Unlonely with Dr. Jody Carrington - There is Still Joy in the Unexpected: Dr. Alisha Rai

Episode Date: May 23, 2024

Dr. Alisha Rai, is a South-African Canadian family physician who is deeply committed to advocacy for the disability community. This is fueled by her personal experience as a mother to a son with cerebral palsy. She co-founded a non-profit with her husband, Hope for Cerebral Palsy to fund quality private early interventional therapy for children with cerebral palsy. Additionally, she openly shares her experience with infertility and has the privilege of speaking at a TEDx event at the University of Mississippi. Her multifaceted background reflects a passion for healthcare, advocacy, and sharing impactful stories.In this episode Dr. Jody and Dr. Alisha chat all about opportunities coming your way and the choices we make to take these opportunities to learn something new and love it or NOT and that is okay. Alisha tells us her incredible story that has so many layers, from joining the military in South Africa to raising a son with Cerebral Palsy. Being a special needs parent has shaped her to be the compassionate physician she is now with less judgment and more understanding.LinksAlisha's InstagramHope For Cerebral Palsy Website Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

At the beginning of every episode, there will always be time for an acknowledgement. You know, the more we do this, people ask, why do you have to do the acknowledgement in every episode? I got to tell you, I've never been more grateful for being able to raise my babies on a land where so much sacrifice was made. And I think what's really critical in this process is that the ask is just that we don't forget. So the importance of saying these words at the beginning of every episode will always be of utmost importance to me and this team. So everything that we created here today for you happened on Treaty 7 land, which is now known as the center part of the province of Alberta. It is home of the Blackfoot Confederacy, which is made known as the center part of the province of Alberta.

It is home of the Blackfoot Confederacy, which is made up of the Siksika, the Kainai, the Pekinie, the Tatina First Nation, the Stony Nakota First Nation, and the Métis Nation Region 3. Our job, our job as humans, is to simply acknowledge each other. That's how we do better, be better, and stay connected to the good. Oh, my friends. Welcome back. Welcome in to the Everyone Comes From Somewhere podcast. I, listen, I, sometimes in this journey around this globe, I get to meet some of the most

incredible humans on the planet. And this is sort of the point of this podcast, right? It's like, how can I bring some of the best who I get to meet to you? And I was at an event not long ago, speaking to women in wealth. And there was a bunch of, you know, probably some of the most powerful women who are crushing glass ceilings, creating new standards of practice, thinking about the world in different ways. And as I was just like minding my own business, the amazing Dr. Alicia Ray came up to me. And I just knew that she was somebody this community needed to meet. And let me tell you a little bit about her before we jump in, okay? So Dr. Alicia Ray is a South African Canadian family physician

who is deeply committed to advocacy for the disability community. This is fueled by her personal experience as a mother to a son with cerebral palsy. She co-founded a non-profit with her husband called Hope for Cerebral Palsy to fund quality private early interventional therapy for children with CP. Additionally, she openly shares her experience with infertility and has the privilege of speaking at a TEDx event at the University of Mississippi. Her multifaceted background reflects a passion for healthcare advocacy and sharing impactful I, listen, humans, buckle up. Because this remarkable woman has experienced, survived, navigated so much heartache, so much pain in this world of not only like racism and immigrating to a new country, but also navigating just the biggest wish to become a mom and how difficult I think we don't talk about

those things for so many people. And so welcome to the stage, humans, Dr. Alicia Ray. Thank you so much for having me, Jodi. Now we start every episode with this question, as you know. Whether you're in your running era, Pilates era, or yoga era, dive into Peloton workouts that work with you. From meditating at your kid's game to mastering a strength program, they've got everything you need to keep knocking down your goals. No pressure to be who you're not, just workouts and classes to strengthen who you are. So no matter your era, make it your best with Peloton. Find your push, find your power. Peloton. Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca.

The difference between empathy and judgment often comes in understanding people's stories. So tell me, Dr. Ray, where do you come from? I come from South Africa and a little town in KwaZulu-Natal called Newcastle. What happened there? Who was in this family? How did it all happen? Set the stage for me in Newcastle, South Africa. So Newcastle is a small coal mining town.

And my mom was born and brought up there and my dad was from a province along the coast he was a boiler maker and moved to this mining town saw my mom as the story goes had one look at her and said, marrying that woman. And they married really young and had three children. And I am the middle child. Interesting. And where's, so the older and the younger sibling, where are they at in this moment?

So both of them still are in South Africa. Wow. And how, like what, do you get back there often? Not, I was lost back there in 2018. And we went back to Africa in 2019 to Namibia, the country that my husband is from. And then of course COVID happened. And that was the same year that my son was born in and we never went back and we couldn't even have them over during that time. So the plan is when my son is old enough to understand how to navigate a 30 hour flight, we will take him back. Oh my gosh. Okay. Can you take me back to how this process started for you, how you got into medicine? Because it is truly such a remarkable story because you were such a fierce, independent

thinker, breaking barriers in this country ahead of your time. And I just love your story. I've heard it a couple of times. Can you tell it from the beginning? Because I think it really is the prerequisite to how you become such a fierce advocate. So again, growing up in a country that was under apartheid for, I would say, 10 years of my life, I, you know, you were always told what you couldn't do, where you couldn't go. There were signs in our country that said whites only, and then for others, colors, blacks, Indians. But the thing I loved and I appreciated the most that my parents, having known this their whole lives, didn't limit us in what we could do and what we could be. And so my mom was the one that was a really fierce advocate for education. And she always said that education is the one thing that no one can take away from you. And that, I think, was her way of saying that if you're educated as a woman of color, there's some sort of independence and choice that you

would have in your life. And in sort of high school, I needed to start thinking about what I wanted to do. And I was just drawn to the medical field. I was a middle child. I liked peacemaking. I liked serving. That was just my nature. And so I thought I wanted to be a dentist. And of course, like, you know, anything in the medical field is pretty expensive. And it would have been this real stretch for my parents to educate me. And so right from the beginning, it was you've got to work hard and get some sort of scholarship to get educated. And that's what I did. I applied for dentistry, the SANDF, which is the South African National Military. They were offering bursaries. However, it's never been offered to anyone of color before. And, and the year that I applied for dentistry,

it was then said that, well, actually we've closed our dentistry, uh, department and we're going to give you the option of actually applying for medicine itself. And so it was just a real shot in the dark to kind of apply for it and then just see what happened right wow I can't believe that like it was like dentistry or no guess what this door's closed while we go into medicine which is like remarkably two different very different things yeah exactly and I mean at first I thought to myself I don't want to study another two years and again being a middle child and a people pleaser, I saw how excited my parents were about me getting into medicine. And I was like, yes, I'm being medicine. Oh my gosh. Amazing.

So that's how I got into firstly the military and then studying medicine. Gosh. And so tell me a little bit about your service in the military, because I think I've done a little bit of work around first responders and military and just like what it's like to be a woman in a very patriarchal, hierarchical situation and a woman of color. Like what? Tell me. Can you tell me a little bit about that experience? Sure. So I was 17 years old when I finished my last year of schooling. And so when I was 18, went into the military, did one year of military training. So that was a prerequisite to getting the bursary was one year of military training. And thereafter you were able to go in and study, they would fund it and then you would pay them

back in service. Wow. So you were like training on the things, running? Running. Shooting, climbing through things, were you? Is that, like seriously, really? A hundred percent, yeah. So a lot of the time was spent in the bush, digging trenches. I learned how to fire AK-47 and a 9mm. And that was, they used to call it, that's your boyfriend.

You had it with you. You went to the bathroom with it. You slept with it. You did everything with it. You had to care for it. Stop! Yeah. So my husband often jokes and he's like,

you don't want to get into trouble with Alicia. No shit! Oh my God. You're so much more of a badass than I even knew. Okay. So tell me after the AK 47 deal, then what happens? So then I completed my six years of, of studying and then decided, okay, where, and that was in another province called Halting in Pretoria, Pretoria university, and then decide what I wanted to do. And I thought, well, I do want a little bit of a change. I'm going to move to another province,

which is Western Cape along the coastline. And so then I found myself in the Navy. So still moved the department into the Navy, which was amazing. Then I just, time out. Then I just time out. Then I found myself in the Navy. Okay. Like just, I just found myself in the, how do you just find yourself in the Navy? Again, I think sometimes it's just opportunities. What I've learned is that there's sometimes there's just opportunities that come your way and it's a, I'm going to take it or I'm not. And I've always been the person to like, oh, there's a door, let's try it. And if I don't like it, guess what? I'm not committed to it. I can always, you know, do something else. And it was the opportunity to work in the Navy and I got to

work with the South African Navy divers. And that's how I got my experience in diving and hyperbaric medicine. And I enjoyed it. Okay. Like, do you, when you tell your story, like, are you ever like, I am so amazing? Like, do you ever sort of reflect on the words that are coming out of your mouth and be like, I, I'm amazing. Like we, we literally have sat and had a conversation a couple of times now. I knew nothing of this. I knew nothing of this. Like you are, you are amazing. So you get

into the Navy and, and then, then what happens? Then I just spent a a few years uh practicing there I did my primary practice was emergency medicine and that kind of continued until I got to the point where I started realizing that of course being in South Africa and under the hardships that it was um I was working in government so South Africa's medical system is divided into government and private. And I started to realize that it wasn't necessarily at that point, the lifestyle that I wanted to have for the rest of my life. And so I started thinking about other opportunities and what else I would like to do with my life. I was still single at the point. I was in, you know, late 20s going into my 30s. And I thought,

well, I'm not really, I don't have any dependence at this stage. And really, the world is my oyster now. And so I thought, well, I think I want to go to Canada. I have a few colleagues in my class that were here and really enjoyed that lifestyle balance that they had. And so I thought, well, let's give it a go. If I don't like it, then I'll come back. Yeah, you can come home. Sure. Yeah. So you were prepared to come to Canada and then something happened. Yeah. So before preparing to come to Canada, I thought, well, it's going to take some time. There's exams to write and multiple English tests. What's up with that Canada immigration? So many English tests.

So multiple tests. And then I thought, well, what I would do in the interim is just go work on a cruise liner. So get paid, have a vacation and see the world while I'm, while I'm waiting. Yeah. Yeah. And life as it always does two months before going to the ship, I met my husband. And so that threw in a different, you know a different dimension that i had never ever considered before because at that point being an indian woman in my late 20s it was already like

well just passed a sell-by date so wait wait wait you've passed your sell-by date. Well, you know, what do they say? You know, like if milk's on the shelf and you're like, oh, yeah. Oh, I know what it means. And you were just getting started. Okay, so remind me how you met him because this is a really fascinating story too, right? What's the story here?

So my high school best friend was coming to Cape Town and she said, well, I'm coming to Cape Town. We're going to have dinner. And I said, yeah, absolutely. She and then my husband were catching a hop on hop off bus. She ran into a glass door and broke her nose. And then she said, well, could you come a little before dinner? Because I got a problem. I think I broke her nose. And then she said, well, could you come a little before dinner? Because I got a problem. I think I broke my nose. I was like, okay, sure. Yeah. Let's use the doctor. Yeah. It's always handy to have a doctor friend. And so she said, my husband downstairs, she's like, I'm going to go send my friend. He'll be downstairs and you can meet him and then bring

him up. And I remember walking through this hotel, seeing him and thinking, oh, hello, how are you? Because he was so handsome. And I thought, gosh, Alicia, focus. You're here just to help out your friend and let's get that sorted out. And then we actually ended up just spending some time in the emergency department while she was getting sorted out, just chatting. And I thought, well, this is a really nice guy, but I can't really start anything now. I'm literally leaving in two months time to go away. And that's how I met my husband. And I know you did go on the ship. Is that right? I did. And he waited, you made a plan.

Yeah. So, you know, he, he said to me, look, I know I was like quite honest at that point, you know, that's a, that's a beauty. Also, when you get older and you're dating is you really, you just lay out your cards. This is me. This is who I am. This is my goals. This is my plans. You know, you're out. Yeah. Yeah. You know where I think it was different, you know, when you, and I know how to shoot an AK 47. Yeah. So, you know, I said to him, well, look, I'm going to go to the ship. I'm going to be working on the cruise liners until I go to Canada. And he was like, sure. But, you know, let's just go for coffee and let's just get to know each other.

And that's what we did. And to be honest, so after we had our conversation in the emergency department, he went back to his group of friends and said, I think I just met my wife. And they were like, oh, Liam, don't be ridiculous. Almost like she's way out of your league but in honesty I think he was really out of my league but yeah amazing and then you come to Canada together is that right like were you were you married in South Africa or did you come to Canada and start your life really officially together there? How did that work? We were married in South Africa and for two years, because it just, it took a long time to get everything, you know, to get all the paperwork and all the exams and things like

that done. So it took some time, but we got married in 2013. And then at the end of 2015, we were in Canada. The holidays are coming and nobody wants to deal with seasonal bugs making their way through the family. That's where Maple comes in. No more scrambling for open clinics during holiday festivities. One membership covers the whole family, making it a gift that keeps on given this season. And with over a million five-star reviews, Canadians are loving it. Don't let sickness slow down your season. Download the Maple app today.

See a real doctor on your phone in minutes, 24-7. Get Maple. Get well sooner. Whether you're in your running era, Pilates era, or yoga era, dive into Peloton workouts that work with you. From meditating at your kid's game to

mastering a strength program, they've got everything you need to keep knocking down your goals. No pressure to be who you're not. Just workouts and classes to strengthen who you are. So no matter your era, make it your best with Peloton. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton.

Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca. Wow. And you know, you started working and he started working and was the, was the plan always to, to become parents? Was that a, was that a thought that you both would, you wanted children? Yes. I think I've, I've always had, as I said, you know, that want to take care of from a really young age. So I grew up in a home with three kids. My husband came from a family with four kids. And so we thought three is a really good number. I think we would have three kids. And I said, you know, and if we have capacity, maybe we adopt one or two kids.

And that was our conversation that we had prior to getting married. And, and so when I got married, there was no like, okay, we're gonna not get pregnant for two years. It was like, we're just gonna roll the dice and hopefully I get pregnant, you know, and when it happens, it happens, you know, that's what people say. So I was like, I was ready to be a mom as soon as we got married. Yeah. Yeah. And then there was so much struggle, so much loss. Can you tell me about that? Yeah. So, you know, you, life goes on and you kind of, you have it at the back of your mind that, gosh, I'm not getting pregnant. I went and I saw a physician in South Africa and said, you're healthy, your husband's healthy. There should be no reason why the two of you cannot get pregnant. Women get

pregnant well into their 40s. Yeah. And that was a reassurance I took, right? And I didn't. And finally, we got into when we got to Canada, I got pregnant. And I thought, well, is you know a component to me not getting pregnant but I was around about eight weeks and I lost that pregnancy and that really then started a really really painful journey of trying to figure out why why this is happening, why us? And in many ways, I thought, well, what did I do wrong? Yeah. Isn't that the truth? I mean, as a physician, and I know you know, as a mom, that's the question that we all ask ourselves, particularly when we struggle with infertility or miscarry. I mean, I don't know what the percentages are of, of, you know, women who miscarry, but they're massive. And, and so many people don't ever talk about it. So you've, you know, you've lost this baby, which even that terminology is so interesting, right? But

you're in this place of trying again. So what, what did you discover? What was, you know, what did, what did they tell you? Up to today, nothing's wrong yeah apparently we're both really healthy but we just cannot keep babies yeah and did you have any other losses as well how did that go uh I had three losses in total wow and we tried for we had five years of fertility treatments. And then eventually got to the point where it's exhausting. It's exhausting every month thinking, well, this is the month. This is the month we're going to get pregnant. Every month I started that way. This is a month we're so hopeful.

And then at the end of the month when it's not the case and that disappointment shows up. It's tough to kind of pick yourself up from this emotional roller coaster that you go through. And then when you're pregnant, you're like, this is it. I'm like, one miscarriage. Okay, fine. Let's do it. Second miscarriage.

And you're like, okay. The doctors are saying, just a freak thing. Just keep going. We're going to get there. Third miscarriage. And then you're like, okay, I am now done. And at that point, after my third miscarriage, I said to my husband, I think I'm done. I think I'm done. I can't do this anymore. I can't do this anymore. I can't keep putting my body through all these hormones anymore. All the treatments, the mental burden of like,

where am I in my cycle? Can we travel? Do we need to be near the clinic? Just so much of your life is controlled by trying to have a child. And I'm, you know, I would see at that stage, I mean, I was in family practice and I would see mothers coming in with three, four kids and I'd be like, how, how does this work? How does she get three or four kids? And I don't. Yeah. Yeah. And then that internalization, what's wrong with you? What's wrong with me? What's wrong with us? Like, I, I bet it like, again, as you say, it's exhausting and it's such a silent fight that I think so many families, you know, try to navigate. And so then you made a decision to sort of change that. And what tell me what happened there? I think it was after our third pregnancy, my husband was always, you know, he brought it up

after our second miscarriage. And he said, well, why don't we consider adoption? And I said, you know, yes, but I would like to have a child that is that is ours, that that I can see you in and I can see me in. And there's a there's a there's a part of wanting when you love your partner to be able to say that we created this this is this is us this is a this is um the fruit of our love right and i think maybe that's just a natural instinct in women to to want to have biological children um but after my third miscarriage, I felt that absolute surrender where I felt like I can't keep doing this. And my husband, he said, well, what do you really want? Do you want biology or do you want to experience being a mom? He's a smart guy. Smart guy. And, you know, throughout my, throughout my,

throughout our journey of, you know, getting pregnant, losing it, fertility treatments, working, not working in, you know, after every appointment, you know, his embrace got deeper, got longer, got stronger. And I remember him just saying to me the once after our last failed fertility treatment cycle, he said, I'm so hopeful because love makes a family. And so he was not really concerned with biology. He was more wanting the experience of us being parents, of seeing me as a mom, of being a dad. And so that's how we've started the pursuit of embryo adoption because I thought, well, that gives me the experience of still experiencing a pregnancy and a delivery and having that connection to a mom. But beyond that, realizing once I, you know, explored the options of traditional adoption, how long that would take. Right. And at that point, I was well into my 30s, you know, mid-30s by that point. Yes. And so the embryo adoption starts, you get pregnant,

and you carry this baby, not without significant struggle, but you carried this baby. And, yeah, I always had this really smooth pregnancy until it wasn't. And Aiden came at 31 weeks, so two months premature. And I think that's really when it was almost like a whirlwind experience of just intense pain and grief, just thinking, gosh, have we not been through enough already? Yeah. Because when you went into premature labor, there was complications in the delivery. This was

a, you know, we use this, these terms typically developing, but typically developing healthy baby, there was no concerns about, you know, his capacity in any form. And then because of complications during the premature delivery, he had a stroke. Is that right? Yeah. So he had head trauma and he had a stroke. And for two days, we just watched and waited to see if he would survive. And so there was a part of me that thought, well, gosh, how could I have come this far to now lose another baby? And I remember just sitting next to that isolated and just pleading and praying that he just survives. And you also have done such vulnerable conversations around, I'm also not sure if I can be a special needs mom. What does that mean to be a mom of a child with special needs?

And navigating both of those conversations as you sat beside that isolate, I've watched, your response to this has been just so beautiful. Tell me a little bit about those moments when you saw how much this baby was going to need. they were telling you that he would struggle significantly. Yeah. Like on the third day, I got to hold him. On the fifth day, they did a head ultrasound and an MRI. And I often say when, when the doctors call in the psychologists and the social workers, and they call you for the meeting, know it's not good yeah yeah um and they said look he's had an extensive stroke we can't we can't speak to the quality of his life and we uh we want you to just have very little expectations for this baby

and at that point it was like his high risk for cerebral palsy, and then it was still also still like if he makes it, you know. Wow. Again, I think, you know, at that stage, you know, I was post C-section at that point, and you're just so overwhelmed by your own experience, and then you're getting this information kind of thrown at you as well. And it's just overwhelming. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

And how, how did the two of you as a couple do then, you know, just the unfairness of it all. Do you remember, you know, those few, few days in the hospital? You know, I think I relied so heavily on my husband at that time because he's always been my husband's background is an engineer and he's always just been very level-headed and very when he's made a decision that's it and very stable and in his emotions and I remember him just saying to me the one day, Aiden needs love and milk today. Today is all we have.

And so that's what we're going to give him. And that's what we did. And even when we got his diagnosis of cerebral palsy when he was eight months old, my husband just said, well, Aiden's Aiden. He's my boy. I'm going to love him. So tell me about this Aiden, this idea that when we take, you know, you back, we're not sure if he's going to walk. We're not sure if he's going to talk. We're not even sure he's going to live. And I got to tell you, I mean, I'm going to link everything to Dr. Alicia's profile so you can see this child. He is a phenom. The spiciest human you can ever imagine, full of vim and vigor. He walks, he talks, he does all kinds of things

that nobody, that everybody said he wouldn't. Tell me about this hero of a human? So Aidan is absolute pure joy. I think that's the word I could absolutely, if I had to describe him in one word, it would be joy. He himself, you know, I think many times I have to remind myself that as much as this is my story, this is also Aidan's story.

Right. And I, you know, I often, we often have conversations about being parents that can harness the little person that he is growing up to be and giving him opportunities where one day he will share his story of how he overcame hours of therapy, daily therapy, to be able to do something that so many of us take for granted. We don't even think about using an arm, walking, running, talking.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And what a gift those things are. And I know that early intervention has become such a big part of your advocacy work. How much of his success do you attribute to that early work of, you know, getting his brain to start working in ways that, you know, it wasn't wired for as a result of that stroke? I mean, when you have top neurologists and unitologists telling you it's pretty bad don't expect much but literature and other medical professionals are saying look don't discount early intervention the you know we know about neuroplasticity the brain's ability to adapt and create new connections and I thought well we have nothing to lose really by just throwing everything at it.

Like we said, we love Aiden. Aiden is Aiden. But if I can do something that can maximize his potential, any parent would do it, right? Yes, yes. And that was really the way I looked at it, is that we're going to get him into therapy. We're going to really throw everything at it and see where he lands. And I would say it's really been a combination of faith,

trusting, hoping, praying. And not only that he has his full life, but also that we as parents have the wisdom to give him the best possible life. Yeah. Yes. What would you say to parents who are listening to this, you know, you know, this, this world of navigating the medical system for your baby and alongside your baby, what are some of the things, you know, as a physician, as a mom, as all of those things, I mean, you're just such a beautiful soul that have experienced both sides of it. You know, what is, what is the thing you sort of talk about the most these days, do you think, in this space for moms and dads navigating these?

I would say advocate. Do not stop advocating for your child, even if you look like a fool. Even if you look like a fool. Do not stop advocating. I mean, I, um, I remember wanting what they call a gay trainer and a walker for my son. And the physiotherapist almost just, almost just looking at me with a little bit of pity thinking it's,

it's sweet that you think he's going to walk with this gay trainer, but the chances are that he's going to walk with this gait trainer, but the chances are that he's probably not. And I remember just coming back with this gait trainer and saying to my husband, you know, I think I'm crazy. You know, I'm literally becoming the crazy mom, advocating and pushing so hard for him. But I just believe it in my heart. I just believe it in my heart that this kid is going to walk.

And I believe it in my heart that he's not only going to walk, but he's going to run. And Liam being Liam, he's like, well, then we just get him in the walk and we will walk with him. And so last summer or the summer before we were just pounding the pavement with fish crackers, goldfish and iPads. Once again, secret to everything. Yeah. It's a secret to parenting. Yeah, it's a secret to parenting. Goldfish and iPads.

But once again, looking absolutely crazy to our neighborhood, thinking, here we are, just trying to get this kid to me. Would you get him to try to step on the goldfish or to come to you so that he would get it? He would come to me and get it and I would put it into his mouth or just hold the iPad and he would watch and then try to take steps. And I mean, of course, we also had an amazing physiotherapy and occupational therapy team that had given us tools that we could do. And he was still going to therapy with that. And you know, we, and then we started seeing steps and then we started seeing steps. And then we started seeing. Take me to those moments, Alicia, when you watched him take those steps.

And I mean, I've seen video of him running. And I just like I can't imagine as as a human what that must have been like. I don't think that there would actually ever be words to describe. Yeah. I think as a parent of a neurotypical kid, seeing your kid walk for the first time is such a momentous milestone. Yeah. But as a special needs parent,

when you see your kid doing something where everybody said that he wouldn't, it gives you a new level of appreciation. But it also is indicative of our human nature to persevere and to push through if we are in the right environment that harnesses it. Yeah. How much this world, this disconnected world, when we discount everybody so easily, what it means to have somebody who believes in you without reason even, what it means to sort of stay connected in times of despair, the goodness that can come from this.

I mean, that is just your story. That is Aiden. That is, you know, and I, has this changed you as a physician at all? I don't think I could go through this without changing. Yeah. I mean, being a patient, I often say that I think every physician at some point or stage needs to experience what it is like to be on the other side, to be in those vulnerable situations where you are dependent on just someone's compassion and giving their best. And so that definitely has shaped me in the way I see other patients now and other parents. I mean, pre-parenting, I was a great parent. I'm like, my kid, never going to do that. I say that all the time too. I'm so good on paper. Yeah. So good on paper. And now I'm like, yeah, he watches TV, loves Peppa Pig. And, you know, I think there's less judgment and more understanding for the way people cope with sometimes grief and anxiety, depression. All those mental health components that people don't

often talk about. Yeah. And I think that's so true in this world of, you know, modern medicine is, you know, I just, I met with a group of female physicians in Alberta earlier, a couple of weeks ago now, and just reminding them, I always come back to this. I know I've shared this with you before, but we're just walking each other home. You know, that Ram Dass quote always gets back to me. And when we're put in positions of privilege to be able to be the walkers, we will always need a walker at some point. Whether it's with our children or as we age or we experience illness or disease, we will always need somebody on the other side of that to help us through it, to compassionately navigate those moments. And it's never been more important than it is today, right? To see that

spark in somebody else, to be able to connect enough to make this journey that is often so lonely. Um, one in which we're just like, we just weren't meant to do it alone. We'll figure it out. And when you have that, I mean, I just think about how, how lucky, how blessed Aiden is to have you as his mom, how, you know, to have Liam as his dad, it just, this, this wasn't by chance and how much your story is going to mean to so many people listening today and, and how much to the foundation I know in, you know, in Liam's name, uh, or sorry, in Aiden's name has really created probably so much hope and space for people in that same place of wondering, is this baby going to be okay? Yeah. I love it. I love it. You are phenomenal. Okay. There's not a thing about you that isn't amazing. And I hope you

know that. Uh, what is the thing that you want people to know the most? If you could boil it down to one thing, after all of that. Gosh, after all of that. What would I want people to know the most? I think if you're listening to this and you're facing a hard time, whatever that unexpected situation is, I would say push through. There is still peace.

There is still joy in the unexpected. Dr. Ray, thank you. You were everything I needed to hear today. And I hope that all of this beautiful community that now I hope gets to be a part of your community. Um, they feel it in their bones. Cause I know I do. You are just, you're remarkable. So thank you. Everything that you need to know will be in the show notes in terms of connecting to Dr. Ray, her work, her advocacy. You can see Aiden and his journey a little bit on some of your social platforms. And it's worth every ounce of inspiration that that baby boy brings to the world. Listen, from the bottom of my heart, thank you so much for doing this. Thank you so much for having me. Oh, my gosh. All right, everybody. Until next time, my fellow humans,

I'll meet you right back here again next week. But thank you. Thank you for sitting with us today. I hope you can feel it in your bones, just the joy that can be in this world, regardless of what's on your plate today. So take care of each other, take care of yourself, and I'll see you here again next week.

Hey, after this episode, if you're thinking about, what do I do? Where do I go to do the work? Where do I land? I'd love to listen to Jodi's voice more. Gosh, I wish she had a course where I could just do the work with her on my own time whenever I'm ready. Guess what I created? It's called Feeling Seen, the course. And it's so fucking good. I got to tell you that it's really good. If you want to have a place to land where you want to think a little bit more, you know, we talked about some really important things on this episode.

And if you want to dive a little deeper with me, you can go to drjodekierrington.com and check out my courses. Feeling Seen is one that I think I created for everybody who wants to just sink in a little more in this time of disconnect. So go there. I'll put a link in the show talented and handsome team at Snack Labs. Mr. Brian Seaver, Mr. Taylor McGilvery, and the infamous Jeremy Saunders. The soundtracks that you hear at the beginning of every episode were created by Donovan Morgan.

Our executive producer is Marty Piller. Our PR big shooters are Des Veneau and Barry Cohen. Our agent, my manager, Jeff Lowness from the Talent Bureau. And emotional support, of course, is provided by, relatively speaking, our children. For the record, I am a registered clinical psychologist in Alberta, Canada. The content created and produced in this show is not intended as specific therapeutic advice. The intention of this podcast is to provide information, resources, education, and maybe even a little bit of hope. I'm going to go. From meditating at your kid's game to mastering a strength program, they've got everything you need to keep knocking down your goals. No pressure to be who you're not.

Just workouts and classes to strengthen who you are. So no matter your era, make it your best with Peloton. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton. Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca.