Unlonely with Dr. Jody Carrington - It's "just menopause": Colleen Rosenblum & Bridgett Garratt

Episode Date: February 8, 2024

Colleen and Bridgett: are co-hosts of Hot Flashes & Cool Topics podcast where we talk about anything and everything to do with women in midlife and beyond. The show is currently ranked in the top 1.5% of global podcasts. Colleen is a former attorney turned pilates instructor turned podcaster and Bridgett is a former teacher turned actress turned podcaster.In this episode Dr. Jody chats with Colleen and Bridgett all about menopause, what it is, what we can do to help get through it and just what a ride it really is. This topic is something that doesn't get talked about enough and we are so excited to dig deep into it.IG: @hotflashesandcooltopicsFB: @hotflashescooltopicsTikTok: @hotflashescooltopics Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Whether you're in your running era, Pilates era, or yoga era, dive into Peloton workouts that work with you. From meditating at your kid's game to mastering a strength program, they've got everything you need to keep knocking down your goals. No pressure to be who you're not. Just workouts and classes to strengthen who you are. So no matter your era, make it your best with Peloton. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton.

Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca. Let's start here, where I think the answer begins for everything and everybody, in the place of acknowledgement. Indigenous peoples in this country have taught me the most about what acknowledgement truly means. So everything that I've created for you happened here on Treaty 7 land,

which is now known as the center part of the province of Alberta. It is home to the Blackfoot Confederacy, made up of the Siksika, the Kainai, the Pikani, the Tatina First Nation, the Stony Nakota First Nation, and the Métis Nation Region 3. It is always my honor, my privilege mostly, to raise my babies on this land where so much sacrifice was made. And to build a community, invite a community in, talk about hard things as we together learn and unlearn about the most important things, that we were never meant to do any of this alone. oh my fellow humans welcome back welcome into the everyone comes from somewhere podcast i am your host dr to. Jodi Carrington.

And today, for the first time in the history of this podcast, we have two guests, two powerful women who are going to rock your socks. Okay? So buckle up wherever you are because Pauline Rosenblum, Bridget Garrett, I don't even, I can't even tell you. Okay. I'm going to be on their podcast as well. So this conversation is going to be almost like a two-part series. You're going to hear their take and my take, and I cannot wait to collider our worlds.

Colleen, first of all, is the co-host of Hot Flashes and Cool Topics, the podcast where they talk about anything and everything to do with women in midlife and beyond. Their show is currently ranked in the top 1.5 percent of global podcasts, something we can only dream about over here. Now, Colleen is a former attorney, Pilates instructor turned podcaster. I mean, a life course that is completely clear and understandable. Bridget, on the other hand, is also the co-host of Hot Flashes and Cool Topics. She's a former teacher turned actress turned podcaster. I mean, these people, these women are my people. And we're going to jump in because these women have a story that I don't know, that I think can change your life. And as you know, around here, I think judgment and empathy are all about understanding the context

of the story. People are hard to hate close up. And I want to know a little bit mostly about where you come from. So I don't know. Colleen, let's start with you. Let's jump in. Tell me, where do you come from? Well, I come from the Jersey Shore in New Jersey. Stop. Yes. To Canadians, that's so exciting.

It feels so sexy. Tell me about it. It was before the, you know, MTV houses. And so I'm that old. I'm prior to MTV. But now I'm youngest of four daughters and grew up with my parents who owned amusement parks. So we would go different places every summer and work the amusement parks and started working at age five, haven't stopped. And yeah, kind of crazy, right? Grew up in a very Italian family, was expected to, you know, get married, have babies. Instead, I went to law school. So my father did not know what to do with me. And he was like, you know, Italian man gets four daughters. Interesting combination. And realized very quickly that I was not meant to be a lawyer, that I just didn't have that need to argue that so many lawyers love to do. So at 35, I had two kids, decided to pivot and didn't know what I wanted

to do, but I knew what I didn't want to do, which I think is equally important. And a lot of people don't take note of that. You don't always have to know what you want to do, but you're pretty clear on what you don't. So I said, you know what? I'm a couch potato. Let me start exercising. Fell in love with Pilates and being the academic that I am decided to go to school and learn it and taught again until, you know, for another, I call it the 12 year itch. I intend to do things for 12 years. And then Bridget and I, and we could tell the story after about how we just at lunch decided what the heck let's do a podcast because there didn't seem to be, we were like right at the beginning of the menopause conversation. It was September 2019, right before the pandemic, right before this menopause explosion happened.

And Bridget and I were like, you know what? What the heck? How hard could it be? And oh, it was so hard. I can't even begin to tell you how much we learned from day one. So that's kind of my, yeah, that's kind of my story. And Bridget, you know, the interesting thing about our co-host is that Bridget has a completely different upbringing than I do. But again, in this stage of life, we have so many commonalities. We're more

alike than we are different. So. Oh my God. I was going to just say that. Yeah. We are way more alike than we are different. And I love that. So tell us, you go, Bridge. Well, so like Colleen said, completely different. I grew up in Kentucky in a small town right outside of Louisville, Kentucky. I am what we have similar as we're both of Italian heritage. However, I'm the 11th of 12 children. So, yeah. So even though four is a lot, I consider four a lot. I think, yeah, 12 is insane. Same parents, you know, same household, 10 girls, two boys. So a lot of mamas. I had a lot of mamas because I had a lot of females tell me what to do, more so than my mother. She was not bossy at all, but she had a lot of people under her. She was exhausted, no doubt. She was having a nap. I had a lot of moms. And, you know, great. We love each other dearly. You know, my siblings. All of you?

Now there's one that passed away. My oldest sibling passed away, but my parents passed away. My mother was 40 when I was born. My dad was 46 and they had one more after me. So we all, we all get along. We all, you know, have our moments. We all have our moments. But, you know, I, Colleen had mentioned how, you know, her father had expected this daughter to fall in line and get married. And that's how it was in my family. You know, you get it kind of, yeah, it was patriarchal. I mean, it was, however it was, you know, my dad worked, my mother didn't work. She had been a nurse, intended to go back after she raised her kids. She never went back to being a nurse.

Was she nursed at home? She nursed a lot. But, you know, it was like that. And I just kind of remember it. Luckily for me, I married someone that is a very kind person. But it was kind of like, yes, you go to college, but you get married right after college. So I saw sister after sister do this. One or two didn't do that exactly. But I saw it and said that was expected. So I thought that's what you do. Lucky for me, I have a wonderful husband, but that wasn't

the case for some of my siblings that, you know, so it was kind of like a whole thing of following what the one in front of you did. And as I got older, I found out it's okay not to follow and do exactly what someone else did. And that's a gift of this time of life. You know, I was a teacher. I, you know, I really liked teaching, but I probably went into it because some of my siblings were teachers. Yeah.

And it looked like something you did. And I really did like it. It just got to the point after 17 years that I've really, I always liked the kids. I always liked the kids. Of course. It just got to the administrative, the politics, the administrative duties, things just came together. Children, my son had already left for college. My daughter was getting ready to leave. Things were hitting me like, oh my gosh, they're leaving. My mother was very ill. She didn't have much time left. And I thought, what am I doing taking this time away from my child, away from my mother?

Fortunately, I was in a position where I could leave. And the reckoning happens. The reckoning. So I left for a while and then the youngest went to college and I moved to the Nashville area and decided to try out acting. They were filming the TV show Nashville. So I would do like some stuff on there, took acting lessons, did some little things like some commercials and things like that. Got kind of tired of that, too, because these overnight shoots aren't fun. And, you know, stepped on a spider barefoot and had a tick on me filming something. I was like, I don't think I like this. So Colleen and I, you know, at lunch with two other friends,

we're just talking about how, yeah, I don't get the answer to that. I want to know what's going on here. How come they don't tell us this or they don't tell us that. And, you know, we, I think at first talked about that's bullshit. We need a bullshit meter. And that's kind of how it went from there that we decided to do this podcast. So, you know, that's, you know, what we've been really delved into and learned so much about midlife and questions that I never would have thought to ask. It's been amazing.

Met just amazing people. Oh my gosh. And so how did the two of you come together? Because four, is this, did I hear this right? Four kids between you? Yeah, I have two daughters and Bridget has a son and daughter. Okay. And so then you come together.

Did you know each other growing up or where do you meet? We met in our neighborhood, actually. We both moved to a small city outside of Nashville and the neighborhood we live in promotes a lot of like get togethers. So you were just frolicking. You were frolicking in Nashville and you just saw each other and you were like, Hey, you look menopausal. Let's talk about what a shit show this is. That basically my sister moved here. One of my my sisters the one that's right above me number 10 she moved here there are a lot of them yeah there are a lot of them and i'm so glad

she is the easiest to get along with um and she is and she came to visit me and loved it and she and her husband both worked outside of their home and they just moved right here to the neighborhood too and there was a they used they'd have outdoor concerts on the lawn. You bring a lawn chair and somebody would sing. And she I was out of town and she's like, hey, hey, I met some people. They look like they're our age. And I think I met you the first time, Colleen, at the neighborhood welcome thing. Because I remember.

They do a welcome party. Yeah, you said I'm a Pilates instructor and your husband wasn't with you that night. And I remember meeting you then. And then my sister said, there's a group of people sitting together and they look like they're our age. And they're really they're really fun. And it never changes. Right. Like in the tea.

I feel like we've had this conversation at every stage in our life. We're like, are they cool? What do we do with them? Do they look like us? Do they sound like us? Do they know something different than we might? Let's see if we can get to know them. And that's how it works.

She didn't see any little kids running around and running up to them. But they didn't quite look old enough to have grandkids. So she kind of knew that, okay, yeah, that they look like our people at what you said, our people, you check the boxes. So that's kind of how we just started. You know, it's really great because our husbands get along. It was great for all of us because we were all new in the neighborhood and it was just like a coming together and, you know, feeling out and finding your people. So that's kind of like 2016, 2017.

Yeah. Yeah. So it's been we're coming on a decade of of you sort of navigating your friendship and your ability to sort of then give your thoughts back to the world. What has been the thing that you think has resonated most? I mean, so largely speaking, I would guess that your audience is middle-aged women trying to figure out what the fuck is happening with their bodies and why nobody's talking about the fact that you can bleed for six months and not die. But some of us come close. I don't know if you know my story.

I just had a blood transfusion earlier this year because I was on stage and I couldn't, I mean, I didn't know that, you know, this was because I was on stage and I couldn't, I mean, I didn't know that, you know, this was this excessive bleeding. This is what everybody does until, um, my Hebrew album was at 50 and, uh, I couldn't stand up. And so, um, we've done everything we can to sort of get that under control, but it has been such a journey that I didn't even know. And I said to my mom, she's like, oh yeah, I had a hysterectomy. What you, huh? What? How come? No, we didn't know about this. So I think there's so many things like the brain fog and I'm an older mom. Like our babies are, I mean, I'm going to be, I'm 48. Our babies are, our twins

are 11. Those are our youngest. And then our boys, 13, our oldest is 13. And so it's like, I'm also in a place where most moms in this small town are 10 years old or 10 years younger than me. Right. So I keep saying, oh yeah, they're about our age. And people are like, well, are we, which decade we talking about here? They're mom. Okay. Because that is also, so this is also a disaster. I mean, I'm so grateful that I'm older and I have younger kids. Cause they're like, mom, we're going to go play, you know, mini sticks or street hockey. And I'm like, all right, here we go. We're taking them to Disney World next week.

And I'm like, do they have carts for moms with young kids? Because that's what but I'm like, nope, strapping on them shoes. Watch this. I'll do it. And so it's like so interesting to me to watch this unfold because I don't want to reckon with the fact that my body's changing, but it is so inevitable that it's all, you know, things are happening. So tell me the things that are coming up the most. Like what, I mean, obviously that resonates with you. What resonates with the people who, you know, are so profoundly impacted by this incredible podcast. I would actually kind of weave it into your discussion

because we hear so many women say they feel invisible. They don't feel seen or heard, which is your topic, which we will explore in our podcast. But they're lonely, they're isolated. Their doctors are simply not educated. You know, unfortunately, one of the things Bridget and I have learned is that a lot of doctors do not receive proper educational menopause. So the term just menopause comes up. If you're, you know, you were weight gain, hot flashes,

mood swings, brain fog, weight, you know, I did I say weight gain? because that's a big one. Weight gain. It's just there's so many symptoms. There's over you say 32 that it goes to 40. You say 40. I've heard up to 80 now. I've heard. So, yes, yes. in silence, which is crap because we are vocal to protect our children. We are vocal to get help for our spouse. But when it comes to our struggles, we put ourselves last. We'll deal with, you know, we'll suffer through it. But when you sit down at a table with other women who are going through it, when you talk to the experts, there are solutions out there, but it's going to be us to get the word out to those women because their doctors aren't sharing this information. If you go to a specialist, yes, but there aren't that many of them. Hey everyone. We all know how draining cold and flu season can be. Waiting rooms, missed appointments, and that worry about whether a fever is something serious.

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everything you need to keep knocking down your goals. No pressure to be who you're not. Just workouts and classes to strengthen who you are. So no matter your era, make it your best with Peloton. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton.

Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca. And I've had so many women, you know, particularly chatting about this lately, because I think it's still just, it's such a woman's issue. You know, like even if you, you refer to people when you're like, oh, it's just that, that's just a lady's issue, or that's a woman, you know, that's a lady thing. That's a whatever. And it's not ever taken seriously. And I think that, you know, we even, the vagueness of the symptom description, the vagueness of, you know, when you started, what is paramenopause? What is postmenopause? Like, when are you in menopause? How do you know? And like, oh, some people get it. Some people are like, no, really, I feel so confused. And I have this massive brain fog and

I'm having trouble sleeping. And I, I am like, is this, is this menopause? And like, then I love that you say that because it always is followed like this. It's just menopause, right? This is what you're going to experience. So like just deal is basically the end. Do you find that a lot? And like, how does that affect women? It's, it's terrible. It really wreaks havoc, not, you know, on their mental health. And just so much misinformation is out there. And I always go back to the Women's Health Initiative report from 2002 that started the whole thing about HRT being, you know, can cause breast cancer. Yes. Yes. Hormone replacement can cause cancer. And it all starts there. I know so many people that just stopped

that were on hormones. Now, hormones are not for everybody. They are not for there. I know so many people that just stopped that were on hormones. Now, hormones are not for everybody. They are not for everybody. You know, it's a very, you know, Colleen and I say this time and again, we are not physicians. And so you definitely need to, you know, contact a physician before you consider starting this. But it really, this misinformation and then the judgment that is out there, you would be so surprised when you put out, you know, Hey, this is some, I just put a video on TikTok yesterday about this is what I take. This is what works for me. But the judgment, you should try natural stuff, which, Hey, if you want to try natural stuff, good for you, you know, great. And there

may be a good reason and, and good for you, but know, great. And there may be a good reason and good for you. But the judgment that, especially from women that place this on other women for doing something like that, that is a big, that's a big issue too. And like Colleen said, the number of doctors that are not educated. I know that when I started experiencing symptoms and I was kind of on the younger end, I went to my gynecologist, which I thought would be your first line of defense that this is where I need to be. And she's telling me, no, no, you're too young.

I was 47. And then she would not put me on hormone replacement because my mother had had a blood clot. My mother did not die from a blood clot. I didn't know my mother was, had already passed away. So I couldn't ask her what caused your blood clot. I found out later from a sister that it was an injury. She had fallen. I didn't know that she would not put me on any kind of hormones. And so that's, that's really, you know, something that she didn't have the information, the education.

I did find another doctor. That's another thing we learn that we tell women that it is okay to break up with your physician. The doctor that delivered your babies does not have to be the doctor that treats you in menopause. Oh, my God. Yeah. It's amazing.

Can we start with some basics? Like, I just think about our audience, like listening. So define for me things like perimenopause and menopause. Like what what does it mean? Why have we labeled it as such? And, you know, what what are some common experiences? Because I think there's so many women that are like, we don't even know what this means. I was like, what do you mean at 47 I should be these words, perimenopause. And how do you define that? So, so give me some of the understandings of sort of the research, what it talks about these days. There are four stages premenopause, which, you know, you're getting your period, your fertile, all that great stuff. Perimenopause can be anywhere from eight to 10 years. Okay. So there are women in their late thirties that are starting in perimenopause and perimenopausal symptoms run the gamut. Some women, I think about 10% Bridget, if I'm not wrong of women don't even have symptoms, but the vast majority of women can suffer everything from, you think you have early Alzheimer's because of the brain fog,

you're exercising and eating the same way. And all of a sudden you've got a gut, a middle weight gain. You don't know what's happening. You're, you can have rage. You can have everything from a tingling in your mouth to well, hot flashes is kind of like when women think menopause, they think hot flashes, which is true, but they could be at night. They could be during the day. It's kind of like when women think menopause, they think hot flashes, which is true, but they could be at night. They could be during the day. It's kind of like morning sickness. It was never just morning.

You know what I mean? It was all day long. And so they run the gamut. Menopause is one day. Women don't realize that menopause, it's 12 months of no periods. So you celebrate menopause for one day. You're up, you're in Perry up to the day before you're in post the day after. Wow. And women think, oh, I'm in post. I won't have

any symptoms anymore. Not true. You could struggle with symptoms post-menopausal. I mean, we have women who post in our Facebook group. We have a private Facebook group. So women feel comfortable posting. They're seven years old and you know, they're getting, now you're suffering from vaginal dryness, sex hurts, or your libido has gone by and by, and you don't want sex. There are so many facets to the journey. And again, women just, they go to their gynecologist, like Bridget said, your first line that you think is going to inform you of everything. And they're like, well, just suffer through it. It'll get better. No, if sex hurts, it's not going to get better. And there are options out there. And like, for example, our episode this week talks to Dr. Rachel Rubin, who is a urologist and certified, she's a certified urologist and a menopause

expert, sexual health expert. And she talks about the topical estrogen you can use, how it gets a bum rap that it's not systemic. She talks about testosterone because in the United States, testosterone is only approved for men, not women. But women can take one tenth of it. So Bridget does take testosterone and she's spending a hundred plus dollars. And Dr. Rubin's like, I can get you six dollar two there are options and we bring you know what's it i find interesting is i posted this morning about our episode and some women woman responded are you trying to sell something like seriously we are offering you information from an expert, a recognized expert in the field. Take it or leave it.

What are we selling? Take it or leave it, Barb. Take it or leave it. It's amazing that women are always on the, like, what do you want from this? Like, you can't just be, Bridget and I just want to educate women. That's always been our intent. And I think this is part of the issue, right, is that, like, I talk a lot around here about the role change that has happened for women. That's always been our intent. And I think this is part of the issue, right? Is that like, I, I talk a lot around here about the role change that has happened for women. We are the first generation of women that have had, I mean, you even talk about this, I think Bridget, in your

lifetime, sort of the expectation, you knew most of us were born with this expectation. You find a good man, settle down and have babies. If you want to have a career, that's cute, but it will always take a backstage to whatever you're going to do to be able to serve your family. And I think I, we are the first generation of women that could consider law school, that could consider being an actress, consider maybe balancing motherhood with a becoming a primary breadwinner. Can you imagine? And all at the same time, we're now in this place where it's like, however, you still are expected to be very maternal and very connected to everything that happens. And so we as women judge each other far more harshly. Kavita Ram Dass, there's a beautiful quote by Kavita Ram Dass, who I just think is such a beautiful feminist. And she just said,

feminism today isn't really about fighting the oppressor or the patriarchy in any way. It's often women ourselves that hold each other to these high standards that we don't want to be shackled with, but we also want to be like, hey, this is not the way it's supposed to go. And I think this conversation of like, how do we show up as partners, as women, as entrepreneurs and CEOs? And I say this all the time, you know, I'm the CEO of my company. I have three books. I, you know, I'm the primary breadwinner. And oftentimes my mother-in-law and I would have conversations like, what's going to happen if you're away and the kids are sick? And I would be like, well, fuck if I know. I mean, like, I think your son can run some Tylenol. I'm very, you know, but then I think that too.

Like, oh God, what happened? Oh, I missed this puking. And like, how do we navigate those things? In addition to then some of us being older moms going through this place of our bodies are changing and the expectations to do it all, be it all. And also focus on like, fuck, I can't think like I used to, or I can't operate, or I'm not even attracted or sexually motivated in any way.

What is wrong with me? Do you feel like a lot of people have that question as women? Absolutely. Absolutely. Oh yeah. And that's a big thing of so many, that's when their mental health really starts to, you know, they start to have issues with their mental health because they do feel like something's wrong with me. And I have felt like that just as well. You know, just kind of in the right before in the Perry stages, like, what's going on with me? You know, like I remember saying, if JFK Jr. walked in that door, I would not want to have sex with him. Right? I mean, the bar is high.

I know. It's like something is just wrong. And to finally, finally find something that can help. But then again, I know my privilege. I can afford that testosterone. So many women cannot afford it or cannot find a physician to give it to them i mean today i don't know if you saw colleen dr kelly casperson put on a blurb about how this doctor the only way this woman could get testosterone or get vaginal estrogen was to say it was a problem

for her partner to say oh the partner was having an issue. And another woman chimed in and said, yeah, I made up a partner. I'm not married, but I made up my husband and said, you know, I can't function. Well, then, oh, if the man was having a problem, then they got their prescription. Fascinating. Isn't that now? Fortunately, with North American, which is now called the Menopause Society, it was called NAMS, North American Menopause Society. You go to menopause.org, you can find physicians that are menopause certified. And there's so much wonderful telehealth out there that you could also have conversations, especially for women that live in areas where you might not find a gynecologist. I mean, places are closing down and access just to any kind of care, you know, female health care is just really hard to find.

A hundred percent. Yeah. And I think, too, I mean, I think, too, you know, I think about my sister who's five years older older than me and she said, you know, the brain fog right now is just really crushing her. And she's so brilliant, like witty, smart. And she's like, I can't figure this out. And then of course our worry is because our history is we we get as concerned about menopause as we do about dementia, that as we do about sort of any, you know, what else could this be? But that menopause is up on the list. And it's like, then how do we treat it versus, oh, this is probably what it is, you know? And I think that that is just such an interesting thing for so many women who are listening to be like, okay, how has these symptoms affected your life? If you're in your forties, thirties, forties, fifties, sixties, seventies, what, you know, how has it shown up? Because did you say, what is the percentage around? Is there some women that

don't get affected at all? 10%. That's 10%. And we don't talk to them because we're mad at them. Every once in a while, we'll have a guest on. When someone says, oh, I had no problems, Bridget and I are like, okay, interview over. Thank you. Thank you for your service. Yep. I have siblings that say they didn't really have issues and that kills me. And then I deserve this because I feel like I deserve this. My oldest sister, she, I remember her just turning the thermostat down. And I think I was like, she's 18 years older than me. And she's just doing this.

And I was like, she is just trying to get attention. Like, would she just stop it? Well, karma came and bit my butt because I think I got it worse. I think I had them worse than any of the 10 females in my family that I had it worse than anyone. It's just, it's heartbreaking for some people, you know, and I think that, you know, we don't like just drenched in the middle of the night, um, you know, with night sweats or horrible sitting in a meeting, trying to sort of garner respect and you are dripping with sweat. Like you can't just even navigate that. And I think there's so much about that that just really, I think, undermines authority, intelligence, you know, the ability to navigate situations that I don't think we talk about

nearly enough. And I wonder, I wonder too, a little bit about, I don't know, like the differences that we have as women in our experiences, because this is the thing, just like, I guess, in any major diagnoses, you know, I guess, in any major diagnoses, you know, there isn't a direct route. This isn't like, ah, this is what paramenopause looks like. You know, you would say with your, you know, 47 sisters that each one of you all had a completely different experience. And that's fair too, isn't it? Like we're looking for solidarity here in some ways. And I think the issue is it

happens to 90% of us in some capacity. So sink into that and wonder a little bit about what that looks like for you. Is that fair? Like how do you open these conversations? Absolutely. It's not a competition. It's not like, well, I had a headache and I suffered from a menopausal migraine. It's not a competition. It's how can we support each other? Because women sitting at a table, having the conversation, you will end up with more solutions than you did going to your gynecologist meeting for 10 minutes. Okay. And the problem that we are seeing now, you know, I mentioned the beginning of your podcast that we kind of started at the cusp of the menopause revolution, evolution, whatever you want to call it. But as soon as they heard that it was potentially a $600 billion industry,

people came out of the woodwork with products. Try this, this works. We want women to be very careful. We are educated and we are intelligent. And we don't want those people that are just trying to sell us something to jump on the bandwagon of selling menopause products. We want, if we know something works, we will be a loyal customer. But women of our demographic research shows that we are fine changing products. We are fine switching to something else. And I feel bad, and I'm sure Bridget feels the same way, when women are like, but I saw it on my Facebook and they said it would get rid of hot flashes or, and it was a hundred dollars. We're like, no, don't just, if it sounds too good to be true, it usually is. Yeah. And what do you find? I mean, I, you know, given this conversation, cause I, Oprah did a massive piece about it, um, had lots of interviews about it.

I was so fascinated cause it was right in the middle of my massive time off because I couldn't even function was what are the suggestions, you know, prevailing these days, you know, when, when you sort of sit with your, like hormone replacement therapy is something people talk a lot about. Like, do people go directly to hysterectomies? Are we looking at, you know, and that was so funny because in the ER, that was the first conversation, which was like, okay, this is where you're headed. And then my OBGYN was like, no, no, no, no, no, no. Like we do not need to be considering major surgery here. This is something that, you know, we have a number of options we can consider, including, um, a, um, oh my God. Ablation. So ablation. Now my uterus was too bulky for an ablation. I was

like, can you not maybe use that fucking word right now? But anyway, whatever. And so I had to do, I did, um, uh, um, oh my God, what is it called? Where I have a device inserted that, um, is like, uh,G? Thank you. Yes. And that is exactly what we do with brain fog. That's the brain fog. Oh, I do it all the time. Yeah. Sounds like...

Oh, yeah. I do it all the time. Yeah. I'm showing you like up around... The uterus. Yes. I could see it. Yeah.

Yeah. I was going to stand up. What's sad is it took us a second to get there. We were all like that thing, that insert. Yeah, you know what I mean? And it worked beautifully. Stopped the bleeding and my iron. Then I needed multiple iron infusions.

But I think that was the thing that I didn't even know was a possibility. My physician was such a rock star. And just like, okay, let's slow everything down. And I know this is an emergency in this moment because yes, we were close to dying, but we've got the, the, the blood back on board. Your hemoglobin is up a little bit. So like, let's get iron on board and let's figure out how we stop the bleeding. Is that possible? If that's not possible, then let's consider a hysterectomy. And for some women, I mean, there isn't any possibility. And so right away, you know, so many women, my mom and my aunts, my grandma, like saying like,

get that out of there. You don't need it. Just pull that out. Huh? Get the plumbing out. And I'm like, what are you talking about? I don't, but it's so fascinating, right? Like everybody's experience. And I think what I love about your work is that it is, it's so clear on like, be careful, right? Like do your research, know what you're getting into, because I think there is so many massive conversations that are happening right now. Hey. Oh yeah. I mean, you know, when you were talking about what was happening to you, I'm so glad you're, your OBGYN came in and gave you those options because I have seen, you know, members of my family that, boom, it just happens.

They just do the hysterectomy. And then when you, I, you know, I'm not a physician, but it happened to one of my nieces. She's going to be 40. She's 39. And she had a hysterectomy. And I remember saying, listen, you know, you're pretty young. You really want to talk about hormone replacement, you know, talk about this. And then another sister who had a hysterectomy comes in that's older than me. I didn't need hormones. And I'm like, just talk about it because

you are very young and you're, you know, you're going to lose all this access to producing hormones. So, you know, so. Options. You're both saying the same word, options. You need someone who is educated on options because that's when they deserve options. We don't deserve the bare bones minimum. We deserve options. And if your doctor says there aren't any, find somebody who says there are, because there are options for every situation. But, you know, it just, it's so scary because it depends on who you go to. Yeah, it does. And I think, you know, to your point earlier, it really is a privilege. It really is. And I think just the advocacy for women and, you know, having the accessibility of your podcast, having these conversations? Is this something that you might be experiencing? I think is just the accessibility

of that information. What do you think is the thing that people get wrong the most in this space? That if you have any history of cancer in your family at all, you can't take hormone therapy. I think that like Bridget was saying before, the 2002 research study that came out shared bad news before good. And a lot of misinformation 20 years later is still being shown that you're not eligible for hormone therapy. You're not a candidate and you need to talk to your doctor. You may not be. Right. But the majority of women are that don't realize that they are.

And it can be life changing. I'm not on hormone therapy. I would take it in a heartbeat if I thought I needed it. Bridget is. It's been life-changing for her. But every woman needs to go through her personal family history with an expert who could say, no, you're not precluded. That's not contraindicated.

You could still take hormone therapy. And also that topical, like vaginal estrogen, if you have dryness, that's not systemic. It's not going to go through your body. So women are like, well, I can't take this because it's going to go. No, it's topical. So I think education would help answer a lot of the misinformation or contradict a lot of the misinformation. What about you, Bridget? I have to piggyback on that too. I mean, you said the vaginal estrogen and to add to that, a lot of women at this age, I don't know, this is just another important part, is the sex part. That sex should not hurt. I have heard that from Mayo. We have heard it from Mayo Clinic physicians.

We've heard it from numerous gynecologists, urologists, sexual wellness experts, that like you said, vaginal estrogen is so helpful it is so helpful and if you know is i think i've heard as long as you don't have active breast cancer but even that could have changed uh that you should be okay with vaginal estrogen and not only is it good for sexual health it is is good for UTI. So the person that we were putting up this week that we dropped today, Dr. Rachel Rubin, she said the funniest thing. She's like, I don't care if you are a nun walking through the door, if you have UTIs, this can be life-saving because a UTI can turn sepsis. And it really, boy, the older you get with UTIs.

I remember my mother in her 80s having UTIs. And I mean, we were like, what's wrong? She's dying. What's going on? Having to call an ambulance to come and get her to take her to the hospital and finding out it's a UTI. She just needs an antibiotic. And she needs different things just to help her not to get reoccurring ones.

So that's just piggybacking on what Colleen had said to just in addition. So helpful. So helpful. And so what I'd like to just sort of, I think, land on here last is really this idea about. This gets such a bad rap, you know, 50 and beyond. It feels like we're we head into it like with the brakes on, like, you know, we're now we're going to get flashes and we're hot and we're fat and we hate people and nobody can touch us ever again. Like, why would anybody want to step into this decade and beyond? You know, what happened to this idea of like,

these can be the best years of your life. And, and tell me a little bit about that, because this is also the work that I love about yours the most, which is, yes, let's identify these experiences, but also do you know that this is the most remarkable time of life? So, so tell me a little bit about that. Well, I think midlife is the best kept secret, honestly, because Bridget and I always say we've kind of never been happier. You know, I married my high school sweetheart, Bridget married her college sweetheart. So we're lucky that we have healthy marriages.

But, you know, women are like, oh, well, I'm no longer fertile, so I'm not useful. Who wants their period? Like, I don't want it. OK, I had it till I was 55. You can keep I wish there was a switch that could have just gone off, you know? And body acceptance. We don't have to look like a 20 year old.

I don't want to look like a 20 year old. That's way too much. I want to enjoy my wine. I want to enjoy going on vacations and eat what I want. Like, yes, exercise is important for our health now. It's not about fitting in a size two anymore. It's about, do you want to live longer, healthier? So your attitude towards exercise and eating changes, not because you want to be deprived,

but because you want to live longer and be healthier. And honestly, you know, we're both empty nesters. I just became an empty nester last week. So I'm a little melancholy, but I'm okay. And I just think it's changing the perspective, changing the language, changing the narrative around aging because you're going to live 30, 40, 50 years longer. What do you want to do with it?

What do you, you get to choose. You're not responsible for the kids getting to school anymore. You're not responsible for maintaining kids getting to school anymore. You're not responsible for maintaining a household full of crazy people. Like this is your time. Self-care is not selfish. You can start moving up the ladder. So I would say it's changing your perspective and changing the narrative. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I, you know, like Colleen said, I have never been happier and I always,

you know, I'll see people that I knew like I'm turning 50. I'm like, Hey, this is the best decade of my life that I have had. And I, I expect it to continue to be even happier. You know, you hear about the happiness, the U curve of happiness and, you know, I think it kind of is happening. And that's something that I didn't realize, you know, as I was heading into this, I didn't realize that you would get that happy, that you could just find things and things that used to seem so important, just are not important anymore. Just worrying about what other people think of you is just like, I don't care. Just really being your authentic self. Just really, you know, I found that the truer you are to yourself, the happier you are. And you just don't have to worry like, OK, if they don't like me, well, that's their problem that they don't like sometimes. I mean, my daughter is 11 and I and I watch her and my sons, you know, as well. Like, I think it's there is a bit of a rite of is, you know, there are going to be the haters. There are going to be the critics. This is going to happen. You're going to want

to try to fit in everywhere. Like, but there's such a freedom. I think if you can step into this lifetime in your, as early as your thirties, my God, what a gift, but I almost think it's, I feel like, you know, now in my late forts, it really truly is setting in that you will not, you cannot be that good for everybody all the time. And so what's left at the end of the day is that if you truly want to enjoy, find the joy in whatever chapter you're in, whatever circumstance you're surrounded with, it really comes back to becoming the best part of you, which means that idea of selfishness and self-care being in the same sentence, that rhetoric is just exhausting to me because you can't, I mean, this old adage is true,

you can't pour from an empty cup and all that bullshit, but it's so true is that if you are not okay, the people you love don't stand a chance. And when we are looking at parts of our bodies changing, really just paying homage to that, taking, being honest about that, being okay with that, not attempting so hard to stick to the ideals. What, what freedom is what I hear you saying in that, you know, do you, do you remember, you know, do you flip in and out of that freedom? Are you still in this sort of wheel? Sometimes you're like, ah, fuck, I wish I

could be, I wish I could be. Is it, is it a bit of a journey as you sort of navigate these years? Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think, I don't know about you, but I have two daughters. So when I hear the language that comes out of their mouths, I'm like, oh gosh, you're not going to care about this 10 years from now. You're going to look at that picture that you're critiquing and be like, why did I ever complain about that picture? But they look at me and it's like, there's just some, like you said, rite of passage. And I think some of it comes from, we have so many times in our lives when we go, I'm never going to survive this. How am I going to survive? Well, once you've survived enough of the, I'm never going to survive these, then it gives you a perspective on what's really

important and helps you kind of navigate life's journey a little bit. There's still going to be crappy stuff that takes you down, but you know, you're going to survive it because you already have another circumstance is the loss of a parent's relationship problems, raising God teenagers. Good luck with that. And, um, seriously, seriously, you're right at the cusp. You're right at the cusp. We do survive the things we never think that we're going to. So Bridget and I talk about earning privileges and with age comes earned privileges. And one of those is not given a crap when anybody else thinks. And it's okay to be happy. You don't have to feel guilty that you're happy.

And it's because you know what? It's going to be up and down. Take the happy when you have it because it doesn't last forever. Just like, you know, I think it was one of the actors talked about what profoundly affected him. And he said, this too shall pass. Nothing good lasts forever. Nothing bad lasts forever. With everything in life, this too shall pass.

And I think that's so true. Oh, my God. It's so true. We put such an emphasis on just everybody being happy. When I ask parents to finish this sentence, you know, what do you want for your child? I just want them to be happy. And I always say this, do you know that nobody is happy all the time? The biggest wish I think that I have for my children and certainly in this like next season of life for me is that you feel all the emotions deeply, profoundly, and understand

that they will pass all of them, right? All of them will. And I think what a gift this is as you, you know, you, I, what I hear you saying it I think what a gift this is as you, you know, you, I, what I hear you saying it, Colleen is really this idea that you, you gather enough experiences so that you, you appreciate, you have a script for more things that, ah, this is how I handle death. This is how I handle grief. This is how I handle breakups or when people let me down that, you know, everybody is operating on their own system. Right. And that I am, you know, not as important as I think I am in this whole big world. So I might as well focus on the things that matter to me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We've talked to, yeah, we've talked to two different. Well, we talked to Karen Duffy. She was a former VJ on MTV. And we've talked to Bridget Delaney about stoicism. And that is, it's so true.

It's like, well, what can I control in this world? There's not much I have control over, but I can control my reaction to what is happening. Boy, I wish that I'd read about the Stoics when I was in my 20s. Would you have absorbed it? Exactly. Would it have been you know been able to absorb it the same way that I do now when I'm 56 probably not but it's really been it has been great my husband bought me the daily stoic for Christmas oh I love it I love it but um but yeah it it really is it's been very helpful. And just to look back and think about what was important, what truly is important. Learning so much just about, you know,

what I have that is such a privilege and such a gift that other people have to struggle so much harder to get. Yes. And, you know, just just in having empathy for those people that, OK, this is going to be a little tougher for them because they have some things that they can't even help that are in the way. So I think using your voice in that way, I think the older I get to, that's really what a privilege it is to be where I am and have what I have. And so you can't tell the next generation to be kind, how to be kind or anti-racist or inclusive. You got to show them. And I think, you know, having a voice on a podcast is really the whole purpose for you and me. Right. As you said, I'm not selling you stuff. I'm telling you, if this is going to help you, great. And if it isn't, if this isn't your jam or your time, that's okay too. Right. That's listen, hot flashes and cool topics. That was one of the best conversations ever. And I know that there's going to be so many people in our community that will be welcomed into your community. Where can they find you? Well, the podcast they can find on any platform.

So, you know, Apple, Google, everything. We have a website, howflashescooltopics.com. We have a great YouTube channel. All of the videos where the guests say, okay, we'll let you do video are up on there. We have hundreds of them on there. Great conversations. And sometimes seeing the person articulate their thoughts holds a little more meaning.

So How Flashes Cool Topics YouTube channel. We're on Instagram, Facebook. We have a great Facebook group. It's private. We have almost 5,000 women in it. And they'll daily ask questions like, I want to kill my spouse. What should I do?

You know what I mean? Don't do that. Yes. And we always start by going, please don't do that. But things like, you know, I just can't take it anymore. Or the dryness is dry. It's just personal stuff that they feel comfortable sharing and other people go, I get you. I got it. What a beautiful gift. What a beautiful gift. And it

really truly is about that feeling scene, that acknowledgement piece, right? Because oftentimes there isn't even an answer, but it is this sense of me too, where I got you, you have somewhere to land. So thank you for that. Thank you for creating that space for women. Thank you for offering this to the world. And thank you for joining me today you for creating that space for women. Thank you for offering this to the world. And thank you for joining me today. Everybody, I hope you just can sink into these two women too. And listen, take care of you, take care of each other. And I will meet you right psychologist here in beautiful Alberta, Canada.

The content created and produced in this show is not intended as specific therapeutic advice. The intention of this podcast is to provide information, resources, some education, and hopefully a little hope. The Everyone Comes From Somewhere podcast by me, Dr. Jodi Carrington, is produced by Brian Seaver, Taylor McGillivray, and the amazing Jeremy Saunders at Snack Labs. Our executive producer is the one and only, my Marty Piller. Our marketing strategist is Caitlin Beneteau. And our PR big shooters are Des Veneau and Barry Cohen. Our agent, the 007 guy,

is Jeff Lowness from the Talent Bureau. And my emotional support during the taping of these credits was and is and will always be my son, Asher Grant. Woo! Whether you're in your running era, Pilates era, or yoga era, dive into Peloton workouts

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