to understand what's happening now and why this keeps happening. The system is very immature even today. And so that bothers me a lot. Well, we're going to find some answers here.

Yeah, thank you. And I think you're ready for answers, and that's what I'm excited about, too. Yeah. Thank you. Okay. Sounds good. Okay. Take care.

Bye-bye. Bye. I did reach out to the former music teacher. As I mentioned, Doug Walker maintains he had a consensual relationship with Anne-Marie Robinson. But he didn't want to do an interview. With few answers from him, Anne-Marie and I plan a trip. Please note that masks are required if you are not actively eating or drinking during the service. Thank you and bon appétit.

COVID restrictions are still in force in the winter of 2022. Anne-Marie and I and everyone around us are wearing masks. So we're heading to Toronto. We're on the train. The train starts moving out of the Ottawa station. Our bags and downcoats are stored above, but Anne-Marie hangs on to a heavy tote, leaves it between our seats.

How do you feel about this trip? Good, yeah. It's kind of, for me, going back into the environment is a bit triggering. Yeah, so... Well, so we're gonna take care and we're going to you know you're gonna let me know how how you're doing and yeah no I'll be fine it's good to get it done and get it over with yeah it's really weird from a time frame because for most of my life when I wasn't dealing with it I felt like this

happened like 100 years ago but now that I'm into it it feels like it was literally yesterday yeah it's kind of a strange feeling it's good because I'm finally dealing with it because I didn't process it for 40 years I'm finally dealing with it because I didn't process it for 40 years. I still feel like I'm that 15-year-old girl and so I'm trying to reconcile those things. For Anne-Marie, it was another little girl who helped her come to terms with her past. One of the tipping points for me coming forward, I think I told you this, was when I went to one of my daughter's band practices and I was setting up chairs. I was a stagehand for a grade 9, 10 band when I was in grade 10 when he started to abuse me.

And I just, like, I couldn't. I just suddenly realized, like, really, it was so stark. These little girls I saw them as, you know, I was a woman in my 50s at that time and I just couldn't understand how he could not see us as children. But did it make you better understand that you were a child and that you're not to blame and that this wasn't about something you did? Well, that took time because I think part of when predators groom children, they groom you to be silent. And I think one of the main mechanisms is to make you feel ashamed of it. And I felt very ashamed my whole life.

Anne-Marie reaches for that heavy tote bag. That's a school. Pulls out yearbooks from her old high school. It was called the Eastern High School of Commerce, but then it was called Eastern Commerce later? I think it's always Eastern High School of Commerce, but everyone just called it Eastern Commerce. Flips to the band section.

Yeah, there he is right there. He enjoys all kinds of sports and he likes jazz music. Mr. Walker also plays the trombone in the Royal Regiment band. He feels a student's best qualities are warmth and friendliness. That's ironic. There's a photo of Anne-Marie and the music teacher from 1978. He's tall, a broad smile, under a bushy mustache. He wears a wide necktie and plaid shirt. The teacher and Anne-Marie stand together. He's about a head taller. She cradles the French horn he bought for her. Yeah, my name's there, yeah. This is where I first found the date for the Belleville trip, the one that that I was sexually assaulted on.

So there he is with a jazz band. So I'm not in this picture. Now where's Christine? There's Christine. An old high school friend, someone we're going to meet in Toronto. The train comes into the station. We pack up the yearbooks, gather our things. Here we go. Uncover from CBC Podcasts brings you award-winning investigations year-round. But if you want to listen ahead, all episodes of The Banned Teacher are available right now.

Binge listen to the entire series by searching The Banned Teacher are available right now. Binge listen to the entire series by searching The Banned Teacher wherever you get your podcasts. You can also listen ad-free by subscribing to the CBC True Crime channel on Apple Podcasts. Uncover the best in true crime. Anne-Marie and I arrive at the hotel bar at the Royal York. It's a Toronto landmark.

Leather couches, dim lighting, and old books on shelves. Anne Marie checks the time on her phone, then peeks above her glasses to scan the room. Nice to meet you. Who gave that? Nah. Your hair looks nice. It's a little darker. No. The women hug, then discreetly check each other out. There are changes since grade 11, like the tiny creases where blue eyeshadow used to shine. But one thing hasn't changed. The place they are now. You used to take us here to the Royal York, to the jazz club.

Do you remember that? I do. That's where those pictures are from. The he is Mr. Walker. As students, they drink here with their teacher. The two women lurch down memory lane. It's been so many years. Christine sort of knew what was going on between Anne-Marie and the teacher,

but she sort of knew what was going on between Anne-Marie and the teacher, but she sort of didn't. I kind of, I felt horrible, but I couldn't help you. You know what I mean? I could only be there for you. I couldn't help you because what could I say or do? You were in love with him, and he made you feel those feelings, right? So how do you, as a 15- 16 year old, make sense of that? Christine's description comes straight from the romantic memory of a kid in grade

10. Back then, Anne-Marie did think it was love with a man, but she soon saw it as manipulation, assault. He raped me and then he Was it a heartbreak? No, I didn't physically resist, but I didn't... It wasn't consensual, but you knew it was wrong. No, I knew it was wrong and he was my teacher and so I did what he asked me to do. Christine also recalls the music teacher singling Anne-Marie out for special attention.

You were like the pet. That's what people felt like. Do you remember that he bought me a horn? That he used the entire band budget to buy me an instrument. Anne-Marie wants to know how Christine perceived the teacher.

Do you consider yourself a victim of him? Of him? A little bit, yeah. Christine says the music teacher would often make sexual comments. There were kisses and hugs, pinches on the bum. Because years later, I still, yeah, for sure,

because I was still affected by it. I still had memories of feeling hurt. It hurt me by growing, by building that relationship, that friendship, that friendship, that weird friendship that we should, yeah, it was not normal. Yeah, I'll have the steak fritter, or called something else. We order food. Anne-Marie and Christine order wine.

There's confusion about some recollections, experiences lived so long ago. This is the first stop on our fact-finding mission. Anne-Marie hoped Christine would have insight, maybe even names, clues. Could there have been other girls at their school who had the same experience? But Christine doesn't provide those leads. Instead, she tries to get Anne-Marie to see it through Walker's eyes. So, you know, you have to look at two sides. You look at your side, which is a horrendous experience, compared to his side, he did nothing wrong. You know, as far as he's concerned, you were okay with it. But I'm saying you've got to put yourself on the other side. And what is okay with him?

I mean, we're playing psychology here, but yeah. Well, you have to be friends again. We do, yeah. Later that night, I find myself tossing and turning over that conversation at the Royal York Bar. I think Anne-Marie expected unqualified support, solidarity. But it kind of fell short of that. I could see disappointment in Anne-Marie's eyes. In the last season of The Band Played On, many of the survivors I spoke to were men. They were teen boys when they were propositioned, touched, or assaulted by

male teachers. I documented horrible, inexcusable crimes. No one ever questioned whether those boys consented. The come-ons from men to boys were always considered wrong, inappropriate, illegal. Anne-Marie was 16. She says she was groomed, felt trapped, couldn't say anything. But in this case, she was a girl. And it appears society applies a different set of standards. There are assumptions made. It's the natural order of things that the man may not be entirely at fault. I make a mental note. I need to investigate this further. My gut tells me there's a bigger story

here with implications going way beyond Anne-Marie. I finally managed to get some sleep before our next big day in Toronto. I hope Anne-Marie does too. The next station is Broadview. Broadview Station. How did you sleep last night? I slept fine because the night before I didn't sleep, so that helped. I slept fine because the night before I didn't sleep, so that helped. But yeah, no, I woke up this morning and I, yeah, I had like a knot in my stomach and can't eat. You know, it's kind of, I just, yeah.

We're going to take it slow. Yeah. We're going to see how it goes. Day two in Toronto and Anne-Marie seems robotic, going through the motions. Her dark bangs hang over her eyelids and a mandatory mask covers the other half of her face. So do you want to tell me where we're heading? Oh, we're going on the subway. Yeah, what I used to take to school every day.

To Eastern Commerce, which was where I went to high school and was abused by Doug Walker. So it's kind of nerve-wracking for me. What stop are we getting on? We're going to Eastern Commerce so we're stopping at Don Lunds. The next station is Don Lunds. Don Lunds Station. Let's just go out and see where we are. I'm going to take my mask off. I don't want to take my mask off.

I feel safer being hidden. Well, it's up to you. I don't mean from COVID. I mean from Doug. In a weird way. That's the Danforth there. There's the school right there. I see the sign.

Oh, yeah. Wow. I wasn't expecting that. It feels the school right there. I see the sign. Oh, yeah. Wow. I wasn't expecting that. It feels so close. Yeah. And when you're a kid, everything feels further away. Yeah. Slushy day. It is, yeah. It's imposing. Red brick, what's called collegiate gothic style. Old. gothic style, old. My mom went to this school. Yeah, she went here in, oh goodness, 1940s. And both my siblings graduated from here. The main doors are dwarfed by a grand stone archway high above. Yeah, see here right here, here's the parking lot. I get angry when I look at the parking lot because he used to always leave like, I don't know, half an hour after school. And I used to get in the car with him all the time and all the other teachers were around. I don't know why they didn't, alarm bells didn't go off in their heads, but anyway.

We walk around to the back of the school ann marie wanted to come here just to see the outside not go in and the school looks exactly the same and music room's right there she points to the almost floor to ceiling windows up on the second floor, a hallway. That's really what I remember most is the music room because that's where my trauma took place. And I, yeah. And he assaulted me once in the music room in a closet where he followed me in. And I think in many ways that was the absolute worst

because I knew that students were in and out of the room and I was just so terrified of how do I get out of here without, yeah. Her teenage trauma caused deep damage. It's never left her. Intellectually, she knows the guilt and shame are misplaced, but they're still there. I see anger, frustration, yet never a tear. Maybe she's numb, or maybe it's the one thing she can control. Anne-Marie is smart. No one gets to the highest levels of a country's bureaucracy without being resourceful.

In this moment, she's going to do what she needs to do. Anne-Marie hurries through the snow and slush on the sidewalk to the main entrance. Plans have changed. She wants to go inside. I want to get my power back, so I've never walked these halls without being terrified. All of a sudden, there's a determination in her steps. This isn't even the same person I started out with on the subway. Being back at the school has ignited something. So where we're walking is the front of the school basically? Yeah.

Yeah. I don't think they're going to let us. I don't think so either. Anne repushes the buzzer at the door under the archway but it's the height of COVID and we're uninvited guests trying to get in. Hi um I'm a former student at the school from the 1970s and I just wondered if I could do a like a really quick walk I'm well masked. The receptionist tells Anne-Marie to hold on. She's coming to the door. Then Anne-Marie pretty much vomits out her story to this unsuspecting, kind stranger. I was actually sexually assaulted at this school by my teacher in the 1970s. Oh dear. The receptionist is patient. She gives a sympathetic ear to Anne-Marie's request. Well this is when it was easy to calm her down. The woman tells Anne-Marie to send an email to the administrator. Maybe next time she can get in.

With an appointment. We walk to a nearby cafe, grab coffees, warm up. I want to be in the building. I want to walk through those hallways and not feel powerless. Yeah, and it means a lot to me. I didn't realize that until this moment, yeah. She's smiling, cupping her mug with both hands. Suddenly, a little bit of my deputy minister brain came back and thought,

yeah, I'm going to take charge here. She's not just here to help herself. She wants to see institutional change. How did this stay hidden? How does this stay hidden? What did he do to my mind, my psyche, my sense of self that I couldn't come after him sooner? Anne-Marie needs to get into that music room

and the instrument closet where she says she was raped. She wants to picture herself there as a girl and understand what really happened through her adult eyes. It wouldn't mean a lot to me. It sounds crazy, but it's just relieving that burden and not being afraid to go in there, I think, is really what it's about. It doesn't sound crazy at all. We leave her old neighbourhood and eventually we leave Toronto for home.

But Anne-Marie is determined. She will get into that music room. This trip wasn't a waste of time. It lays the groundwork for a visit sometime in the future. Back at home, I work the phones. I keep searching for that other victim. The girl, now woman, whose name was blacked out. It was on that official report after the teacher was found guilty of professional misconduct.

Julie Ireton calling. Oh, yes, I know. I also find contacts for musicians who played with the Royals. Some say they weren't aware of anything inappropriate going on. Others don't want to comment. Then I track down a to comment. Then, I tracked down a talker. Hi, Julie. How are you? Barry Hodgins used to teach music. He's happy to chat. I'm good. How are you doing? Good. I know it's been so busy and I apologize. He taught music at Eastern Commerce. He remembers Anne-Marie. She was a very popular girl. Not loud, but very, very popular. And he worked with Doug

Walker. It was a long time ago, but Barry recalls Ann Marie and Walker spending a lot of time alone together. He and Ann Marie are in the music room, the music office. And I found that very strange. I thought it was something real, real off there. And then when I saw them together, you know, at other places, I thought, but I had, you know, I guess the naivety, and I was naive. He's surprisingly frank about what he was thinking back then. days and what they are now, I should have gone to the principal. But then, it sounds selfish and I don't mean to be selfish, but I was in a position where I was the third teacher in the group. In other words, he was outranked. So Vivian was the head, Doug was the assistant head, and I was teaching English and music. But none of them checked in on their talented French horn player when she suddenly quit school.

I felt it was very, very strange. Like, Anne-Marie didn't come to me at all, and I understand why. Because she was probably very embarrassed, and I can only understand that. And I never knew what went on in that room because never anybody say anything. Anne-Marie is glad Barry Hodgins is so open, but she's still angry about what adults knew and how they reacted. She now sees it all differently. My adult brain started kicking in and I had to kind of understand what it was and see it through my adult brain. And that was just such a painful experience. It makes her wonder about that other woman,

the one who reported the music teacher to the Ontario College of Teachers. Their story seems so similar. Could there be others? She figures there's one way to find out. Next time on The Banned Teacher. We were in 55 Division. Could you just say your name for the camera? It took a good two years after I saw him for me to have to put things in order in my brain to go to the police. And still to come this season. I knew she existed.

I knew someone existed from the other school. There's more of us. The Banned Teacher is investigated, reported, written, and hosted by me, Julie Ireton. Alison Cook is the story and script editor, producer, sound designer, and mixer. Felice Chin is our executive producer and story editor. Eve Saint-Laurent is our legal advisor. Jennifer Chen, Amanda Pfeffer and Jen White provided valuable production advice. Special thanks to the folks at CBC Podcasts for their support.

The managing editor of CBC Ottawa is Drake Fenton. If you want to binge the whole series, subscribe to CBC True Crime Premium on Apple Podcasts. Just click on the link in the show description or binge listen for free by logging in to CBC Listen. If you or someone you know has been sexually abused, community resources can help. Reach out to a trusted person, sexual assault centre, or rape crisis center in your area.