Unseen - The Original Mindhunter | The Case of Opal Horton ft. Ann Burgess | UNSEEN

Episode Date: December 20, 2024

“I think he’s right behind me — watching me” June 13th 1985: Dr. Ann Wolbert Burgess, a trailblazer mindhunter, sits across from an 8YO girl, trying to analyze her. 10 days prior, little Opal... Horton barely escaped a kidnapping by a man who took her best friend Missy right in front of her. Now, Dr. Burgess’s job is to catch this man, to find Missy before it’s too late, but there’s one problem: Opal is not talking. Dr. Burgess will need to use everything her studies have taught her, from her nursing career, to teaching the FBI, to studying the most notorious serial killers, to eventually catch Opal’s monster. Unseen would like to sincerely thank Dr. Burgess for time to meet with us, share her insights on the case, and teach us about her groundbreaking work in mental health and forensics. Dr. Burgess has authored numerous publications, including her recent book “A Killer by Design” about her career revolutionizing treatment of the trauma and abuse, and criminal psychology: https://www.amazon.com/Killer-Design-Murderers-Mindhunters-Decipher/dp/0306924862 Credits: Written, edited & directed by Justin Chalifoux Researched by Manon Lafosse Produced by Alexandra Salois & Salim Sader Voiceover by William Akana A big thank you also to Jeremy Rothman Productions for the shoot. Sources: Red Marble Media Hulu Boston College A&E television networks Movie Web The interview room National Geographic Daily Herald Wondery - Candice DeLong Film Rise True Entertainment and Condé Nast Entertainment for Discovery Illinois Police 60 minutes ABC7 News NCTV17 CONUS Archive Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Starting point is 00:00:00 Were you at home today? With your mom? Yes, and how is dead. Really? I'm sorry. Yes, but the big boy did it. The big boy did it? What big boy? This is three-year-old Jade Scotton.
Starting point is 00:00:19 Five hours before this footage was recorded, her mother Alita was found unconscious at home, having taken a lethal amount of insulin and methamphetamine. While it may look like an overdose, Her three-year-old daughter tells a different story. Was there one boy? Notice how the investigator is phrasing the question. He wants the answer to come strictly from the child,
Starting point is 00:00:46 which makes what she says next even more disturbing. Was there one boy? Three boys. Three boys? Mm-hmm. They're all older boys. My mom told them that. Were them grown-ups or kids or what?
Starting point is 00:01:04 Growing up. Although Jade does her best to give a detailed account of what she witnessed, investigators can't tell if it's the truth or if it's her own imagination. Well Jade, how would your mommy get dead? Somebody come in the house and rolled over the floor. They rolled over the floor. And I killed my mom. Actually, just in the world.
Starting point is 00:01:31 I'll kill my mom. Five months later, the plot to murder Jade's mother will be uncovered. A jealous ex-wife, Vicky Arlene Jensen, hired three teenagers to kill her ex-husband's new girlfriend, Jade Scotton's mother, Alita. The three-year-old girl, solved her mother's murder. But what happens when the child being interrogated refuses to talk? When a victim has been kidnapped and the only witness is an eight-year-old so traumatized, they won't speak to anyone.
Starting point is 00:02:16 The interrogation you're about to hear was recorded on June 13, 1985. Just days earlier, 7-year-old Melissa Ackerman was abducted in broad daylight. Her best friend, Opel, is the only one who escaped, after she jumped out of the car's window. Do you like to draw? Instead of just having to talk, we can talk and draw. How about the picture of your favorite weather? The woman asking questions is Anne Burgess. She was called in by the FBI.
Starting point is 00:02:48 They believe she's the only one who can make global talk. She was somebody who had this set of knowledge that nobody else had and was the brains of the operation. Dozens of police, firefighters, and volunteers were on the search today. Melissa was riding her bicycle with a young girlfriend yesterday. A young, unkept man tried to abduct both of them. It's not supposed to happen in a small town. Just keep working, keep following up everything.
Starting point is 00:03:14 It's discouraging, but we've got to keep. going. On Sunday, June 2nd, 7-year-old Melissa, or Missy for short, spent the morning riding her bike with her friend Opel in Sominoc, Illinois. At 11.30 a.m., they were both seen in the area of County Line Road when they stopped at the home of their elementary school principal, James Wood, and asked him for the time. The girls then rode off going east. Minutes later, Principal Wood was driving to school when he noticed the girls' bikes abandoned in the middle of the road.
Starting point is 00:03:53 The girls, however, were nowhere in sight. At 1142 a.m., the police department received a call from the Hickey residents, more than a mile out from where the bikes were found. The boy on the phone was yelling frantically, while the operator could hear young Opel in the background, sobbing and out of breath. Her friend Melissa had been kidnapped. It's a call that you never want to get. It seemed almost like slow motion and wishing and hoping that it was not.
Starting point is 00:04:21 real. When I went to Samanak to work on the case, there was a level of anxiety and fear that was pretty high. It was palpable. Missy's friend Opal was with her, and he tried to kidnap both of them, but she was able to get away from him. Anything that she said was really important and could give us more information into the offender we were looking for. It's not easy getting someone to talk to you and Opal wasn't talking. In order to find Melissa, investigators are looking for more witnesses, anyone who might have seen the abduction. At the very least, they need a physical description of the suspect or any information about the vehicle he was driving. Without those two things,
Starting point is 00:05:18 they have no hope of finding Missy alive. The first 24, 48 hours are crucial after that much time. The likelihood of getting that child back from a known abduction diminishes every hour. June 12, 1985, Missy has been missing for 10 days, and still, investigators are no closer to finding her. Their only hope is to make 8-year-old Opel talk. The FBI flies in Dr. Anne Burgess, a teacher of nursing at Boston College. She has been working for the agency for over seven years, studying serial killers and dangerous predators. But it's her experience with victims that make her a key asset.
Starting point is 00:05:56 You never can forget Opal. She was just adorable, but just so small and lost. It was a tiny table, child's table, that we sat at so that she was comfortable. And I introduced myself. I said I'm Dr. Anne and then I said, Do you like to draw instead of just having to talk, we can talk and draw? I said I have specific types of questions I want to ask you. And the first was, can you draw a picture of your favorite weather? How about a picture of your favorite weather?
Starting point is 00:06:39 Rainy days? She drew Maloney days. Melissa in raindrops. And so then I said, is that your favorite weather? And she said, no, I like sun. Her mind is just on Missy. She started out slow and non-threatening, took time to gain her trust.
Starting point is 00:07:07 I could have just gone in and said, what do you remember? What can you tell me? But we had a traumatized child here. The task was to be able to not traumatize her further because you're going to ask her to go back through a very distressing time. While Dr. Burgess is slowly making progress with Opel, she's under pressure from the FBI.
Starting point is 00:07:27 She needs to deliver any information that will lead to a suspect. The life of 7-year-old Melissa Ackerman is on the line, and every second counts. But there's a reason why Anne Burgess is able to connect with Opel when no one else could. It's 1956, nearly 30 years earlier. In Boston, Massachusetts, 19-year-old Anne, Burgess is studying to become a nurse. One night, as she's planning to attend a sorority meeting, Anne hitches a ride by the side of the main street. The college was up this big hill. My sorority met up there, but then coming back down, it was dark by this time. And then they said,
Starting point is 00:08:06 oh, you just stand over there by that road, and lots of people go down, you can just hit a ride. As one car pulls over, Anne gets in the front seat, next to a man she's never met before, But in the 50s, it's not unusual for people to accept rides from strangers. The dangers of hitchhiking are not yet common knowledge. So Anne doesn't think twice and puts her seatbelt on. And the man drives off. About halfway down the road, Anne notices the car is slowing down before it starts to pull over. Then the man turns to face Anne with a disturbing smirk on his face.
Starting point is 00:08:42 She quickly understands what his intentions are, and she's terrified. I knew I was in trouble. So I just screamed at him. I said, I have to get done. They'll be looking for me if I don't go back. I was really, really scared. I hit the horn. As cars passing by began to slow down at the sound of the horn,
Starting point is 00:09:03 the man is distracted, worried someone might have seen. Anne doesn't hesitate. She unbuckles her seatbelt, opens a door, and runs off. I said, I'll get out, I'll walk the rest of the way. Luckily, he took off. but I saw how easy it was to get into a situation. That's what gave me some real sensitivity to the plight of the victim. That night, Anne took a decision that would change the rest of her life.
Starting point is 00:09:32 She was going to do everything she could to help victims of rape. I thought we've got to get people aware of this problem. I began to talk to the patients with traumatic experiences. The year is 1978, seven years before, meeting with Opel. Anne gets a call she could never expect. I was just in my office right here. And I can remember I had a research assistant at the time, Anna Laslow, and she just stood in the doorway. And she said, I think you better take this call. And I said, no, just get a message. I'll call them back. She said, no, you better call. It's the FBI.
Starting point is 00:10:10 You know, some of my taxes or something. Why are they calling me? You know, what did I do? And he says he'd like to invite me down to talk about the book that I wrote. when the FBI called rape cases weren't being looked at. They were just being put in a shelf. Because of her experience, having spoken to many victims, she's asked to come teach the men at the FBI everything she has learned about sexual assault and trauma. For Anne, this is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity.
Starting point is 00:10:39 I also had to think about my family. Because it might take up extra time, night time, weekend time. That was hard because I had the young. children. I hesitated. When you're looking for who can you influence to change a broken system, the FBI was the top of the list. So I felt I could make a difference. I decided this was important. In 1978, Anne Burgess flies down to Quantico, Virginia, to the FBI's headquarters. But while she's been invited, Anne is not welcomed quite as she expected. I'm Ann Burgess, and I'd just like to, again, personally welcome all of you. You all have been selected for your expertise in a wide area.
Starting point is 00:11:25 She looked out at this audience of 40 FBI agents who were all men, and she started talking about rape, and there were some sniggers in the audience. All of my research is in the area of victims, and the impact of victimization. Do they thought rape was just sex? Women secretly wanted it, or they were out there and asked for it. would blame the victim. Why weren't you taking care of your kids? What are you doing out at night? Did you like it? I mean, you would not believe some of the questions that would be asked by interviews back then, because they believed that something that the victim said did a war was the reason that they were inciting all of these feelings in the men. We started changing the questions
Starting point is 00:12:13 rather than what were you doing. What was he doing? What we now call a trauma-focused interview is that you ask it in terms of understanding the reaction that the victim had. So you can better deal with it. 1985, Anne Burgess has spent the last seven years changing how FBI agents do their interrogations. Her work will be crucial to unlocking victims, like Opel, who can help the investigations. What was it like for you that night? Did you go to sleep? I stand up for long past the ways. And people would go through you on?
Starting point is 00:12:55 I thought about Melissa. It really part that scares me. I think like he's right behind me, watching me. But you say to yourself, he's not there. I just thought that. It isn't. That's good that you know. She was so scared.
Starting point is 00:13:15 She wouldn't go in front of a window because he might be out there. She wouldn't go near her window. She wouldn't eat. I said, why aren't you eating? She says, I'm waiting. Missy and I were going to go for lunch. So here it is a week later. Opal is distraught, but she seems willing to open up to Anne Burgess. She was so sad and so forlorn. So made her feel that she was giving me something that might help Missy. The detail Ople is about to share will help create a profile of the abductor. But Anne Burgess, has to ask the right questions because one mistake could lead investigators on the wrong path. Time is running out. Every minute, the chances of finding Missy alive decreases.
Starting point is 00:14:00 But how will Dr. Burgess be able to make sense of what a traumatized eight-year-old remembers? In 1978, Anne began consulting for the FBI. The only department who was interested in having Anne on board is the behavioral science unit, located in the sub-basement of the Quantico FBI headquarters. I remember the first time going, and you get on that elevator that doesn't have any numbers, you get down two floors, and there are no windows. It's a bomb shelter, literally. Agents were all working on these sort of not-by-the-book projects, some of which were approved, some of which were not so approved. It kind of didn't matter because they were in the basement where no one was really paying them attention anyway. The first project, Ann is brought into,
Starting point is 00:14:42 is one most FBI agents consider useless, outrageous, and a huge waste of resources. interviewing serial killers with the intention of understanding them better. The reason they wanted to study serial killers is they were having these cases and they didn't know the motive. We don't start looking at serial killers, and learning something about them. 10, 15, 20 years from now we're going to be right back where we are today. The mind of the serial predator was not something that was at all understood. Why would somebody choose to kill strangers? strangers over and over and over again.
Starting point is 00:15:20 What makes him so different from the rest of us? Thoughts drive behavior. A lot of people do it the other way around. Behavior and then the thoughts, no. Thoughts is what made people behave. So you've got to get into their head. This is where the Mind Hunter monograph came. I knew a week before she died, I was going to kill her.
Starting point is 00:15:41 I knew a week before she died, I was going to kill her. We didn't have the approval of the FBI, but it was something that he had to do in secret. Because Anne is only a consultant, she's kept out of the interview process. For now, all they ask her to do is listen to the recordings of interviews with known serial killers. Hours and hours of conversations with the most wicked men on the planet. I can see how certain feelings and ideas developed in me to the point where I began to act out on the certain very violent and very destructive feeling. something snapped in me I picked up a rock and big size softball size and I hit her with
Starting point is 00:16:30 the rock upside of her head it knocked her unconsciously once you kill another human being you'll never be the same person again the tapes that they brought back the cases were so horrific what I heard was like eavesdropping on the rawst fringes of humanity I later on who heard the car and I'm ready to... I said, you do exactly what I say. So if you're going to kill somebody, you just put it out of her neck and she was...
Starting point is 00:16:58 I cut off her head. I had a utility knife, and I cut her through. I think I stabbed her four or five more time. We're walking up the stairs with a camera bag that had her severed head. The tapes that I listened to
Starting point is 00:17:12 were fascinating. Now, the problem was we had to make sense out of it. These were agents that never had done research. They needed help with the methodology. Anne was the brains of the operation. She saw the potential for using interviews with serial killers
Starting point is 00:17:31 to be predictive of who a killer might be. She thought, if you can recognize the patterns, you can do something to stop that pattern from continuing. So we had to come up with this questionnaire. What are our research questions? How did you get up to say this? How was he able to tell you that? that maybe we'd learn a good question.
Starting point is 00:17:53 What should the order of the questions be? How far back do you have to go? Well, that's where we were starting to learn this. I would listen, I would hear something, I would jot down to see what was coming up over and over. So if we see this in another guy, all right, that's really interesting. If we see it in a third, okay, this is a pattern. What are the patterns?
Starting point is 00:18:13 Categories, data sets. So the data began piling up. Now we have something with you. we have something we can work with. June 13, 1985, Anne Burgess is making significant progress with young Opel, but she's about to ask her questions that will bring her back to that horrific event. And there's a chance that Opel is too upset and will simply shut down. So then I said, okay, now I want you to draw what happened that day.
Starting point is 00:18:43 No, that Sunday, was it raining? No, what was it like on that day? It was hot. Hot and sunny. She started drawing and she drew the road first. She drew a line down it, indicating it's a two-way road. And she drew the car, and she drew the man, and she drew herself and Melissa.
Starting point is 00:19:13 They had their bikes, and she had them in different colors. I said, and what happened? Now, because she had drawn it, we could use that. Coming this way, the car is going this way. Right, cause going that way more. And you're coming that way. And she has us to stop her bikes. Then we stopped her bikes.
Starting point is 00:19:33 And he asked us how to get up town. And so I told him how to go up town when I said he got me here. So then he got out of the car. So he came over, and it was at that point that he grabbed her. She said, he grabbed me, and he grabbed me. grabbed me and he threw me in the car through the window. And he snuck up behind me and that way. Then he grabbed me through me in his head first.
Starting point is 00:20:01 And then he was going to get him. Try to do something to us. And so then he went back to get Melissa. And she said, I had to get out. And I tried to get the door handle, but there was no door handle. Already, Dr. Burgess can tell this was premeditated. The car had been modified with the intention of kidnapping someone, but she's going to need more than that if she wants to create a profile for the offender.
Starting point is 00:20:32 Anne Burgess knows this more than anyone. It's 1979. Anne has been working for the Behavioral Science Unit for just over a year when she first hears about a man they call the ski mask rapist. He's been spreading terror across the state of Louisiana. The state's top law enforcement officer, Colonel Beau Garrison of the Louisiana State Police, called a press conference tonight in the ski mask rape case. The case involving burglary and crime against nature fits the better of some 20 rape cases throughout South Louisiana.
Starting point is 00:21:03 A state police spokesman says most of the break-ins involve sexual assault. The rapist would sneak into a house through an open window or door to surprise his victim. Then in many cases he would wait until the woman's husband or boyfriend return. After tying up the husband, the attack would start. Governor Dave Trane instructed state police commander Bull Garrison to make capture of the ski mask rapist top priority. Well, local police departments had never seen a case like this. The community was so scared that they reached out to the BSU
Starting point is 00:21:34 and said, we really need help. He would target someone. He'd find out where they lived, surveil the place, and get as much out of planning it. He'd cut the wires into the house. for telephone. And he prided himself in getting them all together and raping the victim in front of the husband and the kids. Police are advising women to be very, very careful. I really don't feel safe. I'm just afraid. That's all. Really afraid. Some residents have decided that locking doors and windows
Starting point is 00:22:10 isn't enough. South Louisiana saw an increase of gun sales by well over a thousand, percent. I'm very, very scared. I have all the windows locked and the dogs lose at night. I think I'm going to put some bars in my window. Summer in 1981, the ski mask rapist is increasing his pace. But the behavioral science unit is no closer to solving the case. They have no physical description of the suspect and no detail on the vehicle he drives.
Starting point is 00:22:39 He really kept them looking for two years and he was escalating. The ski mask rapist was doing such sadistic things to the victim's body that my feeling was that we'd better catch him fast or we're going to lose, physically lose a victim. While she's only a consultant for the FBI, Anne is sent down to Louisiana to interview victims of the ski mask rapist. They believe if she brings her understanding of psychology to the interview process, she could gain more information on the offender. I felt very anxious to go out because it would be an accident. actual part of an ongoing investigation was unusual for me. The pressure I was struggling was really a question of would I be able to contribute to the case? How do you get someone to trust you in an hour?
Starting point is 00:23:28 And I could have just gone in and said, well do you remember, what can you tell me? But I chose to take it from a more human standpoint. I told her that they were asking because they wanted to get the offender. She's helping in this process. And once she knew that, she realized they really believed her, and she would give up the information. When you know about this far, thank you,
Starting point is 00:23:54 about that feeling. I just thought that's about something else. You try to find out what is going to be the last thing memory that the victim has. That's going to be the hardest thing for her to get rid of, to help neutralize that. The thought that just keeps going around and around in the head. It's like a song that you can't get out of your head.
Starting point is 00:24:38 Finally, Anne is able to unlock the victim's memory, which will lead. Finally, Anne is able to unlock the victim's memory, which will lead to this composite sketch. 25 rapes attributed to the ski mask rapist. Rape cases in five Louisiana cities. The escalation of the occurrences was rapidly progressing. We were fearful that one of these days we were going to have a deceased victim. When I came back to Quantico, I gave the information on the victims to the agent. We realized how he selected victims. It was a similar pattern.
Starting point is 00:25:20 He would go after wealthy women. His domineering behavior showed that he saw himself as an alpha male. His evasiveness and the frequency with which he moved showed that he was educated and served in the military. We know that he liked nice things, and he's profiting off what he could steal. He was profiled as having a fancy car, but not that expensive. One of the questions they always ask,
Starting point is 00:25:50 any victim. Did you see anything unusual in your neighborhood? And several had said they had seen this car, a red trans ant. Finally, they were able to get the profile out. The authorities have been working with a psychological profile of the rapist. The profile called an individual a good looker who picks up women easily but is likely to beat them up and is incapable of long-lasting relationships. A police officer out of Lake Charles, Louisiana that's seen the car that matched the profile of the ski mask rapist. He came out of the house about 5.30 and drove to a convenience store just around the street. At 555, Simonus comes walking out of the store with a loaf of bread and two packs of cigarettes. We got him. On November 27, 1981, after spending two years
Starting point is 00:26:39 spreading terror across 12 states, John Barry Simonus is put under arrest. He confesses to at least 81 attacks. Although none of his victims were found dead, He is sentenced to 2,690 years in prison. This comes as a huge relief to the survivors and the community. But Anne's work is beginning to take its toll on her personal life. It was a very careful separation of what was talked about during the day and what was the personal time with the family. You can get PTSD from some of this.
Starting point is 00:27:14 There was one particular time. I started to get letters and threats again. against me. Alan, my husband, said, maybe you should get a gun. We bought a handgun for me. And it's not just me, but you always worry about your family. It's a very difficult position to be in, but I decided I was just going to stand up and just keep on going. June 13, 1985, as she's sitting across from 8-year-old Opel, Ann is listening for any detail that could help find her friend. And she said, I had to get out. And I tried to get the door handle, but there was no door handle. I said, so what did you do? She was so smart. She says,
Starting point is 00:28:05 I went back out the way he threw me in. So she got out, and she runs and hides. They were near a John Deere sales office. There was a big one out on the lawn. And she said she hid behind it. And she drew it. This is where you're hiding behind me behind. The man then started the car. He had thrown Melissa in the backseat. You know, some of us banged on the window. He's screaming my name.
Starting point is 00:28:46 That's the memory that she has. You know that that has to be in her head all the time. After that. She gets very disorganized. And you can see in the drawing, she just starts drawing little pieces. Opal's last image of her friend Melissa being kidnapped is one no child should ever have to see. Anne knows the best way to help her would be to bring back Melissa alive. But for that, she needs Opel to keep talking.
Starting point is 00:29:15 I knew they wanted something on the car. Describe it as your drawing it. When they go to shake like a panel, but it wasn't. How about the man? Can you draw a picture of the man? How did he look to you? She looked like you know, in mid-20s or something. Had things sticking on, like he hasn't seen. She gave a pretty good description.
Starting point is 00:29:45 Don't underestimate what a child can tell you. Now, maybe you may have to interpret it a little bit, but they will get some parts that are just on target. Margaret. You thought about what you'll say to her when you see? What would you like to say? I'm like to tell her with how I've been doing. And I got it.
Starting point is 00:30:06 And I was fine. Can you tell her that? Yeah, that was pretty neat, wasn't? A Sal County deputy was just out patrolling about 20 miles from Samana, an area that had been searched. And he was able to see two little feet under a heavy rock. You don't hear news like that without feeling it at an emotional level. The key to the case was Opal being able to give information to law enforcement
Starting point is 00:30:56 and then taking that information and spreading it throughout the county. The FBI this evening is charging a 28-year-old Aurora man with a kidnap and murder of 8-year-old Melissa Ackerman. Because of Opel's description of the suspect and the vehicle, a man named Brian Dugan is arrested. During his interrogation, Dugan confessed. Authorities also found out how he had victimized at least a dozen girls and women between 1974 and 1985, raping seven and killing three of them. Brian Dugan admitted killing Janine Nicarico back in 1983. DNA evidence suggested Dugan was indeed the murderer.
Starting point is 00:31:36 Donna Snor was the oldest victim at 27. Melissa Ackerman became the youngest at just seven years old. Anne and I did not discuss the emotional toll that working a case like that has on investigators that have children. We didn't discuss the pain and we didn't discuss the fear. It isn't really possible to take all of these things and completely and totally dissociate them. Every once in a while, we pause and realize what it is we're really looking at.
Starting point is 00:32:16 Someone's child was living an innocent life, and then the family has to look at an empty seat at the table forever. I remember when I was a little boy, I was in the backyard, and my mom came home. I look over, and we make eye contact. And I started thinking to myself, I'm like, oh my gosh, I must have did something wrong. And before I could get through the whole list of things, she's upon me and she kisses me on the forehead. And I'm like, Mom, what was that for?
Starting point is 00:32:48 And she's like, oh, I talked to a man today. It's a very bad man. And I had to ask him, why did you do the bad things that you did? He said to her that the reason he was so bad was because his mom never kissed him on the forehead. For my mom, one outlet for her is her work. She's very devoted to try to figure out how to prevent this from happening in the future. Her work helps her deal with some of the tragedy that she's experienced. You don't forget these cases, but you learn from it.
Starting point is 00:33:29 And you only hope that it, in some way, helps, and you've learned something that can help in the next case. After spreading terror for years, Brian Dugan is finally behind bars. He is sentenced to life without parole. Although she will never see Melissa again, Opel has brought justice to her friend. Because of her courage, Brian Dugan will never make another victim. Over the years, the shock of her ordeal subsided, but her everyday anxiety persists. However, in 2009, during the trial for Janine Nicarico's murder, she faced Brian Dugin for the first time since the kidnapping.
Starting point is 00:34:08 She forced herself to watch him plead guilty to the crime to finally put her fears to rest. Today, Opel has a beautiful family and lives her life to the fullest. As for Anne Burgess, it is because of her meeting with Opel that she finally realized how much of an impact her work could make.
Starting point is 00:34:26 When they found Melissa's body, somebody had to tell Opel. After they told her about Missy, She said, Opel said, I want to draw.

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