Unheard: True Crime in Their Own Words - Columbine: Rachel Scott’s Father Speaks — The Truth About What Happened After

Episode Date: April 18, 2026

The Columbine High School shooting changed everything, but what came after is a story most people don’t fully understand.In this episode of Unheard: True Crime In Their Own Words, Darrell Scott, the father of Rachel Scott, the first victim of the Columbine High School shooting, shares what happened after that day, how his family coped with unimaginable loss, and how Rachel’s story became a movement that has impacted millions.This is not only a conversation about Columbine. It’s about what came next.Darrell walks through the creation of Rachel’s Challenge, a program focused on kindness, compassion, and preventing violence in schools, which has now reached more than 30 million students and parents. Alongside Kristi Krings, we talk about bullying, mental health, forgiveness, and what schools, parents, and communities can actually do to change the culture for the next generation.We also get into what people still misunderstand about Columbine, the long-term impact on families, and why Rachel Scott’s message continues to resonate decades later.If you think you understand Columbine, this conversation will challenge that.Make sure you subscribe as we continue bringing you real conversations with the people directly connected to the stories you think you know.SUPPORT RACHEL'S CHALLENGEhttps://rachelschallenge.org/See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

So welcome to Unheard, true crime in their own words. This is the show where we strip away the headlines and let people speak for themselves, the victims, the families, and the people whose stories remind us what's truly at stake. Today's show is a very personal one for me, and I'll explain why in a moment. But I want to introduce today's guests. Today we're joined by two people carrying forward one of the most powerful legacies to come out of tragedy. In 1999, Daryl Scott's daughter, Rachel, was the first victim of Columbine. And out of that loss, he has spent the last 25 years sharing her story and inspiring millions

through Rachel's Challenge. And alongside him, we're also joined by Christy Kringes, who is the CEO of Rachel's Challenge, who was taken on the responsibility of leading this mission into a new generation and ensuring Rachel's message continues to change lives. So thank you both for joining us. Thank you. Thank you. Now, for many people, Columbine is a name that they know, but not everyone fully understands

the impact, because at this point, you know, there's a lot of, it was a long time ago. There's 25-year-olds people who've gone through and just know it by name. But for those who don't know, on April 20th, 1999, two students walked into Columbine High School in Littleton, Colorado with guns and explosives. And in less than an hour, they killed 13 people and wounded more than 20 others before taking their own lives. Rachel, who was just 17 years old, was the first victim. Her death not only changed her family forever, but it shifted the way the nation thought about schools, safety, and compassion. And this is where it gets a little bit personal. Personally speaking, I was a junior in high school at the time, living in a community, much like Littleton, going to,

a high school that looked like Columbine High School and had similar enrollment, and I will never forget how it felt. This was something that couldn't happen. It didn't happen. Before Columbine's school was just school and the idea of a shooting was something that we never even thought about, never crossed our minds. And afterwards, it felt like the unthinkable could happen anywhere. And for me, it was a turning point, much like 9-11, that would be a couple years later. And Darrell, I'd like to start with you if that's okay. For those who might only know Columbine as a headline. What do you want to tell people most about that, about who Rachel was and the impact of that day? Well, common mind was, and still is, a good school, not one of those places where you would

ever expect a school shooting to take place. And on April 20th, 1999, I was in a store, and back then cell phones were just coming out. We used a lot of pagers. And I had just gotten a, a cell phone at that time, and my wife called and said that there had been a shooting at the school. And in my mind, I was thinking it was probably a student who had been bullied. You know, the first image I had was, in my mind, was the student was trying to get revenge from another student. And so I wasn't deeply concerned for my two children because I didn't think they would be involved but then she said you need to turn on the radio because i was away from a television

and so i got in my car and or actually was on a truck and turn on the radio and i was stunned because the announcer was crying and saying that up to 30 students had been shot many of them had been killed and i had a nephew and a niece in that school my my son and my daughter was in that school and so I rushed over toward the elementary school where they were directing parents to go and got caught up in a massive traffic jam on the way there and my brother was the first one that I saw my brother Larry and he ran up to my truck and he said he said we've heard from Craig we've heard from Jeff and Sarah his two children and my son but he said we haven't heard from Rachel

and my heart nearly pounded out of my chest because I knew that she would have contacted us and so we spent the next few hours at that elementary school there was a whole string of buses that came dropping off

students, parents were rejoicing at their kids safety and I remember standing on top of the fence looking in the bus windows as they would arrive and just hoping to catch a glimpse of Rachel. And at one point I thought I saw her, but it wasn't her. And when the last bus arrived, the last student stuck off that bus, my heart sank.

And our family knew at that point that she probably was either wounded or that she had been killed. And we began to call all the hospitals around the Denver area, and nobody had a court of name of Rachel Scott. So we knew before they ever told us that she was gone. It wasn't until noon the next day. That was the most horrible 24 hours of not knowing, of being in suspense. And my heart goes out to parents who lose a child or their child disappears. They never know what happened to them. It's an indescribable, horrible feeling. At least once you know there's a tiny bit of closure, that you know what happened. We got official word at 12 o'clock the next day

that she had been the first victim of the Columbine tragedy. And I've thought about that often. She was the first of hundreds of young people that have been shot and killed in schools. But for everyone like Rachel that's been shot and killed in a school shooting, there are 600 students that have committed suicide. and we see a lot of suicide interventions from our program, Rachel's Challenge.

And so we're so thankful that we're able to be a small part of changing the lives of now thousands and millions of young people. And I think it's a phenomenal program, and I actually tell everybody I can about it. I tell my followers about it, as well, because it's such a prevalent issue. And, you know, I've had a lot of conversations with Christy about. this too and one thing that she put into perspective for me and you kind of sort of started going here with it is that a lot of these shootings are suicides first yes and so that was the way that i've never thought about it um because it's rare that these people come out alive and they don't want to come out alive and they go and knowing that um before i go further and ask something because i know you know obviously

i so i have a daughter she's six years old and and and i can imagine that she was probably your pride and joy just like my daughter is um is there anything you'd want to take tell the people about her that they might not know or that you're comfortable sharing about who she was. Well, Rachel was my middle child. I have five children, two older daughters and two younger sons. So she was right in the middle. And she just, you know, you meet people over once in a while.

I've had the opportunity to meet some very well-known people like Oprah Winfrey and Elton John and three presidents. and people have a spark. Occasionally you meet a person, like, for example, Oprah Winfrey, whether you agree with her or not, whether you like her or not, like Elvis, she had that charisma that when they walk in the room, Christy, who's on with us, has that spark. When they walk in the room, you know they're there.

They don't have to say anything. It's not ego. It's a charisma that captures the room. and Rachel had that magnified. Every time she walked in the room, she was immediately the center of attention, and she didn't crave that. She didn't seek that.

She didn't even, she didn't do anything to get it. She just had it. It's the it factor. We all call it the it factor. And I've met a number of people in my life who have that it factor, and you know it when it's there. And hers was also a gentle one that was full of compassion and also full of mischievousness.

She had that mischievous spark. She loved to play practical jokes on people. They were always tame and non-threatening. But she was a teaser. But she also stood up for the underdog. She always was bringing home a stray cat or a stray dog. or, you know, she just had that compassion built into her. And some people call her an old soul.

And sometimes I wonder about that. What makes one child self-centered and the other child a giver? And I have child, I have children. All of them have different personalities. And you just wonder, what is it even before they were born that causes them to be that way? Well, she was that way. and she lived her life in 17 years. She did more in 17 years than some people do in 71 years.

Thank you for sharing that about her. And I love the way that you light up when you talk about her. It's really, it's beautiful. Now, when you look back, what do you think Rachel would be most proud of about how her story has been carried forward? I think she would be touched by the many, many stories that Christy and I and others have shared

of the students that are overlooked. I think she would be so happy that her life touched the child that's been bullied, the child that's been neglected, the child that's been hurt, the hungry child that now is fed at her school or his school

by Rachel's Challenge clubs that we've created that have created themselves what's called Rachel's pantries in thousands of schools around the country. They have pantries in the school started by the Friends of Rachel clubs where students that didn't get enough to eat for breakfast or didn't get anything to eat can come to school and have something to eat. Or the Rachel's closets where they can get clothing that's more

up to date or shoes or socks or whatever is needed, free of charge. I think that would have warmed her heart and thrilled her the most. But I think she would also be. be amazed at the millions, because we've reached over 30 million now, students and parents that have been touched, and many of them, their lives have been changed, and many of them are alive today because of her story. That's incredible. Before we get into the founding of Rachel's challenge and what brought you to that, I was talking to Christy the other day, and she told me that you, and I'll say that you're a much stronger man than I am, because I don't think I could have done it. that you've forgiven the shooters as part of, as part of this.

And so I guess, you know, I'll say that forgiveness is something that apparently, you know, according to Christy, you speak about, it's very important to you. So for people listening who might never face something as tragic as you, what does forgiveness really mean, you know, to you and for everyday life? Well, first of all, I wouldn't have forgiven those boys for one second if it was just me. I don't believe forgiveness is humanly possible when you've been when you've had a child either tortured or kidnapped or killed I don't think that's possible so I see it as a divine trait that we have to tap into it's something beyond ourselves and fortunately I had a strong faith background

and I understood the power of forgiveness mentally but I never had to experience it at that level. And so I had to ask for it. I had to seek for it more than just demonstrate it. And it came, and I was able to allow it to flow through me rather than be from me. And I believe that with all of my heart. I always encourage people who have a hard time forgiving, stop trying and start trusting and turn to a higher power than yourself. I don't care what your religious background is. I'm not here to proselyte. But I am here to say that it comes from our creator and not from ourselves. It's a divine attribute. And that's been echoed by philosophers and spiritual teachers from beyond the time of written word. And the truth is it works.

Forgiveness is not for the perpetuate or the one who's done it to you. It's for you. Now, it may affect them, it may have an impact on them, and it may release them or help them, which is good that if that can happen. But forgiveness is primarily for you, because if you don't forgive, the other alternative is not to forgive. And if you don't forgive, you put yourself in a prison of bitterness and anger and a desire for revenge that will never be satisfied. you can't do enough bad to that person to satisfy the shame, the guilt, the unforgiveness in you.

And I've seen it work both ways and people. And I've watched people turn angry and bitter that were good people because of unforgiveness. And I've watched people find freedom who've practiced forgiveness. So forgiveness primarily is for you, not the other person. and it's a divine attribute that you must ask for our release from within you. That's it in a nutshell. I think that's beautiful. And like I said,

you're a stronger man than I am. And I mean, I know it's more for you personally, but it's hard. I can't imagine, I know there are certain situations in my life that it's been hard to get to that. I can't even imagine. I mean,

that's, you know, you had to have somebody else helping you with that, you know, another higher power. Now, I want to get to Rachel's challenge because this has been Rachel's legacy. It's your legacy now, and you've helped millions of people. You know, there were 13 families that lost children that day.

There were, you know, 20 that, you know, had injuries from that day and trauma for every single one who witnessed it, who was there. But out of all of it, to my knowledge, you're the only person who decided, and nothing wrong with this for the others, too, you know, people do what they're called to do. But you're the only person who had, who from this tragedy, you know, from extreme loss, decided to build Rachel's challenge to make a difference. What, how did you get there to do that? Well, first of all, the other families are friends of ours and our heart goes out to all of them as well. And many of them have done some important things in honor of their children. they weren't necessarily national, but they were local or even regional. And so I commend them whether they did anything or not,

each person it's up to them what they do, and there's no judgment. I felt like there was a force behind me that drove what happened rather than me initiating it myself. I never at any point sat down and said, hey, I'm going to start an organization that'll reach millions of kids. And that just never happened. What did happen was because Rachel was the first victim and because she left us with six diaries inspired by Anne Frank. And because kids at her funeral, there was just a series of things that sort of thrust us into the limelight. Her funeral was the first funeral.

It was viewed by millions and millions of people worldwide on CNN who asked us permission to film it. And they told us that it was their most watched show in their history at that point. More people watched Rachel's funeral on CNN and watched Francis Dye's funeral on CNN, according to them. And so the whole world became aware of my daughter. and her her kindness because of the hour long, almost hour long string of young people who got up at her funeral and talked about the things she did, things that I had never heard, things that were new to our family. And so immediately, I began to get requests from all over the United States at huge events. Events were 10, 20, 30,000 people showed.

up in football arenas and soccer fields and and so I had a choice to make either stay at home and grieve or to celebrate her life with other people and to let people know what a powerful person she had been in her 17 years through kindness and compassion so I made the choice to go out. And I was not prepared for the explosion. For the next three years, my life has nonstop travel to millions of young people. And we did an event in Washington, D.C., where over 400,000, 400,000 young people from all over the United States came at the open mall outside. And there were 17 mega screen TVs that they put up. And it wasn't just Rachel's story.

There were others there that shared stories as well. But I went to Australia, and in Australia we packed out the Olympic Center there, absolutely packed with young people. We went to New Zealand, and over 30,000 young people came to a little town called Parachute where they have an annual music festival, and they had been to share Rachel. a story. So it was just place after place after place day after day after day. I would go sometimes five places in one week where there would be over 10,000 people at each event. And that really was what helped us launch Rachel's challenge in schools. We went to El Pasar, Texas, about a year

after the tragedy and we took a handful of young people from Columbine, including my children. There was about 15 of them. And we did 40 school assemblies in one week in El Paso, Texas. And that was the launch of Rachel's Challenge. And from there, it's never stopped. That's incredible. I don't think I knew about any of those things back then. I guess I'd started college and just wasn't paying attention, but that's pretty incredible and pretty intimidating. to be thrust in front of 400,000 people. You're not used to doing it. It's Emily.

Yeah, I'm quite sure. So carrying this story for 25 years must be both a burden and a blessing because it's a lot for a parent to go through. How do you take care of yourself while continuing to carry her message? Or how have you, especially over the years that you were very active doing it. Well, I eat a lot of junk food and don't exercise. I mean, that's tame. No, that's not true. I was in pretty good health, and I had no problem going and traveling because it was a joy to celebrate her life and to see so many lives impacted.

But in 2020, I had a unique experience. My stomach twisted on me. I had just played a round of golf with my wife, and we had a little kid. cabin up near Divide, Colorado. And we just finished a golf game and my stomach started swelling. And it had twisted. I didn't know that. And I ended up to make a long story short, ended up in the hospital for six weeks. They had to take out half of my stomach. They had to remove my bladder, my gallbladder. My kidneys failed. I'm on dialysis. And so it stopped my travel. and my health conditions

I just got hit by a number of major problems all at once I've somehow recovered from all of that and I'm still able to travel some but not like I used to and Christy came in and picked up the ball and ran with it and she's done a phenomenal job of not only being our CEO and leading the organization

but also going out and speaking and we have a number of certified speakers who travel all of the United States and around the world, and we have a program in Mexico, Rachel's Channel's program there, with eight employees who go out and reach thousands of young people in Guadalajara area. So it'll continue long after I'm gone. Her message will continue to touch the lives of millions of others. I've had a lot of conversations with Christine. I definitely think you have the right person in the role to do this.

And I haven't had some questions for her in a minute, but let me ask you just a couple more real quick. And then obviously when I'm talking about interject anything that you want. So you've met millions of students at this point over the past 25 or so years. Is there one moment, one student that really sticks with you as proof that Rachel's legacy is still alive? Like one that's complete there. There's many, many stories I can tell. but one that stands out was a young man by the name of Odie. Odie was a gang leader.

He was one of the toughest kids in the, I can't remember the town in California. But I went to his high school about 18 years ago and spoke. And we had started, began to start what we call Friends of Rachel Clubs because we realized the impact that our assemblies had. They're very motivational, inspirational, but we wanted to go beyond inspiration and equip young people to do something, not just be inspired. So we begin to do trainings and we begin to create Friends of Rachel clubs. We call them FAR clubs, F-O-R-C clubs, Friends of Rachel. And the FAR clubs are focused on what you can do.

And we are for things, not against them. always say, we're not against hate, we're for love. We're not against bullies. We're for kindness. So what you focus on, you become. If you focus on the negative, you become negative. If you focus on the positive, you become positive. So we begin to provide solutions and things for young people to do that would carry that message of kindness and compassion into a practical realm. and so I did an assembly and then I did the FAR training, the Friends of Rachel Club training, and we're limited to that to 100 students. And Odie happened to be one of the students that volunteered to be a part of the Friends of Rachel Club,

which shocked his counselors because this was a tough guy who had been viewed as a mean bully and a gang leader. Nothing positive about him in the, and the, and the, minds and eyes of a lot of people. But I already came to the Friends of Rachel Club, and I did what I always did. I said, if you're here because your teacher asked you to come and you don't want to be here, I want you to get up and leave. I don't want you to be trained in an area that you don't want to be trained in. And I said, if you don't want to be here for any reason, I want you to stand up right now and leave, and nobody's going to judge you. No,

nobody's going to criticize you. And Odie stood up. He's the only one in the crowd that stood up to leave. And I had seen him in the auditorium with tears in his eyes when I was talking. And I said, what's your name? He said, my name is Odie. I said, why are you choosing to leave? Do you mind sharing why you're choosing to leave?

And he said, and he started crying. And he said, I'm not worthy to be here. I was so touched by that. And I said, I mean, he was obviously a big guy. And I said, why do you not feel worthy? And he said, because I've done horrible things. I've done a lot of things, even to kids in this room. I've done a bully.

And I said, Odie, sit down. And he sat down. I said, you're as worthy to be in this room as I am. because we've all done things we regret. How many of you've done things you've regret? They all raise their hands. I said, so shut up and sit down. And I smiled, and he smiled back at me.

I said, you're worthy to be here. Is there any other reason? And he said, no. So Odie stayed for the train, and he came up afterwards. We hugged. I said, your life is about to change. She said, I know. I heard later that he became the president,

the leader of that club and was doing wonderful things for kids. But about 18 months later, I got a letter from his counselor, and she sent me a picture of Odie, which I still have. And she said, unfortunately, Odie was just killed in a motorcycle crash on his way to help fight fires. I was back when they had the fires in California, on his way to help the firefighters with people that had survived the fires. So he died going to do a good deed.

And I would show his picture for several years after that every time I started a Friends of Rachel Club and I would tell his story. And in honor of him, in honor of Rachel. So that story will live with me until I die. That's the beautiful story. Sounds like he really needed to be there. Yes.

What it sounds like. was compelled but then wasn't sure that's this beautiful um so this next question i don't know how to word this in a way that that's that's going to be as sensitive as i would like it to be but um since columbine there's been what 435 school shootings that we're aware of something like something it's in that realm there was just another one in colorado the same day that that charlie kirk was killed um you've been seeing this happen for 25 years every time you see one of these what does that do to you How do you, like, what do you feel has changed? Well, almost always I get a call from either CNN, Fox News, one of the national television shows.

The minute I hear this is so-and-so from CNN or Fox News or MSNBC, my heart sinks, because I know that there's been, that's when they call me. I wish they would call me to say, look, what are you doing that's making a difference that we can share with our audience? A few of them have, so I've been on a few of their shows and talked about the positive impact of Rachel's challenge. But my heart just sinks, and I immediately think of the parents, even more than the victims and the ones wounded and the shooter. I think of the parents because I know what that feels like. And my heart always goes out to them. And, you know, we offer up our prayers and thoughts, typical thing that everybody does.

but I just relive those feelings from the first moments that I heard that they had been shooting at my daughter's school and they're not something that you can describe they're just beyond words yeah it's it's challenge I can't imagine it from your situation I know that from the average people

the average person looking at it you know we're like myself I'm tired of it I say take my daughter to school every day and I worry and I think that these are things that parents shouldn't have to worry about that. We're still challenged and we're still dealing with. And, you know, for whatever, you know, certain ones will always stick out with you. You know, Columbine, obviously, Uvaldi, Sandy Hook, you know, Marjorie Stoneman Douglas.

For me, anunciation, the one that recently happened in Minnesota, as that one has just destroyed me as a person. Like I've been still, and I made a decision. I know that Chrissy's kind of talked to you about this, that kind of the goal is a lot of these shooters. they want the infamy. They want the notoriety that comes with it. So, you know, typically when I talk about something on my platforms, I will, when they're identified, and I try to do it at the same time,

I'll show their picture in their name one time, and then I just refer to them as the shooter. I know that we can't change who they are, what they did, but that's just what we try to do. And then I try to put the focus on the victims instead and then continue to follow this because those are the people who matter. The families are the ones that matter.

And so I'm sorry that every time it happens, you have to relive that. I can't imagine what that nightmare is like. Now, before I ask Christy a question, is there anything that I didn't ask you that you want people to know? And obviously, yes, as we talk, you can still chime in to whatever you want,

but is there anything else that I haven't asked you that you really want people to know? The one thing I would say is that shame on you, politicians, both sides of the aisle, that use derogatory terms toward those that disagree with you. The bullying that takes place,

the, horrible dialogue from politicians and from leaders that should be our examples are fueling a lot of the anger in young people. And I believe in debate. I believe in the freedom to disagree with someone. But I have said over and over again, I hate the word tolerance. I do not want to be tolerated by people. And I don't want to tolerate you. I want to accept you. and love you as a human being, but that doesn't mean I can't disagree with you. But I have said this, and I've said this at the White House, when the president asked me to come after the shooting in Florida

and speak to the victim's families there, we can accept one another without agreeing. We can be friends and totally on the opposite aisles of the sides of the aisle and our political views and our religious views and our personal views. but do not treat people as though they're trash. Do not treat people in a derogatory manner that you disagree with. And that's something that I speak out against to both sides of the aisle politically, to any religious group that uses hate language, there's no place for that.

We need to accept and love one another as human beings, first of all, and then be able to disagree and talk about our disagreements. because I've learned a lot from people that I disagree with. And they've learned, some of them have learned from me. We need to create a culture of kindness and compassion, not tolerance, not just putting up with each other. That's what tolerance means. Yeah.

I don't want tolerance. I want acceptance, but acceptance does not mean approval or agreement. And if we can accept other people, then we may come to some middle to ground. We may come to some areas of agreement. And so I just want to challenge our leaders of every kind, leaders not just politically, but leaders religiously, leaders in our schools, shame on you teachers and you counselors and you principals and you superintendents who speak out words of violence to people that you disagree with.

Shame on you. So I agree with you. And let me dovetail off that a little. little bit too. And I'll try not to go off on too much of a tangent. I agree with you because, you know, one of the things about with Rachel's challenge that you all are trying to assist with is obviously bullying. That's a big part of it. And what we're seeing by a lot of grown adult politicians, not just population, but people is, is bullying. I mean, it is, it's, it's a hundred percent bullying. It's encouraging bullying. And if you don't agree with somebody, it's, you know,

we see political violence, which is never, violence in general is never okay. we're seeing political violence like what we saw, which is now ignited another spark of just, you know, hateful rhetoric and, you know, which is, which becomes very dangerous. And so I agree with you. And, you know, one thing that I live by, no matter what side of the aisle you on, and I will always say this, I don't believe that any, the politician in my opinion has one job and that is to get reelected. That is it, whether they're right or they're left. Their one job is to get reelected.

But other than that, they'll do what they have to. do say what they have to say to make that happen. And let me say a little bit more because it brings us up was when we talk about things like these school shootings, which, you know, yes, I think a few happened prior to Columbine, but Columbine's really that marker for it. And nothing's changed. And I see the comments. People love to blame Democrats.

People love to blame Republicans. But if we look at this from the reality, the standpoint of reality here, Columbine happened in 99 when Clinton was still president. we then had Bush for eight years. We then had Obama for eight years. We then had Trump, Biden, and then Trump again. And so we've had people, leaders from both sides of the spectrum. The House and the Senate have gone back and forth multiple times,

and not one of them has done a thing to stop this or have any sensible legislation to help, you know, make it harder for this type of thing to happen. So, you know, if people like to point fingers, you know, I agree with you. Let's listen to the other people. person because you might learn something. I hate being in an echo chamber. I don't want to just hear people who agree with me. I want to be challenged. And it sounds like you agree with that too.

One of the things I would say is that they have tried to do some things, but it's always been in one arena. And that's hardening the target. They focus on gun control. They focus on more barriers around the school, lock doors. And all of those things may be valid to take a look at. but until they begin to spend as much time, money, and effort on prevention by reaching the hearts of kids, by creating a culture like we had before Columbine, when I was in the 50s and 60s, early 60s anyway, we had none of this. And it's because our culture was different. We were much more family-oriented.

We didn't have the Internet, which has been a big contribution to the vibe. We didn't have cell phones. We didn't have instant access to, so there's been a lot of things that contribute to the violence. But if we could help create an atmosphere of kindness and compassion, acceptance, and our schools, and spend as much effort on that preventative side as we do on hardening the target, I always say, why not focus on softening the heart as much as we do on hardening the target? the target. Both of those are needed. And I'm not against any of the things that they've done to harden the target as much as I am that they have not spent nearly the focus that we spend

on softening. And show me one other organization that's prevented nine school shootings that they can show. Not one. I don't know of one. No, I don't know of any either. And like I said, and I want to just, again, the caveat, which I said at the beginning of this, nine that are quantified by law enforcement. This means that there could be some that a student was thinking about doing this, heard what they said, and you never knew they were going to do it. That's right. The numbers could be significantly higher, but it's hard to quantify and show statistics

for something that didn't happen. And not only that, schools are very reluctant to give out any report that's negative, toward the school. So you don't hear about a lot of the suicides. You don't hear about a lot of the fights. you hear about a lot of the bullying or the shooting and I understand their point of view they don't want negative press

and so a lot of that you never hear about yeah it's and I mean that's how they want it to be plus you know they don't want to keep kids in school and you hear all the negative people's the number of homeschooling parents has really grown in the number of years because parents are getting tired of the whole you know let me send my kid to school and maybe or maybe not they they'll come home

and so they want to keep kids enrolled because that's how they make money. And to go off the last thing before I switched to and ask Krista question here, because I know she's been faintly waiting, but when you look at like anunciation, they didn't even enter the school. You know, he didn't even enter the school. He was all through a small window. So it's showing that, you know, I agree with you. Hardening the target isn't the only way, you know, and unfortunately, we have a society that has been for a long time, very reactive versus proactive. Right.

I think we need to get to a point where it's proactive. Absolutely. So with that said, Christy, I know you were sitting there patiently. You've been doing a lot of stuff. Obviously, you didn't walk through Columbine the day that Daryl did. You're probably more like how I did. But you've stepped into leading this movement. What first drew you into Rachel's challenge?

Well, first I'd like to say that Daryl, Scott, is an amazing human being. and what the Scott family has done to take the worst possible thing that can happen to you as a parent and turn it into hope for millions of people. I know you've said it, Justin, you said, I don't know that I could do it.

I don't know that I could do it. I don't think I could. I really don't. And so... I could not do what you've done, Daryl. I don't think I could do it. Yeah. Yeah.

And so I just would like to say, Daryl, I love you. I think you are amazing human being. I really appreciate how you have taken the pain in your life and turned it into purpose for so many. And I liked what you both said earlier that now Rachel's legacy has become your legacy. It's become mine too. It's something I'm deeply grateful for that I have had the privilege to get to spend my time on something that is meaningful. And so it's a real gift to get to be here doing this with you, Daryl. So what drew me in, Justin, I like you, I was a young person when Columbine happened.

I came home from school that day and saw what was happening on the news and was horrified. It was just not even in our, it wasn't in my consciousness as a child, that age, that something like that could happen at school. And of course, now all the children that go to school, it's very present. It's very, very top of mind for them. And it shocked me. And I felt then, then and there, that I wanted to be a part of something that helped write society, that helped change society for the better, that did good. And that was a part of spreading love and kindness as opposed to the hatred and rage that I saw present at Columbine and so many other since. So I've always wanted to, and I think I echo many people when I say this, wanted my life to be purposeful and meaningful and my time to be spent doing.

something that is purposeful and meaningful. And so to get to do this is a real dream come true and a real honor. Okay. I think that that's beautiful. And like I said, you know, you and I have had multiple conversations over the last year, two years or so. And I know that you're the perfect person for this. You definitely have the passion. And you're bringing this into another generation. And that said, how do you take a story that started in 1999 and make sure that it still resonates were students still in 2025 who weren't even born anywhere near the time that Collin line happened. That's a great question, and I hope Dural chimes in on this one as well. But the bottom line is that unfortunately, school shootings are relevant still.

Collabine is still relevant. I hope that we will get to see a time where that is not true. And what Rachel's Challenge does, I hesitate to say what Rachel's Challenge teaches because we don't teach. we awaken or remind people of what I think they already know. What Rachel's challenge instills in schools are basic human principles that we can all relate to that are universal. Principles like kindness and compassion, respect, helping others, reaching out, having empathy, what empathy means and teaching the life skills to maintain and practice empathy, hope connection. Hope is a life skill.

there are some people, I mean, I'm sure you've met people that they just sort of are a ray of sunshine and they are always positive. They always seem to have an endless well of hope within them. And then there are the rest of us that have had a bad day or a bad month or a bad year where we have a struggle to access hope. And so it's about inspiring hope and young people and then teaching them the skills for how to maintain it because it is something that you can practice. It's something that you can learn. And so those are all basic human universal principles that never. go out of style that are part of the human condition, that yeah, we're born out of tragedy, but that's part of the human condition, too. We're all going to experience tragedy and failure and pain in our lives. And so what resilience is really about is knowing how to come together to support each other through those challenges. And that's really what kids are missing, I think, when we see the kind of troubles that Rachel's challenge directly addresses at schools, like bullying, like violence, like school shootings, like the despair that is a part of young people feeling suicidal. And so Rachel's challenge addresses those things at a deep core heart level.

I think this leads into another question that I had. And you did answer some of that with this, but I want to make sure that it's phrased this way for listeners. What is one of the biggest challenges that schools face today when it comes to bullying mental health or violence and how does Rachel's challenge help? And I know you just kind of said a lot of ways why it helps, but I want to make sure that I phrase it that way for listeners to be like, hey, you know, this is what is happening in schools today. And this is what this program can do. I think some of the biggest challenges that schools face today is that so much of what is contributing to the problem is out of their control. It's not something that the schools have control over.

They don't have control over what kids choose to fill their minds and their hearts with outside of school hours. They don't have control over what's going on in their kids' homes. They don't have control over what is on the omnipresent devices that the kids are addicted to and the platform. that the kids are addicted to. And so they are constantly reacting to the symptoms that those problems create. And so the main challenge that schools have is getting to the root cause of those symptoms so that they can address them directly with as many students as possible. And that's another thing that Rachel's challenge is very good at.

So when we look at young people feeling suicidal feeling like they don't want to live anymore, We look at young people wanting to hurt others. At the core of those feelings is real or perceived deep existential isolation. These are people that do not feel connected to others in a way that is healthy or pro-social. They also don't feel connected to their future possible selves, the person that they can be that feels better than they feel now. And so when we deeply address the root causes of suicidality, we deeply address the root causes of violence as well. And a way to do that is to help connect these kids to each other, to healthy adults in their schools, and to their future possible selves to give them some hope. And so I think that schools are deeply, deeply troubled right now.

They are given so many conflicting commandments. They have to teach. The kids have to have proficiency in math and learning. The nation's report card just came out and something like less than 30 percent of 12th graders have proficiency in math or reading at graduation, right? So they've got to address all of that at the same time that they're addressing what is a pretty serious mental health crisis among young people in general and this deep isolation that they're feeling and address bullying and violence in their schools is a lot.

So schools need they need support. They need support from programs like ours and from parents who are also overwhelmed and taxed beyond what they used to be. I think that's a great answer for that. And to go back to the real quick isolation thing for parents who might not remember what it was like to be that age, especially if you were somebody who was more popular in school, I was not. Okay, I was bullied quite a bit from the time we entered. Basically, my time I was in second grade all the way through pretty much through 12th.

And I had, you know, my group of friends that I was with and never did I think to do, you know what some of these people have done but for people um who may not remember being that age saying well in five years things will be different five years was an eternity and when you're when you're 15 14 15 16 years old that's you know a third of your life um and you know now in my 40s you know five years is like that's goes by super quick um but i think that parents need to remember that that you know sometimes you your kids, you can sit there and say, well, you know, when you go to college or when you get out of high school, it's not going to be this way. But for them, that's all they know is their

reality. Yeah. And I think that that's something that parents need to remember. When you're, when you're, oh, go ahead, sorry. I'll give parents just a quick little tactical help that it has been shown that if you as a parent, one parent is present in a child's life daily in one of four times, of day that they're significantly less likely to experience the mental health crisis that leads to suicide. So if you can be present when a child wakes up, when a child has breakfast, when a child arrives home from school, or when a child is having dinner, if you can be present for one of those four times in your child's life, your child has more connectedness, more of that preventative connection in their lives than most do. And that alone has been shown to address.

some of these problems. So maybe that can feel a little like something that they could possibly do in their lives. It's just a little bit of guidance there. I think let's kind of go a little bit further with that. And this is for either one of you guys or both of y'all. For parents who are listening outside of that, what is some other practical advice that you would give on raising children with, you know, with mental health in mind, with kindness and compassion, especially in today's world? Darrell? Well, the number one thing is being an example. Your own words, your own actions are things that they're going to consume and imitate.

You're the number one role model in your child's life. And if you're angry, if you're spewing out hateful words, if your actions are not kind and compassionate, they're going to imitate those things. and it's just that simple. I think some of the things that Christy just mentioned are important and just being an overall example to your children, being aware that your children are watching you and that they're learning from you at all times.

Rachel wrote in her journals about starting a chain reaction of kindness. What does that look like in action today? And I think you kind of said that, which is why I'm following it up with that question. What does that look like in action? Well, we started, when we started our friends of Rachel clubs, we were looking for things for children to do, young people to do that would be practical, that would give them hands-on experience. And one of the first things that came to us was, why not have them write down acts of kindness? Because if you see an act of kindness, if you do an act of kindness, or if you receive an act of kindness,

it has the same effect. Even if you just see someone else doing an act of kindness, it increases your endorphins. There's chemical reactions in your body that are positive that take place. It's a healthy thing to do acts of kindness. So we begin to encourage them to record those acts of kindness on pieces of paper and turn them into chain links. So they begin to do that.

And it caught on like wildfire. And all across the country, we begin to see these chain links grow in schools. And the longest link is 27 miles long. That was done in Rockwall, Texas, by the students in that school district that did acts of kindness. And part of that was contributed by the earthquake that took place in 2010 in Haiti. and all the children, all the young people from kindergarten through high school and all Texas came together and they began to package meals for the hungry people in Haiti who were starving, especially after the earthquake.

They broke a world's record. They packaged over a million meals and seven hours. And they made a link for every meal that they prepared. and that chain link was over 27 miles long. Over 10,000 people showed up at the football stadium to celebrate that occasion, and the kids brought out their chain links. There, where you're from, near Atlanta,

we worked with the NBC affiliate in Atlanta, Georgia, in 2011, and over 14,000 young people showed up at the Georgia Dome, which doesn't exist anymore, but they had brought so many chain links representing their acts of kindness, but they had to hire cranes to lift them up to the ceiling. We've got pictures of this. It's amazing. And 14,000 young people showed up to celebrate acts of kindness.

So we see those happen every year all across America. Friends of Rachel clubs bring their chain links. So that's just one thing. Another thing is what I mentioned earlier. They start in their school, what's called Rachel's Pantry. That's an action that they can participate in. So all the children, all the young people in that school that want to can contribute new clothing. They can go out to clothing stores and get donations so that they can create a Rachel's closet for clothing.

And the same thing for Rachel's pantry for food. We have schools where they're far-clothed to go to, I call them old folks homes, I'm an old folk. But senior citizens now, places where they're at, to just sing or to perform for them, or just to talk to them. People that are helping the homeless, people that are helping to hospitals and to cancer wards, following up on tragedies. So we can't even keep up with all the acts of kindness that happen every week here in the United States, not counting the rest of the world. So the chain reaction has become a very real thing. That's absolutely incredible. So I'm sure that there are parents listening wondering, well, how do I get this to my school?

If you want to bring Rachel's challenge to your school, there's two things that you can do. You can get in touch with us on the website. You can reach out. come to your school, we'll implement Rachel's Challenge, we'll start a four club, and then you can help keep that going beyond the day that we're there. But there's another way that you can contribute. You can give. You can donate to Rachel's Challenge. It's as little as $5 per student per year to have Rachel's Challenge in their school. And so every bit helps and is deeply appreciated. And I will put the links for Rachel's Challenge for the form and for

you know, the donations in the show notes for here. So whether you're watching this or listening to it on, you know, any of your platforms, you'll be able to see that. And for parents who don't know, it doesn't have to be the school that reaches out to them. You as a parent can reach out because you have interest. And then they get in touch and they'll reach out to you. So it could be a parent. It could be a teacher, somebody part of the PTA,

somebody who just feels that they need this in their community, and you can reach out. So just so you're aware of that. Now, for the next five, to 10 years, what would you like Rachel's challenge to accomplish that? It hasn't yet. One of the things that I would like to see is Rachel's challenge in every school in America. And I think that's possible. It's not possible by just us doing it. It would require help from others. and so that's one of my goals is to see every school in America have it as part of their culture, part of their climate changer.

We've done programs for, for example, Cal Rickin saw the Cal Rickin Jr. He's one of the most famous baseball players who's still alive, had this to come and do all of his baseball camps because he saw the need for an atmosphere of kindness, compassion, in those baseball camps. Chuck Norris, who's become a very dear friend, he and his wife, use our program and their program, which is called Kickstart Kids. And they're in 59 schools in Texas. We provide all of their character development programming.

And there's other organizations like that that could tap into what we do, and we partner with them and provide the character training program. So it doesn't have to be just the focal point on Rachel's Challenge, could be the focal point on their organization that partners with us to provide that programming in their school. So we are an atmosphere-changing program. We're a climate and culture-changing program.

And every school needs that. They need that as much as they need a football team, as much as they need a soccer team. They need something that's helping with the climate and culture in a positive way. We provide that. I'd argue that they need it more than the football team or the soccer team because, you know, for some, for a lot of kids, you know, it's unfortunate, you know, we don't think about it a lot or enough, but a lot of kids don't have kindness at home. And so sometimes that's the only place they can get it.

And that's, you know, often, you know, I'm sure you've heard it said oftentimes a child's first bully as a parent. Not always, but, you know, there are those cases. And so I think that, you know, this shows a child another side of the way that they can handle things that probably might resonate with them a little bit better because children for the most part I think most I mean they can be mean but for the most part I think they want to be nice they want to be helpful

is just a matter of showing them what to do if nobody's ever shown them then how do they know oh yeah that's right question oh go ahead Chrissy no it's fine I was just agreeing with you so what have I not asked that you guys want to share either one of you

or talk about and if there's nothing that's okay Oh, you've done a good job. Yeah. Justin's a great interviewer. I would say I love Daryl's answer about where Rachel's challenge is going, where we'd like it to see going. I would love Rachel's challenge in every school in America. And I'd like to also expand beyond schools.

I think that we need the same culture change that we bring to schools in businesses and communities and in different parts of the world as well. So very, very much looking forward to a bright future. and getting to expand this message beyond into all the schools and beyond? I would like to just, I'd like to add to what Christy just said, and that is we've had a tremendous impact in prisons that we've gone to, tremendous impact in prisons. I spoke at a hardcore prison a few years ago, and when I finished, the toughest guy in that prison,

he was he was he was they called him the bear a huge man tattoo tattooed from head to toe uh not the tattoos are bad i'm not saying that but he stood up and he said uh with tears in his eyes i haven't talked to my daughter in 20 years i'm calling her today and asking her to forgive me and the chaplain had tears in his eyes as well and later i heard that he had called his daughter and all the men in that prison when he stood up and said that, began to cheer. And so we see impact. I spoke to the regional presidents around the nation and Bank of America. They told me that it was the most powerful presentation they'd ever seen.

They have top-notch speakers come in. It wasn't because of me. It was because of the message. So we do have an impact on corporate America, on prisons, on schools, colleges. It's across the board. The story is universal, and it has the same impact. And everybody could use kindness. Yes.

That's right. Well, I appreciate you guys coming in today, Daryl, especially you sharing the story. You know, I hate, I'm always hesitant in a situation like this because to make you have to relive that day, I'm very sensitive. And I appreciate you giving me the privilege of being able to share your story and Rachel's story. So thank you for that opportunity. And thank you guys both for being here. Well, thank you, Justin. Thank you, Justin. We're so appreciative.

The views and opinions expressed in this episode are solely those of the individuals speaking and do not necessarily reflect those of the host. Unheard is intended to provide a platform for personal stories and lived experiences, not to establish facts, determine guilt, innocence, or provide legal, medical, or professional advice. Listeners are encouraged to conduct their own research and form their own conclusions. Thank you for listening to Unheard.