Unlonely with Dr. Jody Carrington - "I Come from Lower Sackville" - Jeremie Saunders

Episode Date: June 13, 2024

Jeremie Saunders, MSM, is an acclaimed actor, speaker, host, and producer, known for his impactful contributions to Canadian media across film, television, and podcasts. As the visionary co-founder of Snack Labs, he has propelled podcasts such as CBC’s Sickboy, Turn Me On and of course Everyone Comes From Somewhere to international recognition. Driven by a unique blend of humour and educational ambition, and informed by his personal journey with Cystic Fibrosis, Jeremie co-founded the podcast Sickboy with his closest pals, Taylor MacGillivary and Brian Stever. In 2023, the three best friends' efforts were formally recognized when they were honoured with the Meritorious Service Medal (Civil Division) by the Governor General of Canada, highlighting their instrumental role in destigmatizing topics of illness and death and fostering a supportive global community.In this episode Dr. Jody and Jeremie chat about CF, what it is, how it was to find out he had a life ending disease when he was 10 years old and to have come to terms with a short lifespan and THEN to get the chance to take a new medication that has given him a second chance at life. You may be surprised by the challenges that come with such incredible news. Follow Jeremie:InstagramSickboy PodcastSnack Labs ProductionsLinkedin Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Find your push. Find your power. Peloton. Visit Peloton at one you need, whenever you need it. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton. Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca. At the beginning of every episode, there will always be time for an acknowledgement. You know, the more we do this, people ask, why do you have to do the acknowledgement and every episode? I got to tell you, I've never been more grateful for being able to raise my babies on a land where so much sacrifice was made. And I think what's really critical in this process is that the ask is just

that we don't forget. So the importance of saying these words at the beginning of every episode will always be of utmost importance to me and this team. So everything that we created here today for you happened on Treaty 7 land, which is now known as the center part of the province of Alberta. It is home of the Blackfoot Confederacy, which is made up of the Siksika, the Kainai, the Pekinie, the Tatina First Nation, the Stony Nakota First Nation, and the Métis Nation Region 3. Our job, our job as humans, is to simply acknowledge each other. That's how we do better, be better, and stay connected to the good. welcome back welcome in every fellow human uh who i'm, I'm so grateful for you joining us today to, for another episode of the Everyone Comes From Somewhere podcast. I have to tell you something. Today is an episode I've been waiting for. I, there's a few humans I've met in my life that I think are remarkable. And this guy's in my top five. And I don't say that lightly. Uh, I cannot

wait for you to meet this human. I'm going to tell you a bit, a bit of a story about him first. Um, but I need you to know full disclosure, uh, he is one of the producers of this podcast. I met him a number of years ago, um, through our agent, my manager, uh, Jeff Lowness, who, uh, had just fallen in love with this, this group of guys. They, they kind of grew up together in Nova Scotia and knew a lot about each other. Um, and there's this guy named Jeremy that I started to hear a lot about and I want to tell you his story. Okay.

So Jeremy Saunders is who you're about to meet today and it's going to change your life. I promise you. So you, wherever you are, buckle up. Okay. you're about to meet today and it's going to change your life, I promise you. So wherever you are, buckle up, okay? Because Jarrett is an acclaimed actor, speaker, host, producer, known for his impactful contributions to Canadian media across film, television, and podcasts. He is the co-founder of Snack Labs and he has propelled podcasts such as CBC's Sick Boy, that's his, Everyone Comes From Somewhere, that's mine. And other podcasts like Turn Me On into international recognition.

He's the reason I think that this podcast has become so successful. He's so brilliant. Now, Jer, driven by a unique blend of humor and educational ambition and informed by his personal journey with cystic fibrosis, Jeremy co-founded the podcast Sick Boy with his closest pals, Taylor McGilvery and Brian Stever. Their mission, to revolutionize the conversation around health, illness, and mortality. In 2023, his efforts were formally

recognized when he was honored with a meritorious, how do I say that? Meritorious service medal. Meritorious service medal by the Governor General of Canada, highlighting his instrumental role in destigmatizing topics of illness and death and fostering a supportive global community. Jer's life is a testament to the power of resilience and versatility. Not only has he distinguished himself

in the realm of patient advocacy, but he has also achieved personal milestones, such as becoming a certified death doula, mastering forklift operation, fucking unbelievable, and the remarkable ability to ingest over 10 pills in a single attempt. I think I observed that today.

And then I want to tell you about a plot twist, what I'd really like to dive into today, because as I, when I knew this guy, all he knew the first time I met him was that life was going to be short. He and everybody who loves him believe that to be true because of cystic fibrosis, which is a fucking horrible life shortening illness that he's going to tell us a little bit about. But in 2021, a drug called Trikafta was approved by Health Canada and it essentially revolutionized, transformed the experience of those diagnosed with CF and potentially can give back the life to those who thought that theirs would be shortened.

And so unlike many people who kind of get a second lease on life or get news that can alter a life, Jer, his families, those who love him, have had to think about now what it might mean to grow old with this guy. And he now gets to have conversations around what it might mean to grow old with this guy. And he now gets to have conversations around what it might mean to engage in long-term relationships, maybe even become a dad, all of those things that he just assumed for the vast majority of his days weren't a possibility. So, you know, this question, Jeremy Saunders, everyone comes from somewhere. I've told this whole beautiful story about you and I want to know from you where do you come from well uh I mean considering I've edited every

one of your episodes thus far uh you would think that I would have pieced together what the best answer would be uh and I've heard so many people say it on the podcast oh wow that's a really that's a really tough question um and it is like that is a really it's it's a confronting question i mean i could give you the i could give you the answer that like sometimes people go oh i'm from i'll say it i'm from lower sackville uh actually you know what that's not true i'm from st john's newfoundland stop so i i was born in Newfoundland in 1988. My whole entire family is from Newfoundland. So here's my answer. That's why I love you even more.

So my answer to where do I come from? I come from a family of Newfies. I come from a family of storytellers. I come from. Two parents that. Are incredibly strong and beautiful and hilarious. And who. Did the best that they could do with what they had at their disposal. I was forced to grapple with a lot of really challenging and confronting issues that shaped me into the person that I am today. And without trying to sound vain, I really love who I am today. Um, but I grew up in Lower Sackville, so I come from Lower Sackville, Nova Scotia, which is,

which is, which is a real shame. Uh, I, you know, I, here's what I love about you is, um, I think working with you and your two best friends in this process of creating a space of vulnerability and connection can only be done when the people who I think produce this whole place believe that to the core of them. And I don't know if I have met a more reflective, intuitive human being than you. And I often wonder about being faced very early with your own mortality. I mean, tell me, born in 1988, at what point did you, were you diagnosed with CF? Is that a disease that you know right away when your baby is born? What happens? Yeah. So in 1988, this was before the time where newborns were automatically screened for CF.

Okay. So that happens now. That does happen now. Okay. Yeah. So when I was born, my parents found out that I had CF when I was 18 months old. I was diagnosed at 18 months old. Actually, it's kind of a fun story. So I was born, came into the world. I was the first child of Cobb and Maxine Saunders. And I was having these issues, a lot of digestion issues. And I can get into what CF is, how it affects patients, maybe a little bit later. But basically, I was having digestion issues.

My mom's a nurse. My dad's a car parts auto salesman. And they knew something was up. They were taking me back and forth from the hospital. And my dad was in a meeting or with a coworker, and he was expressing to this person, like, yeah, you know, Jer's having all these issues, and he's, you know, he's not digesting his food,

he's losing all this weight, and the guy that he was with was like, you know what, Cub? This is what you should do. Go home tonight, take Jer, put him in the bath, clean him off real good, take him out of the bath, dry him off, turn him around and lick the back of his neck. And if he tastes like salt, I bet you he has CF. And so my dad's like, what? Okay. All right. I mean, at this point, my dad's like, fuck it. I'll try anything. So he

drives home, takes me, puts me in the bath, washes me off, takes me up, dries me off, licks the back of my neck. And he said, the moment he licked my neck, he was like, Jerry, you tasted like a salt lick. And in that moment I knew. And so he went and he told my mom, he said, I think Jerry's got CF. And my mother was like, cop, no, there's no way. And he said, let's go right now. Let's go get him. Let's go tell them to test for it. And that's what they did the next day. And they ended up finding out that I had CF.

So the part, so why, why does the salty baby? Um, well, that's often the first kind of sign or symptom that parents will notice about their babies is that they taste really salty. And it's because patients with CF have like two to five times more salt in their sweat than your typical person. And that all has to do with the inner workings of how CF affects Okay. So CF is a genetic disease. It is where there's a genetic mutation that causes a malformation of a particular protein. And that protein has to do with transferring sodium in and out of the cells of the body. And so with this like sodium issue, I mean, if there's a doctor,

if there's a physician listening to this, they're going, what the fuck are you talking about? No, it's perfect. But it's, you know, somewhere in that realm. And so with that, without this ability to transfer water in and out of the cells properly, it leads to mucus, a big buildup of mucus.

All throughout the system. So it's not just So it's mostly known as the lung disease, but it affects every organ in the body that produces mucus. So the pancreas, the lungs, the intestines. And so as a part of this, there's this issue with an excess amount of salt. Okay. And that salt comes through the skin. Therefore, you have a salty taste. Okay. Baby tastes like a salt lake. And the biggest then debilitating factor. So they explain this diagnosis to mom and dad. What do they know to be true at that time? What do you then know to be true? Like, do you remember the first time that you understood this was a part of who you were or or did this just what this was just a knowing from 18 months on yeah i mean like i i think i was always i was always aware that i had cf um and you know it was

it primarily because there was all these elements to my daily routine that were very different from all my peers so you know anytime i ate food I had to take oral enzymes. You know, I take like 40 pills a day. I've taken around 40 pills a day my whole life. Twice a day, I would have to do like a nebulizer. So, you know, take a, there's a machine hooked to a tube with a face mask and that machine takes liquid medicine like Ventolin and turns it into vapor. And so I'm breathing that in for, you know, two hours a day, every day. So like those types of things, it was very evident that like, oh, I, you know, I do this, but why doesn't, why doesn't Alex have to do this? Yeah. But the, but there was an element where, you know, I knew, I knew that much, but I didn't know the full

gravity of the situation. So when my parents, when I was born, what they essentially told my parents was, you know, you guys, if you guys get to see his 20th birthday, you're going to be very, very fortunate. Um, and so they knew this and this was something that they didn't inform me of I didn't know this part I found out when I was when I was about 10 that CF was a fatal disease so like that was the moment where CF went from oh this is like an everyday nuisance to wait what the fuck like oh no this is like an everyday nuisance to wait, what the fuck? Like, oh no, this is. Do you remember that moment? Oh yeah. Where were you?

I was in my living room at home and I found a pamphlet and the pamphlet was simply just titled all about cystic fibrosis. And I'm pretty sure it was like a pamphlet intended for my school teacher to give them a sense of like, Hey, you have a kid with CF in your class. Here's what you can expect. And one of the like first sentences in the pamphlet was, uh, cystic fibrosis is a fatal genetic disease. And whenever I talk about this, I, I, I make a note that like when I was 10, Mortal Kombat was my life. Like I was so good at Mortal Kombat, so addicted. And so I knew the word fatal.

Right. Fatality is like, you know, it's the finishing move in Mortal Kombat. But the next sentence was where it kind of it it brought everything into this context that i really like understood which was the average life expectancy of someone living with cf is 30 years of age and like that was a moment where i just i just was like wait what like what? Like, what? Yeah.

Does anybody else know this? Does everyone know this? Like, yeah. Yeah. And so. So what did that 10-year-old boy do? I did what most boys at that time, probably what a lot of boys do today.

I took that info and I just buried it as deep down as I could did you tell mom or dad that you read that no no stop yeah yeah so so this so I mean I've talked with my parents about this at length now as an adult but so okay so you know I'm 10 right now. I'm 36. When I found this out, uh, at 10, my parents were younger than I am now. And so when I talked to my mom about this, I was like, why didn't you, why didn't you tell me? And she said, well, it's because that's what they told us to do. You know? So like at the time, I don't think they do this anymore. I hope they don't. But at the time, my mom would go into the clinic. I'd have to go to

clinic every three months, the CF clinic. That's why I live here in Halifax. We're recording this in Halifax right now, which is where I'm based. We moved, my family uprooted from St. John's, moved to Halifax to be closer to the IWK, which is the children's hospital here. And so at the IWK, the CF clinic, we're telling my mother every day, you know, every time she would go and she goes, hey, so should I bring it up with Jer? Should I talk with Jer about the, you know, the life expectancy thing? And they were like, oh, no, no, no, no, no. Don't, you aren't the one to bring it up. He will find out and then he will come to you with questions. So just let that process naturally occur. Okay. And that's not what happened. I found out I didn't go to her and she continued asking these questions.

She found out I knew when I was 16. And we still didn't have the conversation. We didn't end up having the conversation until I was 20. Yeah. And so slow it down for me a little bit. So other siblings or is it just you? I have one sister. Okay. Yeah. Natasha. She's two years younger. Okay. Does not have CF. Okay. Far more good looking and responsible than I am. And at 10, like, let's start to think about how you integrate this whole understanding into your body. Right. Yeah. So do you really consciously have those thoughts, right? That, okay, so I've got potentially 20 years left. And so you're like, I'm going gonna live like

my hair is on fire or were you like fuck it i don't know this to be true like how does this shape you i don't think i had so so what i what i remember kind of thinking the way i the way i sort of the way i pieced it all together was like okay i 10. So that means I can do what I've done this, thus far two more times. And then I'm dead. Like that was the way that my brain kind of like pieced that together. But the, the way that I, the way that I, I don't know, like allowed that information to shape the, the decisions that I made day by day. I don't think that started until, you know, I was around 16, 17, 18. Your brain got a little bit older. Yeah. I mean, my son is 11 and I'm just thinking about what that,

how heavy that must have been to hang on to. And do you remember thinking, you know, I don't want, it would be scary to have this conversation with my mom and dad? No. So when I say I buried it, I think I really, I think I really did. Like, I think I took that moment and I went, nah, I'm not, I'm not going to think about this. And, and I, I think I just sort of compartmentalized it, shoved it but what you know in retrospect i think how that played out how that manifested in me was a deep deep resentment borderline like hatred for uh specifically for my mom like i really resented my mother for that.

And, you know, I, like I remember, I remember so many times growing up, like memories of my mom just weeping, like keening, begging me to just show a semblance of some sort of affection.

And I think when, when those moments were occurring, I think what was like happening in my head was like, oh, well, you know, all teens don't want to like hug their mom or tell their mom that they love them or give their mom a kiss or whatever. So like, there's nothing wrong with this, but the, like the amount of deep emotion that was just pouring out of my mom, like truly begging for me to do this. It, you know, when I became an adult and look back at that, I was like, Oh my, Oh wow. Oh my God. No. Like it was way more than just that. You know, that, that, that came from the fact that you, I don't know, felt robbed or felt betrayed by this person that you, that you loved or that you trusted, that you thought was like the one that had all the answers. If I just like, it crushes me to think about my mom at those, at those moments, like at those,

those moments of me growing up and her just, just, just bawling her eyes out, you know? And how I think about it, as you're telling this story as a mom, if I knew that one of my boys had a limited amount of time, but I didn't want to talk to them about that. Or I didn't think they knew. I think that it maybe wasn't even necessarily in response to your lack of response, but to her deep knowing that she may have to bury you. And maybe the expectation was, this is how kids respond. This is how this, my son is wired, but I know i might not get him forever and that knowing as a mom just implores that need for like hey hey hey hey hey and you're like get fucked as many you know as many kids do right and so i wonder if it was even more about just the knowing as a mom yeah right that this this might not be you know i i get what was your sister's name

natasha i thought that was it you know natasha for all bets you know are on here she's going to be here forever but this guy you know you're the first you're the baby you're the boy all the things so yeah i just and so now what's up in wait. Okay. So you leave this, you grow up in this community, Lower Sackville. We can cut that out. Okay, thank you. Apparently this is a big problem. I don't know about this from Alberta. But the idea is then how does that shape your desire to sort of enter a career?

Because you become an actor. You like step into this wild world of emotional expression and connecting people. And like, have you always been this gregarious and outgoing and like, regardless of CF, do you think that's a part of who you would have been regardless? Or like, how does this all come together? Yeah, I think so. I mean, I was always the, I was always the, the clown, you know, it was always like every, everything, every choice that I made, whether, especially

from like a, there was like formative social years, it was all about like, all right, well, I can make people laugh pretty easy. So just go for the laugh. Always go for the laugh. Even at the, even at the expense of your own like wellbeing, go for the laugh. and um and i think where the where like where cf sort of played a role in how i made decisions that i think that i think that came that started to form when i was around 16 so that when I said that my mom found out when I was 16, that I knew she found out because in grade 10 or 11, I had this, um, this English, uh, project, English 10 project. And it was to write an autobiography about yourself. And in that autobiography, I had a whole chapter just titled

My Future. And so I handed it in. I got a really great grade on it. And a couple of days after I got the assignment back, the teacher, Mr. Strugdell, amazing teacher, God rest his soul. And he called my mom and he said, hey, Maxine, did you happen to read Jeremy's autobiography assignment? And she was like, no, no, he doesn't share anything with me. And he was like, okay, I think you really need to read it. And she was like, why? And he was like, there's just some things in there that I think you need to read and be aware of. So she went rooting through my room, found it, read it. And this chapter titled My Future was basically this like, woe is me sort of expression of what's the point? I don't have a future. No one's going to want to marry the dying guy. Kids are out of the question because I don't want to have a kid and die on

them before they even make it to grade school. And when I think about this kind of stuff, it makes me feel useless. And so my mom reads this and was like, and this is the moment where my mom goes, oh my God, he knows. What the fuck? I thought he was going to come to me and ask me questions. He never did. How long has he known this? How long has this been going on? He's clearly thought this out. But I think for me, when I, when I wrote that, when I wrote that thing out, it was the first time that I actually had to confront these thoughts. Yeah. It was the first time that I ever spoke them out and not spoke them, but like put them to paper. It was like, I've never, I never talked about it. So it was the first time I ever like

journaled about it or put it down on paper. So I was getting these thoughts out of my head that had just like bested and grown into this way that I was viewing the world. And I don't know if this was like a conscious decision. I think it was more subconscious, but I think the act of putting that to paper put me in a place where I was confronted with the fact that I had like clearly two two paths to choose from here one path is like choose the path of letting fear consume your life where you're not able to do the things that you feel like you want to do because everything is shrouded in fear because the clock is ticking or

fuck that use the fear as a tool to pioneer the life that you want to create and it was around 16 like after that after that assignment where I just started to like make decisions that stemmed from this idea that I might only have 10 years left. So what, what are you going to do? Well, you're going to, you're going to go for the laugh. What, what makes a better story? This or that? Go for the better story. The next time you write your autobiography, make sure it's a fucking banger. So what's the decision you are going to make right now at this point in life? That is the more exciting decision. And he just came to that. You just came to that in and of this own body, right? Once you put it

out there, you're like, okay, wow. And still recalling as it was me mom didn't address you so four years later at 20 did you like at what point did you be like what the fuck mom it was was that a come to jesus oh it was it was rough it was a rough moment so i i'd moved away i went to toronto uh for university did you know she had found that no okay i had. I had no idea. Yeah. Went to Toronto, studied acting at Ryerson University, now Toronto Metropolitan University. And I came home for Christmas and we, it was me, my mom, my dad, and my sister having Christmas dinner. And it was like the classic Christmas dinner from hell scenario where I don't know how it came to be. Right. But there was like, I was probably in a pissy mood, didn't really want to be home,

was having a good time on my own in Toronto, building a new life. And something was said. And then it came out. I don't know who said it, who brought it out first, but it came out and it, the whole table just turned into like a, like a UFC match where it was just like. Did Natasha know? She knew that I knew. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And like she, she was aware and I started lashing out at my mom and then natasha started like standing up for her and i was like whose fucking side are you on like and

and my dad was like jesus christ guys like can we just fucking enjoy the ham you know yeah jesus yeah his birthday is at hand here fuckers oh. Yeah, and it was a disaster. And then it wasn't until a year later, I joined this cult. No, actually, you might have to cut that out. I think they're very litigious. But I did landmark form, which is, it's not a cult.

It's basically like a self-help weekend sort of retreat. And it's meant to force you to confront all of your regrets. Okay. I mean, that's a part of it. And one of the parts in this weekend-long event is, write down the people that you have harmed and call them and acknowledge. And so, you know, I wrote down like Alison Poitier, my, you know, my, like my grade seven girlfriend that I cheated on by like, you know, by touching Missy's boob or whatever. Like that was my, that was in my, in my mind, I was like, yeah, that was, you know, by touching Missy's boob or whatever. Like that was my, that was in my, in my mind,

I was like, yeah, that was, you know, I, I never apologized to Allison, my first girlfriend, because I, I cheated on her. And I was trying to think, who else did I, who else have I like, have I hurt? And then it came to me and I thought about my mom and I was like, geez, you know, I don't think I've really like actually talked to my parents about this thing. So after I called Allison and told her about touching Missy's boob um to which she was like I hadn't seen Allison in years and I remember she picked up she was like living in Texas or something and she was like Jeremy how are you and I was like I have to apologize I I touched Missy's boob and she was like oh oh yeah okay I knew that. It's okay. I mean, we were dating for about three days.

And I was like, I know. I just, you know. It's part of the program. I work in the fucking program, all right? I'm doing a cult. And they asked me to. So then after that call, I called my mom and I just said, I'm sorry. And she said, she was like, honey, for what? And I just burst. I just had this overwhelming expression of all those years,

like all the 10 years, 11 years of just pent up frustration and disappointment and sadness and regret. And it just flooded out of me. And she started bawling and my dad here. So he picks up the other line and now all three of us are on. And, uh, and it was like,

all of a sudden I was, and like this call, this, this phone call was like the moment where it clicked all All those moments of my mom weeping and begging. Like that was the moment where I realized, oh, right. Like I wasn't calling to heal the harm based on that. It was just based on the fucking fight we had at the kitchen table. But it was during this call that I was like, I realized, oh my God.

All of that, like I hated you. I hated you for years. I can't believe that. And like my mom is, oh my God, she's just the sweetest. She's just, and she's so strong and she's so beautiful. Like she's just such an incredible person. And it was like, I didn't know, I didn't see any of that until this moment. And it was,

um, let me call it what you will, but like Lynn, that, that landmark form was such a integral part of my like ability to grow and to to really acknowledge what had happened and then like from that moment forward it was just about just opening my arms up so wide to just welcome my mother into my life. The holidays are coming,

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Peloton has thousands of classes built to push you. We know how life goes. New father, new routines, new locations. What matters is that you have something there to adapt with you, whether you need a challenge or rest. And Peloton has everything you need, whenever you need it. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton. Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca. You know what I love so much about that is I think about that little boy, you know, at 10 and what capacity he would have had to put that fear and that anger and, you know, who did this to me? How did this happen in my body? And why don't I only have this many years left? Right. And you only put that in places where it's safe enough to.

And I love how you describe her today, right? That she is strong and she is relentless. There was that even in all of the memories of rejection that you have of giving her that experience, that she was like, no matter what, like, I got it, I got it, I got it. Right. And it just is just such this epitome of the human relationship, right. Is that it's just so hard sometimes to come back around to that place of having those hard conversations. And she was so skilled at that always. Right. And that, that message from those physicians, he'll come back when he's ready, actually did come to fruition.

Right. Yeah. You're right. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And you knew and she knew and all of these things. Right. But like the, the direction always was he'll come to you and you did

at 20. Yeah and it's I'm glad you said that because like I think a lot about sometimes it's really hard to to bring yourself into a mindset to think about this one particular thing. But, you know, especially when we started sick boy and we started having these conversations, I, you know, I was doing whatever like CBC interviews or,

or, you know, answering questions after a keynote or something. There's this question that comes up quite often. That's like, you know, if you, if you could go back and,

you know, do it all over again, or like, if you had, if you had the ability to live your life without CF, would you do, would you do it? And like, the answer is always, oh no, like absolutely not. It might sound, uh, it might sound crazy, but like CF is the ultimate gift. It is the best thing that has ever happened to me, period. There's no question. And I think when we go through really challenging experiences in life, it's a really good exercise after the dust has settled to sit back and to think, okay, I went through this horrible thing. If I could rewind and experience life again without that one particular thing, would I do it again? I think the initial response is, well, fuck yeah, I would do it again and not have to go through that awful thing. But when you really take time to really think that through and then look at where you are

in this current moment, I think more often than not at 10 if I could rewind and do that over again where I read that sentence and I went straight to my mom to ask her then would I go back and do it differently and I've actually never thought about this until right now, since you just brought this up, because it did come around. I did end up going to her. It just panned out a little differently and took 11 years longer than it was expected to. I don't think I would do it again any differently. Because again, like I said, I love who I am. And if I had gone back and chose a different path, I wouldn't be who I am. I wouldn't be here. And, and, and I think that's fair. And I think oftentimes I think about that, you know, my story, right? So my mom, I have a full sister and I often think so many times, why didn't you tell me, right? We had such a close relationship. Like, why didn't you, why didn't you? And, and even, you know, once I became a mom and all of those things, like, why did it take so long? And I even said, if my sister found us, if she had never found us, would you have told me? Like, on your deathbed, would you have said it? And you know what she said to me? Absolutely not. I said, what do you mean why? And she said, because they told me not to. And it's so interesting when I think about your mom as a young woman, first baby, she's a nurse. She knows all the things about medical things, but they said, don't tell him.

He will come to you when he's ready. And it's so interesting about what, what things get stuck in our systems that, you know, upon reflection later on, like, what the fuck was I thinking? You know, like, why didn't I, when I, when his teacher called me or when I, why didn't I just check in? Hey, what do you know about CF? You know, other than the, anything else you've been learning, you know, and we reflect often, I think in relationships in it, particularly, you know, with our children or the, you know, our, in our marriages, the thing that's a matter of the most to us. But I think we, I love how you started this today. We do the best we can with what we had at the time. And I truly think, you know, if I think

about my mom or your mom in those days, in this time where so much has changed, our capacity to think about things differently or to go back in time and step in. You know, you could wish you could for a thousand ways to Sunday, but you can't fucking anyway. That's right. So what is it because of this? And I think this is the interesting thing. So you go to acting school,

you get on with CBC, you become a superstar of a children's program called Art Zuka. Does anybody, if you listen, if you Google Art Zuka, you will see Jeremy Saunders is the hottest child actor singing nursery rhymes oh such a fucking cutie i can't even tell you and so you make a splash in cbc and what's going on in your head like as those years are ticking by you're taking on piles of medication Do you go through periods of being sick and well and sick and well? Like, does it kick you in the ass quite a bit, this

disease? I, you know what? I, I mean, I definitely had, I definitely had periods where it was hard, but, but I, I think when I, I know so many people that, that had CF, I know a lot of people that have had CF and died. Yeah. I know a lot of people that have CF and have gone through multiple double lung transplants. So it's like, you know, when I look at that in comparison to that, I was fucking doing great. Right. But I did, it did, you know, I did have hard times, you know, like on average, I was probably admitted to the hospital typically like once a year, you know, two to three weeks at a time. It, it definitely, it definitely like took a toll on me, but I, but I, I, I think I was one of the lucky ones because it could have been way worse. Yeah. Yeah. And it changed the course of, or you

tell me, did it change the course of deciding to get married, to have children, to. Yeah. Yeah. So, so it's funny. Like when I was, when I wrote that autobiography, it was like, well, I'm not going to get married. So, you know, like why I'm, no one's going to want to marry me. So there's no point there, but that, so, so again, when I was like 18 or 19, making that, those decisions of like, okay, I'm finishing high school. What am I going to do next? You know, all my friends were like, well, you know, mom and dad said that I got to like go to commerce, get a commerce degree. Cause like, that's what, that's how you're going to make money. Or like, you know, my parents are forcing me to become a dentist. So I got to go to, and I was like, all right, well, my parents haven't really actually told me I got to do

anything. So what do I want to do? Well, I was, my plan was to become an athlete. I was, I was a competitive canoe kayaker and I was really, really good at it. Um, actually Brian, it's Brian Stever, co-host of Sick Boy and co-founder of Snack Labs. Uh, him and I were like competitors. We were frenemies and and he would him and his brother were phenoms and i was kicking their ass and i had cf so i was like you know i was i was the best paddler in atlanta canada i was you know shooting for the canada games team i was going all right i'm gonna go to the olympics ended up with a knee injury basically ended my paddling career. And that same, like within a few months of that happening, my childhood best friend, Ryan, uh, was on the improv team. And he was like, Hey man, you're not training two times a day now. Like you've got time in your life. You should come

audition for the improv team. It's super fun. And I was like, okay. So I went, did an audition and it was like that moment, boom. I was like, oh my God, this is awesome. Like I just, I'm just given free reign to be as goofy and as outlandish as I possibly can be and with a competitive edge. Hell yeah, let's do it. And so that was like my introduction into performance. And then from there, fell madly in love with my drama teacher, Erin Morris, still to this day, like I catch up with her three or four times a year, still like very close. She played a pivotal role in where I've ended up today. And she cast me as the lead in the high school musical. And that was like, oh, like a different type of performance. This is very fun. I got to memorize lines. I'm singing and dancing. And so when it came to like, all right, I'm graduating. What comes next? I was

like, well, I'm going to go, I'm going to become an actor. I'm going to get a bachelor's degree in arts and study acting. And I knew that that was a financially, that was the dumbest idea in the world. I was fully aware of that. I even alluded to that. I was the valedictorian in my high school. And so in my speech, I was like, hey, you know what? I'm going to go become an actor. And I know that that's probably going to make me broke, but that's what's going to make me happy. And so like focus on that, whatever it is that you guys's going to make me happy. And so like, focus on that, whatever it is that you guys are going to go off and do with your lives, just ensure whatever you're doing makes you happy. And that was like my mantra. That was my mantra.

It was coming from this place of going, you're 18. You might not make it to 28, 30 years old. It was this number is 30. Like you're going to be dead by 30. So just do what makes you happy. And every decision was do what makes you happy. So when I, when I got to university, I went to, I went to Toronto and in now ex-wife and co-host of Turn Me On that I host with her. And I met her and I was like, she's pretty and I like her and I'm going to die in eight years. So I'll ask her to marry me. And it's a short-term contract. So like, she's probably going to be say yes. It's like, you know, there's not a long commitment here, you know, get on board, have some fun. And then I'm out, out the door and she can have another, you know, she'll be young. She can still have another, another partner.

And so I just, I just asked her to marry me at like 22 21 and she said yes and we got married and it was like you know so again like just coming back to your question like the when I was 16 it was like gloom and doom yeah but there was this spark that that clicked at one moment where I went no no no no like this, no. Like this is actually, this is awesome. You don't have to grow old. Like this, you're fucking Peter Pan. Like you, you just, you're going to be young forever. There's no future. There's no future that you have to worry about. Be broke. You're not even going to live long enough to be broke, dude. Yeah. So you didn't think about saving? No, fuck no. My bank account was just a piggy bank.

It was like, you know, retirement? No way. Your body's not going to get old. Your back's not going to fucking hurt. You know, do whatever you want. Now I'm going to live till I'm 80 and I'm fucked. But it felt good when it was happening. Fast forward. Yeah.

So you come back to Halifax after this, you, you host this CBC show, uh, did remarkably well. Uh, and then when you settle back in back here, when, when does that happen? Because, you know, plot twist, as you heard in the intro, um, health Canada approves this drug that is basically a new lease on life for people with CF. You qualify. And I was just new into your world when this was happening. I remember Jeff, our mutual friend saying to me, guess what just happened? And I remember thinking like, Oh, isn't that nice? And, but not understanding, like I just said to you that it, you know, gave a new lease on life, but you were like, no, listen, you need to understand that it was like a revolutionary understatement to people with this life ending disease. And this drug essentially allows your body to function as, I mean, you tell me.

As though it doesn't have CF. So it's not a cure, right? I still genetically, I still have CF. But what Trikafta does is unlike all the other meds that I've taken my whole life, they're all meant to treat the symptoms. So my lungs are filled with mucus and I'm coughing up blood and my lung functions at 50%. Well, I take the nebulizer to inhale the Ventolin, which opens up my small airways, which then I needed to break down food and my intestines are filled with mucus so I don't actually absorb nutrients, well, I take those oral enzymes and it helps that to a degree.

Trikafta doesn't treat the symptoms. It treats at the source. So at that molecular level where that protein that's malformed, Trikafta is going down and it's folding that protein into the correct shape so that my body can actually act a lot more like a typical person. In my DNA, my genetics, I still have CF. Right. But the CF is not expressing itself the way that it had for 30. How different do you feel? Oh my God. Like night and day. It's so hard to put into words to describe how, how different everything is. Like everything from physical to my mental state, to my energy. Like when I started taking it, my lungs, my lung function was at 50%. Okay. The lowest it had been my whole life.

Because CF was starting to take over. Yes. Was that fair to say? It's a progressive disease. So like, you know, more often than not, that's the way that someone's going to die. Your, your lungs decline. It's through all that mucus and all that coughing and all those, you know, all the infections that causes this fib 50%. And that, that 50% was pretty rapid from like 75% over the span of like five years. So it was like, I was on this pretty steady slope downward. And when I took Trikafta, the first dose, prior to taking that dose, if you had spent any time with me, I had this very distinct cough that would happen all throughout the day consistently. All the previous episodes of Sick Boy prior to Trikafta, it's like Jair's just coughing throughout. All my interviews with whoever I was doing interviews with all you just hear me coughing through it two days after taking trikafta my cough

disappeared it hasn't come back two months after taking trikafta my lung function went from 50 to 80 the highest it had been in like well over a decade my i i people people with CF because of the malabsorption and the inability to like digest food, gaining weight for me was next to impossible my whole life. I remember when I was like, I don't know, I was like 14 and my dad was like, Jared, if you, as soon as you hit a hundred pounds, buddy, I'm going to give you a hundred bucks. So just fucking just put the butter in you, eat the peanut butter, eat the cheese, like all the stuff all the stuff just you know but the diet of a cf-er is that they don't get there they don't give a fuck about what you put in your system as long as it's high calorie high fat so you're just pounding calories like 4 000 calories a day fat anywhere you can get it put butter on everything, wrap everything in bacon, just eat fat. One, I think I was 138 pounds, like the

heaviest I had been. And, uh, two months into taking Trikafta, I was 175 pounds. I was overweight. I started to get fat and I was like, this is fucking awesome. I'm getting fat. And then like three weeks later, I was like, this has to stop. Like I getting fat. And then like three weeks later, I was like, this has to stop. Like I've got to make a drastic life, life altering decision here. I got to take out the fat, take out the calories. So, but, but, but yeah, so it was like a total, it was a total transformation of how every day felt. Tell me about the moment that you knew you were going to have access to this drug. Uh, I was sitting in my living room. It was like the height of COVID. Like the height of like, you don't leave your house. And it was announced that Trikafta was coming to Canada.

And I just broke, like I broke down. I think I I I think I recorded like a story to put out on sick boys Instagram or something and I was just I was just like brought to tears it was amazing that from that period uh till I got the drugs in my hand it was about a year and then when I got the drug it was kind of like a this is weird like it feels like there should be more of a, I don't know, a thing. I don't know. Like it's, it's like the novelty wore off or the excitement kind of wore off and it was like, Oh, it's here. Okay. And so I took the first dose on an episode of sick boy, me and the guys sat here in the studio and I took my first dose.

As soon as I put it in my mouth and swallowed it, I started to convulse and have a seizure to try to scare the guys. Shut up. How do I not fucking know that story? But yeah, and so we celebrated. We had this big thing. And then it was just, it was like every day after that was like a kind of a light bulb moment of like, oh, I took my dog Donut for a walk up Citadel Hill, which Citadel Hill is pretty steep.

Yeah, I'm aware. And like I would get winded. I would be out of breath walking from my condo to here, which is a two minute walk. And there is no incline. And I was taking Donut for a walk and I walked him up the walk and there is no incline. Um, and I was taking donut for a walk and I, I walked him up the Hill and I got to the top and it was like, I was up to the top and I was there for maybe three or four minutes. And then I went, Oh my God, I'm not even remotely out of breath right now. That's why that is wild. Tell me what that's like in the last year and a half of now coming to terms with the fact that

you might not be the first to go in this group of friends that you might actually see your parents go before you that now that you don't have any savings, you're fucked. Um, what about being a dad? All of those things that were just unquestionable before. Um, tell me a little bit about what that's like. Yeah. So like the first, the first year of Trikafta, it was so exciting about all these physical changes and my energy and even my mental state that it didn't really dawn on me how ontologically fucked up this is going to be. And I never thought about it. And I had thought about it. And it was, and I had people ask sometimes, like usually whenever I, whenever somebody hears a story about Trikafta, almost always the response is that's amazing. And I was in that state at the first year of like, yeah, it is right. Yeah, totally. And then, you know, I went into the

CF clinic and they were like, so how, like, how are you doing? I was like, I'm amazing. You know, like walked up to the hill. I was, I wasn't winded. I'm, I'm fat. Like this is fucking awesome. And they're like, cool. How are, so how are you dealing like with it mentally though? Because we, you know, we have the psychologist on call. So if you want to have any coverage, and I was like, what, what, what is that? Is, does, does Trikafta like, um, is there, is there a chance it might give me depression? And they were like, oh no, no, no, no. It's, it's just that this is, this is kind of a shock for some people. And I was like, oh, not me. Not me, dude. This is fucking sweet. I am all about it. And then I think like maybe there was

like the seed was planted. It was like inception where I started to think like, oh, yeah. Oh, well, actually, hold on. They probably said that for that for a reason and why and how does, how can that affect? And then the more, the more I started thinking about it, the more I was like, wait a minute. Yeah. Whoa, hold on. There's a whole bunch of things here that I did not consider. Finance, financially, that is one of those things where I was like, yeah, wow. Yeah. God, I really didn't set myself up for success. Like I really, I put myself into debt thinking that it wasn't like, I'm going to die. Yeah. Like, yeah, yeah. Government of Canada, good luck. Thank you for your service. So like that was, that was like the first thing I think that came to mind of like, oh, right. Okay. I didn't think this through but then that the financial

piece that really quickly started to like fall down the the ladder of like priority of what's i need to be focusing on here as as the as the like the the veil of of the excitement of this thing started to wear off or then I started thinking like wait like what does this mean for everything else in my life that I that I like what does this mean for the way that I've chosen to live my life you know again I feel like and and to be to be frank I'm still going through that right now it's only been been in the last, like, I don't know, six, seven months where like, I've really started to confront these like very confusing feelings that come with this thing. And again, I continue to hear from people that say, that's amazing. And I, and I still respond with, yeah, it is. But there's this voice in the back

of my head that wants to go. Yeah, it is. And also it's fucking actually hard. It's actually kind of confusing. And I had this moment not long ago where my perspective on this was kind of like rocked when I was having a conversation with a buddy of mine who has been an acquaintance for a number of years and he moved to town. Um, and you know, he doesn't, he didn't know many people here. And so I was like, Hey, let's go grab a beer. Uh, and so I don't know him that well, but like, you know, we've, I've seen him around and, and we, we have like a bit of a relationship. So it was like, cool, new friend. Like I'll invite, you know, this guy, Mikey into my life and we'll, we'll hang out. So we went, we were having beers and he was like, Hey, what's the deal? Like, weren't you supposed to die? Like, what's the deal with the, I was like, Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. So I told him, I said, like, try Kafta, had this thing, told him the whole thing. And again, expecting him to say,

that's amazing. But instead he goes, his immediate response to that whole situation is, holy shit, that must be really hard. And it was the first moment that I had permission with somebody else to go, oh, oh, you get it, okay. And before I could even respond, he said, you know what? That's like if you were in a relationship with someone who's in the military and they go overseas, they fight in this war,

and then you get a knock on your door and when you open it up, it's some representative from the military, and they say, your partner's died. They were killed in action. And you grieve the loss of this relationship that you had. And a few years down the road,

you've gone through your grief. You've found a new partner. You had kids. You've got this new life. And then you get another knock on the door. And you open it up and it's your partner that you thought was dead. And they say, hey, I'm back. I was a prisoner of war. They thought I was dead. I survived. I escaped. I'm home. What do you do in that moment?

I mean, it's amazing. You're here. This is amazing. But I've moved on. I've got a whole other life. What do you do with this information? How do you, how do you handle this? It's not the way it was supposed to go. Yeah. It's, it's the, the, the, the scene in, in Castaway when, when, when he, when he comes home and knocks on Helen Horn, Helen Hunt's door and he's like, I'm back. And she's like, Oh, I'm amazing. But I'm, I've, I've moved on. Like, I'm so sorry. And, and so, you know, this, this news of finding out, hey, you thought you were going to die. You grieved the life. You grieved the future that you weren't going to have. And you moved on. And that was okay. And you found this other life, this way to live your life. This was your new family. This was your new life. And you are settled in and it feels amazing.

And then all of a sudden you get a knock on the door and it's your future that you didn't think you had because you grieve that future and your future is going, Hey, I'm here. I'm here. What do you do? Like, how do you, and so when Mikey said this, I was just like, holy fuck shit. I, oh my God, I am Helen Hunt. Like this is, I'm like,'m like this is you know and it was the first time that I was able to I was able to just like conceptualize how how fucking wild this is and and what did the boys do what did your mom and dad do like Like your wife at the time, your partner, like what, what happens then? Like, have you spoke to them about it? Is this just sort of a, an unwritten thing? Like, you know, when I watched the two boys who, I mean, adore you more than life, the three of you have the most unique relationship I've ever seen in the history of the world.

So much to the point that I wanted my children, my oldest to watch this. And so Marty and I brought our boys to be in your presence because it is the most unique friendship I have ever seen ever. They enter into this relationship thinking they won't have you for long. And I remember, you know, you were excited when Taylor had his first baby. You just wanted to meet her. That was the goal goal and now the second one's here and now we're talking about you even considering becoming a dad in your own right like you're right that is a fucking hell and hunt deal yeah right so how you know just for you but also has there been time to process you know have you looked taylor in the eyes and been like hey bud

we're fucking growing old together like how does he feel about that? What does that, you know, what happens to your people that love you the most? I mean, the one thing that I will say is like how fortunate I am to have two best friends that not only are the, you know, the type of people that they are, where it's, you know, they are, they are the epitome of what masculinity should be viewed as, you know, like this, masculinity has, has, has taken on this unfortunate bad rap where toxic is, is the, is the, you know, the post the pre-nominal. You are what our sons could be. Yeah. And I think that's, that's the beauty of this relationship. And, and so how do they handle this? It's, I, I mean, we talk about, we've talked about it at length on the podcast and I think there's,

there's, there's collectively, there's a lot of excitement. Um, and I think also like, fortunately there's a lot of understanding from their end knowing where I'm coming at this from I mean it's a part you know we've talked about this on the show the show you know sick boy does offer it I think it's one of the things that also makes our friendship unique is that we are committed to having these conversations on a weekly basis with guests that put that force us into a place of being vulnerable to match the person that we're having this conversation with on the podcast and so it's that's poured over into our like daily lives when we when we're just hanging out and conversing

so like it's it's awesome there like that's great um i haven't really talked about these struggles of the feelings that come with this new lease on life with my parents very much. The interesting thing with my intimate relationships, Bridie and I got divorced. She has a new partner. They're both still very closely intertwined in my life. My partner right now, Kira, she came in. It's so funny. She came into this. She doesn't know the Jeremy that didn't have Trikafta. So she met you after tricaft. Yeah. She didn't, she doesn't know the, like the, the Jeremy with 50% lung function, the Jeremy who is constantly living in the hospital. Like she came in, she came into the picture with this new, this.

And she's a fucking gem. Let's just say that out loud. She's, she's incredible. And, and I love that that she she didn't have to see those parts of me you know like I love that she's come into my life at this moment where I'm this new like fresh new version of myself um but the hard part about that is that I think that it makes conversations about things that I've come to terms with, like death or my death or, you know, Donut, our dog's death. Those are hard things for her to talk about or think about. Whereas like when it comes to the idea of death for me, it's, it's, it's all I've thought about for my whole fucking life. And it's so easy for me to talk about loss.

Um, but I, I do think that I'm, I've, whether this has been like a conscious decision or not, I've, I've just found myself in this place where I've surrounded myself with people that are incredible. You know, like there's no, there's no one in my life that, that takes up any of my time that isn't just a miraculous, beautiful, caring, compassionate, empathetic person, you know? So I'm really lucky there. And even though I haven't had those conversations with my mom and dad so much, I know that I can. You know, I can have those conversations.

We just haven't found the time to sit down and hammer it all out. And now you got the time. Quite a bit of it. Turns time. Quite a bit of it. Turns out. Okay. So I, you know, there's so much more. I mean, we're going to have to do more and more and more of this. I thank you so much for just your brilliance and your insight and your kindness. And I mean, I'm so grateful that I get you in our lives because you are what I hope my sons have the capacity to develop in their life. The people you surrounded yourself with, how you present yourself in the world, how you advocate for me, for us, for this podcast, for this message, for what you do. Like, I hope you know how amazing you are.

And you know what I think is so cool for you is you're just getting started. I can't wait to see. I'm so grateful I get a front row seat. I'm your biggest fan, Jeremy Saunders. I'm your biggest fan. I was really nervous to sit down and do this because you're, you know, I, like, I, I really do mean this. You're, you're one of my heroes. Like you are, you're one of the funniest people I've ever met. You're, you're one of the most accomplished people I've ever met. Um, I mean, when you brought your son into the studio, you know, when I hear you say like, I hope that my kids turn out the way that you guys have turned out, like they are already there. You know, it's it's so evident that they are coming from a family that has shaped them into something that is extraordinarily valuable and and needed in this world. So yeah, I was, I was really nervous to actually do this

because it's, it's nerve wracking to sit and be interviewed by one of your heroes. Oh snap. Oh my God. Well, I feel the same way about you and I want to do this a million more times. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And I mean, as we always do, we end every episode by saying, you know, you can find everything you need to find out about our guests in the show notes, but I really, I, you know, if you want to be surrounded by people, by men who understand what it's like to stay connected in this world with other humans, the sick boys are the place where you need to land. Um, their podcast is even better than this one. Uh, well, I don't know. You've been doing it a lot longer. Uh, but I, but I think this is the thing. We only have so much time, even if we have that extension of time.

We're not here for very long. So sit with the people that bring out the best in you. Because even if you do get that lease on life, and you can still look around the table, even if you don't, and you can say, this is exactly who I want to be sitting with. What a gift. And I'd rather be nowhere other than here today. So thank you for this. Thank you. All right. Deep breath, my friends, fellow humans.

I am so grateful you got to meet this human today and, um, for what it's for, whatever it's worth, I hope you're surrounded by some of the best lean into them, lean on them. And, uh, I'll meet you right back here again next week. Hey, after this episode, if you're thinking about what do I do? Where do I go to do the work? Where do I land? I'd love to listen to Jodi's voice more. Gosh, I wish she had a course where I could just do the work with her

on my own time whenever I'm ready. Guess what I created? It's called Feeling Seen, the course, and it's so fucking good. I got to tell you that it's really good. If you want to have a place to land where you want to think a little bit more, you know, we talked about some really important things on this episode. And if you want to dive a little bit more. You know, we talked about some really important things on this episode. And if you want to dive a little deeper with me, you can go to drjodekierrington.com and check out my courses. Feeling Seen is one that I think I created for everybody who wants to just sink in a little more in this time of disconnect.

So go there. I'll put a link in the show notes and I'll meet you there when you're ready. The Everyone Comes From Somewhere podcast is produced by the incredibly talented and handsome team at Snack Labs, Mr. Brian Seaver, Mr. Taylor McGilvery, and the infamous Jeremy Saunders. The soundtracks that you hear at the beginning of every episode were created by Donovan Morgan. Our executive producer is Marty Piller. Our PR big shooters

are Des Veneau and Barry Cohen. Our agent, my manager, Jeff Lowness from the Talent Bureau. And emotional support, of course, is provided by, relatively speaking, our children. For the record, I am a registered clinical psychologist

in Alberta, Canada. The content created and produced in this show for the record i am a registered clinical psychologist in alberta canada the content created and produced in this show is not intended as specific therapeutic advice the intention of this podcast is to provide information resources education and maybe even a little bit of hope you